NationStates Jolt Archive


How far should science go? Human brain in mice?

Mistme
01-05-2005, 06:37
http://www.cnn.com/2005/TECH/science/04/29/human.animal.mixing.ap/index.html

Creating 'human-animals' for research
Ethics report endorses mingling human cells with lesser beings


THE ISSUE: The biological co-mingling of animal and human is evolving into exotic and unsettling human-animal hybrids that bring to mind the chimeras of ancient myth.

THE RESEARCH: Scientists have created pigs with human blood, mice with brain cells and rabbit eggs fused with human genetic material.

THE CONCERNS: Critics worry that one of these experiments could create an animal with human traits, especially in work where human and animal brain cells are co-mingled.

THE SOLUTION: The National Academies, in a recent report, said mixing human and animal cells could be vital to advancing medicine. But the Academies recommend that each proposed experiment be first reviewed by an ethics board created at each research institution. It also proposed banning the mixing human embryonic stem cells with monkey and other primate embryos.

RENO, Nevada (AP) -- On a farm about six miles outside this gambling town, Jason Chamberlain looks over a flock of about 50 smelly sheep, many of them possessing partially human livers, hearts, brains and other organs.

The University of Nevada-Reno researcher talks matter-of-factly about his plans to euthanize one of the pregnant sheep in a nearby lab.

He can't wait to examine the effects of the human cells he had injected into the fetus' brain about two months ago.

"It's mice on a large scale," Chamberlain says with a shrug.

As strange as his work may sound, it falls firmly within the new ethics guidelines the influential National Academies issued this past week for stem cell research.

In fact, the Academies' report endorses research that co-mingles human and animal tissue as vital to ensuring that experimental drugs and new tissue replacement therapies are safe for people.

The National Academies -- private, nonprofit agencies chartered by Congress to provide public advice on science and technology -- consist of the National Academy of Sciences, the National Academy of Engineering, the Institute of Medicine and the National Research Council.

Doctors have transplanted pig valves into human hearts for years, and scientists have injected human cells into lab animals for even longer.

But the biological co-mingling of animal and human is now evolving into even more exotic and unsettling mixes of species, evoking the Greek myth of the monstrous chimera, which was part lion, part goat and part serpent.

In the past two years, scientists have created pigs with human blood, fused rabbit eggs with human DNA and injected human stem cells to make paralyzed mice walk.

Particularly worrisome to some scientists are the nightmare scenarios that could arise from the mixing of brain cells: What if a human mind somehow got trapped inside a sheep's head?

The "idea that human neuronal cells might participate in 'higher order' brain functions in a nonhuman animal, however unlikely that may be, raises concerns that need to be considered," the Academies report warned.

In January, an informal ethics committee at Stanford University endorsed a proposal to create mice with brains nearly completely made of human brain cells.

Stem cell scientist Irving Weissman said his experiment could provide unparalleled insight into how the human brain develops and how degenerative brain diseases like Parkinson's progress.

Stanford law professor Hank Greely, who chaired the ethics committee, said the board was satisfied that the size and shape of the mouse brain would prevent the human cells from creating any traits of humanity.

Just in case, Greely said, the committee recommended closely monitoring the mice's behavior and immediately killing any that display human-like behavior.

The Academies' report recommends that each institution involved in stem cell research create a formal, standing committee to specifically oversee the work, including experiments that mix human and animal cells.

Weissman, who has already created mice with 1 percent human brain cells, said he has no immediate plans to make mostly human mouse brains, but wanted to get ethical clearance in any case.

A formal Stanford committee that oversees research at the university would also need to authorize the experiment.
Living factories

Few human-animal hybrids are as advanced as the sheep created by another stem cell scientist, Esmail Zanjani, and his team at the University of Nevada-Reno.

They want to one day turn sheep into living factories for human organs and tissues and along the way create cutting-edge lab animals to more effectively test experimental drugs.

Zanjani is most optimistic about the sheep that grow partially human livers after human stem cells are injected into them while they are still in the womb.

Most of the adult sheep in his experiment contain about 10 percent human liver cells, though a few have as much as 40 percent, Zanjani said.

Because the human liver regenerates, the research raises the possibility of transplanting partial organs into people whose livers are failing.

Zanjani must first ensure no animal diseases would be passed on to patients.

He also must find an efficient way to completely separate the human and sheep cells, a tough task because the human cells aren't clumped together but are rather spread throughout the sheep's liver.

Zanjani and other stem cell scientists defend their research and insist they aren't creating monsters -- or anything remotely human.

"We haven't seen them act as anything but sheep," Zanjani said.

Zanjani's goals are many years from being realized.

He's also had trouble raising funds, and the U.S. Department of Agriculture is investigating the university over allegations made by another researcher that the school mishandled its research sheep.

Zanjani declined to comment on that matter, and university officials have stood by their practices.
Ethical boundaries

Allegations about the proper treatment of lab animals may take on strange new meanings as scientists work their way up the evolutionary chart.

Human stem cells have been injected into mice and now sheep. Such research blurs biological divisions between species that couldn't until now be breached.

Drawing ethical boundaries that no research appears to have crossed yet, the National Academies recommend a prohibition on mixing human stem cells with embryos from monkeys and other primates.

But even that policy recommendation isn't tough enough for some researchers.

"The boundary is going to push further into larger animals," New York Medical College professor Stuart Newman said. "That's just asking for trouble."

Newman and anti-biotechnology activist Jeremy Rifkin have been tracking this issue for the last decade and were behind a rather creative assault on both interspecies mixing and the government's policy of patenting individual human genes and other living matter.

Years ago, the two applied for a patent for what they called a "humanzee," a hypothetical -- but very possible -- creation that was half human and chimp.

The U.S. Patent and Trademark Office finally denied their application this year, ruling that the proposed invention was too human: Constitutional prohibitions against slavery prevent the patenting of people.

Newman and Rifkin were delighted, since they never intended to create the creature and instead wanted to use their application to protest what they see as science and commerce turning people into commodities.

And that's a point, Newman warns, that stem scientists are edging closer to every day: "Once you are on the slope, you tend to move down it."
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I can live with human lungs/hearts/livers in animals for testing, but brains!?!? I dunno, but that's a bit creepy...
How far should science go? Laissez-fair?
Kelleda
01-05-2005, 06:41
This is why we have ethics. "Would life supremely suck for this creature if we did <action>?"

And I'm amused they kill the ones that HAVE humanlike behavior. Killing the ones that have potential... that's not right. Well... unless life DID supremely suck for them. Or the humanlike behavior was a predilection for reality shows. Either one would be an act of mercy.
Yevon the Third
01-05-2005, 06:42
Initial Post Too Long. Sum It Up In Under Five (5) Lines
Powerhungry Chipmunks
01-05-2005, 07:06
(The original post is fine for me, but maybe that's just my interest in journalism)

I think, and recent ethics guidelines seem to agree with me (if I heard the NPR report correctly), that human life-tampering, especially human brain-tampering is absolutely unethical in the science community.

No one wants to be the one allowing rich parents to ask doctors, "Hey doc, how much is it to give little Timmy a Nobel prize? How bout a Pulitzer?"
Reformentia
01-05-2005, 07:12
Initial Post Too Long. Sum It Up In Under Five (5) Lines

With All Due Respect. If You Can't Handle Reading More Than Five (5) Lines Consider Getting Off The TEXT BASED INTERNET DISCUSSION FORUM And Go Watch TV .
The Cat-Tribe
01-05-2005, 07:13
Initial Post Too Long. Sum It Up In Under Five (5) Lines

Perhaps if you aren't willing to read beyond 5 lines, you don't really have a serious opinion about the ethics of genetic medical research.
Yevon the Third
01-05-2005, 07:14
With All Due Respect. If You Can't Handle Reading More Than Five (5) Lines Consider Getting Off The TEXT BASED INTERNET DISCUSSION FORUM And Go Watch TV .
There's nothing good on at 2:00 am ;)
Laskin Yahoos
02-05-2005, 06:24
Morality-based issues aside, this could create potentially devastating practical problems. Putting human cells into a chicken, for instance, is a great way to start another influenza pandemic and kill millions of people.
Samaran
02-05-2005, 06:43
well, not if proper precautions are taken.

I for one believe science should go as far as it can. Reagrding the main problem people have with this type of research: a human mind could not exist in a non human body, the sensory input, physical atributes, neural distribution and so on of non humans do not lend themselves to human style thinking. Even a direct transplant of a fetal human brain into a fetal non human would fail, The resulting organism (assuming the brain wasn't rejected) would have none of the instincts necesary for long term survival in its body and would have none of the necesary equipment for acting on the instincts it does have for survival. The same problem goes all the way up and down the developemental ladder, A human brain/non human hybrid would never survive outside of laboratory conditions and would never be able to develope self awareness. I'll stand by that until a sheep passes a turing test (A test capable of determining self aware behavior from instictual or learned behavior, currently capable of being spoofed but not without a lot of work)
Imperial Dark Rome
02-05-2005, 08:01
Science should have no limit. Especially if it helps the U.S. military.

Posted by the Satanic Priest, Lord Medivh
BLARGistania
02-05-2005, 08:36
There was an article that ran in the NYTimes a few days ago about stem cell research finally getting the marginal go-ahead by the Bush administration.

One of the basic points of the article was that the National Science Academy, the top rated scientists in the US, came up with a set of guidelines to preform stem cell research. The major issue involved human-animals (known as Chimeras) . What the NSA said was that this practice will be banned.

You will never see a mouse with a human-equivilant brain under set scientific experimentation procedures.
Straughn
02-05-2005, 19:51
With All Due Respect. If You Can't Handle Reading More Than Five (5) Lines Consider Getting Off The TEXT BASED INTERNET DISCUSSION FORUM And Go Watch TV .
Hallelujah!
*props to Reformentia and The Cat-Tribe*
Straughn
02-05-2005, 19:54
There was an article that ran in the NYTimes a few days ago about stem cell research finally getting the marginal go-ahead by the Bush administration.

One of the basic points of the article was that the National Science Academy, the top rated scientists in the US, came up with a set of guidelines to preform stem cell research. The major issue involved human-animals (known as Chimeras) . What the NSA said was that this practice will be banned.

You will never see a mouse with a human-equivilant brain under set scientific experimentation procedures.
Interesting turn from his stance in Puerto Rico a little while back, though ...


Taken from RBM Online Volume 10 January 1 2005
In 2003, a motion to prevent cloning worldwide was proposed to the UN by a Catholic country, Puerto Rico, and supported by the USA among other nations. A single vote led to the suspension of the motion for further discussions, in view of hesitations or opposition from Moslem and other nations. Proponents threatened to renew their motion in 2004, which led to numerous submissions from many governments and organizations on the pros and cons of the proposed motion. Strenuous objections were received from leading scientific and medical organizations in many countries. Objectors included the U.S. National Academy of Sciences.
Proponents included President Bush who recently addressed the UN, demanding that the total moratorium on all forms of cloning and human embryo stem cells must be accepted since these advances in reproductive biomedicine affronted human dignity.
It must be rare for such a conflict to arise between a country’s president and its most senior scientific institution. In late November 2004, and despite immense pressure and support from the Vatican and many Catholic countries, the motion was thrown out, perhaps for ever, killed by ‘frantic campaigning by such organizations as the Genetics Policy Institute that led to around half the member countries in UN rejecting the American way’ (Ahuja, 2004). The US dropped its ambitions to introduce strict rules on prevention since the UN was split down the middle and any showdown would be futile. The motion has become now a watered-down ‘declaration’ that is seemingly not a treaty, is non-binding on member countries and is a triumph for nations determined to pursue good biomedicine. Credit goes to Belgium especially for pushing three alternatives and Italy for designing the compromise resolution. Britain’s system of domestic bans on reproductive cloning and acceptance of therapeutic cloning offered a model that may prove attractive to other member nations.
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Again it might seem that either Bush is a Flip-flopper or simply doesn't have the understanding required to tackle issues like this until everyone else makes up his mind.
Or both. *sigh*
Drunk commies reborn
02-05-2005, 19:56
Science should have no limit. Especially if it helps the U.S. military.

Posted by the Satanic Priest, Lord Medivh
Agreed with one small modification. It should also help the US economy.
Dempublicents1
02-05-2005, 20:54
Things like this would help with transplant crises and with drug and device creation for medicine in humans.

There are, obviously, ethical issues and they are quite clearly being discussed and dealt with. =)

Meanwhile, the idea that a small percentage of cells being human will somehow make a creature act human (even if those cells are in the brain) is pretty far-fetched. There is way too much outside of single cells or even clusters of cells that affects development.
Syniks
02-05-2005, 21:08
The last time Mice wanted a human brain it was because the Earth had been blown up... so I'm against it.