NationStates Jolt Archive

Tennessee county, site of `Monkey Trial,' wants to charge gays with crimes against nature

(03-17) 10:34 PST DAYTON, Tenn. (AP) --

The county that was the site of the Scopes "Monkey Trial" over the teaching of evolution is asking lawmakers to amend state law so the county can charge homosexuals with crimes against nature.

The Rhea County commissioners approved the request 8-0 Tuesday.

Commissioner J.C. Fugate, who introduced the measure, also asked the county attorney to find a way to enact an ordinance banning homosexuals from living in the county.

"We need to keep them out of here," Fugate said.

The vote was denounced by Matt Nevels, president of the Chattanooga chapter of Parents, Family and Friends of Lesbians and Gays.

"That is the most farfetched idea put forth by any kind of public official," Nevels said. "I'm outraged."

Last year, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down Texas' sodomy laws as a violation of adults' privacy.

Rhea County is one of the most conservative counties in Tennessee. It holds an annual festival commemorating the 1925 trial at which John T. Scopes was convicted of teaching evolution. The verdict was thrown out on a technicality. The trial became the subject of the play and movie "Inherit the Wind."

In 2002, a federal judge ruled unconstitutional the teaching of a Bible class in the public schools.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2004/03/17/national1334EST0667.DTL

I think we should ban rednecks...from living.

Ok hang on a sec, they want to charge gays because theyre gay.

WHY ARE PEOPLE DUMB!!!! WHY WHY WHY.
*stabs dumb people*

Whoever came up with this should die a slow painful death - or realize they themselves are gay.

Is this for real? Or a joke?

Fascinating. And thoroughly depressing.

Is this for real? Or a joke?
I second this. This cant be real. People cant be THAT dumb.

Tennessee county, site of `Monkey Trial,' wants to charge gays with crimes against nature

(03-17) 10:34 PST DAYTON, Tenn. (AP) --

The county that was the site of the Scopes "Monkey Trial" over the teaching of evolution is asking lawmakers to amend state law so the county can charge homosexuals with crimes against nature.

The Rhea County commissioners approved the request 8-0 Tuesday.

Commissioner J.C. Fugate, who introduced the measure, also asked the county attorney to find a way to enact an ordinance banning homosexuals from living in the county.

"We need to keep them out of here," Fugate said.

The vote was denounced by Matt Nevels, president of the Chattanooga chapter of Parents, Family and Friends of Lesbians and Gays.

"That is the most farfetched idea put forth by any kind of public official," Nevels said. "I'm outraged."

Last year, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down Texas' sodomy laws as a violation of adults' privacy.

Rhea County is one of the most conservative counties in Tennessee. It holds an annual festival commemorating the 1925 trial at which John T. Scopes was convicted of teaching evolution. The verdict was thrown out on a technicality. The trial became the subject of the play and movie "Inherit the Wind."

In 2002, a federal judge ruled unconstitutional the teaching of a Bible class in the public schools.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2004/03/17/national1334EST0667.DTL

I think we should ban rednecks...from living.

You picked some crappy county out of the foothills of the Appalachians that passed some crazy resolution. Whoop-dee-fucking-dee.

Man, thats crazy. But it'll never get passed, or if it does it wont stay law for long. It should just get struck down like the texas sodomy laws were if they still have any sense.

You picked some crappy county out of the foothills of the Appalachians that passed some crazy resolution. Whoop-dee-fucking-dee.

Passing a law like that could set a precedent and other places might want to do it.

Did you check the date?
Wednesday, March 17, 2004

That's over a year ago. I doubt that this is still going to happen.

lol. Finally, putting gays in their place

heh, that amuses me. Especially the reason. "Crimes against nature"


eh? There are loads of animals that are gay, and some frogs (and other amphibians) that can change their sex. Should they be killed for crimes against nature?

Sometimes people are so silly that you have to laugh at them, whether they're joking or not.

lol. Finally, putting gays in their place
Surely you mean 'their place as contributing members of society, entitled to all rights anyone else would have'?
I do hope so.

Ein Deutscher']Did you check the date?
Wednesday, March 17, 2004

That's over a year ago. I doubt that this is still going to happen.

Heh, I didn't even notice that. Was the original poster just searching through online archives to find some obscure topic to make an excuse to post?

Perhaps freemartins should be charged with crimes against nature and exiled. Oh, no, wait, they got that way *naturally*.

that happened a while ago. the town actually ended up issuing an apology. don't get your panties in a knot.

Originally posted by Neo-Anarchists:
Surely you mean 'their place as contributing members of society, entitled to all rights anyone else would have'?
I do hope so.










yay!

I second this. This cant be real. People cant be THAT dumb.

Never underestimate the power of stupidty.

Oh weird, I didn't notice the date. A buddy of mine showed it to me so I thought it would make a good discussion. Sorry guys.

Haverton: I didn't pick anything. Chill out man.

Never underestimate the power of stupidty.








it's misunderestimate

I second this. This cant be real. People cant be THAT dumb.

Mmh. Hopefully you're right. With U.S. American youth I'm not quite sure... And yes, I think it's really stupid. Amis...

heh, that amuses me. Especially the reason. "Crimes against nature"
.

Me too. How come is it we can't do anything "against" nature, but nature gets to do whatever the hell it wants with us? We should at least be able to put nature on trial too, for murder via tsunamis, disease etc.

Isn't there something very wrong when a public official even suggests something like this?

Hitler didn't want Jews in Germany in the 1930s. How is this any different?

Apperently animals have gay sex too! So therefore thy should get a group that tracks them down for crimes against nature

The county that was the site of the Scopes "Monkey Trial" over the teaching of evolution is asking lawmakers to amend state law so the county can charge homosexuals with crimes against nature.

Hmm... hardly surprising that people who ignore scientific observations of nature (and thus know little of it) would charge people of crimes against it.

How exactly are you supposed to act against nature anyway? "I think I'll disobey gravity today! Falling's such a bitch!"

Ok hang on a sec, they want to charge gays because theyre gay.

WHY ARE PEOPLE DUMB!!!! WHY WHY WHY.
*stabs dumb people*

Whoever came up with this should die a slow painful death - or realize they themselves are gay.

well, i think that they should kill the gays, and the christians, and the libertarians, and the capitalists, and the people who refuse to work or can't work, and the people who have mental illnesses, and rascists, and anti-rascists, and genderists, or anti-one-genderists. there's more, but i don't want to take the time to translate it all into english. i also agree that that person who came up with that should be killed like you said, cause he's most likely christian.

I have nothing against homosexuals, in fact I love them as fellow men, but I have a problem with homosexual acts.

I have nothing against homosexuals, in fact I love them as fellow men, but I have a problem with homosexual acts.

Like breathing?

I hate homophobe and racist acts like that too.

it's misunderestimate

Ding ding ding, we have a winner for stupidest post in this thread. Care to correct yourself for two remedial points?

Like breathing?

I hate homophobe and racist acts like that too.

Wow, are you just kidding or are you that shallow? No, like fucking someone in the ass... jeez, some people need it spelled out.

Calling me a homophobe is slander, I just said I have nothing against homosexual, indeed I love them.

And where did the racist bit come from? How on earth am I a racist now?

Ding ding ding, we have a winner for stupidest post in this thread. Care to correct yourself for two remedial points?

I believe he was being facetious.

Even if it never passed, the person who suggested it should be lobotomized. Hmm, perhaps that's the problem, he already was.

I believe he was being facetious.

Oh ok... but you never know with the "INDUURR-KNET"

Even if it never passed, the person who suggested it should be lobotomized. Hmm, perhaps that's the problem, he already was.

Look, most people laugh at the idea/pity the man who came up with it. Very few people take it seriously, and the end result is that some little dingy county had another 15 seconds of fame a year ago. So what... nothing to get so worked up about... there are worse things happening in the world today...

Wow, are you just kidding or are you that shallow? No, like fucking someone in the ass... jeez, some people need it spelled out.

Calling me a homophobe is slander, I just said I have nothing against homosexual, indeed I love them.

And where did the racist bit come from? How on earth am I a racist now?

LOL.

Anal sex is not the sole province of homosexuals, sparky. Thank you, Lord!!

Look up the word "slander." You clearly have no idea what it means.

You can say you love homosexuals -- even while you turn on the "showers."

Did I call you a racist? Or did I touch a nerve?

LOL.

Anal sex is not the sole province of homosexuals, sparky. Thank you, Lord!!

Look up the word "slander." You clearly have no idea what it means.

You can say you love homosexuals -- even while you turn on the "showers."

Did I call you a racist? Or did I touch a nerve?

Yeah, well I am against anal sex in general. Not just between homosexuals. That's a one-way hole, so take the right at the next corner, not here.

Nice, amateur flame baiting here kids... this guy thinks he is good.

No chance, wise guy... I think you are the racist for even bringing it up...

Yes, I get so damn hot for a man's penis when I turn on the showers...

I mean, what do you want me to say? 10 pages and a lock? Drawn down on the fool? Did you lock up your dog? The Super-Hornet is the best thing since sliced bread? Any one of hundreds of such random bits? Do you have a point?

*sits down with pop-corn to watch cat-tribe and holy see*

This is even more fun than the year-old attempt to pass a stupid law.

All things considered, isn't it kind of a good thing, that this silly county tried to pass a stupid law? And ended up apologizing?
It gives more support and legitimacy to the gay cause, having been "proven right" after all.

I, for one, am surprised they haven't tried this in other states along the "Bible belt". (Being from Alabama, I can vouch for the insane level of homophobia here.) I mean, the local news has obviously biased headlines informing the people of new laws banning "the promotion of unhealthy lifestyles within the education system" and the like. :rolleyes: Oh, yes, the South is such a lovely place.

*sits down with pop-corn to watch cat-tribe and holy see*

This is even more fun than the year-old attempt to pass a stupid law.

All things considered, isn't it kind of a good thing, that this silly county tried to pass a stupid law? And ended up apologizing?
It gives more support and legitimacy to the gay cause, having been "proven right" after all.

/me grabs a fistful of popcorn and starts polishing the trout...

Yeah, well I am against anal sex in general. Not just between homosexuals. That's a one-way hole, so take the right at the next corner, not here.

Nice, amateur flame baiting here kids... this guy thinks he is good.

No chance, wise guy... I think you are the racist for even bringing it up...

Yes, I get so damn hot for a man's penis when I turn on the showers...

I mean, what do you want me to say? 10 pages and a lock? Drawn down on the fool? Did you lock up your dog? The Super-Hornet is the best thing since sliced bread? Any one of hundreds of such random bits? Do you have a point?

I like you. You're silly.

Lots of body parts can be used in lots of fun ways. Try it. You might like it.

If you are making an argument from nature, you are about to step off a cliff.

Pointing out that you misused (in several different ways) a term ("slander") is not flamebait. But feel free to turn me in.

Saying I hate racists makes me a racist?

(And, again, you assumed I'd called you a racist. When reading comprehension 101 would tell you otherwise.)

I'd like you to not say asinine things like "I love homosexuals, but I hate homosexual acts."

Given that you said it, I am free to criticize your nasty and stupid statement. Welcome to the free exchange of ideas.

Yeah, well I am against anal sex in general. Not just between homosexuals. That's a one-way hole, so take the right at the next corner, not here.

no problem with homosexuals, just homosexual acts?
I have no problem with baseballers...I just have a problem with baseball. Baseball is a bad, bad sport, and people shouldn't play it. Football is much better.
Oh, but I have no problem with baseballers, I'm all for them. Lots of my friends are baseballers. I just have a problem with playing baseball.

Except, amusingly enough, that would be a much more reasonable thing to say. If you don't like baseball, you can just find another sport you do like. It might not be as good, but it's not the end of the world.
Not quite the same as telling someone that they should forego sexual contact, which is a basic human need, or else only have contact with people they don't find attractive.


The interesting thing is you think anal sex is special, because "That's a one-way hole". So it's something to be against.
Interesting.
It wasn't designed for that purpose (to your mind), so it's somehow wrong?

Against oral sex too?
Masturbation?
Against using flowers for decoration?
Against deaf people using their hands to "talk"?

Are you also telling me that, assuming you still think exactly as you currently do...if the only way to have children was for two men to have anal sex, or for two women to have...um...some sort of lesbian sex, you're telling me that you'd gladly become gay? (since you have no problem with homosexuals, and just have problems with having sex in a way our bodies are not designed)


Yes, I get so damn hot for a man's penis when I turn on the showers...
I don't think those were the sort of showers he meant...

I, for one, am surprised they haven't tried this in other states along the "Bible belt". (Being from Alabama, I can vouch for the insane level of homophobia here.) I mean, the local news has obviously biased headlines informing the people of new laws banning "the promotion of unhealthy lifestyles within the education system" and the like. :rolleyes: Oh, yes, the South is such a lovely place.

Hell, I am for the notion that schools shouldn't promote any sort of "lifestyle", whatever it may be. Schools are there to educate, so that means the three R's. Aside from that they may discipline our children as needed, and that's it. I think schools do a terrible job of sex ed. It should be done by the parents. Sadly, most parents claim not to have the time and/or don't know how. Maybe the parents should be forced to enroll in a "How to teach Sex-Ed" course when their kids get to around 13 so they can be prepared. Kids don't listen to the schools on such issues anyway, and are much more likely to listen to their parents and indeed, would probably respect their parents more for having the courage do discuss this.

I, for one, am surprised they haven't tried this in other states along the "Bible belt". (Being from Alabama, I can vouch for the insane level of homophobia here.) I mean, the local news has obviously biased headlines informing the people of new laws banning "the promotion of unhealthy lifestyles within the education system" and the like. :rolleyes: Oh, yes, the South is such a lovely place.

The oddest thing I discovered within the past month is:

There's a section of Alabama, a line through the middle, that voted strongly democratic.


I was shocked. But, I'll presume there is a corridor of saneness in that region of hate.

http://img184.echo.cx/img184/3037/ust0ug.jpg

(And, again, you assumed I'd called you a racist. When reading comprehension 101 would tell you otherwise.)

To be fair, it is a valid interpretation of your post to assume you implied he was racist.

You did bring racism into the conversation, as something akin (in your mind, at least) to the discrimination against gays.

Which is fair. And does not state he is a racist. And my interpretation was that you were saying that these are both seperate, but bad things. And one does not make you the other.

...but, it is a valid interpretation to also assume you were implying that they do both go together.

The oddest thing I discovered within the past month is:

There's a section of Alabama, a line through the middle, that voted strongly democratic.


I was shocked. But, I'll presume there is a corridor of saneness in that region of hate.

http://img184.echo.cx/img184/3037/ust0ug.jpg
Yay, I'm from a "County of Hate"

My county, 'tis of thee
Sweet delusions of empathy ;)

Tennessee county, site of `Monkey Trial,' wants to charge gays with crimes against nature

(03-17) 10:34 PST DAYTON, Tenn. (AP) --

The county that was the site of the Scopes "Monkey Trial" over the teaching of evolution is asking lawmakers to amend state law so the county can charge homosexuals with crimes against nature.

The Rhea County commissioners approved the request 8-0 Tuesday.

Commissioner J.C. Fugate, who introduced the measure, also asked the county attorney to find a way to enact an ordinance banning homosexuals from living in the county.

"We need to keep them out of here," Fugate said.

The vote was denounced by Matt Nevels, president of the Chattanooga chapter of Parents, Family and Friends of Lesbians and Gays.

"That is the most farfetched idea put forth by any kind of public official," Nevels said. "I'm outraged."

Last year, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down Texas' sodomy laws as a violation of adults' privacy.

Rhea County is one of the most conservative counties in Tennessee. It holds an annual festival commemorating the 1925 trial at which John T. Scopes was convicted of teaching evolution. The verdict was thrown out on a technicality. The trial became the subject of the play and movie "Inherit the Wind."

In 2002, a federal judge ruled unconstitutional the teaching of a Bible class in the public schools.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2004/03/17/national1334EST0667.DTL

I think we should ban rednecks...from living.
I find it fascinating that so-called "Christians" have this hardon (pun intended) for making gays' lives hell.

In the bible it clearly states: "Judge not, lest ye be judged."

I say let them live their lives. God will deal with them when and if it's warranted. It's not my place to judge.

I like you. You're silly.

Lots of body parts can be used in lots of fun ways. Try it. You might like it.

If you are making an argument from nature, you are about to step off a cliff.

Pointing out that you misused (in several different ways) a term ("slander") is not flamebait. But feel free to turn me in.

Saying I hate racists makes me a racist?

(And, again, you assumed I'd called you a racist. When reading comprehension 101 would tell you otherwise.)

I'd like you to not say asinine things like "I love homosexuals, but I hate homosexual acts."

Given that you said it, I am free to criticize your nasty and stupid statement. Welcome to the free exchange of ideas.

Did I say I am making an argument from nature? Could you stop putting things in my mouth?

Read again, that's not what I referred to as flame baiting, young 'un.

Could we drop the racist issue because you know that I know that you know that I know that you know that you are racist. ;)

How is that asinine? You can love the people but disagree with some of the things they do. Or are you so shallow that you think homosexuals only have sex and do nothing else? What about their contribution to the arts, sciences, education, law, etc. etc? You seem like you want to make everyone swallow what you give them without a freedom to choose a different view.

Nasty statement? How? I have friends and acquaintances who are homosexuals and they know that I don't agree with some of the things they do but they keep what happens in their bedroom to themselves so there is nothing to discuss and indeed, they have nothing against my view, as I am entitled to it and I don't play favorites. I am against "straight" anal sex as well.

You are such an uptight, arrogant little man... you have a lot of anger built up in you. How would you like a nice hot oil massage?

I say we ban telemarketers. Telemarketing violates more laws of nature than anything. Death to telemarketing!

Hell, I am for the notion that schools shouldn't promote any sort of "lifestyle", whatever it may be. Schools are there to educate, so that means the three R's. Aside from that they may discipline our children as needed, and that's it. I think schools do a terrible job of sex ed. It should be done by the parents. Sadly, most parents claim not to have the time and/or don't know how. Maybe the parents should be forced to enroll in a "How to teach Sex-Ed" course when their kids get to around 13 so they can be prepared. Kids don't listen to the schools on such issues anyway, and are much more likely to listen to their parents and indeed, would probably respect their parents more for having the courage do discuss this.

Very fair points. In theory, I agree wholeheartedly.
In practice, I'd like the schools to at least teach the basics (safe sex, what hormones are, what you can expect when you go through puberty), just in case the parents don't. Parents still have their own responsibility to teach this, but I'd rather hedge my bets, so that there isn't some poor child who doesn't realize how people get pregnant (it can happen!)

I agree wholeheartedly that they schools shouldn't teach any sort of "lifestyle", and should accept all non-harmful lifestyles of the students.

Unfortunately, as good a job as your teachers do, children spend a lot of time at school, and that's where a lot of their morals and formative development happens. I've learnt my morals from my parents, but a lot also comes from some teachers/friends who I highly respected at school. They're still role-models. As such, I only agree with you MORE that schools shouldn't promote or discourage certain "lifestyles"

lol. Finally, putting gays in their place


unless this is stated as a joke, then i will be happy to denounce you as another of the worthless bastards that are making america a worse place to live.

if it weren't for homophobes, rednecks, and christians in america, the country would have few social problems left these days

no problem with homosexuals, just homosexual acts?
Exactly. In the bible it clearly states: "Hate the sin but love the sinner."

You're making the same mistake as a lot of gays. They are so caught up in their homosexuality that they let it define everything about them. I prefer to look at people as people, regardless of sexuality/color/race/etc.

If you define everything about yourself in regards to where you put your dick/tongue... you don't just have issues... you've got a whole subscription.

To be fair, it is a valid interpretation of your post to assume you implied he was racist.

You did bring racism into the conversation, as something akin (in your mind, at least) to the discrimination against gays.

Which is fair. And does not state he is a racist. And my interpretation was that you were saying that these are both seperate, but bad things. And one does not make you the other.

...but, it is a valid interpretation to also assume you were implying that they do both go together.

Thank you, I knew that at least some people would see this blatant implication on his part.

I say we ban telemarketers. Telemarketing violates more laws of nature than anything. Death to telemarketing!

Hear hear! I knew an owner of a telemarketing company once, wow, was he a shady scrupleless character...

unless this is stated as a joke, then i will be happy to denounce you as another of the worthless bastards that are making america a worse place to live.

if it weren't for homophobes, rednecks, and christians in america, the country would have few social problems left these days
Hey, leave my friends out of this! They're really good people, just misguided.

Did I say I am making an argument from nature? Could you stop putting things in my mouth?

Read again, that's not what I referred to as flame baiting, young 'un.

Could we drop the racist issue because you know that I know that you know that I know that you know that you are racist. ;)

How is that asinine? You can love the people but disagree with some of the things they do. Or are you so shallow that you think homosexuals only have sex and do nothing else? What about their contribution to the arts, sciences, education, law, etc. etc? You seem like you want to make everyone swallow what you give them without a freedom to choose a different view.

Nasty statement? How? I have friends and acquaintances who are homosexuals and they know that I don't agree with some of the things they do but they keep what happens in their bedroom to themselves so there is nothing to discuss and indeed, they have nothing against my view, as I am entitled to it and I don't play favorites. I am against "straight" anal sex as well.

You are such an uptight, arrogant little man... you have a lot of anger built up in you. How would you like a nice hot oil massage?

I'll try this again in small words.

You said you love homosexuals but hate "homosexual acts."

I challenge that facile dichotomy.

Breathing is a homosexual act. Homosexuals do it.

So do racists, homophobes, Democrats, Republics, and fundamentalists.

So the statement is rather inane.

Further the statement is nasty.

Try "I love Jews, but I hate Jewish acts."

Or "I love heterosexuals, but I hate heterosexual acts."

Follow along yet?

And, btw, homosexual sex is not just anal sex. Forget about lesbians? Oral sex?

As for your other comments, just as you feel free to denounce homosexual acts I feel free to denounce idiotic and harmful statements. Live with it.

And the one who fears the menance of anal sex calls me uptight? LOL.

Hey, leave my friends out of this! They're really good people, just misguided.

i have nothing but contempt for homophobes, and most rednecks i've met are homophobes

i have no personal problems with christians themselves. i know some good ones, at least up to the subject of gays. i hate the religion, and the christians who use political mean to oppress gays.

why should an entire religion oppress an innocent social group that never collectively harmed anyone?!!

unless this is stated as a joke, then i will be happy to denounce you as another of the worthless bastards that are making america a worse place to live.

if it weren't for homophobes, rednecks, and christians in america, the country would have few social problems left these days

You writing off all Christians like that makes you no better than any homophobe. In fact, it makes you a hypocrite. Why? Because you are not as tolerant as you portray yourself as being. Furthermore, the term redneck is a bit archaic and indeed offensive these days. Do you know the origins of the word? You should...

Exactly. In the bible it clearly states: "Hate the sin but love the sinner."

You're making the same mistake as a lot of gays. They are so caught up in their homosexuality that they let it define everything about them. I prefer to look at people as people, regardless of sexuality/color/race/etc.

If you define everything about yourself in regards to where you put your dick/tongue... you don't just have issues... you've got a whole subscription.

Actually, I can see why you interpret my posts in that way, but I'm not.
It would be extremely unlikely for me to say "I don't have a problem with construction workers, but I hate the act of eating ham sandwiches".
That makes no sense at all. Even if some construction workers eat ham sandwiches.
I'd say "I don't have a problem with ham sandwich eaters, but I hate the act of eating ham sandwiches"
I'd defining the person as someone that eats ham sandwiches.
Just like I'm defining someone that is homosexual, in this discussion, as where they put their dock/tongue. (actually, as where their sexual attraction lies, which is an influencing factor in where they put...)
I'm not talking about anyone specific.
If I was talking about "my friend John" who, among his many other personality features, also happened to be homosexual, then I wouldn't be defining in this way.

I don't think it's valid to say "I have no problem with homosexuals, just with homosexual acts". When you say "I have no problem with homosexuals" you are referring to people who have sexual desires for their same gender.
When you are referring to homosexual acts, you are referring to sexual desires for the same gender. (yes, a guy checking out another guy is a homosexual act. I can't help but, subtly, check out attractive girls on the occasion. I can't imagine homosexuals having any easier time than me)

I *do* think it's valid to say "I have no problem with homosexuals, but I have a problem with anal sex". Accepting their sexual desires and choice of partner, but defining the behavior that isn't acceptable. As you point out, anal sex is not what defines a person, homosexual or not.
But, I also think this is an extremely naive way of looking at the situation, assuming the two can be kept seperate this easily.
Assuming we accept homosexual sexual relationships, it's *much* more reasonable to say "straight people shouldn't have anal sex" because they have another similar option. Homosexual males don't have this same option.

i have nothing but contempt for homophobes, and most rednecks i've met are homophobes

i have no personal problems with christians themselves. i know some good ones, at least up to the subject of gays. i hate the religion, and the christians who use political mean to oppress gays.

why should an entire religion oppress an innocent social group that never collectively harmed anyone?!!
You do realize that not everyone from the South is a redneck? I don't agree with discrimination either, but you're only discriminating right back.

Exactly. In the bible it clearly states: "Hate the sin but love the sinner."

You're making the same mistake as a lot of gays. They are so caught up in their homosexuality that they let it define everything about them. I prefer to look at people as people, regardless of sexuality/color/race/etc.

If you define everything about yourself in regards to where you put your dick/tongue... you don't just have issues... you've got a whole subscription.

This is sort of what I was getting at. Just because I disagree with one small aspect of their lives doesn't make me a bad or intolerant person. As I have said before, homosexuals have the same life any straight person has. They too work, pursue hobbies, are involved in various clubs and organizations, indeed, some of them go to church. Some of them are cooks, some are police officers, some are teachers. They are just like you and me.

My point: So, therefore, if you choose to only focus on their sexuality and let that define their entire lives then you are a very mistaken and shallow person who really needs to think before speaking.

You writing off all Christians like that makes you no better than any homophobe. In fact, it makes you a hypocrite. Why? Because you are not as tolerant as you portray yourself as being. Furthermore, the term redneck is a bit archaic and indeed offensive these days. Do you know the origins of the word? You should...

i am tolerant of anythign and everything, up until it causes harm. christianity has caused nothing but harm in this country.

i was wrong to use the term christians instead of christianity, which i was really speaking of.

as for the term redneck, i have no problem using it, as long as certain groups keep using words like fag, queer, and homo
and i do know the origins of the word redneck

Exactly. In the bible it clearly states: "Hate the sin but love the sinner."

You're making the same mistake as a lot of gays. They are so caught up in their homosexuality that they let it define everything about them. I prefer to look at people as people, regardless of sexuality/color/race/etc.

If you define everything about yourself in regards to where you put your dick/tongue... you don't just have issues... you've got a whole subscription.

Most heterosexuals define much of their lives around their sexual orientation. Dating, marriage, family.

You are the one singling them out by denouncing their sexuality.

Sexuality is a pretty fundamental and pervasive aspect of humanity.

Attempting to deny that in order to seem objective and superior is pathetic. And it makes your focus on particular sexuality hypocritical.

Out of interest, why are you against anal sex?

i am tolerant of anythign and everything, up until it causes harm. christianity has caused nothing but harm in this country.

i was wrong to use the term christians instead of christianity, which i was really speaking of.

as for the term redneck, i have no problem using it, as long as certain groups keep using words like fag, queer, and homo
and i do know the origins of the word redneck
Just because you do not agree with a religion does not mean you can't respect it. If you do not respect other religious/spiritual beliefs, you are not better than even the most restrictive, close-minded religion.

Out of interest, why are you against anal sex?
He's homophobic. I thought we already established this. ;)

You do realize that not everyone from the South is a redneck? I don't agree with discrimination either, but you're only discriminating right back.


i never said every southerner is a redneck, or even suggested it.

as for discrimination, i believe some groups do deserve it, (i.e. bigots, homophobes, racists, etc.) groups that hate those who have done nothing to them

I'll try this again in small words.

You said you love homosexuals but hate "homosexual acts."

I challenge that facile dichotomy.

Breathing is a homosexual act. Homosexuals do it.

So do racists, homophobes, Democrats, Republics, and fundamentalists.

So the statement is rather inane.

Further the statement is nasty.

Try "I love Jews, but I hate Jewish acts."

Or "I love heterosexuals, but I hate heterosexual acts."

Follow along yet?

And, btw, homosexual sex is not just anal sex. Forget about lesbians? Oral sex?

As for your other comments, just as you feel free to denounce homosexual acts I feel free to denounce idiotic and harmful statements. Live with it.

And the one who fears the menance of anal sex calls me uptight? LOL.

You know what I mean by homosexual acts, you are just being a troll and nit-picking.

Challenge that "facile dicotomy"? Indeed? Good, so you did. And I replied. It is called discourse.

Your point about breathing is obvious, unneeded, a waste of breath (pun intended), and pointless in this discussion, if you don't see why, then just stop now.

When did I ever said anything about Jews, never mind anything bad about them? You don't know me. While I may not be a religious Jew anymore, my grandfather certainly was and my father was to some extent. So, being ignorant of my identity, you just implied that I am an anti-semite. Interesting. And yet I am Jewish... are you going to call me a facist next? Just to stir up the pot a bit more?

We are focusing on gays (read: homosexual males) at the moment, so leave my sister and her fellow lesbians out of this or I will smite you.

You are just trying to nitpick when there is nothing to nitpick over. Did I upset you or something?

Lastly, when did I ever say I "feared" anal sex? Stop putting things in my mouth! Also, when did I ever equate anal sex with a menance? You should really stop this annoying habit of trying to put things in my mouth.

i never said every southerner is a redneck, or even suggested it.

as for discrimination, i believe some groups do deserve it, (i.e. bigots, homophobes, racists, etc.) groups that hate those who have done nothing to them
Alright newbie, I'm glad you can establish the difference. I just had to make sure. It's a common misconception, you know.

He's homophobic. I thought we already established this. ;)

I'm not homophobic, but I'd never have anal sex. I wouldnt stop other people from doing it though.

Out of interest, why are you against anal sex?

First of all, me being for or against is not something that makes me a good or bad person, either way. Second, I am allowed to have an opinion on anal sex as I please. It is not as if I were trying to force my opinion on others. Thirdly, I just find it sick. But you do whatever you like. I don't care. Just as long as I don't have to do it myself or have to endure you pushing that in my face. Live and let live...

Just because you do not agree with a religion does not mean you can't respect it. If you do not respect other religious/spiritual beliefs, you are not better than even the most restrictive, close-minded religion.


i respect religion, but i hate christianity because it does not respect anyone outside christianity. try reading the bible, there's some messed up stuff in there.

and how am i no better than a close-minded, restrictive religion? i think everyone shoudl live as they wish, as logn as it doesn't harm anyone else. i am only close-minded when it comes to such things as prejudice and bigotry

I'm not homophobic, but I'd never have anal sex. I wouldnt stop other people from doing it though.
Okay. I'm sure you have your perfectly logical reasons which have nothing to do with the common belief that anal sex is "gay". :rolleyes:

i respect religion, but i hate christianity because it does not respect anyone outside christianity. try reading the bible, there's some messed up stuff in there.

and how am i no better than a close-minded, restrictive religion? i think everyone shoudl live as they wish, as logn as it doesn't harm anyone else. i am only close-minded when it comes to such things as prejudice and bigotry
Because you seem to believe that your beliefs are the only "truth". That's the same as pretty much any other group of Christians you could name.

i am tolerant of anythign and everything, up until it causes harm. christianity has caused nothing but harm in this country.

i was wrong to use the term christians instead of christianity, which i was really speaking of.


What's wrong with Christianity, or Judaism for that matter. Or any religion? How have, for example, we Jews hurt you? Or how have the Christians hurt you?

He's homophobic. I thought we already established this. ;)

No, we established that disagreeing with anal sex does not make one a homophobe. If you think so, then you are an idiot.

Personally I do not really care if the discriminate between sexualities. It would eventually die down like rascism and antisemitism. Besides I am really annoyed with all the parades that they have and all the shows they get just because they are homosexual.

:headbang: This country is living in the dark ages. With draconian, outdated, and ignorant beliefs like this I think homosexuals would be glad to leave. We are ceratainly not importing dildoes from there any more.

First of all, me being for or against is not something that makes me a good or bad person, either way. Second, I am allowed to have an opinion on anal sex as I please. It is not as if I were trying to force my opinion on others. Thirdly, I just find it sick. But you do whatever you like. I don't care. Just as long as I don't have to do it myself or have to endure you pushing that in my face. Live and let live...

Hey man, I wasn't attacking....just curious.

I'm not homophobic, but I'd never have anal sex. I wouldnt stop other people from doing it though.

Did I ever say I would stop others from doing it? Did I? No. In fact I only said you can do what you like as long as I don't have to and as long as you don't shove it in my face.

Because you seem to believe that your beliefs are the only "truth". That's the same as pretty much any other group of Christians you could name.

i'm not the same as them. i wouldn't kill a christian for being christian, or turn him down for a job, or any of the things you see them doing to homosexuals.

No, we established that disagreeing with anal sex does not make one a homophobe. If you think so, then you are an idiot.
The wink was meant to indicate I was not serious in any way. If you think I was, then it must be you who is the idiot.

Okay. I'm sure you have your perfectly logical reasons which have nothing to do with the common belief that anal sex is "gay". :rolleyes:

I do have my own reasons. They logically stem from me not wanting to. I don't care what common belief is. I know some heteros have anal sex. I don't wanna be one of them.

I do have my own reasons. They logically stem from me not wanting to. I don't care what common belief is. I know some heteros have anal sex. I don't wanna be one of them.
Okay.

Did I ever say I would stop others from doing it? Did I? No. In fact I only said you can do what you like as long as I don't have to and as long as you don't shove it in my face.

I wasn't replying to you...

if it weren't for homophobes, rednecks, and christians in america, the country would have few social problems left these days
One can quite easily be the latter without being either of the former. Christians in general are not at all the problem in America.

why should an entire religion oppress an innocent social group that never collectively harmed anyone?!!
The entire religion is not opprseeing anyone. It's the rednecks that claim to follow that religion. Christian ideals are actually quite tolerant.

i respect religion, but i hate christianity because it does not respect anyone outside christianity. try reading the bible, there's some messed up stuff in there.

and how am i no better than a close-minded, restrictive religion? i think everyone shoudl live as they wish, as logn as it doesn't harm anyone else. i am only close-minded when it comes to such things as prejudice and bigotry

That is a narrow minded view. Most Christians do not believe in strict interpretation of the Bible first of all. Neither do most Jews interpret the Torah literally, and I know this as a fact because my grandfather was a very religious and devout rabbi and neither he nor any of his fellow rabbis simply tok the words for their straight meaning. That is the whole beauty of the language of the Old Testament.

Furthermore, there is some "pretty messed up stuff" in the Koran too. How about that? Or is that just fine with you, and you only have a prejudice against Christians and Jews (since the Bible does include the Old Testament and that is where most of the "messed up stuff" as you call it is)?

i'm not the same as them. i wouldn't kill a christian for being christian, or turn him down for a job, or any of the things you see them doing to homosexuals.
Okay, but don't you believe that all people are equal? Why is any one group less deserving of respect than any other? We all have our tragic flaws; it is often considered one of the things that makes us human.

i'm not the same as them. i wouldn't kill a christian for being christian, or turn him down for a job, or any of the things you see them doing to homosexuals.

What do you mean by "any of the things you see them doing to homosexuals"?

I am Christian and I hathn't done anything to a homosexual. Besides some are more strict then other. In Christianity it is a sin to be a homosexual, that is true but then again it is better then being an adulter. Since it is against their religion to be a homosexual it would make sense that they wouldnt want homosexuals to be part of their religion.

What's wrong with Christianity, or Judaism for that matter. Or any religion? How have, for example, we Jews hurt you? Or how have the Christians hurt you?


many christians in office are trying to pass laws targeting gays in particular, as well as trying to enforce christian codes of behavior

as for jews, didn't they use what's now called the old testament? most of these messed up things i've seen started with them

i don't know much on judaism, so i won't speak on it

:headbang: This country is living in the dark ages. With draconian, outdated, and ignorant beliefs like this I think homosexuals would be glad to leave. We are ceratainly not importing dildoes from there any more.


If you think the USA is "living in the dark ages" and that Americans in general hold "draconian, outdated, and ignorant beliefs" then I will kindly, on behalf on my fellow Americans ask you to leave this country and move to Afghanistan if that suits you better. Where did dildo importation come from? Stay focused...

Hey man, I wasn't attacking....just curious.

I know, I was just saying that for the benefit of those who might have had objections as well, albeit slightly different ones...

You know what I mean by homosexual acts, you are just being a troll and nit-picking.

Challenge that "facile dicotomy"? Indeed? Good, so you did. And I replied. It is called discourse.

Your point about breathing is obvious, unneeded, a waste of breath (pun intended), and pointless in this discussion, if you don't see why, then just stop now.

When did I ever said anything about Jews, never mind anything bad about them? You don't know me. While I may not be a religious Jew anymore, my grandfather certainly was and my father was to some extent. So, being ignorant of my identity, you just implied that I am an anti-semite. Interesting. And yet I am Jewish... are you going to call me a facist next? Just to stir up the pot a bit more?

We are focusing on gays (read: homosexual males) at the moment, so leave my sister and her fellow lesbians out of this or I will smite you.

You are just trying to nitpick when there is nothing to nitpick over. Did I upset you or something?

Lastly, when did I ever say I "feared" anal sex? Stop putting things in my mouth! Also, when did I ever equate anal sex with a menance? You should really stop this annoying habit of trying to put things in my mouth.

Do you want some help or can you nail yourself to that cross?

Did I call you a racist? No. I mimiced your inane statement.

Did I say you hated Jews? No. I illustrated how your statement appears acceptable only because you apply it to gays.

Stop with the silly hysterics. If you aren't capable of defending what you said, so be it.

You are going to rather ridiculous lengths to say that you hate anal sex but not those who engage in it. Fine.

You are entitled to that opinion. And I am entitled to (a) denouce it as silly and (b) doubt its veracity.

But, given your insistence that you just hate anal sex, why do you refuse to explain why?

What's wrong with Christianity, or Judaism for that matter. Or any religion? How have, for example, we Jews hurt you? Or how have the Christians hurt you?
I would argue that your values shaped society to a large degree, and society sucks.

The wink was meant to indicate I was not serious in any way. If you think I was, then it must be you who is the idiot.

I was guessing that you were sarcastic but I wrote that just to be safe. I am sorry, I guess I should have made that clear. :fluffle:

many christians in office are trying to pass laws targeting gays in particular, as well as trying to enforce christian codes of behavior

as for jews, didn't they use what's now called the old testament? most of these messed up things i've seen started with them

i don't know much on judaism, so i won't speak on it

There are also many atheists in America (USA and Canada) that are trying to force their views on people. Canada legalized gay marriage which isn't Christian and if you have been paying attention to the news then you would have found out that the legislative branch recently decided on two things

1. Marriage is defined between a man and a woman
2. Homosexuals can not marry, but could go through a near identical process, but it wouldnt be called a marriage.

Now where do you see christains trying to enforce their codes on others.

I was guessing that you were sarcastic but I wrote that just to be safe. I am sorry, I guess I should have made that clear. :fluffle:
Oh, fine, I will play along. :rolleyes: :fluffle: :fluffle: :fluffle:

That is a narrow minded view. Most Christians do not believe in strict interpretation of the Bible first of all. Neither do most Jews interpret the Torah literally, and I know this as a fact because my grandfather was a very religious and devout rabbi and neither he nor any of his fellow rabbis simply tok the words for their straight meaning. That is the whole beauty of the language of the Old Testament.

Furthermore, there is some "pretty messed up stuff" in the Koran too. How about that? Or is that just fine with you, and you only have a prejudice against Christians and Jews (since the Bible does include the Old Testament and that is where most of the "messed up stuff" as you call it is)?


i wasn't singling out christians and jews, but they have a much stronger presence in america, and i don't know much about the koran

also, there is a part in the bible that strictly says that gays are an abomination and "will not be suffered to live". i don't think that's open to interpretation, just manyt christians choose to ignore it, like many parts of the bible

I would argue that your values shaped society to a large degree, and society sucks.

And I would disagree and say that society sucks TODAY because of the Cat-Tribe sort of moral relativism and entitlement mentality, among others. Which is just a by-product of the liberal revolution, but times are a changing. Look, social trends and history are cyclical, it's just people ignore this nowadays and are much more pigheaded about accepting change than say 200 years ago. Times are constantly changing. Get with it or kill yourself. I don't care.

There are also many atheists in America (USA and Canada) that are trying to force their views on people. Canada legalized gay marriage which isn't Christian and if you have been paying attention to the news then you would have found out that the legislative branch recently decided on two things

1. Marriage is defined between a man and a woman
2. Homosexuals can not marry, but could go through a near identical process, but it wouldnt be called a marriage.

Now where do you see christains trying to enforce their codes on others.

WTF? You are a very confused young man.

There are some portions of almost any set of beliefs that would like others to follow those views. So?

I'd love to see you show an example of atheests legislating atheism. But I think the whole point is silly either way.

What legislature are you referring to re these statutes?

America is Christian and Canada isn't?

i wasn't singling out christians and jews, but they have a much stronger presence in america, and i don't know much about the koran

also, there is a part in the bible that strictly says that gays are an abomination and "will not be suffered to live". i don't think that's open to interpretation, just manyt christians choose to ignore it, like many parts of the bible
Actually, it is. Check a "homosexuality is wrong" thread and you will see that part of the bible being interpreted and debated by many different people many different ways.

i wasn't singling out christians and jews, but they have a much stronger presence in america, and i don't know much about the koran

also, there is a part in the bible that strictly says that gays are an abomination and "will not be suffered to live". i don't think that's open to interpretation, just manyt christians choose to ignore it, like many parts of the bible

I dont like to explain this alot. I should just save this as a document and just copy and paste. Pope JP2 said that most of the things in the Bible are metaphorical. Now by the homosexual part it is ture that it is in the Bible, but in the very same Bible it says that Adultery is worse then homosexuality.

Do you want some help or can you nail yourself to that cross?

Did I call you a racist? No. I mimiced your inane statement.

Did I say you hated Jews? No. I illustrated how your statement appears acceptable only because you apply it to gays.

Stop with the silly hysterics. If you aren't capable of defending what you said, so be it.

You are going to rather ridiculous lengths to say that you hate anal sex but not those who engage in it. Fine.

You are entitled to that opinion. And I am entitled to (a) denouce it as silly and (b) doubt its veracity.

But, given your insistence that you just hate anal sex, why do you refuse to explain why?

Hysterics? You really like those strong words, don't you. Especially "hate". When did I ever say I hated anything?

You know what, it is time that you started answering some questions.

Why are you such an angry person?

Why are you so vehement?

Why are you so arrogant?

Answer those and then we can continue.

Okay, but don't you believe that all people are equal? Why is any one group less deserving of respect than any other? We all have our tragic flaws; it is often considered one of the things that makes us human.

i believe all individuals start out equal. their actions change their worth.
open bigotry isn't a flaw, it's a horrible thing
i have nothing against an individual unless they purposefully cause another harm (not just physical)

i'm not the same as them. i wouldn't kill a christian for being christian, or turn him down for a job, or any of the things you see them doing to homosexuals.
Nice way to paint all Christians as gay haters, you bigot.

i wasn't singling out christians and jews, but they have a much stronger presence in america, and i don't know much about the koran

also, there is a part in the bible that strictly says that gays are an abomination and "will not be suffered to live". i don't think that's open to interpretation, just manyt christians choose to ignore it, like many parts of the bible

Not all versions of the Old Testament are the same. The translated versions which you have access to are all various interpretations of the original text which due to the age and language of the text is open to various translations. You seem to have the hardcore fundi version. Check out the New Revised Standard Version for example if you want something a bit lighter yet widely used. I won't comment on the Torrah simply because it is very different and its use is also fairly different.

Hysterics? You really like those strong words, don't you. Especially "hate". When did I ever say I hated anything?

You know what, it is time that you started answering some questions.

Why are you such an angry person?

Why are you so vehement?

Why are you so arrogant?

Answer those and then we can continue.

You know, I've been watching this discussion, and CT has been rather straightforward, while you are the one dodging the issue.

You are the one that I would rather see "answering some questions."

What do you mean by "any of the things you see them doing to homosexuals"?

I am Christian and I hathn't done anything to a homosexual. Besides some are more strict then other. In Christianity it is a sin to be a homosexual, that is true but then again it is better then being an adulter. Since it is against their religion to be a homosexual it would make sense that they wouldnt want homosexuals to be part of their religion.


i'm not saying all christians actively oppress homosexuals , but many do.
but i've seen many christians who consider homosexuality to be the worst sin.

why is homosexuality even a sin to them? it doesn't hurt anyone, and it's a proven natural behavior.

i believe all individuals start out equal. their actions change their worth.
open bigotry isn't a flaw, it's a horrible thing
i have nothing against an individual unless they purposefully cause another harm (not just physical)
Who says that all Christians have purposefully caused another individual harm?

Fine hit me. What am I dodging? What would you like to me to be as blunt as CT about? Would you like me to be arrogant as well?

i'm not saying all christians actively oppress homosexuals , but many do.
but i've seen many christians who consider homosexuality to be the worst sin.

why is homosexuality even a sin to them? it doesn't hurt anyone, and it's a proven natural behavior.

I believe you are misunderstanding it. Most Christians who have anything against homosexuality have something against homosexual intercourse, NOT against the homosexuals. Just clearing that up for you as you don't seem to be very much in the know...

And I would disagree and say that society sucks TODAY because of the Cat-Tribe sort of moral relativism and entitlement mentality, among others. Which is just a by-product of the liberal revolution, but times are a changing. Look, social trends and history are cyclical, it's just people ignore this nowadays and are much more pigheaded about accepting change than say 200 years ago. Times are constantly changing. Get with it or kill yourself. I don't care.

Condemning anal sex without any explanation is the moral high ground and will save America?

ROTFLASTC.

Aren't we the cute little puppet?

Are you afraid to debate this as your main nation or was it deleted?

I'll try this again in small words.

You said you love homosexuals but hate "homosexual acts."

I challenge that facile dichotomy.

Breathing is a homosexual act. Homosexuals do it.

So do racists, homophobes, Democrats, Republics, and fundamentalists.

So the statement is rather inane.

Further the statement is nasty.

Try "I love Jews, but I hate Jewish acts."

Or "I love heterosexuals, but I hate heterosexual acts."

Follow along yet?

And, btw, homosexual sex is not just anal sex. Forget about lesbians? Oral sex?

As for your other comments, just as you feel free to denounce homosexual acts I feel free to denounce idiotic and harmful statements. Live with it.

And the one who fears the menance of anal sex calls me uptight? LOL.


I see these as rather good points, and would like you (Blackwater) to answer them rather than dodge them.

And please, don't be arrogant.


The point CT is trying to make, (if I can make it any more clear) is saying you like homosexuals but disagree with homosexual acts is either hypocritical, or ignorant.

Could we just all take a deep breath and look at the pretty picture and then continue with a bit less anger?

http://img232.echo.cx/img232/2407/amazingpicture8mu.jpg

ETA: WHY THE HELL WON'T IT DISPLAY THE IMAGE? Damn board... :mp5:

There are also many atheists in America (USA and Canada) that are trying to force their views on people. Canada legalized gay marriage which isn't Christian and if you have been paying attention to the news then you would have found out that the legislative branch recently decided on two things

1. Marriage is defined between a man and a woman
2. Homosexuals can not marry, but could go through a near identical process, but it wouldnt be called a marriage.

Now where do you see christains trying to enforce their codes on others.

i don't think anyone should enforce their ideals on another, but other's ideals should be respected, if they don't demean another group.
i think gays should be allowed to marry, if they wish, or marriage, by name, should become a purely religious matter.

have you seen on the news about some states making it illegal for gays to be foster parents? or what about the army refusing gays who want to serve?

Could we just all take a deep breath and look at the pretty picture and then continue with a bit less anger?

http://img232.echo.cx/img232/2407/amazingpicture8mu.jpg

Now that is one great picture! :p

Condemning anal sex without any explanation is the moral high ground and will save America?

ROTFLASTC.

Aren't we the cute little puppet?

Are you afraid to debate this as your main nation or was it deleted?
Oh, yeah, I forgot that Blackwater was a puppet. *LMAO* I believe he was created at approximately the same time as my "Jesusmysuperstar" puppet, so we had them both going at once; it was very amusing. :D

Now that is one great picture! :p
:mad: It angers me. :headbang:

Actually, it is. Check a "homosexuality is wrong" thread and you will see that part of the bible being interpreted and debated by many different people many different ways.


the passage was, roughly:

"if a man lies with another man as he would a woman, then he is an abomination, and will not be suffered to live"

tell me how that can be interpreted in more than one way, and i'll admit it can be seen differently

I see these as rather good points, and would like you (Blackwater) to answer them rather than dodge them.

And please, don't be arrogant.


The point CT is trying to make, (if I can make it any more clear) is saying you like homosexuals but disagree with homosexual acts is either hypocritical, or ignorant.

And my point is that one can disagree with homosexual intercourse and be perfectly alright with homosexuals and that does not make one a hypocrite. As I have said before, I have homosexual friends and associates, and none of them think my view is hypocritical. Are you a homosexual? If not, then I will discount your disaproval as negligible.

the passage was, roughly:

"if a man lies with another man as he would a woman, then he is an abomination, and will not be suffered to live"

tell me how that can be interpreted in more than one way, and i'll admit it can be seen differently
For one thing, it could be said that only homosexual acts between men are an abomination.

[QUOTE=Cumulo Nimbusland]I see these as rather good points, and would like you (Blackwater) to answer them rather than dodge them.
[QUOTE]

I have addressed all of CT's issues, most of them in duplicate or triplicate. If you still find something missing, please be specific and I will clarify.

And my point is that one can disagree with homosexual intercourse and be perfectly alright with homosexuals and that does not make one a hypocrite. As I have said before, I have homosexual friends and associates, and none of them think my view is hypocritical. Are you a homosexual? If not, then I will discount your disaproval as negligible.

Hypocrisy is not the only form of being wrong. You illustrate several.

And I thought you didn't have a problem with homosexual intercourse, but rather with anal sex between anyone.

Hard to keep your story straight, is it?

Could we just all take a deep breath and look at the pretty picture and then continue with a bit less anger?

http://img232.echo.cx/img232/2407/amazingpicture8mu.jpg
That's God bringing his wrath down upon all homosexuals and their supporters.








(No... I'm not being serious. :p)

Oh, yeah, I forgot that Blackwater was a puppet. *LMAO* I believe he was created at approximately the same time as my "Jesusmysuperstar" puppet, so we had them both going at once; it was very amusing. :D

Well sorry if I am creating a few nations in order to endorse myself. It is not exactly illegal as I am using different email addresses. I never attempted to hide my primary indentity. Therefore I should think you calling me a puppet is uncalled for and wrong.

Hypocrisy is not the only form of wrong.

And I thought you didn't have a problem with homosexual intercourse, but rather with anal sex between anyone.

Hard to keep your story straight, is it?

Anal sex is a form of homosexual intercourse. Would you like me to write out a nice long list of what I exactly mean whenever I say something? Are you a fucking lawyer? You are pissing me off now.

You certainly know what I mean, you are just incapable of accepting someone having a differing opinion and you are trying to nitpick and try to play the childish "legaleese" game.

I see these as rather good points, and would like you (Blackwater) to answer them rather than dodge them.


I have addressed all of CT's issues, most of them in duplicate or triplicate. If you still find something missing, please be specific and I will clarify.

Nope, I don't see anything wrong, unless I misunderstood CT, which is quite possible.

Well sorry if I am creating a few nations in order to endorse myself. It is not exactly illegal as I am using different email addresses. I never attempted to hide my primary indentity. Therefore I should think you calling me a puppet is uncalled for and wrong.

Um. Did you just admit to having multiple UN nations? (Only UN nation can endorse another, right?) That is against the rules.

And I have no idea idea what your "primary identity" is. I know you've switched identities during this thread.

If you think I'm going to apologize for calling you a puppet, feel free to hold your breath until that happens.

Hypocrisy is not the only form of being wrong. You illustrate several.

And I thought you didn't have a problem with homosexual intercourse, but rather with anal sex between anyone.

Hard to keep your story straight, is it?

Are you suggesting that I am lying somehow? How, where, why? You are bordering on the ridiculous with your nitpicking. Stop playing the lawyer.

Well sorry if I am creating a few nations in order to endorse myself. It is not exactly illegal as I am using different email addresses. I never attempted to hide my primary indentity. Therefore I should think you calling me a puppet is uncalled for and wrong.Wait. You're creating nations to endorse yourself? That means you have more than one UN nation? That means...I get to report you to the mods and watch you die a slow and painful death?

(no, just kidding... but still...)

~Czardas, Supreme Ruler of the Universe

Nice way to paint all Christians as gay haters, you bigot.

now, don't be getting offensive. i was merely speaking of christians as a group, to simplify the sentance

i never called all christians gay haters.

i was merely speaking in the sence that the christians who do openly oppress gays will oppress all gays they know, just as any gay who, sadly, would resort to oppressing christians, would oppress all christians they know

Well sorry if I am creating a few nations in order to endorse myself. It is not exactly illegal as I am using different email addresses. I never attempted to hide my primary indentity. Therefore I should think you calling me a puppet is uncalled for and wrong.
I wasn't the first to call you one, dude. :p

If you noticed, I didn't say anything negative about your puppetting. In fact, I believe I portrayed it in a positive light: my own personal amusement.

Um. Did you just admit to having multiple UN nations? (Only UN nation can endorse another, right?) That is against the rules.

And I have no idea idea what your "primary identity" is. I know you've switched identities during this thread.

If you think I'm going to apologize for calling you a puppet, feel free to hold your breath until that happens.

I won't argue with an idiot lawyer like you anymore. You seem to be incapable or accepting the fact that some people may have perfectly valid opinion that differ from yours. I need to sleep as I have to work tomorrow. And you can stuff your nitpicking up your ass...

Thank you. You sufficiently pissed me off with your asinine nitpicking...

Who says that all Christians have purposefully caused another individual harm?


i never said all christians have caused harm, but many have

but, in this statement, i wasn't even speaking of christians, just people in general

Wait. You're creating nations to endorse yourself? That means you have more than one UN nation? That means...I get to report you to the mods and watch you die a slow and painful death?

(no, just kidding... but still...)

~Czardas, Supreme Ruler of the Universe

Boohoo. I have three nations. Big deal. That is not enough to fully endorse myself. It is not as if I would have a dramatic advantage over everyone else.

Anal sex is a form of homosexual intercourse. Would you like me to write out a nice long list of what I exactly mean whenever I say something? Are you a fucking lawyer? You are pissing me off now.

You certainly know what I mean, you are just incapable of accepting someone having a differing opinion and you are trying to nitpick and try to play the childish "legaleese" game.

Yes. I am a lawyer. And I rather enjoy fucking. You should try it some time.

Anal sex is a form of intercourse. Engaged in by other than homosexuals.

Homosexuals engage in other forms of intercourse.

You are trying to play a cutesy game of semantics that condemns homosexuals without admitting it. I am pointing out the hole in your attempt.

Do you condemn all homosexual sex or just anal sex?

Are some kinds of sex wrong when homosexuals do it, but not when heterosexuals do it?

Feel free to dig yourself a deeper hole.

You are free to have a different opinion. I don't have to accept it. I can criticize it. That is the free exchange of ideas.

I wasn't the first to call you one, dude. :p

If you noticed, I didn't say anything negative about your puppetting. In fact, I believe I portrayed it in a positive light: my own personal amusement.

Yes I know what you meant but when CT that idiot lawyer called me a puppet I knew what HE meant.

I second this. This cant be real. People cant be THAT dumb.

Note that that's taking place in Tennessee.

And why bother? I don't particularly like homosexuals, but as long as they don't advertise it but running around screaming "I'M GAY! I'M GAY!" or holding parades then I'm willing to leave them alone.

i never said all christians have caused harm, but many have

but, in this statement, i wasn't even speaking of christians, just people in general
My understanding was that you connected Chrisitianity directly to "individuals who have caused other individuals harm" (paraphrased quote)

For one thing, it could be said that only homosexual acts between men are an abomination.


but why kill the men committing the acts, if they don't harm anyone, or force the act on an unwilling person?

Yes. I am a lawyer. And I rather enjoy fucking. You should try it some time.

Anal sex is a form of intercourse. Engaged in by other than homosexuals.

Homosexuals engage in other forms of intercourse.

You are trying to play a cutesy game of semantics that condemns homosexuals without admitting it. I am pointing out the hole in your attempt.

Do you condemn all homosexual sex or just anal sex?

Are some kinds of sex wrong when homosexuals do it, but not when heterosexuals do it?

Feel free to dig yourself a deeper hole.

You are free to have a different opinion. I don't have to accept it. I can criticize it. That is the free exchange of ideas.

You are just mostly saying things I have already said and made clear to everyone. Why is it that you fucking thickheaded lawyers want EVERYTHING written out on stone tablets, covering every single possible interpretation or angle. LEARN TO FUCKING UNDERSTAND WHAT SOMEONE MEANS AND STOP BEING A FUCKING MACHINE.

For the FOURTH (count 'em, 1, 2 , 3, 4) time: I AM NOT PLAYING FAVORITES. I said I have a problem with anal sex. Be it performed by a man on a woman, a man on a man. Well, I must admit, I have no problem with it being performed by a jackhammer on a lawyer...

What you refuse to accept is that I have a different opinion and that I am entitled to it. Shakespeare was so right when he wrote that bit in Henry V...

I said I have a problem with anal sex. Be it performed by a man on a woman, a man on a man. Well, I must admit, I have no problem with it being performed by a jackhammer on a lawyer...
This is SO going in my sig. :D

but why kill the men committing the acts, if they don't harm anyone, or force the act on an unwilling person?
If I were to give an honest reason, it would be that the Christian church likes to discriminate against those who are different from themselves. However, the Christian answer would most likely be, "That is the word of God".



Remember, I have personal biases against the Christian church myself, but I do not believe they are justifiable in any way, shape, or form.

My understanding was that you connected Chrisitianity directly to "individuals who have caused other individuals harm" (paraphrased quote)


i'm sry if i made a mistake like that. i meant the two statements to be seperate. i don't think all christians cause harm, not at all. and not all who cause harm are christians

Good night all. I hope to dream sweet dreams of crazed clowns with chainsaws and axes chasing lawyers around in a circus while little children spit at the lawyers from above. Oh the sweet joy of lawyers being fed to the lions...

Note that that's taking place in Tennessee.

And why bother? I don't particularly like homosexuals, but as long as they don't advertise it but running around screaming "I'M GAY! I'M GAY!" or holding parades then I'm willing to leave them alone.

i'm glad you're one of the better people who wants to "live and let live"

yes, i disapprove of people who shove their lifestyle in another's face, and these "gay pride" parades are just plain insanity

i, myself, am bisexual, and i never state so unless it comes up directly in conversation, or someone asks. but i don't hide it, either. it's neither shameful, nor something to be proud about. it's just who i am.

One picture can be worth a thousand words...

http://img154.echo.cx/img154/5853/morelesbians0lp.jpg

Good night all. I hope to dream sweet dreams of crazed clowns with chainsaws and axes chasing lawyers around in a circus while little children spit at the lawyers from above. Oh the sweet joy of lawyers being fed to the lions...

Miehm, is that you?

Sweet dreams, pumpkin. :fluffle:

i'm glad you're one of the better people who wants to "live and let live"

yes, i disapprove of people who shove their lifestyle in another's face, and these "gay pride" parades are just plain insanity

i, myself, am bisexual, and i never state so unless it comes up directly in conversation, or someone asks. but i don't hide it, either. it's neither shameful, nor something to be proud about. it's just who i am.

Yes, and most homosexuals/bisexuals keep sexuality a private matter as it is and should be. Unfortunately a few seem to base their lives only on that aspect and seem to want to shove that in everyone's face. Then again straight people have also been guilty at times of shoving their sexuality in others' faces... I suppose some people just get off on making their extreme sexuality (no matter what kind) a public matter for all.

Miehm, is that you?

Sweet dreams, pumpkin. :fluffle:

http://img54.echo.cx/img54/8264/gladtopost5ze.jpg

I will play nice and give you a nice big fat wet smooch as well... :fluffle:

DAMN THAT PICTURE FRIGHTENS ME! I really need to sleep...

*snip*

What you refuse to accept is that I have a different opinion and that I am entitled to it. Shakespeare was so right when he wrote that bit in Henry V...

LOL.

Not my fault you try to draw a fine line and keep stumbling over it.

So all other forms of homosexual intercourse are A-OK with you. Spiffy.

And you denounce anal sex but won't say why (and it is wrong to press you for why or to criticixe you for an irrational position) :rolleyes:

Perhaps you should read Henry VI so you can learn the context and realize how silly endorsing that quote is.

What you refuse to accept is that you have different opinion and I am entitled to criticize it.

You are not entitled to voice your opinions free from criticism. Tough cheese.

One picture can be worth a thousand words...

http://img154.echo.cx/img154/5853/morelesbians0lp.jpg
:confused: I thought you were the dude who was against homosexuality.

Yes, and most homosexuals/bisexuals keep sexuality a private matter as it is and should be. Unfortunately a few seem to base their lives only on that aspect and seem to want to shove that in everyone's face. Then again straight people have also been guilty at times of shoving their sexuality in others' faces... I suppose some people just get off on making their extreme sexuality (no matter what kind) a public matter for all.


yup. one's sex life should be a private matter, and public displays of affection shouldn't go as far as making out in public. just keep it reasonable, like holding hands, or a simple kiss sometimes. certainly not shoving your tongue down their throat. and i believe this goes for all groupings.

yup. one's sex life should be a private matter, and public displays of affection shouldn't go as far as making out in public. just keep it reasonable, like holding hands, or a simple kiss sometimes. certainly not shoving your tongue down their throat. and i believe this goes for all groupings.
I have to disagree with that. I do not believe that PDAs should be limited in any way, shape, or form. :fluffle: :fluffle: :fluffle:

One picture can be worth a thousand words...

http://img154.echo.cx/img154/5853/morelesbians0lp.jpg
*Stares, drools.* Hmm? What were we saying? :p

There are also many atheists in America (USA and Canada) that are trying to force their views on people. Canada legalized gay marriage which isn't Christian and if you have been paying attention to the news then you would have found out that the legislative branch recently decided on two things

1. Marriage is defined between a man and a woman
2. Homosexuals can not marry, but could go through a near identical process, but it wouldnt be called a marriage.

Now where do you see christains trying to enforce their codes on others.
1. The US government is supposed to be secular.
2. Atheists forcing their views on people? LOL We're not the ones making all the silly laws.
3.Sodomy laws. I don't think the atheists made those. As a matter of fact I think that was from Christians.
4.As far as I know, there are no atheists openly serving in the House or Senate. So exactly how is this atheist conspiracy controling the country? The vast majority of politicians profess Christianity.

I suppose I could continue numbering things just for fun, but most people have probably gotten the idea that the atheists taking over the country and oppressing Christians is just silly.

I have to disagree with that. I do not believe that PDAs should be limited in any way, shape, or form. :fluffle: :fluffle: :fluffle:


so, people should be able to have sex in public?

so, people should be able to have sex in public?

I wish ;)

so, people should be able to have sex in public?

It doesn't harm anyone. So yes.

I'm wholly against privacy.

so, people should be able to have sex in public?
Yes.

the passage was, roughly:

"if a man lies with another man as he would a woman, then he is an abomination, and will not be suffered to live"

tell me how that can be interpreted in more than one way, and i'll admit it can be seen differently

I'm assuming that's a misquote because it's impossible to penetrate a man's vagina :p

Also, gays wouldn't lie with women, so again they'd be fine.

I second this. This cant be real. People cant be THAT dumb.They can, and they are. That's why I make sure not to be human. :D


~Czardas, Supreme Ruler of the Universe

You are just mostly saying things I have already said and made clear to everyone. Why is it that you fucking thickheaded lawyers want EVERYTHING written out on stone tablets, covering every single possible interpretation or angle. LEARN TO FUCKING UNDERSTAND WHAT SOMEONE MEANS AND STOP BEING A FUCKING MACHINE.

For the FOURTH (count 'em, 1, 2 , 3, 4) time: I AM NOT PLAYING FAVORITES. I said I have a problem with anal sex. Be it performed by a man on a woman, a man on a man. Well, I must admit, I have no problem with it being performed by a jackhammer on a lawyer...

What you refuse to accept is that I have a different opinion and that I am entitled to it. Shakespeare was so right when he wrote that bit in Henry V...Why don't you learn to understand what the mods have made clear and stop flaming! This message has been cleaned up by Czardas's censors due to fears that the copious overuse of expletives will offend people.

~Czardas, Supreme Ruler of the Universe

They can, and they are. That's why I make sure not to be human. :D


~Czardas, Supreme Twi'lek of the Universe


you're a Twi'lek then? Good dancers... but not much else. :D

I'm assuming that's a misquote because it's impossible to penetrate a man's vagina :p
S/he had it pretty close.
Leviticus 18:22
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."(King James Version)

"Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable."(NIV)

you're a Twi'lek then? Good dancers... but not much else. :DYou misquoter!!

~Czardas, Supreme Ruler (as in king, emperor, sovereign, lord, maharajah, shah, sultan) of the Universe

S/he had it pretty close.
Leviticus 18:22
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."(King James Version)

"Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable."(NIV)Well, it's not very easy to lie with a man as one lies with a woman.


And what if you're a woman? You can sleep with someone of the same sex, but not of a different one. The Bible actually promotes homosexuality!

~Czardas, Supreme Ruler of the Universe

Well, it's not very easy to lie with a man as one lies with a woman.


And what if you're a woman? You can sleep with someone of the same sex, but not of a different one. The Bible actually promotes homosexuality!
That's why I am not quite sure on what that verse is really supposed to mean.

That's why I am not quite sure on what that verse is really supposed to mean.
It has been intepreted in the way that conservatives wish it to be interpreted. Isn't that lovely?

It has been intepreted in the way that conservatives wish it to be interpreted. Isn't that lovely?

Par for the course. IMHO, being a good Christian belies devoting yourself to any organised religion as well....but for those people, it's all about control.

Tennessee county, site of `Monkey Trial,' wants to charge gays with crimes against nature




You mean because they go to church or pay tax?

No animal was ever seen doing this.