NationStates Jolt Archive

Im confused.. ive heard this so called "fact" stated several times.. but where is the evidence to suggest it.. numbers of followers arn't decreasing they are increasing.. annually.. so how is it catholisim is dying ?

I don't think Catholicism is dying. I've not seen any signs of it.

Although it really doesn't concern me, because I'm not religious.

Perhaps it would be helpful if you provided an example of someone saying Catholicism is dying.

Not dying so much as it is receeding in some countries. As I mentioned in the atheist vs religion thread I cannot remember the exact name of now, in Britain, many kids in a Catholic school do not go to Church. I can only imagine this is the result of western countries becoming more and more tempted to play around with things. My education even in my school did not spark off any faith in me... only at 16 with philosophy and ethics am I starting to see religion as a possible truth. Religion is more a chore for most young people here. It is also a hindering aspect of life among free young people. I can't see why people would choose for their lives to be hindered, lol... although an awful lot of old people seem to find God.

Layarteb
Semi-Pro Sp@mPig

Well Catholicism is slowly eroding and Judaism has remained where it was. Islam is growing. It's just a question of time. Personally I'm agnostic so whether it stays or goes doesn't bother me but I do think a little bit of religion is good. If, at the very least, those who worship the religion follow its true morals then they will be good people because that's really all the Bible and other texts are, aside from historical accounts (albeit overexaggerated ones). They are very good books on morals.

Here is one place in the most recent "when will religion become obsolete " thread.

and to the Black Imperium.. it is a little hard to judge the direction Catholisim is taking ESPECIALLy in countries like Britian seeing how that is a Prostistan country in nature. If you look at catholis in Northern Ireland you'll find very different numbers.. and in Ireland itself again you will have a different impression... As well CAtholism is spreading like wild fire throughout asia especially in China. So I simply dont get where the idea that Catholisim is dying comes from

In my experience I would say that Catholicism isn't dying, but anti-catholic sentiment is raising. The Catholic Church is often still thought of as the head of the Christian belief system. Most attacks on Christianity are directed at Catholic traditions and beliefs. Though most don't know true Catholic belief and tradition the you might say, "Neo-Catholics" keep many of the beliefs and some of the tradition. So attacks upon the new church are directed at catholics in general. At least in my observations of course.

And when people on this forum say religion is dying, its mostly hope for their cause. Atheists don't like religion anymore than fundamentalists like atheists. Religion doesn't die. Atheism will live on. It's how it works. Perhaps religion will evolve again and monotheism will be forgotten, maybe not, only time will tell.

It depends on where the statistics come from, too. No one "registers" as a Catholic. So the statistics probably come from baptism, communion, or confirmation records. However, those records don't necessarily reflect the religion of the person. I was raised Catholic and was baptized. I do not consider myself to be Catholic. Many people are baptized and confirmed because theire parents wanted them to. Even though they may pursue a different religion. Catholicism may be spreading by the next generation of followers are fading.

Last I heard most religions were receding in developed western European nations, including Catholicism, but that it's gaining grounds in both South America and Africa. Sorry, I don't have any sources.

Im confused.. ive heard this so called "fact" stated several times.. but where is the evidence to suggest it.. numbers of followers arn't decreasing they are increasing.. annually.. so how is it catholisim is dying ?
Catholicism isn't dying worldwide. It's dying out in some regions. Europe most notably. In the USA the number of catholics will probably rise due to immigration from Latin American countries, but the number of non-latino catholics is decreasing. In Africa it's numbers are increasing. Also probably in Asia. There is, however, a problem with a shortage of priests. The celibacy thing is hampering recruitment.

Well Catholisism never existed, and Catholicism is NOT dying. That's a foolish assumption to make, especially with the massive numbers of converts in Africa.

Religion tends to decline in developed areas because of increased education. Knowledge is the enemy of superstition. In poor areas though, the people don't know that much to say that something isn't true, and so grab onto religion and become ideologues. Also, in the US the least developed areas have the highest religious population.

Here is one place in the most recent "when will religion become obsolete " thread.

and to the Black Imperium.. it is a little hard to judge the direction Catholisim is taking ESPECIALLy in countries like Britian seeing how that is a Prostistan country in nature. If you look at catholis in Northern Ireland you'll find very different numbers.. and in Ireland itself again you will have a different impression... As well CAtholism is spreading like wild fire throughout asia especially in China. So I simply dont get where the idea that Catholisim is dying comes from

OOO I'm being quoted...hehe I wonder if that's good or bad?

It seems, to me, that most people brought up catholic hate it. But that's just based on people where I live, who are forced catholics.

I don't think Catholicism is dying. I've not seen any signs of it.

Although it really doesn't concern me, because I'm not religious.

Do you know how man children they have? Like vermin and viruses. It's horrible. Can't they learn to read [Malthus or Swift]?

So no. They aren't.

It seems, to me, that most people brought up catholic hate it. But that's just based on people where I live, who are forced catholics.

Number one cause for therapy: Catholicism.

You think I'm kidding.

Well Catholisism never existed, and Catholicism is NOT dying. That's a foolish assumption to make, especially with the massive numbers of converts in Africa.

They seem to be getting along fine, eh? I'll have a nice cup of civilization.

It seems, to me, that most people brought up catholic hate it. But that's just based on people where I live, who are forced catholics.

It's not Catholicism in general. When forced to do anything there is a very good chance that they'll hate it.

I'm catholic by choice and couldn't be happier about myself

I'm catholic by choice and couldn't be happier about myself

Yes. Ignorance is bliss.

It's not Catholicism in general. When forced to do anything there is a very good chance that they'll hate it.

It's because Catholicism is so antithetical to the concepts of being a human, though, that make it so horrid.

Yes. Ignorance is bliss.

Ignorance. How so?

catholicism isn't dying, only the pope is :D

Ignorance. How so?

Nothing. Don't let me get in the way of your delusion.

catholicism isn't dying, only the pope is :D

Aww. He was a good pope. He progressed that pathetic little religion quite a bit along. He got them to accept Jews and blacks, and even evolution. That's pretty impressive for one little guy.

Nothing. Don't let me get in the way of your delusion.

here we go...

Aww. He was a good pope. He progressed that pathetic little religion quite a bit along. He got them to accept Jews and blacks, and even evolution. That's pretty impressive for one little guy.
heh I still hate him for his war on contraceptives though

catholicism is dying.
want proof watch dogma,actually watch dogma even if you dont care it is hilarious

ps religion itself is evvill because it promotes the acceptance of totaltarianism(you know "the all powerful, infalible god")

catholicism isn't dying, only the pope is :D

John Paul II is a great man and an excellent Pope, even if I don't agree with him on everything. I pray that he retains his health. Personally I think he will...dude's survived through ALOT!

I know that alot of people have left the Catholic church because of the child abuse scandal. But people need to understand that these priests DO NOT represent what the Catholic faith is about. We are about unity and respect.

When John Paul II leaves us...I hope we will have a replacement as good as he was.

also, all you people who say that catholicism isnt dying because it is imposing itself on others (EG "all those converts in africa") means nothing because someone saying that they are catholic doesnt neccessarily mean that they actually buy into catholicism's belief system

also, all you people who say that catholicism isnt dying because it is imposing itself on others (EG "all those converts in africa") means nothing because someone saying that they are catholic doesnt neccessarily mean that they actually buy into catholicism's belief system
exactly, everyone that's baptised as one is counted as a catholic, but many atheists just can't be arsed to get that undone (and are unlikely to get 'un-baptised' anyway)

It's because Catholicism is so antithetical to the concepts of being a human, though, that make it so horrid.

It's not just Catholicism dude.

No, the Catholic Church is not dying. The Church has existed for 2000 years, surviving heresy, civil war, insurrection, schism, assaults from within and without. It will remain with Christ until the end of the age.

Saipei, I pray you'll one day turn to the light of reason.

i dont think you can be "un-babtised" its like the boyscouts, your stuck with what your parents did to you

No, the Catholic Church is not dying. The Church has existed for 2000 years, surviving heresy, civil war, insurrection, schism, assaults from within and without. It will remain with Christ until the end of the age.

Saipei, I pray you'll one day turn to the light of reason.

how is relying on an ethereal figure to shape your life instead of just doing what you believe is right yourself reason?

One can only hope.

I'm going to make a rare act of indulgence.
Saipea, does your odious arrogance come to you naturally or is it something that you've been working on?

It's because Catholicism is so antithetical to the concepts of being a human, though, that make it so horrid.

"ya know, all im saying here is that one of us might need a little nap" -- dogma

beliefs can't be changed, i mean right now existence is about to be wiped out because of a catholic belief, why can't we all just have good ideas?--dogma

"leave it to the catholics to destroy existence" -- dogma

Don't know if this has any relevence to anyone but here goes:
Supposedly there is a list (I think written by Nostradamus, for what that's worth) of all Popes to come. So far, it's been 100% accurate. The thing is, there are only 2 or 3 names after the current Pope. And supposedly, the last one on the list will "betray" the Catholic church leading to it's eventual demise. This is why the current Pope is hanging on with dear life, trying to delay the "last" Pope from coming to power.
Just curious if anyone else has heard of this.

Im confused.. ive heard this so called "fact" stated several times.. but where is the evidence to suggest it.. numbers of followers arn't decreasing they are increasing.. annually.. so how is it catholisim is dying ?
CAtholisim is dieing in the sense that its becoming Liberal.
Allowing Rock MUsic to attract the Kiddies.
Ireland allows Divorce
Attendence is down in Australia and New Zealand
Where have all the Fathers gone?-We are running out.

Haven't heard anything on that.

My parents are Catholic, and very active in the Church. I do know that there is an extreme problem with enough priests and nuns - many are leaving, fewer are joining and those there already are growing old - even nuns and priests retire eventually.

isnt that a prophecy of fatima thing?

Here's another thought: Maybe all of the priest/altar boy scandals that have come to light recently have soured people on the Catholic church.

Don't know if this has any relevence to anyone but here goes:
Supposedly there is a list (I think written by Nostradamus, for what that's worth) of all Popes to come. So far, it's been 100% accurate. The thing is, there are only 2 or 3 names after the current Pope. And supposedly, the last one on the list will "betray" the Catholic church leading to it's eventual demise. This is why the current Pope is hanging on with dear life, trying to delay the "last" Pope from coming to power.
Just curious if anyone else has heard of this.
It's not Nostradamus, I believe it's one of the prophesies of Our Lady of Medjugorie, which hasn't officially been accepted as an apperition (sp?) and even the visionaries, one of whom I've met, aren't always 100% on what Our Lady is saying. So who knows.

As for Catholicism dying, it isn't. It's just shifting. No longer centered in Old Europe, it's moving onto concentrated areas in North America and large portions of Africa. There's an underground movement in Asia and it's been in South America for a while now. So it's changing populations. But dying, no.

And what's with all the vitriol against Catholicism? All this "yeah, go ahead and follow the lies of the so-called church" and "Catholicism is the cause of all the world's problems" and all that. It seems to stem from that progressivism-Americanism-liberalism doctrine that if authorities say it, it must be wrong. It never seems to occur to some of these people that traditions that have been followed for 2000 years were originally true and continue to be true. You don't have to like Catholicism, but that doesn't mean you need to bully around or browbeat those that follow her doctrines. It's/They're a free countr(y/ies), and you can follow whatever faith you want, or none at all. So don't go telling people they're stupid for beliving what they want. Get over yourself. And can't we all just get along?

It's/They're a free countr(y/ies), and you can follow whatever faith you want, or none at all. So don't go telling people they're stupid for beliving what they want. Get over yourself. And can't we all just get along?
tell that to the missionaries

i dont think you can be "un-babtised" its like the boyscouts, your stuck with what your parents did to you

Not true. You can get a Satanic Baptism. There are two kinds of Satanic Baptisms, the adult version (ages 18 and over) and the children version (ages 4 and under).

The adult's baptism celebrates the individual's rejection of hypocrisy.

The children's baptism celebrates in the infant's freedom to find the truth for himself or herself and celebrates the miracle of the creation of the child.

The Satanic baptism is a celebration of life and freedom rather then a purification of "original sin" and preparing him or her for a life of blind devotion to an existing faith.

"What, it will be asked, will young readers, whose ages fall between the two baptisms, do to commit themselves to Satanism? The answer is that whether you are right or wrong, your beliefs will not be held valid by those outside unless money can be made on them. If enough of you believe in the principles of Satanism, they will find ways of making money on your faith. They, without realizing it, they will have contributed to Lucifer's rise by making popular what was shunned as evil. Your faith in Satanism need not to be formalized by baptism in order to become a Satanist. Your faith need only be outspokenly stated. That is what you can do." Passage 10-8 from the "Satanic Rituals".

I am authorized to preform baptisms. So who wants one?

Posted by the Satanic Priest, Lord Medivh

About Catholisim dying.

Dying would be the wrong word for it. I would call it. Fading. Catholisim is fading from their old ways. Their numbers aren't down that much, but their followers now rarely follow the rules of their own faith.

Yes, the next Pope will be the Black Pope!

Posted by the Satanic Priest, Lord Medivh

yeah, ehm, that's kind of not what we meant though, you'd still be listed as a catholic in the statistics if you did that

It's not Nostradamus, I believe it's one of the prophesies of Our Lady of Medjugorie, which hasn't officially been accepted as an apperition (sp?) and even the visionaries, one of whom I've met, aren't always 100% on what Our Lady is saying. So who knows.

As for Catholicism dying, it isn't. It's just shifting. No longer centered in Old Europe, it's moving onto concentrated areas in North America and large portions of Africa. There's an underground movement in Asia and it's been in South America for a while now. So it's changing populations. But dying, no.

And what's with all the vitriol against Catholicism? All this "yeah, go ahead and follow the lies of the so-called church" and "Catholicism is the cause of all the world's problems" and all that. It seems to stem from that progressivism-Americanism-liberalism doctrine that if authorities say it, it must be wrong. It never seems to occur to some of these people that traditions that have been followed for 2000 years were originally true and continue to be true. You don't have to like Catholicism, but that doesn't mean you need to bully around or browbeat those that follow her doctrines. It's/They're a free countr(y/ies), and you can follow whatever faith you want, or none at all. So don't go telling people they're stupid for beliving what they want. Get over yourself. And can't we all just get along?

Yes it is a free country … the reason we get so worked up is because that belief (which we think you are more then welcome to hold) is pushed onto us (hell look at the current ban on gay marriage)

We get upset when something we do not have faith in controls our lives for (as far as we can see) no logical reason. We tend to strike out at the source of this … the religion that spawned it. It’s a mistake but a very human one

Nothing. Don't let me get in the way of your delusion.

Because you certainly won't let him get in the way of yours, eh?