NationStates Jolt Archive

..FOLLOWING A FRIENDLY EMAIL..I DECIDED TO MAKE CLEAR THAT: THE "LIBERAL PARTY" IS NOT WHAT MOST PEOPLE HERE CALL "LIBERALS"
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OTTAWA (CP)Tue May 3, - The Liberals are engaging in squalid horse-trading in a bid to forestall their defeat in the Commons, the opposition Conservatives said

The Tories say at least four of their MPs were offered plum government jobs to remove their votes from a coming showdown in the House.

The Liberals denied the charge and no evidence was put forward by the Tories who made the claim, MP Inky Mark and deputy leader Peter MacKay.

Mark said a cabinet minister called to offer him an ambassadorship. MacKay said he was aware of similar offers to at least four Tories.

The allegations come in a political climate so intense the fate of the government could turn on a single vote.

Conservative Leader Stephen Harper confirmed this week he will attempt to bring down the government in a confidence vote this spring.

His fortunes could rest on one missing MP, on a coming byelection in Newfoundland, or on a new Senate appointment from the opposition benches.

Mark said the objective was clear when he received a phone call from a minister last Friday afternoon. He offered no proof and repeatedly refused to identify the minister.

"The suggestion was, 'Perhaps you'd be interested in being an ambassador?' " said Mark, a Manitoba MP.

"I said, 'No. I'm not interested. I've travelled enough.' The comment was, 'Seriously consider it. . . . I want to talk to you again.' "

The Commons is in a virtual deadlock with the NDP vowing to support the Liberals in confidence votes this spring.

The Bloc Quebecois and Tories will need the support of at least one of the three Independent MPs to get the crucial 154 votes needed to topple the government.

The government lashed back at Mark, saying he was the one out fishing for a job.

"I don't know what fantasies exist in Mr. Mark's mind," said Reg Alcock, the Liberals' political minister for Manitoba.

"I know he's been desperately unhappy in the Conservative caucus and he's been sending messages that he'd like out. . . . Only the prime minister has the authority to make such an offer - and he has not."

Prime Minister Paul Martin uttered a simple "no" when asked by reporters whether he had offered Mark a job. Martin spokesman Scott Reid said Conservatives "can keep their resumes."

The Tories' deputy leader said he's been hearing otherwise.

"I'm aware of other people in the caucus that the government approached with offers of positions - maybe in the Senate or some other position," said MacKay.

"Four people have confided in me that approaches were made - including Mr. Mark. . .

"This is the same old, corrupt Liberal party," Harper said.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/s/cpress/20050503/ca_pr_on_na/elxn_posturing;_ylt=AttmsJ2eAh3icSNngpa2rkKFM1IB;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

The Liberals denied the charge and no evidence was put forward by the Tories who made the claim

That's where I stopped reading.

Yes, and then yesterday it was announced that Belinda Stronach has been given a cabinet post for the Liberals, thus confirming the rumours. WOOT! I love it, I love it, I really really love it.

Wait...

we have congressmen? Since when do we even have a congress?!

Wait...

we have congressmen? Since when do we even have a congress?!

I believe that it's an Americanism, where parliament is thought to mean "congress".

I believe that it's an Americanism, where parliament is thought to mean "congress".
Oh, well I love how people who don't know enough about our system to name things properly thinks they can comment on what's going on.

Oh, well I love how people who don't know enough about our system to name things properly thinks they can comment on what's going on.

Hear, hear. My thoughts exactly.

Oh, well I love how people who don't know enough about our system to name things properly thinks they can comment on what's going on.Its a Newspaper article...I made no comments so far...

and USCongress is the equivalent of canadian Parlament...

I used the Word "Congress" for the benefit of most US players...so they know what I am talking about...

Its a Newspaper article...I made no comments so far...

and USCongress is the equivalent of canadian Parlament...

I used the Word "Congress" for the benefit of most US players...so they know what I am talking about...
They would understand parliment the same. Hell, when discussing british politics, I haven't heard anyone refer to their parliment as a congress. So don't give us this garbage that americans are apparantly too stupid to figure out what parilment means.

Its a Newspaper article...I made no comments so far...

and USCongress is the equivalent of canadian Parlament...

I used the Word "Congress" for the benefit of most US players...so they know what I am talking about...
US players aren't stupid. We know what a parliament is.

The conservative Gurmant Grewal have recorded evidence of the PLC trying to get is vote:

Link (http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actualites/article/article_complet.php?path=/actualites/article/18/1,63,0,052005,1038426.php)

Belinda could have vote for the budget from is conservative seat if she had really wanted. But she switched party mainly because Martin gave her a minister job.

US players aren't stupid. of course we are not studid...you damn gringo :D

US players aren't stupid. We know what a parliament is.
I dont doubt that for a second...i would be so unbelievably surprised if someone said "Labour are the largest party in the British congress"

in fact, i think i would fall off my chair laughing.

They would understand parliment the same. Hell, when discussing british politics, I haven't heard anyone refer to their parliment as a congress. So don't give us this garbage that americans are apparantly too stupid to figure out what parilment means.most of us do not know what is the name of your President...dont mean we are stoopid.
It means most of us dont care. ;) (we are lazy about world affairs :( )

si, se q' no es un Presi.

most of us do not know what is the name of your President...dont mean we are stoopid.
It means we dont care. ;)

si, se q' no es un Presi.
Was that a hidden attempt at french there... actually it could just as easily be horribly butchered spanish....

And referring to the canadian parliment as congress for the benefit of your countrymen does imply that you consider them stupid enough not to figure it out on their own.

And referring to the canadian parliment as congress for the benefit of your countrymen does imply that you consider them stupid enough not to figure it out on their own.I t was for the benefit of all the readers...even the ones droping high School...and the ones that think that your president is Jean Putine

Was that a hidden attempt at french there... actually it could just as easily be horribly butchered spanish....si mi amor...si eres tan sexy come eres inteligente...eres la bomba.
mais non c etait pas du francais...et ca ne passe pas au traducteur en ligne non plus ,domage :D

I t was for the benefit of all the readers...even the ones droping high School...and the ones that think that your president is Jean Putine

Canada does not have a president.

..FOLLOWING A FRIENDLY EMAIL..I DECIDED TO MAKE CLEAR THAT: THE "LIBERAL PARTY" IS NOT WHAT MOST PEOPLE HERE CALL "LIBERALS"
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--snip--

The Liberals denied the charge and no evidence was put forward by the Tories who made the claim, MP Inky Mark and deputy leader Peter MacKay.



http://story.news.yahoo.com/s/cpress/20050503/ca_pr_on_na/elxn_posturing;_ylt=AttmsJ2eAh3icSNngpa2rkKFM1IB;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl


Okay, so the people making these allegations are Inky Mark and Peter MacKay. Not even Inky Mark beleives a word Inky Mark says. He's the single most corrupt and completely retarded politician in all of Canada. Why in God's name would the Liberals want anything to do with him. They already have scores of fart-catchers with expertise in getting away with breaking the law. They don't need a schmuck like Inky.

Peter MacKay, the man who betrayed his own party and sold it down the river for a chance to be Stephen Harpers Eastern Fart-catcher. I loathe the Liberals, but you have got to be joking if you think they want to add more criminals, liars, traitors and sundry swine to their ranks.

Belinda Stronach only jumped ship the same way her father switched from Gestapo to Gehlen before getting booted from Germany. She's carrying on a tradition of backing the fattest swine, the Liberals didn't have to lift a finger to lure her over.

Canada does not have a president.
I think the little bit in some horribly butchered romance language might have been saying that... hopefully.

Though one could also point out that he misspelled Poutine.

I t was for the benefit of all the readers...even the ones droping high School...and the ones that think that your president is Jean Putine

you do realise that only about half the posters here are from the US, whereas everybody else knows what happens outside their borders?


oh be quiet, yes i know not all americans have no idea about anywhere else.

si mi amor...si eres tan sexy come eres inteligente...eres la bomba.
mais non c etait pas du francais...et ca ne passe pas au traducteur en ligne non plus ,domage :D
Your french is atrocious. Your spanish is at least coherent.

Okay, so the people making these allegations are Inky Mark and Peter MacKay. Not even Inky Mark beleives a word Inky Mark says. He's the single most corrupt and completely retarded politician in all of Canada. Why in God's name would the Liberals want anything to do with him. They already have scores of fart-catchers with expertise in getting away with breaking the law. They don't need a schmuck like Inky.

Peter MacKay, the man who betrayed his own party and sold it down the river for a chance to be Stephen Harpers Eastern Fart-catcher. I loathe the Liberals, but you have got to be joking if you think they want to add more criminals, liars, traitors and sundry swine to their ranks.

Belinda Stronach only jumped ship the same way her father switched from Gestapo to Gehlen before getting booted from Germany. She's carrying on a tradition of backing the fattest swine, the Liberals didn't have to lift a finger to lure her over.
__________________________________________
I have some swampland in Florida for you...
Is that close to DisneyWorld?

Your french is atrocious.my english is not better...but I am a pretty good Lover.

my english is not better...but I am a pretty good Lover.
.... why does that come off as creepy?

.... why does that come off as creepy?c't une bonne question...mais j' n past toute les reponses...y de todas maneras solo tu tienes la respuesta...

you do realise that only about half the posters here are from the US, whereas everybody else knows what happens outside their borders?


oh be quiet, yes i know not all americans have no idea about anywhere else.
I am trying to be quiet... :D

c't une bonne question...mais j' n past toute les reponses..
eew. You're using the abbreviated, ugly online french.

can this be locked or something - there never was any discussion or debate here - just people bickering about each other - the post didnt even have a topic

you do realise that only about half the posters here are from the US, whereas everybody else knows what happens outside their borders?


oh be quiet, yes i know not all americans have no idea about anywhere else.


And here I thought I had to point that out for you. Hope you don't mind the factI revealed your little palimpsest. No need to be shy about that fact. I've heard my fellow Canadians make some pretty ignorant comments about the US and other parts of the world. Ignorance is universal, unfortunately. Thankfully the flipside to that is that most people don't like to be seen as ignorant, and some of them go to an effort to ensure that they aren't.

The conservative Gurmant Grewal have recorded evidence of the PLC trying to get is vote:

Link (http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actualites/article/article_complet.php?path=/actualites/article/18/1,63,0,052005,1038426.php)

Belinda could have vote for the budget from is conservative seat if she had really wanted. But she switched party mainly because Martin gave her a minister job.
some would say she sold her vote...to the corrupted Liberal Party (at least the current liberal party)

Okay, so the people making these allegations are Inky Mark and Peter MacKay. Not even Inky Mark beleives a word Inky Mark says. He's the single most corrupt and completely retarded politician in all of Canada. Why in God's name would the Liberals want anything to do with him.they just wanted to buy a vote and they were ready to give him anything...even a ministers job...

it makes sense that thay look for a corrupt scumbag...

maybe this one was not corrupt enough...as he declined to sell himself.

they just wanted to buy a vote and they were ready to give him anything...even a ministers job...

it makes sense that thay look for a corrupt scumbag...

maybe this one was not corrupt enough...as he declined to sell himself.

Inky Mark's price is well known to be 100G at the casino, 2 whores and a case of Crown Royal. He works his but off to be the most corrupt he can possibly be. The only way what he says is true is if he forced his own party to make a counter-offer. This guy is so corrupt he makes Chretien look like Mother Theresa....and he'd pimp Mother Thersa if given the chance. He's not even human, he's a breed unto himself. How could ANYONE not from Alberta beleive him?

Inky Mark's price is well known to be 100G
A minister chair is surely worth more than 100.000 Dollars (US or Canadian)

A minister chair is surely worth more than 100.000 Dollars (US or Canadian)

It's not worth anything to me.

Canadian governments have come and gone, and it hasn't changed anything in my life.

It's not worth anything to me.

Canadian governments have come and gone, and it hasn't changed anything in my life.do you know what am I talking about?

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/19/grewel-050519.html


This changes things. Those have been some tense moments, the recent allegations. Interesting to see where this goes.

do you know what am I talking about?
Yes, you're talking about conservative politicians in Canada claiming that the Liberals are trying to buy their votes.

There's a slightly different spin on the story on NPR down here. Apparently, NPR isn't raising any doubts about it being vote-buying (at least the story I heard on Morning Edition).

My point, however, is that it doesn't seem to affect me no matter who is in charge of Canada - Liberals or Tories.

Well, you might be wrong there, Legs. It might matter to you indirectly, who gets to sit in the PMO. It might affect trade, positively or negatively. It might affect diplomacy, existing treaties, proposed treaties...

But no, it most likely wouldn't mean anything truly tangible to you as an individual, I'll concede that.

There's a slightly different spin on the story on NPR down here. Apparently, NPR isn't raising any doubts about it being vote-buying (at least the story I heard on Morning Edition).IMO vote-buying...is even worse than the AdScam...

Its the worse kind of political coruption, in a democratic system...

IMO vote-buying...is even worse than the AdScam...

Its the worse kind of political coruption, in a democratic system...

I'm shocked, shocked to find gambling going on here...

It's not worth anything to me.let give you an simple example...If the gov offers you to choose between $100G...or a job as an ambassador/Senator/Cabinet Minister...

what do you choose the money or the job?

I'm shocked, shocked to find gambling going on here...what gambling?

let give you an simple example...If the gov offers you to choose between 100 grand...or a job as an ambassador/Senator/Cabinet Minister...

what do you choose the money or the job?

I'm not a politician, so my answer isn't a valid comparison.

It's important that you don't have corruption in government, but I'm sorry, politicians are revolting. They stink on ice.

Or, if the Liberal Party offers you a cushy position, if you'll abandon your party (which is full of assholes anyway) and cross the floor...

It's disgusting, I admit. But I'm in the US, and we have stinking rotten problems of our own.

what gambling?
You need to watch the movie Casablanca.

let give you an simple example...If the gov offers you to choose between $100G...or a job as an ambassador/Senator/Cabinet Minister...

what do you choose the money or the job?

I'd take the job - it could lead to other things that would make 100k seem like pocket-change.

Oh, well I love how people who don't know enough about our system to name things properly thinks they can comment on what's going on.
I was laughing at the title; 'twas asinine, and proof that the starter hadn't the faintest notion of Canadian politics. If they did, they would have said the "Canadian Liberal Party", and mention that it was Conservatives MPs that were being 'drafted'.. I'll stop of making a full out insult.

I'd take the job - it could lead to other things that would make 100k seem like pocket-change.im sure embassador gets more than 100000 a year

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/19/grewel-050519.html


This changes things. Those have been some tense moments, the recent allegations. Interesting to see where this goes.

It probably would help if you posted the title of that link:

Go-between says Tory MP approached Liberals

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/19/grewel-050519.html


This changes things. Those have been some tense moments, the recent allegations. Interesting to see where this goes.from reading the whole article i say Gurmant Grewal is more credible...

# Canadian Liberals accused of trying to buy congresmen...
Don't you guys have anti-slavery laws?

Don't you guys have anti-slavery laws?what we need is better anti corruption laws

some would say she sold her vote...to the corrupted Liberal Party (at least the current liberal party)


Others would say that she spoke out her opposition to the non-confidence motion publicly weeks ago, got hauled onto the carpet by her party leadership and dressed down for her stance, and was left with no choice. After getting chewed out she had the following choices:

1) Be a REAL sellout and vote contrary to her well-stated position to bring down the government. Now THAT would have been whoring her principles and it is exactly what Harper wanted her to do.

2) Stay in the party but vote her conscience anyway and get tossed from the party for breaking ranks - which you bloody well know would have happened - which would leave her marginalized as an independant and yet have equally embarrassed Harper. People here who are suggesting she could have stayed in the party and voted against the measure are naiive as hell if they think that she wouldn't have been given the exact same public bitchslapping that she got had she done that. Hey, if you know you are about to get fired you do what most people do and tell the boss to go fuck himself while you quit rather than give them the satisfaction. I would - and I have done inthe past.

3) Abstain. Abstaining sucks. We elect people to do a job, not to shirk their responsibilities. Abstaining is for whimps, whiners, and spineless jellyfish.

4) Leave the party BEFORE the vote as clearly her views and theirs are impossibly opposed. This would have allowed HArper to save face and NOT try and force a non-confidence vote he couldn't win. Of course, he tried anyway - and lost.


So, which options from the above would YOU have chosen?


She was VERY vocal and VERY clear about her opposition to this attempt to take down the government. One way or another, if she was to do what elected people are SUPPOSED to do and vote their conscience she was going to be out of the party she helped build. Might as well make the most of it while you're going.

Is she ambitious? Sure! How many politicians aren't? You want people who DON'T give a shit running your country? I don't!



Oh, and as a side-note, McKay came across as the most pathetic, whiney-assed wimp on the hill with his little "woe-is-me" suckfest interview two days later where he whimpered and whined about her "betrayal".

You lost the girl AND the vote.

Boo Hoo fucking Hoo.

Grow up and deal with it.

Others would say that she spoke out her opposition to the non-confidence motion publicly weeks ago...where and when did she speak up?

what date?

where and when did she speak up?

what date?


http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1116418510479_16/?hub=Canada

A few weeks ago, Stronach was summoned by Harper to his Rockcliffe mansion over comments she had made to The Globe warning against defeating the budget, which would kill money for infrastructure to her Ontario riding of Newmarket-Aurora.

A Tory insider told the newspaper that Stronach was reportedly told she was being frozen out of appearances in election ads.

A report in the Toronto Star suggests the meeting between the two ended in a shouting match, with Harper telling her she would never be the leader of the party.

Stronach told CTV that shouting is not her style. But she said she had begun feeling uncomfortable with the direction the party was going, in terms of urban issues, and social issues, such as a youth wing.

"I respect the fact he is the leader, and he has the right to lead the party. But I'm going to express when I have some concerns about some of the fundamental issues affecting the nation," she said.




She made clear to the newspaper that she was against this action, and got bitchslapped for it.


Oh look, she slapped back.



Odd how the Conservatives who have tried to deride the Liberals to allow a completely free vote on the gay marriage issue sure don't seem to like anyone who won't goosestep in line for their own platform.... isn't it?