NationStates Jolt Archive

Britain has only had one commoner as head of state. Oliver Cromwell (actually his son Richard Cromwell as well but we'll glaze over that). The new model army Parlimentarians marched at the head of a huge army, with their characteristic yellow sash, fighting shoulder to shoulder forcing their will on all how they surveyed, the beat the Scot, the Dutch at sea and wiped out half the population of Ireland (I'm only suprised Hollywood haven't got hold over it yet, maybe Americans don't like to see the Irish getting killed). Still After the end of the civil war their remnent formed the Whig Party. When that folded some of its members became Tories others formed the Liberal Party which joined with the SDP to form the much talked about Liberal Democrats, yes the Liberal Democrats, yes the political decendents of Oliver Cromwell appear to be the Lib Dems, the most boring political party in the history of the world, with the possible exception of the aliance of green socialists. They have policies granted but most of them are very small scale or just stupid. I've met loads of people who strongly support them, ask them for a policy of theirs... no idea what so ever. The only policies I know of are

Local income Tax-- Which makes many people pay more, Council tax was fine, no-body complained or rioted until Labour used it as a stealth Tax.

Legalise hash-- they can't because of UN commitments but "would like too" sounds like pandering to the populist view knowing they will never have to pick up the tab.

Disassemble Britain's Nuclear Deterent-- what will we use to kill the french if the world goes arse over tit?

The Euro-- Lets give our power over interest rates to the Bundesbank shall we otto? That won't lead to problems when some nations are in recession and some are not.

No ID cards-- Fair enough personally I don't care.

Equal Pensions for Men and Women-- Satistically Women live long then men so it stands to reason that a women's pension will have to last longer. An EU commity was set up to investigate this and make it "fair". As soon as the feminists found out an equality bill would mean they would have to pay more car insurance the bill was dropped, allegedly.

No war in Iraq-- Your a bit late I sugguest Charles Kennady should read the papers more.

In the recent nationstates pole they had 45 votes nxet to a conservative 25 and a Labour 28. So if you most vote Lib Dem please tell me why!

In the recent nationstates pole they had 45 votes nxet to a conservative 25 and a Labour 28. So if you most vote Lib Dem please tell me why!

I personally believe it's all down to huggability. After all, if you were forced to hug one of the three leaders, Howard, Blair or Kennedy, who would you choose? Obviously Kennedy, that great big loveable ginger teddybear.

I will grant you that but you may need to lure him into range with a bottle of single malt first [ALLEGEDLY]

I personally believe it's all down to huggability. After all, if you were forced to hug one of the three leaders, Howard, Blair or Kennedy, who would you choose? Obviously Kennedy, that great big loveable ginger teddybear.

I'd hug Blair, just because the poor man looks so knackered most of the time. He needs a hug. And look at his wife; not happening there! xD

What was it someone said yesterday.. loveley women but a smile like a machetty wound

Local income Tax-- Which makes many people pay more, Council tax was fine, no-body complained or rioted until Labour used it as a stealth Tax.

the bottom 50% of people will be better off
the middle 20% won't be effected
the top 30% will be worse off. But they can affored it

Legalise hash-- they can't because of UN commitments but "would like too" sounds like pandering to the populist view knowing they will never have to pick up the tab.

Untrue. The lib dems have no intention of legalising it

Disassemble Britain's Nuclear Deterent-- what will we use to kill the French if the world goes arse over tit?

what is the point of using Nuclear Weapons? Because I don't know.

No war in Iraq-- Your a bit late I suggest Charles Kennady should read the papers more.

the war in Iraq is not about the fighting. it is about trust. the fact that people feel lied to. the "war" is more about honesty than the war itself.

In the recent nationstates pole they had 45 votes next to a conservative 25 and a Labour 28. So if you most vote Lib Dem please tell me why!

because most people agree with them.

ps: viset libdems.org.uk (http://libdems.org.uk) to find out about the lib dems policy rather that posting a rant on the internet

Local income Tax-- Which makes many people pay more, Council tax was fine, no-body complained or rioted until Labour used it as a stealth Tax.

The Lib Dems are a socialist-leaning party which means they need more money. Which has to come from the people, if you don't want the idustry to suffer too much.
Also, they plan to make it the sole tax increase, which reassures me. No other party says it'll increase taxes, which is generally an election move. Most administrations rise taxes (the last one has done so rather quietly).
Lastly, it'll only effect earners of over 100k. Although the fairness of variable taxation is debatable, it's a good idea IMO.

Legalise hash-- they can't because of UN commitments but "would like too" sounds like pandering to the populist view knowing they will never have to pick up the tab.

Just as well...

Disassemble Britain's Nuclear Deterent-- what will we use to kill the french if the world goes arse over tit?

Oh no! Losing the ability to destory the world! What will we do? All this extra money... maybe we could save some people instead?

The Euro-- Lets give our power over interest rates to the Bundesbank shall we otto? That won't lead to problems when some nations are in recession and some are not.

Way separate debate, but I consider it cutting though the eurosceptism on Britain and doing something right.

Equal Pensions for Men and Women-- Satistically Women live long then men so it stands to reason that a women's pension will have to last longer. An EU commity was set up to investigate this and make it "fair". As soon as the feminists found out an equality bill would mean they would have to pay more car insurance the bill was dropped, allegedly.

Don't know anything about this. Got any pointers where I can read up on it?

No war in Iraq-- Your a bit late I sugguest Charles Kennady should read the papers more.

They want to withdraw, let the Americans sort their own mess out. Also, the Lim Dems want to assure people that they're not doing this "Bush's servant" thing, and that they will no longer support the American wave of hostility.

You forgot the one about how they are going to let all the asylum seekers in to steal all our jobs.
"AlanBstard", tory? or just like the TV programme?

You forgot the one about how they are going to let all the asylum seekers in to steal all our jobs.
"AlanBstard", tory? or just like the TV programme?

your being very cynical here asylum is a vey important issue and it is never helped by people being hysterical about. Thats another issue from this thread though.

I am a Tory but I think its is always a good idea to be able to laugh at yourself.

I'm an American so I can't vote in this election (or in my own since I'm still 15), but I would rather vote for the Liberal Dems. than the Labour Party because I don't like Tony Blair. He's an ally of Bush and I hate Bush. Tony Blair is just his puppet. And the conservatives, well let's not get started with them. Go Liberal Democrats!

Untrue. The lib dems have no intention of legalising it




I heard a spokesman on TV from that lib dems who said they did so *RASPBERRY*

Also what is the point in nuclear weapons. 15 years ago they were very important now less so, but the world situation may change, who knows. Plus the euro is a very important part of the debate, you can't just dismiss it. Also not agreeing with it is not the same as eurosceptism. I all for good relations with europe but that does not mean following blindly what otherpeoples governments say, I'm not being sceptical, I'm just being sensible and still local income tax will be a pain in the arse "who can afford". Better just lower the tax in first place. Your probably only wase the money what with the amount on experience the Lib dems have. Okay the tories may have made a few blunders in the past but that only means they will be less likley to make them in the future.

Disassemble Britain's Nuclear Deterent-- what will we use to kill the french if the world goes arse over tit?True, but..
Retaining Britain's nuclear deterrent until real progress can be made for the multilateral elimination of nuclear weapons.Source = http://www.libdems.org.uk/conference/agenda.html?id=198&navPage=conferenceagenda.html

Another vitally important point that you all have missed is that the Lib Dems are so dull. Watching parlimentry debates will be like watching countdown. Anti-foxing hunting (best not talk about that all I'll open a whole can of worms) committed to, I don't know, grape fruit, and enough charisma to make John Major look like Casanova. This is true (allegedly according to BBC 4) a few years ago at the party conference they had a press panic because someone nearly braught up the issue of abolishing the monarchy and they only just managed to block it, it was never policy so you won't find it on that website before you try. That fact it came so close sugguests a somthing too me, their bloody republicans (no reference for many american readers)....gumble... grumble....Bastards....

I heard a spokesman on TV from that lib dems who said they did so *RASPBERRY*

As I understand it, there are many within the parliamentary party and the wider party that want it legalised, but AFAIK it is not official party policy.

But I am no expert on the Lib-Dems (to be honest, they are hardly the most exciting party in history. Except for Lembit Opik of course)

Oh, and another thing.The Euro-- Lets give our power over interest rates to the Bundesbank shall we otto? That won't lead to problems when some nations are in recession and some are not.Untrue, the Liberal Democrats would maintain a veto in areas of vital interest to the UK, e.g. defence and tax regulation and budgetary.
Source = http://www.libdems.org.uk/media/documents/policies/19europeandtheeuro.pdf

True, but..
Source = http://www.libdems.org.uk/conference/agenda.html?id=198&navPage=conferenceagenda.html

Why surly the best time to have Nuclear weapons clearly is when no one else does!

Why surly the best time to have Nuclear weapons clearly is when no one else does!Are you just wanting to kill us all?

You have to admit a a debate with Lib Dems is like watching paint dry. Vote communist I would prefer it, at least they use colurful language. (sorry if it looks like I resulting to insults) So far all of you policies seem so short term. You could impliment all the Lib Dem policies in a weekend. What GRAND PLAN do they have for 21st century Britain, more local government?

Are you just wanting to kill us all?

no just blackmail, killing would be bad for the economy

Blah, if I could I would vote Lib Dem (I'm only 15)no just blackmail, killing would be bad for the economyWhat would we be getting blackmailed with?

You have to admit a a debate with Lib Dems is like watching paint dry. Vote communist I would prefer it, at least they use colurful language. (sorry if it looks like I resulting to insults) So far all of you policies seem so short term. You could impliment all the Lib Dem policies in a weekend. What GRAND PLAN do they have for 21st century Britain, more local government?

And compulsory wolly jumper wearing (Yes, I know I'm voting Lib-Dem, but it is only to try and kick Labour off the constituency seat. And form some reason I always identify them with wolly jumpers)

I'm going to vote lib dem, because where i live the conservatives or the lib dems will win the seat. Therefore by voting for lib dem, i will try and keep the conservatives from winning the seat, and so will in effect be voting for Labour.

personal it's the lesser of 3 evils... Blair... no Howard... GOD NO.... Kenardy eh he makes me giggle on have i got news for you..

also i want to go for the most left main party... which is the Lib dems

Hey, Alan, I love the Copy and Pasting that you do, you posted the same thing(Or about the lib dem polocys) on the other Elction thread, and guess what...we told you the truth there as well, and put the same links up...Do you want me to copy and paste it here for you? I case you missed it last time?

Hey, Alan, I love the Copy and Pasting that you do, you posted the same thing(Or about the lib dem polocys) on the other Elction thread, and guess what...we told you the truth there as well, and put the same links up...Do you want me to copy and paste it here for you? I case you missed it last time?

Well no body gave me a statisfactory answer on the previous thread so I though I'd set up this one to investigate further. That's not illegal is it?

You didn't tell the truth either, you never answered the acutual question either when I asked Why vote lib dem it was a retorical question what I wanted you to do was deal with the issues in the first post. Non of them have really been answered, the euro has been dimissed and the nuclear armament thing has just got silly (although that was probably my fault). I would like it if we could discuss the issues rather thn calling each other names, (again probably my fault but It would be nice to stop here). So blaze and tel the the "truth" but I doubt they will be awe inspiring. And don't bother doing that thing where you go down the list quoting "UNTRUE" "FALSE" "REACTIVE TO IODINE" as its been done twice in this thread.

tony and his mates will walk this upcoming election... why? because there is no viable alternative! pure and simple! is that a good or bad thing? well to me its both! yep we pay them more than ever, but the hospitals are improving, busses and trains are improving, the economy is in great shape, and the housing market is fantastic. however they have done as much to damage the public's trust in politicians as the last buch did... at the moment tho they aint dun as much to damage the country... will they? im sure we will have at least another 4 years 2 find out!

Okay I'm resonable guy assuming what you say is true, and that all of it is true,

The euro is a seperate issue- So is irrelevent to the debate apparantly.

The LIb-dems Drug policy- confusion here so I'll just ignore it.

Nuclear disarmament- I disagree with, for real reasons not the stupid ones I put forward early, I'msure the French are a lovely people, public reassurance, detterence etc.

No ID cards- Again I don't care but i suppose its a point.

No war in Iraq- A matter of trust so I take that to mean under no circumstances will the Lib Dems act for Humanitarian intervention. I disagree but I'm sure some will disagree with me using a different choice of words.

Local Income Tax- I say just lower the tax but hey, I think that Local Income Tax smacks of Poll tax only more complecated but hey I can can sort of see where your going with it.

Equal pensions- no one has given an answer should women get the same pension if they have saved the same amount. I wold have thought that some would have jumped to disagree with me but no you seem to have a better grasp of Mathe then I gave you credit for.

So inconclusion the issues have been whittled down to...

ID Cards- No opinion

Humanitarian Inverention- I disagree for valid reasons but if it about solely about trust then, I don't trust them anyway because they have no experience of government.

Nuclear Detterence- I disagree, may they nation with no Nuclear weapons ar not bombed because the countries that have have created a safe international community, or Liberal Empire if your being cynical.

Okay

I've got to agree with AlanB

You can't trust a party whose single policy is 'sit on the fence'.

They commit to absolutely nothing.
As AlanBstard points out they'd create more local government, but they'd also effectively devolve more power to Europe by joining the Euro, and their policies on Iraq and all the resultant problems and solutions (ie ID cards and powers to detain etc) and the nuclear question shows that their policy would be to leave 'international 'problems to others. They are the party that wants other people to do everything for them. As a potential government they seem about as viable as the SNP.

You have to admit a a debate with Lib Dems is like watching paint dry. Vote communist I would prefer it

I reckon you're right. And i think both the Labour and Conservative parties should conspire to erradicate them: i would be so amused if both Labour and Conservative came out asking people to make a real choice and vote for either Tony or Tory - don't sit on the fence.

Just look at what the LibDems have done in Scotland. They formed a collation with Labour and have achieved next to nothing. Why? They got a few minor consessions and thought they'd be seen to be doing something. But you'd be better off giving your vote to a party that will actually achieve something rather than the party of vagueness.


I'm an American so I can't vote in this election (or in my own since I'm still 15), but I would rather vote for the Liberal Dems. than the Labour Party because I don't like Tony Blair. He's an ally of Bush and I hate Bush. Tony Blair is just his puppet. And the conservatives, well let's not get started with them. Go Liberal Democrats!

Whether or not Bush was right with regards to Iraq and whether Blair followed Bush because he genuinely believed it to be the right thing to do or not, with the LibDems they'd still be bouncing up and down on their fence wondering what to do. At times of war and with terrorist threats i'd much prefer to have a leader that will actually do something. As much as Bush and Blair may have made an alleged 'mistake' - it was better than LibDems would have done - their policy would no doubt have been 'wait and see' or 'let someone else decide'. I'm sure that's why Americans re-elected Bush - because at least they knew where he stood - Kerry is quite like the LibDems - criticises the decisions that were made, after they're made, and offers no solutions.

The LibDems are the problem party - they point out all the problems, yet offer no viable solutions. Just look at all their 'big' problems that they make a lot of noise about - it's hardly groundbreaking stuff. The LibDems couldn't cope if they were ever elected as Government, and as an opposition things would be dubious too.

Stand up and be a proper man (or woman) and make a proper decision - Labour or Conservative. Don't sit in the middle - it'll no one anywhere.

I'm an American so I can't vote in this election (or in my own since I'm still 15), but I would rather vote for the Liberal Dems. than the Labour Party because I don't like Tony Blair. He's an ally of Bush and I hate Bush. Tony Blair is just his puppet. And the conservatives, well let's not get started with them. Go Liberal Democrats!


As you grow and mature, hopefully the brainwashing that your teachers are giving you in school about "Bush" and the "Republicans" will not affect your thinking.
Quick lesson in politics: Three branches are Executive, Legislative, and Judicial. The reason for the three branches is so no one branch can have absolute power, nor a single person (i.e., Bush). I would bet your teachers blame everything on Bush.
Believe it or not, the President has NO power other than that given him by the other branches.

Before you form an opinion so early in your life about politics, take a serious look at what each party is for and against; not just what they say they are for or against. Watch C-SPAN(boring!) and take note of how the majority of each party votes for a particular issue.

Maybe you have done this already. I hope so.

I've got to agree with AlanB



Someone agreed with me huzzar!

Oh yeah and in Britain the executive and legelative powers are baiscally the same (in theory so is the Judicial system as it is owned by the crown) except maybe if you count the house of Lords and the house of Commons as leglative and the civil servive as executive but I doubt you could