NationStates Jolt Archive

Now the British General Election is official and the three major parties have kicked of their campaign, who do you want to win?

Labour, but with a small majority so they have to work with the Lib Dem's a bit.
I'll probably vote Lib Dem though, as they have more chance of winning in my area.

I've cast my vote.

I wouldnt have thought that Plaid Cymru or the SNP can win the General Election seeing as they only stand in their respective countries

I wouldnt have thought that Plaid Cymru or the SNP can win the General Election seeing as they only stand in their respective countries

they can legally win, but its very unlikely

i doubt i'll vote, i don't see what choise we really have. we can go with labour who tax us more and waste our money. or the tories, who tax us less but make life harder for the worse off... hmmmmm... and every other political party won't get anything :s so i dont see what the point of voting for them is.

why does everyone like the lib dems?

Labour - for the sake of the millions of people in this country who depend on the government's investment in our public services.

It will be a tough fight; obviously the war in Iraq has horrified people (quite reasonably) and voters are getting fed up with Tony Blair. After 8 years in power it is not surprising that some Labour supporters are now feeling disillusioned.

What the party needs to do is to remind them of the achievements of this government - virtually full employment, introduction of a minimum wage, record levels of funding going into health and education, 10s of thousands more police, doctors, nurses, radical constitutional reform, etc - and re-inspire them to stick with Labour, rather than vote Liberal Democrat or some other party as a form of protest.

That will not make things any better. All that will do is help the Tories get into power. I don't think it is negative campaigning for Labour to remind voters who Michael Howard is - he's a staunch Thatcherite, part of a government that introduced the poll tax, oversaw unemployment of more than 3 million people, and ordered cuts in public services that severely damaged British society. The fact that he's still ranting on about tax cuts (i.e less investment), immigrants, and gypsies demonstrate how there is nothing positive the Conservative Party has to offer.

Sorry about the long post - I just feel it would be a disaster for Britain for Labour to lose office and I don't think people understand that.

record levels of funding going into health and education, 10s of thousands more police, doctors, nurses?

what do we have to show for the funding and i don't see the police any more cus we've got tied into european red-tape.

they can legally win, but its very unlikely

Even if they won every seat they stand in they wouldnt have a majority though

and what may i ask is wrong with thatcherites, i think margaret thacher is the gretest prime minister this country's ever know. how did she stay in power for all them years if she was a bad prime minister?

can't decide between labour and the lib dems.

gordon brown has done a fantastic job as chancellor and has helped our economy modernise and grow in the face of world economic slump. BUT he has cunningly brought in a whole load of taxes on the sly which have hit my parents pretty hard (doesn't affect me, but still...) and then there's the whole thing over the Iraq war that looses points for labour in my eyes.

i agree with the Lib Dems' social policies a fair bit more (especially the decriminalisation of marijuana), and their economic policies seem sound, but they aren't tried & tested or have the excellent record that chancellor Brown has. "if it aint broke, don't fix it" and with the economy, stability is an important factor - i wonder what the international business speculation will be like if Chancellor Brown goes out of office?
and then there's the whole issue about the Lib Dems having far less chance of actually getting elected than Labour - i don't want to waste a vote.

too many things to consider i suppose, so i still haven't made up my mind (except not to vote Tory of course)


edit:

and what may i ask is wrong with thatcherites, i think margaret thacher is the gretest prime minister this country's ever know. how did she stay in power for all them years if she was a bad prime minister?
imho, thatcher was about as close to pure evil there is (disregarding the real evil political leaders like Hitler & Stalin of course)

Why does everyone hate the conservatives, them and the BNP are the best parties going.

and what may i ask is wrong with thatcherites, i think margaret thacher is the gretest prime minister this country's ever know. how did she stay in power for all them years if she was a bad prime minister?

Bribing the media, and there being no real opposition

why does everyone like the lib dems?

Why do you dislike them?

Why do you dislike them?

cus they're too left-wing and want to take power from london to brussels

Why does everyone hate the conservatives, them and the BNP are the best parties going.

I wouldn't say that everybody hates the tories, they are too middle of the road to hate. Most dislike and dont trust them. Good one about the BNP though; party, i get it.

record levels of funding going into health and education, 10s of thousands more police, doctors, nurses?

what do we have to show for the funding and i don't see the police any more cus we've got tied into european red-tape.

19,000 more doctors, 77,000 more nurses, hospital waiting lists in England are at their lowest since 1987, the government has started the largest hospital-building programme ever...

Labour's recruitment means we now have the highest police numbers ever, if you don't see more police in your community either you're lucky enough not to live in a high-crime area or you're not looking properly.

And in reply to your post about Maggie....well, if you really think she was the best PM ever that's up to you. Personally, I think her policies were aimed at deliberately undermining the social state (the NHS is, after all, an example of socialism in action so of course the Tories don't care about it...), encouraging a culture of greed and selfishness, and causing a huge amount of division.

Bribing the media, and there being no real opposition
don't forget starting the utterly pointless Falklands War, which could have been easily avoided through diplomatic channels, to stir up patriotism and further her political ends - so she used the lives of british soldiers just to stay in power. evil.

Labour's recruitment means we now have the highest police numbers ever, if you don't see more police in your community either you're lucky enough not to live in a high-crime ever or you're not looking properly.

no i live in a private house in the middle of a council estate, there's been riots and muggings etc. the police have only ever turned up once when an old man chased off some youths that were spray-painting his fence with rude words. they arrested the old man, not the youths and slapped one of them jokes they call an "ASBO" on him.

And in reply to your post about Maggie....well, if you really think she was the best PM ever that's up to you. Personally, I think her policies were aimed at deliberately undermining the social state (the NHS is, after all, an example of socialism in action so of course the Tories don't care about it...), encouraging a culture of greed and selfishness, and causing a huge amount of division.
agreed. evidently The Britainists preferrs a more laizes faire way of running things. personally i find undermining the welfare state a horrible thing to do.

lets not also forget that through her massive cuts to state education and the business & social climate she created, she effectivley created an underclass of people. generation X - undereducated, unmotivated, and now they are bringing up their children with the same values, compounding the problem. the townies/chavs/whatever you want to call them are this new generation - the children of Thatcher's legacy. they are the ones who are causing such problems with crime, teenage pregnancy, etc... if it wasn't for Maggie creating her underclass Britian would be a better place today (imho) with less tax needed to fund the police and welfare programs these people soak up, and less tax needed to sort out the problems these people create in general.

lets not also forget (again) that trickle-down economics does not work.


[/rant]

Labour's recruitment means we now have the highest police numbers ever, if you don't see more police in your community either you're lucky enough not to live in a high-crime ever or you're not looking properly.

no i live in a private house in the middle of a council estate, there's been riots and muggings etc. the police have only ever turned up once when an old man chased off some youths that were spray-painting his fence with rude words. they arrested the old man, not the youths and slapped one of them jokes they call an "ASBO" on him.

You sure you didnt just steal that story from the sun last Friday?

no i live in a private house in the middle of a council estate, there's been riots and muggings etc. the police have only ever turned up once when an old man chased off some youths that were spray-painting his fence with rude words. they arrested the old man, not the youths and slapped one of them jokes they call an "ASBO" on him.

Hmm, well obviously no-one's going to approve of that, if it's true. But it's hard to take you seriously when you say the neo-Nazi BNP is one of the best parties around....

You sure you didnt just steal that story from the sun last Friday?

I don't read the sun i read the express, it agreese with my views more, i also read the mirror for a laugh.

lets not also forget (again) that trickle-down economics does not work.


It does, as long as you remember it isn't money that is trickling down ;)

I don't read the sun i read the express, it agreese with my views more, i also read the mirror for a laugh.

both those papers are jokes

if it wasn't for Maggie creating her underclass Britian would be a better place today (imho) with less tax needed to fund the police and welfare programs these people soak up, and less tax needed to sort out the problems these people create in general.
[/rant]

Completely agree with you, which is why long-term investment is vital to the well-being of Britain. Maybe the Lid Dems would carry this on, I don't know. Its easy for them to make all kinds of promises when they have no hope of reaching government any time soon. What I do know is that Labour is the party committed ideologically to the social state, and for the poor and vulnerable of this country a Labour government is a lifeline, not a luxury.

The difference between now and the 1980s is that just about everybody agrees on the importance of our public services, which is one reason why the Tories took such drastic action against their MP Howard Flight when he revealed their secret agenda of bigger spending cuts. They simply cannot be trusted.

both those papers are jokes

I'd buy a broadsheet if i could afford it, but thanks to "new labour"'s britain i can't afford soup cus of high taxes going towards providing homes for asylum seekers

I'd buy a broadsheet if i could afford it, but thanks to "new labour"'s britain i can't afford soup cus of high taxes going towards providing homes for asylum seekers
wtf.

You obviously have an internet connection, many papers have free online editions.

wtf.

You obviously have an internet connection, many papers have free online editions.

do they? i gotta go to one of them.

I'd buy a broadsheet if i could afford it, but thanks to "new labour"'s britain i can't afford soup cus of high taxes going towards providing homes for asylum seekers

Surely the combined price of the Express and the Mirror is roughly equal to a broadsheet

wtf.

You obviously have an internet connection, many papers have free online editions.

Yeah. If you can afford all this time on the internet I really doubt you can't afford to buy a proper newspaper!

maybe i excaggerated a bit, but i'm still worse of than i was under john major, i liked john major, he was boring like me.

maybe i excaggerated a bit, but i'm still worse of than i was under john major, i liked john major, he was boring like me.
:eek: :D

I'd buy a broadsheet if i could afford it, but thanks to "new labour"'s britain i can't afford soup cus of high taxes going towards providing homes for asylum seekers
sorry pal, assylum seekers aren't as much of a problem as the tabloids like to make out.
in a mori poll recently (i heard this quoted on Newsnight a couple of months back) people in the UK were asked what percentage of the world's assylum seekers came to Britian. the average answer was 26%. the real figure is 3%.

we don't have a problem with immigration, just the media and certain political parties are making a big issue (excuse the pun :D ) out of this because they can.

In case anybody's interested, I just found this site (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/uk_politics/2004/party_policies_at_a_glance/default.stm), which outlines the policies of the three major parties on various issues.

In case anybody's interested, I just found this site (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/uk_politics/2004/party_policies_at_a_glance/default.stm), which outlines the policies of the three major parties on various issues.
cool, cheers :)



http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40151000/jpg/_40151840_kennedy2_6649.jpg
"DRINK!"


:D

maybe i excaggerated a bit, but i'm still worse of than i was under john major, i liked john major, he was boring like me.

Are you a Leftie in disguise making joke posts??

Good on you comrade!

Are you a Leftie in disguise making joke posts??

Good on you comrade!

No i'm extremely right-wing some people class me as "racist" but i don't see it that way. I never say anything unless someone has said or done something to me first.

troll?

troll?

what does that mean?

what does that mean?

A troll is somebody who deliberately posts inflammatory/annoying stuff in order to irritate other posters. Personally, I don't think you are.

oh thank you for the explaination of a troll, i thought it was a charchter out of a kids story.

Well I can't vote yet as I'm too young, but my friend that can kind of has to vote Lib Dem as her father is something in it, I forget what. Anyway if the rest of my friends could vote, the majority would be Lib Dem or to be different, the Monster Raving Loony Party.. :p

I'm too young to vote, but next election i'll be 18 hehe, and conservatives will get my vote, the rtest of my friends are conservative as well. so the conservatives will have at least 5 more votes.

either the UUP or the DUP, seeing as the Monster Raving Loony Party doesnt stand in my constituency

Not British but, IMO I think the Lib Dems are gonna pull out a narrow victory.

yay the tories are winning and labour's stuggling behind. i don't think this represnts how it will actually turn out though, because the green party have the same number of votes as labour do. :headbang:

Grrrrrr, what is it with young people and the Lib Dems? Oh wait, I know, Charles Kennedy being against tuition fees and the war in Iraq...

But for all you idealists who think the Lib Dems are more Left-wing than Labour: don't forget they voted against the introduction of a minimum wage, their Orange Book wants to introduce market reforms to the NHS, they plan to scrap the New Deal that has helped in the fight against unemployment, and Lib Dem councillors up and down the country are more than happy to form coalitions with the Tories (something Labour does not do).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/uk_politics/2004/party_policies_at_a_glance/default.stm i agree with most of the Lib Dem policies. they will be getting my vote

yay the tories are winning and labour's stuggling behind. i don't think this represnts how it will actually turn out though, because the green party have the same number of votes as labour do. :headbang:

Nah, I doubt this poll is an accurate representation of the nation's voting intentions......

i wish this was accurate, cus the conservatives are winning and tony blair is failing spectacularly. i can still hope.

i wish this was accurate, cus the conservatives are winning and tony blair is failing spectacularly. i can still hope.

And yet the Lib Dems seem to be doing pretty well. They've got more votes than the tories at the moment.

And yet the Lib Dems seem to be doing pretty well. They've got more votes than the tories at the moment.

i wrote that when the tories had 9 and lib dems had 8

Not British but, IMO I think the Lib Dems are gonna pull out a narrow victory.

Doubtful.

The swing needed by the Conservatives to win is insanely large.

The Lib Dems are in a worse position.

Grrrrrr, what is it with young people and the Lib Dems? Oh wait, I know, Charles Kennedy being against tuition fees and the war in Iraq...

But for all you idealists who think the Lib Dems are more Left-wing than Labour: don't forget they voted against the introduction of a minimum wage, their Orange Book wants to introduce market reforms to the NHS, they plan to scrap the New Deal that has helped in the fight against unemployment, and Lib Dem councillors up and down the country are more than happy to form coalitions with the Tories (something Labour does not do).

For many I know who are voting Lib Dem aren't doing so for idealistic reasons. But because they want a reduced Labour majority and would rather sell their soul then vote conservative.

I'm voting for the Conservatives. There are many reasons for this, suffice it to say that the Tories most accurately reflect my views.

Doubtful.

The swing needed by the Conservatives to win is insanely large.

The Lib Dems are in a worse position.



For many I know who are voting Lib Dem aren't doing so for idealistic reasons. But because they want a reduced Labour majority and would rather sell their soul then vote conservative.

the latest opinion polls are undecided on whether the conservatives or labour have the majority, at the moment its looking pretty close, on average labour only has 1% more than the tories

the latest opinion polls are undecided on whether the conservatives or labour have the majority, at the moment its looking pretty close, on average labour only has 1% more than the tories


Opinion polls don't mean squat (unfortunetly). Britain use First Past The Post, not Proportional Representation.

In the last election the Conservatives weren't too far behind Labour. But Labour got more constituency seats, so they won.

Also, no one has the majority. There has not been a majority in British politics for a long time (if at all).

yes however more former labour ministers have left and moved to either the lib dems or the tories. that ever before.

so technically those constituencies could go to whatever the defector has moved to, plus there is a lot more tactical voting predicted this year

For many I know who are voting Lib Dem aren't doing so for idealistic reasons. But because they want a reduced Labour majority and would rather sell their soul then vote conservative.

Well, as I've already said I think that's a dangerous game to play and there's far too much at risk. In the 2000 American Presidential elections a small but significant number of former Democrat voters decided instead to support the Green Party. They hoped to somehow make the Democrats more Left-wing. But as we all know, all it did was help deliver the election to Bush.

Chances are, if Labour doesn't win this election, it will be the Tories who form the next government. Maybe those who are voting Lib Dem out of protest could afford that, but I belive the country as a whole couldn't.

Much better if you want to make a difference in Labour to join the party and campaign for policy changes.

plus i've heard a lot about turn out affecting labour a lot, i don't know why yet though.

yes however more former labour ministers have left and moved to either the lib dems or the tories. that ever before.

so technically those constituencies could go to whatever the defector has moved to, plus there is a lot more tactical voting predicted this year

True. But given the size of Labour's majority I think the most radical thing that would happen is a hung parliament with a Labour PM.

I seriously doubt anyone but Labour will win the next election. If I had money and there were good odds I definetly would bet.

Well, as I've already said I think that's a dangerous game to play and there's far too much at risk. In the 2000 American Presidential elections a small but significant number of former Democrat voters decided instead to support the Green Party. They hoped to somehow make the Democrats more Left-wing. But as we all know, all it did was help deliver the election to Bush.

America was different. On candidate was not going to win as obviously as Labour won in the last election. I seriously doubt anyone but Labour can win the next election.

My God.. The people in England are almost as liberal as the blue states.. :eek:

In which case if i were british (Thank God i'm not..)

i'd vote either conservative or communism.

Conservative just out of spite.
Communism because communism is cool. :cool:

Or whatever the hell Tony Blair's party is. I like Tony Blair.

Unless ofcourse you're finnaly willing to submit to Satan and vote in Ozzy as prime minister.

America was different. On candidate was not going to win as obviously as Labour won in the last election. I seriously doubt anyone but Labour can win the next election.

I wish I could be as certain as you. But I truly believe the Tories could give us all a nasty surprise, not because the country really wants to go back to Thatcherism, but because of apathy, complacency, and good-intentions-gone-wrong.

its funny that the DUP are the 4th biggest single party yet they always get left off polls...

My God.. The people in England are almost as liberal as the blue states.. :eek:

In which case if i were british (Thank God i'm not..)

i'd vote either conservative or communism.

Conservative just out of spite.
Communism because communism is cool. :cool:

Or whatever the hell Tony Blair's party is. I like Tony Blair.

Unless ofcourse you're finnaly willing to submit to Satan and vote in Ozzy as prime minister.

Tony Blairs party is Labour and tony blair is a prat and a liar, he never consults the british people in anything and he makes uninformed decisions on everything.

he never consults the british people in anything
so thats why hes just called an election....i was wondering

Tony Blairs party is Labour and tony blair is a prat and a liar, he never consults the british people in anything and he makes uninformed decisions on everything.

How old are you? Are you even old enough to vote???

so thats why hes just called an election....i was wondering

I mean he doesn't consult thyem on issues like the war in iraq.

I mean he doesn't consult thyem on issues like the war in iraq.
there was a vote in the Commons

your MPs is representing you, literally voting on your behalf

he consulted your representative, so he asked the person the democratic process elected to decide for you

that not enough?

no i'm not old enough to vote but i know more about politics and political issues than the average voter.

there was a vote in the Commons

your MPs is representing you, literally voting on your behalf

he consulted your representative, so he asked the person the democratic process elected to decide for you

that not enough?

but what if we didn't elect our mp, what if he was in labour and we're conservative

but what if we didn't elect our mp, what if he was in labour and we're conservative
thats how representative demoracy works

(i dont mean PR)

I wish I could be as certain as you. But I truly believe the Tories could give us all a nasty surprise, not because the country really wants to go back to Thatcherism, but because of apathy, complacency, and good-intentions-gone-wrong.

I'm sceptical about this "nasty surprise" to which you refer. I think a "nasty surprise" would come from the extremes, not from the mainstream.

thats how representative demoracy works

(i dont mean PR)

what if we live in the area of birmingham where there was vote rigging by labour. eh?

I'm sceptical about this "nasty surprise" to which you refer. I think a "nasty surprise" would come from the extremes, not from the mainstream.

"Nasty surprise" as in the majority of this country really do not want a Conservative government.

Thing is, Mr.Blair isn't too popular either, so there's not a great deal of enthusiasm for supporting Labour again. Therefore, there is a real risk of the Tories getting into power - not because of support for their policies - but because of disillusionment with Blair weakening the Labour vote.

Well I put Lib Dem... But, the problem is I live in the United States.... :headbang:

what if we live in the area of birmingham where there was vote rigging by labour. eh?

I haven't heard anything about that. Could you provide a link to an article or something?

And just as a supplementary comment, if you are a Tory supporter in a Labour stronghold, under FPTP, your views are generally disregarded. And some might argue that even a Labour elector in a Labour seat has his or her views disregarded. MPs do not vote after consulting their constituents. They vote on party lines and by following their conscience. Very rarely will they consult constituents. Some might argue that isn't "representative democracy".

what if we live in the area of birmingham where there was vote rigging by labour. eh?

The party immediately suspended all the people involved and the constituency's Labour MP has condemned it.

what if we live in the area of birmingham where there was vote rigging by labour. eh?
that was for council elections, and the result has been overturned.

so whats that got to do with Blair not consulting the people?

precisely nothing.

I haven't heard anything about that. Could you provide a link to an article or something?

It was all over the british news yesterday, its died down now though, but basically 6 labour minister rigged the postal votes in two swing constituencies in birmingham. so now theres gonna be another vote which the lib dems are expected to win in those 2 constituencies

I wish I could be as certain as you. But I truly believe the Tories could give us all a nasty surprise, not because the country really wants to go back to Thatcherism, but because of apathy, complacency, and good-intentions-gone-wrong.
In a perverse sort of way I am glad about the emmergence of a 'new right.'

It is seems to do in split the right wing vote.

I would not be as certain as I am it the Tories weren't losing ground too.

I haven't heard anything about that. Could you provide a link to an article or something?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/vote_2005/frontpage/4413337.stm

It was all over the british news yesterday, its died down now though, but basically 6 labour minister rigged the postal votes in two swing constituencies in birmingham. so now theres gonna be another vote which the lib dems are expected to win in those 2 constituencies
labour candidates rigged postal voted in a council election. there is nothing to suggest it was condoned by the party

that was for council elections, and the result has been overturned.

so whats that got to do with Blair not consulting the people?

precisely nothing.

you're talking rubbish, that just proves that blair and his party are lying to get votes and they are cheating the system which people have died to save from dictators. also he is using the death of the pope to his advantage to make people like him, it just shows how arrogant and dispicable he is.

wow the communists have more than labour.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/vote_2005/frontpage/4413337.stm
theres also this:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_midlands/4406575.stm

In a perverse sort of way I am glad about the emmergence of a 'new right.'

It is seems to do in split the right wing vote.

I would not be as certain as I am it the Tories weren't losing ground too.

I agree with you, the right-wing vote is being increasingly split because of nutters like UKIP,the BNP and even Veritas (lol!).

But if Labour's support doesn't hold up it doesn't change the fact that the Tories are the second-largest party. Perhaps in the upcoming few weeks all those renegade Tories who have recently tended to vote for a minor party will suddenly see they have the chance to put the Conservatives back in government. That's the danger.

wow the communists have more than labour.

That's Leftist solidarity for you....*sigh*

But if you were a proper communist you'd want the Tories to get in, because a reactionary right-wing government would aggrevate class tensions and bring the revolution ever nearer. (It's always nice to get a bit of Marxism into the argument)

you're talking rubbish, that just proves that blair and his party are lying to get votes and they are cheating the system which people have died to save from dictators. also he is using the death of the pope to his advantage to make people like him, it just shows how arrogant and dispicable he is.

Although I'm not defending rigging votes, I'm not sure I can see how the death of the Pope has got anything to do with the election. The announcement was delayed by twenty-four hours out of respect, and that's about as far as the link goes.

theres also this:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_midlands/4406575.stm

Thanks.

you're talking rubbish, that just proves that blair and his party are lying to get votes and they are cheating the system which people have died to save from dictators. also he is using the death of the pope to his advantage to make people like him, it just shows how arrogant and dispicable he is.
and the Tories don't do that? :rolleyes:

you're talking rubbish, that just proves that blair and his party are lying to get votes and they are cheating the system which people have died to save from dictators. also he is using the death of the pope to his advantage to make people like him, it just shows how arrogant and dispicable he is.

How exactly did you come to that conclusion? Six Labour councillors in Birmingham do not represent the party as a whole.

and the Tories don't do that? :rolleyes:

The tories don't rig votes, thats a trick Blair uses and no-one else in britain

How exactly did you come to that conclusion? Six Labour councillors in Birmingham do not represent the party as a whole.

Its called propaganda, they don't not represent it ither.

The tories don't rig votes, thats a trick Blair uses and no-one else in britain
nobody else in Britain? heard of Sinn Fein?

The tories don't rig votes, thats a trick Blair uses and no-one else in britain

You're making a fool out of yourself. Idiots from all parties; Labour, Tory, Lib Dem, and I even remember a case of the BNP getting involved, sometimes try to cheat. We all condemn electoral fraud. Now can we get back to proper grown-up debate?

nobody else in Britain? heard of Sinn Fein?

Sinn Fein are in Ireland. and they're terrorists, not a political party

Sinn Fein are in Ireland.

Then why do they stand for Westminster elections?

Sinn Fein are in Ireland.
and Northern Ireland, which is part of the UK, and stand for Westminster

Sinn Fein are in Ireland.

Oh dear.

ok ok, i don't want to get into an argument about geography.

ok ok, i don't want to get into an argument about geography.
its nothing to do with geography, its politics. Sinn Fein have 4 seats in Westminster


(although as a matter of principle they dont sit)

Sorry to disappoint, but Sinn Fein is the political wing of the IRA, which was born out of the republican desire to have a united Ireland and remove the Crown's control of the northern partition. It has been linked to the slogan "vote early, vote often". That sounds like electoral fraud - and in the IRA's case probably intimidation - to me.

its nothing to do with geography, its politics. Sinn Fein have 4 seats in Westminster


(although as a matter of principle they dont sit)

i'm seriously begining to dislike you.

Sorry to disappoint, but Sinn Fein is the political wing of the IRA, which was born out of the republican desire to have a united Ireland and remove the Crown's control of the northern partition. It has been linked to the slogan "vote early, vote often". That sounds like electoral fraud - and in the IRA's case probably intimidation - to me.
at the last election they forced a polling booth to remain open past closing time, and theyve done other stuff similar...

Its called propaganda, they don't not represent it ither.

Er, I'm not quite sure what you mean by that.

Just to clarify what I said: just because a few councillors committed electoral fraud, is does not mean that the entire party is riddled with corruption (which is what you were suggesting).

i'm seriously begining to dislike you.
good

look, all parties are, at some level, corrupt and scandalous - its part of how people are nowadays. in my view, the tories are by far the most corrupt, labour are heading that way, and the lib dems may well be as corrupt as the other two but they aren't in the media spotlight as much, so its difficult to tell.
out of the three i'd trust the lib dems the most.

Er, I'm not quite sure what you mean by that.

Just to clarify what I said: just because a few councillors committed electoral fraud, is does not mean that the entire party is riddled with corruption (which is what you were suggesting).


wheres your evidence to say its not riddled with corruption.

wheres your evidence to say its not riddled with corruption.

Where's your evidence to suggest that it is? That's a logical fallacy.

link (http://datanation.com/fallacies/distract/ig.htm)

wheres your evidence to say its not riddled with corruption.
That's an impossible task.

i'm seriously begining to dislike you.

At risk of upsetting you, I'm still not sure how Tony Blair used the Pope's death for political gain.

Where's your evidence to suggest that it is? That's a logical fallacy.

link (http://datanation.com/fallacies/distract/ig.htm)

I don't have any, but I do know that I do not trust Tony Blair any more than I would trust a criminal that was released early by labour

As usual I've voted for the Lib Dems.

At risk of upsetting you, I'm still not sure how Tony Blair used the Pope's death for political gain.

Something about him delaying the announcement of the election for 24 hours out of respect or something (though listeners of Today in Westminster would have know it was scheduled in for that time around two weeks ago :p)

At risk of upsetting you, I'm still not sure how Tony Blair used the Pope's death for political gain.

He makes people like him by not going to the queen to get permission on monday

Something about him delaying the announcement of the election for 24 hours out of respect or something (though listeners of Today in Westminster would have know it was scheduled in for that time around two weeks ago :p)

I still don't see how being 'respectful' to the Pope can possibly be politically-motivated.

He makes people like him by not going to the queen to get permission on monday

It didn't work on me. That's a bit spurious.

He makes people like him by not going to the queen to get permission on monday

...

I still don't see how being 'respectful' to the Pope can possibly be politically-motivated.
Well remember who origanally asserted the point

I have to go now, so i have one last thing to say "vote conservative"

I have to go now, so i have one last thing to say "vote conservative"

It's been interesting talking to you.

Ok, I didn't realise the latest MORI poll puts the Conservatives ahead of Labour, with a big enough swing to produce a hung Parliament. Yes, most of the polls still show Labour slightly ahead and yes I understand how with FPTP voting these national indications aren't too useful - but at the same time I don't think people appreciate the fact that if Labour lose this it is the Tories who will win it. Do you really want that to happen?

And to all those pledging their support to the Lib Dems, can I ask would you still be doing the same if Comrade Blair resigned tomorrow and Gordon Brown took over? Just out of interest I would like to know how much of a difference that would make.

Ok, I didn't realise the latest MORI poll puts the Conservatives ahead of Labour, with a big enough swing to produce a hung Parliament. Yes, most of the polls still show Labour slightly ahead and yes I understand how with FPTP voting these national indications aren't too useful - but at the same time I don't think people appreciate the fact that if Labour lose this it is the Tories who will win it. Do you really want that to happen?

And to all those pledging their support to the Lib Dems, can I ask would you still be doing the same if Comrade Blair resigned tomorrow and Gordon Brown took over? Just out of interest I would like to know how much of a difference that would make.
I would still vote Lib Dem

And to all those pledging their support to the Lib Dems, can I ask would you still be doing the same if Comrade Blair resigned tomorrow and Gordon Brown took over? Just out of interest I would like to know how much of a difference that would make.

I have to say, if I thought it was a case of "vote Blair, get Brown" I would be more inclined to vote Labour, however I am worried about these ID card proposals and won't vote for a party that holds them.

Interestingly the Conservatives toyed with the idea of using "Vote Blair, get Brown" as a campaign slogan, but quietly ditched after it was realised that this line of attack would probably help Labour. :D

I heard this on PM the other week, web links seem short on the ground.

Accept this blog if you will:

http://europhobia.blogspot.com/2004/10/vote-blair-get-brown.html

I support the Scottish Socialist Party (http://www.scottishsocialistparty.org/) and I hope they will win in Scotland which although very unlikely is possible since they will be standing in all 59 Scottish constituencies. Out of the UK parties listed I would be most likely to vote for the Communist Party of Britain (http://www.communist-party.org.uk) although unfortunately I don't think they'll be standing in many areas.

I have to say, if I thought it was a case of "vote Blair, get Brown" I would be more inclined to vote Labour, however I am worried about these ID card proposals and won't vote for a party that holds them.[/url]

Tony won't be around forever. If Labour wins this election, I'd give him maybe 1 or 2 years before retirement. However, if the campaign does seem to be going disastrously maybe Blair should stand down (or at least state when he plans to stand down and let Gordon take over). He must not let his position jeapordise the cause.

I find it really hard to get worked up about ID cards, whether arguing for them or against them.

I support the Scottish Socialist Party (http://www.scottishsocialistparty.org/) and I hope they will win in Scotland which although very unlikely is possible since they will be standing in all 59 Scottish constituencies. Out of the UK parties listed I would be most likely to vote for the Communist Party of Britain (http://www.communist-party.org.uk) although unfortunately I don't think they'll be standing in many areas.

Hmm. Which Communist Party of Britain is it exactly? You have to be specific; The Communist Party, The New Communist Party of Great Britain, The Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist)....

if you're a lunatic Leftie you're spoilt for choice you really are

Hmm. Which Communist Party of Britain is it exactly? You have to be specific; The Communist Party, The New Communist Party of Great Britain, The Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist)....

if you're a lunatic Leftie you're spoilt for choice you really are

I was referring to the "Communist Party of Britain (http://www.communist-party.org.uk)" and the link goes to their site. They are the largest communist party in Britain, the only one that is standing in the elections and they have the closest connections to the old official CPGB (which was closed in the 80's) and their paper the "Morning Star (http://www.morningstaronline.co.uk)" which is still published every day and which I regularly read.

Tony won't be around forever. If Labour wins this election, I'd give him maybe 1 or 2 years before retirement. However, if the campaign does seem to be going disastrously maybe Blair should stand down (or at least state when he plans to stand down and let Gordon take over). He must not let his position jeapordise the cause.

Hasn't he said he would stay for the whole term then resign for the next election?

I find it really hard to get worked up about ID cards, whether arguing for them or against them.

Meh, different strokes. I find it hard to get worked up on many of the issues the parties are focussing on.

I was referring to the "Communist Party of Britain (http://www.communist-party.org.uk)" and the link goes to their site. They are the largest communist party in Britain, the only one that is standing in the elections and has the closest connections to the old official CPGB (which was closed in the 80's) and their paper the "Morning Star (http://www.morningstaronline.co.uk)" which is still published every day and which I regularly read.

Yup, I regularly flick through the Morning Star myself. Ironically, for such a "progressive" newspaper it's not even printed on recycled paper!

The Communist Party still preaches revolution, I didn't know that. I wonder what they've ever actually achieved for helping working people in this country? Sweet f-all I think you'll find

Theres no point in doing a poll on the British general election in here because the results are never proportionate to what most British people actually think. Almost all of the British people on here are students who voted Lib Dem as a matter of course so thats why they always win NS British election polls. In reality, the Lib Dems dont stand a chance of even getting half of the Conservative's vote, let alone winning.

Not British here, but personally I've always hated the Conservatives, and the Labour is sucking right now, so go Liberal Democrats!

Theres no point in doing a poll on the British general election in here because the results are never proportionate to what most British people actually think. Almost all of the British people on here are students who voted Lib Dem as a matter of course so thats why they always win NS British election polls. In reality, the Lib Dems dont stand a chance of even getting half of the Conservative's vote, let alone winning.

Well, that just means that if the parties stay their course, eventually the Liberal Democrats will win out. If they don't, well, the party closest to the current beliefs of the Liberal Democrats will be in power. It's only a matter of time.

Labour is the way forward. The country has been improving in most areas since Labour came and cleared up after the other parties made a mess of the country. Labour still has alot of kick left in them too.

Also Micheal Howard tells us more about Labours mistakes and makes up silly stories more than he tells us what he is going to try and do to the country.

Labour is the way forward. The country has been improving in most areas since Labour came and cleared up after the other parties made a mess of the country. Labour still has alot of kick left in them too.

Also Micheal Howard tells us more about Labours mistakes and makes up silly stories more than he tells us what he is going to try and do to the country.

Make up silly stories? I think thats Labour's department, dont you? Like when they said we (the Conservative Party) were going to cut piublic spending by £35 million and it was proved to be a complete and utter lie by members of the press. Or that other silly, silly story about Iraq having WMDs.

Make up silly stories? I think thats Labour's department, dont you? Like when they said we (the Conservative Party) were going to cut piublic spending by £35 million and it was proved to be a complete and utter lie by members of the press. Or that other silly, silly story about Iraq having WMDs.

Um - isn't it official Tory Party policy to reduce public spending by £35 BILLION during your first term in government?

And don't forget the whole Howard Flight fuss. Do you think he was telling the truth; that secretly the party plans even more dramatic cuts in spending but knows it can't tell the electorate because its such an unpopular idea?

Um - isn't it official Tory Party policy to reduce public spending by £35 BILLION during your first term in government?

And don't forget the whole Howard Flight fuss. Do you think he was telling the truth; that secretly the party plans even more dramatic cuts in spending but knows it can't tell the electorate because its such an unpopular idea?

Um no actually that myth was fabricated by our friends in the New Labour spin department.

I find it really hard to get worked up about ID cards, whether arguing for them or against them.
Looks like the whole topic could be moot now anyway.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/vote_2005/frontpage/4414653.stm

I'm probably going to vote Lib Dems. My dad insists that I'll grow out of it by the time the next ones roles around. :p Once the real world hits I'll apparently stop being so idealistic and vote for one of the others.

But I'm never in a million years going to vote for UKIP. I hate them. And it's not just because of Robert Kilroy Silk (even though I do just want to throw things at him). Europe rocks my socks and I want to be a part of it. I'm increasingly tempted to make loud booing noises when I walk past the UKIP house near where my mum works. It's their local centre of opperations or something.

But I'm never in a million years going to vote for UKIP. I hate them. And it's not just because of Robert Kilroy Silk (even though I do just want to throw things at him).

Get to the end of a very long queue :)
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/dec2004/4/1/000881E6-7DAA-11B5-BAE980BFB6FA0000.jpg

Um no actually that myth was fabricated by our friends in the New Labour spin department.

This is from the website of that famous Leftie rag, the Daily Torygraph;

"the remarks confirmed Labour's view that the Tories had plans for public spending cuts beyond the £35 billion savings publicly acknowledged by the Conservative leadership."

Savings = less investment in public services = another word for cuts

Get to the end of a very long queue :)
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/dec2004/4/1/000881E6-7DAA-11B5-BAE980BFB6FA0000.jpg

You have no idea how much that made me laugh when I first saw it. :D

Then I had to go and be a decent human being by feeling slightly sorry for the man being humiliated like that. I hate my conscience sometimes. :rolleyes:

I'm increasingly tempted to make loud booing noises when I walk past the UKIP house near where my mum works. It's their local centre of opperations or something.

Go for it; ya boo sucks!

I'm probably going to vote Lib Dems. My dad insists that I'll grow out of it by the time the next ones roles around. :p Once the real world hits I'll apparently stop being so idealistic and vote for one of the others.

But I'm never in a million years going to vote for UKIP. I hate them. And it's not just because of Robert Kilroy Silk (even though I do just want to throw things at him). Europe rocks my socks and I want to be a part of it. I'm increasingly tempted to make loud booing noises when I walk past the UKIP house near where my mum works. It's their local centre of opperations or something.

What may I ask is wrong with Robert KilroySilk. And why does Europe rock your socks off. Europe would mean, higher taxes for businesses, making it harder for small businesses to get off the ground and taking power from London to Brussells, and nobody in their right mind would want this country to do that.

I really do want to kill Howard Flight. What a tosser, does he want his party to win or not. Even though most of the fuss did come from Alistair Campell and his spin doctor tactics.

I really do want to kill Howard Flight. What a tosser, does he want his party to win or not. Even though most of the fuss did come from Alistair Campell and his spin doctor tactics.

I sent an agry email to Howard Flight's constiuency party attacking him and the constituency support for him. As yet I have received no response

Well if you think this poll is accurate, you would have Lib Dem majority with a Conservative opposition but the British Communist Party would hold the balance of power as the Lib Dem majority isnt big enough. Labour have just become a minor fourth party.

That tells you how realistic these polls are. The British Communist Party don't even have one MP in the House of Commons and there is no way that the Lib Dems are going to win the election.

Labour is the way forward. The country has been improving in most areas since Labour came and cleared up after the other parties made a mess of the country. Labour still has alot of kick left in them too.

Also Micheal Howard tells us more about Labours mistakes and makes up silly stories more than he tells us what he is going to try and do to the country.

In the words of Micheal Howard and his back-benchers,

Taxes - UP
Crime - UP
Immigration - UP
Hospital Waiting Times - UP
MRSA - UP
Truancy - UP

Pay - DOWN
Pensions - DOWN
Productivity Growth - DOWN
Manufacturing Employment - DOWN

All in the eight years under Tony Blair and Labour.

Doesn't your country have a party that supports classical liberal principles, or at the very least a Libertarian party?

Doesn't your country have a party that supports classical liberal principles, or at the very least a Libertarian party?

Thankfully no.

In the words of Micheal Howard and his back-benchers,

Taxes - UP
Crime - UP
Immigration - UP
Hospital Waiting Times - UP
MRSA - UP
Truancy - UP

Pay - DOWN
Pensions - DOWN
Productivity Growth - DOWN
Manufacturing Employment - DOWN

All in the eight years under Tony Blair and Labour.

In the words of me (because I can think for myself); Michael Howard's a disgraceful politician. For a start, just about all those claims are complete bollocks.

The really important things to remember are:
Unemployment - Virtually zero
Investment in public services - Larger than any previous government
Interest rates - Lowest for a generation

and also...

Michael Howard, a Tory who helped bring you the poll tax, unemployment of more than 3 million, interest rates through the roof in a boom and bust economy, the cutting of police numbers while he was Home Secretary, the privatisation of hospital cleaning staff from which hospitals have never recovered, the privatisation of school catering from which our childrens' health has never recovered, AND HE CAN'T SEE ANYTHING WRONG WITH THIS