NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N05536306.htm

Venezuela, Brazil world leaders in gun deaths-UN
06 May 2005 03:29:58 GMT

Source: Reuters

BRASILIA, Brazil, May 5 (Reuters) - Venezuela and Brazil have the highest gun death rates in the world, according to a U.N. study released on Thursday in Brazil as the country's legislators considered a referendum to ban firearm sales.

Gun murders are the leading cause of death in Brazil, which ranked second only to Venezuela in gun murders out of 57 countries studied by the United Nations report.

In Venezuela, 22.15 people out of every 100,000 are murdered with guns, while 21.72 are killed in Brazil.

Those rates were higher than for Israel, which has an armed conflict with the Palestinians. At the bottom of the ranking was Japan with a rate of 0.06 people, according to the United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) study.

Brazil's Congress is considering a national referendum this year to ask whether the sale of arms should be prohibited in a country said to have the world's highest number of murders.

Brazil imposed tough controls in 2003 that made it illegal for ordinary citizens to own guns and set tough prison sentences for people found carrying them illegally.

Latin America's biggest nation is still awash with as many as 20 million unregistered and illegal firearms.

Guns overtook traffic accidents as the leading cause of death in Brazil in the 1990s. Between 35,000 and 40,000 Brazilians are killed each year by firearms.

_________________________________________________________________

So they find out that gun control doesn't work, but they choose to opt for more gun control? Real smart. America's gun crime rates are going down, and gun laws are becoming more and more lax. Theirs are becoming Draconian and their crimes keep going up.

If anything, this should be a lesson to you all. Gun control isn't about guns, it's about control. Their government doesn't care about reason or logic. They just care about disarming their populace. Meanwhile, rogue police officers are wreaking havoc and murdering disarmed civilians.

So Brazil outlaws guns as a result to rampant gun violence, and because gun violence doesn't instantly, gun control doesn't work. That makes a lot of sense.

It's been two years of crackdowns and other measures. Didn't result in anything but it going up.

Brazil never actually implemented the controls that were proposed in 2003. The whole project got locked up in the arguing over vested interests. It was partiucularly newsworthy in the town where I live as one of the major industries here is gun manufacture, (the other being chainsaws makes for it being a peaceful little town with the two army barracks as well.)

Gun death in Brazil, however, is almost totally restricted to the wars between drug gangs and their conflicts with heavily armed police in the major cities, as well as one or two particularly stupid criminals in any given area. There are some deaths due to stray bullets, and these make national news when they happen, so not that common.

No gun control has been implemented as of yet, As the report makes clear in the lines preceding the highlighted ones, we are awaiting a promised referendum on the subject. I think Reuters got themselves a bit confused here.

So, Reuters is wrong when they say: "Brazil imposed tough controls in 2003 that made it illegal for ordinary citizens to own guns and set tough prison sentences for people found carrying them illegally." ???

Yet, Brazil did these things. Right?

So they find out that gun control doesn't work, but they choose to opt for more gun control? Real smart. America's gun crime rates are going down, and gun laws are becoming more and more lax. Theirs are becoming Draconian and their crimes keep going up.

If anything, this should be a lesson to you all. Gun control isn't about guns, it's about control. Their government doesn't care about reason or logic. They just care about disarming their populace. Meanwhile, rogue police officers are wreaking havoc and murdering disarmed civilians.
Gun control will work differently in different countries with different cultures and attitudes towards guns. what works in one country might not work in another.

thats the only reasonable conclusion anybody can possibly come to regarding gun laws worldwide.

Gun control works in countries that usually racially homogenous and have never had a lot of violent crime resulting in homicide. Japan is an example of this.

Meanwhile, Switzerland is awash with them. But it's the same exact thing, only opposite. They have guns, Japan doesn't. Both have low homicide rates.

What you said is largely true. However, one must question the morality of taking weapons used to defend one's self from criminals on the streets and those in government. The natural right to self-defense is the bedrock of civilization.

So, Reuters is wrong when they say: "Brazil imposed tough controls in 2003 that made it illegal for ordinary citizens to own guns and set tough prison sentences for people found carrying them illegally." ???

Yet, Brazil did these things. Right?

No, Brazil's congress debated these controls, there were proposals made, ideas suggested, arguments heard, but NOTHING was actually done. This is a very normal process in Latin America. Lots of noise and posturing, political capital being made left, right and centre, but in the end absolutely no change in the situation. It is the same thing with land reform, with nuclear power, with tax reform, with social security, with corruption crackdowns, with a judicial system overhaul, with prison review etc. etc.

I can go into a sports store now and buy a gun if I want to. In this case Reuters is wrong. I can understand how they came to believe that gun control has been implemented here, as even the US government believes it and it is difficult to know when something has or has not become law hhere. The fact, living here, is that if it did get off the drawing board and became law, no-one seems to know it happened, and as such, it may just as well not have happened.

OK. The UNESCO Brazil site says:

O Brasil registra a segunda maior taxa de mortes causadas por armas de fogo entre 57 países pesquisados pela UNESCO no Brasil (Organização das Nações Unidas para a Educação, a Ciência e a Cultura), ficando atrás apenas da Venezuela. São 21,72 pessoas mortas por armas de fogo em cada grupo de 100 mil habitantes. O estudo comparativo foi entregue hoje, às 15h, pelo Representante da UNESCO no Brasil, Jorge Werthein, ao Presidente da Câmara dos Deputados, Severino Cavalcanti, a fim de sensibilizar o Congresso para que agilize a votação do decreto que prevê a realização do referendo popular sobre o fim da livre comercialização de armas no País. O deputado informou ao Representante da UNESCO no Brasil que o decreto será a primeira matéria a ser votada pelo plenário da Câmara dos Deputados logo após o fim da obstrução da pauta.
Source (http://www.unesco.org.br/noticias/ultimas/severino/noticias_view)


Translating into English:
Brazil recorded the second highest mortality rate caused by firearms amongst the 57 countries examined by UNESCO in Brazil (United Nations Organization for Science, Education and Culture) being behind just Venezuela. There are 21.72 people killed by firearms for each 100 thousand of the population. The comparative study was delivered today, at 15:00, by the representative of UNESCO in Brazil, Jorge Werethin, the the president of the house of representatives (deputies), Severinho Cavalcanti, with the intent of sensitizing Congress to promote the vote on the holding of a popular referendum on the ending of the free trade in weapons in the country. The deputy informed the representative of UNESCO in Brazil that the decree would be the first item to be voted on by Congress soon after the end of the blockage on the agenda.

Note the part highlighted. Brazil, currently, has no arms control. Reuters did get it wrong.

Edit: I have translated as literally as possible, which makes the grammar structure in English horrible, but this is to avoid any accusations of mistranslation.

What you said is largely true. However, one must question the morality of taking weapons used to defend one's self from criminals on the streets and those in government. The natural right to self-defense is the bedrock of civilization.

Sorry just a stupid swed but is not the bed rock of society that you should not need to defend yourself and personally use the a eye for a eye and that you instead real on the society to garantie safety? Because it was before civilization you needed to have a big rock to defend yourself.