NationStates Jolt Archive

Okay, I'm sure most of you have met HerPower...and if not, well, you're missing out because she's AWESOME! If by awesome you mean great at making feminists look like man-hating nutjobs. So please...you real feminists, the ones who want gender equity...yes, you men too can be feminists, please come in here and discuss this issue rationally. Let's clear the air and get things out in the open. Femi-nazis are the extreme and the minority. Let's not let them ruin it for us all!

Yes, this is what we need. I'm in Sinuhue. :)

I don't think gender equality is the answer. We need to work for full and complete equality. For everyone, regardless of age, creed, colour, beliefs, sex, or gender.

dont know what to say other than i agree with what Sinuhue said

but it should go further, everyone should be equal regardless of anything

Okay, I'm sure most of you have met HerPower...and if not, well, you're missing out because she's AWESOME! If by awesome you mean great at making feminists look like man-hating nutjobs.

HerPower? - she sure ain't no Valerie Solanas.

Is she hot? Does she have anything against giving oral sex?

Why do feminists hate to give head, but appreciate the favor themselves?

I need to know.

Real feminists, time for some damage control!

By what standard is HerPower not a 'real feminist', as seems to be implied by your title?

Yes, all people should be equal. Period.

NEXT!

By what standard is HerPower not a 'real feminist', as seems to be implied by your title?

by being a troll

She did have some interesting ideas about quotas to get equal representation in government. HEAR ME OUT! (to those who are already frothing at the mouth at the idea). In Rwanda, they reserved a certain number of seats for women and are the first country to have near equal representation. Now, that hasn't solved world hunger or even made Rwanda a better place, but it has given women the chance in a particularly oppressive nation to have a real political voice. Now it's up to women to maintain their positions by doing a good job. I'm not really sure how I feel about the idea here in the west (where we still don't have even near equal represenation), but it might be a start in some of the more repressive nations. Then again, maybe women puppets will be put in power to back Shari'a and such...

Still, progress is being made in some countries, while things are going backwards in others. What can we do about that?

I don't think gender equality is the answer. We need to work for full and complete equality. For everyone, regardless of age, creed, colour, beliefs, sex, or gender.
:)

I like the late Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King's comment "that they may be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character". Let's apply that to sex as well.

Yes, this is what we need. I'm in Sinuhue. :)

And while we're at it, I need to learn not to snigger at the second sentence here.

I like the late Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King's comment "that they may be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character". Let's apply that to sex as well.


"that they may be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their sex"?

Is she hot? Does she have anything against giving oral sex?

Why do feminists hate to give head, but appreciate the favor themselves?

I need to know.
Don't stereotype here...there is nothing in feminism that says oral sex is bad...or good...or whatever. Feminism isn't about oral sex unless it's for EQUAL oral sex:)

She did have some interesting ideas about quotas to get equal representation in government. HEAR ME OUT! (to those who are already frothing at the mouth at the idea). In Rwanda, they reserved a certain number of seats for women and are the first country to have near equal representation. Now, that hasn't solved world hunger or even made Rwanda a better place, but it has given women the chance in a particularly oppressive nation to have a real political voice. Now it's up to women to maintain their positions by doing a good job. I'm not really sure how I feel about the idea here in the west (where we still don't have even near equal represenation), but it might be a start in some of the more repressive nations. Then again, maybe women puppets will be put in power to back Shari'a and such...

Still, progress is being made in some countries, while things are going backwards in others. What can we do about that?

we have some parliament seats that can only be contested by women for one of the parties.

What do we get?

less democratic choice and SERIOUSLY patronised women.

They get no respect in the houses of parliament, because they only got there by being female

Yes, everyone should be equal. Now let's rejoice in our feminism. Feminism's weak! Right, HerPower?

EDIT: I'm proud of feminism. Just trying to show HerPower that I won't stop being proud of it because it's "weak". :)

By what standard is HerPower not a 'real feminist', as seems to be implied by your title?
Well, I'm going on the hunch that she's a troll for one...possibly even a man disguised as a rabid feminist. I could be out to lunch though and maybe she's for real. If she is, she still isn't a feminist because she is not for gender equity, she is for imposing another wrong to right a wrong. Which just don't work in my books:) She is creating a lot of resentment towards feminists, and perpetuating a stereotype that we want men on the bottom (which is actually nice, but outside of the bedroom, not really a good goal:)).

Yes, all people should be equal. Period.

NEXT!
Should be, but aren't. So, what do we do to fix that?

And while we're at it, I need to learn not to snigger at the second sentence here.
Damn, now I'm sniggering!

Yes, this is what we need. I'm in Sinuhue.
And while we're at it, I need to learn not to snigger at the second sentence here.

I laugh.

Should be, but aren't. So, what do we do to fix that?

better education at lower levels.


Quotas don't fix inequality, they treat the symptoms.

Damn, now I'm sniggering!

Phew, at least I'm not the only one with an overly perverted mind here.

Don't stereotype here...there is nothing in feminism that says oral sex is bad...or good...or whatever. Feminism isn't about oral sex unless it's for EQUAL oral sex:)
I'm sorry. I just think feminism has done some good, but also some bad to our society.
Here's my rules for dealing with women and feminists:
When dating a woman, open the door and pay for everything.

With feminists, let her open the door, and split the costs or let her pay for everything.

Sometimes feminists can be good company, especially if you're low on cash. :p

we have some parliament seats that can only be contested by women for one of the parties.

What do we get?

less democratic choice and SERIOUSLY patronised women.

They get no respect in the houses of parliament, because they only got there by being female
That is the risk, for sure. However, what else can we do to get more women in politics? (seriously, I'm asking for solutions here). Plenty of women are political, but are sidelined by male candidates unless no male candidate can be found. Then again, I'm not really a fan of our democracy anyway...representative democracy is a crock. Maybe we need to focus on getting women into REAL positions of decision making at the lower levels (municipal and so on) first....

With feminists, let her open the door, and split the costs or let her pay for everything.

You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that only women can be feminists.

You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that only women can be feminists.
Oh boy. When I hear a guy say he's a feminist, I hear "guy who likes to screw feminists". :rolleyes:

better education at lower levels.


Quotas don't fix inequality, they treat the symptoms.
True...I've seen that in the North where they have quotas for aboriginal employment...it doesn't make aboriginals more trained or better qualified, just more hired...and fired.

It'd be nice to see more emphasis from employers on recruiting women. Encouraging girls to train to enter the trades as instrumentation mechanics or whatever would be good...there are plenty of those positions that don't take brute strength. More men in education would be nice too...it's turning into an almost all female profession, and I think kids need good role models of all genders.

I'm sorry. I just think feminism has done some good, but also some bad to our society.
Here's my rules for dealing with women and feminists:
When dating a woman, open the door and pay for everything.

With feminists, let her open the door, and split the costs or let her pay for everything.

Sometimes feminists can be good company, especially if you're low on cash. :pWell, what bad things has feminism done? I mean, HerPower is annoying, but she's not setting public policy, so....

That is the risk, for sure. However, what else can we do to get more women in politics? (seriously, I'm asking for solutions here). Plenty of women are political, but are sidelined by male candidates unless no male candidate can be found. Then again, I'm not really a fan of our democracy anyway...representative democracy is a crock. Maybe we need to focus on getting women into REAL positions of decision making at the lower levels (municipal and so on) first....

stop the local parties from choosing their candidates. You need to look at grass roots. WHO is only voting for men? Is it the party members? Are they all men? If so, you need to make the party appeal to women.

You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that only women can be feminists.
Thanks for bringing that up. We need men to be in on this gender equity thing too! Unfortunately because of the connotations, most don't like being called feminists:(

A woman's place is in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant...

Clinton for President 2008! :D

A woman's place is in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant...

Yes, they are second class citizens. They shall have no land and no vote.

Thanks for bringing that up. We need men to be in on this gender equity thing too! Unfortunately because of the connotations, most don't like being called feminists:(

I prefer the title Equal Rights Campaigner.

stop the local parties from choosing their candidates. You need to look at grass roots. WHO is only voting for men? Is it the party members? Are they all men? If so, you need to make the party appeal to women.
Good point. It IS the parties, for the most part putting in male candidates. The voters aren't even getting to choose. I guess more women need to start becoming party members and voting.

I prefer the title Equal Rights Campaigner.

good point, that's less sexist.

Thanks for bringing that up. We need men to be in on this gender equity thing too!
do i count?

A woman's place is in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant...
Hi troll...back again to bless us with your flamerisms?

Originally posted by McLeod03
I need to learn not to snigger at the second sentence here.

Oh? Just what are we trying to imply?

Clinton for President 2008! :D
See, Hillary is the perfect example of why women aren't necessarily better candidates...she is a cool cucumber..very calculating...I see another Thatcher...

do i count?


sure you do :)

True...I've seen that in the North where they have quotas for aboriginal employment...it doesn't make aboriginals more trained or better qualified, just more hired...and fired.

It'd be nice to see more emphasis from employers on recruiting women. Encouraging girls to train to enter the trades as instrumentation mechanics or whatever would be good...there are plenty of those positions that don't take brute strength. More men in education would be nice too...it's turning into an almost all female profession, and I think kids need good role models of all genders.
Is anyone here aware that most universities and graduate schools are suffering from an inequality of the sexes?
Turns out the number of young men entering college has been dropping for the past decade.
Our future is going to involve more women than men in the educated workplace.

What are you guys whining about?

The problem here has been that the women of age to be in powerful positions missed the boat. They were raised to be housewives. They had families at a young age.
They were from a different generation than you.


Check your numbers, maybe you'll be able to discern the obvious trends emerging in our society. It's not anti-woman, I assure you.

Oh? Just what are we trying to imply?

Me? Nothing, was just showing my own immaturity when reading the phrase "I'm in Sinuhue"

do i count?
I knew I'd slip up even though I'm trying to include more than two genders...

Yes, ALL genders are needed to work for gender equity:)

sure you do :)
well ok, but only until i change the whole male thing...

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO FEMINAZIS!

hehe

Thanks for bringing that up. We need men to be in on this gender equity thing too! Unfortunately because of the connotations, most don't like being called feminists:(

No, I'm comfortable with being Dad.

Having raised a daughter, and tried to get her to do things regardless of gender roles, is more challenging than you know.

The worst part is fighting the social patterns of adolescents at school. Want to get her to stay in math and computers? She'll have to live with the class being largely composed of guys who are social outcasts - which by definition makes her a... social outcast.

Tell her not to worry about it... yeah, that works...

It was easy to get her interested in some things - shooting in particular.

But it's not the school that discourages her from doing the math, science, and computers - it's the social venue. The teachers are very encouraging. So are the guys in the classes - but not everyone else in the school.

A lot of this oppression seems to be brought on by what the media sells. Young girls are sold on the idea that they're supposed to be good looking, popular, etc. - things that have nothing to do with how successful you're going to be unless you plan on being a hooker. And so many young girls have bought this idea, that they pressure each other mercilessly.

It's hard to fight.

I knew I'd slip up even though I'm trying to include more than two genders...

Yes, ALL genders are needed to work for gender equity:)
woohoo :)

Me? Nothing, was just showing my own immaturity when reading the phrase "I'm in Sinuhue"

No worries Mac...I giggled out loud, and wished I had beaten you to the punch.

Allow me to be a man, stand tall, and say: "I'm a feminist!"

Yeah boyyeee!

(Crushes coke can on head)

Yeah...that may have been a little odd. Anyway, I am in complete support of gender equality, and allowing both an equal chance to succeed in life. But there are those who take it too far, in the case of extremists, whom I LOATHE.

Also, people need to be realistic.

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO FEMINAZIS!

hehe

Ah, nothing like reasoned and constructive debate.

Me? Nothing, was just showing my own immaturity when reading the phrase "I'm in Sinuhue"

That's just wrong. I'm a girl! :mad:

Clinton for President 2008! :D

Actually, my dream matchup for the 2008 U.S. Presidential race would be Hillary Clinton vs. Condaleeza Rice. And that scenario ain't far-fetched by any stretch of the imagination.

That's just wrong. I'm a girl! :mad:

That is no bar to penetrative activity.

That's just wrong. I'm a girl! :mad:

It's so wrong that's its just right.

good point, that's less sexist.
I don't know...feminism sounds sexist because it started out by campaigning for women, but equal rights campaigner is too broad. You can be for equality for everyone, but gender needs to be addressed specifially too. Often equal rights (let's say, ending Apartheid for example) are achieved, but the position of women is not adequately addressed, nor are the gender roles of men dealt with. Gender roles are damaging to all genders. We need to deal with them just as specifically as we deal with racism. Or rather, we need to deal with gender issues WITHIN each specific issue. Racism, from a feminist persective for example. That means, you look at how people are treated by racism, and you see how the different genders are better or worse off than the group as a whole.

No, I'm comfortable with being Dad.

Having raised a daughter, and tried to get her to do things regardless of gender roles, is more challenging than you know.

The worst part is fighting the social patterns of adolescents at school. Want to get her to stay in math and computers? She'll have to live with the class being largely composed of guys who are social outcasts - which by definition makes her a... social outcast.

Tell her not to worry about it... yeah, that works...

It was easy to get her interested in some things - shooting in particular.

But it's not the school that discourages her from doing the math, science, and computers - it's the social venue. The teachers are very encouraging. So are the guys in the classes - but not everyone else in the school.

A lot of this oppression seems to be brought on by what the media sells. Young girls are sold on the idea that they're supposed to be good looking, popular, etc. - things that have nothing to do with how successful you're going to be unless you plan on being a hooker. And so many young girls have bought this idea, that they pressure each other mercilessly.

It's hard to fight.
Wow, you sound like an observant father. Now if only most of those other kids had parents that knew what the hell was going on in their daughter's lives, then maybe most of them wouldn't be going to schoold dressing and acting like stupid, spoiled sluts.

I applaud your concern.

EDIT: I wonder, too, how many of those girls would sell you their wardrobe and attitude with a "female empowerment" speech.
How do the real feminists feel about this?

I don't know...feminism sounds sexist because it started out by campaigning for women, but equal rights campaigner is too broad. You can be for equality for everyone, but gender needs to be addressed specifially too. Often equal rights (let's say, ending Apartheid for example) are achieved, but the position of women is not adequately addressed, nor are the gender roles of men dealt with. Gender roles are damaging to all genders. We need to deal with them just as specifically as we deal with racism. Or rather, we need to deal with gender issues WITHIN each specific issue. Racism, from a feminist persective for example. That means, you look at how people are treated by racism, and you see how the different genders are better or worse off than the group as a whole.

feminism is about empowering women. The word is not a call for equity, it is not an equal word.

Is anyone here aware that most universities and graduate schools are suffering from an inequality of the sexes?
Turns out the number of young men entering college has been dropping for the past decade.
Our future is going to involve more women than men in the educated workplace.

What are you guys whining about?

The problem here has been that the women of age to be in powerful positions missed the boat. They were raised to be housewives. They had families at a young age.
They were from a different generation than you.


Check your numbers, maybe you'll be able to discern the obvious trends emerging in our society. It's not anti-woman, I assure you.
Hey now, calm down. I for one am not 'whining'. Plus we can't just look at our society...not when so many women are still in very inferior positions around the world. Feminism is not just about improving things for western women (and men, and other genders), it's about gender equity EVERYWHERE. Yes, there is a problem with boy's gender roles too...they are forced into damaging stereotypes as well, and that also has to be dealt with. We need more men in teaching. We need them in child care. We need them to feel free to express themselves and not worry if they aren't seen as 'masculine' enough.

Okay, I'm sure most of you have met HerPower...and if not, well, you're missing out because she's AWESOME! If by awesome you mean great at making feminists look like man-hating nutjobs. So please...you real feminists, the ones who want gender equity...yes, you men too can be feminists, please come in here and discuss this issue rationally. Let's clear the air and get things out in the open. Femi-nazis are the extreme and the minority. Let's not let them ruin it for us all!
You are a womyn of my taste! Go, Grrl! :D

No, I'm comfortable with being Dad.

Having raised a daughter, and tried to get her to do things regardless of gender roles, is more challenging than you know.

The worst part is fighting the social patterns of adolescents at school. Want to get her to stay in math and computers? She'll have to live with the class being largely composed of guys who are social outcasts - which by definition makes her a... social outcast.

Tell her not to worry about it... yeah, that works...

It was easy to get her interested in some things - shooting in particular.

But it's not the school that discourages her from doing the math, science, and computers - it's the social venue. The teachers are very encouraging. So are the guys in the classes - but not everyone else in the school.

A lot of this oppression seems to be brought on by what the media sells. Young girls are sold on the idea that they're supposed to be good looking, popular, etc. - things that have nothing to do with how successful you're going to be unless you plan on being a hooker. And so many young girls have bought this idea, that they pressure each other mercilessly.

It's hard to fight.

So are you saying that a major reason that women are not achieving as much in the workplace as men is...teenage girls?

So are you saying that a major reason that women are not achieving as much in the workplace as men is...teenage girls?

I actually understood it as being the media / peer pressure, not teenage girls.

A woman's place is in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant...

while she runs her fortune 500 company from home.

So are you saying that a major reason that women are not achieving as much in the workplace as men is...teenage girls?
I heard "personal values of today's youth, tomorrow's future" where you only heard the dumbed-down, "teenage girls".

His whole point went right over your hat. :rolleyes:

So are you saying that a major reason that women are not achieving as much in the workplace as men is...teenage girls?

The media and society brainwash teenage girls into oppressing each other.

If you aren't achieving academically, you have no chance later in the workplace.

Want an engineer? A scientist? You need to start young.

Kill that in the nursery, and there are fewer women trying for those jobs.

No, I'm comfortable with being Dad.

Having raised a daughter, and tried to get her to do things regardless of gender roles, is more challenging than you know.

The worst part is fighting the social patterns of adolescents at school. Want to get her to stay in math and computers? She'll have to live with the class being largely composed of guys who are social outcasts - which by definition makes her a... social outcast.

Tell her not to worry about it... yeah, that works...

It was easy to get her interested in some things - shooting in particular.

But it's not the school that discourages her from doing the math, science, and computers - it's the social venue. The teachers are very encouraging. So are the guys in the classes - but not everyone else in the school.

A lot of this oppression seems to be brought on by what the media sells. Young girls are sold on the idea that they're supposed to be good looking, popular, etc. - things that have nothing to do with how successful you're going to be unless you plan on being a hooker. And so many young girls have bought this idea, that they pressure each other mercilessly.

It's hard to fight.
it's absolutely hard to fight. Kids want to belong and there are clear social guidelines about how you 'belong' depending on your gender. That's why laws won't do it alone...attitudes are what need changing and they are the toughest things to deal with. We can all do our part with our own children, and hope for the best, and we can also keep very aware of harmful gender stereotypes and TALK about them. That's how we're going to change things...being aware of the problems, and trying however we can to counteract them. Good role models needed...apply here:)

I like the late Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King's comment "that they may be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character". Let's apply that to sex as well.

"that they may be judged not by the color of their organs, but by the content of their character."

:)

That's just wrong. I'm a girl! :mad:
Doesn't make it impossible honey...one of the joys of living in a country that doesn't look into your bedroom...

Doesn't make it impossible honey...one of the joys of living in a country that doesn't look into your bedroom...

Really?

*Plans trip to Canada*

Damn, people are posting in this thread at the speed of light!

Anyway, I think I've been a feminist or possibly even a feminazi since about 2nd grade. I can't help it. I can't imagine it any other way.

I think the gender quotas thing is a load of crap and a terrible idea. It's incredibly patronizing and I'm disgusted by the thought. We should fight for our rightful positions in the workplace, politics, etcetera. and force people to GET USED TO IT!

Let's all ignore Ryes. He's an idiot.

I do believe that women should have the same rights as men, but I believe certain jobs should only be reserved for males. These include police, fire, military, and the like.

The one major problem I have with feminists is that they have pussified men. I mean for the love of pete, it's just stupid. Men who are alpha males (yours truely, and guys like him) (http://products.priceclash.co.uk/images/nodrop/180/B000002NFI/the-very-best-of-frank-sinatra.jpg) are condemned by feminists for being chauvanistic. It always makes me pig-bitting mad when men give into feminism. I wanted to vomit everytime I saw Clinton crying on tv. It was pathetic.

Men and women are different, physically and emotionally, and we should not have to try to merge the two sexes together in some unnatural way.

EDIT: I wonder, too, how many of those girls would sell you their wardrobe and attitude with a "female empowerment" speech.
How do the real feminists feel about this?
It all depends, and it's a tricky issue. Are women dressing in a provocative manner just to be accepted? Are they doing it because they enjoy enhancing their appearence, for THEIR sake? And let me tell ya...women check each other out all the time, and I have to admit that I dress more for the women than the men...it's a petty competition thing and I resist it...but sometimes I give in....

Then again, other times I dress up just for me, to feel good, not to be 'accepted' or ogled, but to look nice, feel nice and make a night special.

Kids shouldn't be forced into 'sexy' outfits, expecially when their sexual identities and identities period are so confused...again, it's a tough issue.

feminism is about empowering women. The word is not a call for equity, it is not an equal word.
Sigh, here we go again. Here's the definition for you:

Main Entry: fem·i·nism
Function: noun
1 : the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes
2 : organized activity on behalf of women's rights and interests

It started out as just a women's issue, but has spread to include ALL genders. Empowering women was the main focus at first, but it has shifted to include the gender roles of men and others.

You are a womyn of my taste! Go, Grrl! :D
Hush you, before I take out my dictionary...

Sigh, here we go again. Here's the definition for you:


It started out as just a women's issue, but has spread to include ALL genders. Empowering women was the main focus at first, but it has shifted to include the gender roles of men and others.

it's an unnecessarily sexist word

Damn, people are posting in this thread at the speed of light!

Anyway, I think I've been a feminist or possibly even a feminazi since about 2nd grade. I can't help it. I can't imagine it any other way.

I think the gender quotas thing is a load of crap and a terrible idea. It's incredibly patronizing and I'm disgusted by the thought. We should fight for our rightful positions in the workplace, politics, etcetera. and force people to GET USED TO IT!

Let's all ignore Ryes. He's an idiot.
What you've just described is feminism. You are not a feminazi...HerPower fits that bill nicely though.

while she runs her fortune 500 company from home.
LOL

I do believe that women should have the same rights as men, but I believe certain jobs should only be reserved for males. These include police, fire, military, and the like.

The one major problem I have with feminists is that they have pussified men. I mean for the love of pete, it's just stupid. Men who are alpha males (yours truely, and guys like him) (http://products.priceclash.co.uk/images/nodrop/180/B000002NFI/the-very-best-of-frank-sinatra.jpg) are condemned by feminists for being chauvanistic. It always makes me pig-bitting mad when men give into feminism. I wanted to vomit everytime I saw Clinton crying on tv. It was pathetic.

Men and women are different, physically and emotionally, and we should not have to try to merge the two sexes together in some unnatural way.
I know a woman who has been a paramedic and a firefighter, (I can't remember which she is currently) and she does her job extremely well, while managing to take care of her adorable little under-two-year-old.

I agree that men and women are different, but women have all the capabilities (in the workplace) as men, if not more. Nobody, as far as I know, is trying to "merge the two sexes together".

I do believe that women should have the same rights as men, but I believe certain jobs should only be reserved for males. These include police, fire, military, and the like.

The one major problem I have with feminists is that they have pussified men. I mean for the love of pete, it's just stupid. Men who are alpha males (yours truely, and guys like him) (http://products.priceclash.co.uk/images/nodrop/180/B000002NFI/the-very-best-of-frank-sinatra.jpg) are condemned by feminists for being chauvanistic. It always makes me pig-bitting mad when men give into feminism. I wanted to vomit everytime I saw Clinton crying on tv. It was pathetic.

Men and women are different, physically and emotionally, and we should not have to try to merge the two sexes together in some unnatural way.
Welcome Johnny, thanks for bringing us a fresh breath of sexism:)

Not all men are alpha males...it made you sick to see Clinton cry? Men shouldn't cry? They are 'pussified'? This is part of the problem...men are being forced into macho stereotypes...sleep around, be agressive, work like a dog, repress your feelings...it isn't good for them. I for one don't want sons to think they have to be like that. If they are, good for them, but let ye fear the wrath of the mother if you try to FORCE my boys to be like that...

Hush you, before I take out my dictionary...
*Gets out geek glasses* Womyn is another spelling, considered a less sexist variation.

it's an unnecessarily sexist word
I for one am not willing to change it (or change woman to womyn). It started out with the empancipation of women, but it has evolved. The name may be a bit inaccurate, but we are all thinking adults who can see past the limitations of our language (hopefully). So a feminist I remain, and that will never mean I am pro-woman, anti-other genders.

I do believe that women should have the same rights as men, but I believe certain jobs should only be reserved for males. These include police, fire, military, and the like.

The one major problem I have with feminists is that they have pussified men. I mean for the love of pete, it's just stupid. Men who are alpha males (yours truely, and guys like him) are condemned by feminists for being chauvanistic. It always makes me pig-bitting mad when men give into feminism. I wanted to vomit everytime I saw Clinton crying on tv. It was pathetic.

Men and women are different, physically and emotionally, and we should not have to try to merge the two sexes together in some unnatural way.

screw you man, a firewoman/firewomyn/firefighter/fireperson put out our fire yesterday.

Hey, I'm all for this feminist lark. And fair play to any woman who stands up and demands her equal share. But, my fragile male ego wonders if, in evolutionary terms, this is the begining of the end? Is the male gender becoming obsolete?

*Gets out geek glasses* Womyn is another spelling, considered a less sexist variation.
:confused: How is it less sexist than "women"?

I for one am not willing to change it (or change woman to womyn). It started out with the empancipation of women, but it has evolved. The name may be a bit inaccurate, but we are all thinking adults who can see past the limitations of our language (hopefully). So a feminist I remain, and that will never mean I am pro-woman, anti-other genders.

there is no label for people who don't discriminate, they are people.

Those who DO are chauvinists/racists/sexist etc

feminism is, and always will be, about making women equal to men

:confused: How is it less sexist than "women"?
You must have missed HerPower...I'm sure you'll see her around though:) She has enlightened us to new terms like:

womyn
grrl
shi
herstory

there is no label for people who don't discriminate, they are people.

Those who DO are chauvinists/racists/sexist etc

feminism is, and always will be, about making women equal to men
That's your take on it, and you're welcome to it. But don't try to tell me what I can call myself.

The media and society brainwash teenage girls into oppressing each other.

Yes, very much so.

If you aren't achieving academically, you have no chance later in the workplace.

No argument there, at least as a general rule.

Want an engineer? A scientist? You need to start young.

Kill that in the nursery, and there are fewer women trying for those jobs.

Which leads us to a rather un-PC question: how much of this because of outside influences (parenting, peers, media) and how much are the choices to go after "softer" occupations influenced by simple natural tendencies? And what does it say about our society that these fields where women tend to flock to are devalued enough to make them less rewarding income-wise?

:confused: How is it less sexist than "women"?
Becuz a lot of women/womyn don't like the fact that the word "woman" seems to have a root in the word "man", or that the word female's base word seems to be "male".

Interesting fact I just had to share: the word "male" in Latin is an adverb meaning "insufficiently" or "badly"

Doesn't make it impossible honey...one of the joys of living in a country that doesn't look into your bedroom...

Oh, gosh! Must you have said that? Now I have bad images in my mind. What's worse is I'm in them! :mad:

That's your take on it, and you're welcome to it. But don't try to tell me what I can call myself.

feel free. But so long as people label themselves to make themselves distinct, there will be discrimination.

Oh, gosh! Must you have said that? Now I have bad images in my mind. What's worse is I'm in them! :mad:
A homophobic feminist. Now I'm heard everything. :rolleyes:

Which leads us to a rather un-PC question: how much of this because of outside influences (parenting, peers, media) and how much are the choices to go after "softer" occupations influenced by simple natural tendencies? And what does it say about our society that these fields where women tend to flock to are devalued enough to make them less rewarding income-wise?
Good point. I went into teaching because I love it...but also because it's kind of family tradition among the females of my family. I never even considered carpentry until recently, even though I LOVE working with wood, and am actually quite good at it. Some women will want those 'soft' jobs still...but they shouldn't be so underpaid. Physical work is not always worth more than 'brain' work...cripes, look at what janitors get paid, and that can be a damn physical job. But it still seems that most of the 'female' jobs are low paying, or low-opportunity jobs. I think outside influences play a larger role, but natural tendencies can't be ignored. I don't think, however, that there is much proof that women prefer (naturally) certain positions over others...

1) I'm a guy. A guy who grew up riding horses, chopping wood, building houses, and breaking things. A straight guy who loves a good roll in the hay with a gal or three.

2) I'm a feminist. I believe that men and women (And hermaphrodites and whatnot) should have exactly equal opportunity with nothing being altered for or against them based on their genes. Anyone who is ready, willing, and able, should be treated as such. No dumbing things down, no making exceptions, no quotas. Just equal opportunity.

3) The earlier comment on men becoming 'pussified' is an ass one. Men are allowed to cry. Only a spineless coward won't cry at a loved one's funeral to show how manyly they are. People who have overly-strong gendered behavior also tend to have psychological problems. This tends to suggest that being a manly man or a womanly woman is something of a mental illness brought on by culture. Kind of like what Brittany Spears does to people's brains. Its not healthy. Now, men can be strong. Men can even bask in having more upper body strength. Doesn't mean you have to be a prick. I have some decent strength, as well. I can fight. I can kill people if I truly have to. I much prefer, however, using my muscles to scoop up lady friends so I can twirl them around and make them dizzy, or to give them piggy back rides, or to pin them against walls like they get off on.

Becuz a lot of women/womyn don't like the fact that the word "woman" seems to have a root in the word "man", or that the word female's base word seems to be "male".


I wouldn't say most women...I'd say a fringe group.

I support gender neutral language...police officer, judge, doctor, flight attendant...they aren't too weird, and are easy to use.

feel free. But so long as people label themselves to make themselves distinct, there will be discrimination.
That's BS. We could all of us call ourselves GROMPS and there would still be discrimination.

We can't all be the same. In fact this is a crazy aim. We are not all the same. Women and men have different biological agendas, different physical abilities and different mental wiring.

In this case, equality is the wrong aim. Tolerance of all differences would be a much more laudable goal.

Welcome Johnny, thanks for bringing us a fresh berath of sexism:)

Not all men are alpha males...it made you sick to see Clinton cry? Men shouldn't cry? They are 'pussified'? This is part of the problem...men are being forced into macho stereotypes...sleep around, be agressive, work like a dog, repress your feelings...it isn't good for them. I for one don't want sons to think they have to be like that. If they are, good for them, but let ye fear the wrath of the mother if you try to FORCE my boys to be like that...

Real men should be able to hold their emotions in check. The only crying that should be done is with a bottle of bourbon in a dimly lit room. Good things to cry over:death of a loved one, friend, dog, truck, car, and having your son make you proud in the state high school football championship.

Well, I always question the sexual orientation of "men" who claim to be "in touch with their fem side". A man should be a man, and should act like a man. Being an alpha male doesn't mean you follow the macho stereotype. It's that you are a real man, and are in touch with your true masculinity. Alpha males don't always sleep around, in fact many are true to their partner. Males are born aggresive, it is perfectly natural, ever hear of testosterone? Hard work (working like a dog) is an excellent character trait. In the media of today men ARE being forced into the feminist idea. Heck, it goes on in our public schools on a daily basis, and in our college campus'!

That's BS. We could all of us call ourselves GROMPS and there would still be discrimination.
But we could have some good Dr.Suess-like stories...

I wouldn't say most women...I'd say a fringe group.

I support gender neutral language...police officer, judge, doctor, flight attendant...they aren't too weird, and are easy to use.
You haven't ever (not even at a much younger age) been at least a bit upset about it? Haven't ever mentioned it to a (female or male) friend before?

We can't all be the same. In fact this is a crazy aim. We are not all the same. Women and men have different biological agendas, different physical abilities and different mental wiring.

In this case, equality is the wrong aim. Tolerance of all differences would be a much more laudable goal.
Equity=fair
Equal=same

We often say equal, but we really mean equity. Not the same...no one, not even HerPower (I'd bet) wants women and men to be the same. Just have equal opportunities and equity. Just because I'm a feminist doesn't mean I ignore other inequalities. I happen to be a Native feminist...but always a human first.

I know a woman who has been a paramedic and a firefighter, (I can't remember which she is currently) and she does her job extremely well, while managing to take care of her adorable little under-two-year-old.

I agree that men and women are different, but women have all the capabilities (in the workplace) as men, if not more. Nobody, as far as I know, is trying to "merge the two sexes together".


She may be a good mother and all, but I wouldn't want her on my squad while rushing into a building engulfed in flames. You think a woman is going to have the strength to carry a 250 lb man out of a building.

I guess you haven't heard of the studies that show womens brains perform less then mens, which is one of the reasons they don't succeed in science and math!

I don't think gender equality is the answer. We need to work for full and complete equality. For everyone, regardless of age, creed, colour, beliefs, sex, or gender.

I would have to disagree with that. Belief is something that we should judge people on! I quote someone quoting someone:

I like the late Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King's comment "that they may be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character". Let's apply that to sex as well.

You haven't ever (not even at a much younger age) been at least a bit upset about it? Haven't ever mentioned it to a (female or male) friend before?
Mentioned what? I think we've misread each other's quotes....I said a fringe group want to change women to womyn...

If you mean upset about having men in women (hahahaha...pun not really intended, but there it is), then yes, a little. But I can live with it. I prefer to change things like mankind and say humans or humanity. Use words that exist. Say, "Your students should complete their exam" instead of "your student should complete his exam" and so on...

A homophobic feminist. Now I'm heard everything. :rolleyes:

I'm not homophobic. I have no problems with gay people. However, I'm heterosexual, not bisexual.

I guess you haven't heard of the studies that show womens brains perform less then mens, which is one of the reasons they don't succeed in science and math!
Whatever Johnny...Servus Dei and VoteEarly can dredge up studies showing that non-whites are less intelligent too...doesn't make it true.

That's BS. We could all of us call ourselves GROMPS and there would still be discrimination.

I'm for equality under the law at birth (ie not religious equality or ideological equality). Does that make me a feminist?

No.

It just means I'm not an arse.

Real men should be able to hold their emotions in check. The only crying that should be done is with a bottle of bourbon in a dimly lit room. Good things to cry over:death of a loved one, friend, dog, truck, car, and having your son make you proud in the state high school football championship.

Well, I always question the sexual orientation of "men" who claim to be "in touch with their fem side". A man should be a man, and should act like a man. Being an alpha male doesn't mean you follow the macho stereotype. It's that you are a real man, and are in touch with your true masculinity. Alpha males don't always sleep around, in fact many are true to their partner. Males are born aggresive, it is perfectly natural, ever hear of testosterone? Hard work (working like a dog) is an excellent character trait. In the media of today men ARE being forced into the feminist idea. Heck, it goes on in our public schools on a daily basis, and in our college campus'!


You know, John, there's such a thing as being a dick. I'm sure you've heard of that before. You don't have to act like a dipshit to be a man. And what you listed above is just that.

Being pressured to hold emotions in is disturbing to me. It's happened the better part of 17 years of my life, and it's getting old. You shouldn't have to act like a doorknob to be a "man".

I'm for equality under the law at birth (ie not religious equality or ideological equality). Does that make me a feminist?

No.

It just means I'm not an arse.
I'm for it to. Does that mean I'm NOT a feminist? No it just means I realise that as much as we WANT this equality, it doesn't exist yet, and that means we have to work towards it, not wish it into existence.

She may be a good mother and all, but I wouldn't want her on my squad while rushing into a building engulfed in flames. You think a woman is going to have the strength to carry a 250 lb man out of a building.

I guess you haven't heard of the studies that show womens brains perform less then mens, which is one of the reasons they don't succeed in science and math!

Some -can-, and those are the ones that should be allowed in.

I do agree however that they shouldn't make exceptions for gender in regards to requirements. Gender equality does not equal gender bias.

I do agree however that they shouldn't make exceptions for gender in regards to requirements. Gender equality does not equal gender bias.
Thank you. Exactly.

She may be a good mother and all, but I wouldn't want her on my squad while rushing into a building engulfed in flames. You think a woman is going to have the strength to carry a 250 lb man out of a building.

I guess you haven't heard of the studies that show womens brains perform less then mens, which is one of the reasons they don't succeed in science and math!
All together now: BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUULL...SHIIIIIIIIIIIT!
I have always recieved A's and B's in math AND science and plan to enter a field heavy on mathematical skill.

I'm for it to. Does that mean I'm NOT a feminist? No it just means I realise that as much as we WANT this equality, it doesn't exist yet, and that means we have to work towards it, not wish it into existence.

no, but feminism is quite a specific word

feminism

• noun the advocacy of women’s rights on the grounds of sexual equality.

(OED)

I don't see the need to separate women's rights from ethnic minority rights or men's rights.

I'm not homophobic. I have no problems with gay people. However, I'm heterosexual, not bisexual.
Still, your comments were most likely offending to many individuals, and they did sound extremely homophobic. You can be hetero and not say "Girls screwing girls? Yucky!" (EDIT: I don't mean that as though it is a direct quote from you, BTW.)

Real masculine, huh?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40166000/jpg/_40166693_ap200comfort.jpg

An unfortunate side affect of this Equity is the tendency toward sameness. Men are becoming more ‘in touch with their feminine side’. The media constantly shows the ‘New’ man. A previous thread (Why Shave) discussed why women must do what men don’t (none facial shaving I guess). There is a danger that when we see men rewarded for occupations that they do best we dismiss them as Macho or anti-feminist OR when we congratulate women on achievements that they do best men (and feminists) are seen as demeaning.

Let’s just celebrate the differences and variety that nature has bestowed upon us and tolerate the differences.

Once voting and employment opportunities are equal, the market will decide the worth of individual roles.

Still, your comments were most likely offending to many individuals, and they did sound extremely homophobic. You can be hetero and not say "Girls screwing girls? Yucky!"

I find anal sex 'yucky' am am free to say so. But it doesn't mean I want to stop anyone else doing it.

Real masculine, huh?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40166000/jpg/_40166693_ap200comfort.jpg

you're an arse, troll

Becuz a lot of women/womyn don't like the fact that the word "woman" seems to have a root in the word "man", or that the word female's base word seems to be "male".

Interesting fact I just had to share: the word "male" in Latin is an adverb meaning "insufficiently" or "badly"
Ahh, ignorance of etymology. Tell them they have nothing to fear, "woman" is actually an empowering word. It is from the Indo-European "ghwbh" (which incidentally means thread-weave). Wo-man is the progenitor of man, the womb of man. She is a "root" in the basic sense of the word; a foundation from which something grows. I think these people should take pride in the word rather than trying to alter it into something meaningless.

Real masculine, huh?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40166000/jpg/_40166693_ap200comfort.jpg

Awww... that's cute. :D He's kinda cute. :p


I like a guy who's not afraid to shed a few tears now and then. ;)

Real masculine, huh?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40166000/jpg/_40166693_ap200comfort.jpg

Yup. Next question.

no, but feminism is quite a specific word

feminism

• noun the advocacy of women’s rights on the grounds of sexual equality.

(OED)

I don't see the need to separate women's rights from ethnic minority rights or men's rights.
Okay, I'll give you a reason why it SHOULD be. Just one, 'cuz I really should do some work here, after all my grandmother fought hard so I could have a job:)

When you are dealing with racism, you have to realise that a woman within that minority has different status than a man. Let's say in this culture that is being discriminated against, the women are not allowed to go to school, have jobs, or leave the house without their husband's permission. That cultural group as a whole has less power than the majority culture, but the WOMEN within it have less power than the men. If you don't address that fact, you are only dealing with one issue...racism. You aren't dealing with the gender imbalances.

Too many programs to relieve poverty, racism or whatever, do NOT address the fundamental inequalities in gender roles. That is why feminism is a sort of lens through which to see these issues. You have to look at the issue of racism through the lens of gender to see the bigger picture.

Okay, I'll give you a reason why it SHOULD be. Just one, 'cuz I really should do some work here, after all my grandmother fought hard so I could have a job:)

When you are dealing with racism, you have to realise that a woman within that minority has different status than a man. Let's say in this culture that is being discriminated against, the women are not allowed to go to school, have jobs, or leave the house without their husband's permission. That cultural group as a whole has less power than the majority culture, but the WOMEN within it have less power than the men. If you don't address that fact, you are only dealing with one issue...racism. You aren't dealing with the gender imbalances.

Too many programs to relieve poverty, racism or whatever, do NOT address the fundamental inequalities in gender roles. That is why feminism is a sort of lens through which to see these issues. You have to look at the issue of racism through the lens of gender to see the bigger picture.

no, because feminism is just feminism. It doesn't represent black people, or white people, or men, who are oppressed.

Ergo it is sexist.

I find anal sex 'yucky' am am free to say so. But it doesn't mean I want to stop anyone else doing it.

Exactly. I have no problems with having sex or other people having sex. Yet I still don't want to be apart of the act. I have no problems with homosexual people. Just because I don't want to have sex with a woman, Zotona, doesn't mean I find something wrong it.

I find anal sex 'yucky' am am free to say so. But it doesn't mean I want to stop anyone else doing it.


You should try it with a man with a very small dick.

Real masculine, huh?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40166000/jpg/_40166693_ap200comfort.jpg

Yep.

Real men aren't afraid to show their emotions. Only cowards who feel that showing emotion will make them vulnerable do. And you notice how supportive the other guy is? He, too, is a real man. Being there for his buddy when he needs it. Letting him get it out in a healthy way.

I cry, sometimes entirely on purpose, because I need to get it out. I don't need booze for it, either (another crutch for weak people).

An unfortunate side affect of this Equity is the tendency toward sameness. Men are becoming more ‘in touch with their feminine side’. The media constantly shows the ‘New’ man. A previous thread (Why Shave) discussed why women must do what men don’t (none facial shaving I guess). There is a danger that when we see men rewarded for occupations that they do best we dismiss them as Macho or anti-feminist OR when we congratulate women on achievements that they do best men (and feminists) are seen as demeaning.

Let’s just celebrate the differences and variety that nature has bestowed upon us and tolerate the differences.

Once voting and employment opportunities are equal, the market will decide the worth of individual roles.
Every movement has 'side effects'...(like HerPower). That isn't a reason to scrap them. The civil rights movement in the US had the side effect of spawning some racist black groups, but overall it was a positive movement.

Not sameness. Not women becoming men (well, in some cases:)). The dissolution of gender roles. Women shouldn't feel bad if they aren't 'maternal'. Men shouldn't feel bad if they aren't 'macho'. That IS celebrating differences. People are people and their genitalia shouldn't dictate how they act in public or what jobs they take. We don't want a reversal of gender roles (women acting more masculine and men acting more feminine). We want to free people from those roles, and let them take up the roles THEY want.

no, because feminism is just feminism. It doesn't represent black people, or white people, or men, who are oppressed.

Ergo it is sexist.
Again, that's YOUR definition. I've already provided you with one that includes gender equity period. You choose to see it as sexist, despite the fact that nothing I have said is sexist. Again, this is your right, but I say feminism is one thing, you say it is another, and never the twain shall meet. 'A rose by any other name would still smell as sweet'.Let the subject drop.

Again, that's YOUR definition. I've already provided you with one that includes gender equity period. You choose to see it as sexist, despite the fact that nothing I have said is sexist. Again, this is your right, but I say feminism is one thing, you say it is another, and never the twain shall meet. 'A rose by any other name would still smell as sweet'.Let the subject drop.

no, that's the DICTIONARY definition.

YOU choose to see it as some sort of all encompassing equality word.

But it is not.

You know, John, there's such a thing as being a dick. I'm sure you've heard of that before. You don't have to act like a dipshit to be a man. And what you listed above is just that.

Being pressured to hold emotions in is disturbing to me. It's happened the better part of 17 years of my life, and it's getting old. You shouldn't have to act like a doorknob to be a "man".

How does anything I typed make me a dipshit. It is my honest opinion. You have your own opinions. I believe that men should act a certain way, as should women. Our brains are wired differently. Call me old fashioned, but that was good enough for thousands of years.

Why is it disturbing? I care not to see a man blubbering away in public. Go to the bathroom and do it. Same with women and breast feeding. It's not my fault you couldn't be in control of your emotions when in public, it's a negative character trait on your part, and you need to work on it. Real men can cry with their wives and mothers when in private. It is also ok to cry in war with your brothers in arms.

you're an arse, troll

Coward!

Women are free to take up whatever roles they wish. That arguement has been won. Where does the inequality exist today? It exists in women not taking certain roles to the same degree as men and vice versa. Let the market decide. Don't enforce quotas or push to change what are natural career selections by people. Trying to arbitrarily engineer society to appear equal is not the same as allowing equal opportunity and letting people make their own choices.

no, that's the DICTIONARY definition.

YOU choose to see it as some sort of all encompassing equality word.

But it is not.
Last time I'm goint to address this, because it's really not that important.

http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=feminism

There is a dictionary definition, the one I gave you before. YOUR dictionary doesn't have that same definition? Well, woohoo for diversity, because this one does. That's celebrating difference, it is :D

Always nice knowing that us male feminisists are sexist.

The reason feminism is called feminism and not 'gender equalism' is because women are the primary target these days. If it was the hermaphrodites being oppressed in massive numbers, we'd all become hermanists.

Guess what: The instant gender equality exists, we can all cease to be any sort of ist.

How does anything I typed make me a dipshit. It is my honest opinion. You have your own opinions. I believe that men should act a certain way, as should women. Our brains are wired differently. Call me old fashioned, but that was good enough for thousands of years.

Why is it disturbing? I care not to see a man blubbering away in public. Go to the bathroom and do it. Same with women and breast feeding. It's not my fault you couldn't be in control of your emotions when in public, it's a negative character trait on your part, and you need to work on it. Real men can cry with their wives and mothers when in private. It is also ok to cry in war with your brothers in arms.
Johnny isn't a dipshit. He's a sexist:) The two are not necessarily the same. He's got some good in him though...he's just afraid to show it for fear of being 'pussified'.

You know I luv ya, despite your faults.... :D

Coward!

You sir, are an idiot.

Last time I'm goint to address this, because it's really not that important.

http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=feminism

There is a dictionary definition, the one I gave you before. YOUR dictionary doesn't have that same definition? Well, woohoo for diversity, because this one does. That's celebrating difference, it is :D

meh, mines the Oxford English Dictionary.

A PROPER dictionary.

Yep.

Real men aren't afraid to show their emotions. Only cowards who feel that showing emotion will make them vulnerable do. And you notice how supportive the other guy is? He, too, is a real man. Being there for his buddy when he needs it. Letting him get it out in a healthy way.

I cry, sometimes entirely on purpose, because I need to get it out. I don't need booze for it, either (another crutch for weak people).

Only cowards let the tears flow at the drop of a hat. Those "men" in that picture are Arabs, they are generally cowardly in the first place. I don't need booze to cry over a loss in private, but the bourbon helps the tears come out.

Women are free to take up whatever roles they wish. That arguement has been won. Where does the inequality exist today? It exists in women not taking certain roles to the same degree as men and vice versa. Let the market decide. Don't enforce quotas or push to change what are natural career selections by people. Trying to arbitrarily engineer society to appear equal is not the same as allowing equal opportunity and letting people make their own choices.
Wow...have you really never left your own country, because let me tell ya...the things we take for granted here are shocking innovations to be feared in many a nation...

The battle is not won when the majority of women in the world are still considered chattel. Cripes, I used a HerPower word...SHOOT ME NOW BEFORE IT SAY WOMY....*ack*

meh, mines the Oxford English Dictionary.

A PROPER dictionary.
:D !!!!!!!!!

Real men can cry with their wives and mothers when in private. It is also ok to cry in war with your brothers in arms.


"For these two men, seeing the body of a dead family member was clearly too much to bear." (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_pictures/3724949.stm)

However, crying when you see the dismembered body of one of your family blown apart by missiles is unacceptable?

You sir, are an idiot.

Takes one to know one, pole-smoker!

Hey, where are all the other feminists? This is turning into a Johnny Wad thread...HELP! Get us back on track!

Hey, where are all the other feminists? This is turning into a Johnny Wad thread...HELP! Get us back on track!

don't feed the troll and he will go back under his bridge

Those "men" in that picture are Arabs, they are generally cowardly in the first place.

Evidence?

"For these two men, seeing the body of a dead family member was clearly too much to bear." (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_pictures/3724949.stm)

However, crying when you see the dismembered body of one of your family blown apart by missiles is unacceptable?

Yes it is. You are a man, you are supposed to be the rock that gives strength to others. Cry all you want when you are in your own home with your wife.

I have visited 6 of the worlds continents and have friends in many countries and from many religions. Your sense of outrage at the plight of women in other counties merely makes you alienist.

Just how much do you know if their way of life or social standing, I wonder.

Only cowards let the tears flow at the drop of a hat. Those "men" in that picture are Arabs, they are generally cowardly in the first place. I don't need booze to cry over a loss in private, but the bourbon helps the tears come out.

Stop sodomizing the strawman.

Crying at 'the drop of a hat' is silly for both genders. Extremes are always unhealthy. Crying at the loss of a loved one, or because you're massively frustrated and need to let out the steam, on the other hand, is fine and dandy.

Oh, by the by, booze helps get one's inhibitions out. Just means you've been wanting to cry for a long long time, but have been hiding it. Hiding, as usual, is a cowardly act. Wuss.

Let’s see… thanks to the feminists who came before me I can:

go to school
own land
vote
work in the job of my own choosing
decide if and when I want to get married or not
decide if and when I want to have kids or not
choose to be a working mom, or a stay at home mom
initiate a divorce
press charges if I’m raped
wear pants in public
get credit in my own name

There are other women in the world who do not have those choices. That’s why I’m a feminist. The ability of men to cry or not has nothing to do with it.

Johnny, I'm going to ask you not to hijack this thread...though you are bringing up valid issues of expected male gender roles, I think this is turning more into a potential flamefest. Please cease.

don't feed the troll and he will go back under his bridge

Grab a piece of your fat, and slide off!


Enlightened Humanity, your name is kind of sissyboyish, don't ya think?

Yes it is. You are a man, you are supposed to be the rock that gives strength to others. Cry all you want when you are in your own home with your wife.

I -am- the rock around those I care about. But my strength is unrelated to my gender, and it does not prevent me from crying. You can cry without going in to the fetal position.

Grab a piece of your fat, and slide off!


Enlightened Humanity, your name is kind of sissyboyish, don't ya think?

Hey John?

You've been asked NICELY to cease and desist your flaming...please do so.

Evidence?


What do you need?

Like how they have to be high on meth before they can attack us?

How they brainwash kids to be suicide bombers?

Or how they are so easily killed?

Yes it is. You are a man, you are supposed to be the rock that gives strength to others. Cry all you want when you are in your own home with your wife.
I tire of debating about gender roles when obviously my opponent will not let up even when evidence of his own ignorance is right in front of his nose.

Let’s see… thanks to the feminists who came before me I can:

go to school
own land
vote
work in the job of my own choosing
decide if and when I want to get married or not
decide if and when I want to have kids or not
choose to be a working mom, or a stay at home mom
initiate a divorce
press charges if I’m raped
wear pants in public
get credit in my own name

There are other women in the world who do not have those choices. That’s why I’m a feminist. The ability of men to cry or not has nothing to do with it.

Feminists did stirling work. But there are other issues now and they all must be addressed.

I have visited 6 of the worlds continents and have friends in many countries and from many religions. Your sense of outrage at the plight of women in other counties merely makes you alienist.

Just how much do you know if their way of life or social standing, I wonder.
Can you possibly be serious? The battle is won? In all your travels you can seriously sit here and say that?

Stop sodomizing the strawman.

frustrated and need to let out the steam, on the other hand, is fine and dandy.

Oh, by the by, booze helps get one's inhibitions out. Just means you've been wanting to cry for a long long time, but have been hiding it. Hiding, as usual, is a cowardly act. Wuss.


That first part show you are a sissy. Do you munch the pillow as well?

Booze is a depressent, it makes you low, it helps bring up the tears. Acting like a wuss in public is a cowardly act. Would you stand there and cry when some gunman starts blasting away in a public place, or would you jump into action and stop them? Coward!

A woman's place is in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant...
Oh hey, you again!

Feminists did stirling work. But there are other issues now and they all must be addressed.

Feminists do sterling work.

What other issues do you give more importance to?

That first part show you are a sissy. Do you munch the pillow as well?

Booze is a depressent, it makes you low, it helps bring up the tears. Acting like a wuss in public is a cowardly act. Would you stand there and cry when some gunman starts blasting away in a public place, or would you jump into action and stop them? Coward!

Alright, lets try you.

A depressed man, drunk on bourbon, runs over your entire family, maiming them all, then drives off. How do you react? Knowing you are utterly alone, with no one left who cares about you, and knowing that everyone you cared about is dead.

Feminists do sterling work.

What other issues do you give more importance to?

I give equal importance to ethnic minorities being under-represented, and to men being discriminated against.

Why define yourself as only out to help women?

1) I've stood up to over a dozen larger assailants before. If that's a wuss, well, gee, sorry I didn't fight a dragon.

2) Being able to cry without hiding doesn't mean crying when you need to break things. Women should be just as ready to beat the snot out of an opponent before crying over machine-gunned loved ones. Timing is important to tears, hiding, however, isn't.

3) Again, stop sodomizing strawmen.

I give equal importance to ethnic minorities being under-represented, and to men being discriminated against.

Why define yourself as only out to help women?

1) Half of the problem with most cultures is that they're stuck in ancient modes. Getting half of their population to advance towards equality leads to changes in that culture, and makes them more readily identified with by the rest of the cultures who have gone foreward

2) Who said ONLY?

Feminists did stirling work. But there are other issues now and they all must be addressed.
Here is where we need to continue working. Some stats for you:

57 million young men and 96 million young women aged 15-24 in developing countries still cannot read or write. About 90 countries are on track to meet global goals for ending gender inequality in primary education by 2015. But for the rest there is still a long way to go.

• 79 million girls who would otherwise be expected to be alive are ‘missing’ from various populations, mostly in Asia, as a result of sex-selective abortions, infanticide or neglect.

• At least 130 million women have undergone female genital mutilation or cutting; another 2 million are at risk each year.

• Nearly half-a-million women a year still die from complications relating to pregnancy. Most of these are in the poorer countries – for every woman who dies in the North, 99 will die in the South. Many millions more experience complications that can lead to permanent ill-health or disability. The tragedy is that nearly all this is preventable.


The world still needs gender equity.

That first part show you are a sissy. Do you munch the pillow as well?

Booze is a depressent, it makes you low, it helps bring up the tears. Acting like a wuss in public is a cowardly act. Would you stand there and cry when some gunman starts blasting away in a public place, or would you jump into action and stop them? Coward!

6'3".
200 lbs.
11 years boxing, 4 years kick-boxing.
Stabbed once (barfight), broken nose twice (barfights), busted knuckle (street fight)

I cry on a regular basis. You got a problem with that, little man?

I give equal importance to ethnic minorities being under-represented, and to men being discriminated against.

Why define yourself as only out to help women?

I agree that those are both very important issues. I didn't think that calling myself a feminist limited me to one issue. I can be a feminist, and an environmentalist, and work to end oppression and discrimination, all at the same time, no?

I give equal importance to ethnic minorities being under-represented, and to men being discriminated against.

Why define yourself as only out to help women?
Again, this is YOUR definition. Accept that we are working from a different one than you, and our problems are cleared up. If you continue to argue semantics, you do nothing to further this discussion. For the purposes of this thread, unless otherwise stated, feminism is working for gender equity. That does not mean one is a feminist ONLY. Desist.

Johnny, I'll ask you once more to take your discussion elsewhere before I report you to the mods (dum, dum dum...ominous music playing). No, but seriously, you're sidetracking the main issue and you're riling people up on purpose. Please knock it off.

*echoing* hello...hello...hello...

Without the potential flaming, the thread dies? *long face*

Why do feminists hate to give head, but appreciate the favor themselves?

I need to know.
I like to give head.

At any rate, taht herpower person is annoying. And she is exactly the kind of idiot who gives the rest of us a bad name, damnit.

I like to give head.

At any rate, taht herpower person is annoying. And she is exactly the kind of idiot who gives the rest of us a bad name, damnit.
No, our parents give us bad names. Well, not me. :D

No, our parents give us bad names. Well, not me. :D
hehehehhee

6'3".
200 lbs.
11 years boxing, 4 years kick-boxing.
Stabbed once (barfight), broken nose twice (barfights), busted knuckle (street fight)

I cry on a regular basis. You got a problem with that, little man?

Sure is easy to say you are whatever you want to be on the internet, eh?

BTW I'm 6'7"
260lbs
12 yrs NFL, 5 yrs UFC (3 championship titles)
Never stabbed, shot 15 times (combat), busted hands (jeet kune do battle)

I don't cry on a regular basis. You do have a problem, little buddy!

Sure is easy to say you are whatever you want to be on the internet, eh?

BTW I'm 6'7"
260lbs
12 yrs NFL, 5 yrs UFC (3 championship titles)
Never stabbed, shot 15 times (combat), busted hands (jeet kune do battle)

I don't cry on a regular basis. You do have a problem, little buddy!
how can you be 6'7" if you dont have any legs? :confused:

Alright, lets try you.

A depressed man, drunk on bourbon, runs over your entire family, maiming them all, then drives off. How do you react? Knowing you are utterly alone, with no one left who cares about you, and knowing that everyone you cared about is dead.

I grab my keys, and find this scumbag. I then exact my vengenace on his entire family, or whomever I could find! Then when I am satisfied, I'll find a new wife.

how can you be 6'7" if you dont have any legs? :confused:

Exactly!

how can you be 6'7" if you dont have any legs? :confused:

He's THAT big.

He's THAT big.

Damn straight mofo!!

I'm a dude, but I believe in equality for all. I hate Feminazi's(people who believe Women are superior to men).

I'm a dude, but I believe in equality for all. I hate Feminazi's(people who believe Women are superior to men).
Fantastic...so how do we get that equality/equity? (don't just think in your own country either...think globally...)

how can you be 6'7" if you dont have any legs? :confused:

a Marge Simpson hair-do.

You all should be ashamed of yourselfs. Wadd is a veteran, an athlete, and a American hero. Just cause you Nancy-boys don't recognize or respect backbone in a man, doesn't mean you should try to tear him down. Not that you're really up to the task. Your idea of a fight seems to involve pillows and crotchless teddies. Boo-hoo.

Fantastic...so how do we get that equality/equity? (don't just think in your own country either...thing globally...)
The only thing we can do is fight our way through industries that are considered to be male dominated. For instance, I plan to become a video game programmer. The more women that are hired in these industries, the more people in general will have to accept the fact that women are just as skilled as men, at least to that extent, and the more gender equality just becomes... standard, expected.

The only thing we can do is fight our way through industries that are considered to be male dominated. For instance, I plan to become a video game programmer. The more women that are hired in these industries, the more people in general will have to accept the fact that women are just as skilled as men, at least to that extent, and the more gender equality just becomes... standard, expected.
The issue isn't employment alone...what about division of labour in the home? What about wider problems of sexual exploitation and oppression in ALL aspects of women's lives in certain countries and cultures?

Though for us in the West, employment and politics are the next big hurdle since we've progressed in other areas...how can we help women elsewhere (let's not start a 'war on sexism' please...a war to STOP oppression? bah)

Fantastic...so how do we get that equality/equity? (don't just think in your own country either...think globally...)

equality of education. Everyone does the same subjects and the same work up to teenage. Then they can choose what to do after that.

Equal pay for equal work.

Less power in the hands of institutions that are sexist/racist/nosist.

And elimating sexism. ALL sexism. That includes cheaper car insurance for women, and man-bashing on tv and adverts as well as tart-parades like Miss World.

And just be aware that if you use 'feminist' to any Brits (other, possibly, than 'feminists') they will understand it as WOMEN'S rights, not gender rights.

Because we speak English. Not that horrible regional dialect American.

I am new here, just joined today. Personally as a guy, I support feminism, I have nothing to fear from it. If I had a daughter, I would want her to have every opportunity, fulfill every dream, and most mainstream feminists work for that. And you don’t have to be a feminist to support human rights issues like gender equality. I have been a campaigner against the trafficking of women for sexual slavery for a few years. I have never thought of it as a feminist issue, although in many ways it is, but a basic human rights issue.

The only thing we can do is fight our way through industries that are considered to be male dominated. For instance, I plan to become a video game programmer. The more women that are hired in these industries, the more people in general will have to accept the fact that women are just as skilled as men, at least to that extent, and the more gender equality just becomes... standard, expected.

Watch out, games programming is under a lot of economic pressure right now. Make sure you get with one of the big companies, a lot of small ones are going under.

equality of education. Everyone does the same subjects and the same work up to teenage. Then they can choose what to do after that.

Equal pay for equal work.

Less power in the hands of institutions that are sexist/racist/nosist.

And elimating sexism. ALL sexism. That includes cheaper car insurance for women, and man-bashing on tv and adverts as well as tart-parades like Miss World.

And just be aware that if you use 'feminist' to any Brits (other, possibly, than 'feminists') they will understand it as WOMEN'S rights, not gender rights.

Because we speak English. Not that horrible regional dialect American.
I was with you 'till the end. I'm a damn Canadian, thanks, and you bloody Brits don't OWN the language.

Okay, good goals. Now how do they get achieved. Here, AND abroad?

For example, how do we address the issue of equal education, when most women in the world don't have access to education at all?

You all should be ashamed of yourselfs. Wadd is a veteran, an athlete, and a American hero. Just cause you Nancy-boys don't recognize or respect backbone in a man, doesn't mean you should try to tear him down. Not that you're really up to the task. Your idea of a fight seems to involve pillows and crotchless teddies. Boo-hoo.

Now THAT would be a great fight!

Everyone freaks out over every issue.

I support the equality of everyone, because none of us or lesser than the other. But I don't support the bashing of the Nazi Femis because well there national beliefes are Facist. I think that we all need a realization that were all different through character, but that does NOT make us another race. Everyone is too air headed to realize were all HUMANS. But apparently, that realization won't come if oh you are prettier then another, or you have a bigger something, or you think you do lol. And equality is just not going to come, same thing with peace.

" Man is too afraid to leave there barbaric practices of war, for they fear what will come next. "
~Joseph Michael Liberator, aka Pyschotika. ( Someone may have said something like this before, but I just woke up one day and started making quotes, and this one came to me. I am NOT coppying anyone if they have a quote like this. )

Anyways, I wish that those who do make fun of others or bash them because of color, sex, mind state, beliefe, etc would just wake up and realize that there accomplishing nothing other then the destruction of one's sane self respect.

" Take away Oxygen, you kill the body.

Take away Self-Respect, you kill the spirit. "

~ I can't remember the name of the guy who made this quote.

Anyways, this is basically my 2 cents on equality and peace.

I was with you 'till the end. I'm a damn Canadian, thanks, and you bloody Brits don't OWN the language.

Okay, good goals. Now how do they get achieved. Here, AND abroad?

For example, how do we address the issue of equal education, when most women in the world don't have access to education at all?

[conceited patriotism]it's our language, that's why it's called ENGLISH[/conceited patriotism]

politics - Look at politcal party membership. Are they all men? Why are they voting for male represnetitives?

Education - aid. Aid to schools, aid to families. And education for families (as in 'Your daughter could be a Doctor'). If we run free schools, and maybe pay the family (so the children aren't sent to work) then those children get educated and their prejudices are reduced, thus helping change their society.

You all should be ashamed of yourselfs. Wadd is a veteran, an athlete, and a American hero. Just cause you Nancy-boys don't recognize or respect backbone in a man, doesn't mean you should try to tear him down. Not that you're really up to the task. Your idea of a fight seems to involve pillows and crotchless teddies. Boo-hoo.

Amen brother!

You should get banned from NS if you attempt to insult the great man, and the legend in his own time!


I think America lost it's backbone in the damn 70's. Damn you Gloria Steinman!! :headbang:

BTW Guess which one is the feminist:

#1 (http://www.dickandthechicks.com/images/ugly.jpg)

#2 (http://www.yenra.com/brooke-burke-bikini/brooke-burke-bikini.jpg)

Sigh, this isn't as fun without HerPower to argue with (or at...she didn't really answer much...)...

I guess it's off to work for me:(

Fantastic...so how do we get that equality/equity? (don't just think in your own country either...thing globally...)

A few steps:

Public re-education:

Yes, we will educate the people in racial tolerence.

Take-down racist/sexist regimes:

Certain countries just scream inequality(Saudi Arabia, for example). They need to be taken care of.

Financial Support:

A lot of minority groups can't afford college, a living, etc. We can ( at least partially ) pay for those things. But they have to work for the government/military for a certain amount of years.( I'm not Socialist, here! I like my individuality!)

Culture Preservation:

While we need to boost inter-culture relations, we need to keep individuality. We need to inform people of their cultures and their heritage, so the whole world isn't just turned into one place where everyone is the same.

[conceited patriotism]it's our language, that's why it's called ENGLISH[/conceited patriotism]


Thanks for the tags...they allow me to remain reasonable:)

lol #2 looks like Michael Jackson's face pasted on the body.....

The second one?

Whoa missed some posts. The second picture linked by Mr. Wadd is the feminist.

lol #2 looks like Michael Jackson's face pasted on the body.....


Are you joking? Brooke Burke is one of the foxiest sex kittens these days! ;)

The answer is #1.

The reason: Good looking chicks don't need to be feminists to get what they want or need! ;)

iLock pending Moderator review.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446488&postcount=83
screw you man, a firewoman/firewomyn/firefighter/fireperson put out our fire yesterday.
You might want to calm down a bit.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446628&postcount=103
I guess you haven't heard of the studies that show womens brains perform less then mens, which is one of the reasons they don't succeed in science and math!
You might want to provide links to these studies or articles about the studies. Just making a statement like that without linking a source looks like trolling.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446884&postcount=139
Only cowards let the tears flow at the drop of a hat. Those "men" in that picture are Arabs, they are generally cowardly in the first place. I don't need booze to cry over a loss in private, but the bourbon helps the tears come out.
Johnny Wadd: Official Warning - Trolling.


http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8447017&postcount=159
That first part show you are a sissy. Do you munch the pillow as well?

Booze is a depressent, it makes you low, it helps bring up the tears. Acting like a wuss in public is a cowardly act. Would you stand there and cry when some gunman starts blasting away in a public place, or would you jump into action and stop them? Coward!

Johnny Wadd: Official Warning -Flamebaiting.


http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446737&postcount=119
you're an arse, troll

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446853&postcount=132
Coward!

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446873&postcount=137
You sir, are an idiot.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446910&postcount=143
Takes one to know one, pole-smoker!

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446942&postcount=149
Wuss.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8446953&postcount=152
Grab a piece of your fat, and slide off!

Enlightened Humanity, your name is kind of sissyboyish, don't ya think?

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8447017&postcount=159
That first part show you are a sissy. Do you munch the pillow as well?
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8447281&postcount=184
Your idea of a fight seems to involve pillows and crotchless teddies. Boo-hoo.
Okay, the personal attacks are going to stop or I will break out the Heavy Hammer of Mod. Do I make myself perfectly clear?

iUnlock. This had better remain civil.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
NationStates Game Moderator

All I can do after skimming this thread is...


Scream!



Good lord, pay for minorities to be able to do various things? Where is the equality in that? Take down regimes like Saudi Arabia, then moments after claim that we need to support all cultures?!






Bloody hippies.

Okay, I'm sure most of you have met HerPower...and if not, well, you're missing out because she's AWESOME! If by awesome you mean great at making feminists look like man-hating nutjobs. So please...you real feminists, the ones who want gender equity...yes, you men too can be feminists, please come in here and discuss this issue rationally. Let's clear the air and get things out in the open. Femi-nazis are the extreme and the minority. Let's not let them ruin it for us all!
Thats ok we understand this ... it may upset us sometimes ... and a knee jerk reaction almost always happens when someone tries to degrade somethng you are part of (specialy something you have no controll over)
But we understand (at least I do) that this is not productive thinking (herpower's thinking that is) every viewpoint has their crazies ;) we have to deal with it in a calm mannor

Take care