NationStates Jolt Archive

This is one of those topics, springing up, cuasing much debate, now granted, 99.9% wont give a damn about my opinion on the case, but still, its a worthy subject, now, I am prodominitly, Republican, and a Catholic one at that, however, I dont own any corsses, my family doesnt have a bible, we dont go to church except on like Easter maybe once or twice in 6 years. Just like everyone else however, I have intently watched the Schiavo case, as the husband asked for his wife to die, as the family fought to save her life, and watching evrything, fills everyone up with emotions, most of which are differant then others.

From a Moral View, I have no idea were I truly stand, I think I lean more toward the "let her live side" but im not about to stand outside a Hospital *or whatever the name of the kind of buildings she's in*, but on the other hand we have the claim that she never wanted to be kept alive by a feeding tube, and hr legal guardian is her husband who wants her dead, so its really split, I could say one thing such as I want her to live, but if the husband is telling the truth, I just disagreed with the laws of the US, but if I go with him and say she should die at her husbands will, and it turns out he is being a prick, I am no better then Satan.

From a Govermental View, you can call me heartless, but she needs to hurry up and die, this case has cuased so much political backlash, its not even funny. This is truly one of those cases were in my town, instead of seeing Liberals and Conservatives argueing, I have seen everyone bickering at eachother about it. But like I sid she needs to hurry up and die.

Why im flat out pissed, the goverment is just getting so hated for this, and depending on who you ask, republicans, and liberals, are all mad. The Federal goverment as many have said, had no right to pass them laws to overthrow the Florida court ruling, then, the goverment takes sides, proclaiming they want the women to live, however, Bovenor and Pres Bush do not want to overdo there power to do something. This leaves them in a spot that, no matter what they do, people will hate them. They could...

1.Find a loophole of some kind to save her life or cheat through legislation or the Congress to save her life, but this would invoke the wrath of "strict constitutionalist" becuase the officials went over there powers to saver her.

or

2.Do what there doing now and do nothing, this really pisses off a lot of people, but damnit, there going to be bitched at no matter what.

Its all mixed feelings for me, but for the final thing that pisses me off, hippocracy, this seems to be all over the debates, people speak what they feel on Shciavo, but then woudnt want that to happen to them.

I know this perticuler post kinda hgas no flow, but it really the bundle of crap I feel on this case.

And on a lighter note, nothing taste better then Fresh Baked Cookies.

If I'm gonna make a stance, it's going to be this. I don't think anyone should have to live with no real memories, no real way of communicating, and can only survive through a feeding tube. However I don't think she should die by starving to death. Maybe this is where euthanasia is needed. But imagine the stir that would cause. I guess I'm a bit of a fencesitter on this topic, so I'm not going to be too heavily involved in this forum.

Pull
The
Gawd
Damned
Plug
Aye'right!

Pull
The
Gawd
Damned
Plug
Aye'right!

hey who turned off my gamecube????

hey who turned off my gamecube????
Hee.

Well. I don't know them, and I'm not even in the same country - but this is precisely the type of case that I see as an argument for a national euthanasia programme. If you can convince me that it isn't cruel to keep someone alive in that situation, I'll reconsider my support for her husband.

My opinion is that euthanasia should not only be legal, but enforced in cases like this one. Keeping someone alive in a vegetative state is IMHO a pointless waste of resources. So: The quicker she dies the better.

Ah, that works well enough for us. We believe that she should die now. The problem usually comes when you run into sentimental and/or religious family members (enter M./Mme. Schindler). It may well be a waste of resources and a waste of dignity to keep an individual like Ms. Schiavo alive, but to mandate that she must die would go too far for the sensibilities of the American public. It was only within the past ten or twenty years that the courts set a definite precedent for these right-to-die cases, and even with this precedent there is a decent-sized burden of proof that must be met. We may think what we will, but others will as well, and they outnumber us considerably, eh?

*yawn*

yay for not caring!

Yay for... you guys suck.

Now... which smiley would be best for this situation?

Perhaps :confused: is best? Bah... I don't know. Maybe I'll throw in a little :fluffle: ... because I can!

Perhaps someone in favor of letting her die could answer a question for me?

If she is, like they say, unable to feel or anything else...

Why is it they are giving her Morphine for pain, if in fact she cannot feel pain?

Regards,
Gaar

You know what I think?

Keep her alive. Yeah. As long as the parents or whosoever wants to keep her alive. Just make sure the people who want to keep her alive pay the hospital bills to keep her alive. Ie: The parents and the people outside.

Don't touch the gov funds.

You know what I think?

Keep her alive. Yeah. As long as the parents or whosoever wants to keep her alive. Just make sure the people who want to keep her alive pay the hospital bills to keep her alive. Ie: The parents and the people outside.

Don't touch the gov funds.

That's another good option. That way, no one else loses because of it.

So either: Enforced euthanasia, or let the people wanting her alive pay for it themselves.

The Schiavo's case is reaching to near ridiculous levels. For whoevers sake..

If you want to keep her alive, why don't you support her and pay her bills. If she wakes up, Hurrah, Praise be Jesus etc.

If she doesn't... well, you keep on paying now, she's your responsiblity. Ta ta .. have a good day.

And on a lighter note, nothing taste better then Fresh Baked Cookies.
I wholeheartedly agree.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/kevorkian/law/

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/kevorkian/chronology.html

"April 13, 1999
Convicted of second-degree murder and delivery of a controlled substance in the death of Youk, a Michigan judge sentences Kevorkian to 10-25 years in prison. He would be eligible for parole in six years. Kevorkian plans to appeal."

Ok, so a man who merely gave people the tools they needed to end their own lives -- people who were of sound mind and could clearly state their wishes in the matter -- is in prison for up to 25 years, then where ought Terri Schiavo's doctors be after her death by starvation? After all, she is not able to state that she wishes to die.

Ok, so a man who merely gave people the tools they needed to end their own lives -- people who were of sound mind and could clearly state their wishes in the matter -- is in prison for up to 25 years, then where ought Terri Schiavo's doctors be after her death by starvation? After all, she is not able to state that she wishes to die.

The law has nothing to do with common sense.

And on a lighter note, nothing taste better then Fresh Baked Cookies.

Mmmm Cookies... MMMMMMM Subway cookies. Damn, why can't there's be a Subway close by.

I only hear parts, we don't get the all over coverage - probably a good thing, or else I may end up not caring. But death by starvation is bollocks. It's cruel, it's stupid.

I think its sad that the only 2 options are leaving the feeding tube in and leaving her vege state, or pulling it out so that she starves to death or dies of dehydration. I'd rather see her humanely euthinased.

I am wondering if this will be the new procedure when a convicted criminal is sentenced to the death penalty. Will they lock him in solitary confinement and allow him to starve to death?
Will they start removing the feeding tubes now of the thousands of geriatric patients and premature babies that are incapable of chewing/swallowing and let nature take its course?
Also-I know doctors have emphatically stated that they are quite certain Ms.Shiavo cannot feel the pain. I am wondering about the show I saw last week that detailed accounts of surgery patients that couldnt move or speak under anesthesia, but COULD FEEL the entire surgical procedure-some lasting several hours-pure, unmitigated torture of feeling instense, sustained pain and not being able to express themselves. And then, whne doubted, being able to recount and verify parts of the procedure and conversations that took place to prove the were conscious and aware. And experts stating that there is no real way to guarantee that the patient cannot feel.

Mmmm Cookies... MMMMMMM Subway cookies. Damn, why can't there's be a Subway close by.

I only hear parts, we don't get the all over coverage - probably a good thing, or else I may end up not caring. But death by starvation is bollocks. It's cruel, it's stupid.


This sums it all up-it is cruel and stupid. You can get 24 hour coverage of everything that is happening on half a dozen cable channels here-killing time while they wait for the pope to die. And click up a few channels and watch inner city people getting arrested and sentenced to two years in jail for not treating their pit-bull's mange on Animal Precint.

I am wondering if this will be the new procedure when a convicted criminal is sentenced to the death penalty. Will they lock him in solitary confinement and allow him to starve to death?
Will they start removing the feeding tubes now of the thousands of geriatric patients and premature babies that are incapable of chewing/swallowing and let nature take its course?
Also-I know doctors have emphatically stated that they are quite certain Ms.Shiavo cannot feel the pain. I am wondering about the show I saw last week that detailed accounts of surgery patients that couldnt move or speak under anesthesia, but COULD FEEL the entire surgical procedure-some lasting several hours-pure, unmitigated torture of feeling instense, sustained pain and not being able to express themselves. And then, whne doubted, being able to recount and verify parts of the procedure and conversations that took place to prove the were conscious and aware. And experts stating that there is no real way to guarantee that the patient cannot feel.

I agree, we should force her to remain alive in a sessile, withered body with no hope of ever regaining use of it, doomed to a few more decades of simply lying there, not being able to do anything. (assuming she still has a mind that is)
Hurrah for compassion!

I agree, we should force her to remain alive in a sessile, withered body with no hope of ever regaining use of it, doomed to a few more decades of simply lying there, not being able to do anything. (assuming she still has a mind that is)
Hurrah for compassion!


You missed my point. I think its a tragedy that heroic measures were used to ressucitate her, only to live the last decade or two in a near vegetable state. I dont think she should starve to death, though. We as a population are supposed to be against cruel and unusual punishment for criminals tried and convicted of heinous crimes against humanity-we still dont starve them to death.

You missed my point. I think its a tragedy that heroic measures were used to ressucitate her, only to live the last decade or two in a near vegetable state. I dont think she should starve to death, though. We as a population are supposed to be against cruel and unusual punishment for criminals tried and convicted of heinous crimes against humanity-we still dont starve them to death.

No problem, I more or less just quoted your post to make mine seem sensible. :P

And I agree that starving isn't the right way, an overdose of something would be better. But I believe that'd be active euthenesia, which is illegal in the US right?

No problem, I more or less just quoted your post to make mine seem sensible. :P

And I agree that starving isn't the right way, an overdose of something would be better. But I believe that'd be active euthenesia, which is illegal in the US right?


It is illegal. The whole thing sucks and I cant stand that it dominates every news channel all day. It did prompt my wife and I to square this away, so my kids wouldnt have to go through all the bs if it happened to us.

To be quite honest the fact whether I do or do not support euthanasia is not so much an issue.

Apperently US-law offers the possibility that this poor woman has the option to choose for euthanasia. And if she (or the person closest to her according to law) decides he wants to use this option, it is completely legal to do so.

Of course, it's a painful situation for the parents. And if they question his motives, they should ask the court to look into his motives - preferably backed by the medical staff of the place she is staying.



But what disgusted me most that people are willing to jump on the wagon to force their opinion upon society and the juridical system in particular. Fair enough if you don't agree to the law, but it's ridiculous to change the law simply because you don't like it.
Actually, it's dangerous and undermines the all legal and democratic principles of a country. Separation of state and church & separation of state and legal powers: these are treasures long fought for. And then this country is going to put democracy in the world. SHAME, BITTER SHAME.


And the discussion about God's law above the law of men. Well, to be quite honest. We are talking about the land of men and not the land of God. I therefore think we should let men's law prevail over God's.

If Congress had really wanted to "be involved" they would have passed legislation making it illegal to starve a patient to death.

It looks to me like a lot of useless grandstanding around a corpse.

Pinch her nose and mouth. It's more fun than letting her starve.