NationStates Jolt Archive

*NOTE* This post is pure opinion and thought on my part, I have done no research and have no evidence to support my statements. These are merely a few ideas that have been kicking around inside my skull for a while. Cheese is good. Have a nice day.

In the Old Testmanet, when Judaism was one of the only existing monotheistic religions, God liked to get His/Her/Its hands dirty. He/She/It would often speak to humans when He/She/It had a message that He/She/It'd like delivered in His/Her/Its name, but whenever action was require there were times when He/She/It'd do the deeds personally. The Ten Plagues of Egypt, the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, these are examples of when God needed something done and did it Him/Her/Itself. But what happens when God takes a vacation?

Now, I'm not positive, but I'm pretty sure that since the writing of the New Testament, essentially since Christianity came into play, God has been taking more of a back seat role. He/She/It still speaks to people and guides humanity, but He/She/It's is no longer jumping into the road and directing traffic personally. What I mean is that God no longer takes direct action, there's no more Divine Wrath burning down from the Heavens and smiting the sinners where they stand. A least, it's not as obvious (When God blacked out the Sun over Egypt it was really hard to miss, giving an STD to somebody who has had an affair is easy to pass off as simple bad luck). Naturally, when God is no longer smiting the evil ones and purging sin, something needs to fill the void. I think this is where we find the key to the bloody history found in most existing Western religions.

I think that, as the time passed and people no longer saw any direct examples of Gods anger, doubts began to form (as doubts often do when people aren't faced with any evidence). Worshipers felt that "Look, God no longer seems to care. When's the last time you saw him rain down Fire and Brimstone, eh?" and began to break away from the religions of the day. The religions, who can't very well call up God and say "Uh, God, we're getting a few doubters down here. How 'bout you stop by after dinner and turn them all into pillars of salt?", had to find some way of enacting Gods will without relying on God Him/Her/Itself to lend weight to the teachings. So, the religions themselves began to play God. They began to burn the heretics, they began to sack the sin filled cities, they began to lay waste to the armies of the heathens, all in Gods name because they feel that they are taking over where God left off.

Like I said at the beginning of the this post, I haven't done any research on this (For all I know there could be hundreds of miracles performed after the writing of the New Testament that are simply in obscure passages of the Holy Books) and I might be wrong, but to me this does give a small explanation as to why so many religions founded on peace have deviated from their paths and found war.

Thoughts?

Strangely, my reply comes from Futurama. When Bender meets God/Voyager, God explains why He seems so inactive in our lives.
If He does too much, we become dependent on Him and don't learn for ourselves. If He does too little, people lose faith and begin to doubt. When He does His best, people won't be able to realize He's done anything at all.
Also, the congregation of saints should be enough to satisfy the 'miracle' question.

Maybe god started life on other planets as well as ours. And he has been checking on them for the last 2000 years. :p

I think that we have grace now....in the Old testament, there was no grace for others than God's Chosen people....then god got lenient on people since it was easier to come through him...the jews were not the only people now that could come to heavan...at least that is how I see it....

science.

Help control the Human Population, Have your heathen subjects Spayed or Neutered. :D

*NOTE* This post is pure opinion and thought on my part, I have done no research and have no evidence to support my statements. These are merely a few ideas that have been kicking around inside my skull for a while. Cheese is good. Have a nice day.

In the Old Testmanet, when Judaism was one of the only existing monotheistic religions, God liked to get His/Her/Its hands dirty. He/She/It would often speak to humans when He/She/It had a message that He/She/It'd like delivered in His/Her/Its name, but whenever action was require there were times when He/She/It'd do the deeds personally. The Ten Plagues of Egypt, the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, these are examples of when God needed something done and did it Him/Her/Itself. But what happens when God takes a vacation?

Now, I'm not positive, but I'm pretty sure that since the writing of the New Testament, essentially since Christianity came into play, God has been taking more of a back seat role. He/She/It still speaks to people and guides humanity, but He/She/It's is no longer jumping into the road and directing traffic personally. What I mean is that God no longer takes direct action, there's no more Divine Wrath burning down from the Heavens and smiting the sinners where they stand. A least, it's not as obvious (When God blacked out the Sun over Egypt it was really hard to miss, giving an STD to somebody who has had an affair is easy to pass off as simple bad luck). Naturally, when God is no longer smiting the evil ones and purging sin, something needs to fill the void. I think this is where we find the key to the bloody history found in most existing Western religions.

I think that, as the time passed and people no longer saw any direct examples of Gods anger, doubts began to form (as doubts often do when people aren't faced with any evidence). Worshipers felt that "Look, God no longer seems to care. When's the last time you saw him rain down Fire and Brimstone, eh?" and began to break away from the religions of the day. The religions, who can't very well call up God and say "Uh, God, we're getting a few doubters down here. How 'bout you stop by after dinner and turn them all into pillars of salt?", had to find some way of enacting Gods will without relying on God Him/Her/Itself to lend weight to the teachings. So, the religions themselves began to play God. They began to burn the heretics, they began to sack the sin filled cities, they began to lay waste to the armies of the heathens, all in Gods name because they feel that they are taking over where God left off.

Like I said at the beginning of the this post, I haven't done any research on this (For all I know there could be hundreds of miracles performed after the writing of the New Testament that are simply in obscure passages of the Holy Books) and I might be wrong, but to me this does give a small explanation as to why so many religions founded on peace have deviated from their paths and found war.

Thoughts?

I vaguely remember from my christian ubringing something about how after the resurrection, there was no more need for miracles because everyone can go to heaven now.

I though this odd - being Catholic - because to become a Saint, you have to have performed* three miracles.

I've probably confused this a bit, but I can't be arsed to look it up. (Oh yeah, something about Daniel too. )

*Well, techinically God does the miracles or something.

*Well, techinically God does the miracles or something.

LOL i'm quoting this. :D

Guys, this thread really isn't wondering why God stopped performing the miracles, rather if it was that his lack of miracles is what caused the Crusades and other such violent religious actions.

First of all, let me give you a tip. Unless you're looking for a comitic addition, He/She/It should not be used like that. There are three ways to fix this;

1. Say it once, then in parenthasis write (Hereinafter: 'X') where 'X' indicates the title which you will give the diety.

2. Simply use the more proper term of 'God' rather than a word to take the place of his name. It's only three letters, and easier to read and write.

3. Or, you can simply use the masculine 'He' since it refers to all possible replacements for the word. If in doubt, use the masculine form while using the English Language.

Anyway, God still acts as he had, we just don't go running around claiming God did it anymore, because the media would call us loony.

Eh, I just like cramming the "He/She/It" thing down peoples throat cause I've seen like twenty threads on NS with people bitching about offending men, women, or both by using only one of the three.

Strangely, my reply comes from Futurama. When Bender meets God/Voyager, God explains why He seems so inactive in our lives.
If He does too much, we become dependent on Him and don't learn for ourselves. If He does too little, people lose faith and begin to doubt. When He does His best, people won't be able to realize He's done anything at all.
Also, the congregation of saints should be enough to satisfy the 'miracle' question.

that was a good episode. :D

It's simple really. There is no god. The bible is just a crock thought up by the rulers of the time to keep the peasents in line.


the mumbles

Okay, is anybody going to comment on the topic of this thread?

Guys, this thread really isn't wondering why God stopped performing the miracles, rather if it was that his lack of miracles is what caused the Crusades and other such violent religious actions.

No dude, the Crusades were all politics.

(unless you are Ward Churchill, then you would probably blame the muslims).

Okay, is anybody going to comment on the topic of this thread?
Oh you rude boy. Go and wash your N out with pope!

aish tamid eternally
fire burns continuously

You're king. You've just parceled out all your land to your best mates. Then you realise that if they got together, they'd beat you up. So you go have a chat with the Pope. After a while, you come to an agreement- the Pope declares a holy war, all your freinds go beat up Muslims, and you get to stay King. The Pope gets a load of power as well, as religion becomes even more interetwined with politics.

Well, that's the gist of it. ;)

Oh you rude boy. Go and wash your N out with pope!

Hey, I'll be as rude as I want!

Look, people, forget the Crusades. That's just one example of religious violence. I'm trying to talk about the general progression from "God takes revenge" to "We take revenge in Gods name" througout the entire Western religious history.

Hey, I'll be as rude as I want!
Or will you...

Look, people, forget the Crusades. That's just one example of religious violence. I'm trying to talk about the general progression from "God takes revenge" to "We take revenge in Gods name" througout the entire Western religious history.

Um...look at religious extremists today. They blow people up, they shoot people up. I mean, extremsist go with Christians, Muslims, Jews, all therein. Its everywhere that people want to take revenge in Gods Name.

But, to look at it in a better way, God just wants us to have PEACE with our fellow man, not declare war on our kind just because of our beliefs.

We have free-will, and if God allows us to use our Free-will any way we want, then perhaps that should give us something to think about. Sure, we can talk about our beliefs, perhaps even convert people to our beliefs. However, it is IMPORTANT never tyo resort to violence in these areas, else we shame that which we hold Dear, our Faith.

Look, people, forget the Crusades. That's just one example of religious violence. I'm trying to talk about the general progression from "God takes revenge" to "We take revenge in Gods name" througout the entire Western religious history.

That's hardly a "Western" idea. And if anything it came from the middle east in the first place.

Plus, I don't think the west is any more or less violent than anywhere else per se.