NationStates Jolt Archive

Ok so I've been in a few threads were people have been discussing there religious/spiritual beliefs and I was wondering two things.

1. How many other people here on NationStates are Wiccan/Pagan?

and

2. How did you come to be Wiccan/Pagan? Were you raised as such or did you actively leave a previous religion? If so why?

You can count me as Wiccan, and as I always say

"They tried to raise me Catholic, but it didn't take"

I'm not a wickan but try this site: www.witchcraft.com (http://).

"They tried to raise me Catholic, but it didn't take"

That's very interesting because I too was raised Catholic before becoming Wiccan. Geez, they even named me so that I would be closer to god (CHRISTal). If you don't mind me asking why did you choose to leave the Church?

I'm a Druid.
I worked it out by my self. I was raised to think.

I prefer the free thought in our very open grove to the more rigid belief systems of Wicca, northern tradition and strict druids. Whilst of course respecting their rights to believe blah blah blah....

I am agnostic, but I tend to lean towards paganism and nature reverence.

I dispise the Wiccan.

I dispise the Wiccan.

Would you care to elaborate on that?

Not Wiccan, but know that many Christian traditions are based off of both Druid and Roman paganism. So as an Irish Catholic...I guess I have a connection.

I dispise the Wiccan.

I think that may have been a mistake...

I dispise the Wiccan.
Then what were you doing reading the thread? :rolleyes:

While I'm an atheist and don't believe in the supernatural, the reverence that Wicca gives to the natural world has always struck a chord in me. While some of the beliefs actually seem a little silly to me, I think Wiccans are generally good folks. Please don't be offended if I think it's a little silly, it's not really meant as an insult. I think a lot of things are silly, but to me that's not the same thing as stupid. It just means I don't see the logic in it. Perhaps I'm not explaining the difference well, but at least know I mean no offense.

No problem, BK - I don't think that there is a faith out there that doesn't have something that will strike some one as silly, even more than a bit so.

I didn't chose to leave the RC - it just never was 'me', wasn't a part of me -my 'worship' was a proforma following of rites and rituals to keep my parents ( specifically my mother ) happy. Like a set of cothes that didn't fit, didn't suite me.

When I could stop with out it being rubbed in their faces I did so. It's something we don't discuss - I know it probably hurts them and I'd rather not cause them any more hurt than I have to - I don't hide my religion I just don't discuss it unless directly asked.

I call my self wiccan but there are as many types of wiccan as there are wiccans - and trying to get us to all go in one direction is like trying to herd cats...

My belief systems includes Shinto, much native american ( specifically Lakota ) and more...

You can count me as Wiccan, and as I always say

"They tried to raise me Catholic, but it didn't take"
*applauds*

I'm a wiccan

Anyone up for making a region called "The Coven of the Bible Burners"? XD

I was always curious as to what percentage of 'wiccans' are aged 14-20 and only do it to anger their traditionalist parents and be able to say to their friends 'Im a Wiccan!' or similar...

I dispise the Wiccan.
Please elaborate and give us a valid explanation if you do not wish to be prone to hate-mail. :D

I guess you can count me as Wiccan/Pagan. I was born/raised a Catholic, turned agnostic, then Wiccan. I was always fascinated with the supernatural even as a Catholic, but I turned agnostic after studying extensively the Catholic Bible in freshmen year of high school. (My connection with Catholicism was, though, long gone before that; I just needed a push. I was tired of the sexism and politics within the Church, and hearing it during mass all the time.) That (agnosticism) last about two years, and I was studying many other religions in the mean time (Wicca/paganism, Buddhism, Islam, etc., etc.) Unlike many/most humans who convert to Wicca, mine wasn't to cast Spells or anything of the sorts; for me, it was the whole Nature and freedom of it. Plus, it (the religion) explained a lot of things to me I knew were different of me, but I couldn't either place my finger on it; or there wasn't enough "information given" in the other religions studied. I was drawn to it for its' beauty, not for the power.

I admit, though, am not the best of them, but I do try, as anyone (hopefully) does.

I always found the Norse gods to be cool... although agnostic I definitely feel a nostalgia, or even attraction to the old pagan beliefs. Their mythology is so much richer and their gods are more exciting than today's.

I dispise the Wiccan.
Making blanket statements like that without any logical argument is generally bad. Some people (like Moderators, for example) might mistake you for a troll.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Game Moderator

...

The remainder of my post in unofficial. As it's 2 AM as I type this, my post is also liable to be incoherent.

I apologize for going off-topic a bit, as this is a topic about Wicca, and not about Catholicism. However, a few respondents so far have mentioned that they are former Catholics. These people (if I understand them) seem to have become... disappointed? disillusioned? ...with the Church.

The Gospel according to Mark (http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__PWE.HTM), verses 28 through 31

One of the scribes, when he came forward and heard them disputing and saw how well he had answered them, asked him, "Which is the first of all the commandments?" Jesus replied, "The first is this: 'Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God is Lord alone! You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.' The second is this: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these."
Love is not something that can be drilled into your head, and it is unfortunate that some still attempt to do this. For those of you who have turned from the path of Christ: I hope that you eventually return to it. Even if you don't, though, then I ask you to remember that love is the most important thing.

The thirteenth chapter of the first letter of Saint Paul to the Corinthians (http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__PZI.HTM)

If I speak in human and angelic tongues but do not have love, I am a resounding gong or a clashing cymbal. And if I have the gift of prophecy and comprehend all mysteries and all knowledge; if I have all faith so as to move mountains but do not have love, I am nothing. If I give away everything I own, and if I hand my body over so that I may boast but do not have love, I gain nothing.

Love is patient, love is kind. It is not jealous, (love) is not pompous, it is not inflated, it is not rude, it does not seek its own interests, it is not quick-tempered, it does not brood over injury, it does not rejoice over wrongdoing but rejoices with the truth. It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

<snip verses 8 through 12>

So faith, hope, love remain, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."

What ever path one follows to the Divine - love is the most important thing I completely agree with this.

I am not in my 20's - I'm 50 - this is not some rebellion against my parents...and since I generally speak of my faith only if asked it's definitely not something to 'say I'm cool or trendy'

I disagree with the love thing. I believe it is whatever path leads you happiness which you should focus on. It is my personal belief that love is a pivotal part of reaching this happiness, but it is still the happiness that should be your goal.

My ex-girlfriend is a Wiccan.

It's unfortunate that more Christians don't feel the same. I was told just yesterday on another thread that unless I repent my sin and turn to Christ I will go to hell. This was well meant advice not a flaming.

As I said, I'm a 43 year old Druid. I have not sinned by the standards I set my self and I really don't believe in Christ in the same way I don't believe in fairies or unicorns. Fortunately I don't believe in hell either so...whatever.

I have stood in a rainy wood a midnight and felt the world breath around me. I do realise I am totally insignificant in the grand scheme of things. I 'm sure that Mother Nature has no real interest in me and would snuff me out without (metaphoricly) blinking.
I'm also sure that we are squatters on this world and if we fuck it up no one will miss us when we've gone.

So

May you all feel Spring coursing through you.

Bright Blessings

Eternal Green Rain

I dispise the Wiccan.

Just the one?

I may have described myself as Wiccan a few years ago, now I identify more with specifically Indo-European mythologies (primarily Nordic, Baltic and Vedic) rather than the mishmash of influences from Celtic and "miscellanious others" from various unrelated cultures that seem to typify modern Wicca - no offense... So I prefer to refer to myself as a Heathen, or perhaps just "Indo-European neo-pagan". To me Wicca seems to be a noble ideal (a move away from the Kristjian influences in our culture) that has, unfortunately, become a mite confused as to what it's actually trying to do.

Total yawnification. As a Catholic, I've never really had a need to leave the Church. But at those confused times during one's teenage years I courted with some of the neo-pagan traditions that were making runs in Poland and Eastern Europe. It was interesting to see the beliefs that were being renewed from a sociological view point. Now that I look at it, the damage done to the old Slavic ways is probably going to be irreproable if the neo-pagan growth isn't checked and met with something a TEENSY bit more benign. From what I know of friends in the region, they say that some kids will find an archeaological site and dig it up themselves, rather than report it to a place of higher education. :( The loss of ancient information makes this historian sad! Besides, the white supremist beliefs popping up in some of the Nordic-Slavic pagan groups is rather alarming and disturbing. It is well-document (for the Ukrainians of the world) that Xerxes of Persia married many Scythian men to Persian and African women, before sending them back to their land of falling feathers.

As for Wicca. I personally don't follow it. I have no problem with the religion. I find a lot of the beliefs to be somewhat bizzare and egocentric and really, really different from the ancient rites of worship. I suppose no religion is truly intact in its modern incarnation...But that stands regardless. I find a lot of the "old Wiccans" from the 60s, 70s more than nice people. I often hang around with them. (despite being often more than a decade my senior). What I truly, and honestly dislike are the trollish and ogrish Wiccans and neo-pagan teenagers that mill around in the local book store's astrology section (oh so wisely placed across from the Christianity-Judaism-Islam-Zorastrian section) and make snide remarks (that are completely lacking in wit) about how the other person's religion is a lie, or something along those "blah, blah, blah, blah, blah" lines. Teenage angst is not wisely expressed as religious intolerance, to say the least ;) Of course, I've had to swat away many jerks on both sides of the argument out of that section whenever I read the Screwtape Letters or pick up the Necronomicon for a chuckle (or just stand around and look like I'm reading something while laughing at people who are talking about how they use the Necronomicon as serious spell craft...tee hee). Either way, when the two groups get too ornary I have to put down my book and I have to get up and either argue them until they leave (studying theology and religion in your spare time can really sharpen the tongue) or simply say "either you be quiet with your insults and blatent idiocy, or I'm going to talk to the employees". More often than once I've had people tossed out of that place. :headbang:

I was always curious as to what percentage of 'wiccans' are aged 14-20 and only do it to anger their traditionalist parents and be able to say to their friends 'Im a Wiccan!' or similar...

Although I do fall slightly into your category of 14-20 (I was 16 when I started to do research to find my faith, and I am now 22). I didn't do it to anger my parents, I looked at what I was being taught and I looked at the hypocrisy around me. Most importantly I didn't feel anything, no connection, no loving relationship with "God". Nothing. While I do understand were you are coming from, I have seen an increasing amount of teenagers that claim to be Wiccan/Neo-pagan. And honestly, they frighten me just as much as the teenage christians that walk around condemning people.

However, a few respondents so far have mentioned that they are former Catholics. These people (if I understand them) seem to have become... disappointed? disillusioned? ...with the Church.

For those of you who have turned from the path of Christ: I hope that you eventually return to it

If you look above you'll see that it wasn't just disappointment in the Church that sealed my decision to leave. As I've said I had no connection with "God". From my personally view, you can not claim to be a part of a religion/spirituality if you feel nothing. Again this is only my opinion.

Although I understand your love for Christ (I may not share it but if it's as strong as my love for the Goddess then I understand), I must respectfully say that sometimes statements like the second one anger me slightly. I understand that you don't really know me, so I can not be angry. The reason I do not like statements like that is because it usually leads to arguements and condemning statements from the Christian part of the arguement. I am in no way saying that all Christians condemn people outside their religion but most of the ones I have come across have. Instead of leaving the subject end at "Well I have a strong connection with the Goddess and you with Jesus, neither of us are going to change our opinions so lets just leave it at that." Far too many times I have heard simple heartfelt statements like the one above turn into "you're going to burn in hell" statements. Again I am not saying that you would do such a thing.
I must admit though I've turned that statement around a few times when being confronted by crazed Christians. It's rather funny to see their faces when you say: "I hope that you eventually return to the path of the Goddess". ;)

From what I know of friends in the region, they say that some kids will find an archeaological site and dig it up themselves, rather than report it to a place of higher education. The loss of ancient information makes this historian sad!

This also disturbs me. This is a very sad thing indeed. Treasures, like ancient archeaological sites, should be protected and cared for by the people of those countries regardless of what religion they are.

I suppose no religion is truly intact in its modern incarnation...But that stands regardless. I find a lot of the "old Wiccans" from the 60s, 70s more than nice people. I often hang around with them. (despite being often more than a decade my senior).

Although I'm young, I too have sought out older members of the craft. Luckily, I found out that one of my professors was an "old wiccan" and a "real feminist" for that matter. She has been a Wiccan since the late 60's and has taught me more than most of the books I've read on the subject.

What I truly, and honestly dislike are the trollish and ogrish Wiccans and neo-pagan teenagers that mill around in the local book store's astrology section (oh so wisely placed across from the Christianity-Judaism-Islam-Zorastrian section) and make snide remarks (that are completely lacking in wit) about how the other person's religion is a lie, or something along those "blah, blah, blah, blah, blah" lines.

To be completely honest I laughed when I read this. I too have been in the New Age section (although mine is next to the Eastern Religions section and across from the Gay/Lesbian Studies) and have come across those "ogrish" (lol) "Wiccan" teenagers. I always have a laugh when they begin talking amongst themselves of spells they are going to perform against so and so in their math class. I myself wear a triskelle and I have found it entertaining to see if they are wearing "Wiccan" jewerly and say: "I was just noticing your necklace and I really like it. What does it mean?" Many fumble the meanings and I end up pointing out a book that would help them become more knowledgable. But in all seriousness, those types of people annoy me till no end. They give Wicca/Neo-paganism a bad name, just as the fanatical Christians give Christianity a bad name.

Eclectic pagan here...while I respect wicca, it's a little too rigid for me in some ceremonial sense. I prefer being a solitary and communing with the world around me in my own way. And yes, yes I'm 18, so I fall within the age range you mentioned, but my parents don't know. They're Christian and I'd rather they didn't know at this point because they'd worry for me. I don't want to cause them unneeded fear on my behalf.

i am a wiccan. i was raised to be catholic but it just didn't have the same viuews on life as i did. i also believe in Karma but Karma is rather a belief than religion or society. Wicca just holds alot closer beliefs for me than the catholic religion or any religion i have discovered for that matter. Oh yeah, to the person who said: I dispise the wiccan, tell us why because if you don't even have a reason all you're doing is discriminating. :D i am open with both wicca and Karma to all sides of my family, though they hardly accept it. There are some of my relatives who stand up for me though.

I am nearly 32 and have been Pagan since I was 17... My parents were supportive so rebellion had nothing to do with it.I was raised within the baptist religon... Saw just how hypicritical that church was... researched other christian based faiths... nothing 'did' it for me til I started reading up on Paganism and earth religons... So I am a Believer in the Goddess and the God and the connection between everyone and everything, Plant, animal,mineral... it is what I feel is right

i think it's a great idea when people are questioning their religion in a big way to go exploring on the internet or do some research to find some other religions that hold close beliefs to what they feal is right and wrong.

-snip-
:eek: welcome back, you have been missed :p

*smiles* I still Bounce around here from time to time... can you believe I have been on NS more or less for 2 years? Yikes...

*smiles* I still Bounce around here from time to time... can you believe I have been on NS more or less for 2 years? Yikes...
I bet its nice to be remembered though, good to see some of the old crew back, first spaam now you
[/hijack]

Thank you! yeah we crop up from time to time like fungus..lol :D

Wicca's interesting and many of my ideas are similar to it, but I don't really believe in dieties from ancient religions and don't see their appeal, especially the one that is so fat that she appears spherical. Did they hire fat admirers to design their pantheon?

Wicca's interesting and many of my ideas are similar to it, but I don't really believe in dieties from ancient religions and don't see their appeal, especially the one that is so fat that she appears spherical. Did they hire fat admirers to design their pantheon?

It's fine that you don't believe in their dieties, but please by all means, don't make jokes about them. It does offend some people who directly worship them. Just a little heads up.

It's fine that you don't believe in their dieties, but please by all means, don't make jokes about them. It does offend some people who directly worship them. Just a little heads up.

Sorry.

Wicca's interesting and many of my ideas are similar to it, but I don't really believe in dieties from ancient religions and don't see their appeal, especially the one that is so fat that she appears spherical. Did they hire fat admirers to design their pantheon?
She isn't fat. Just heavy boned.

its ok, but i was just giving you a little heads up. so anyway, what do you believe in if you don't mind my asking?

In the aggregate, I have noticed wicca to exist mainly as a fad among young people.

Though it does have its handfull of believes who are mainly ranked among new agers &c.

I deposit wicca and its kin-faiths into the same bs pile of all the other religions, but closer towards the "silly" end, and further from the "potentially harmful" end.

I adhere to the religion where the worship the aliens and think some day they'll come down and "save" earth. (jk) :p

im not a wiccan because i can be, its because its holds closer beliefs to my own than my previous religion so im not wiccan because it's a fad. i dont think it is a "fad" either. something religious shouldn't be taken that way. to that guy who said it was leaning to the silly side, please don't offend other people's religions because we havn't offended yours. its ok to have your opinions, but please don't post it if it may make some people feal uncomfortable.

I've never met any of these white power type Wiccans, is that a European thing? The white power nuts in the US seem to all be Protestant.
The Wiccans I've met seem to tend towards liberal attitudes.

I've never met any of these white power type Wiccans, is that a European thing? The white power nuts in the US seem to all be Protestant.
The Wiccans I've met seem to tend towards liberal attitudes.
Eeh? Who said white power wiccans? Never heard of such a thing.

Wicca's interesting and many of my ideas are similar to it, but I don't really believe in dieties from ancient religions and don't see their appeal, especially the one that is so fat that she appears spherical. Did they hire fat admirers to design their pantheon?
You might enjoy a study of mythology, then.

I adhere to the religion where the worship the aliens and think some day they'll come down and "save" earth. (jk) :p
Scientology?

ya, i have never heard of a white power wiccan. there not only in europe either. i live in the U.S. and im wiccan

Eeh? Who said white power wiccans? Never heard of such a thing.

I'd never heard of them either, but Planet Care Bear posted Besides, the white supremist beliefs popping up in some of the Nordic-Slavic pagan groups is rather alarming and disturbing.

I'm a Wiccan because it was the religion that felt correct to me. I believe in many of its principles, and the ties to nature are what I love especially...

See, it's more than just a fad. People actually believe in Wicca because of their views on things and what they feel and know to be correct

See, it's more than just a fad. People actually believe in Wicca because of their views on things and what they feel and know to be correct

I find it very hard to call any sort of paganism a fad because it was the first and most common religion until Judaism, Christianity, and the Islam. I understand that it has changed over the years, I feel all religions do, but just because it's becoming more appealing to people again doesn't make it a fad.

My ex-girlfriend is a Wiccan.

Yeah mine too.

I am agnostic but I do tend to speak of and talk of paganism but in the classical sense, now this neo-fad paganism. And I'm not all that against human sacrifices either ;). I am writing an epic, which is largely and overwhelmingly pagan, after all, in it, their chief deity is the moon goddess.

I'd never heard of them either, but Planet Care Bear posted
Oh. But he didn't say anything about wiccans.

i thought planet care-bear was about...care bears? not wicca :confused:

I find it very hard to call any sort of paganism a fad because it was the first and most common religion until Judaism, Christianity, and the Islam. I understand that it has changed over the years, I feel all religions do, but just because it's becoming more appealing to people again doesn't make it a fad.
It wasn't the "first religion". "Pagan" is a Christian word that means things not-Christian, Muslim or Jewish. That includes a *lot* of religious beliefs.

Oh. But he didn't say anything about wiccans.

Oops!
I sorta lumped Wiccans in with pagans in general.
Sorry.

i thought planet care-bear was about...care bears? not wicca :confused:
But care bears are the devils minions.

PAGANS! HERE! FETCH THE FIREWOOD! lol

No in all seriousness, I generally can't understand most modern religious expression. I don't understand most modern things. I have come to accept that people do odd things and it is best to let them get on with it. If people didn't do odd things then they wouldn't be people. So I will condone you tree huggers etc etc for now but don't you hugging any of my trees or old Mr. Shotgun will get an airing!

off topic... everytime I see this thread title... I think of CHARMED.

back to topic.

But care bears are the devils minions.

again, lets try to refrain from posting things that could offend people. Wiccans aren't the devils minnions. in fact, there really is no devil in Wicca, just the way people do things.

again, lets try to refrain from posting things that could offend people. Wiccans aren't the devils minnions. in fact, there really is no devil in Wicca, just the way people do things.
Where did I say wiccans?

o, oops. i thought you were incinuating that Wiccan's were the devil's minnions. my mistake :rolleyes:

It wasn't the "first religion". "Pagan" is a Christian word that means things not-Christian, Muslim or Jewish. That includes a *lot* of religious beliefs.

The form of paganism that we have now is in no way the first religion. However, paganism as we now know of it and speak of it generally refers to the many polytheistic religions of Europe and parts of Africa (mainly Egypt). It is quite clear that these polytheistic religions were the first religions.

I never mentioned Wicca, thanks to who pointed that out, it is a growing trend in Germany, Scandinavia and Teutonic regions of Poland for people to take Germanic belief systems and turn them into a white supremist mixing pot. I personally dislike it, a lot. Mixing hate into any religion is a recipe for disaster. Besides, it is an offshoot of the Black Order of NAZI Germany under Heinrich Himmler. He had this bizzare obsession with those hazy parts of history and thought that NAZI Germany would benefit from a strong paganized belief system. But we know what happened when internal dissension began to run hot in that lovely winter of '44 :) Back to the trends. They aren't very common right now, thankfully. They are vastly underground, but recentely that poor child Jeff Weise that popped up and shot 9 in his reserve tangled with these people. If you are familiar with any neo-NAZI movements today. You'd have a better understanding of what I speak about.


These people simply call themselves neo-Pagans. The Anti-Defamation League has a VERY interesting segment about their symbology (although a lot of their information is silly :P)

As for the FIRST religion...People believe it was probably animal worship, or empathy art. Our ancient ancestors, neigh 11'000 years ago, would paint pictures of animals that they just killed on walls or cliff faces. It is theorized that they would throw objects at this to emphasize to the young men and the women of the tribe the importance of the kill. It sanctified it, and showed the absolute necessity of food and the struggle for it. Then there was the fertility worship that began during the primative settlement stage of mankind (effectively camps where small idols were made). That quickly turned into the many forms of Pagan and monotheistic faiths we have today. Interestingly (I could go on FOREVER on this topic from a theological stand point) Hinduism is the earliest monotheistic faith. From my understanding, all of their dieties and Gods, as well as everything on Earth is simply an incarnation of Bhrama. The singular all encompassing god.

wow...how do you know so much about that topic? (the first religion and stuff) and i have a question: what exactly does the Neo- mean in Neo-Pagan or Neo-NAZI?

wow...how do you know so much about that topic? (the first religion and stuff) and i have a question: what exactly does the Neo- mean in Neo-Pagan or Neo-NAZI?



I can answer the second.

Neo of course means literally "new" but it often attatched to a word to denote a 'new sort.' neo-conservatives, neo-nazis, neo-pagans are not conservatives, nazis, or pagans in the original or traditional sense, rather they are new groups with distinct ideologies which identify with the older groups and ideologies.

A neo-nazi may have little or no conception of actual third reich national socialism, just a hatred of minorities.

A neo-conservative may not stand for small government or fiscal responsiblity, but they are for big defense spending.

A neo-pagan may not have much to do with ancient religions (the specifics of which are mostly lost to history anyhow), but they model their new beliefs on what they can garner from old ones or inject older iconography or ideas into whatever new things they decide to believe.

ooo i get it. so Neo- can be different depending on which context it is used in?

Wicca, and neo-paganism, is highly offensive to celts who follow the old ways. It is nothing more than a bunch of posturing arrested adolescents.

If you want to follow the old ways, fair enough, but at least go learn about them. They are not what you think.

Frankly, the whole wiccan/neo-paganism is just a bunch of made up dog-shit.

I was Wiccan for a while, but I was always too lazy to actually keep up on the Sabbats and full moons. Much of it is still in my beliefs though, and if I were to label myself something besides agnostic, I'd probably fall back on that name. My parents have never been religious, so I didn't really leave a religion for it... but I did actively choose.

Wicca, and neo-paganism, is highly offensive to celts who follow the old ways. It is nothing more than a bunch of posturing arrested adolescents.

If you want to follow the old ways, fair enough, but at least go learn about them. They are not what you think.

Frankly, the whole wiccan/neo-paganism is just a bunch of made up dog-shit.

Haven't been using this puppet to troll much lately, eh? :p

i'm not wiccan anymore but its pretty much the only religion i still support.

'Wicca' is an evil fabrication.

Haven't been using this puppet to troll much lately, eh? :p
But he does have a point. Wicca as a movement was basically made up by two guys in the 1800's, if I remember my history. It has almost nothing to do with the actual druids of old.

Just the one?


LOL, Keruvalia you're the reason Generalis so funny.

Now.. on to responses.

Frankly, I don't consider myself a "pagan". In fact, I hate the term for a number of reasons. These reasons include, but are not limited to:
- Pagan is connotated with "tree huggung hippy".
- Most Pagans/Wiccans I meet are idiots. (For instance "Wicca is thousands of years old.")

And that's all I'm going to think up right now.
But, for your purpouses, you may lump me into the "pagan" category anyway, since most people will/are going to do it anyway.
I follow the Sumerian religion (Not to be confused with the Akkadian/Assyrian/Babylonian variant), although not as strictly as many people would assume a "pagan" would. In fact, I take the same approach to it as the avrage layman Christian, I just go about my daily life and do things that fit my life as I see it. Of course everything religious I incorporate into my life, comes directly from my study of ancient Sumer, and is not made up. Although some stuff is "modernized", IE I'm planning to incorporate a simmilar "tradition" to Christmas or Easter into the two Akitu festivals (New year/mid-yearish.. it's complicated) since origonally it involved stuff I just can't do.

Other then that, I hate Wicca.
As I said, most "wiccans" I've ever met, are idiots. Fortunatly for the smart ones, I don't consider them wiccan, I just consider them them (The idiots got the title first).



PAGANS! HERE! FETCH THE FIREWOOD! lol

No in all seriousness, I generally can't understand most modern religious expression. I don't understand most modern things. I have come to accept that people do odd things and it is best to let them get on with it. If people didn't do odd things then they wouldn't be people. So I will condone you tree huggers etc etc for now but don't you hugging any of my trees or old Mr. Shotgun will get an airing!

Lol.
I'd like to introduce you to, well, me! Probably the only militaristic, totalitarian, "pagan" you will ever find.
I am in no way a hippy.. I hate them to.



Wicca, and neo-paganism, is highly offensive to celts who follow the old ways. It is nothing more than a bunch of posturing arrested adolescents.

If you want to follow the old ways, fair enough, but at least go learn about them. They are not what you think.

Frankly, the whole wiccan/neo-paganism is just a bunch of made up dog-shit.

Here here!
As long as you're thinking like I do, IE that the actual practises of the ancient ways are not categorized as "wiccan/neo-paganism".
Oh, and "paganism" in any of it's forms is not limited to Celts.

It's unfortunate that more Christians don't feel the same. I was told just yesterday on another thread that unless I repent my sin and turn to Christ I will go to hell. This was well meant advice not a flaming.

As I said, I'm a 43 year old Druid. I have not sinned by the standards I set my self and I really don't believe in Christ in the same way I don't believe in fairies or unicorns. Fortunately I don't believe in hell either so...whatever.

I have stood in a rainy wood a midnight and felt the world breath around me. I do realise I am totally insignificant in the grand scheme of things. I 'm sure that Mother Nature has no real interest in me and would snuff me out without (metaphoricly) blinking.
I'm also sure that we are squatters on this world and if we fuck it up no one will miss us when we've gone.

So

May you all feel Spring coursing through you.

Bright Blessings

Eternal Green Rain


**applauds ***
33 year old Pagan here - started as a Baptist - but raised to follow my instincts. When I told my parents that I didn't believe the Christ myth - they told me ( lovingly )to find my own way to God.
And I have.
I sleep well at night in the arms of the Divine.

However, a few respondents so far have mentioned that they are former Catholics. These people (if I understand them) seem to have become... disappointed? disillusioned? ...with the Church.

For those of you who have turned from the path of Christ: I hope that you eventually return to it
If you look above you'll see that it wasn't just disappointment in the Church that sealed my decision to leave. As I've said I had no connection with "God". From my personally view, you can not claim to be a part of a religion/spirituality if you feel nothing. Again this is only my opinion.
Fair enough. I respect your opinion.

Although I understand your love for Christ (I may not share it but if it's as strong as my love for the Goddess then I understand), I must respectfully say that sometimes statements like the second one anger me slightly.
Uhhh... yeaaah... I think I can see how it would anger some people.

Usually, I am more considerate of other people's beliefs than that, but like I said, it was 2-in-the-morning when I posted that, so I wasn't quite thinking straight. I usually follow my own standard advice, "Think about it for a moment", but there are times when I'm more like Saint "Shoot from the hip" Peter; I should reread the Gospels if only to count how many times the man of whom Christ said "You are the rock upon which I shall build my church" ran his mouth off without thinking.

I understand that you don't really know me, so I can not be angry. The reason I do not like statements like that is because it usually leads to arguements and condemning statements from the Christian part of the arguement. I am in no way saying that all Christians condemn people outside their religion but most of the ones I have come across have. Instead of leaving the subject end at "Well I have a strong connection with the Goddess and you with Jesus, neither of us are going to change our opinions so lets just leave it at that." Far too many times I have heard simple heartfelt statements like the one above turn into "you're going to burn in hell" statements. Again I am not saying that you would do such a thing.
Chruch doctrine used to assert that salvation can only be found through Christ. I'm not sure if it's still part of doctrine today; it may have been overturned during the papacy of His Holiness John Paul II. Regardless of its' current official status, it's not a doctrine I agree with. There are many who abide by the most important of Christs teachings (most important above all, love) but who do not necessarily call themselves followers of Christ; I find it very difficult to believe that such people would be condemned merely because of an accident of their upbringing. I do wonder sometimes if, for those people with love in their hearts, the different religions are just many paths to the one Almighty God.

I must admit though I've turned that statement around a few times when being confronted by crazed Christians. It's rather funny to see their faces when you say: "I hope that you eventually return to the path of the Goddess". ;)
/me laughs.

Okay, I set myself up for that one; good for the goose, good for the gander.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."

I'm Wiccan. I am 17 almost 18 and my sister is 20 my mother 42 and both of them are wiccan as well. I never believed all the stuff that christians told me and I was drawn to Wicca at an early age and actually got into all of it when I was 13, I eventually told my sister and got her into it with me. My mother at first did not want us dealing with it, because she was raised christian and believed that Wicca was bad, though she soon found out diffrently. Now we are all wiccans, thanks to me. lol I am proud to be Wiccan, and not christian.

**applauds ***
33 year old Pagan here - started as a Baptist - but raised to follow my instincts. When I told my parents that I didn't believe the Christ myth - they told me ( lovingly )to find my own way to God.
And I have.
I sleep well at night in the arms of the Divine.
It's nice to see some common sense here.
The true pagans I know (who are many) don't debate their beliefs agressively but respect each other in a way I rarely see in the other world religions.

It wasn't the "first religion". "Pagan" is a Christian word that means things not-Christian, Muslim or Jewish. That includes a *lot* of religious beliefs.
Unfortunately that's untrue.
Pagan comes from the Roman Pagani (singular Paganus) which literally means country dwellers (I think) and was used as a term of abuse for the ignorant (as the Romans saw them) rural folk of the regions of France, Germany and the Uk (as they now are) that the Romans occupied.

Ok so I've been in a few threads were people have been discussing there religious/spiritual beliefs and I was wondering two things.

1. How many other people here on NationStates are Wiccan/Pagan?

and

2. How did you come to be Wiccan/Pagan? Were you raised as such or did you actively leave a previous religion? If so why?


I first spotted your post and shrugged it off, then, I decided to give it a click, I'm glad I did!

I openly practice Wicca as well as slight Shamanism!

So, tally up one for you list!

I was born into a Wiccan family, raised one, then, after my mother and father were divorced, I found out it was a front for my father and he attempted, in vain, to convert me to Christianity!

I now live with my mother, step-father and step-brothers, while my step father is Catholic and my step-brothers are Athiest, they allow Mother and I to practice, which, is a wonderful thing!

Feel free to telegram me anytime!!

~~Mina, the Empress of Minoia

That's awesome!

Ok, so this will be my first post here. Hello :)

I don't fully considering myself "wiccan" or "pagan" (just words with different meaning to different people). However I do have many beliefs that are "paganic" greatest of which is the utmost respect for Nature. Eternal Green Rain (I think it was he) put it rather well on the earlier pages.

I'm 18 and used to be lutherian. My parents are both officially lutherian but not very religious type. When I said Christianity is not the religion for me they understood and let me make my own decision without greater drama.

Finding my way to paganism wasn't a sudden revelation but rather a very long process which started long back when I was about 13 years old. That's when I first started reading stuff about old times. As many might think the books I read weren't any necronomicons or any other "cool" stuff but just ... well ... books :) Biggest thing was Kalevala which is the national epic of Finland. Basicly a collection of old poems. During those years I considered many of the old beliefs to fit my view of the world better than those that I've been taught. I didn't consider myself a "pagan" or anything though.

One big influence was music. I'm a big fan of metal music and even bigger fan of the so called "folk metal" which basicly mixes traditional music with modern metal. The most of the earlier mentioned "idiots who claim to be pagans" are surely the fan-base of this type of music :p I'm not one of those "pagans are cool 'cos Finntroll is cool" types though.

As for the white-power pagans... Yea, unfortunately they exist. Not as numerous as people seem to often believe though. By outlook I'm your typical "pagan-metalhead". Long hair, black clothes, beard and a mjöllner-necklace and because of that I'm often labeled as nazi by those who don't know what they are talking about. I know lots and lots of people similiar to myself, who are nice, smart persons, but you only need one idiot to make a whole "sub-culture" look like idiot to outsiders.

Cheesh... first post and I write a bloody novel.

But he does have a point. Wicca as a movement was basically made up by two guys in the 1800's, if I remember my history. It has almost nothing to do with the actual druids of old.
Witchcraft has been rampant all over the world, for years. Even without Wicca, Witchcraft, what Wicca basically is, has its forms in practically every culture. Hindus have their Yogis, there's voodoo in the Caribbean islands, Santeria in South America, various tribes which perform magic in Africa, and according to Wicca's definition of magic, even Catholics and many other Christian denominations perform magick when they do things like Communion or any form of rritual prayer. A lot of Christians are terrified by witchcraft, but they just don't understand it. It's really nothing more than designing your own religious rituals. Catholics say a cracker represents Christ's body.. Well, a Wiccan can take any object and make it represent whatever they wish.

Now, as for your comments, "it was started by a couple of guys in the 1800's." That sounds very condescending and ignorant. Witchcraft, as said before, had been rampant, even through England and America. When witches had been persecuted, they met in secret and recorded their rituals in what's called a "book of shadows", that was handed down, from generation-to-generation. This was very informal, however.

In the 50's and 60's, however, Dr. Gerald Gardiner, a scientist who originally researched Wicca, as a culture, had begun practicing it and writing books on it. He formalized the central concepts of Wicca, such as "casting a circle", using an athame, and following the Wiccan Rede. After his death, many other traditions formed, with their own rules, etc. It iwas an extremely agnostic religion, leaving a lot open to interpretation (you'll even find Christian Wiccans). But it's just as valid of a belief system as anything else. Although, I admit, a lot of their followers are nutcases.

Oh, and, on a side-note.. as to what the previous person just posted. Paganism was also a cultural movement. A lot of people considered themselves "pagan" and had a certain style, but mostly, they were just drug-addicted hippies that often hung out and had sex with bikers. Not all Pagans are like that.

And a lot of teenage Wiccans today are retarded. They're rejected nerds, who have no abilities whatsoever, but desperately want them, or people who are totally ignorant of the practice, but think it's cool to dress that way or identify with that culture.

I was always curious as to what percentage of 'wiccans' are aged 14-20 and only do it to anger their traditionalist parents and be able to say to their friends 'Im a Wiccan!' or similar...


Oddly enough, I was raised like this. Of course, my very existence pisses my mother off to no end, but she reacts to about 95% of the world's population in the same manner, so it's not really noteworthy.

But he does have a point. Wicca as a movement was basically made up by two guys in the 1800's, if I remember my history. It has almost nothing to do with the actual druids of old.

Try 1950's. Buckland brought it to the United States. Try picking up a copy of Buckland's Complete Book of Witchcraft at your local bookstore. This tome has been nicknamed "Uncle Bucky's Big Blue Book" by pagans and bookworms alike, and is a wonderful reference.

I would not yet consider myself truely a Wiccan, as I have no real interaction with others proficient in the faith, but I have read up enough to begin seeing myself, at the very least, as a solitary neophyte of sorts. I've yet to bother even trying to cast a circle, lacking many of the recommended supplies, but at the very least, I've been working on my passive meditation with the ultimate goal of reaching the astral plane. It's a start, I guess...

I'm really somewhat ashamed of how I came to immersing myself in the religion, as it began and, (hopefully) ended quickly as a silly search online for authentic magical practice, I guess as some strange self-esteem boost..

Lucky for me, when I came across Gavin and Yvonne Frost's website, I began reading things that I'd believed all along, but never really had a launch pad to open myself even further to these beliefs. I've been collecting their books ever since, and the things I once believed to either be stupid questions or some kind of paradox are treated with a deeper level of thought. I don't really see it as some sort of 'fad' (though it's a fun bonus to identify myself, to a modest degree, with the Craft; ) rather, I see it simply as the Western reply to a path towards enlightenment, and its philosophy on the psychic and the divine deeply appeal to me.

As for pantheons, I haven't exactly chosen one of my own, though I'm drawn to the Gauls. I was a bit uneasy on the concept of polytheistic worship and/or honor, but when I was at least led to believe that, much like titles a person holds to identify there religion by (i.e. Wicca, Judaism, Shamanism, Islam, etc.,) multiple gods are only simplified ways of dividing the Great Spirit into aspects simple enough that they can respond to human desire, and that latent power is found in their names today left over from their bigger days of reknownment. The fact that these were just as practical as the use of saints in Christianity was all it took for me to no longer see those practices as 'strange.'

Now, if I could just understand the sense in a 'sacred marriage,' I wouldn't be so hesitant to initiate myself some day in a group setting...


And a lot of teenage Wiccans today are retarded. They're rejected nerds, who have no abilities whatsoever, but desperately want them, or people who are totally ignorant of the practice, but think it's cool to dress that way or identify with that culture.

This opinion, which has crossed my mind many times before, makes me very, very self-conscious of how I look and act, being a 16 year-old with a bad habit of thinking he knows more than he may actually know. I wear primarily (And typically) black clothing with a bit of rose quartz in two pockets, a sterling silver ring on both of my middle fingers, and a pentacle(Properly position with the center point facing up), though I wish I was more knowledgeable on charging amulets; until then I suppose all I have is a crappy aluminum necklace from Spencer's Gifts to represent the 5 beliefs that lead the ideal human (Law of attraction, proggressive reincarnation, power through knowledge, harmony and serenity, and the Wiccan Rede: If it harm none, do what you will; though I can proudly understand that it can represent many other things, including the Eastern portrayal of the 5 elements and human senses. Obvious to those that know far more than me, but I'm trying as hard as I can to express legitimacy. Bear with me...)

For this, I give my deepest apologies to those many wiser than myself. For all else, I hold no shame in being young yet identifying myself by these beliefs. May we all keep in mind that age is never a solid rule of thumb for intelligence, and even the most primal of animals can still know more about the world than a human.

(I didn't initially mean to take my post to such great lengths only to put a concerned effort to insure that my opinions be considered valid. I ask for one last grain of forgiveness for anyone that read all of that...)

Try 1950's. Buckland brought it to the United States. Try picking up a copy of Buckland's Complete Book of Witchcraft at your local bookstore. This tome has been nicknamed "Uncle Bucky's Big Blue Book" by pagans and bookworms alike, and is a wonderful reference.

If it's of any important note, Gavin and Yvonne Frost (Whom I just mentioned and source most of my information from,) actually established (In the U.S., anyway,) the Church and School of Wicca in, I think, 1959. It was finally recognized as a church in the 70's, and has been running ever since.

You can count me as Wiccan, and as I always say

"They tried to raise me Catholic, but it didn't take"

Same :)

The earth based faiths are just so much more fun ^^

plus i dont think catholics clebrat their faith, they mourn it

I'm really somewhat ashamed of how I came to immersing myself in the religion, as it began and, (hopefully) ended quickly as a silly search online for authentic magical practice, I guess as some strange self-esteem boost.This opinion, which has crossed my mind many times before, makes me very, very self-conscious of how I look and act, being a 16 year-old with a bad habit of thinking he knows more than he may actually know. For this, I give my deepest apologies to those many wiser than myself. For all else, I hold no shame in being young yet identifying myself by these beliefs. May we all keep in mind that age is never a solid rule of thumb for intelligence, and even the most primal of animals can still know more about the world than a human.(I didn't initially mean to take my post to such great lengths only to put a concerned effort to insure that my opinions be considered valid. I ask for one last grain of forgiveness for anyone that read all of that...)

no prob im a 14 year old wiccan girl who is a nerd with no abilites apart from 8 languages and an iq of 140

I'm a sensualist romantic, i worship war heroes and writers and chefs and my temples are glorious and beautiful buidlings, concert halls and kitchens.

To take the easy way out of answering this, please read this: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=421519

It explains it about how/why I'm Pagan.

plus i dont think catholics celebrate their faith, they mourn it
lending weight to the argument: when in doubt, quote a Kevin Smith film.

May we all keep in mind that age is never a solid rule of thumb for intelligence, and even the most primal of animals can still know more about the world than a human.
Although age and experience are more concerned with wisdom, which can be a far more powerful tool if used properly. Animals don't 'know', as such.. more, 'feel'.

25 year old Wiccan here, of the very eclectic kind. (Though I don't really practice it very much.)

.. I have not sinned by the standards I set my self and I really don't believe in Christ in the same way I don't believe in fairies or unicorns. Fortunately I don't believe in hell either so...whatever.
damn straight. I don't believe that this bus is going to hit me and kill me so I'm fine. Aw, bastards, it did.

I'm a sensualist romantic, i worship war heroes and writers and chefs and my temples are glorious and beautiful buidlings, concert halls and kitchens.

ur from religious impact rite? hi u sounded kwl

I'm a sensualist romantic, i worship war heroes and writers and chefs and my temples are glorious and beautiful buidlings, concert halls and kitchens.

Isn't that something like epicureanism or hedonism... epicurianism probably.

Maharlikana