NationStates Jolt Archive

I know a fair ammount about EMP. Basicly it is a shockwave of electromagnetic energy which renders anything using any kind of electronic circut useless. But heres the interesting thing. The human brain and central nervous system are basicly a series of very advanced electrical ciructs, carrying bio-electicty. Would it be therefore possible to develop a form of EMP that disables or kills a human, a neural EMP? This is just a random idea I had piceing things together in my head so it proberbly is completely impossible, but it would be intersting to hear some thoughts.

Damn. This is when I wish I knew more about this.
Grr...

Tazers kind of do that. The sudden jolt of high voltage temporarily scrambles the nervous system. The problem with doing it through an electromagnetic field is that the human body is decent shielding against EMP. It's a conductor, and it's grounded. I think the ammount of microwave energy needed to overcome that shielding would cook a person. Then again, I'm not a biologist or physicist, so I may be way off.

I want to know exactly what an EM pulse is before I have a crack at this one. I mean, is it electrons moving freely? Is it like an expanding B-field? Does it suffer from the inverse square law? etc.

Speaking as a biologist, my first thought on the matter would be that the source of the charge in the human nervous system is the physical sequestration of ions. The body spends an almost stupid amount of its chemical energy on ion pumps that establish an electrochemical gradient across neural membranes. It's kinda like a chemical battery. I don't know if an EMP would affect a system like that.

I'll take a stab at this. The EM pulse such as with nuclear detonations or EM bombs works on electronics because it induces a current in metal conductors. Since humans don't have copper or aluminum nervous systems I don't see how it could work. :confused:

I'll take a stab at this. The EM pulse such as with nuclear detonations or EM bombs works on electronics because it induces a current in metal conductors. Since humans don't have copper or aluminum nervous systems I don't see how it could work. :confused:
We conduct electricity though. Maybe with enough energy the EMP could do it, but I think it would cook us first.

We conduct electricity though. Maybe with enough energy the EMP could do it, but I think it would cook us first.

Well it wouldn't be a death of induced electromotive force I reckon...

Well it wouldn't be a death of induced electromotive force I reckon...
I figgured maybe it would cook a human like a microwaved TV dinner.

I figgured maybe it would cook a human like a microwaved TV dinner.
Yup but it would have to be quite an intense pulse to work over significant distances.

this explains it all http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/ernaehrung/food-smiley-013.gif

I figgured maybe it would cook a human like a microwaved TV dinner.
And we're debating over building something to disable people?!?
Hell, let's build one of these!
:p

I know a fair ammount about EMP. Basicly it is a shockwave of electromagnetic energy which renders anything using any kind of electronic circut useless. But heres the interesting thing. The human brain and central nervous system are basicly a series of very advanced electrical ciructs, carrying bio-electicty. Would it be therefore possible to develop a form of EMP that disables or kills a human, a neural EMP? This is just a random idea I had piceing things together in my head so it proberbly is completely impossible, but it would be intersting to hear some thoughts.

hmm however the elcetrical charge in an EMP is low enough to not kill humans but high enough to disable leccy , its basically a big electromagnet as i understand and an electromagnet doesnt effect your brain as we're not magnetic. so it wouldnt be in my book.

but a direct form of electricity like as in a defribulator obviously kills you

well...and EMP changes metal in general, much like a wave of static electricity moving through the air...the metal in a circut gets charged enough, and it jumps the circut, in essence, it shorts it out. that's pretty much it. it has virtually no effects on a human. and a high levels it would most likely cause a burning sensation from low level microwaves.

it would all depend on intensity and frequency.

The human nervous system has some vulnerable natural frequencies, and if it was intense enough at these then you might get a physiological reaction.

However, I think it is unlikely.

what kind of EMP are you asking about?

from a nuclear explosion, the gamma rays would most likely kill you in the range where the EMP 'might' have an effect

what kind of EMP are you asking about?

from a nuclear explosion, the gamma rays would most likely kill you in the range where the EMP 'might' have an effect
No, I think he meant just the EMP, not the ionizing radiation.

i dont think it would have any effect. as previously said:
1.we are pretty well insulated
2.we have a low metal content and the metals in us aren't responsible for nerve impulses in a direct fashion.

also ive seen various animals suspended by intense electro magnetism (enough to allign the atoms of the body and repel them) and they didnt seem to show any ill affects and even moved during the process.

http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/ernaehrung/food-smiley-013.gif
Omg ROFLMAO!

i dont think it would have any effect. as previously said:
1.we are pretty well insulated
2.we have a low metal content and the metals in us aren't responsible for nerve impulses in a direct fashion.


I know normal EMP wouldnt work, what I am asking is could it somehow be modified to work or do something to humans?

36. Anti-personnel application. HPM and EMP weapons can have a range of effects when directed against personnel. The electromagnetic weapons used in the US armed forces’ Vehicle Mounted Active Denial System, penetrate the skin causing water molecules to vibrate, producing heat and discomfort.33 HPMs on the other hand are capable of doing extensive damage to humans.
This includes the scrambling of brain waves, blurring of vision, nausea, vomiting, muscle spasms and uncontrolled body movement.34 The extent of damage will be governed by the range at which the weapon is applied. Although the effects are largely temporary—death can occur if HPMs are applied from a short distance.

Taken from here (http://www.defence.gov.au/adc/Publication/ASC/Geddes%20Papers%202003/09%20Air-delivered_Squ%20Leader%20Coles.pdf)

That HPM sounds like the pain beam (http://people.howstuffworks.com/pain-beam.htm).

That HPM sounds like the pain beam (http://people.howstuffworks.com/pain-beam.htm).

yeah, that's the one.

(HPM just stands for High-powered microwave)