NationStates Jolt Archive

Your assertion that we agree about rape is not just wrong, but insulting.

Your nauseating views on the subject -- if they are your views, which I doubt --are not worthy of the attention they have recieved here.

You've not even bothered to deny that you are a liar. Which is particularly true if you are from Occitania.

Your alleged views are that of a rapist. Hopefully, you are not and never will be one -- just as hopefully you will never be raped.

I will be ignoring you in the future.I'm sorry I have to remind you but stating that you ignore me publicly is considered flaming. If you ignore me, just do so don't post it.
Anyway I didn't understand your talk about Occitania and I'm not a liar, nor a rapist. I understand that my opinion shocks you and it may take you some time to digest it and come here to talk again. I will happily talk to you again if you decide to do it.

Psylos I find it funny that you constantly accuse everyone of being anti-sex, and then seem to treat sex with as much importance as a handshake.

Am I more anti-sex than you because I think it is a special thing to share with someone you love instead of cheap entertainment to fill in some time when you are bored?

The appropriate punishment for sex crimes is a swift, painful death.
:mad:
Or a slow one preceded by torture for repeat offenders. :mad:

The appropriate punishment for sex crimes is a swift, painful death.
:mad:
Or a slow one preceded by torture for repeat offenders. :mad:

The appropriate punishment for sex crimes is a swift, painful death.
:mad:
Or a slow one preceded by torture for repeat offenders. :mad:One might ask how one becomes a repeat offender when the punishment for the first offence is death? :)

Sorry, but there is non violent rape.

Rape is called rape because it is sex without consent.

Non violent rape simply involves sex without concent, weather it involves threats, drugs or alcohol.

Violent rape is by it's definition violent, non consentual sex.

Ask a date rape victim if her rape compares to women beaten, tied up or half strangled. If they say it is comparable, they really dont know what violent rape is.

Thats because it exists. People who rape a girl who is unconscious from excessive drinking and/or drug use for example. There is no violence involved but there is still rape. Unless you consider sex an act of violence, in which case I feel sorry for you.

I did let my rhetoric run away from me a bit.

I do not believe sex is inherently violent. One can make a convincing case that rape is inherently violent, but I am personally not 100% persuaded of that point of view. My concern, as explained more below, is that distinguishing "violent rape" from "nonviolent rape" usually involves dangerous preconceptions.

I do not deny that each case of rape is different. Unlike many on here, I have agreed with another poster that each rapist is best sentenced individually, rather than by some pre-set, extreme punishment. And LazyHippies is correct that "sex crimes" involve a wide range of offenses beyond rape (although the question has been redefined on here several times to refer to violent rape).

However, there are common myths and misperceptions about rape. Many of this myths shape most people's attempts to distinguish different "types" of rape. (I am not saying either of you necessarily fell into this. I am just explaining my initial reaction to LazyHippies's post, which was shaped in part by the context of the discussion with Psylos who asserted violence itself may be punished but rape is simply theft.)

Anyway, cases of purely non-violent rape are so rare they are practically a myth.

"Date rape," on the other hand, is extremely common and does routinely involve violence.

Although neither of you fall in this category, there have been many on here that have separated "real" rape from "date rape" and "nonviolent rape." That is, unfortunately, a common, but malevolent opinion -- as this article explains: All Rape Is 'Real' Rape (http://www.vachss.com/guest_dispatches/alice_vachss.html)

I apologize for any misunderstanding. I hope I have made myself clear.

One might ask how one becomes a repeat offender when the punishment for the first offence is death?

Well the really stupid or unlicky one's would be caught first time, the clever or lucky bastads would be repeate offenders, no?

Well the really stupid or unlicky one's would be caught first time, the clever or lucky bastads would be repeate offenders, no?Ah. I take that as "multiple offenders"

I thought "Repeat Offender" meant someone who was found guilty a second time for any one type of crime.

I thought "Repeat Offender" meant someone who was found guilty a second time for any one type of crime.

You're probably right. I'm just trying to fit things into nice, ordered boxes again.

[snip]
Anyway, cases of purely non-violent rape are so rare they are practically a myth.
[snip]


I admire your integrity for backing out of a statement admittedly made in haste. However I still want to address your continued insistence that there is no such thing. Have you ever been to a rave? Did you ever see a guy pick up a girl who was so drunk and stoned that she is obviously incapable of consenting to anything and probably wont remember who had sex with her in the morning? This is a very common occurence and is far from being a myth. I have heard of many cases where people have taken advantage of an unconscious or nearly unconscious woman at a party or a rave. You ever see the movie kids? That kinda thing happens all the time. It is not rare and definitely not a myth. There are men who specialize in taking advantage of such situations and seek out women who are obviously too stoned or will be before the night is over.

Did you ever see a guy pick up a girl who was so drunk and stoned that she is obviously incapable of consenting to anything and probably wont remember who had sex with her in the morning? This is a very common occurence and is far from being a myth. I have heard of many cases where people have taken advantage of an unconscious or nearly unconscious woman at a party or a rave. You ever see the movie kids? That kinda thing happens all the time. It is not rare and definitely not a myth.

What a wonderful tale :mad:

Yes it does happen, It's still rape though. Next time these people talk to you, why not try telling them it's rape and unacceptable instead of trying to say it does no harm to the victim?

If people drug raped all felt hunky dorey about it or couldnt remember it, why do we hear so much about it?

Concent is concent. No concent is rape.

Perhaps we should call this oportunistic rape. Or such-a-pathetic-looser-you-had-to-rape-a-helpless-girl-but-it's-ok-she-was-drunk-out-of-her-skull rape?

What a wonderful tale :mad:

Yes it does happen, It's still rape though. Next time these people talk to you, why not try telling them it's rape and unacceptable instead of trying to say it does no harm to the victim?

If people drug raped all felt hunky dorey about it or couldnt remember it, why do we hear so much about it?

Concent is concent. No concent is rape.

Perhaps we should call this oportunistic rape. Or such-a-pathetic-looser-you-had-to-rape-a-helpless-girl-but-it's-ok-she-was-drunk-out-of-her-skull rape?

I didnt say it does not harm the victim. It must be terrible to wake up knowing your body was used but being unable to remember by whom. Always wondering if that guy looking at you was the one who did it. Even worse when it happens in college parties because then you dont know if it was someone you take class with, you dont know if it was someone you know, you dont know if its someone you walk in front of every day and they look at you and remember what they did. It must be terrible, I never claimed it wasnt. Sadly, it is not a myth, thats all I was pointing out.

Psylos I find it funny that you constantly accuse everyone of being anti-sex, and then seem to treat sex with as much importance as a handshake.

Am I more anti-sex than you because I think it is a special thing to share with someone you love instead of cheap entertainment to fill in some time when you are bored?
You have your culture.
I have no problem with that so long as you respect that for some people it is cheap entertainment to fill some time when you are bored and that sex is just sex, whether you give it more importance or not.
Maybe it is something special to you to share with someone you love, but don't think it is something special to everybody and don't push your culture (values and idea of justice) down everyone's throat. I say you should relax and enjoy the things of life but I won't force you.

Psylos I find it funny that you constantly accuse everyone of being anti-sex, and then seem to treat sex with as much importance as a handshake.

Am I more anti-sex than you because I think it is a special thing to share with someone you love instead of cheap entertainment to fill in some time when you are bored?

Perhaps Psylos has never had great sex before.

If anyone is familiar with the Dave Chappelle show on Comedy Central, Dave made a skit where he was in the moment with a woman, but before he would have sex with her he made her sign "The Love Contract"...stating that the sex is consensual..."initial here for oral"..and "initial here for anal" ..funny. The sad truth is that today there are so many scumbag rapist men and lying women that unless there is hard evidence either way in a rape case you just don't know who to believe.Comedy central rocks :D

...the topic is sex crimes. This includes rape as well as consentual sex between a minor and adult, and in some jurisdictions anal or oral intercourse between consenting adults. In Alabama, USA this now includes buying or selling vibrators or other sex toys as well.USA laws are fucked up.

When I created this poll/thread, I meant penalty for crimes such as violent rape and pedophilia.
The term "sex crimes" covers a wide variety of other crimes - I apologize for the confusion.Too late for that...

If anything you should star another POLL...

anything else is water under the Bridge...This Debates already includes all "sex crimes" because you cant edit the title.

Perhaps we have a language barrier -- do you know what "rape" means?
.
the last 200+ post i been reading..tell me that Rape does not mean the same think for all...and it thet the Laws are not the same in all countries...they are not the same even when you cross a satat lane...

Picture this:
a couple having sex on a MobilHome...on the road (soemone else is driving) ...they are legaly fine for the first 10 minutes of the "action"...and the second they cross the state lane...the 18 years old Girl is a Criminal...she is now supossed to go to prisson for rape.

My opinion: Just focus on rehabiliation. Punishment doesn't work; its evil.
Punishement is not evil.

and Punishement is not only meant to discourage other criminals.

All studies indicate that forcible rape is almost NEVER about sex.bull-shiitte

It's from the psychological profile experts at the Federal Bureau of Investigation - they don't base their profiles on religion. They base them on provable psychological evidence. Here, they give their information to this newspaper:

http://www.sacbee.com/static/archive/news/projects/rape/profiles.html
like I said...in my previous post..

I dont get this
"a 16 year old who consents to sex with a 20 year old has still been the victim, legally anyway, of a rape"
She consented so why is it called rapeLooks like these days a lot of things are called Rape...and it depend where you are.

<<see the mobilehome example<<

Perhaps Psylos has never had great sex before.
Perhaps you don't know what sex is since you must have wedding before sex, only to procreate.

Perhaps Psylos has never had great sex before.
it is quite possible to have great sex without being in love. many people don't believe sex is "sacred," but still have happy, healthy sexual relationships. these people also often have loving and intimate romantic lives. recognizing that not all sex is "holy" is just realistic...that's the truth, and it's not necessarily bad.

i'm living proof of this, in fact :).

it is quite possible to have great sex without being in love. many people don't believe sex is "sacred," but still have happy, healthy sexual relationships. these people also often have loving and intimate romantic lives. recognizing that not all sex is "holy" is just realistic...that's the truth, and it's not necessarily bad.

i'm living proof of this, in fact :).
Thank you for your support. Sometimes it is hard to express your views when everybody seems so locked against your style of life.

Thank you for your support. Sometimes it is hard to express your views when everybody seems so locked against your style of life.
personally, i think the notion that sex is "holy" is one of the biggest problems with most people these days. but that's just me...to each their own.

Perhaps you don't know what sex is since you must have wedding before sex, only to procreate.
Hardly. I don't require a wedding, nor do I require procreation.

Anyway, cases of purely non-violent rape are so rare they are practically a myth.

"Date rape," on the other hand, is extremely common and does routinely involve violence..
It would count if Women were forced to drink...
...Have you ever been to a rave? Did you ever see a guy pick up a girl who was so drunk and stoned that she is obviously incapable of consenting to anything and probably wont remember who had sex with her in the morning? This is a very common occurence and is far from being a myth.
....women who are obviously too stoned or will be before the night is over.

You have your culture.
I have no problem with that so long as you respect that for some people it is cheap entertainment to fill some time when you are bored and that sex is just sex, whether you give it more importance or not.
Maybe it is something special to you to share with someone you love, but don't think it is something special to everybody and don't push your culture (values and idea of justice) down everyone's throat. I say you should relax and enjoy the things of life but I won't force you.Lol, don't pull the "I'm tolerant" thing on me.

I don't care what you think about sex. But through the whole thread you've been bashing people about being "anti-sex"

Maybe you should practice what you preach.

And Bottle, for me there is a difference between "special" and "holy." I'm atheist :)