NationStates Jolt Archive

I stull don't get why so many people thought that the two sequels to the matrix sucked so badly. I enjoyed them. Could anyone please explain this sentiment?

The majority of cinema going audiances didnt understand it.
I hated it but i understood it.
I just dont like the series.

The Matrix was a tough film to live up to, but I think the Wachowski brothers did it fairly well. I understood, and loved the whole series

The Matrix Revolutions trully was diabolical. It turned what was an intriguing philosophical film into an average Hollywood film, full of gung ho shooting.

Apparently you missed a large portion of The Matrix. You know, like that whole scene in the army base.

The Matrix Revolutions trully was diabolical. It turned what was an intriguing philosophical film into an average Hollywood film, full of gung ho shooting.

Revolutions was always going to be a showdown sort of movie. It's the third act. Much like the original Star Wars Trilogy. You expect a showdown.

The second movie's problem was that it moved too slowly.

It isn't that the sequals sucked. ALL THREE of them sucked.

It isn't that the sequals sucked. ALL THREE of them sucked.

Which is your opinion, and you're entitled to it. Regardless of whether I think it's valid or not. :)

The first one had, I dunno, a plot. The second and thirds were trite and dumb to watch. The first one made you feel like wow, what a good movie even though it has Keanu. The second and third made you feel like wow, what a stupid movie, and not even entirely Keanu's fault. The first one had believable twists and characterizations and a neat philosophical symmetry. The second and third tried but failed, and that is what everyone senses about the movie. It's not that we don't "get" them. There's nothing to get! The idea for the Matrix was good but didn't need a sequel. Kind of like the Bible.

Reload didn't really serve any purpose beside filling in gaps that could've been filled with five minutes of dilouge.

Reload didn't really serve any purpose beside filling in gaps that could've been filled with five minutes of dilouge.

True. They definitely spent too much time in Zion.

Apparently you missed a large portion of The Matrix. You know, like that whole scene in the army base.
Yeh.... that wasn't an army base. Buildings don't have to be military bases to have soliders in them. It was military-controlled, controlled being the key word

The first one had, I dunno, a plot. The second and thirds were trite and dumb to watch. The first one made you feel like wow, what a good movie even though it has Keanu. The second and third made you feel like wow, what a stupid movie, and not even entirely Keanu's fault. The first one had believable twists and characterizations and a neat philosophical symmetry. The second and third tried but failed, and that is what everyone senses about the movie. It's not that we don't "get" them. There's nothing to get! The idea for the Matrix was good but didn't need a sequel. Kind of like the Bible.

I agree. I know it was all a biblical parable, but the second and third ones got WAY too Jesus-y.

Which is your opinion, and you're entitled to it. Regardless of whether I think it's valid or not. :)

Thanks. I saw the first one in the theatres, the second on DVD and the third in the theatre again (not my choice!). I was bored to tears. They really could have done so much more with it.

The whole concept of the matrix as introduced in the first movie was a wonderful philosophical mind-f**k. Then came the second movie, which expanded on it, but left you with the absolutely huge mind-f**k when Neo started doing matrixy stunts in the "real world." My wife and I left the theater after the second movie even more excited than the first one, talking about all the implications of that, and what it meant for the next installment.

All the scenarios we came up with were infinitely better than the crap that was unloaded on us in the third movie. It stunk. The brothers Wachowski must have had a brainstorm session, trying to figure out how they're going to end the series, and then thrown away all the ideas that didn't suck. The third movie was so bad, my wife and I have decided it never happened. And we're still looking forward to the real ending.

Did anyone see/like The Animatrix??

Did anyone see/like The Animatrix??

I saw bits of it. I'm not an anime fan, but the parts I saw were ok. It was interesting to see The Matrix without the special effects.

All the scenarios we came up with were infinitely better than the crap that was unloaded on us in the third movie. It stunk. The brothers Wachowski must have had a brainstorm session, trying to figure out how they're going to end the series, and then thrown away all the ideas that didn't suck. The third movie was so bad, my wife and I have decided it never happened. And we're still looking forward to the real ending.I thought I knew what the third movie would be like.

At the end fo the second movie we saw Neo do something 'impossible'.

When we say him 'see' in 'firey matrix'-style vision I was convinced that he was merely 'one level out' from the 'green character-cascade' matrix, not in real life.

But that wasn't exploited.

/That/ I could have believed. I could have believed that your 20th/21st Century simulation was for the majority of people, with imperfections to keep them sane, that the 'dark future' world was a simulation to satisfy those who still didn't believe it and further out is reality? Reality could have been "cyber-geeks" in a CyberPunk setting (or a Better-Than-Life scenario for those familiar with that reference) playing a MMORPG, or the ultimate Reality TV sho, or a penitentiary sentencing people to certain types of life (either rehabilitative or as punishment), or it could have been a Dark City-style "What do humans do?" thing, or it could even be aliens 'pretending' to be human, on the same relative scale as we play Pac-Man...

And not everyone need have been real (even at the Zion level), because reality is what is provided... Our type of 'Real life' was relevaled to be fake, so why couldn't the 'Real people' in it?

Loads of scope. Wasted.

Good effects, shame about the plot.


(BTW, I give Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy five towels out of five... ;))

I thought I knew what the third movie would be like.

At the end fo the second movie we saw Neo do something 'impossible'.

When we say him 'see' in 'firey matrix'-style vision I was convinced that he was merely 'one level out' from the 'green character-cascade' matrix, not in real life.

That's what my wife and I thought, too. We figured Zion was just another simulation, designed to pacify the 1% who rejected the matrix. The One was a statistical anomaly who had the potential to reject both, so all these other programs were designed to steer him into the mainframe and end him in a system reboot... with the Oracle playing the part of manipulator.

In the second movie, Neo refuses to enter the system, and he becomes the first "One" to break the cycle. His magical fireball thingy starts him waking from the matrix. What does he find when he wakes up? Billions of possibilities. Conflict is created by the fact that he is the ONLY human who is awake. He needs to fight for survival (of course, there would be no sentinels, because why would they be needed when everyone has been asleep for generations?), while somehow finding a way to hack back into Zion and wake his friends.

That's the real third movie. Someone needs to make it.

That's what my wife and I thought, too. We figured Zion was just another simulation, designed to pacify the 1% who rejected the matrix. The One was a statistical anomaly who had the potential to reject both, so all these other programs were designed to steer him into the mainframe and end him in a system reboot... with the Oracle playing the part of manipulator.

In the second movie, Neo refuses to enter the system, and he becomes the first "One" to break the cycle. His magical fireball thingy starts him waking from the matrix. What does he find when he wakes up? Billions of possibilities. Conflict is created by the fact that he is the ONLY human who is awake. He needs to fight for survival (of course, there would be no sentinels, because why would they be needed when everyone has been asleep for generations?), while somehow finding a way to hack back into Zion and wake his friends.

That's the real third movie. Someone needs to make it.

That is the first time I've heard this theory... I love it.

Thanks. I saw the first one in the theatres, the second on DVD and the third in the theatre again (not my choice!). I was bored to tears. They really could have done so much more with it.

Don't mention it. :)

Didn't mean any of that by the way. Just felt like saying that. I'm feeling very random today.

My wife and I left the theater after the second movie even more excited than the first one, talking about all the implications of that, and what it meant for the next installment.

All the scenarios we came up with were infinitely better than the crap that was unloaded on us in the third movie.

The third movie was so bad, my wife and I have decided it never happened. And we're still looking forward to the real ending.

Man, and I thought I was the only one who felt like that...
My girl and I left the second one and I was all excited too; not sure where anything was going (though the proposed storyline here is a million times better.) Anyway, the next day at school I talked with my friends (Physics majors discussing the Matrix movies - hold the jokes till the end, please) and it seemed like everyone was slamming them - the hugely slow Zion orgy, the fact that everyone in Zion looked homless but they could produce hovercraft, the Neo-having-to-kiss-the-Frenchman's-girl bit (one of my classmates, a girl, noted Keanu must've written that bit himself) and, mostly, the ending. I, on the other hand, LOVED the ending, and though things were setup for som spectacular and cimactic third movie...
Which stunk to high heavens. I suppose the things I liked about it least were (in no particular order):

1. The Frenchman, revisited. What the hell was the point of having him there again?
2. The Train Station. Other than giving Neo a place to be in his coma, what was the deal with the train station? Other than, I suppose, to set up...
3. That annoying little indian girl child of two machine world programs. The JarJar of the Matrix series.
4. Her parents. ("No, it is a word!") 5 minutes into the movie and I was ready to vomit.
5. The machine killing amazons. So Zion CAN produce Hovercraft, armored exoskeletons, and that giant machine-in-the-basement, whatever it was, but their only defense against the really bad stuff are homemade rocket launcers?
6. The ammo-running kid. I guess I understand the idea: Neo has made a difference, those left behind in Zion are all struggling against the machines, yadda yadda yadda. But did it have to be a major plot point?
7. The big battle. I THINK I understand: by letting Smith absorb him, Neo (who is hardlined to the Machine World) lets the machines get at Smith...but boy, was it disappointing.
8. Big Dramatic Sunset Ending. Need I say more?

Anyway, between the last two Matrix movies and the last two Star Wars movies, the Physics department has been a grim place...

To me, the reaction to the latter two films was inevitable.
The first film held so much promise, and was better left with the "Tiger or the Lady" feeling at the end... the ultimate "what if?"

It was impossible to follow up.

Reloaded and Revolutions were massive disappointments in my eyes, but the original was just fantastic.

Shame.

I stull don't get why so many people thought that the two sequels to the matrix sucked so badly. I enjoyed them. Could anyone please explain this sentiment?I thought they didn't live up to the original, but having said that, I did enjoy them. So I've been wondering the same thing.

The first one was an innovative and original movie that holds a due place in our culture and is worth seeing.

The second and third are low quality movies and paying money to watch them is a waste of money, watching them is a waste of time.

Well, let's see.

I did understand (for the most part) the Matrix Trilogy.
The second and third films simply didn't engross us as much as the original, most likely because we are now used to the groovy special effects...
And lastly, the second and third films (at least to me), just seemed to lose their way a little and rambled on at times. The defence of Zion scene/s still kicked ass.

but didn't need a sequel. Kind of like the Bible.
Bible II: The Reckoning.

eh, I liked all three of them, and the animatrix. But then, it was really Smith that I liked. He was the epitome of the classical supervillain. He monologued, had a God complex, superpowers.... the full shiblammo. Plus if a movie does degenerate to a shooty special effect fest, I just switch off the brain and enjoy the mind candy. But like I said.... Smith, damnit! Smith!

Bible II: The Reckoning.

LotR: Book four: Morgoth strikes back.

(now that would rock.)

eh, I liked all three of them, and the animatrix. But then, it was really Smith that I liked. He was the epitome of the classical supervillain. He monologued, had a God complex, superpowers.... the full shiblammo. Plus if a movie does degenerate to a shooty special effect fest, I just switch off the brain and enjoy the mind candy. But like I said.... Smith, damnit! Smith!
i could have done without the chewing on the scenery in the third one. especially when he did the whole maniacal laugh. for five damn minutes. dude. it's not that funny.

My experience with The Matrix:

I sit in my seat (center, about 6 rows back, as usual) and watch some previews. Movie comes up, starts, all is fine. Keanu, ok, I can handle that. I've seen extremely good movies with him in it such as My Own Private Idaho and Feeling Minnesota and Parenthood.

No problem.

Then some things happen, some chick does cool things and vanishes into a phone. I'm with it so far. Then all the mess with the pills and the human pod and I stopped and said, "Hey ... Plato wrote this! About men chained in a cave. Neat."

And then it happens ... Neo's out, he's back on his feet, Morpheus starts to explain things and says the following line:

"Welcome to the Desert of the Real"

I literally threw up a little in my mouth right then and there. I wanted to punch Larry Fishburn right in the face.

I got up and walked out and never looked back.

sorry i have to say this

I LOVE THE MATRICES!!!!!


i thinks thats the plural.


i expected everyone to hate number 3 and i was right but i loved it, i felt it had heart, i was sitting on the edge of the seat the whole time ,not because my butt was knumb, but because of the suspense. and i hate it when people say the dont understand the matrix . . . . How!! it so bloody simple well IMO

1) Way too goddamn obvious.

2) Wouldn't WORK as described. That whole body heat harvesting thing isn't going to work well enough to make something like the matrix worth powering, nor is the mind required to keep tissue alive. The only explanation is that humans are being experimented with or observed. Energy generators.. FFFt.

3) Still way too goddamn obvious.

Also, that whole mosh and 'wild passion' stuff... dorky as hell.

I watched the first two and was unfortunate enough to be dragged along to babysit some college students on an outing to see the third.
I can only guess that the whole purpose of each movie was to make the previous one look good. And considering the first one was pretty damn boring with only a couple of decent action scenes, they had to dig real deep to come up with the dreck that made Matrix II.


As for Matrix III, that was one of the worst movies I have ever had the misfortune of seeing. It was so boring. Even the students, who one would assume were the target audience, were bored shitless. I can't remember one of them NOT saying how dull and crappy that movie was.

It lacked any continuity, plot or substance. The action scenes were inserted randomly just to break up the incredibly dishwater-dull monologue scenes. I remember one scene (actually this might be Matrix II, I can't remember as they're both such shit movies) where Neo is talking to some guy in Zion. It goes on and on and on for well over 10 minutes. Next Neo's off to see the black woman in the Matrix, walks into a room and a Chinese guy fights him for 5 minutes, then suddenly stops and says: "Just had to check it was you. She's out the back". Then we have another 15 minutes of tripe spewing from mouths, which is apparently meant to be cool and philosophical. It was blindingly obvious the fight scene was inserted just to break up 1/2 an hour of boring drivel. That is the sign of a crap movie, written by hacks imo. The action scene was completely unnecessary - it didn't progress the plot, the characters, or the story. Remove it and you would miss nothing from the movie.

Compare this with say X-Men II, which is a good comparison to make in so far as much as they're both action movies targeting teenagers. Now I challenge you to think of one fight scene in X-Men II that could be have been cut and the contuity to the story wouldn't have been lost. I can't think of any off-hand. Each action scene was important to the plot. And they were inserted into the story at appropriate moments between the talkie bits. Unlike this series of crapola where they're just thrown in anywhere just to stop people falling alseep or thinking they've walked into the wrong movie theatre.

And as for Laurence waddling (let's face it, he was a fatty in the third movie) around with his arms folded behind his back. That wasn't cool - he just looked like a dork. That speech he gave when at Zion -inspiring? Inspired me to check for barf bags under the cinema seats - lay it on a bit thicker, Laurence! We still don;t get what you want! And where the hell did the dance music suddenly come from - and the rain? They're underground! Oh, wait - I know: Once again to break up the monotony of lots of boring speeches and to show us men lots of half-naked wet women dancing in slo-mo. But because they couldn't think of a proper way of inserting action, they figure a music vid for MTV will work just as well.
And the ammo-running kid in Zion - please, spare me from such obvious cliches.
'You're not good enough! Go away!'
'But Neo believes in me! I can do it!'
'Oh so you have. Well done'.
Yep, didn't see that one coming.
And the forced emotional scenes, like Trinity dying. God, was that overdone and overwrought. Why didn't they flash signs on screen saying "Real sad scene! Cry Damn you!" Or have Neo and Trinity turn and watch a puppy be run over. They tried to squeeze every ounce out of that scene, and just ended with it being boring and laughable.

If they had expended just 1/50th the effort into writing a decent script as they did on trying to make everything look 'cool', it might have been watchable. As it was I felt like writing to the Washy brothers (however the hell you spell their neme) and asking for my money (and time) back. Or perhaps writing to one of them's dominatrix mistress and telling her that he's been really bad.

The Matrix (The first movie) was by far better than the following two. You know, I really loved the ending to number one. It was so cool. But they ruined the first one by making more.

They should have just stopped at number one, and it would have remained a classic for years to come. The story used to be left up to interpretationg, which made the movie unique, but now that the other two movies drew conlusions and explained some things, IT SUCKS.

By the by, I fully understood all three movies (eventually)

its all your opinion Demented Hamsters as you said and in mine
x-men 2 was S**T, and okay at best. its all over the place it is confusing and does'nt fit in with the story/comic except that it has the same characters.
but that is not the point and im geting off topic. the matrix series was slick, sexy and cool and i admit, yes Matrix1 was better than the other two, but matrix 2 & 3 had a lot to live up to but they suceeded with a good story that was NOT predictable.

I stull don't get why so many people thought that the two sequels to the matrix sucked so badly. I enjoyed them. Could anyone please explain this sentiment?

I thought they were excellent. I don't understand why people had a problem with the ending.

The Matrix is really like Jurassic Park.

At first, you go OOOH!

Then, it makes you think.

As soon as you actually think, you go "Oh dammit why did I pay for this!?"

it think everyone was pissed of at the ending because the humans made peace with the robots and everone was expeting neo to kick ass

The Matrix is really like Jurassic Park.

At first, you go OOOH!

Then, it makes you think.

As soon as you actually think, you go "Oh dammit why did I pay for this!?"
the first time my family tried to see jurassic park, a knife fight broke out in the theater. honestly, that's almost all i remember about that movie. other than the theme song, of course. doo-dee-doo-dummm-dummmm, doo-dee-dooo

the first time my family tried to see jurassic park, a knife fight broke out in the theater. honestly, that's almost all i remember about that movie. other than the theme song, of course. doo-dee-doo-dummm-dummmm, doo-dee-dooo

:eek: :eek: :eek:

OMG that humming reminds me of next Gen star trek :D wow !!

I loved all three movies (and the animatrix)! Great, groundbreaking sci-fi (and yes, I understood it -- what's to not understand? Seemed clear enough to me) I never did quite understand why everyone is so fixated on Neo -- now Morpheus, everything he said or did was soooo cool. If computers ever get good AI's I want mine to sound just like Morpheus.

The thing that ruined the trilogy a bit for me, I guess, is that IT HAS NO ENDING! All these years of fighting for freedom, and at the end of the third movie, all we have is an uneasy truce, with none of the big issues that the characters were so passionate about being resolved, one way or the other. The stupid Watchcowski brothers left things hanging so that everyone would go out and play the Matrix online, just to be able to get some kind of closure. I think I would have liked ANY kind of ending better then the uneasy truce that they did end with.

re: Time in Zion, dancing, 5 min. ID check fight etc: These were to help us care about the characters and to see some of their complexity -- the complexity that makes us human. I think it worked fine -- although the Frenchman's dance club was just a little bit too weird IMHO.

Re: technology, hovercraft, etc: Who ever said the current inhabitants of Zion built them? The machines could have given them to them and made neccessary repairs every time the appearance of the One caused them to wipe out Zion every few years. Or they could have been salvaged from the original war with the machines (see Animatrix). Take a random person and dump him onto a modern military base and, yeah, he can probably figure out how to USE most of it eventually, if he's smart, but will most likely never learn how to BUILD most of it.

There is one reason that makes the Matrix trilogy superior to most films, one and one alone which makes up for the bad acting of the good guys, and that reason is Agent Smith, or should I say Agent Smiths. As Jordaxia said, he has all the best lines, he shows up just when you think, “Where is that lovable tyke?” and, I don’t need to add the point that he has a Xenocidal nature.

Agent Smith makes the Matrix films.

http://www.markshields.com/archives/agent-smith-standing-in-rain-matrix-revolutions.jpg

See look how cool he is!

See look how cool he is!

He was cooler in Pricilla ...

http://www.earlham.edu/~efs/priscilla4.jpg

:eek: :eek: :eek: :confused:

No F**King WAY!!!

hahahaha :p

ah i bet he'll never live that down.

http://www.moviesnapshot.com/1994Stills/The_Adventures_Of_Priscill.JPG

You hear that, Mr. Anderson? That is the sound of inevitability ...

Oh and let's not forget Elrond ...

http://www.arwen-undomiel.com/images/Elrond_bw.jpg

From an even worse trilogy ...