NationStates Jolt Archive

I really do.

Over the past 5 years, we've seen a massive build-up of Republican power in the government of the US. Bush was elected to Preisdent, whether you think it was legit or not, he is there. With him came a divided congress. Then, in the mid-term election, Republicans took power. They were dethroned breifly when one of their own defected, but, again, at the Presidential, we got Bush for another term and a Republican majority.

Here's what I'm predicting.

The Republicans will continue to rise in power for another few election cycles. They may be able to attain a massive philibuster-proof majority in congress, keep control of the executive branch, and gain control of the judicial branch through appointments as well. If and when this happens, it will be the downfall of the Republican party. As we all know, power corrupts, easily. For the party that claims to be right and moral party, it will probably happen faster than normal because of the idea of 'mandate'.

Eventually, it will happen. And when it does, the backlash will come into affect. People will get tired of hearing that they are wrong if they disagree with the conservative party, people will stop wanting to here what they need to believe and feel. People will get tired of religion playing such a big role in determining what moral character a candidate has. When that happens, the Republicans will lose power, but it will not be a gradual thing. The republicans will lose power suddenly. The will go into an election night with a huge majoirty, feeling confidant. When they come out however, it will be like a beaten dog.

The Democrats aren't dead yet, they're just in remission. They had an upswing with Clinton and faced the backlash, I think the Conservatives will have another President after Bush, and maybe one more after that, but then, I think, the backlash will occur.

sad thing is
you are probably right

:shrug: the Republican Party may very well be heading for a blacklash. I'm not aware of this "Conservative" Party of which you speak. This refers to your title, not your post.

As far as the post, yes the Republican party will eventually fall from Grace. However by the time it will its my person prediction that the Democratic party will either a) be changed so much it will not be the same Democratic party we see today or b) the Democratic party won't exist and there will be a different party that rises in its place, with a whole new name.

Personally I hope the Republican party falls down and splits up into 2 or 3 and that the Democratic party falls down and splits into 2 or 3 parties.

Perhaps. You could be right. However, as much as I want the Democrats to regain power, I would rather it not happen this way. This would take too long and would allow the Republicans to pass FAR too much legislation FAR too easily. I don't think I could stand it. I hope, rather, that the power is balanced in 2006 and 2008. *crosses fingers* I'll be sure to contribute :)

I think that for all the talk after the Presidential election of "healing the rift, uniting America" and all the other rhetoric, the Republican party has been doing a bang-up job of further alienating the other 49% of the population. Mandate of the people, my ass; just over half is not a mandate by any stretch of the imagination.

On the other hand, I'm not real impressed with the Dems either. In fact, if the '08 election came down to...say, Hillary Clinton and Jeb Bush, I think I'll just stay home that day, or throw my vote to Ayn Rand or the Green Party canidate that year.

However, if it was a Clinton vs. McCain race, I'd probably vote Republican for the first time in my life...

I think that for all the talk after the Presidential election of "healing the rift, uniting America" and all the other rhetoric, the Republican party has been doing a bang-up job of further alienating the other 49% of the population. Mandate of the people, my ass; just over half is not a mandate by any stretch of the imagination.

On the other hand, I'm not real impressed with the Dems either. In fact, if the '08 election came down to...say, Hillary Clinton and Jeb Bush, I think I'll just stay home that day, or throw my vote to Ayn Rand or the Green Party canidate that year.

However, if it was a Clinton vs. McCain race, I'd probably vote Republican for the first time in my life...

I don't know. Given a choice of two ballless hypocrites I think I'd take the one that was designed that way. Plus we did damn well under the first Clinton. It would be nice to tell all the people who like to chalk it up to the Republican Congress "ok, republican president and congress, country down the toilet, even a Democratic president with a Republican congress ridin' high." Hell, it's pretty much proven by now that Carter's supposed "weak" presidency was the fault of Reagen's plotters. Give republicans any power at all and everything goes to shit.

If it was Hillary vs. McCain, i Might go republican as well, just because I happen to like McCain.

I think Barak Obama would make an interesting Dem candidate. he already has a nation network and has proven himself to be very charismatic.

McCain sticks to his guns. He was the only Republican in Congress that I actually heard speak out against their whole action in the Schiavo mess. The rest were either riding their moral high horse or keeping their mouths shut, even if they disagreed.

Of course, I tend to believe that it's not the Republicans nor the Democrats that are the problem by themselves, it's this degradation of elections into a two-ring (party) political circus that's ruining the country.

I kinda/sorta agree with you BLARGistania.

My feeling is that yes, the Republican party will rift, fragment, and alienate people once they see what happens when you really, truly enact most of the ideas they want: I'd love to see what happens to big and little "L" libertarians in the face of a second Great Depression, which I think we seem to be skidding inerrantly toward. Something tells me they might reconsider their mantra of Reagan's argument that Government is the problem. Moreover, they'll get fed up with social conservative's agenda of nannying the television tube, and Christian moderates will eventually start calling out fundamentalists for the blasphemers they are.

But the problem at the moment, and the reason I don't entirely agree, is because I don't think the Democratic Party is in remission. I think it's in the end stages of terminal illness. What I mean by this is that liberalism as a doctrine isn't dead, as there are plenty of people out there who still object to both libertarian and social conservative policies, and would like a return to the days of yore when people could be reasonably trusted to watch TV they wanted, and government could be reasonably trusted to prevent companies from jacking their customers with a pen instead of a knife. The Democratic Party, however, has bought the neo-liberal idea of socially liberal, economically conservative line hook, line, and sinker. Unfortunately, that just plays right into the conservative handbook, because the two parties fundamentally agree on the same (IMO flawed) premise: that less government is better government where the economy is concerned. Without that distinction, the Democratic Party will always look out of touch, because it on the one hand does not address the central economic issues of blue-collar workers, and on the other does not correspond with their intuitions on social issues. Moreover, there doesn't seem to be one damn person in the party with the backbone to stand up to the neoliberals and fight back against this assumption. As such, what you have is less a party than a bunch of suits with all the spine of wet noodles. Mind you I'm a hard-core Democrat saying this.

[bump]

:shrug: the Republican Party may very well be heading for a blacklash. I'm not aware of this "Conservative" Party of which you speak. This refers to your title, not your post.

Yes it was fairly annoying that he used that term. I was going to say the same thing. The Conservative Party is in Britain, BLARG!

Yes it was fairly annoying that he used that term. I was going to say the same thing. The Conservative Party is in Britain, BLARG!

oh get over it. I got you to read it. And, if you happen to be an American and can't figure out which party is conservative, you don't deserve to vote. Or be involved in politics in any way.

I think you are wrong Blarg, I believe the Democrats will splinter and split long before the Republicans/Conservatives do. It already has happened on more than one occassion, one more strong defeat will finish the job and the Democrat party will be no more. I actually have a few bottles of champaign stored away for the occassion and will throw the largest party my State has seen in decades.

2006- Need to get rid of another 4-10 Senators and atleast 20 more House Democrats

2008- Another 4-10 Senators and another 20-30 House Democrats couple with another Republican win

this all spells doom for the Democrats, I hope it comes to pass.

I think you are wrong Blarg, I believe the Democrats will splinter and split long before the Republicans/Conservatives do. It already has happened on more than one occassion, one more strong defeat will finish the job and the Democrat party will be no more. I actually have a few bottles of champaign stored away for the occassion and will throw the largest party my State has seen in decades.

2006- Need to get rid of another 4-10 Senators and atleast 20 more House Democrats

2008- Another 4-10 Senators and another 20-30 House Democrats couple with another Republican win

this all spells doom for the Democrats, I hope it comes to pass.

i diagree... the Democrats wont splinter dramatically.. but shift their party ideologies starkly to the right. they will move from center/middle left to center right. THEN they will die out as a result when more far liberal parties like the Greens come back to counter the Republicans (who are ever sliding right) btw i am republican and would love to see another contendor against us. Only because while the Republicans are largely a party of questionalbe ideas.. the Democrats are a party of NO ideas... and this is not constructive to our nation.. especially when the Democrats are suppose to represent LIBERALS whose whole ideology is centered around CHANGE!

I really do.

Over the past 5 years, we've seen a massive build-up of Republican power in the government of the US. Bush was elected to Preisdent, whether you think it was legit or not, he is there. With him came a divided congress. Then, in the mid-term election, Republicans took power. They were dethroned breifly when one of their own defected, but, again, at the Presidential, we got Bush for another term and a Republican majority.

Here's what I'm predicting.

The Republicans will continue to rise in power for another few election cycles. They may be able to attain a massive philibuster-proof majority in congress, keep control of the executive branch, and gain control of the judicial branch through appointments as well. If and when this happens, it will be the downfall of the Republican party. As we all know, power corrupts, easily. For the party that claims to be right and moral party, it will probably happen faster than normal because of the idea of 'mandate'.

Eventually, it will happen. And when it does, the backlash will come into affect. People will get tired of hearing that they are wrong if they disagree with the conservative party, people will stop wanting to here what they need to believe and feel. People will get tired of religion playing such a big role in determining what moral character a candidate has. When that happens, the Republicans will lose power, but it will not be a gradual thing. The republicans will lose power suddenly. The will go into an election night with a huge majoirty, feeling confidant. When they come out however, it will be like a beaten dog.

The Democrats aren't dead yet, they're just in remission. They had an upswing with Clinton and faced the backlash, I think the Conservatives will have another President after Bush, and maybe one more after that, but then, I think, the backlash will occur.
you could argue that its already happened in the UK - the conservative party held power for 18 consecutive years and then suddenly lost to the largest majority in UK history. however religion wasn't the major issue.

i diagree... the Democrats wont splinter dramatically.. but shift their party ideologies starkly to the right. they will move from center/middle left to center right. THEN they will die out as a result when more far liberal parties like the Greens come back to counter the Republicans (who are ever sliding right) btw i am republican and would love to see another contendor against us. Only because while the Republicans are largely a party of questionalbe ideas.. the Democrats are a party of NO ideas... and this is not constructive to our nation.. especially when the Democrats are suppose to represent LIBERALS whose whole ideology is centered around CHANGE!

The Dems have become Republican-lite. If someone prefers Republicans, they can just vote for them. Why the hell would anyone vote for an almost clone of another party? I want a real choice and wish this country had about six real opposition parties.

I don't understand how people think the Democratic party is dead. Democrats just had a bad year because of bad leadership. They are turning into "Republican clones", but they can fix that.

The real problem is: has the American people just lost interest in politics?

The Republican party successfully tricked the public into voting their way (don't deny it, they made a war hero look like a war criminal.) and people are looking more for so called "morals" (that don't realistically affect them in any way) and less on the personal economic consequences of their votes. They successfully revived the "southerners hate northerners" attitude from the Civil War. If this continues America is in a boatload of trouble.

Just as Salvondia said, I am not sure of this "Conservative" party in which you speak of. There are many other parties that are Conservative as well who would not be 'hit' if the GOP failed.

I understand perfectly well that you meant to say "I think the REPUBLICAN party is headed for a backlash". But I wouldn't generalize and say that Conservatives are only made up of the GOP.

;)

i diagree... the Democrats wont splinter dramatically.. but shift their party ideologies starkly to the right. they will move from center/middle left to center right. THEN they will die out as a result when more far liberal parties like the Greens come back to counter the Republicans (who are ever sliding right) btw i am republican and would love to see another contendor against us. Only because while the Republicans are largely a party of questionalbe ideas.. the Democrats are a party of NO ideas... and this is not constructive to our nation.. especially when the Democrats are suppose to represent LIBERALS whose whole ideology is centered around CHANGE!

Well said.

<snip>
The Republicans will continue to rise in power for another few election cycles. They may be able to attain a massive philibuster-proof majority in congress, keep control of the executive branch, and gain control of the judicial branch through appointments as well. If and when this happens, it will be the downfall of the Republican party. As we all know, power corrupts, easily. For the party that claims to be right and moral party, it will probably happen faster than normal because of the idea of 'mandate'.
<snip>
The Democrats aren't dead yet, they're just in remission. They had an upswing with Clinton and faced the backlash, I think the Conservatives will have another President after Bush, and maybe one more after that, but then, I think, the backlash will occur.

Welcome to the wheel. I totally agree, the GOP is getting near the top of the wheel, if they're not there already.

However, I disagree re: the DEMs. If they don't win the White House by 2012, it's game over.

Why? The Supreme Court.
Right now, the only DEM appointees (both by Clinton, as Carter didn't get to appoint any) are Ginsburg (65) and Breyer (60).
If the GOP wins in '08 and '12, that puts it at 2017 as the earliest year the DEMS *could* put one up. Breyer will be 72; that's only 3 years younger than Rhenquist is now Ginsburg will be 77. And that's just to keep the status quo of 7-2!!

While I doubt Roe v Wade will even be overturned, lots of other issues will be "nipped in the bud".

I cried when they shot Medgar Evers
Tears ran down my spine
I cried when they shot Mr. Kennedy
As though I'd lost a father of mine
But Malcolm X got what was coming
He got what he asked for this time
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I go to civil rights rallies
And I put down the old D.A.R.
I love Harry and Sidney and Sammy
I hope every colored boy becomes a star
But don't talk about revolution
That's going a little bit too far
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I cheered when Humphrey was chosen
My faith in the system restored
I'm glad the commies were thrown out
of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board
I love Puerto Ricans and Negros
as long as they don't move next door
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

The people of old Mississippi
Should all hang their heads in shame
I can't understand how their minds work
What's the matter don't they watch Les Crain?
But if you ask me to bus my children
I hope the cops take down your name
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I read New republic and Nation
I've learned to take every view
You know, I've memorized Lerner and Golden
I feel like I'm almost a Jew
But when it comes to times like Korea
There's no one more red, white and blue
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

I vote for the democratic party
They want the U.N. to be strong
I go to all the Pete Seeger concerts
He sure gets me singing those songs
I'll send all the money you ask for
But don't ask me to come on along
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

Once I was young and impulsive
I wore every conceivable pin
Even went to the socialist meetings
Learned all the old union hymns
But I've grown older and wiser
And that's why I'm turning you in
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal

The Democrats are not winning elections because their rhoteric is tiring and old. Thier the party of the 1960's and 1930's when the nation was flat broke.
Now its a new time, people live longer, get paid more, and we have a rising middle class

They have no soultion into fixing the problems of a rising deifict

Look at Kerry for example he said he was going to fix the economy. Yet the only thing that Kerry has ever voted to cut was the defense budget. He wants to expand programs like Medicaid and Medicare which has grown 50% each year...the very programs that are keeping the economy down. Plus Kerry wanted to make Medicaid avaliable to workers with three times below the poverty level, which in turn would force businesses to drop health insurance because the govt would be giving it out for free. Now add that Kerry and the dems want to provide fund urban schools, give out subsides for college cost, unversial health care for children and somehow the economy is suppose to get better????? The economy isn't going to improve with more welfare programs...its going to improve with less welfare programs

Why do we need welfare poloices in when most of Americans are middle class????????? doesn't make any sense

Now, thats not to say that i don't hate the ultra conservatives. Ultra conservatives are nuts!
Im a Republican sure, but im more a follower of McCain then Bush

I really do.

Over the past 5 years, we've seen a massive build-up of Republican power in the government of the US. Bush was elected to Preisdent, whether you think it was legit or not, he is there. With him came a divided congress. Then, in the mid-term election, Republicans took power. They were dethroned breifly when one of their own defected, but, again, at the Presidential, we got Bush for another term and a Republican majority.

Here's what I'm predicting.

The Republicans will continue to rise in power for another few election cycles. They may be able to attain a massive philibuster-proof majority in congress, keep control of the executive branch, and gain control of the judicial branch through appointments as well. If and when this happens, it will be the downfall of the Republican party. As we all know, power corrupts, easily. For the party that claims to be right and moral party, it will probably happen faster than normal because of the idea of 'mandate'.

Eventually, it will happen. And when it does, the backlash will come into affect. People will get tired of hearing that they are wrong if they disagree with the conservative party, people will stop wanting to here what they need to believe and feel. People will get tired of religion playing such a big role in determining what moral character a candidate has. When that happens, the Republicans will lose power, but it will not be a gradual thing. The republicans will lose power suddenly. The will go into an election night with a huge majoirty, feeling confidant. When they come out however, it will be like a beaten dog.

The Democrats aren't dead yet, they're just in remission. They had an upswing with Clinton and faced the backlash, I think the Conservatives will have another President after Bush, and maybe one more after that, but then, I think, the backlash will occur.

Unfortunaly, and no one realizes this, if there is another election like last year's, there will be another civil war. Mark my words. These elections are splitting us apart. Conservative versus Liberal, Republican versus Democrat. It will happen, we're long overdue for another.

Unfortunaly, and no one realizes this, if there is another election like last year's, there will be another civil war. Mark my words. These elections are splitting us apart. Conservative versus Liberal, Republican versus Democrat. It will happen, we're long overdue for another.

Never happen. You going to go shoot your own family members?

And, btw, 90% of us really don't care. ;)

I don't understand how people think the Democratic party is dead. Democrats just had a bad year because of bad leadership. They are turning into "Republican clones", but they can fix that.

The real problem is: has the American people just lost interest in politics?

The Republican party successfully tricked the public into voting their way (don't deny it, they made a war hero look like a war criminal.) and people are looking more for so called "morals" (that don't realistically affect them in any way) and less on the personal economic consequences of their votes. They successfully revived the "southerners hate northerners" attitude from the Civil War. If this continues America is in a boatload of trouble.

This is not about the Democrats having a bad year. Since beginning with Clintons second term the Democrats have lost all the power they once had. When Clinton came into office the Democrats held nearly all the power, but Clinton was both the Democrats champion and bane... With all his charisma and charm and wits he built a model for the democrats that no one can ever meet.. and his hugh popularity let the democrats lose focus... he made them so centrist no one could tell the difference between them and the republicans only the republicans built their state foundations while the Democrats worked on national forums... now the Democrats have no infastructure from state to state (which is why they lose the midwest and south every election cycle)..

Did the democrats have just a bad year ? think about it.. these last two elections shouldn't have even been close.. they should have won in land slides. Gore was able to claim one of the greatest economies America has ever known (even though it was in recession and we didn't even know it) ... and Kerry the supposed Hero of america from his time in vietnam to the senate veteran opposed a president waging an expensive costly unpopular war with unemployment and healthcare as key issues while holding record trade deficits 4 years over. And the republicans held both the house and the senate. The republicans were the only ones to blame for any precived problems in the country and yet.. they did not just win the election it was a blow out. An unpopular president wins with a solid majority and the republicans secure the house and senate with absolute control (As opposed to a raiser thin division). Kerry ends his campegin with what was it.. 15 million in the bank ? instead of investing it in races for his parties... REpublicans dont just have the house senate and presidency.. they have the majoirty of govonorships as well. Demcrats today have almost no meaningful infastructure to speak of and the last election told us "moral values" of all things toped voters agendas as opposed to social issues which should be most prevalent in a time in which unemployment (all be it astonishingly low) is the key concern...

The experts have it right... the democrats are out of step with mainstream america... they are too conservative for the liberals and too liberal for the conservatives.. the only problem is Howard dean is the face of the democratic liberalism and is seen as the knife in their backs by their own party(and he is their leader no less). How can you see nothing but death for this party ?

Never happen. You going to go shoot your own family members?

And, btw, 90% of us really don't care. ;)

give me a break.. a civil war ? the polarized sections of the political spectrum are the mass minority.. the only difference is.. the so called chrstian evangalists are mobolized and actually voting.. while the die hard liberals are staying at home cursing up a storm... the rest of us are moderats at worst just waiting for someone to come along with an idea we like... the only problem is the republicans are the only ones pumping out ideas (be them good or bad) while the democrats are so busy shooting them down they havn't time to make up their own... and so they are slowly bleeding themselves to death

and the fact that democrats are talking about Obama as a perspective candiate shows their desperation... he is a freshman in the political field only now for the first time being elected to a senate seat. MAYBE in 8 - 10 years he will be ready to be a democratic heavy weight.. but today.. any seasoned Republican politican will whipe the floor with him. Thinking of Obama as the next president is like thinking Alan Keyes as the next president (a promising freshman republican politican)

The Republican downfall will begin this term, I think. Or at least for Congress. DeLay's ethics violations and the Terry Schiavo/Religious Right things can be manipulated into election victories for the Democrats- if the Dems can grow some balls and get smart about the whole deal. Presidential politics are a bit difficult to predict, but I bet a Clark/Obama or Clark/pretty-much-anyone ticket could beat most of what the Republicans have to offer (Which is mostly Bill Frist and the hard right).

But I think that if the Dems don't get the White House by 2012, it could well be Game Over. I would say that the Democrats haven't really won an election since 92. By 96 Clinton was moderate enough to barely consider him a Democrat.

If the Democrats to not either adapt or change rhetoric, they will fall into a deeper remission. My theory is that one of the Big Two will fall permanently into a remissiona and will be replaced.

The Republican downfall will begin this term, I think. Or at least for Congress. DeLay's ethics violations and the Terry Schiavo/Religious Right things can be manipulated into election victories for the Democrats- if the Dems can grow some balls and get smart about the whole deal. Presidential politics are a bit difficult to predict, but I bet a Clark/Obama or Clark/pretty-much-anyone ticket could beat most of what the Republicans have to offer (Which is mostly Bill Frist and the hard right).

But I think that if the Dems don't get the White House by 2012, it could well be Game Over. I would say that the Democrats haven't really won an election since 92. By 96 Clinton was moderate enough to barely consider him a Democrat.

you gotta be kidding me.. Terry Schiavo ?? she is nothing more then a memory NOW with the death of the pope... in 2 years we wont even know her name let alone an election victory.

and Clarke was a joke canidate to begin with... How could Clarke contend with politicans like McCaine, Jebb Bush, hell even Arnold if he could run (who knows if the laws will be changed)... Guliani could beat clark FOR SURE... but there are so many others. Colin Powell if he were to run... maybe even Condi Rice (if she doesn't screw the state department up)...

I maybe a republican damnit.. but Colin Powell was made for the State Department.. a general gone diplomat is surely a quality to be praised


Those are just to name the popular canidates 3 years away from the next election... What do you we have for the democrats.. obama who just got into politics... and the panel of demcrats who screwed up the last time. Maybe Hiltary whose obiviously not a chance in the world since she is totally unapealing to even some in her own party let alone the republicans

The democrats last big chance was just with the Republians ploy to break the filibuster rule... they had the opprotunity to deamonize the entire republican party as authoritarians.. what do they do in response ?? threaten to shut down the government ?!?!?!!?! THey want to hold the government hostage because they aren't getting their way ?? That does not inspire symapthy.. it shows their inability to work within the system.. (there was no support behind the move to change the filibuster rule to begin with).. and they pull what could only be thought of as a last resort.

give me a break.. a civil war ? the polarized sections of the political spectrum are the mass minority.. the only difference is.. the so called chrstian evangalists are mobolized and actually voting.. while the die hard liberals are staying at home cursing up a storm... the rest of us are moderats at worst just waiting for someone to come along with an idea we like... the only problem is the republicans are the only ones pumping out ideas (be them good or bad) while the democrats are so busy shooting them down they havn't time to make up their own... and so they are slowly bleeding themselves to death

and the fact that democrats are talking about Obama as a perspective candiate shows their desperation... he is a freshman in the political field only now for the first time being elected to a senate seat. MAYBE in 8 - 10 years he will be ready to be a democratic heavy weight.. but today.. any seasoned Republican politican will whipe the floor with him. Thinking of Obama as the next president is like thinking Alan Keyes as the next president (a promising freshman republican politican)

Right on.

I'm a Connecticut Independent. I've voted (since '88) for 2 DEMS, 2 GOP, and one Independent. No one is going to start fighting in the streets because of the crap on the news channels. (And that goes for ALL of them!)