NationStates Jolt Archive


Us #1?

Letila
04-03-2005, 00:54
No. 1?

BY MICHAEL VENTURA

Letters at 3AM

No concept lies more firmly embedded in our national character than the
notion that the USA is "No. 1," "the greatest." Our broadcast media are,
in essence, continuous advertisements for the brand name "America Is No. 1."

Any office seeker saying otherwise would be committing political
suicide. In fact, anyone saying otherwise will be labeled "un-American."
We're an "empire," ain't we? Sure we are. An empire without a
manufacturing base. An empire that must borrow $2 billion a day from its
competitors in order to function. Yet the delusion is ineradicable.
We're No. 1. Well ... this is the country you really live in:

. The United States is 49th in the world in literacy (The New York
Times, Dec. 12, 2004). The United States ranked 28th out of 40 countries
in mathematical literacy (NYT, Dec. 12, 2004).

One-third of our science teachers and one-half of our math teachers did
not major in those subjects. (Quoted on The West Wing, but you can trust
it - their researchers are legendary.)

. Twenty percent of Americans think the sun orbits the Earth. Seventeen
percent believe the Earth revolves around the sun once a day (The Week,
Jan. 7, 2005).

?The International Adult Literacy Survey ... found that Americans with
less than nine years of education ?score worse than virtually all of the
other countries?? (Jeremy Rifkin's superbly documented book The European
Dream: How Europe's Vision of the Future Is Quietly Eclipsing the
American Dream, p.78).

. Our workers are so ignorant, and lack so many basic skills, that
American businesses spend $30 billion a year on remedial training (NYT,
Dec. 12, 2004). No wonder they relocate elsewhere!

. "The European Union leads the U.S. in ... the number of science and
engineering graduates; public research and development (R&D)
expenditures; and new capital raised" (The European Dream, p.70).

"Europe surpassed the United States in the mid-1990s as the largest
producer of scientific literature" (The European Dream, p.70).

Nevertheless, Congress cut funds to the National Science Foundation. The
agency will issue 1,000 fewer research grants this year (NYT, Dec. 21,
2004).

Foreign applications to U.S. grad schools declined 28% last year.
Foreign student enrollment on all levels fell for the first time in
three decades, but increased greatly in Europe and China. Last year
Chinese grad-school graduates in the U.S. dropped 56%, Indians 51%,
South Koreans 28% (NYT, Dec. 21, 2004). We're not the place to be anymore.

The World Health Organization "ranked the countries of the world in
terms of overall health performance, and the U.S. [was] ... 37th." In
the fairness of health care, we're 54th. "The irony is that the United
States spends more per capita for health care than any other nation in
the world" (The European Dream, pp.79-80). Pay more, get lots, lots less.

"The U.S. and South Africa are the only two developed countries in the
world that do not provide health care for all their citizens" (The
European Dream, p.80). Excuse me, but since when is South Africa a
"developed" country? Anyway, that's the company we're keeping.

Lack of health insurance coverage causes 18,000 unnecessary American
deaths a year. (That's six times the number of people killed on 9/11.)
(NYT, Jan. 12, 2005.)

"U.S. childhood poverty now ranks 22nd, or second to last, among the
developed nations. Only Mexico scores lower" (The European Dream, p.81).
Been to Mexico lately? Does it look "developed" to you? Yet it's the
only "developed" country to score lower in childhood poverty.

Twelve million American families, more than 10% of all U.S. Households,
"continue to struggle, and not always successfully, to feed themselves."
Families that "had members who actually went hungry at some point last
year" numbered 3.9 million (NYT, Nov. 22, 2004).

The United States is 41st in the world in infant mortality. Cuba scores
higher (NYT, Jan. 12, 2005).

Women are 70% more likely to die in childbirth in America than in Europe
(NYT, Jan. 12, 2005).

The leading cause of death of pregnant women in this country is murder
(CNN, Dec. 14, 2004).
Neo Cannen
04-03-2005, 00:58
Thank you. Someone pointing out US is not the best. Are you American? If so I better get a paper bag over my head. With this kind of paradox the universe is sure to fall apart soon...
Katganistan
04-03-2005, 01:09
Letila, if you are going to post someone else's essay/article, link the source and add your own commentary to it. Otherwise, it is considered spamming.
Letila
04-03-2005, 01:13
Thank you. Someone pointing out US is not the best. Are you American? If so I better get a paper bag over my head. With this kind of paradox the universe is sure to fall apart soon...

I was born in the empire, but I don't really consider myself to be American in a cultural sense.
The Black Forrest
04-03-2005, 01:16
A Source would be nice.

Little quotes don't really mean much especially when it involves surveys and statistics.

For example I am having a hard time beliving the claim that 60 million americans think the sun revolves around the earth.
Drunk commies
04-03-2005, 01:19
A Source would be nice.

Little quotes don't really mean much especially when it involves surveys and statistics.

For example I am having a hard time beliving the claim that 60 million americans think the sun revolves around the earth.
I once read in a tabloid that Cher beleives the moon is a part of the sun. I don't know if she's that dumb, but there are some deeply stupid people out there.
31
04-03-2005, 01:22
Most USians I know readily admit the fualts of their nation and rarely if ever say that the US is #1 in all areas. They readily admit that each country has strong and weak points.
I have read and seen many articles like the one posted on this thread. This is nothing new. I am not sure the point, it will change the minds of no one. If you love the US you will continue to love the US and if you dislike the US you will nod your head and agree with the article and continue to dislike the US.
The assertion that the media is somehow overwhelmingly pro-US I disagree with. Most news agencies are very critical of the US. I would, however, agree that most fictional shows that deal with national or global issues are biased toward the USian way of thinking but this is to be expected because they are written by USians who are grounded in the ideals of their country.
Why should we expect the people of a nation to run around telling everyone that their country sucks and is just not up to snuff? I certainly don't expect people from other countries to do so and in fact am embarassed when they do. Have a little national pride, I think. I meet a surprising number of Japanese who dislike their own nation and love either the US or European nations. It makes me cringe to listen to their self-hatred.
Alien Born
04-03-2005, 01:23
First I am not an American. I am an Englishman

If you take any country in the world you can find statistics, which in isolation apear to be highly important, that place that country in the lower echelons of the world rankings.
Statistics can be misused.
Things like American women are 70% more likely to die in childbirth than European ones. Over what period of time and which European ones. Just those all from Sweden, or does this include Albania as well.

The USA is 49th in literacy. How was this measured. Were the same criteria used everywhere? In Brazil, for a long time, if you could read and write your own name, nothing more, you were counted as literate. (No longer true). If you measure literacy like this in some countries, then in the USA you actually assess the person's ability to read, then the figures come out a little distorted.

This is not to say that the overweaning arrogance of the US is not something that should not be slapped down, but don't go too far the other way. Take your statistics with a healthy dose of cynicism.
Luporum
04-03-2005, 01:23
I once read in a tabloid that Cher beleives the moon is a part of the sun. I don't know if she's that dumb, but there are some deeply stupid people out there.

I wouldn't doubt that, I had an arguement not to long ago concerning whether the Earth was flat or not.

Most of those I can't in any way relate to, I see almost no poverty and people aren't that dumb where I live. Maybe it's because I've never left the eastern seaboard :D
Corisan
04-03-2005, 01:33
"The U.S. and South Africa are the only two developed countries in the
world that do not provide health care for all their citizens" (The
European Dream, p.80). Excuse me, but since when is South Africa a
"developed" country? Anyway, that's the company we're keeping.

Pssst I dont want to waste my tax dollars on some poor people, its not my problem! :headbang:
Evil Arch Conservative
04-03-2005, 01:56
First, you're un-American.

Second, I want to see corresponding statistics regarding European countries.

Third, that has a massive bent towards Socialism. We're one of two developed countries that doesn't provide all health care for our citizens? That's because we're also one of the more capitalistic countries. Socialism and Capitalism don't compare on such a scale.
Katganistan
04-03-2005, 01:59
I was born in the empire, but I don't really consider myself to be American in a cultural sense.

American Empire? Where is our Emperor?
Katganistan
04-03-2005, 02:01
First, you're un-American.

Dissent is a key part of being an American. Whether you agree with him is another story entirely.
Andaluciae
04-03-2005, 02:05
American Empire? Where is our Emperor?
Palpatine! Who else?

But seriously, I am massively picky about some of the stuff in this little blurb-fest. Like the literacy tests, for example. Literacy and vernacular varies from region to region, and if you use an "international" literacy test that isn't calibrated for each region, then you are making a major error in your test.

Or the fact that the EU leads the US in science and engineering grads and the like. Of course the obvious objection would be that there are 100 million more EU inhabitants than US inhabitants.

Or the charge that we don't provide everyone healthcare. I don't think it's because we can't. I'd say it's probably more because we don't want to. After all, Americans have supported reductions in welfare programs for the last quarter century.
Malkyer
04-03-2005, 02:11
I would take these statistics with a rather large grain of salt. After all, not too long ago there was a report/study thing that reported Norway as the #1 peacekeeping nation (i.e. sending troops to foreign countries to keep a lid on civil unrest), and the U.S. was something like number 20. If I can find the article I'll post the relevant parts, or link to them.
Calricstan
04-03-2005, 02:17
I (an Englishman) am very fond of America. Been there on a few occasions, having a wonderful time and meeting lots of wonderful people. I even married one of them. While it definitely has it's problems it's somewhere that I'd happily live.

The odd thing is that a surprising number of Americans not only viewed their country as the best in the world, but were genuinely surprised that anyone might think otherwise. I suspect that most people look favourably upon their own country - as David Sedaris says, you don't see many saying "We're number two!".
31
04-03-2005, 02:18
Or the charge that we don't provide everyone healthcare. I don't think it's because we can't. I'd say it's probably more because we don't want to. After all, Americans have supported reductions in welfare programs for the last quarter century.

I am walking, breathing proof that we do have healthcare for the poor. I am alive because we do. I returned from Japan, a socialist healthcare paradise, to have my surgery because I visited Japanese hospitals and was less than impressed.
I returned home with no job, and about 500.00 in the bank. I went to the county hospital, was checked in and had a lifesaving surgery three weeks later. I was given excellent care and every dime was paid for by the state of California. I am not required to pay back one cent.
So how is it that I received this care if it does not exist in the US? It sure existed for me and most of my fellow patients in that hospital.
Domici
04-03-2005, 04:34
A Source would be nice.

Little quotes don't really mean much especially when it involves surveys and statistics.

For example I am having a hard time beliving the claim that 60 million americans think the sun revolves around the earth.


It's not so much that they all really think it. There was a survey done a while back where they'd ask questions like
"How often does the sun go round the Earth?"
a) once a day
b) once a week
c) once a year
d) never.

It's sort of like that old joke.
Q. What's 3+4
A. Seven
Q. What's 10-3
A. Seven
Q. What 1995 film staring Brad Pitt, Morgan Freeman,, Gwenyth Paltrow and featuring Kevin Spacey showcased the deadly sins as the theme of a searial killers murders?
A. Seven
Q. How many weeks in a day?
A. Seve... D'oh!!! :headbang:

Many more people would have gotten it correct had the question been phrased more like "describe the spatial relationship between the Earth and the Sun."
Insequa
04-03-2005, 06:16
Excuse me, but since when is South Africa a "developed" country?
So speaking about America's shoddy education system...
Tanara
04-03-2005, 06:53
My rebuttal to the initial post is this...

Spotting the Losers: Seven Signs of Non-Competitive States by Ralph Peters (http://carlisle-www.army.mil/usawc/parameters/98spring/peters.htm)

When you leave the classroom or office and go into the world, you see at first its richness and confusions, the variety and tumult. Then, if you keep moving and do not quit looking, commonalties begin to emerge. National success is eccentric. But national failure is programmed and predictable. Spotting the future losers among the world's states becomes so easy it loses its entertainment value.

In this world of multiple and simultaneous revolutions--in technology, information, social organization, biology, economics, and convenience--the rules of international competition have changed. There is a global marketplace and, increasingly, a global economy. While there is no global culture yet, American popular culture is increasingly available and wickedly appealing--and there are no international competitors in the field, only struggling local systems. Where the United States does not make the rules of international play, it shapes them by its absence.

The invisible hand of the market has become an informal but uncompromising lawgiver. Globalization demands conformity to the practices of the global leaders, especially to those of the United States. If you do not conform--or innovate--you lose. If you try to quit the game, you lose even more profoundly. The rules of international competition, whether in the economic, cultural, or conventional military fields, grow ever more homogeneous. No government can afford practices that retard development. Yet such practices are often so deeply embedded in tradition, custom, and belief that the state cannot jettison them. That which provides the greatest psychological comfort to members of foreign cultures is often that which renders them noncompetitive against America's explosive creativity--our self-reinforcing dynamism fostered by law, efficiency, openness, flexibility, market discipline, and social mobility.

Traditional indicators of noncompetitive performance still apply: corruption (the most seductive activity humans can consummate while clothed); the absence of sound, equitably enforced laws; civil strife; or government attempts to overmanage a national economy. As change has internationalized and accelerated, however, new predictive tools have emerged. They are as simple as they are fundamental, and they are rooted in culture. The greater the degree to which a state--or an entire civilization--succumbs to these "seven deadly sins" of collective behavior, the more likely that entity is to fail to progress or even to maintain its position in the struggle for a share of the world's wealth and power. Whether analyzing military capabilities, cultural viability, or economic potential, these seven factors offer a quick study of the likely performance of a state, region, or population group in the coming century.

The Seven Factors

These key "failure factors" are:

Restrictions on the free flow of information.
The subjugation of women.
Inability to accept responsibility for individual or collective failure.
The extended family or clan as the basic unit of social organization.
Domination by a restrictive religion.
A low valuation of education.
Low prestige assigned to work.

There's more, ( much more) and it is an excellent read, definitely worth taking the time to read seriously. I don't agree completely ( I'm not exactly into the glorification of work, but then again I'm lazy and he is talking on a national scope not individual ) with everything in there.

This article was written in 98 but it is still valid.
Pepe Dominguez
04-03-2005, 07:27
USA = #1, baby. You all know it. :D

Someone had to say that, or else the original post wouldn't make any sense. I mean, what good is a stereotype without anecdotal evidence to point to?

Seriously though, I'm not up on the statistics, but there isn't anywhere else I'd rather live than the U.S., and that's not just because, as a law student, all the knowledge that I possess is useless anyplace else. ;)

I'd also be a bit skeptical about the original article, as it seems to come from someone who actually believes it'd be a good thing if the government ran all healthcare programs... maybe they aught to visit the DMV some time... Besides, no one is turned down for treatment at any hospital in the U.S. under any circumstances, and we don't even pay 30% of our incomes for "free" care.
Demented Hamsters
04-03-2005, 07:40
"Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. 14% of people know that."
Homer Simpson.
Thelona
04-03-2005, 07:53
Letila, if you are going to post someone else's essay/article, link the source and add your own commentary to it. Otherwise, it is considered spamming.

It looks to be from a regular columnist in the Austin Chronicle. This particular article was published on 21 January, 2005.

Article (http://www.austinchronicle.com/issues/dispatch/2005-01-21/cols_ventura.html)
My Romania
04-03-2005, 07:57
Seriously though, I'm not up on the statistics, but there isn't anywhere else I'd rather live than the U.S., and that's not just because, as a law student, all the knowledge that I possess is useless anyplace else. ;)


Seriously.. what do u know about other countrys?;) thats why u wouldnt live someplace else.. because ur informational system only transmit the bad parts of other countrys. Questions like when did that country becomed civilised is dumb and funny in a way.. it proves how US citisens really dont know shit about the world anymore.

i dont know about the sun revolving question.. it looks 2 much even for me..and i never though americans are bright.
Its funny 2 see that none of the americans who replied to this thread dont believe any of thouse statistics. Never though that maybe u cant believe just because ur mass-media system is kinda fucked-up?
Pepe Dominguez
04-03-2005, 08:04
Seriously.. what do u know about other countrys?;) thats why u wouldnt live someplace else.. because ur informational system only transmit the bad parts of other countrys. Questions like when did that country becomed civilised is dumb and funny in a way.. it proves how US citisens really dont know shit about the world anymore.

i dont know about the sun revolving question.. it looks 2 much even for me..and i never though americans are bright.
Its funny 2 see that none of the americans who replied to this thread dont believe any of thouse statistics. Never though that maybe u cant believe just because ur mass-media system is kinda fucked-up?

I hope to God English isn't your first language..

My "informational system" is based on travel to a number of countries, and from more than enough accurate information about different places. That's about the only question I can gather from your presumptuous gibberish.
My Romania
04-03-2005, 08:09
I hope to God English isn't your first language..

My "informational system" is based on travel to a number of countries, and from more than enough accurate information about different places. That's about the only question I can gather from your presumptuous gibberish.

actualy english is not even my second language.
why all americans (and only them) think what i say is gibberish? i really wonder..
Trammwerk
04-03-2005, 08:13
I love the United States. I love our history, our people, and yes, even our culture. I want to travel the world, see everything I can, meet everyone I can - but ultimately, I think, I'll end up back here, Stateside.

Yeah, it has flaws. Big ones. Gaping ones. But it's my country, damn it.

And I believe the whole "Empire" comment is based more on the political system we use abroad as opposed to our domestic form of government, although I would note that the oligarchy/plutocracy that's showing up in the United States is quite, quite disturbing.
My Romania
04-03-2005, 08:17
I love the United States. I love our history, our people, and yes, even our culture. I want to travel the world, see everything I can, meet everyone I can - but ultimately, I think, I'll end up back here, Stateside.

Yeah, it has flaws. Big ones. Gaping ones. But it's my country, damn it.

And I believe the whole "Empire" comment is based more on the political system we use abroad as opposed to our domestic form of government, although I would note that the oligarchy/plutocracy that's showing up in the United States is quite, quite disturbing.

this is a good post IMO.

i love my country but it has flaws.

also i would like to know how many of your fellows americans know what lets say oligarchy means without searchin into a dictionary.
Thelona
04-03-2005, 08:17
And I believe the whole "Empire" comment is based more on the political system we use abroad as opposed to our domestic form of government [...]

Precisely. Nobody I talk to about US politics even understands how the US government works, let alone particularly care about it as anything more than a curiosity. It's the way it treats the rest of the world that engenders those comments.
Bodesty
04-03-2005, 08:41
this is a good post IMO.

i love my country but it has flaws.

also i would like to know how many of your fellows americans know what lets say oligarchy means without searchin into a dictionary.

I'm an American.
Oligarchy, w/o dictionary: A system of gevernment where the power is in the hands of a select few.

checking dictionary now..."Government by a few, especially by a small faction of persons or families."

Not too bad. I'm rather impressed with myself.

And I, too, love my country despite its flaws. Especially in liberal Portland, where I live (legal gay marrige for a bit last year...I know a couple that got married, actually) there are many students at my HS who are anti american. No pride in the US, quite disaproving of the actions fo the current (and many past) administrations. There are also crazy (IMHO) republicans, and many ex-patriots of other countries, esp. Japan.

We're rather diverse--all geenralizations made here should eb understood to be jsut that.
My Romania
04-03-2005, 08:49
I'm an American.

We're rather diverse--all geenralizations made here should eb understood to be jsut that.

well you are probably right.. :p
Gadolinia
04-03-2005, 09:22
As an american graduate student in the hard sciences in the US, i was appalled by these "facts" many of which couldn't be further from the truth. don't post any more crap like this.





. "The European Union leads the U.S. in ... the number of science and
engineering graduates; public research and development (R&D)
expenditures; and new capital raised" (The European Dream, p.70).

US spends nearly 2x as much as EU on science. The EU is falling behind and fast. For years there has been a massive brain drain (american universities hiring away the best scientists) by the US. Look at Nobel prize winning domination by the US--In the last 20 years, Americans have been shut out of chemistry nobel twice ('91 '88) and three times in medicine ('91, '96, '87). Having done research in germany, i can tell you labs are much better outfitted in the US--any foreign graduate student will undoubtedly agree.

"Europe surpassed the United States in the mid-1990s as the largest
producer of scientific literature" (The European Dream, p.70).

hmmm doubtful, but even so, the number of publications is no measure of the quality of publications. Most of the top jurnals are US-based, and US researchers tend to publish in them before publishing in EU journals.

Nevertheless, Congress cut funds to the National Science Foundation. The
agency will issue 1,000 fewer research grants this year (NYT, Dec. 21,
2004).

Not true. Though certain funding areas were reduced, overall dollars being spent increased (as it does every year).

Foreign applications to U.S. grad schools declined 28% last year.
Foreign student enrollment on all levels fell for the first time in
three decades,

yes applications have declined due to visa restrictions, but I highly doubt by over 1/4, furthermore, US applicants are up, and total grad. student entrants are higher than they have been in years.


just found an interesting article from Euro-Time Magazine talking about EU science woes here is a clip from it:

..the big buyer [of science] is the U.S.: in 2000, the U.S. spent €287 billion on research and development, €121 billion more than the E.U. No wonder the U.S. has 78% more high-tech patents per capita than Europe, which is especially weak in the IT and biotech sectors

http://www.time.com/time/europe/magazine/printout/0,13155,901040119-574849,00.html
Thelona
04-03-2005, 09:43
You gripe about his "facts", yet you don't actually address many of them.

US spends nearly 2x as much as EU on science.

How do you measure this? I suspect you're including corporate funding, while the other numbers aren't. US corporations contribute a great deal to university research.

Even your link below doesn't support this statement.

hmmm doubtful, but even so, the number of publications is no measure of the quality of publications. Most of the top jurnals are US-based, and US researchers tend to publish in them before publishing in EU journals.

Are you ceding the point? Sounds like it.

Not true. Though certain funding areas were reduced, overall dollars being spent increased (as it does every year).

If you're going to disagree with the original statement, you should source your argument.

yes applications have declined due to visa restrictions, but I highly doubt by over 1/4, furthermore, US applicants are up, and total grad. student entrants are higher than they have been in years.

Once again, a source would be useful. It sounds like you're accepting that the original statement may be true.
Whinging Trancers
04-03-2005, 13:17
As an american graduate student in the hard sciences in the US, i was appalled by these "facts" many of which couldn't be further from the truth. don't post any more crap like this.

Quote:
. "The European Union leads the U.S. in ... the number of science and
engineering graduates; public research and development (R&D)
expenditures; and new capital raised" (The European Dream, p.70).


US spends nearly 2x as much as EU on science. The EU is falling behind and fast. For years there has been a massive brain drain (american universities hiring away the best scientists) by the US. Look at Nobel prize winning domination by the US--In the last 20 years, Americans have been shut out of chemistry nobel twice ('91 '88) and three times in medicine ('91, '96, '87). Having done research in germany, i can tell you labs are much better outfitted in the US--any foreign graduate student will undoubtedly agree.


Europe is producing more science and engineering graduates than the US, hence you having to have this Brain Drain to cope with the fact that you haven't produced enough home grown ones...
Whinging Trancers
04-03-2005, 13:22
The second half of the original article gets even more interesting, well worth further reading...
back to the original article (http://www.austinchronicle.com/issues/dispatch/2005-01-21/cols_ventura.html)
though I can understand it not having been posted originally due to the size of it. Read further for more on American growth, economics, businesses and more.

The comments on American attitudes to torture are particularly relevant at the moment, IMO.
United East Asia
04-03-2005, 13:33
I only need to look at the latest PISA study and I feel sorry for the whole western world, not just the US.
Bunnyducks
04-03-2005, 13:54
So Finland isn't part of the western world then? :)
Psylos
04-03-2005, 14:10
This #1 thingy is a renmant of the cold war propaganda.
Most statistics which show the US as #1 are US based. My country is always #1 in statistics published here. The difference is that here people don't buy them that much.
Whispering Legs
04-03-2005, 14:58
This #1 thingy is a renmant of the cold war propaganda.
Most statistics which show the US as #1 are US based. My country is always #1 in statistics published here. The difference is that here people don't buy them that much.

If you can, get a copy of the Great Soviet Encyclopedia.

There you will learn that everything was invented or discovered by the people of the Soviet Union. Also, that all wars were started by squabbling among fascists, and stopped by the Soviet Union.

Everyone thinks they are number one.

I've seen a slight bias even in Encyclopedia Brittanica. But it's subtle. For example, their take on who the first man to break the sound barrier goes to an Englishman - naturally. But here in the US, we don't count his effort as he didn't survive the trip - his plane disintegrated in flight.

I don't believe that any nation is #1 overall, or first in most, or anything like that.

In specific, selective areas, you can definitely say one nation is better - for now - at this specific moment in time. They don't stay that way.
Alien Born
04-03-2005, 15:12
I've seen a slight bias even in Encyclopedia Brittanica. But it's subtle. For example, their take on who the first man to break the sound barrier goes to an Englishman - naturally. But here in the US, we don't count his effort as he didn't survive the trip - his plane disintegrated in flight.


The Encyclopedia Britannica, despite its name is now American.

Encyclopædia Britannica, Inc., headquartered in Chicago, Illinois, is a leading provider of learning and knowledge products. We're proud to be one of the world's most trusted sources of information on every topic imaginable - from the origins of the universe to current events and everything in between.
source (http://corporate.britannica.com/about/)


Apparently it moved in the late 1920s so breaking the sound barrier happened after it moved.

A point for the USA here.
NianNorth
04-03-2005, 15:31
If you can, get a copy of the Great Soviet Encyclopedia.

There you will learn that everything was invented or discovered by the people of the Soviet Union. Also, that all wars were started by squabbling among fascists, and stopped by the Soviet Union.

Everyone thinks they are number one.

I've seen a slight bias even in Encyclopedia Brittanica. But it's subtle. For example, their take on who the first man to break the sound barrier goes to an Englishman - naturally. But here in the US, we don't count his effort as he didn't survive the trip - his plane disintegrated in flight.

I don't believe that any nation is #1 overall, or first in most, or anything like that.

In specific, selective areas, you can definitely say one nation is better - for now - at this specific moment in time. They don't stay that way.
Quite agree. Sound barrier one is a bit of a sore point as the US conned the UK out of its' research, so enabling the US to have the tail plane etc to allow their lane to fly supersonically. But I do get you point, it's like the claim that a US citizen was the first to attain powered flight or invent the incandesant light bulb. If you dig you find boths claims are techniclly flase. But every country is guilty of this to some degree, just some more than others.
I_Hate_Cows
04-03-2005, 15:39
First, you're un-American.

Second, I want to see corresponding statistics regarding European countries.

Third, that has a massive bent towards Socialism. We're one of two developed countries that doesn't provide all health care for our citizens? That's because we're also one of the more capitalistic countries. Socialism and Capitalism don't compare on such a scale.
That is the msot asinine thing I have ever seen in light of the fact the government pays more per capita for healthcare than any other nation
Jester III
04-03-2005, 17:02
hmmm doubtful, but even so, the number of publications is no measure of the quality of publications. Most of the top jurnals are US-based, and US researchers tend to publish in them before publishing in EU journals.
This works both ways. A acquaintance of mine is a scientist of international reknown, a leading specialist for non-destructive testing of concrete. He is from Romania, lives here in Germany, taught in France etc. But most of his publications were in american journals. That doesnt mean he doesnt publish in Europe, but he gets more attention there, because the american publications of reknown are required read for specialists here, while german or romanian journals dont get much attention over the pond.