NationStates Jolt Archive

In another thread, I've recently "shown tha luv" for a few peeps here.

I've had an amazing week. All because of Capitalism.

You know who you guys are; but I love my commie/pinko friends here....
But Capitalism has let me sell half of my web design business at a price I still can't believe we closed on. Very cool, in that "I can now invest", way.

I really just jumped this evening from working class, to investing class (after the Escrow.com service released the funds). I've grown up as a pretty poor kid, as far as the kids go that I went to high school with.

Why is everyone so opposed to Capitalism? I went to an Art School, for Christ's sake.

For Commercial Arts.

If I can make a good living, anyone with a high enough IQ, or talent certainly can.

I must be drunk. I'm gonna tello you kids what I do, and pay attention if college is in your horizon:

Start learning how to buy, fix up, and resell internet/web site businesses.

It's so profitabgle, it's crazy.

Tell that to those hundreds web design companies which got bankcrupted some five years ago ;)

I must be drunk. I'm gonna tello you kids what I do, and pay attention if college is in your horizon:

Start learning how to buy, fix up, and resell internet/web site businesses.

It's so profitabgle, it's crazy.

Hmm... I don't think that's for me. If I did that for a living, I'd probably have to shoot myself. No offense.

Some things are more important to some people than how much money you have or how high of an economic class you are in. This is why some people oppose capitalism. If you cannot seethat, then you shouldn't even be asking the question.

*would like to see all those starving kids that live everywhere and all the poor working class buy websites, fix them up and sell them for insanely high prices*
Even if it worked for you, it wont mean it works for everyone else...

Because if everyone did that and similar things and got rich, there would be no lower classes, and capitalism would probably fall apart.

If I can make a good living, anyone with a high enough IQ, or talent certainly can.
tell that to my parents. they've been working stupidly hard all their lives for pretty much jack squat. they work 7 days a week, from 5am to about 8pm every day, they haven't had a holiday since about 1999 (except this trip to the Germany we got back from yesterday, but that was part business), and whenever they've made a small breakthrough in life there's always been somebody who takes it away from them. honest, hardworking people always get screwed over by the bastards who lie, cheat and sleaze their way to the top. that's my major gripe with capitalism - to get anywhere you need to be a even bigger bastard than the rest of em, or just lucky and let off the hook - like, seemingly, you Eichen. nice one on selling the company :)


edit: this is true for so many honest & hardworking people in this world too :(

tell that to my parents. they've been working stupidly hard all their lives for pretty much jack squat. they work 7 days a week, from 5am to about 8pm every day, they haven't had a holiday since about 1999 (except this trip to the Germany we got back from yesterday, but that was part business), and whenever they've made a small breakthrough in life there's always been somebody who takes it away from them. honest, hardworking people always get screwed over by the bastards who lie, cheat and sleaze their way to the top. that's my major gripe with capitalism - to get anywhere you need to be a even bigger bastard than the rest of em, or just lucky and let off the hook - like, seemingly, you Eichen. nice one on selling the company :)

Weren't you supposed to be gone for 2 weeks? :confused:

Weren't you supposed to be gone for 2 weeks? :confused:
if i said two weeks its cos i was confused :D
i thought it was 2 weeks... it was in fact 5 days :fluffle:

hello all :)

The thing about capatalism, is by one person winning another looses, its the know on effect of the basis economic problem (not enough resorces to go round), and capatlisim works by allocating it to people with the most money. So you may have one but a lot of people get screwed over by it, namley the poor.

Im happy to hear youve sold the company, and im not trying to make you feel guilty, but just becuase you won dosent mean eveyone dose.

Hmm... I don't think that's for me. If I did that for a living, I'd probably have to shoot myself. No offense.
Okay, I'll admit: You had better be a web designer in order to do the reccomended. Just like, when buying distressed real estate; you'd better be a handyman.

I'm not selling a course, I'm just making a lot of money off of this. And shared a small field with everyone else here.

That's not me being a dick.

I've owned my web design company for five years, so it's not an overnight, cheesy suggestion. But kids that are good at this shit--- If you have the talent, get ready for a lot of easy money.

From your bedroom, no kidding. That's my life. :)

Some things are more important to some people than how much money you have or how high of an economic class you are in. This is why some people oppose capitalism. If you cannot seethat, then you shouldn't even be asking the question.
I'm an American=That's Saccharine bullshit. :p

Okay, I'll admit: You had better be a web designer in order to do the reccomended. Just like, when buying distressed real estate; you'd better be a handyman.

I'm not selling a course, I'm just making a lot of money off of this. And shared a small field with everyone else here.

That's not me being a dick.

I've owned my web design company for five years, so it's not an overnight, cheesy suggestion. But kids that are good at this shit--- If you have the talent, get ready for a lot of easy money.

From your bedroom, no kidding. That's my life. :)
No I don't think that it makes you a dick. That's not what I meant. I have an adversity towards computers of any kind. The only reason I use mine is because my brother is a netwroking major. He does the work for me.

tell that to my parents. they've been working stupidly hard all their lives for pretty much jack squat. they work 7 days a week, from 5am to about 8pm every day, they haven't had a holiday since about 1999 (except this trip to the Germany we got back from yesterday, but that was part business), and whenever they've made a small breakthrough in life there's always been somebody who takes it away from them. honest, hardworking people always get screwed over by the bastards who lie, cheat and sleaze their way to the top. that's my major gripe with capitalism - to get anywhere you need to be a even bigger bastard than the rest of em, or just lucky and let off the hook - like, seemingly, you Eichen. nice one on selling the company :)


edit: this is true for so many honest & hardworking people in this world too :(
Well, it's pretty obvious that they need some basic lessons in how to generate passive streams of income. :rolleyes:

Really, I love Capitalism 'cuz it's easy.

Good for you. THere are also a HUGE amount of people underneath you. That's another problem with capitalism, is that in order for one person to succeed between seven and ten people (sometimes higher) have to "fail". One thing you learn in the Army is that for every person fighting on the front lines, there are at least five people putting him there.

Not everyone can be a millionare web designer. If there were no proletariate, then there would be no infrastructure. Then again, if everyone were at least a millionare, then they would be poor and the UberBillionares would be rich.

It also puts a monetary value on peoples' lives. And it is also very trivial. WHy would someone want a billion dollars when it will just go to someone else or the State or whatever after they are dead and gone? As Lenin would say, enjoy what you have instead of trifling over what you haven't.

I've owned my web design company for five years, so it's not an overnight, cheesy suggestion. But kids that are good at this shit--- If you have the talent, get ready for a lot of easy money.


:) Good for you.
I'm jealous to all who work in IT industry. Their wages are very high compared to any other industry (and education level etc). I made a wrong choice. (not really, it's not for me.)

Good for you. THere are also a HUGE amount of people underneath you. That's another problem with capitalism, is that in order for one person to succeed between seven and ten people (sometimes higher) have to "fail". One thing you learn in the Army is that for every person fighting on the front lines, there are at least five people putting him there.

Not everyone can be a millionare web designer. If there were no proletariate, then there would be no infrastructure. Then again, if everyone were at least a millionare, then they would be poor and the UberBillionares would be rich.

It also puts a monetary value on peoples' lives. And it is also very trivial. WHy would someone want a billion dollars when it will just go to someone else or the State or whatever after they are dead and gone? As Lenin would say, enjoy what you have instead of trifling over what you haven't.

First off: A MILLION dollars is so far from my net. I never, ever insinuated that I was "rich".

And I was raised by my Grandmother. She was a few decades beyond "Senior". Very fixed budget. I had no advantage, and am so glad that I didn't have everything.

Compared to my cousin, I had to figure it all out. And it's very exciting, personally.

I'm going to tell you a story. It might run a little long, so bear with me.

There was once a man that lived in a little Mexican village on the shore of a lake. He made his living by fishing for long hours and subsisting off of the meat of the fish, both as sustenance and a slight wage. He fished ever single day, not because he really had a desire to make a lot of money or get a lot of food, but because he enjoyed it. He had his ciesta right there in his fishing boat, and every afternoon or evening he would come home to his wife and children with the fish he had caught.

One day, an American businessman happened upon him. The businessman convinced him to take him fishing.While they were out on the lake, the businessman observed the Mexican fisherman and remarked that he was quite good. Being a capitalist, the businessman tried to convince the fisherman to let him invest into a new fishing company that the fisherman would head up.

"Let me help you buy a fleet of boats to fish the Pacific and Atlantic! We could both make a bundle!" The businessman said to his comrade.

"Why would I wish to do that?" The fisherman replied, checking his line.

"Because, we'll get very rich off of the venture." The businessman retorted, matter-of-factly.

"What would I do with all of those riches?" The fisherman said, bringing in a catfish.

"Oh, well, I suppose you'll be able to retire to a nice little town, never work again...maybe even fish with all of your spare time..."

THE END.

Moral?

First off: A MILLION dollars is so far from my net. I never, ever insinuated that I was "rich".

And I was raised by my Grandmother. She was a few decades beyond "Senior". Very fixed budget. I had no advantage, and am so glad that I didn't have everything.

Compared to my cousin, I had to figure it all out. And it's very exciting, personally.

The aim of capitalism is to get the highest amount of productiity and the largest sum of money. I never insinuated you had a million dollars. But by inferring that I did, you missed the entire point of my statement. If you are going to ignore what I say I won't even bother trying to enlighten you on why some people don't like capitalism, which you originally asked. Oh yeah, you already rejected the reasoning I gave of why some people don't like it.

I guess I can be on my merry way...

I am not some much opposed to capitalism, as what it brings out in people.

Im sure all those exeutives and CEO's being sent to prison for all kinds of business crimes where once idealistic and maybe started of as doing alot of the things they did to help people. But the more money they made the greedier they became and the money they wanted.

Capitalism would be good if people werent so naturally greedy just like communism would work if people werent so easily corrupted.

Another interesting thing someone pointed out to me, is that capitalism promotes competition, and competition is someone winning, be it a race or dominence of a market. But when a company wins the "competition" the governments step in and tell it to stop. eg microsoft.

but then again, its worked so far right? :p

;) I'm going to tell you a story. It might run a little long, so bear with me.

There was once a man that lived in a little Mexican village on the shore of a lake. He made his living by fishing for long hours and subsisting off of the meat of the fish, both as sustenance and a slight wage. He fished ever single day, not because he really had a desire to make a lot of money or get a lot of food, but because he enjoyed it. He had his ciesta right there in his fishing boat, and every afternoon or evening he would come home to his wife and children with the fish he had caught.

One day, an American businessman happened upon him. The businessman convinced him to take him fishing.While they were out on the lake, the businessman observed the Mexican fisherman and remarked that he was quite good. Being a capitalist, the businessman tried to convince the fisherman to let him invest into a new fishing company that the fisherman would head up.

"Let me help you buy a fleet of boats to fish the Pacific and Atlantic! We could both make a bundle!" The businessman said to his comrade.

"Why would I wish to do that?" The fisherman replied, checking his line.

"Because, we'll get very rich off of the venture." The businessman retorted, matter-of-factly.

"What would I do with all of those riches?" The fisherman said, bringing in a catfish.

"Oh, well, I suppose you'll be able to retire to a nice little town, never work again...maybe even fish with all of your spare time..."

THE END.

Moral?
There is no morality, fruitcake!

http://home.adelphia.net/~thensley/images/demseal.jpg

(Admittedly, that was just plain mean ;) )

I am neither part of the United States nor the Democratic Party. I agree that they are a bunch of whiny bitches on corporate welfare. As are the Republicans to a large degree.

If you are going to take whatever I say and ignore it, then please sign off of your computer and go play with you daddy's gun or something. Fuck off.

I'm going to tell you a story. It might run a little long, so bear with me.

There was once a man that lived in a little Mexican village on the shore of a lake. He made his living by fishing for long hours and subsisting off of the meat of the fish, both as sustenance and a slight wage. He fished ever single day, not because he really had a desire to make a lot of money or get a lot of food, but because he enjoyed it. He had his ciesta right there in his fishing boat, and every afternoon or evening he would come home to his wife and children with the fish he had caught.

One day, an American businessman happened upon him. The businessman convinced him to take him fishing.While they were out on the lake, the businessman observed the Mexican fisherman and remarked that he was quite good. Being a capitalist, the businessman tried to convince the fisherman to let him invest into a new fishing company that the fisherman would head up.

"Let me help you buy a fleet of boats to fish the Pacific and Atlantic! We could both make a bundle!" The businessman said to his comrade.

"Why would I wish to do that?" The fisherman replied, checking his line.

"Because, we'll get very rich off of the venture." The businessman retorted, matter-of-factly.

"What would I do with all of those riches?" The fisherman said, bringing in a catfish.

"Oh, well, I suppose you'll be able to retire to a nice little town, never work again...maybe even fish with all of your spare time..."

THE END.

Moral?

Thats a great story IMO.

Whats better than creating yourself a business with a fleet of boats. Giving jobs to other people who need jobs. Increasing productivity of the country and at the same time, get rewarded for smart ideas (or) being at the right place at the right time. :) Capitalism rocks.

I am neither part of the United States nor the Democratic Party. I agree that they are a bunch of whiny bitches on corporate welfare. As are the Republicans to a large degree.

If you are going to take whatever I say and ignore it, then please sign off of your computer and go play with you daddy's gun or something. Fuck off.
Cool. We'll get along just fine.

Excellent.

I am not some much opposed to capitalism, as what it brings out in people.

Im sure all those exeutives and CEO's being sent to prison for all kinds of business crimes where once idealistic and maybe started of as doing alot of the things they did to help people. But the more money they made the greedier they became and the money they wanted.

Capitalism would be good if people werent so naturally greedy just like communism would work if people werent so easily corrupted.

Another interesting thing someone pointed out to me, is that capitalism promotes competition, and competition is someone winning, be it a race or dominence of a market. But when a company wins the "competition" the governments step in and tell it to stop. eg microsoft.

but then again, its worked so far right? :p
Blah, blah, blah.

That's the problem. The flame and fury lies elsewhere.'
It doesn't apply to people like me.

EDIT: I'm ripped, and up pretty late. This was aimed at the other weirdo...
Starts with an R or whatever.

Well, it's pretty obvious that they need some basic lessons in how to generate passive streams of income. :rolleyes:

Really, I love Capitalism 'cuz it's easy.
'passive streams of income' my ass. other people have fucked them over at numerous points in their lives because they do what's 'right' while the others lie, cheat, embezzle and steal to get ahead. where's the justice in that?

i suppose capitalism is not a just system, which is why it stinks imho. then again, justice is such a subjective word.

'passive streams of income' my ass. other people have fucked them over at numerous points in their lives because they do what's 'right' while the others lie, cheat, embezzle and steal to get ahead. where's the justice in that?

i suppose capitalism is not a just system, which is why it stinks imho. then again, justice is such a subjective word.

Actually the fault lies in Humanity.(well, I believe mens hearts are deceitfully evil, and greedy to the core). Not Capitalism. But capitalism leaves more room for corruption or greed. But it happeneds everywhere.

Nevertheless, it improves our system of justice, and it teaches us to be wiser with our resources.

'passive streams of income' my ass. other people have fucked them over at numerous points in their lives because they do what's 'right' while the others lie, cheat, embezzle and steal to get ahead. where's the justice in that?

i suppose capitalism is not a just system, which is why it stinks imho. then again, justice is such a subjective word.
I do not lie or cheat to get my pay. Is that what you're insinuating?

Perhaps these people lack the education to provide society with something valid enough to warrant the paycheck.

Aren't you a socialist? Then you know exactly what I'm taling about.

Only, bring sweet statism into the pic. :p

Hey, love your posts, but don't know you. Is this really the way your logic follows?

In another thread, I've recently "shown tha luv" for a few peeps here.

I've had an amazing week. All because of Capitalism.

You know who you guys are; but I love my commie/pinko friends here....
But Capitalism has let me sell half of my web design business at a price I still can't believe we closed on. Very cool, in that "I can now invest", way.

I really just jumped this evening from working class, to investing class (after the Escrow.com service released the funds). I've grown up as a pretty poor kid, as far as the kids go that I went to high school with.

Why is everyone so opposed to Capitalism? I went to an Art School, for Christ's sake.

For Commercial Arts.

If I can make a good living, anyone with a high enough IQ, or talent certainly can.

i know how you feel. my family was pretty poor when i was growing up, but i've managed to land myself a great job (getting paid to go to school!) and i actually have a savings account already. hard work has paid off, and it feels so good knowing that i earned what i have.

plus, my mom just became a 6-figure-salary woman! she started her own practice about 15 years ago, and her reputation for excellent work has grown with every passing year. now, despite dedicating over half her time to taking "charity" cases, she calculated that she brought in over 100K last fiscal year (before taxes, of course). of course, she's pretty socialist in her beliefs, so she donates a big chuck of that to charities, but my family still is able to build up a decent savings account so that my folks may be able to retire before they die :P.

I do not lie or cheat to get my pay. Is that what you're insinuating?

Perhaps these people lack the education to provide society with something valid enough to warrant the paycheck.

Aren't you a socialist? Then you know exactly what I'm taling about.

Only, bring sweet statism into the pic. :p

Hey, love your posts, but don't know you. Is this really the way your logic follows?
not at all. all i'm saying is that under capitalism people are allowed to rise and fall according to their merits. unfortunatley one of those merits is the ability to get ahead no-matter what, to do whatever it takes, even if it involves bending the rules a little. people who do that can get very far, very fast in capitalism (or they can get caught out, but its a risk they take). the most extreme ways of bending the rules like this are lying, cheating, embezzling, and generally employing underhand tactics which invariably involve stepping on someone else to get ahead. my parents fell victim to a number of such people - perhaps its just bad luck to have unwittingly associated with such scum, but either way its, to me, a flaw in the system. it takes longer to get to the top if you are honest and keep your nose clean than it does if you lie, cheat and scam your way up there. some people, with no morals, take advantage of this and in doing so screw other people over. thats all. i'm not insinuating that you are one of the 'bad' people at all - you seem to be one of the honest lot and have luckily managed to be bypassed by the bastards.

yes i am socialist, and my logic is my unique own blend of randomness and second-hand bitter experience :)


Actually the fault lies in Humanity.(well, I believe mens hearts are deceitfully evil, and greedy to the core). Not Capitalism. But capitalism leaves more room for corruption or greed. But it happeneds everywhere.

Nevertheless, it improves our system of justice, and it teaches us to be wiser with our resources.
yes the fault lies in humanity, but the system of capitalism can be exploited by some to bring quick riches to them, and... problems for others. there are winners and loosers, but some don't play by the rules to win and cause even greater problems for the loosers.

humans are "deceitfully evil, and greedy to the core" but i don't believe this is how we have to be, or the way we always were - or will be. this is how our current society has made us - we are shaped by our environment and upbringing and thus this 'evil' human nature can be changed for the better, somehow, in the future. in a way it's self-perpetuating; capitalism brings us up to be (in a word) 'evil', and then capitalism is the system that best suits this nature.
i'm vastly overgeneralising here, but you get the picture :)

I like to let history decide this issue:

Even the poorest in America still eat. And nobody "disappears" if they dissent.

In almost all nations (I think it's all, but I'm leaving room in case I'm proved wrong) where communism has been instituted, there was starvation, widespread poverty, and in the case of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and other places, brutal totalitarian dictatorships.

I rest my case.

humans are "deceitfully evil, and greedy to the core" but i don't believe this is how we have to be, or the way we always were - or will be. this is how our current society has made us - we are shaped by our environment and upbringing and thus this 'evil' human nature can be changed for the better, somehow, in the future. in a way it's self-perpetuating; capitalism brings us up to be (in a word) 'evil', and then capitalism is the system that best suits this nature.
i'm vastly overgeneralising here, but you get the picture :)

Yup, I get your picture.
Well. I still disagree with you though. :p I agree Capitalism leaves more room for corruption.

But I doubt socialism/communism or a controlled market of any form (or even anarchism), can cause a person to be better. Communism is idealistic, but I don't think we're ants.

I believe man isn't born equal by any means. And man would not want to stay equal even in a communistic society. The very ambitious would still cheat and steal to rise to the top stepping on others. And 'why must I toil in the farms, when I can work in the office, and still receive a same pay'. Unless people are enslaved from changing jobs.

Or the laziness factor. 'Being hardworking pays off for the future, being lazy pays off NOW' :D

I like to let history decide this issue:

Even the poorest in America still eat. And nobody "disappears" if they dissent.

In almost all nations (I think it's all, but I'm leaving room in case I'm proved wrong) where communism has been instituted, there was starvation, widespread poverty, and in the case of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and other places, brutal totalitarian dictatorships.

I rest my case.

Cuba.. Then again, Cuba is self perpetuating not because their economy is able to support itself but black market. (isn't it?)

Then again, lots of Communist symphatizers would say that they were poorly run, and by todays standards it would have been different.... Though I still disagree. Unless you feed the people propoganda to work harder. :D

not at all. all i'm saying is that under capitalism people are allowed to rise and fall according to their merits. unfortunatley one of those merits is the ability to get ahead no-matter what, to do whatever it takes, even if it involves bending the rules a little. people who do that can get very far, very fast in capitalism (or they can get caught out, but its a risk they take). the most extreme ways of bending the rules like this are lying, cheating, embezzling, and generally employing underhand tactics which invariably involve stepping on someone else to get ahead. my parents fell victim to a number of such people - perhaps its just bad luck to have unwittingly associated with such scum, but either way its, to me, a flaw in the system. it takes longer to get to the top if you are honest and keep your nose clean than it does if you lie, cheat and scam your way up there. some people, with no morals, take advantage of this and in doing so screw other people over. thats all. i'm not insinuating that you are one of the 'bad' people at all - you seem to be one of the honest lot and have luckily managed to be bypassed by the bastards.
Dude, you know that you have a serious probelm with money. Psychologically.
Are you serious? Is this the way you feel businessmen think?
If so, it don't take Tony Robbins to tell you why you aren't where you want to be... financially.
If you have at least 5k to invest, write me and I''ll show you (comission-free)
how to live without working. It's so easy.
I don't know why I became the bad guy bringing this up around all of these "smart people".

Yup, I get your picture.
Well. I still disagree with you though. :p I agree Capitalism leaves more room for corruption.

But I doubt socialism/communism or a controlled market of any form (or even anarchism), can cause a person to be better. Communism is idealistic, but I don't think we're ants.

I believe man isn't born equal by any means. And man would not want to stay equal even in a communistic society. The very ambitious would still cheat and steal to rise to the top stepping on others. And 'why must I toil in the farms, when I can work in the office, and still receive a same pay'. Unless people are enslaved from changing jobs.

Or the laziness factor. 'Being hardworking pays off for the future, being lazy pays off NOW' :D
yup, communism won't work and i'm not communist... i'm something else. i'm not sure what though ;)

then again, you do leave out the altruistic factor, one that is essential behind communism. in theory, people wouldn't say "i don't want to work in this field cos i could work in a nice cozy office", they would say "it beneifts society for me to work in this field, so i will do just that, and some other lucky bastard gets to work in a nice warm office". its not perfect, but that's the mentality behind it, FYI :)

I don't know why I became the bad guy bringing this up around all of these "smart people".

Nobody likes a brag about how much they made. :D

Anyway.. I think your ok. Just that I believe they wanted a more serious Capitalism vs Communism kinda discussion. Not you telling them that their managing their money badly. :p

But Imo.. If your willing to tell your secret. I'm all ears. I could use the extra bucks.. But I am very inept at making websites to be honest. So I don't think I will have very much luck in that area.

Dude, you know that you have a serious probelm with money. Psychologically.
yep i probably do :p

Are you serious? Is this the way you feel businessmen think?

some businessmen, yes. some do think this way - i have seen it. the world of business is not a friendly or pretty place. it can be ok, just watch out for the backstabbers and the sort.

If so, it don't take Tony Robbins to tell you why you aren't where you want to be... financially.
If you have at least 5k to invest, write me and I''ll show you (comission-free)
how to live without working. It's so easy.
I don't know why I became the bad guy bringing this up around all of these "smart people".
:confused: i don't not want to work (i'm sorry if that came accross), i'm just saying capitalism can bring out the worst in people. then again, other economic systems may not be any better. who knows?

yup, communism won't work and i'm not communist... i'm something else. i'm not sure what though ;)

then again, you do leave out the altruistic factor, one that is essential behind communism. in theory, people wouldn't say "i don't want to work in this field cos i could work in a nice cozy office", they would say "it beneifts society for me to work in this field, so i will do just that, and some other lucky bastard gets to work in a nice warm office". its not perfect, but that's the mentality behind it, FYI :)

True. But not everybodies altruistic. And seeing how Chinese people and Russians got out of communism, they don't seem like a very altruistic bunch either. Especially the Chinese. :p I know them too much.

Human's are strange IMO. So many different type of people. I guess Capitalism is better that it accomodates both. Whereas Communism asks of all to be the same.

Nobody likes a brag about how much they made. :D

Anyway.. I think your ok. Just that I believe they wanted a more serious Capitalism vs Communism kinda discussion. Not you telling them that their managing their money badly. :p

But Imo.. If your willing to tell your secret. I'm all ears. I could use the extra bucks.. But I am very inept at making websites to be honest. So I don't think I will have very much luck in that area.
You're right. When I do smoke/beer, I can be flakey.
I'm not bragging. I'm trying to show the kidz that the system isn't fixed, or hopeless.

I can't imagine myself really giving up my talents to the state. :rolleyes:

I'm much more likely to tell the authority to fekk off.

True. But not everybodies altruistic. And seeing how Chinese people and Russians got out of communism, they don't seem like a very altruistic bunch either. Especially the Chinese. :p I know them too much.
ah but that's the thing. if the current 'evil' human nature - the one caused in part by capitalism itself - can be changed to an altruistic one, then anything in the realm of socialism is possible. this is why communism cannot work today, but perhaps in the future...


Human's are strange IMO. So many different type of people. I guess Capitalism is better that it accomodates both. Whereas Communism asks of all to be the same.
too true

yep i probably do :p


some businessmen, yes. some do think this way - i have seen it. the world of business is not a friendly or pretty place. it can be ok, just watch out for the backstabbers and the sort.


:confused: i don't not want to work (i'm sorry if that came accross), i'm just saying capitalism can bring out the worst in people. then again, other economic systems may not be any better. who knows?
OK. I don't know dude. I'm able to be human, as a Capitalist, BION.
This Sunday I'm picking up the new girl in our family.

It's a Rottweiler who has been abused, and I'm particular to the breed.
We're adopting Gretchin for her lifetime. (Her name is Sally. Yuck. If you know what you're doing, changing names is a snap. Of course, she'll go through "school (obedience training).
If you want a pup or older, you should do them the favor of letting them be a working dog.
Meaning, give them salck to impress you.

God, I can't wait!

(And I hijacked my own thread :p )

Capitalism is what has made this adoption possible. Without being washy, do you really feel that your philosophy will "help" more?

EDIT: I'm posting pics of our new girl, as soon as she gets home. (http://wecarerottweilerrescue.homestead.com/availablerotties.html)

(Sally's probably our adoption choice 8^)

OK. I don't know dude. I'm able to be human, as a Capitalist, BION.
This Sunday I'm picking up the new girl in our family.

It's a Rottweiler who has been abused, and I'm particular to the breed.
We're adopting Gretchin for her lifetime.

Capitalism is what has made this adoption possible. Without being washy, do you really feel that your philosophy will "help" more?

EDIT: I'm posting pics of our new girl, as soon as she gets home.
i'm not sure, it is impossible to know. plus, i'm not entirely sure what you're getting at :confused:

all i'm saying is that capitalism is a system whereby some people are able to exploit it by arguably immoral means, which leads to those who do not exploit the system in this way being screwed over. put simply, its not fair. but then agian, what is "fair"?

either way, congrads on selling your company :)

The thing about capatalism, is by one person winning another looses, its the know on effect of the basis economic problem (not enough resorces to go round), and capatlisim works by allocating it to people with the most money. So you may have one but a lot of people get screwed over by it, namley the poor.

Im happy to hear youve sold the company, and im not trying to make you feel guilty, but just becuase you won dosent mean eveyone dose.

This is the inherant, critical flaw in socialit and communist thinking. Just because one person benefits does not mean other people have been screwed over. See above. Who got screwed over? Nobody. Eichen performed a service which people wanted, and he got paid to do it. Other people were apparently happy to pay for it. Flaw = where?

Many congrats to Eichen, at any rate ^^

This is the inherant, critical flaw in socialit and communist thinking. Just because one person benefits does not mean other people have been screwed over. See above. Who got screwed over? Nobody. Eichen performed a service which people wanted, and he got paid to do it. Other people were apparently happy to pay for it. Flaw = where?

exactly. if i sell my skills or the products of my labor to a person who wants them, and if we agree on a price, who is losing? in my case, my university gets my skills and my efforts while i get a decent paycheck, and together we create a yet-more-valuable output in the form of specialized research. if my university does not feel my services are equal to my pay, it may fire me or reduce my pay; if i feel i am not being sufficiently compensated for my efforts, i may seek a raise or leave the university for better employment.

when you have something of value to exchange, you can strike a deal that makes all participants happy. the key is to find a way to make yourself, your skills, or your products valuable to other so they will choose to exchange with you for things that you want.

Well done Eichen.

Proof that capitalism can bring wealth to anyone with initiative, a hard-working attitude or even just something to sell.

The thing about capitalism, is by one person winning another looses, its the know on effect of the basis economic problem (not enough resources to go round), and capitalism works by allocating it to people with the most money. So you may have one but a lot of people get screwed over by it, namely the poor.

I’m happy to hear you’ve sold the company, and I'm not trying to make you feel guilty, but just because you won doesn’t mean everyone dose.

Well, this is probably the best thread to begin with, since it is one of the more civil of the posts by people who really know nothing of capitalism. The general premise is that for one person to win another must lose is about as wrong as it gets. Money is not a zero sum game. A new citizen could become a mussel shellfish harvester and sell mussels. Easily done without 'trodding on the little guy'. Mussels are an abundant commodity and easily available, why would anyone buy them?
There is one resource which is evenly divided equally among ALL people - and it happens to be the most valuable resource around. Time. Everyone has exactly 24 hours a day to produce, spend or invest how they see fit. Each new person in an economy brings the potential of their time.

Some create more, some less, but in a day the time is even. Each capitalist is working towards a personal goal that also brings up their community standards as it is achieved. As some become more successful they create even more potential for others. (Like earning enough to hire someone else to paint your house instead of doing it yourself) Some people choose to invest their time unwisely, either each day or over time. Some have other goals than income. Others take chances and lost. They all live with the consequences of their own actions and decisions.

So as you can see, limiting a person's potential is restricting the entire community’s potential.

So, how much is your spare time worth?

Check this out and see;
http://moneycentral.msn.com/investor/calcs/n_time/main.asp

I like to let history decide this issue:

Even the poorest in America still eat. And nobody "disappears" if they dissent.

In almost all nations (I think it's all, but I'm leaving room in case I'm proved wrong) where communism has been instituted, there was starvation, widespread poverty, and in the case of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and other places, brutal totalitarian dictatorships.

I rest my case.

40 million dead native americans amounts to a pretty brutal reigime, I think. Death, suffering, and industrialization go hand in hand; capitalist (Enclosures, Slavery, Genocide against Native Americans), communist (the cultural revolution, dekulakization) it doesn't matter.

I could make all kinds of arguments about other communist nations failing due to the fact that they were systematically denied access to global markets, about the funding of counterrevolutionary forces, etc etc...

Yeah, capitalism 'won' in the general sense, but not necessarily because it provided a superior product. It won the way all battles are won; by attacking the enemy systematically, brutally, and effectively. This doesn't make it good or bad, just strong. Now, having a strong force on your side is no doubt a boon, but sooner or later, someone's going to learn how to play the game better than you; someone like the Chinese or the Indians. When they do, the US might find out exactly how it feels to be beholden to the economic interests of someone else.

I like to let history decide this issue:

Even the poorest in America still eat. And nobody "disappears" if they dissent.

In almost all nations (I think it's all, but I'm leaving room in case I'm proved wrong) where communism has been instituted, there was starvation, widespread poverty, and in the case of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and other places, brutal totalitarian dictatorships.

I rest my case.

communism sprang up in the very poor countries where people didnt have enough to eat anyway. in russia, the revoultion began due to bread riots. if their is no food, it cant really be shared, can it? the poorest in america still eat, but thats only because the classs system has been transfered to a national level. china and africa are working class nations, whereas europe and america are middle/upper class nations, generally. and maybe people do dissappear. you dont know. oh right, the corporate media hasnt told you that the corporate friendly government has been removing people. oh, well that proves me wrong. not saying that happens, btw, just that it could be. doubtless people on one side of russia didnt know what was happening ot other people.

and i hate capitalism. grr and such.

sooner or later, someone's going to learn how to play the game better than you; someone like the Chinese or the Indians. When they do, the US might find out exactly how it feels to be beholden to the economic interests of someone else.

i can hardly wait... :D

Now, having a strong force on your side is no doubt a boon, but sooner or later, someone's going to learn how to play the game better than you; someone like the Chinese or the Indians. When they do, the US might find out exactly how it feels to be beholden to the economic interests of someone else.
the US is already beholden to the economic interests of other nations.