NationStates Jolt Archive

If you could bring back an ancient Empire/nation/republic/citystate (up til... lets say... 1453, the fall of Constantinople, that'll do) which one would it be? I'm going to lump up a poll, but there are far more than 9 (since one is prededicated to other, natch) ancient powers (or even nonpowers) that existed, so I doubt it'll be truly representative.
A side question would be, if this nation suddenly popped back into existence (with modern technology, not trimarans and legions), what do you think the effect would be on world power/diplomacy/relations? The nations would return at the very height of their power, and would overwrite whatever country(ies) currently inhabit their borders. Personally, I'd like to see the Carthaginians make a re-appearance. An incredibly rich and powerful African nation would certainly shake things up a bit, especially in the way the European countries deal with them. I imagine Carthage would be closer to Europe than Africa, and such a maritime power would have certainly had many conflicts (and therefore possibly a very bitter history) with Britain.

Another few nations for consideration would be...
Rome
Ptolemaic Egypt
The Seleucids
The Sarmatians
Armenia
Parthia
Nubia *fine, more tribes, but never mind.*
Macedon (Alexanders Macedon)
The Aetolian league
The Achean league
Athens
Sparta
Genghis' Mongolia
Byzantium
A unified Gaul
ditto for Germania
ditto for the Iberians
Numidia
Epirus
Syracuse
one of the chinese dynasties *very weak on the east, sorries*

Interesting to see, anyway.

Byzantium. Interesting empire and interesting what its location and existence would mean to world relations.

Ancient Egypt, way cool.

Ancient Egypt. From the documentaries I've seen, it appears to be the most liberal of all ancient civilizations. Second would have to be ancient Greece (Athens, I suppose).

I don't think I'd like a hard-line despotism like Rome back in power. Yeugh.

#1 vote goes to Ancient Egypt

#2 vote goes to Sparta (The best military that ever walked the earth ;) )

the Vedic Civilization in India. Either that or the Tocharians.... Or maybe the Scythians...

I'd like to bring back the Roman Empire, Han Dynasty China, and the Gupta Empire of India. It would be great to see these three innovators again, and a war between the three would be amazing. Furthermore, they would result in faster technological development and incredible advances in warfare. :cool:

Not so much a nation, but I'd bring back that wonderful Kurd, Salah al-Din Yusuf (Saladin). The Muslim people need a strong leader like him again.

I'd like to bring back the Roman Empire, Han Dynasty China, and the Gupta Empire of India. It would be great to see these three innovators again, and a war between the three would be amazing. Furthermore, they would result in faster technological development and incredible advances in warfare. :cool:

Gupta? I've obviously heard of Rome and the Han dynasty, but who are the Gupta, and how did they innovate? Just curious, history is my fascination.

Not so much a nation, but I'd bring back that wonderful Kurd, Salah al-Din Yusuf (Saladin). The Muslim people need a strong leader like him again.

On that note, I'll expand the thread. Any ancient leader (important figure) that you think'd be good, or could be influential, then them too. Like Hannibal, Caesar, Sun Tzu (I know more about war than sociopolitics, 'fraid)
Excellent choice with Saladin though.

Gupta? I've obviously heard of Rome and the Han dynasty, but who are the Gupta, and how did they innovate? Just curious, history is my fascination.
The Gupta period in India of course! King Chandragupta united India into an Empire (once again) in the 4th Century I believe. I think it was either the Islamic expansion that ended it or the Huns. Dunno.

Ghengis Mongolia or feudal japan. great militaries. great philosophies.

On that note, I'll expand the thread. Any ancient leader (important figure) that you think'd be good, or could be influential, then them too. Like Hannibal, Caesar, Sun Tzu (I know more about war than sociopolitics, 'fraid)
Excellent choice with Saladin though.

In that case, Julius Caesar with out a doubt. It would have been interesting to see what he would have done to Rome. Also an incredible writer.

Not so much a nation, but I'd bring back that wonderful Kurd, Salah al-Din Yusuf (Saladin). The Muslim people need a strong leader like him again.
Oi! How could I forget him!?!

He's my second favorite military leader. First being Hazrat Ali.

The Gupta period in India of course! King Chandragupta united India into an Empire (once again) in the 4th Century I believe. I think it was either the Islamic expansion that ended it or the Huns. Dunno.


I've never heard of the Gupta period... like I said in the first post, I'm very weak on Eastern history, and a lot better on western history. Silly me.

the Vedic Civilization in India.

ditto

I vote either Athens or Rome, both had well educated people/philosophers that were ahead of their times and both made great advancements in architecture.

The Achean league

it would be the Aryans- so they can see what atrocities are speaking for them nowadays.

"If you could bring back one ancient nation..."

Etrusca, of course! :D

"If you could bring back one ancient nation..."

Etrusca, of course! :D

I knew it. I was actually going to make special mention of them, just because, but I forgot. Silly me, eh?

I think the Spartan timarchy would be interesting to return also, given that as far as practices go, their ones could be pretty damned barbaric.

Oi! How could I forget him!?!

He's my second favorite military leader. First being Hazrat Ali.

Another good choice! Although, as much as I love and respect the Pashai and the Northern Alliance, I don't think Ali is the diplomat Saladin was. Ali's a bit more gungho than I like in a leader and not prone to treatise. Though people in Jalalabad don't seem to like Ali much. ;)

Maybe a nice Saladin/Ali co-leadership. :D

Another good choice! Although, as much as I love and respect the Pashai and the Northern Alliance, I don't think Ali is the diplomat Saladin was. Ali's a bit more gungho than I like in a leader and not prone to treatise. Though people in Jalalabad don't seem to like Ali much. ;)

Maybe a nice Saladin/Ali co-leadership. :D


I have to ask though, assuming Saladin was displaced to now *with no adverse affect on him missing in the medieval times* do you think he'd be the same person? and assuming he is, what do you think he'd do for the middle east, if elevated to the status that he held during his life? Unite it? Make it, or his chosen country, prosper? I don't imagine he'd be too chuffed with the American/British occupation of Iraq...

Han China for my civ (No Asian societies on the list? Boo!) and Zhuge Liang for my military leader. Damn he is so cool.

Carthage because hannibal pwned them all

I have to ask though, assuming Saladin was displaced to now *with no adverse affect on him missing in the medieval times* do you think he'd be the same person? and assuming he is, what do you think he'd do for the middle east, if elevated to the status that he held during his life? Unite it? Make it, or his chosen country, prosper? I don't imagine he'd be too chuffed with the American/British occupation of Iraq...

I believe he could do what he did before and unite Muslims under a common banner. He also was the one who signed the treaty that allowed Christians and Jews to openly worship in Jerusalem, rather than some "leaders" today who would kick everyone out and destroy the artifacts.

Under Saladin, huge advances in medicine, astronomy, industry, and mathematics were made in the Muslim world and the way was paved for future advancements.

I think we really need someone like him today.

Except for Scipio who practically pimp slapped him.

Carthage because hannibal pwned them all

Except Scipio. ;)

Except Scipio. ;)

See Spain. 2/3 Scipios prefer to be pwned by Hannibal. Publius and Cnaeuss. (how the hell do you spell it? I dunno...)

Besides, Gaius Scipio Africanus won because he out hannibaled hannibal. Hannibal used Numidian cavalry expertly. When Africanus (Scipio being a family name and so applicable to hundreds of Scipios, and Africanus being a distinct name which means it's definitely him, but you knew this) came to Carthage, he hired hundreds of Numidians to allow him to win at Zama. Give him a standard legion... and that's the end of that. Triplex Acies don't beat Hannibal.

Han China for my civ (No Asian societies on the list? Boo!) and Zhuge Liang for my military leader. Damn he is so cool.

Mistake. like I keep saying, I don't know much about many Eastern civilisations, and lots of them are still around today... Korea, Japan... China... to name the big three.


Of course, a group that evaded me I just remembered. The south American civilisations, and the earlier meso-Americans.

Mayans, Aztecs and Incas, anyone?

Besides, Gaius Scipio Africanus won because he out hannibaled hannibal.

Oh I know and I agree on Hannibal. I did, after all, name my son after the man. :)

Charlemange.

Oh I know and I agree on Hannibal. I did, after all, name my son after the man. :)

So you did! I knew I liked you for a good reason.
I still think Hasbrudal is a better name purely for aesthetic reasons though.

Zhuge Liang is probably one of the greatest millitary commanders in history (There's still some controversy over whether he existed, or if he really did all he did. I think he did, but it isn't necessarly true!).
Here are two of his most famous strategies:
He was challenged by a political rival to build 50,000 arrows in a fortnight, and then was deprived of materials other than straw. He did it by coating boats with straw, making straw soldiers on deck, and then sailing near enemy territory in a fog at night, causing the tempermental enemy commander to fire hundreds of arrow volleys. His ships pincushioned but unharmed, he returned with enough arrows to win.

He was visiting a city with a small garrison of wounded and weak troops when they came under a surprise enemy attack. He ordered the troops to stand at attention around the gates, opened them all, then sat on top of the North Gate playing a lute, perfectly at ease within sight of a huge enemy army.


The enemy commander was so sure of a trap he retreated.

Mayan/Aztecs.

Besides, Gaius Scipio Africanus won because he out hannibaled hannibal. Hannibal

Publius, not Gaius.

Publius, not Gaius.

Indeed, silly me. I appear, after a google search, to have invented Gaius Scipio.
How bizaare.

doh! I'm really messing up my history here.

Hasbrudal Barca beat the Scipios assigned to Spain, not Hannibal Barca. And there must've been two Scipios... Publius Scipio beaten in Spain, and Publius Cornerlius Scipio Africanus, victorious at Zama.

EDIT: there was a Gaius Scipio in Spain... whether I confused Publius and Gaius, I don't know.

So you did! I knew I liked you for a good reason.
I still think Hasbrudal is a better name purely for aesthetic reasons though.

I had contemplated that, but Hasdrubal means "Baal(God) helps" and Hannibal means "Grace of Baal(God)" and, frankly, I don't like the "Oh God help me!" connotation of Hasdrubal. :D

Carthage, because it had the ancient world's most stable and effective government, and a great military tradition. Or Syracuse, the greatest fortress-city in the ancient Mediterranean, with war machines designed by the mad scientist Archimedes, such as enormous anti-ship claws and mirrors that burned enemies with reflected sun rays.

Indeed, silly me. I appear, after a google search, to have invented Gaius Scipio.
How bizaare.

doh! I'm really messing up my history here.

Hasbrudal Barca beat the Scipios assigned to Spain, not Hannibal Barca. And there must've been two Scipios... Publius Scipio beaten in Spain, and Publius Cornerlius Scipio Africanus, victorious at Zama.

EDIT: there was a Gaius Scipio in Spain... whether I confused Publius and Gaius, I don't know.

IIRC Gaius, was Publius father, and had some position in the senate. Though I would have to drag out my Dodge (translation of polybius IIRC), to confirm that. Still, an easy mistake.

Zhuge Liang is probably one of the greatest millitary commanders in history (There's still some controversy over whether he existed, or if he really did all he did. I think he did, but it isn't necessarly true!).
Here are two of his most famous strategies:
He was challenged by a political rival to build 50,000 arrows in a fortnight, and then was deprived of materials other than straw. He did it by coating boats with straw, making straw soldiers on deck, and then sailing near enemy territory in a fog at night, causing the tempermental enemy commander to fire hundreds of arrow volleys. His ships pincushioned but unharmed, he returned with enough arrows to win.

He was visiting a city with a small garrison of wounded and weak troops when they came under a surprise enemy attack. He ordered the troops to stand at attention around the gates, opened them all, then sat on top of the North Gate playing a lute, perfectly at ease within sight of a huge enemy army.


The enemy commander was so sure of a trap he retreated.
Most of Zhuge Liang's exploits are highly exaggerated because the biographies written of him were editted during the Ming and Qing Dynasties for propaganda purposes. None of his military campaigns against Sima Yi achieved long term success for Shu kingdom, and individual episodes of his mythical brilliance are likely to be mostly fictitious.

Atlantus. That would be the best nation to bring back.

To fill out your appalling lack of east Asian states with my only slightly less inadequate knowledge of two of the players:

For China, I'd be torn between Ming China (a successful dynasty that didn't work), and Qing China (an unsuccessful dynasty that did work).

Or possibly Song China, a marvellous dynasty that was throughly successful, except that it basically lacked the ability to defend itself in an era where this really wasn't a good idea (see: the Tabgach, the Khitans, the Jurchens, the Mongols).

Although, to be honest, I'd be happy bringing back Ming Taizu, the first Ming emperor, and letting him rule the world forever and ever.

Japan's also pretty hard; I'm caught between the Heian period (ineffectual but ever so stylish) and the post-Restoration period (overeffectual and prone to being run by its military).

...

Mind you, if I could bring back a nation, I wouldn't waste this ability on anything useless, like the Romans or some dead Chinese dynasty. I think I'd feel morally obligated to bring back, say, Burma the democracy, or some other shattered state that we already know can work in the modern era :p

To fill out your appalling lack of east Asian states,

This is the last time I'm going to apologise and give a reason for forgetting the East Asian nations.

1: I know basically nothing of them, including names.
2: The ones I do know of are still around.
3: There were a few examples I thought of, but I forgot whilst making the thread because I have a terrible, terrible memory.
4: appalling, not total. Genghis' Mongolia was an Eastern state :D =P

(and this thread, whilst serious, is delivered in a jokey fashion, just so you all know.)

I have to say, I'm a bit suprised that ancient Japan never made the list. But that would be my vote. The current world could use a good lesson in honour

I would have to say the Picts. I don't care if they didn't necessarily constitute a nation. They were just the epitome of awesome. Who wouldn't want to run around various portions of the British Isles wearing blue paint and living in trees?

A unified Germania sounds good. Or maybe the Visi/Ostrogoth kingdoms. And the North-African kingdom of the Vandals.

This is the last time I'm going to apologise and give a reason for forgetting the East Asian nations.

1: I know basically nothing of them, including names.
2: The ones I do know of are still around.
3: There were a few examples I thought of, but I forgot whilst making the thread because I have a terrible, terrible memory.
4: appalling, not total. Genghis' Mongolia was an Eastern state :D =P

(and this thread, whilst serious, is delivered in a jokey fashion, just so you all know.)

Oh, no need to apologize. I know next to nothing about anything west of, say, Tibet. The "appalling" comment was meant to be tongue in cheek, but I guess that wasn't clear enough. My bad :)

To be a pedantic bitch, however, modern China and Japan are more or less completely divorced from what they were even two hundred years ago, politically and socially. In China's case, even the borders are substantially different (Qing China, the last dynasty, extended into Nepal, Taiwan, Russia, and several former Soviet Central Asian states), as is the language. I'd say it's fair to refer to previous incarnations of either country as defunct.

Hrm, there are a great many choices, aren't there?

Ok, first I would have to propose Carthage - it'd probably be a great stabalizing factor in Africa and with the Romans gone, it'd be able to... you know... not die.

Alexander's Macedon, gotta love that. The same is true of Mongolia under the various Khans.

Can one imagine the power of Sparta, given their discipline with our technology?

In Meso-America, I would bring back the Mayans. With resistences to diseases.

As for individuals, I would probably choose Archimedes, and Hippocrites. Both of whom provided immense benefit to mankind; Archimedes' inventions were quite astounding, and Hippocrites was so important to medicine that the Hippocratic Oath itself bears his name.

I would like to see Easter Island at the height of whatever power she may have had, too. :P

Hrm, there are a great many choices, aren't there?

Ok, first I would have to propose Carthage - it'd probably be a great stabalizing factor in Africa and with the Romans gone, it'd be able to... you know... not die.

Alexander's Macedon, gotta love that. The same is true of Mongolia under the various Khans.

Can one imagine the power of Sparta, given their discipline with our technology?

In Meso-America, I would bring back the Mayans. With resistences to diseases.

As for individuals, I would probably choose Archimedes, and Hippocrites. Both of whom provided immense benefit to mankind; Archimedes' inventions were quite astounding, and Hippocrites was so important to medicine that the Hippocratic Oath itself bears his name.

I would like to see Easter Island at the height of whatever power she may have had, too. :P



First of all, to mockstonia above - I like you. When the glorious revolut..... I tire. 'Nuff Said.

Secondly, to the Lunatic tribute. Easter Island is the best idea so far.

I'd have to say the Gupta Empire of India or Macedon.

But Angkor Wat (Cambodia), the great Javan civilization that existed in Indonesia until like 1100, or the civilization that existed at Mohenjo-Daro and Harappa would also be cool. Bringing back one of the dynasties of China or ancient Japan before the Shogunates would be ok.

However, I wonder how the UN would react to this especially with master conquerors like Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan and his sons, and Tamberlane, king of the Silk Road.

I'd have to say the Gupta Empire of India or Macedon.

However, I wonder how the UN would react to this especially with master conquerors like Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan and his sons, and Tamberlane, king of the Silk Road.

What I would find more interesting is how the big consumers would treat a superpower *Alexanders Macedon* which has basically most of the oil. How would Russia and the U.S.A treat Macedon?

I think you forgot to put Atlantis on the poll.

Ahaha, but seriously I think Sparta would be neat. But that's mainly because of Thermopylae...Not including the Spartans, I think the Byzantines would be great to have back.

But then, that's mainly because I think the Byzantines have the most attractive female leaderhead in Civilization III...Most of the people at civfanatics say Joan d'Arc is better looking, but I disagree.

What? I'm not creepy...

Rome.

The politics between it and the United States would be very interesting, to say the least.

Rome.

The politics between it and the United States would be very interesting, to say the least.

Most certainly. Nuclear weapons would be the only thing that'd hold Rome off, if they kept their customary aggression. I can't imagine it would be fun and smiles for the world, anyway. Kinda like the cold war, but with an enemy so zealous in its patriotism, and so horribly rich, that is was just waiting for an excuse. Would be amusing if they deployed for their battle in Triplex Acies with tanks on the flank, though :D

(oh, and when I seen your name as I clicked this thread, I wondered... just who could this person choose? :D )

Atlantis. Just to see if it ever really existed.

Atlantis. Just to see if it ever really existed.

Probably did. Some Greek (not sure if it was Ptolemy) made a map years ago, and it showed Antartica as two islands. That fact was only discovered circa. 70-100 years ago!!!!

I'd personally like to bring back Ancient Egypt. I've always been fascinated by the Ancient Egyptian civilisation. Apart from anything else, it'd settle the whole 'how did they build the pyramids' argument. Did they do it themselves with a series of cranes, with 'wheels', with a makeshift log conveyor belt, or did they have a subspace transmitter hidden somewhere that they used to call in aliens to do it for them? I wonder what intergalactic contract builders get paid, anyway...

Besides. I'd like to see the Great Pyramid with its limestone shell. It was beautiful to see as it is, but with that brilliant, smooth white shell... Man that must have been magnificent.

definetly the celts such a rich culture with fabulous artwork, and celtic legends, fantastic!!! their religion was'nt too bad either.

I would bring back the Roman Empire.

Anatolia. I like ponies.

I'd like to see ancient Rome at it's peak.

This thread makes me want to play Civ...
But Angkor Wat (Cambodia), the great Javan civilization that existed in Indonesia until like 1100, or the civilization that existed at Mohenjo-Daro and Harappa would also be cool. Those are the two that came to my mind. :) At least the Indus valley cities would be the cleanest in the ancient world! :D

And I'd like to take a look at Angkor Wat etc at their peak.

the aztecs

I chose Gaul.

Go celts!

For all the artifacts we have, there's still a lot of questions about how ancient Egyptian society was run, so that one gets my vote. Besides, we could then settle once and for all how the pyramids were built. :p

I'd like to see ancient Rome at it's peak.Thats what I was thinking.

Though the Aztecs would have been amazing to witness - and we know less about them than the Romans, so we would probably gain more historically. :)

Thats what I was thinking.

Though the Aztecs would have been amazing to witness - and we know less about them than the Romans, so we would probably gain more historically. :)

Yes, but they're not ancient, as per the original poster's timeline. The Aztecs lasted until 1521 or thereabouts, while the line was drawn at 1453. I might've picked the Aztec too, if we could pick from any time period.

Yes, but they're not ancient, as per the original poster's timeline. The Aztecs lasted until 1521 or thereabouts, while the line was drawn at 1453. I might've picked the Aztec too, if we could pick from any time period.

But it is extremely likely that the Aztecs were around in ancient times as well. ;)

Probably did. Some Greek (not sure if it was Ptolemy) made a map years ago, and it showed Antartica as two islands. That fact was only discovered circa. 70-100 years ago!!!!

Plato I think.

Though it is also thought that Atlantis was the Minoan civilisation on Crete.

and mayan and Aztec empires

i would bring back the D'ni and the fifth age :D

Carthage!
Aztecs are my second choice.
Not the roman empire please, we do have the catholic church, that's more than enough.
Most interesting person, hm, Saladin is a brilliant choice, Robespierre is too late in the timeline, I'm afraid (french revolution 1789 - 179 :confused: )
Hey, what about Jesus returning right away. That'd be news.

Macedon everybody! Another Alexander to stir up some excitement! ;)

obviously Armenia, because they're my ancestors.... well them and the Celts, but either way loves mah ancestors

Egypt. We need less Muslims.

For a person, either Bismarck or Hitler. We need less Muslims.

I'd like to hang out with Clovis I guess... so long as he didn't think I was related to him (he killed family members whom he thought would try to take his throne).

although when I was a kid I was a huge fan of the Romans, and I won't go back on that now.

For a person, either Bismarck or Hitler. We need less Muslims.
Troll much lately? Maybe we need less rascists.

Troll much lately? Maybe we need less rascists.

You'll know how I feel when you're a minority in your own country.

Yes bring back the glorious Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantium is the incorrect term). Emperor Basil II as well. Also return China to the Ming dynasty, and might as well bring back the Holy Roman Empire of Otto III while were at it.

Egypt

Yes bring back the glorious Eastern Roman Empire (Byzantium is the incorrect term). Emperor Basil II as well. Also return China to the Ming dynasty, and might as well bring back the Holy Roman Empire of Otto III while were at it.

Byzantium may be the incorrect term, but it's so much better! Eastern Roman Empire is meh. Byzantine Empire is so much better, and... possibly more accurate when you think on it. The capital city is byzantium renamed constantinople. It was very different from the Roman Empire which birthed it,
it's more like your Carthage to Phoenicia, making the Byzantine Empire... more correct than the Eastern Roman Empire.

so meh :D

Now you may prove me wrong.

Egypt. We need less Muslims.

The word you're looking for is "fewer". A little grammar goes a long way.

You'll know how I feel when you're a minority in your own country.

Hmm, somehow I thought you were German.
I apologize for my wrong judgement on you.

Athens. No question about it.

Hmm, somehow I thought you were German.
I apologize for my wrong judgement on you.

I am... half, anyway.

Probably did. Some Greek (not sure if it was Ptolemy) made a map years ago, and it showed Antartica as two islands. That fact was only discovered circa. 70-100 years ago!!!!

In two thousand years, someone might say the same about Middle Earth... It's close enough to make some conjectures with Europe, and if those people in two thousand years take into account we barbarians probably couldn't draw properly accurate maps...? :)

i would bring back the D'ni and the fifth age :D

A resounding YAY.

Plato I think.

Though it is also thought that Atlantis was the Minoan civilisation on Crete.

Or the Azores, or Ireland or.......

Plato I think.

Though it is also thought that Atlantis was the Minoan civilisation on Crete.

Or the azores or Ireland or...........

Rome.


Just to see what would happen.

Sumer. Specificly the unified city states of Sumer, centred around either Ur or Uruk (Both great cities).
I think it would certianly mess up the world polotics now, having such an ancient civilization occupying the worlds second largest oil reserve. Besides, with all the advances they made in a thousand years before they colapsed, think where they'd be now if they kept that pace up for the past 8000 years!

Byzantium, hands down. Fascinating culture, and it'd make life so much easier to have a stable, cultured government overseeing the bulk of the Middle East.

For a person. . . Francis Bacon might be interesting, Aristotle would absolutely be interesting. And it'd be a joy to watch him process the advances of science. Maybe Pericles to run the restored Byzantines. He's Greek, after all. ;)

Ancient Egypt, no doubt. I LOVE ANCIENT EGYPT!!! :fluffle:

#1- Ottoman Empire
#2-Sardinia
#3-Soviet Union- they're nto really agent. I just wanna see how they'd fair in todays society.

Byzantium, hands down. Fascinating culture, and it'd make life so much easier to have a stable, cultured government overseeing the bulk of the Middle East.

For a person. . . Francis Bacon might be interesting, Aristotle would absolutely be interesting. And it'd be a joy to watch him process the advances of science. Maybe Pericles to run the restored Byzantines. He's Greek, after all. ;)

For a united middle east in the ancient times, you don't need to look any further than Alexanders Macedon or the Seleucid, never mind the Sumerians and the Persians.... Byzantium, by comparison, only really lorded over Asia minor for a considerable length of time, if I'm correct.

And on that note, you don't think that A Byzantine, like Count Belisarius or Justinian (his contemporary Emperor) would be better? I agree that any ancient Greek philosopher/geometrician would be fascinating to have nowadays... pythagoras/aristotle/plato/socrates/archimedes and the like.

#1- Ottoman Empire
#2-Sardinia
#3-Soviet Union- they're nto really agent. I just wanna see how they'd fair in todays society.

1: Only existed after 1453, my cut off date. no matter though.
2: Sardinia? What'd they do? (seriously.)
3: Aside from continuing the cold war, I really don't see how they'd differ in any way, though feel free to disagree.

1: Only existed after 1453, my cut off date. no matter though.
2: Sardinia? What'd they do? (seriously.)
3: Aside from continuing the cold war, I really don't see how they'd differ in any way, though feel free to disagree.

Sardinia was the kingdom to defeat Austria adn help unite Italy. They secured The Northern Italian Territories from the Austrians, at that point one of the most powerful nations in Europe.

And they invented the Sardine.

Vijayanagara would get my vote if it were on the list, but failing that, Egypt, fo sho.

Vijayanagara would get my vote if it were on the list, but failing that, Egypt, fo sho.

They're all on the list. it's the other option.

Vijayanagara sounds Indian, am I correct? What did it do, how did it influence, locally or globally, the world?

How ancient are we talking? I would vote for Bismarck but I wouldn't normally call that ancient history.

Edit: Never mind, I can't read. I found it.

I'd LOVE to bring back the Aztecs... Imagine if they had nukes... :D *evil grin*

Kievon Rus! The Volga-Bulgars were very enigmatic. Too bad they were wiped out by the Mongols.

I also wonder what the Kwarazmians were like. Too bad they were wiped out by the Mongols too.

I'd LOVE to bring back the Aztecs... Imagine if they had nukes... :D *evil grin*

Every ancient power would be better with nuclear weapons. it's a simple fact of life.

Watch.

Aztecs: High priest makes the sun rise at night! *whoomph*.... see!

Egyptians: Pharoah says explode *whooomph* good job.

Rome: Stupid Gaul *whooomph* that's better.

Carthage: Stupid Rome *whooomph* that's better. Hannibal, you're a genius.

Greeks: "One may compare knowledge to a cave *whoomph* or nuclear weaponry."

Am I making my point, or need I continue?

All tough choices... but I would bring back Rome before it split into two parts.

Every ancient power would be better with nuclear weapons. it's a simple fact of life.

Watch.

Aztecs: High priest makes the sun rise at night! *whoomph*.... see!

Egyptians: Pharoah says explode *whooomph* good job.

Rome: Stupid Gaul *whooomph* that's better.

Carthage: Stupid Rome *whooomph* that's better. Hannibal, you're a genius.

Greeks: "One may compare knowledge to a cave *whoomph* or nuclear weaponry."

Am I making my point, or need I continue?
LOL! I love that! :D

Nations:
Babylon! The ultimate in seriously powerful cities.
Persia! The original conquering superpower.
The Ottoman Empire: Existed well before 1453, as most of their European territory was gained before that date. They must have existed before then as it was the ottomans who took Constantinople.

People:Leaders
Cyrus the Great: One of the greatest military geniuses of all time - defeated Media, Lydia, Babylonia, Bactria, Syria, Assyria... (the list goes on). About the only places he didn't get were the Masargetai (they killed him) and Egypt (whoch his son took soon after.
Alexander the Great: Similar to Cyrus, plus it would be interesting having an openly bisexual world leader.

People: Minds:
Archimedes, Ptolemy: great scientific minds, be interesting seeing how they adapt to this time.
Sophocles, Euripedes, Aristophanes: great playwrights, good to see them make films today.

People: Just for fun:
Cicero: Great orator, plus it would be good to see sparks fly if Clodia was also brought back.
Clodia: A woman who knew the full power of her gender, great enemy of Cicero, counterpart of Caesar and Pompeius Magnus.

Nations:
Babylon! The ultimate in seriously powerful cities.
Persia! The original conquering superpower.
The Ottoman Empire: Existed well before 1453, as most of their European territory was gained before that date. They must have existed before then as it was the ottomans who took Constantinople.

People:Leaders
Cyrus the Great: One of the greatest military geniuses of all time - defeated Media, Lydia, Babylonia, Bactria, Syria, Assyria... (the list goes on). About the only places he didn't get were the Masargetai (they killed him) and Egypt (whoch his son took soon after.
Alexander the Great: Similar to Cyrus, plus it would be interesting having an openly bisexual world leader.

People: Minds:
Archimedes, Ptolemy: great scientific minds, be interesting seeing how they adapt to this time.
Sophocles, Euripedes, Aristophanes: great playwrights, good to see them make films today.

People: Just for fun:
Cicero: Great orator, plus it would be good to see sparks fly if Clodia was also brought back.
Clodia: A woman who knew the full power of her gender, great enemy of Cicero, counterpart of Caesar and Pompeius Magnus.


Very nice and comprehensive. One question though (I'm way better in true ancient history than I am in medieval... wasn't it the Seljuk turks that conquered constantinople and all of the Byzantine territory that Turkey now controls? Then it became the ottoman empire at a later date? That's what I thought it was, anyway.

The Inca's.

Very nice and comprehensive. One question though (I'm way better in true ancient history than I am in medieval... wasn't it the Seljuk turks that conquered constantinople and all of the Byzantine territory that Turkey now controls? Then it became the ottoman empire at a later date? That's what I thought it was, anyway.
The Seljuks conquered most of Anatolia by 1100, but in the 1200s they were completely annihilated by the Mongols. The Ottomans picked up the pieces in the 1300s and conquered the rest of Byzantium (Anatolia, Greece, and Bulgaria), and ended up conquering Constantinople in 1453.

The Seljuks conquered most of Anatolia by 1100, but in the 1200s they were completely annihilated by the Mongols. The Ottomans picked up the pieces in the 1300s and conquered the rest of Byzantium, and ended up conquering Constantinople in 1453.

oooh... much obliged. Thankee.

Very nice and comprehensive. One question though (I'm way better in true ancient history than I am in medieval... wasn't it the Seljuk turks that conquered constantinople and all of the Byzantine territory that Turkey now controls? Then it became the ottoman empire at a later date? That's what I thought it was, anyway.
The Osmanli Dynasty of the Ottoman Empire began in 1280. Osman was given territory by the ruling Seljuk Turks in Anatolia. The sultanate began to extend westward to the Aegean, before crossing to Europe, and finally beseiging and taking Constantinople. So yes, the Ottomans were Seljuk, but by that stage they were independent of the other Turkish tribes.

I'd like to bring back the Indus Valley civilization of India. It'd be interesting to see just how and why they progressed their society and most fields of science as far as they did in the short amount of time that they did. The honorable mention would be the ancient Greek city states for much the same reason. It'd be interesting to ask them what motivated a bunch of backwoods farmers in tiny cities to explore the philosophical and scientific realms that they did and, as a result, build up one of the most influential cultures ever.