NationStates Jolt Archive

BAD NEWS:
LEONSTEIN GOT DEATED!!!

:eek: :eek: :eek: :(

This is not good.

Why?

Friends, we've got a tragic situation to face.
1. Leonstein got banned. Can somebody please explain the reason for it?
2. We'll have to replace him, which should happen as a result of democratic votes - expressed by registered members (up to this moment), unless others express a wish to join the Party in due time and those already included as members allow it (orderly, please). I propose that if the latter happens, the rule should be that these can only be people who have already expressed themselves as sympathizers (i.e.: in this forum, up to this moment).
3. The term for elections should be extended (we live on different hemispheres) - I propose 48 hours. The election shall not be a poll, of course - it should be in this very forum, as messages expressed by those fitting in the categories already mentioned (members, perhaps sympathizers as well).
4. I propose we also send telegrams to those included to inform them of the events (just in case they did not bump into the forum).

Friends, we've got a tragic situation to face.
1. Leonstein got banned. Can somebody please explain the reason for it?
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9819914&postcount=28
ARF-COM and IBTL is an idiot!!!:mad:
2. We'll have to replace him, which should happen as a result of democratic votes - expressed by registered members (up to this moment), unless others express a wish to join the Party in due time and those already included as members allow it (orderly, please). I propose that if the latter happens, the rule should be that these can only be people who have already expressed themselves as sympathizers (i.e.: in this forum, up to this moment).I got ideas to get Leonstein back online (hopefully legally) which I will post later after this post.
3. The term for elections should be extended (we live on different hemispheres) - I propose 48 hours. The election shall not be a poll, of course - it should be in this very forum, as messages expressed by those fitting in the categories already mentioned (members, perhaps sympathizers as well).Great!
4. I propose we also send telegrams to those included to inform them of the events (just in case they did not bump into the forum).Good idea!

BTW I think Katganistan's action is very questionnable.

Edit: does anybody got Leonstein's e-mail???

-snip-
We have to clarify something. I'm sending you a telegram about it.

I just read that Leonstein was DEATed, I wanted to give you my condolences. I highly respected him.

I just read that Leonstein was DEATed, I wanted to give you my condolences. I highly respected him.
Thanks Neo, you're a great guy.

Argersia, I sent you my proposal through the telegram.;)

He got deleted? Damn. now what? There's few enough of us as it is.

Argersia is proposing a election. I am proposing a different idea, but I don't want to post my proposal in the NS forums because if i do, I'll get chased by mods. Do you want me to TG my proposal to you?

*Sigh*... DSP will be different without Leonstein.:(

Edit:

BTW I think it's safe enough to post part of my proposal, here it is:

***

Here's my proposal to protest Leostein's deletion and [black out] [black out]:

The demonstration is divided into [black out] phases.

<PHASE 1>
1. Held a petition for Leonstein's reinstatement and submit the signatures to the moderators.

2. Held a discussion (or negotiation) to pressure the moderators in the moderation forum.

***

How to start your own party, and when is the next elections?

The main problem with the mods decision to ban Leonstein was that they allowed pictures of American soldiers taking aim at Iraqis, all "nice" and "clean" (posted as part of the same crap mood of patriotic furor), but not the results of the very same actions. I consider tham "graphic" just as well - you see people taking aim at others, and you know they are not shooting holy water and blossoms.
It is really overdone. I spent time on a forum started by a perplexing/perplexed Nazi kid. I mean, his first statement was something like "the Jews are still at it". He considered himself a "National-Socialist" and held Hitler in high regard. The mod on duty said "he will outgrow it".
Another guy, from Israel, advocated a "preventive strike" on Muslims, which included mass-murder to counter the "threat of Islam". I started debating that, and he posted a link to a site maintained by extremists in Republika Srpska (from Radovan Karadzic' party). It showed a mound of human skulls (graphic enough?). I checked his country out, and his flag is the symbol of a fascist group in Israel (listed as racist under US law, even) - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kach_and_Kahane_Chai .
Just the other day, somebody was saying that "Italians are not really white, since they are the result of Moorish cross-breeding" (ok, it's not necessarly insulting, but it is racist).
Not to mention my unanswered complaint about a message in post 1 of a certain forum: "and to all emo rock fans out there, a big f*ck you".

See my point?

Okay, I'm possibly risking my neck here, but here's what happened.

I posted the pictures with the same line of thinking that Argesia had above.
They were graphic, and quite frankly disgusting, but I felt that in the context of glorifying war, some sort of counterweight was appropriate. Afterall, I'm not against war because someone told me to - when I think of war, pictures like these are among the first things I consider. People watch "Saving Private Ryan" and think it courageous to show guts hanging out of people as an anti-war statement. People think it's okay to talk about how many people got killed today. Everything to preserve our emotional detachment - I don't see why we need such a difference.
Apparently other people think differently.

Anyways, I sent a telegram to Katganistan, and here's what I got:
Hello there, this is Leonstein (or used to be).
I understand that moderation is supposed to act based on rules, and I admit that it was my mistake not to have realised the heading in the "General Forum Rulings and good General advice" thread was a link to the actual rules.
Nonetheless, I couldn't find any rules regarding what is considered an immediate deletion offense. Could you point it out for me?

What is the normal procedure if one wants to have a case re-examined?
I think I do have a case:
a) I've seen similar links posted in threads regarding Zimbabwe and the Mugabe Regime as well as Japanese war crimes in China - although I'm afraid without the Search Function, finding them will be difficult.
b) It seems to be completely open to the moderator's tastes regarding the matter what is considered "obscene" or "offensive". Surely more than one opinion should be required to ban someone indefinitely (particularly when that person has never had trouble with the mods before, and this is a "one strike and you're out"-offense).
c) I openly said in the thread that if the mods do indeed find the link to be problematic, I'd be happy to take it down. Instead I find myself deleted when I come back from Uni - How am I supposed to interpret that kind of behaviour?

If in a fair re-examination of this you guys come to the conclusion that I maliciously defied the rules and deserve to be kicked out, I'll accept that.
But surely there has got to be a proper process for this, rather than what happened today.

Thanks,
The Poster formerly known as Leonstein
:p

And this is the response:
http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/37015/page=faq#etiquette

What can't I post?

Any content that is:

* obscene
* illegal
* threatening
* malicious
* defamatory
* spam

This applies to your nation's name, motto, and other customizable fields, any messages you write, images you post, or any other content you upload or link to NationStates. If you do, your nation will be deleted. See the site's Terms & Conditions for details.

Also please see:
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8784641&postcount=3

This is a forum utilized by schools, and some of the users are quite young. The link was simply inappropriate for them, and was certainly not worksafe.

Graphic images of aborted fetuses, porn, and of grievous bodily harm, as well as "shock" pics, have always gotten the poster deleted. Several other posters, I believe, tried to warn you to take down the link; however, you delayed and said you'd wait for moderation intervention. Deletion was the moderation intervention.

If you still feel that your deletion was in error despite this explanation, I invite you to post your question to the Moderation forum or to the Getting Help page where another moderator will be able to help you.

This does not mean you are not welcome to use another nation on the forums; however, I suggest reading the One Stop Rules Shop and perhaps asking before posting content that may be considered questionable.

So it seems I did break the rules (although what constitutes such a breach is not outlined - it seems to be completely up to the mod what is considered obscene and what isn't)
I still believe that the reaction was overly harsh, and that at no point did I act in any malicious way - to me at least it seems like Katganistan acted out of the gut on this, a gut that had just been shaken by those images.
And finally, as far as work- or school-safety is considered, I don't think a thread about whether one has had a threesome can go into that category either.

That being said, apparently my forumban has been qualified so as to allow me to use other nations. Nonetheless, I'm not happy, and I want my nation back to be honest.
Question is whether there's much of a point to it, or whether I just risk copping further punishment.

We'll always see you as Leonstein. Good to have you back.

We'll always see you as Leonstein. Good to have you back.
Thanks, but still: If they now allow me to use another nation to post - then why delete it at all?
It's not like it makes a difference what name the nation has when it comes to rule-breaking.

Thanks, but still: If they now allow me to use another nation to post - then why delete it at all?
It's not like it makes a difference what name the nation has when it comes to rule-breaking.
It's supposed to teach you a lesson I suppose.

It's supposed to teach you a lesson I suppose.
See post 261. What lessons are tought to those people?

See post 261. What lessons are tought to those people?
I said that's the purpose of punishment, to serve as a disincentive to do something. I'm not saying I agree with the decision, I was merely stating the purpose.

I said that's the purpose of punishment, to serve as a disincentive to do something. I'm not saying I agree with the decision, I was merely stating the purpose.
I didn't say you were. I was just pointing out more absurdities.

Well, I guess I've got no choice but accept the verdict. But I do so grudgingly - I feel the context in which the link was posted was not taken into account.
Anyways, I'll make a new nation now...

And here we go.
Let's hope that was all the trouble for this week.:rolleyes:

And here we go.
Let's hope that was all the trouble for this week.:rolleyes:
Welcome.

Could I join?

Could I join?
Yes, you can consider yourself a member.
There's not much to it really, but if you have any ideas for proposals we could make for the parliament, then feel free.
:)

And here we go.
Let's hope that was all the trouble for this week.:rolleyes:
welcome back, it's good to see you'll be sticking around.

So, when do we get to work?

well, here comes the 3rd NS general elections, any ideas anybody?

bump

Where's everybody? We got an election to win! ;)

I'm thinking that maybe we need to redo the manifesto. The Odd One seems to have gone the way of all earthly things, and other parties have a better formatted and structured, and better-looking, manifesto.

So I propose we start a new thread, with the first post a revised manifesto, and visually appealing as it should be for NSG's biggest party.

I'm thinking that maybe we need to redo the manifesto. The Odd One seems to have gone the way of all earthly things, and other parties have a better formatted and structured, and better-looking, manifesto.

So I propose we start a new thread, with the first post a revised manifesto, and visually appealing as it should be for NSG's biggest party.Yeah, where the hell is The Odd One. Btw, I think a new DSP thread would be a great idea.

Yeah, where the hell is The Odd One. Btw, I think a new DSP thread would be a great idea.
You've been doing the logo design, so I would think it might be a good idea if you started the new thread. I'll propose a reworked manifesto tomorrow which would replace the current one, if the others (or those who are actually still around) agree.

well, here's the new thread: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=10559437#post10559437

One question, how will radical, islamic, extremists be dealt with when they use terrorism to try and establish a theocracy under Sharia law and Shiite control?

same question should Christians, Jews, Buddists, etc. become as extreme in their actions as radical islamics.

I'm joining