NationStates Jolt Archive

:mad:
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=T2IXST1Q5UYLUCRBAE0CFEY?type=domesticNews&storyID=7989189

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. Army is ordering more people to serve in Iraq and Afghanistan involuntarily from a seldom-used personnel pool as part of a mobilization that began last summer.

They are part of the Army's Individual Ready Reserve, made up of soldiers who have completed their volunteer active-duty service commitment but remain eligible to be called back into uniform for years after returning to civilian life.

The Army, straining to maintain troop levels in Iraq, last June said it would summon more than 5,600 people on the IRR in an effort to have about 4,400 soldiers fit for duty in Iraq and Afghanistan after granting exemption requests for medical reasons and other hardships.

Lt. Col. Pamela Hart said on Wednesday the Army has now increased the number of IRR soldiers it needs to about 4,650, which means a total of about 6,100 will get mobilization orders.

The IRR differs from the part-time Army Reserve and Army National Guard, whose soldiers train regularly as part of units. People on the IRR have no such training requirements.

Hart also said 370 IRR soldiers had not reported to the Army by the date ordered and have not requested an exemption from service or a delay in reporting. Hart said none have been declared absent without leave, or AWOL, and the Army was trying to determine whether all of them actually had received their mobilization orders.

"We're giving them all ample opportunity to comply with their orders," Hart said.

The Army has approved 1,866 requests for exemptions or delays in reporting, Hart said.

There are about 150,000 U.S. troops in Iraq, but the number is slated to decline to about 138,000 this month. The Army has defended tapping into the IRR, saying it was a legitimate personnel tool to find soldiers in a time of need.

Army officials have said that they expect to launch a second round of mobilizations from the IRR this summer on the scale of the current round to provide soldiers for future force rotations into Iraq and Afghanistan.

:mad:

See what happens when the U.S. Army can't fulfil it's quotas - it drags civilians out of their normal lives and sends them to their deaths.

Ein Deutscher']:mad:
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=T2IXST1Q5UYLUCRBAE0CFEY?type=domesticNews&storyID=7989189

:mad:

See what happens when the U.S. Army can't fulfil it's quotas - it drags civilians out of their normal lives and sends them to their deaths.


Hmm, when you sign your papers you should read everything that is on them. Seriously, this is spelled out in English on your enlistment papers and on the ones you get upon your leave from the active military. What's the problem?

Hmm, when you sign your papers you should read everything that is on them. Seriously, this is spelled out in English on your enlistment papers and on the ones you get upon your leave from the active military. What's the problem?
It's not a problem. I guess the US population deserves being sent to Iraq and Afghanistan for Bush's adventures. It's still a highly unethical "rule" in these enlistment papers and it's not like people have a choice to say "no" after they have served their time in the army. Thus this is actually slavery and should be unconstitutional.

Ein Deutscher']It's not a problem. I guess the US population deserves being sent to Iraq and Afghanistan for Bush's adventures. It's still a highly unethical "rule" in these enlistment papers and it's not like people have a choice to say "no" after they have served their time in the army. Thus this is actually slavery and should be unconstitutional.

If you don't like what is on those enlistment papers, don't sign them. The recruiter isn't holding a gun to your head.

Ein Deutscher']:mad:
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml;jsessionid=T2IXST1Q5UYLUCRBAE0CFEY?type=domesticNews&storyID=7989189

:mad:

See what happens when the U.S. Army can't fulfil it's quotas - it drags civilians out of their normal lives and sends them to their deaths.

The Individual Ready Reserve is not some sort of back door surprise. It's in the contract that we all sign when we enlist.

Most soldiers serve 4 years active duty, and then for the 4 years after they leave service, are in the IRR - where usually nothing happens.

We called people up from IRR during the First Gulf War.

It's not really a replacement for fulfilling enlistment quotas. An IRR soldier is already trained - ready to ship out immediately. Someone who enlists is rarely ready for up to a year - unless you want to take someone with virtually no experience past their basic training. An IRR soldier is someone with at least 4 years of experience and additional military schooling.

Stop commenting on subjects on which you are completely and utterly ignorant, and have absolutely no real insight into.

Stop commenting on subjects on which you are completely and utterly ignorant, and have absolutely no real insight into.
Ah thus why there are so many excemptions. These civilians are all ready to go to war for emperor Bush. You wish. US-Army-Apologist number one = Whispering Legs. Or should it say: Festering Legs?

Ein Deutscher']Ah thus why there are so many excemptions. These civilians are all ready to go to war for emperor Bush. You wish. US-Army-Apologist number one = Whispering Legs. Or should it say: Festering Legs?


Why don't you comment on your relatives NAZI love affair and following? I'm sure all of the Germans were Nazi Army Apologists.

Yes, the Ready Reserve is nothing new, and nothing "evil". As Whispering Legs pointed out, it's part of the deal when you decide to serve. You're made aware of this, and if you don't want to be required to be part of the Ready Reserve, well, then you don't sign the papers.
So, those of us who actually know something on the issue, would be greatly appreciative if you would quit posting about it.

Ein Deutscher']Ah thus why there are so many excemptions. These civilians are all ready to go to war for emperor Bush. You wish. US-Army-Apologist number one = Whispering Legs. Or should it say: Festering Legs?

If you'll care to read, you'll notice I'm not an apologist. I tried to explain to someone ignorant how the IRR actually works.

If you signed the contract, and took the oath, you are bound by contract to fulfill it.

Are you suggesting that somehow, these people had no idea, and that in any case, they are not bound by contract?

Are you suggesting that people who signed up for the military, and served in the military, and who had this IRR fact COMPLETELY EXPLAINED to them MULTIPLE TIMES are not obligated and can feign ignorance of their contract?

Eh?

Are you suggesting that people should be able to serve in the military, sign a contract, and then enjoy the privilege of never having to go to war? Despite contractual obligations to the contrary?

That's not apology. Those are facts. Not bullshit.

It is part of the agreement. They go into the IRR and receive the army benefits, the army gets the right to call them up if the army sees it fit. It is neither stunning nor against the rules. It's just part of an agreement between the IRR folks and the army.

Ein Deutscher']Ah thus why there are so many excemptions. These civilians are all ready to go to war for emperor Bush. You wish. US-Army-Apologist number one = Whispering Legs. Or should it say: Festering Legs?

your both treading very close to the line to flaming... watch it.

Apparently you are unaware of what is actually happening. In the US military, your term of enlistment is for 8 years. Generally this is 4 years active duty, followed by 4 years unorganized reserve duty (to be called up in time of war or national emergency if needed). Germany, both East and West, had conscription for the entire duration of the Cold War, a unified Germany had it for its entire existance, and reunified Germany only recently got rid of it.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

No civilians are being dragged to war. Reservists are being recalled to active duty.

A substantial difference.

It is part of the agreement. They go into the IRR and receive the army benefits, the army gets the right to call them up if the army sees it fit. It is neither stunning nor against the rules. It's just part of an agreement between the IRR folks and the army.

Europeans are unfamiliar with the contract and its stipulations. So they perceive the call up as abusive.

I, and everyone I knew who PCSed in the Army knew all about the IRR.

Ahhhh, it's Ein Deutscher again stirring up trouble I see. Like all the others who joined the military I read my contract and I knew what awaited me when I got out, I also knew I was eligible to be called up again under certain circumstances. I guess there's no problem here if you read your contract, but if you didn't and you are called back who's at fault for you not knowing it could happen? You are.

When you raise your right hand and swear to uphold the Constitution of the U.S. and to obey the orders given by the President you have obligated yourself to fullfill the terms of that contract.

Which is worse, Being called back to do a job you signed up for by contract or being drafted? I choose the prior.

I've been in the military myself and I know how this works. There are NO benefits at all associated with being in the civilian reserve of the military. They can call you up anytime for whatever reason and apparently, the lack of recruits (thank god) is reason enough to draft civilians back into the military, ripping them from their family lives.

At least in Germany, you have no choice to say "no" to this "contract". Here you are eligible to be called back into the forces, if necessary, until the age of 45 or something.

swing.....and a miss :D

This is the same person who put of a Reuters article about US soldiers in Afghanistan shooting women and children. For those who haven't seen that thread yet, I highly recommend it. This person is an idiot who will bash America till its blue in the face. To bad we won't break. This person is scum on the bottom of my shoe and is worthless. I hope he goes to war and see's what really goes on in it. People-including innocents-die. Its called war. Welcome to it.

Ein Deutscher']I've been in the military myself and I know how this works. There are NO benefits at all associated with being in the civilian reserve of the military. They can call you up anytime for whatever reason and apparently, the lack of recruits (thank god) is reason enough to draft civilians back into the military, ripping them from their family lives.

At least in Germany, you have no choice to say "no" to this "contract". Here you are eligible to be called back into the forces, if necessary, until the age of 45 or something.

Here in the US, it's only to make up for any years you didn't serve up to the total of 8.

Most people serve 4 years active, so they wait for 4 years after they get out - and then their obligation is complete. You can't be called up after that.

If you served, say, 6 years active, you wait 2 years - and then you're done.

None of this "call you up until you're 45" stuff.

your both treading very close to the line to flaming... watch it.

Apparently you are unaware of what is actually happening. In the US military, your term of enlistment is for 8 years. Generally this is 4 years active duty, followed by 4 years unorganized reserve duty (to be called up in time of war or national emergency if needed). Germany, both East and West, had conscription for the entire duration of the Cold War, a unified Germany had it for its entire existance, and reunified Germany only recently got rid of it.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

No civilians are being dragged to war. Reservists are being recalled to active duty.

A substantial difference.
We still have conscription as far as I know, thus why people here are eligible to be drawn back into the military until age 45 or so. Unless you do civil service, you're eligible for the military until you're almost too old and tattered to hold a gun...

This is the same person who put of a Reuters article about US soldiers in Afghanistan shooting women and children. For those who haven't seen that thread yet, I highly recommend it. This person is an idiot who will bash America till its blue in the face. To bad we won't break. This person is scum on the bottom of my shoe and is worthless. I hope he goes to war and see's what really goes on in it. People-including innocents-die. Its called war. Welcome to it.
Well actually the war already ended a long time ago. It's your inept president who has no clue how to "win the peace". :rolleyes:

Ein Deutscher']We still have conscription as far as I know, thus why people here are eligible to be drawn back into the military until age 45 or so. Unless you do civil service, you're eligible for the military until you're almost too old and tattered to hold a gun...

We found problems with the draft.
1. People don't want to go.
2. The draftee makes a crap soldier.
3. It takes several years to get a high quality soldier. Draftees don't stay in that long.
4. It's unpopular with the people who don't get drafted.

The current US soldier is far, far more high quality than the draftee of the Vietnam Era. The military would like to keep it that way.

Yes, the Ready Reserve is nothing new, and nothing "evil". As Whispering Legs pointed out, it's part of the deal when you decide to serve. You're made aware of this, and if you don't want to be required to be part of the Ready Reserve, well, then you don't sign the papers.
So, those of us who actually know something on the issue, would be greatly appreciative if you would quit posting about it.


I'm sorry but I am afraid you are wasting your breath trying to explain facts and reason to this person. I hope he is not right and we are all slaves under "Emperor Bush". I hope they arent indoctrinating my children in school to go fight in Iraq and Afghanistan. God knows what they could trick them into signing.

Ein Deutscher']Well actually the war already ended a long time ago. It's your inept president who has no clue how to "win the peace". :rolleyes:

No, the war will probably never end. As long as there is one al-Qaeda member on the face of the Earth, it won't end.

The US military has acess to highschools and colleges in the US. It's so embedded into society that they can easily do a draft and the population would not have a say in it. Do you actually think that Bush would care? He's in his last 3 years - he has nothing to lose. :rolleyes:

No, the war will probably never end. As long as there is one al-Qaeda member on the face of the Earth, it won't end.
I guess as long as the US is arrogant and meddling in other countries affairs, there will be no end. Perfect to wage eternal war. Woohoo, just what the world needed.

Ein Deutscher']The US military has acess to highschools and colleges in the US. It's so embedded into society that they can easily do a draft and the population would not have a say in it. Do you actually think that Bush would care? He's in his last 3 years - he has nothing to lose. :rolleyes:


Maybe thats true in your point of view-WHERE YOU LIVE. Not here. And this is a lot of wind coming from a bag that is essentially protected by US bases there anyway.

We can only be so lucky enough to tack him on the list next....

So it is now legal for the U.S. Gov. to 'draft' people?
Selective Service (http://www.sss.gov.)

Ein Deutscher']I guess as long as the US is arrogant and meddling in other countries affairs, there will be no end. Perfect to wage eternal war. Woohoo, just what the world needed.
I guess as long as al-Qaeda's mission is to kill everyone in the Western world, we'll be justified.

Ein Deutscher']I guess as long as the US is arrogant and meddling in other countries affairs, there will be no end. Perfect to wage eternal war. Woohoo, just what the world needed.


Yeah-"Live and let bomb innocent people worldwide"- thats your motto. Your opinion is so skewed as you are used to being in a place that has absolutely no obligation to anyone other than itself.

So it is now legal for the U.S. Gov. to 'draft' people?
Selective Service (http://www.sss.gov.)

No, everyone has, since 1975, been required to register with the Selective Service.

Just in case someone gets the idea to start a draft.

But...

You'll notice that the Selective Service is not the idea of the current Administration. Additionally, a draftee SUCKS as a soldier, and everyone in the Pentagon knows it. It takes longer to make someone a high quality soldier than the terms of any draft enlistment. That's why they designed the military with its reserve components and rotated huge numbers of trained soldiers out to be civilians. Which is also why the huge pool of ex-Special Forces soldiers are now paid consultants.

Also, it should be pointed out that they are not just grabbing every IRR soldier in sight. The personnel that are called up tend to be in specific specialties which a under strength.

I had just ETS'ed from the Army following Desert Storm. 2 months afterward, I was called up out of college for possible service in Somalia. The reason for the call up was that I had spent the last 10 years in the Special FOrces and I was an 18F (Intel SGT). As it turns out, I was only activated for 2 months and never left Ft. Campbell.

The commitment is what the commitment is. Its not hidden, in small print or misrepresented in any way. Complaining about this sort of thing is the same as trying to pull off being a Conscientious Objector in an all volunteer Army.......

Ein Deutscher']I've been in the military myself and I know how this works. There are NO benefits at all associated with being in the civilian reserve of the military. They can call you up anytime for whatever reason and apparently, the lack of recruits (thank god) is reason enough to draft civilians back into the military, ripping them from their family lives.

At least in Germany, you have no choice to say "no" to this "contract". Here you are eligible to be called back into the forces, if necessary, until the age of 45 or something.
Well if you had been in the military, you would note that the mission is given higher priority than your personal life.

Allow me to disect an Oath of Office (USAF, may be different from the other branches). You take this upon entrance into the armed forces.

I, (Full Name) having been appointed a (Rank) in the United States Air Force,
Self explanatory
do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic;
This is affirming your responsibility to uphold and defend the US Constitution with your life if need be.
that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same;
Pledging allegiance to the US (and by extension her people) and her Constitution
that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion;
Swearing that you are not taking this oath because you're being forced to, that you fully understand the consequences of your action, that you're not having reservations about doing so, and that you're not trying to trick the US
and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter, SO HELP ME GOD.
That you WILL fulfill the obligations stipulated in the contract you had to sign, and that you WILL follow orders ) for as long as you keep your "office."

This oath is (in my understanding) a legally binding contract. If there is confusion about what one is getting themselves into, and the obligations they will be required to follow, then perhaps one should bring this up BEFORE hand.

Note: In following orders, one is actually ordered (by the UCMJ, which can be considered a higher authority) to disobey illegal orders. The Ready Reserve is neither illegal nor immoral.

I guess as long as al-Qaeda's mission is to kill everyone in the Western world, we'll be justified.
I havn't seen Al-Qaeda kill any Germans yet (or not that I know of at least). Or Swedes or Fins or Belgians or Netherlanders or Icelanders or Swiss or Austrians...

That Al-Qaeda is out to kill everyone is pure Bush propaganda.

Ein Deutscher']I havn't seen Al-Qaeda kill any Germans yet (or not that I know of at least). Or Swedes or Fins or Belgians or Netherlanders or Icelanders or Swiss or Austrians...

That Al-Qaeda is out to kill everyone is pure Bush propaganda.

There were Germans killed in the World Trade Center. I guess you forgot.

Then again, anyone whose country could shovel live children into ovens is probably not too upset about it.

It's not Bush propaganda. It's in their own papers.

So it is now legal for the U.S. Gov. to 'draft' people?
Selective Service (http://www.sss.gov.)

To My knowledge, it has always been legal to "draft" people in the U.S. It just not a popular thing to do. The reason for "Selective Service" is to know where you are, in case a "draft" is necessary. It is in no way a "draft". There are a lot of countries around the world, most of them allied to the U.S. in some way, that have a mandatory conscription to be in the military. Of those counties most require military service for a period of time and they do not, some of them, allow for exceptions like being in college. So where would you rather live?

The U.S. or a country where you have no choice.

The military is allowed into the schools to recruit because it is another "choice" of a career not a way to "force" those students to join. Some students take the military route because they need to get a jump start in life for some reason, like poor grades, and cannot see a way through the regular channels. They go into it with their eyes open to what the possible consequences are when they join, nobody BS's them.

Ein Deutscher']Well actually the war already ended a long time ago. It's your inept president who has no clue how to "win the peace". :rolleyes:

The war on terror will go on until all freedom prevails

There were Germans killed in the World Trade Center. I guess you forgot.

Then again, anyone whose country could shovel live children into ovens is probably not too upset about it.

It's not Bush propaganda. It's in their own papers.
So the 3k people or so who died in the WTC justify the killing of tens of thousands in Iraq and Afghanistan? Why?

This is the same person who put of a Reuters article about US soldiers in Afghanistan shooting women and children. For those who haven't seen that thread yet, I highly recommend it. This person is an idiot who will bash America till its blue in the face. To bad we won't break. This person is scum on the bottom of my shoe and is worthless. I hope he goes to war and see's what really goes on in it. People-including innocents-die. Its called war. Welcome to it.
Well spoken!!!

There were Germans killed in the World Trade Center. I guess you forgot.

Then again, anyone whose country could shovel live children into ovens is probably not too upset about it.

It's not Bush propaganda. It's in their own papers.

Honestly, WL, why are you bothering. Obviously, he knows what IRR is and, obviously, he knows what selective service is. He's trying to rile people up by saying things he either knows are ignorant or is too ignorant to recognize as ignorant. Either way, it's a waste of breath to explain any of this to him. Let's spend our time have discussions that have a point.

Why don't you comment on your relatives NAZI love affair and following? I'm sure all of the Germans were Nazi Army Apologists.

Oh dear

Do a Google for Godwins Law

:)

Ein Deutscher']So the 3k people or so who died in the WTC justify the killing of tens of thousands in Iraq and Afghanistan? Why?

That wasn't his point. You said Al-Qaeda have not killed any Germans. Germans died in the World Trade Centre.

Honestly, WL, why are you bothering. Obviously, he knows what IRR is and, obviously, he knows what selective service is. He's trying to rile people up by saying things he either knows are ignorant or is too ignorant to recognize as ignorant. Either way, it's a waste of breath to explain any of this to him. Let's spend our time have discussions that have a point.

Good idea. I'm done with this thread.

Good idea. I'm done with this thread.
Finally. Your apologist excuses are a waste of forum space anyway.

That wasn't his point. You said Al-Qaeda have not killed any Germans. Germans died in the World Trade Centre.
The world trade center was in retaliation for the US conduct in the middle east. That a few Germans died in this attack is unfortunate and I feel sorry for their relatives. However, this does not entitle us to wage war against sovereign nations - at least not against Iraq, since Iraq had nothing at all to do with 9/11.

Ein Deutscher']I guess as long as the US is arrogant and meddling in other countries affairs, there will be no end. Perfect to wage eternal war. Woohoo, just what the world needed.

I agree.. we do meddle too much.. we should have left the Balkins where they belonged.. in the hands of the inept EU counicl so that millions more could have died.. Its not like Europe is capable of dealing with its own backyard let alone the world.

I agree.. we do meddle too much.. we should have left the Balkins where they belonged.. in the hands of the inept EU counicl so that millions more could have died.. Its not like Europe is capable of dealing with its own backyard let alone the world.
I don't claim that Europe does everything perfectly so your vitriol is lost. Besides that, I don't think that Europe is trying to police the world (and failing) like the US.

If you don't like what is on those enlistment papers, don't sign them. The recruiter isn't holding a gun to your head.EXACTLY. Or when you fill out your mandatory registration for selective service, make sure to sign up as a conscientious objector.

EXACTLY. Or when you fill out your mandatory registration for selective service, make sure to sign up as a conscientious objector.

actually, it doesn't work that way...... registering for Selective Service merely puts your name on the list if Conscription is once again put into effect. At that time those of draft age will be classified under whatever classification system is put into effect.

Thats right of the Selective Service Web site http://www.sss.gov/

I register people all the time, its part of my job as a counselor for an agency that provides government assistance for training and job placement services (Workforce Investment Act programs)... I also was in the first group that had to register back in 1980

Ein Deutscher']I don't claim that Europe does everything perfectly so your vitriol is lost. Besides that, I don't think that Europe is trying to police the world (and failing) like the US.

I don't think the US is failing. The insurgents are incapable of mounting any real attack on US soldiers, compared to insurgencies in past US conflicts.

Insurgents that attack US forces get annihilated.

In Vietnam, we took 6111 deaths a year to insurgents. Right now, we're at 750 deaths per year, and not all of those are combat deaths. Insurgents that stood and fought in Vietnam were almost always able to retreat with losses. In Iraq, they get annihilated.

The insurgents couldn't stop the election. They don't have the ability to take back the country. And a large number of them aren't even Iraqi.

The insurgency has, in a political sense, already failed. In a military sense, it's now only a matter of time before the insurgency fails completely - because the people are tired of them. The people know that the sooner the insurgency dies out, the sooner the Americans will leave.

Lebanese who hate Americans have called the Iraqi elections their equivalent of the fall of the Berlin Wall. How is that a bad thing?

In Afghanistan, they not only have elections, but their country is more stable. And women are not being shot in the head for listening to music. Men are not being shot for failing to grow a beard. And children are not being shot for flying a kite. I suppose you would have things the other way around.

Yes, it takes time. Yes, it's not perfect. The US was suffering casulaties from insurgents in Germany until 1954. The German economy was in a shambles for years after the war. But if the UK, Russia, and the US had not invaded and occupied Germany, you would be shoveling people into an oven for your job.

France is most certainly trying to police its former colonies. The US is now trying to police areas where it screwed up during the Cold War - Libya is making a deal now - Israel is now making a deal - everyone is moving forward. Even the King of Jordan says he's going to have free elections and become a limited constitutional monarch along the same lines as the Spanish Government - by the end of this year.

Are you saying that you would rather have things back they way they were?

Ok, I'll be sure to sew a couple of SS uniforms for you...

Ein Deutscher']So the 3k people or so who died in the WTC justify the killing of tens of thousands in Iraq and Afghanistan? Why?

war isn't about trading lives.... its about using whatever force is necessary to make the other side accede to your wishes....

as German said "War is a continuation of Policy by other means" (Clausewitz, you may have heard of him)

The US goal in the War on Terror (at least most of the voters) is to make Moslem Terrorists stop attacking American and Allied civilians and soldiers.

Period.

Everything else and all means used are simply to achieve that end.... from dropping bombs on caves to handing out food to attempting nationbuilding.

Pretty straight forward really.

The Terrorists seek to end the "evil" Western influences on their culture. Regardless of the will of the majority of Moslems and based on the teachings of one extremist view of Islam. No matter how many they kill in order to achieve that goal.

Doesn't leave a lot of room for compromise does it?

But if the UK, Russia, and the US had not invaded and occupied Germany, you would be shoveling people into an oven for your job.


I'm so delighted that we finally have people who are capable of predicting the future from a past that didn't even happen. I guess - anything that works for your argument. And that the world would be a Nazi-infested fortress with trillions of people dieing each day if not for the US intervention, is always a grand argument to let the US bask in eternal good light. :rolleyes:

Ein Deutscher']I'm so delighted that we finally have people who are capable of predicting the future from a past that didn't even happen. I guess - anything that works for your argument. And that the world would be a Nazi-infested fortress with trillions of people dieing each day if not for the US intervention, is always a grand argument to let the US bask in eternal good light. :rolleyes:

You're forgetting Russia and the UK.

Just blame Republicans for this.

Just blame Republicans for this.

For what? For a decades old policy? For contracts that were signed before Bush was in office?

why blame republicans? I blame government in general for most of these problems we have

Ein Deutscher']It's not a problem. I guess the US population deserves being sent to Iraq and Afghanistan for Bush's adventures. It's still a highly unethical "rule" in these enlistment papers and it's not like people have a choice to say "no" after they have served their time in the army. Thus this is actually slavery and should be unconstitutional.
Slavery isn't illegal. You can sell yourself into slavery. What is illegal is someone else selling you into slavery. I fail to see how this fits.

Ein Deutscher']Ah thus why there are so many excemptions. These civilians are all ready to go to war for emperor Bush. You wish. US-Army-Apologist number one = Whispering Legs. Or should it say: Festering Legs?
KNOCK IT OFF.

Why don't you comment on your relatives NAZI love affair and following? I'm sure all of the Germans were Nazi Army Apologists.

COOL IT.

This person is an idiot who will bash America till its blue in the face. To bad we won't break. This person is scum on the bottom of my shoe and is worthless.


This, people, is flaming.
WARNED.

Ein Deutscher']The US military has acess to highschools and colleges in the US. It's so embedded into society that they can easily do a draft and the population would not have a say in it. Do you actually think that Bush would care? He's in his last 3 years - he has nothing to lose. :rolleyes:

As a US high school teacher, I call B.S.

Then again, anyone whose country could shovel live children into ovens is probably not too upset about it.

WARNED for Flaming.

Woa momma.. Moderator mass action :p

Ein Deutscher']Woa momma.. Moderator mass action :p


Your quite ignorant. Other countries have stuff like the IRR in the states. Canada being one. I am on a list where if the country declares martial law or we have some sort of huge war etc etc I can be called up as I was in the reverves a few years ago.

You have to sign a contract, its your duty to read the bloody contract before you sign it. :rolleyes: