NationStates Jolt Archive

GOTCHA!! You thought this would be another flame thread, didn't you!

Because of all the pointless "debates" taking place, I have decided to TRY and make a different topic.

Just for this one topic, please say what you respect and admire about your overseas friends. Say just one thing, or as many as you like. If you refuse to say a single positive thing, STAY AWAY! JUST LEAVE NOW.


Here we go:

I respect and admire Europe's system of trains. I wish America had one half as good.

From the Renaissance to today, Europe has been very active in new scientific and political developments.

Europeans have somehow avoided the rampant consumerism that is found in the US. Nice job, any hints on how you did it?

I like spain...Cause Spanish Girls are really hot.
I also like the public transportation systems in Europe...And also how in a lot of their countries healthcare is a right, and everyone has it.

Europeans have somehow avoided the rampant consumerism that is found in the US. Nice job, any hints on how you did it?
I would suggest that Europeans have less faith in 'inevitable' progress and like to have a little something stashed away just in case. When i lived there I was considered a reckless spender, here I am tight fisted--go figure :)

If there were a country populated with clones of myself, there would be almost no economy. I make no impulse purchases. Proud of it. Bump.

I like spain...Cause Spanish Girls are really hot.
I also like the public transportation systems in Europe...And also how in a lot of their countries healthcare is a right, and everyone has it.

and of course, how it is completely unaffordable in the long run with all sorts of vermin coming in to freeload.

Hmmm... gotta say something positive in thread: at least the USA doesn't have the unaffordable welfare state that Europe has! Yay for Bush! :)

Hollywood has produced some of the best films - also the most shitty ones, but the best ones too :p

I love Europe's history! It's "oldness". They don't call it the Old World for nothing. It's cool to think I could be stepping on the same pavestone that Shakespeare or Julius Ceasar or any number of history's greats once walked.

It's hard to get that in most of the U.S., especially in the west.

I'm a Brit and I'm all for Europe, I hope that we in Britain will adopt the Euro in the next few years and after that move towards total political integration.

The Future is Bright for the Union it is already an economic superpower if only we could just work together and put aside petty national differences.

Europe will hopefully form a left wing balance for America's rampantly right wing foreign policy and with Turkey (a muslim country of more than 80 million people) in the Union in the next decade or so Europe will be in a far better position that the states to stabalise places in the middle east. This whole Iraq fuck up wouldn't have happened if Europe had run the show because the Americans are viewed by many in the middle east as Christian crusaders not unlike the ones which raped and pillaged their way across the middle east in the 12th century

Ack.. the Euro sucks. Be glad that you don't have it. It's stronger than the US dollar, so that's kinda cool too, but it made life here much more expensive and due to it's strength, it's hindering our export-oriented economy :(

I admire the fact that Europe doesn't have any god-awful accents like America does in the south.

I also admire its strength to endure through good eras and bad.

I admire the fact that Europe doesn't have any god-awful accents like America does in the south.

I also admire its strength to endure through good eras and bad.

I love the american accents :D That counts as my one. Also the americans I've met were so much more friendly then most people here :(

I admire the fact that Europe doesn't have any god-awful accents like America does in the south.

I also admire its strength to endure through good eras and bad.
We have accents all over Europe. In Germany alone we have at least a dozen accents of German. Bavarian is quite funny. Personally I'm Saxon and thus also speak the Saxon accent of German.

I admire the fact that Europe doesn't have any god-awful accents like America does in the south.
Liverpool.

and of course, how it is completely unaffordable in the long run with all sorts of vermin coming in to freeload.


we've had it for over 50 years and it still seems to be going okay.

Good thing about the US:they invented Pringles! and deep pan pizzas!

edit:stupid code

[QUOTE=Hitlerreich]and of course, how it is completely unaffordable in the long run with all sorts of vermin coming in to freeload.
[\QUOTE]

we've had it for over 50 years and it still seems to be going okay.

Good thing about the US:they invented Pringles! and deep pan pizzas!
True that... Pizza Hut rocks. I love pan pizza :D

At least those accents in Europe are bearable (I like Bavarian, sounds nice).

I'd much rather be around people from Liverpool and London's East End than people from Alabama and Mississippi. It's just the way they talk... It pisses me off.

Not all of them talk like slack-jawed yokels, though. There are some "higher" forms of said Southern accents, that are indeed bearable. It's just a majority have the horrible ones.

[QUOTE=Hitlerreich]and of course, how it is completely unaffordable in the long run with all sorts of vermin coming in to freeload.
[\QUOTE]

we've had it for over 50 years and it still seems to be going okay.

Good thing about the US:they invented Pringles! and deep pan pizzas!


I love Pringles. I once ate two cans of Sour Cream & Onion. They taste too good...

and of course, how it is completely unaffordable in the long run with all sorts of vermin coming in to freeload.


If I ran the place I'd let them all in and none of this asylum crap, full British/European Citizenship for anyone who wants it

America is far better at integrating immigrants than Europe and free speech appears to be better protected in the USA.

Hmmm... gotta say something positive in thread: at least the USA doesn't have the unaffordable welfare state that Europe has! Yay for Bush! :)
Yeah, instead you get an unaffordable military. :rolleyes:

At least those accents in Europe are bearable (I like Bavarian, sounds nice).

I'd much rather be around people from Liverpool and London's East End than people from Alabama and Mississippi. It's just the way they talk... It pisses me off.

Not all of them talk like slack-jawed yokels, though. There are some "higher" forms of said Southern accents, that are indeed bearable. It's just a majority have the horrible ones.
To be fair, redneck southern accents are at least far funnier than scouser Liverpool accents.

Europeans have somehow avoided the rampant consumerism that is found in the US. Nice job, any hints on how you did it?

Just don't buy any crap

I like that America has government that (even if it isnt perfect, too high costs to run for a lot of political offices etc) it isnt based on power thorugh birth. I also like the fit girls from the west coast.
I like that Europe hasn't descended into a paranoid state over 9/11 and havnt begun to curtail their citizen rights because of it (like Britain and the US, btw, I'm british im trying to b nice)

I'm a Brit and I'm all for Europe, I hope that we in Britain will adopt the Euro in the next few years and after that move towards total political integration.

The Future is Bright for the Union it is already an economic superpower if only we could just work together and put aside petty national differences.

Europe will hopefully form a left wing balance for America's rampantly right wing foreign policy and with Turkey (a muslim country of more than 80 million people) in the Union in the next decade or so Europe will be in a far better position that the states to stabalise places in the middle east. This whole Iraq fuck up wouldn't have happened if Europe had run the show because the Americans are viewed by many in the middle east as Christian crusaders not unlike the ones which raped and pillaged their way across the middle east in the 12th century


Thanks for listening. [/sarcasm]

Everyone else... I am proud of you. Thank you!!!! (bump)

I respect and admire Europe's system of trains. I wish America had one half as good.

We don't need trains in the US. If we travel very far, most of us fly (on a fuel consumption per passenger mile basis, it is more cost effective than a train). If we travel short distances, we drive (because our cities aren't designed for walking). But, I would have to say that German trains were the best - far better than the French or Italian trains. And the Germans were always on time.

From the Renaissance to today, Europe has been very active in new scientific and political developments.

So has the US.

Europeans have somehow avoided the rampant consumerism that is found in the US. Nice job, any hints on how you did it?
Well, in Germany, I saw plenty of consumerism - among people who had the ability to pay. If you were sharing a job with someone, and working short hours, and making a low wage, it was hard to be a consumer. Also, they close the shops - US stores are open late every night and open all weekend long. Can't say if this is what other European nations did.

But if the onset of white people dressing like black people has come on in the UK, and if yuppies exist in the UK, you'll have rampant consumerism before you know it.

Oh, and I know a lot of young Germans who never plan to marry or have children - they want to spend the money they make on themselves. I haven't seen it as skewed in the US as I have in Germany for that trend.

I like Oceania.

Might have been a bad idea to bumb it... :)

The USA produces really good films!
The USA was a key ally in WWII
The Simpsons, Family guy, futurama, and south park all come from the USA.
My old house mate, who was very cool, and who I've now lost touch with was from the USA
Arthur Miller was American
Jimi Hendrix was from the USA
Bill Hicks was from the USA

In addition to these, there are lots of other great things about the USA!

This whole Iraq fuck up wouldn't have happened if Europe had run the show because the Americans are viewed by many in the middle east as Christian crusaders not unlike the ones which raped and pillaged their way across the middle east in the 12th century

I guess the fact that the Lebanese view the Iraqi invasion and election as the Arab equivalent of the fall of the Berlin Wall escaped your observation.

Or that Libya, scared by Iraq's swift fall, is now handing over their nuclear weapons material and program to the US.

Or that the Palestinians are finally negotiating in earnest.

Or that the insurgents are confined to a small area around Baghdad - and have no ability to kidnap an American soldier anywhere in the country (they have to kidnap dolls), and no ability to directly engage US forces in combat (they tried that in Fallujah and died). People are more free in the Kurdish and Shiite areas of Iraq than they have been in decades.

Oh, and who were the people who ran the Crusades? From what continent did the Christian invaders come?

I don't believe that the United States existed back then - I suppose, as Osama bin Laden has pointed out in his writings, that place was Europe - the implacable enemy of Islam.

It would appear that Tograna and whispering legs can't read! but nevertheless
[/slowly] This is not about being competitive or defensive about our own countries/continents. But about redressing some of the animosity between Europe and America that is so prevalent in other threads! If you want to go and argue about why europe or the us sucks, there's plenty of threads to do it in!!!

To be fair, redneck southern accents are at least far funnier than scouser Liverpool accents.


Haha, I do like making fun of the redneck accents.

America:

-has the best comedians
-and movies (take that, Bollywood!)
-Rather the USA as a superpower then Russia or China
-decent job in Kosovo
-and Afghanistan
-capitalism rules
-comics are fun
-Mc Donalds and coke
-lots of inventors

Europe has better beer, I'll grant them that.

Well, it got to page two before someone decided to shit on it :rolleyes:

Britain rocks because of Aston Martin, Cosworth, the Hawker Hurricane, the Spitfire, I could pretty much go on for a long time here...

Germany is just cool, I really can't explain it.

Hungary is responsible for pretty much my entire ancestry.

Japan has taken engineering to another level.

Polynesian nations have pretty much nothing to complain about, imo.

Australian Fords are some nice automobiles, we need to import the Falcon up here.

GOTCHA!! You thought this would be another flame thread, didn't you!

Because of all the pointless "debates" taking place, I have decided to TRY and make a different topic.

Just for this one topic, please say what you respect and admire about your overseas friends. Say just one thing, or as many as you like. If you refuse to say a single positive thing, STAY AWAY! JUST LEAVE NOW.


Here we go:

I respect and admire Europe's system of trains. I wish America had one half as good.

From the Renaissance to today, Europe has been very active in new scientific and political developments.

Europeans have somehow avoided the rampant consumerism that is found in the US. Nice job, any hints on how you did it?
I admire the rich history of most European nations. I admire their ability to concentrate on building their economies and their increasing technological sophistication. I admire the way the Germans treat their wooded areas like a valuable resource. I admire the way the French can produce great wines and excellent perfume. I admire the British for their ability to keep that "stiff upper lip" when things go sour. I admire the Italians for their attitudes about life and how it should be lived. And I admire almost all of Europe for learning how to form a successful European Union. :)

US

+ If you're rich you're richer than in Europe.
+ "Has military power" apparently this makes it good. *shrugs*
+ Has the money to get stuff done.
- Rednecks
- Coke and McDonalds
- If you're poor, you're poorer.
- 90% of US Movies

Europe

+ If you're poor, you're not as poor.
+ Has a rich and proud history.
+ Isn't so authoritarian.
+ Isn't so conservative in general.
+ Doesn't think that shooting people stops people from becoming suicide bombers.
+ Better system of education.
- No national pride.
- Coke and McDonalds
- 90% of US Movies

So has the US.
Might want to check your history there. The US was founded a couple hundred years after the Renaissance. Europe hosted all the scientific advances at that time.

And besides, you disregarded my request. This is not about defending your country. You shouldn't have to in theory because nobody should be putting it down in this thread. Regardless of how valid your arguments are, they are inappropriate for this topic.

Be nice. Say nice things about your usual adversaries. Ignore anyone who decides to bash your country of choice. If you can't or don't want to, please don't post here.

France was integral in our victory in the Revolution.

I guess that's worth noting, even though it's pretty much common knowledge at this point.

Be nice. Say nice things about your usual adversaries. Ignore anyone who decides to bash your country of choice. If you can't or don't want to, please don't post here.

Just wondering why you choose to chastise the one who is pro-America and not the ones that are con-America?

US

+ If you're rich you're richer than in Europe.
+ "Has military power" apparently this makes it good. *shrugs*
+ Has the money to get stuff done.
- Rednecks
- Coke and McDonalds
- If you're poor, you're poorer.
- 90% of US Movies

Europe

+ If you're poor, you're not as poor.
+ Has a rich and proud history.
+ Isn't so authoritarian.
+ Isn't so conservative in general.
+ Doesn't think that shooting people stops people from becoming suicide bombers.
+ Better system of education.
- No national pride.
- Coke and McDonalds
- 90% of US Movies

Seems a bit one-sided to jump one and not the other, doesn't it?

Regards,
Gaar

US

+ If you're rich you're richer than in Europe.
+ "Has military power" apparently this makes it good. *shrugs*
+ Has the money to get stuff done.
- Rednecks
- Coke and McDonalds
- If you're poor, you're poorer.
- 90% of US Movies

Europe

+ If you're poor, you're not as poor.
+ Has a rich and proud history.
+ Isn't so authoritarian.
+ Isn't so conservative in general.
+ Doesn't think that shooting people stops people from becoming suicide bombers.
+ Better system of education.
- No national pride.
- Coke and McDonalds
- 90% of US Movies
:) It's the thought that counts. Thank you.

Europe is cool because if you look at it on a map, it kinda looks like an animal.

US
+++----
Europe
++++++---

That's cute.
Way to read the original post. I guess it's just impossible to have a clean thread on these forums.

Just wondering why you choose to chastise the one who is pro-America and not the ones that are con-America?
I chastised Tograna earlier. His post was anti-American, and I have removed my repetition of it for your sake.

I chastised Tograna earlier. His post read something like

So, not only aren't you going to chastise the latest one, but you are nice enough to RE-POST another con-America post?

And here I thought you were going to be fair...

Regards,
Gaar

That's cute.
Way to read the original post. I guess it's just impossible to have a clean thread on these forums.

I'm trying. To be frank, that comment wasn't helpful at all. Now Praetonia might feel the need to respond to defend his/her remarks, starting an argument (please don't, Praetonia).

So, not only aren't you going to chastise the latest one, but you are nice enough to RE-POST another con-America post?

And here I thought you were going to be fair...

Regards,
Gaar
For your information, when I do enter the regrettable flame topics about the US and Europe, I generally do so on the side of the US.

I'm trying my best to be fair. You could help me out by not ticking off people on the other side of the proverbial pond. This is not a time for pointing fingers and blame games. This is a time for saying something nice or saying nothing at all. Please ignore those who don't.

P.S. The offending re-post has been removed. You're welcome. Peace.

Texas, America(my state and damn proud of it)

I'm trying. To be frank, that comment wasn't helpful at all. Now Praetonia might feel the need to respond to defend his/her remarks, starting an argument (please don't, Praetonia).
It wasn't meant to be helpful. I've already posted twice the praises of other nations, and I did it in a way that didn't make a jab at the USA (well, more specifically Europe, in my case, eh). That's what the original poster [you] wanted us to do [right?]. I'm fully even for good and crap posts ;)

No turning the thread into a "Why the US sucks" (which is what Praetonia was doing, even if it was subtle). The title of the thread is "The US and Europe" not "The US vs. Europe" which is what Praetonia was insinuating. Was it really that hard for someone to write "These are some reasons the US is good" and leave it at that? No. Obviously not. Instead, we have to start pulling out a numerically greater amount of reasons the US is bad and tack them on. Then make an inverse list for Europe. That's defeating the spirit of this thread [isn't it?].

I'd like to praise Italy for their wonderful food and powerful automobiles.
I'd like to praise Switzerland for their effective foreign policy.
I'd like to praise Greece for their vast contributions to philosophy over the centuries.

That wasn't too hard for me to do. No bashing Greece, Italy, or Switzerland, no inflating the USA. Just giving credit where credit is due.

I respect and admire Europe's system of trains. I wish America had one half as good.

Well, if we can somehow manage to have a big war that engulfs America, wherein the majority of rail lines are destroyed to disrupt transportation... Then we can rebuild our rail system to be nice like Europes. If it hadn't been for WWII, where the rail systems were blown to pieces, then they/you all might still have a system similiar to America's.


But... Something I like about Europe... Actually, I enjoy mountains and castles. We don't have enough of those here in the states. The only castles I can think of are the fake ones at Disney Land and Disney World.

But... Something I like about Europe... Actually, I enjoy mountains and castles. We don't have enough of those here in the states. The only castles I can think of are the fake ones at Disney Land and Disney World.

Did you just say we don't have enough mountains in the USA? Oh dear :)

:fluffle: Norway for having having the highest Quality of Life in UN nations.

V :cool:

europe:

+trains
+genuinely friendly people
+football!
+speak multiple languages
+amazing metal bands (blind guardian, rhapsody, emperor, extol, at the gates)
+heath care

usa:

+cars
+genuinely friendly (although a little paranoid) people
+american football!
+make english seem like it's more than one language
+amazing hardcore bands (throwdown, champion, gorilla biscuits, youth of today, 7 seconds)
+surfing

Seems a bit one-sided to jump one and not the other, doesn't it?

Regards,
Gaar
Those are my honest views. I know plenty of Americans and like 90% of them, but as a nation America goes against most of what I believe is the right way to run a country, and I'm happy not to be a part of it.

Plus it was balanced, I gave -s and +s for both.

Those are my honest views. I know plenty of Americans and like 90% of them, but as a nation America goes against most of what I believe is the right way to run a country, and I'm happy not to be a part of it.

Plus it was balanced, I gave -s and +s for both.

Well the thread was started for the positive ones, not the negative...

And just so you know, we're pretty Happy you're not "part of it" as well.

Regards,
Gaar

I like that the US has a mix of culture that no where else you can find and everybody work together and get along fairly well.

I like pancakes with grits, bacon, syrup and blueberry jam.

I like Johnny Depp and a couple of other American actors.

I like the rollercoaster in Disney World where you feel like you're in space with planets that look like they're made out of cheese, it's not too scary ;)

You British folk know how to rock man, Led Zeppelin is the best band ever. You guys just need to admit soccors boring.

While I too am fond of a few of England’s Rock Bands, most notably Zeppelin and Supertramp, I would also like to recognize the great German Band Scorpions as well as our neighbors to the Great White North and their contributions to the Rock and Roll genre in Rush and Triumph... :cool:

I believe I am showing my age, so I will leave it at that!

Regards,
Gaar

I like Pantera from Texas.
I'm sorry they separated and I'm sorry Dimebag Darell is dead.

Hmm, lesse...
Europe has tons of cool languages.
Europe has some of the good car companies if I remember correctly.

I would also like to note that the first Concert I ever saw was in the King Dome in Seattle where I watched Led Zeppelin Rock the house, the summer before they lost Bonham.

What a Concert! In many ways it is still the best Concert I have ever seen, those guys knew how to put on a SHOW!

Thanks again England! :D

Regards,
Gaar

Well, one thing that I saw in Ireland that I thought was good was that at places where there were really high cliffs, there weren't any railings to spoil the view, nor were there huge warning signs meant for idiots, nor were there pesky park rangers admonishing you to stay away from the edge.

It's one of the things I liked about Ireland - unlike some places, if you're a complete idiot, they let you remove yourself from the gene pool.

I can't tell you how many other places I've been to (you know who you are) where the view has been spoiled because they had to protect a handful of idiots.

Liverpool.
:(

Well OK, I'm from Manchester but I'll defend Liverpool because... well it doesn't have a lot going for it.

The US has a culture of friendly, efficient service - not especially prevalent here. In fact, I consider it a bonus when people are actually nice in a shop/restaurant here, rather than the norm! Admittedly, I didn't like the expectation of a tip between 15 - 20 % for the good service in restaurants (and some bars), but still, I'd rather pay something for it than not have it at all.

Furthermore, the US has given us some great bands - Metallica, Guns n Roses, and Bon Jovi immeadiately spring to mind - and a few good comedies, such as The Simpsons and Frasier.

I admire the fact that Europe doesn't have any god-awful accents like America does in the south.


Take a trip to the south of Germany and talk to some young farm girls.

If you can stand it - if you're used to hearing the German spoken by newsreaders, you'll be lucky not to be running away, holding your ears. It's worse than Ellie Mae on the Beverly Hillbillies.

And I'm speaking as someone who is not a native speaker of German. It's atrocious.

Of course, in August, you will see these women hanging out around the pool with their shirts off - which is an outstanding sight.

Europeans have somehow avoided the rampant consumerism that is found in the US. Nice job, any hints on how you did it?
We looked to Britain how you don't do it. Back in the 19th century. As a result Germany developed the social system.

I admire the fact that Europe doesn't have any god-awful accents like America does in the south.

Sorry. But we do. Just go to Flanders.

About the train services in Europe thingie from a whil back in the thread.

As a brit I feel it my duty to say the British railway system is probably the shitest in the world apart from maybe Indias. (I have personaly experianced both in depth.)

But I gesus my contribution would be that the US police are probably more effective than the British. I also like the ORIGINAL constitution however world happanings make it look to me like you guy are contradicting it a lot. (For good reasons but you gotta see thr irony? No nuke for Iraqi's but you support the right to bear arms? It almost looks like only AMERICANS have the right to bear bigger arms than everyone else. No offence meant)

I also love the American friendliness and the way you stand up for your beleifs regardless. I respect that.

Wawel Castel in Krakow Poland has a fire-breathing dragon. Damn that's cool.

Liverpool.
:(

Well OK, I'm from Manchester but I'll defend Liverpool because... well it doesn't have a lot going for it.

I have a Scouse girl working alongside me and she has one of the sexiest voices you've ever heard :)

There are lots of things I like about the US but one of my favorites is Sam Adams - a truly great beer !

Sorry. But we do. Just go to Flanders.

No, I think I'll go to Rotterdam and get laid and smoke a bowl.

Well, one thing that I saw in Ireland that I thought was good was that at places where there were really high cliffs, there weren't any railings to spoil the view, nor were there huge warning signs meant for idiots, nor were there pesky park rangers admonishing you to stay away from the edge.

It's one of the things I liked about Ireland - unlike some places, if you're a complete idiot, they let you remove yourself from the gene pool.

I can't tell you how many other places I've been to (you know who you are) where the view has been spoiled because they had to protect a handful of idiots.
This is a VERY good point!! As an American, I can tell you that we have EXCESSIVE protection of idiot consumers. Probably because we have a surplus of lawyers.

Thanks to all of you guys. I didn't believe this thread would get half as far as it has. It had some moments, but it has avoided flame-ness. Congrats to all of you.

I love how friendly everyone seems in America, and how big and wide their roads are. Also how in some places you can keep on driving for miles and not see anything. Except for one time in Arizona where I saw a sign stating "State Prison Ahead. 5 Miles", then another sign 4 miles down the road "Do not pick up hitch-hickers.". That was fun.

Take a trip to the south of Germany and talk to some young farm girls.

If you can stand it - if you're used to hearing the German spoken by newsreaders, you'll be lucky not to be running away, holding your ears. It's worse than Ellie Mae on the Beverly Hillbillies.

And I'm speaking as someone who is not a native speaker of German. It's atrocious.

Of course, in August, you will see these women hanging out around the pool with their shirts off - which is an outstanding sight.


So I see that "hick" accents abound in every nation. That *sucks*... Although the pool thing might make up for it. Might.

I love how friendly everyone seems in America, and how big and wide their roads are. Also how in some places you can keep on driving for miles and not see anything. Except for one time in Arizona where I saw a sign stating "State Prison Ahead. 5 Miles", then another sign 4 miles down the road "Do not pick up hitch-hickers.". That was fun.


Ah, so you like the wide roads? They're so luxurious!

I like that America has government that (even if it isnt perfect, too high costs to run for a lot of political offices etc) it isnt based on power thorugh birth.


Have you not heard of George Bush Jnr? I believe he is the head of state of USA, rather unappealing at first glance, but conveniently the son of an ex-President, and thus well connected politically. Hmmm....

Well, if we can somehow manage to have a big war that engulfs America, wherein the majority of rail lines are destroyed to disrupt transportation... Then we can rebuild our rail system to be nice like Europes. If it hadn't been for WWII, where the rail systems were blown to pieces, then they/you all might still have a system similiar to America's.

.

I think that has very little if anything to do with it. It's about the differing levels of investment in the public transport infrastructures... much higher in most European countries than in USA, often due to more rigorous environmental legislation and feelings of environmental responsibility in Europe.

I admire much of the food of Europe. I also admire their ability to enjoy a meal and socialization with friends.
Also the trains, I like their high speed trains and wish the US had some.

I like the wines. Best wines are (personal choice); Barolo, Amarone, Brunnelo, Barbaresco, Mouton & Lafite Rotshild, Haut Brion, Margeaux, Yquem, Hermitage, Cote Rotie, Cahors, Rioja, Douro wines from Portugal, Tokaji Aszu from Hungary, German Rieslings from the Rhine together with Grüner Veltliner from the Austrian Donau aso aso it is a real winebible.

Altough I allready followed some fine Ausie wine and some Californian, they never reached the high standards of the better EU wines I drunk, mostly overwoody and to chemical (sufites).

I admire much of the food of Europe. I also admire their ability to enjoy a meal and socialization with friends.
Also the trains, I like their high speed trains and wish the US had some.

The problem with trains in the US is this:

1. Over short distances, while a train would probably be more economical, the car is used.
2. Over longer distances, aircraft have better fuel economy per passenger-mile than any other type of vehicle - so they are used.

Not all trains in Europe are good. While Germany has great rail service - the best in the world, IMHO, the trains in the UK and France suck by comparison.

I like the wines. Best wines are (personal choice); Barolo, Amarone, Brunnelo, Barbaresco, Mouton & Lafite Rotshild, Haut Brion, Margeaux, Yquem, Hermitage, Cote Rotie, Cahors, Rioja, Douro wines from Portugal, Tokaji Aszu from Hungary, German Rieslings from the Rhine together with Grüner Veltliner from the Austrian Donau aso aso it is a real winebible.

Altough I allready followed some fine Ausie wine and some Californian, they never reached the high standards of the better EU wines I drunk, mostly overwoody and to chemical (sufites).
I must say you know what you are talking about. The wines you cited are indeed the finest you can find here, especially the Rioja and I like Cahors too.

The problem with trains in the US is this:

1. Over short distances, while a train would probably be more economical, the car is used.
2. Over longer distances, aircraft have better fuel economy per passenger-mile than any other type of vehicle - so they are used.

Not all trains in Europe are good. While Germany has great rail service - the best in the world, IMHO, the trains in the UK and France suck by comparison.

yeah, but I just like trains. Likey likey trains.

Trains trains the wonderful fruit
the more they eat the more they toot
the more they toot the better ya feel
so lets have train with every meal!

Not all trains in Europe are good. While Germany has great rail service - the best in the world, IMHO, the trains in the UK and France suck by comparison.
You can't really compare the trains in the UK with the trains in France.
The trains in France are the fastest in the world. They are cheaper, more confortable, more on time and more frequent than their german counterparts. And the network is a lot more developed.
I suspect you tryed to visit the country side of France and went to exotic destinations and you compared your trip to what you have seen in Berlin. But take a Paris-Marseilles trip and you will be delighted with the TGV. It will take you 3 hours for a 800 km trip.

You can't really compare the trains in the UK with the trains in France.
The trains in France are the fastest in the world. They are cheaper, more confortable, more on time and more frequent than their german counterparts. And the network is a lot more developed.

In my experience, the trains were more on time in Germany. I only had one late train in 3 years, and I rode almost every day. It was two minutes late, and when the train pulled in, the conductor leaped off and apologized.

Not only do conductors not apologize for late trains in the US (and they are ALWAYS late), but the French conductors don't apologize for it, either.

I like the German high speed train quite a bit. But it's not as fuel efficient per passenger mile as a widebody aircraft, so I guess we're stuck with flying around in the US.

I'm lucky enough to live in a city with a good Metro train system - but most US cities don't have one, or their Metro trains suck big time.

And interestingly, our local Metro trains are made by an Italian company.

Not only do conductors not apologize for late trains in the US (and they are ALWAYS late), but the French conductors don't apologize for it, either.I don't want to sound like patriotic or something but I just want to set this straight. In France, when the train is late, your ticket is partly or fully paid back, depending on the lateness. They pay back half the ticket for 25 minutes lateness. And the rail delay statistics show that the french train are more often on time than the german ones (something like 98% to 92%). But maybe you have been to the right place in Germany and the wrong one in France...
Anyway, the french people are rude, so it doesn't surprise me that the conductor do not apologize.

I don't want to sound like patriotic or something but I just want to set this straight. In France, when the train is late, your ticket is partly or fully paid back, depending on the lateness. They pay back half the ticket for 25 minutes lateness. And the rail delay statistics show that the french train are more often on time than the german ones (something like 98% to 92%). But maybe you have been to the right place in Germany and the wrong one in France...
Anyway, the french people are rude, so it doesn't surprise me that the conductor do not apologize.

Whoa!! The New Haven to New York line (Metro North) is late nearly 20% of the time on the morning run and 10% on the evening. By this system, I'd save like $100 a month!! :D

Have you not heard of George Bush Jnr? I believe he is the head of state of USA, rather unappealing at first glance, but conveniently the son of an ex-President, and thus well connected politically. Hmmm....

Yes, but you'll recall that he had to be elected, and that there was a two term President Clinton in between. That's unlike say, North Korea, which is the world's only Hereditary Communist state...

BTW, that's not the first time that happened Presidents #2 and #4 were father and son.

BTW, that's not the first time that happened Presidents #2 and #4 were father and son.

The Adams's (John Adams, & John Quincy Adams)?

This is guess though. My next guess would be the Roosevelds (butchered the spelling I know).

I'm not too good on presidential history.

I love the American South, particularly Arkansas and Texas. Only place I found in America that was willing to flout licensing laws for a charming London accent. And everyone is so damn friendly! Amazing!

I don't want to sound like patriotic or something but I just want to set this straight. In France, when the train is late, your ticket is partly or fully paid back, depending on the lateness. They pay back half the ticket for 25 minutes lateness. And the rail delay statistics show that the french train are more often on time than the german ones (something like 98% to 92%). But maybe you have been to the right place in Germany and the wrong one in France...
Anyway, the french people are rude, so it doesn't surprise me that the conductor do not apologize.

That's a nice thing that they pay back something when the train is that late.

But I found it surprising that for only 2 minutes late, you got an apology in Germany.

I only found the French people in Paris to be rude (well, in Marseilles they were rude, too - but I thought that was racism against people who are not white). Brittany had a lot of friendly people, as did the areas of the northeast of France. Maybe it's an urban/rural thing.

Talking of trains... anyone been on the Central Line recently?!?!?

The tube is ok MOST of the time, but when it f*cks up, it REALLY f*cks up badly... :o(

(Spot the pissed off London commuter!!!)

Talking of trains... anyone been on the Central Line recently?!?!?

The tube is ok MOST of the time, but when it f*cks up, it REALLY f*cks up badly... :o(

(Spot the pissed off London commuter!!!)

I wasn't even a commuter - I was a tourist - and it was enough to piss me off.

Of course, the subway system in Washington DC looks nice, and is very modern - but it's definitely not made to handle the capacity, and doesn't serve enough of the metro area (the coverage of most foreign subways is much better). Try riding it during rush hour, and you feel like a cow in a high tech cattle stampede. And, when it snows, the track sections that happen to be above ground freeze and the trains stop running above ground. That restricts the rest of the system to the below ground sections, which isn't very helpful.

Breakdowns usually happen during rush hour. And when that happens, the line on which the breakdown occurs becomes a single track in that location. Then you'll see stations like Metro Center become wall to wall people, and the trains are sardine tins full of bodies.

I forget to say the most important. The Landscape in the US is WONDERFUL. The Grand Canyon is probably the single most beautiful place on earth.

You've obviously never been to Canvey Island then...

I wasn't even a commuter - I was a tourist - and it was enough to piss me off.

...

Breakdowns usually happen during rush hour. And when that happens, the line on which the breakdown occurs becomes a single track in that location. Then you'll see stations like Metro Center become wall to wall people, and the trains are sardine tins full of bodies.

All of our respective countries need to make a heavy capital investment in rail transit. It's much more efficient and environmentally friendly.

I'll do both, because... well, I kinda feel strung between the two. I've been born and raised in Europe, but I feel like I belong in America.

Good things about Europe:
- Massive contributions to the world's scientific, cultural, and philosophical arenas over the last eight hundred-ish years.
- Good welfare systems (At least on the mainland/Scandanavia.), a system I disaree with on philosophical grounds but which can certainly work.
- Freedoms. Although we don't hold them as highly as the US does, we do have them and we will fight to protect them, when it comes down to it.
- High standard of living, again not so much as the US but nonetheless, it's better than a lot of places.

Good things about the US:
- In the last two hundred years, the US has done nothing but increase it's cultural and social contributions. Even if you dislike them, the fact remains they are there.
- Food. Cheap, good quality, and lots of it. I don't know about anyone else, but that's a damn good thing in my book :D
- Freedom is valued. They had to fight for it over in the USA, and even in over 200 years they've retained that sense and ideal. It does make them a bit paranoid, I'll grant you, but when you're the only place that's actually making a noise about something that amazing, it seems like the only possible explanation could be that other places don't have it, or worse yet, don't care.
- The constitution provides an inescapable protection against a great many things. Yes, it is possible to circumvent, and yes, it can be changed, but with a single thing so highly regarded none of that happens easily.
- Small social welfare, whilst not as good for unlucky (Or lazy) people, is much fairer overall. You get what you put in. As this is in keeping with my philosophical ideal, I'm happy like that.

Try riding the Sydney system then.

The government wants to change late running, so that a train has to be 10mins late, before it's recorded as late....

I guess the fact that the Lebanese view the Iraqi invasion and election as the Arab equivalent of the fall of the Berlin Wall escaped your observation.


Hmm, funny that the pro-Syrian, and anti Bush demonstrations in Beirut arranged by Hezbollah, and attended by both Lebanese christians and muslims dwarfed the anti-Syria ones then. With slogans that said "Lebanon is not your playground, Mr Bush!" US invasion of Iraq akin to the Berlin wall? More like the building of it.

Except those protests did not get much coverage in the US do they? No, because they don't fit in with Bush's lies.

Anti Syria protests in Beirut have nothing to do with the fall of Iraq, but to do with the assassination of a politician who voiced opposition to Syria.



Or that Libya, scared by Iraq's swift fall, is now handing over their nuclear weapons material and program to the US.


Libya wanted to be welcomed back by the west after

A) the Lockerbie bombing and the worldwide revulsion it caused.
B) Al-Qaeda trying to kill Gadaffi to replace him with an Islamic leader.


Or that the Palestinians are finally negotiating in earnest.


Arafat wanted to negotiate before he died. Bush and Sharon wanted no part.
It's the US and Israel who have delayed peace in Palestine.


Or that the insurgents are confined to a small area around Baghdad - and have no ability to kidnap an American soldier anywhere in the country (they have to kidnap dolls), and no ability to directly engage US forces in combat (they tried that in Fallujah and died). People are more free in the Kurdish and Shiite areas of Iraq than they have been in decades.


Get with the real world. The insurgents are all over Iraq, and ambushing Iraqi police and army recruits every other day, as well as killing US Soldiers.

The majority of the insurgents in Fallujash simply left, leaving some behind to keep the US troops busy for a time.

There have been uprisings in Mosul, the taking of police stations, and I have seen video footage of Iraqi police leaving a police station with insurgents, with no guns to their backs, both police and insurgents chatting jovially before they blow up the empty police station.

The insurgents are carrying out a guerilla war. IED's, RPGS, Mortars, and the US military is being bled. It's ok if you refuse to recognise this, I understand nationalism blinds the harsh truth that American soldiers are dying in Iraq in uncontainable attacks by insurgents.

And that the freed Italian hostage the US Soldiers shot at, wounding her and killing an Italian Service agent, claims the US Soldiers meant to kill her on purpose, and that it was 'no accident', and that the Italian goverment, one of the major arse lickers of Bush, itself argues with the US Government that the car was travelling slowly, and not fast as the US says?


Oh, and who were the people who ran the Crusades? From what continent did the Christian invaders come?


1. The Bush administration and the Neo Cons. 2. America.


I don't believe that the United States existed back then - I suppose, as Osama bin Laden has pointed out in his writings, that place was Europe - the implacable enemy of Islam.

But not now. Bush is making a good job of being the replacement.

The State of It, STFU! God it is hard to keep a civil and unconfrontational thread running these days.

I'm from Australia, so this doesn't apply to me, but screw ya'll.

Europe: God, so many good things. It's really hard to talk about ALL of Europe, becuase there's a lot of different countries all with completely different cultures. Dutch pancakes rule, Rome kicks ass, very efficient public transport (the Australian attitude of "she'll be right" is all very well, but not very practical when applied to punctuality), generally more open about sex and nudity, massive history and responsible for some of the greatest inventions and ideas in the history of the world.

The United States of America: Great senses of humour, the powerhouse of films in the Western world, hilarious lawsuit cases, New York, great athletes, generally strong community spirit.

Beer in Europe is great.

People outside the main cities in Germany and even france were some of the friendliest I ever met while traveling. I was invited into houses in Germany and forced to drink their home made schnapps. And in France they had me drinking their Wine. All I had done in both countries was ask to fill up my water bottels on my bike on my way past.

The State of It, STFU! God it is hard to keep a civil and unconfrontational thread running these days.


Kiss me darling. :p

generally more open about sex and nudity,

Not speaking for the whole of Europe, but in Britain it is largely tolerated (although there will be outcry from some quarters) provided it is heterosexual. We seem to be ok with homosexuality in practise, but it appears a lot of use would much rather be able to pretend it doesn't exist at all.


Or that Libya, scared by Iraq's swift fall, is now handing over their nuclear weapons material and program to the US.

Libya was having secret talks with the British government well before the invasion of Iraq. The fact being widely reported here, seems strange that detail was left out elsewhere.

I would also like to note that the first Concert I ever saw was in the King Dome in Seattle where I watched Led Zeppelin Rock the house, the summer before they lost Bonham.

What a Concert! In many ways it is still the best Concert I have ever seen, those guys knew how to put on a SHOW!

Thanks again England! :D

Regards,
Gaar

You saw it in 77. Bonham died in 1980.

You saw it in 77. Bonham died in 1980.

Yes, you are correct...

Funny how close the two events seem to me now.

Regards,
Gaar

All of our respective countries need to make a heavy capital investment in rail transit. It's much more efficient and environmentally friendly.

Over short distances.

For longer distances, such as the distance between major cities in the US, aircraft have a better fuel expenditure per passenger-mile.

According to British Airways, a 747-400 plane cruises at 576 mph (927
km/h), burns 12,788 liters (3378 US gallons) of fuel per hour, and
carries 409 passengers when full:

If the plane is full, one passenger is carried (69 miles for each US gallon of fuel burned).

This fuel efficiency exceeds that of almost all cars, and is better than most trains.

Distances for most European travel (say, from France to Germany) are not as long as from New York to Los Angeles. So the plane is faster and more fuel efficient for the long trips, and rail is better for zipping around Europe.

Over short distances.

For longer distances, such as the distance between major cities in the US, aircraft have a better fuel expenditure per passenger-mile.

...

Distances for most European travel (say, from France to Germany) are not as long as from New York to Los Angeles. So the plane is faster and more fuel efficient for the long trips, and rail is better for zipping around Europe.

If a train crashes some of the people survive...

The Adams's (John Adams, & John Quincy Adams)?

This is guess though. My next guess would be the Roosevelds (butchered the spelling I know).

I'm not too good on presidential history.

Yes, you are right. The Roosevelts were much later, and they were only distantly related, not father & son.

If a train crashes some of the people survive...
That, and you can't fly a train into the building of your choice.

But, here in the US, the distances travelled are a bit longer on average when compared to a European traveller.

The thing we really need is a better system of subways within the city and extending out through the suburbs. The DC Metro system is nice, but it's not enough. Most US cities don't have anything.

The thing I liked most about Germany was that I did not need a car to get around - quickly. Here in the US you absolutely have to have a car unless you want to confine yourself to the core of a major urban center.

That, and you can't fly a train into the building of your choice.

But, here in the US, the distances travelled are a bit longer on average when compared to a European traveller.

The thing we really need is a better system of subways within the city and extending out through the suburbs. The DC Metro system is nice, but it's not enough. Most US cities don't have anything.

The thing I liked most about Germany was that I did not need a car to get around - quickly. Here in the US you absolutely have to have a car unless you want to confine yourself to the core of a major urban center.

All True.

And as you alluded to: the US is a lot larger. Germany is only about the size of Montana.

I still think it's great that Britain invented the intestinal gas collector.

Now, when sitting in a pub, I won't have to endure the odor anymore.

It should make a Great Britain even greater.

Yes, but you'll recall that he had to be elected, and that there was a two term President Clinton in between. That's unlike say, North Korea, which is the world's only Hereditary Communist state...

BTW, that's not the first time that happened Presidents #2 and #4 were father and son.

Yes, more or less, he was. But, would he really have been in a position to have been elected if he didn't have these connections? I very much doubt it. Plus, he really only had one opponent. Elections in USA tend to be 2-party affairs, with 2 very similar parties, which always puzzles me.

Yes, more or less, he was. But, would he really have been in a position to have been elected if he didn't have these connections? I very much doubt it. Plus, he really only had one opponent. Elections in USA tend to be 2-party affairs, with 2 very similar parties, which always puzzles me.

Probably yes. Every US President since WW2 has had a political family, with the exception of Reagan.

Yep, it's a rarity to have a real multi-party race in the US. That's why we're so stable. (Besides, the two parties are 75% the same anyway.)

Probably yes. Every US President since WW2 has had a political family, with the exception of Reagan.

Yep, it's a rarity to have a real multi-party race in the US. That's why we're so stable. (Besides, the two parties are 75% the same anyway.)

Hmm.. stability at the expense of democracy. Not sure I'd be for that trade-off... But different systems for different countries, I guess that is fair enough.

Hmm.. stability at the expense of democracy. Not sure I'd be for that trade-off... But different systems for different countries, I guess that is fair enough.

I'm not saying it's an optimal system, but it does work and could be much worse...

EDIT: And it's still Democratic -- it's just "fast tracked". No, I'm not sure that's a good thing.

Kiss me darling. :p
Actually, as the starter of this thread, I made it perfectly clear that I wanted no arguments and no negative comments.

Thankfully, your words did not spark an argument. Now that you have been reminded, please stick to positive comments about your usual opponent (the US). I don't care if you're right or wrong or how valid your arguments are. If you want to argue, please find a different thread. There are plenty of them.

Thank you! Peace.

Yes, more or less, he was. But, would he really have been in a position to have been elected if he didn't have these connections? I very much doubt it. Plus, he really only had one opponent. Elections in USA tend to be 2-party affairs, with 2 very similar parties, which always puzzles me.
Briefly: We have a dysfunctional system of campaign finance. It lets special interests have too much say, and gives the parties far too much influence. With some reform in that area, our democracy would improve greatly.