NationStates Jolt Archive

I'm curious about what people think of this. Especially by a country break down. Just some information that would be interesting if Australia were to become a US state:

Australia would be the second or third largest state by population in the US. Australia would probably have about 34 electors in the electoral college (by my guess). The US would be the largest country in the world by land area, with a land area of 17 318 269 km² compared to Russia's 17,075,200 km².

I wonder if Australia did become a US state:
Who would be governor?
What would happen to the ALP and coalition?
Would Australia be red or blue?
Would more people move to America from Australia than the other way around?

-snip-

No it shouldn't.

Although this is in the fantasy realm of things. I would welcome a union between USA and Oz. Would also welcome a union with Canada too. Not a onesided union. Equal of course. But this will always stay in the realm of hypothetical. I couldnt ever imagine this happening.

I don't support Australia becoming a state of the US, because Canada should annex the US anyway.
:p

I'm surprised so many Americans are against it. Any reasons?

Well, the whole thing strikes me as wrong (that and it would be viewed as a Bad Thing™ by those in Southeast Asia), but I can't pose a more thorough counterargument unless Snorklenork explains some reasoning beyond curiosity in demographics, especially whether he's an American or an Australian or some other nationality.

I'm surprised so many Americans are against it. Any reasons?

The affect it would have on our politics. Plus I'm sure you Australians would just absolutely love our immigration policy. "Hey you were born here? Well here's your citizenship card, what you were born 2 inches over the border by an illegal immigrant Mexican mother who only had one foot over the border line at time of birth? Not a problem, so how much welfare will you be needing?"

I'm against it. America is America because we share a common history, a common land, different but still common heritages. Australia, though a lovely country that I respect and admire, is not American.

Nah, f it's worthwhile doing its worthwhile getting someone else to do it, so let America become the next Australian state! :cool:

Seriously, geography would be a pretty big problem.

I'm against it. America is America because we share a common history, a common land, different but still common heritages. Australia, though a lovely country that I respect and admire, is not American.Australia and the US share a common heritage: both countries were stolen from the natives by the British. But I wouldn't want Australia to become part of the US, since I plan on moving there to escape America.

Well, the whole thing strikes me as wrong (that and it would be viewed as a Bad Thing™ by those in Southeast Asia), but I can't pose a more thorough counterargument unless Snorklenork explains some reasoning beyond curiosity in demographics, especially whether he's an American or an Australian or some other nationality.
It's mainly curiousity. That, and to look at how things are going, we're moving toward greater integration in a lot of ways, and I'm curious how far people want it taken.

I'm Australian, and I'm probably in a massive minority in being for it. The reason I'm for it is because the alternative is that Australia slowly moves closer and closer to the US, losing sovreignty, but not gaining any share in the say of what happens to it.

Edit: That and we'd go from being a rather small insignificant country to being a great US state. ;)

Wait, WHY would the Aussies want to be a state of our own?

It'd be nice, but I mean really...

Edit: That and we'd go from being a rather small insignificant country to being a great US state. ;)

Hahahahahahahaha!!!! And how young are you? :D

Hahahahahahahaha!!!! And how young are you? :D
Winking smiley means something is jocular.

I don't think Australia should become a state of the US. While we are a small country we do some great things. For instance, I think we manage the environment and social welfare better than our American counterparts. We do not have as big a homelessness problem, we do not have a huge religious conservative movement and we have more of a say in how our country runs precisely because we are smaller. There are many great things about the US, but there are also a lot of very bad things such as poor gun control, the imperialist notions of some American leaders, the increasing power of religious conservatives, juggernaut corporations, their health system etc. We would do better to look to all the nations in the world to see what is 'best practice' rather than join the largest and most powerful country. Perhaps we would take on some American ways of doing things, but I think we could also learn from the Scandinavian and lowland countries, Germany etc. I mean do you measure the greatness of a country by its size, money and military might or by the health and happiness of its people and environment??

i'm for canada annexing the blue states and forming the United Pancanadian Commonwealth of North America... then ethnically cleansing Quebec just for the hell of it to prove to the world they aren't a bunch of pussies.

Isn't Australia still a British protectorate?

Yes, those poor, poor oppressed, third-world nation of Australia. Bet they're barely civilized, eh? If anything, the US should invade and liberate them from... from... oh! I know! Liberate them from the alligators. Those are nasty terrorists. :D

That said, it is relieving that all three groups are against it, Australians, Americans and others. Though I note that we others (ie. Europeans and Asians, mainly) are unanimous. I wonder if it has anything to do with neither of us much liking America, and, in the case of Asia, being not too comfortable with the idea of them having an outpost on our doorstep.

Isn't Australia still a British protectorate?
well it didn't stop us from interfering in their internal politics in the 70s with the cia, why should it stop us from annexing them.

i'm for canada annexing the blue states and forming the United Pancanadian Commonwealth of North America... then ethnically cleansing Quebec just for the hell of it to prove to the world they aren't a bunch of pussies.
Seconded!

:: looking at the pool results :: I'm surprised how many third world countries have voted...do you guys need food? :: shakes head :: Poor UK we'll send some food...wait...2/3 of my family died in Ireland due to Brits. opression. :mad: :mp5: :sniper: :gundge: hhhmmmm. We'll send patatoes.
BTW: 2/3 of my family did die before comming to the U.S. Thoes that stayed behind lived untill 1980s(not the people, but the family line) when they were killed because they were "IRA". I'm not bitter I'm just making a point. The point is....


:eek: Austrailia isn't a Third world country? :eek:

Just kiddin. ;) :p Australia we love you. :fluffle: <--not quite that much...

On one hand, there would be all sorts of problems caused by turning Australia into a state, both in how politics would change and otherwise. On the other hand, it would mean that the United States could now claim the Box Jellyfish to be an American animal, which would boost the coolness factor of the country significantly. Hard to make a decision.

I'd be for it. The more the merrier.

I'm against it. America is America because we share a common history, a common land, different but still common heritages. Australia, though a lovely country that I respect and admire, is not American.

Visit Massachusetts, Texas, and Hawaii. When you're done getting to know the natives you tell me that again. The differences between these states are just as great, if not greater, then the differences between Australia and any given state. One of the tenents of the United States has always been that we welcome diverse cultures as long as they can come together under the values of government that the country was founded on. Surely this hasn't been given up since last I checked?

We do not have as big a homelessness problem

That's not a huge problem here. For those that are homeless this country has some of the best services, some public and many private, on the planet to deal with it if the homeless desire to take advantage of them.


I mean do you measure the greatness of a country by its size, money and military might or by the health and happiness of its people and environment

Both. Health and happiness are things to strive for and size, money, and military might sure go a long way in helping to attain the things that give health and happiness. Those countries don't just give out government subsidized happiness and health, they tax you to pay for it and then they give it to you.

well it didn't stop us from interfering in their internal politics in the 70s with the cia, why should it stop us from annexing them.

You don't have to publically declare one of them. Well... hmm, there's a thought. Maybe you don't have to publically declare either.

I don't support Australia becoming a state of the US, because Canada should annex the US anyway.
:p

You want to call the Shrub a Canadian? :eek:

I am from a 3rd country.

If Australia want to join the USA or EU, they are more then welcome to do it as far as I am concerned.

The EU would require little reworking. The USA current system would not work very well, so IMO for their best interest they would need to work something else to make sure Australia best interest are developped and they didnt become a 3rd world country. IMO, USA are to centralized for the well beeing of 90% of the country. Yet some centralisation worldwide would be good, but not everything. Especially on the matter of entering WAR and invading 3rd countries. At the very least, Australia would need to maintain it current divisions and make many States of those provinces.

Yet, as a Canadian, my opinion matter very little here.

actually, Australia would be 6 states...we should annex New Zealand too... (another state, maybe 2), plus part of Canada north and west of Quebec (add another 7 states) and then we should annex Mexico, thus solving the immigration crisis forever... for another 13 states...

wouldn't the US Flag look really spiffy with another 28 stars.. might as well add DC and Puerto Rico to make it an even 30 extra ... an 80 Star banner would look very imposing

I don't think Australia should become a state of the US. While we are a small country we do some great things. For instance, I think we manage the environment and social welfare better than our American counterparts. We do not have as big a homelessness problem, we do not have a huge religious conservative movement and we have more of a say in how our country runs precisely because we are smaller. There are many great things about the US, but there are also a lot of very bad things such as poor gun control, the imperialist notions of some American leaders, the increasing power of religious conservatives, juggernaut corporations, their health system etc. We would do better to look to all the nations in the world to see what is 'best practice' rather than join the largest and most powerful country. Perhaps we would take on some American ways of doing things, but I think we could also learn from the Scandinavian and lowland countries, Germany etc. I mean do you measure the greatness of a country by its size, money and military might or by the health and happiness of its people and environment??

I agree on that. Good thing about beeing european is that ur not told that ur country is the biggest the greatest the land of the brave the bla bla.. and dont believe everything in this world is there just to be conquered :p

although it would be even more fun to have Australia annex Canada, the US and New Zealand... just think of how big a superpower Australia would be then... might as well have Australia reannex Papau, plus Fiji, and the various Pacific Island states too....

then we conquer the British Isles...... ;)

Well...about Canada becoming part of USA...

Alberta would be happy to be Americans. Saskatchewan, the Maritimes and Manitoba would ask how much you pay them to join. Ontario would turn a terrorist country before joining the US no matter what, it would be harder to quell them then it was with the Dixies. BC would only join California after they secede from USA and would tell you to bum off until then. Québec would ask for a Véto and 347195 new laws regarding french...

But beside those points and the fact that the main 3 provinces are nearly impossible to satisfy, I see this as a detail to get Canada into the USA...also, the Federal government of Canada would never allow any secession of Canada prior a first independant Québec.

I couldn't say no fast enough.

Seriously, blah! It's bad enough as it is, like we need any MORE American domination.

And I have no desire to pay for university and health care etc other than out of my taxes. No thank you. And I think we'll keep out minimum wage thanks.

actually, Australia would be 6 states...we should annex New Zealand too... (another state, maybe 2), plus part of Canada north and west of Quebec (add another 7 states) and then we should annex Mexico, thus solving the immigration crisis forever... for another 13 states...

wouldn't the US Flag look really spiffy with another 28 stars.. might as well add DC and Puerto Rico to make it an even 30 extra ... an 80 Star banner would look very imposing

and hey.. if u got to 80 starts why stop there? lets just get the whole world and call it AMERICA! then youll have enough stars to be incapable of learning wich everyone means :headbang:
:rolleyes:

Ugh.

Yes, those poor, poor oppressed, third-world nation of Australia. Bet they're barely civilized, eh? If anything, the US should invade and liberate them from... from... oh! I know! Liberate them from the alligators. Those are nasty terrorists. :D
We have crocodiles, not alligators :p

I think it is a stupid idea... Australia is the richest nation in the Southern Hemisphere, it is the America of the Asia-Pacific region... we don't NEED the US, we're big enough bullies on our own :D Though if Johnny Howard had his way he'd be giving Bush blowjobs on a full time basis...

Personally, I'd like to see California become their own nation, and then they can join Australia to become... MAGNUS PACIFICUS... because they Hawaii would join us, and we could prolly get Alaska on the act, and we would just bring all the Pacific nations on to our side, and by that time New Zealand would want to join in the fun... Then we would be the most powerful nation in the world because we would control half the world's surface... literally! MWAHAHAHA!

And you know the BEST part of this plan? Arnold Schwarzenegger would be President! I mean, most Aussies supported him in the Californian election, and wouldn't mind him ruling our country... And I'd like to see Bush argue against him...

Plus the entertainment industry would be amazing, because you'd combine the money of Hollywood with the best actors and scenery... yes... this plan is good... good...

You've got to be joking - we're too closely allied to the US as it is. One of the best things Keating did while in power was to try and forge closer ties to Asia - something that Howard and Downer have done a great deal to break down.

And I think we'll keep out minimum wage thanks.

It's here - it's just largely state-determined.

No as then I would have to call myself an American, that would be an embarassment.

It's here - it's just largely state-determined.
I think Pri meant that we'll keep our minimum wage that you can actually live on. Just.

As an American, I feel that Australia needs to be remain independent so we have somewhere that we can flee to if our country continues to act looney. If only Australia would assert a little independence from following our beloved leader in all of his idiocy, that would be great.

If only Australia would assert a little independence from following our beloved leader in all of his idiocy, that would be great.

Believe me, some of us are trying to change that. :)

I think Pri meant that we'll keep our minimum wage that you can actually live on. Just.

Ah, scuzzi. It's just there's a bit in the news lately between the unions and the government about changing the minimum wage laws.

We have crocodiles, not alligators

Most Americans wouldn't notice the difference, I believe. :p

As an australian, id like to see us keep our health care system that works, our constitution that dosent spawn gun nuts, our drugs that dont cost 20 bucks for painkillers and all the other good things about australia.

Serioesly though they can have Adelaide, thats a hole.

Serioesly though they can have Adelaide, thats a hole.

Yeah, place hasn't been the same since I left. ;)

Also im sure america wouldnt sneeze at the extra revenue brought in by Newcastle, what with it having the biggest port in all of the commenwealth, granted commenwealth isnt the world, but still thats pretty awsome!

You're poll is stupid. I don't support it and I'm from a first world country.

As an australian, id like to see us keep our health care system that works, our constitution that dosent spawn gun nuts, our drugs that dont cost 20 bucks for painkillers and all the other good things about australia.

Serioesly though they can have Adelaide, thats a hole.


Victorian?

Adelaide is the Defence hub of Australia mate, and once we get that shipping contract we be even better :)

As to the topic raised.

NO, NO, NO!!!!!!! (Mommy make the insane person stop saying bad things).

Australia is better than america in many ways, if we were to join the USA we would lose them. Also I bet the USA farmers would push to lower our custom standards so they can import infected goods & ruin our crops. Not on purpose I suppose but the USA has rabbies, foot and mouth & a lot of other bad things that would ruin our crops.

Well, I wouldn't want Australia to become a state at this point in history. Things are just too fucked up for us in America right now, courtesy of the Republicans (and also the Democrats, but mostly the Republicans).

Now, It would be nice to see Australia become a state, say, about 40 years in the future. And it'd also be nice to see our government totally crack down on religious zealotry, along with evil corporations that screw us on a daily basis. Sadly, this isn't a perfect world, and these things aren't gonna happen, not even in 50 years. 'Tis a nice thought, though.

Victorian?

Adelaide is the Defence hub of Australia mate, and once we get that shipping contract we be even better :)

As to the topic raised.

NO, NO, NO!!!!!!! (Mommy make the insane person stop saying bad things).

Australia is better than america in many ways, if we were to join the USA we would lose them. Also I bet the USA farmers would push to lower our custom standards so they can import infected goods & ruin our crops. Not on purpose I suppose but the USA has rabbies, foot and mouth & a lot of other bad things that would ruin our crops.


Have you heard about the shit Purina's been doing for the past 25 years? They're the cause of the Mad Cow scare. It's already known that cows eating their own, slaughtered kind can cause the Bovine Spongiform disease, yet they're maintaining slaughtered cow as the main food source for beef cattle. And if you've ever been by a cattle ranch, you'd know why Foot & Mouth disease is so easily spread. Those ranches are some of the filthiest, most poorly-kept tracts of land on earth, second only to the heavy manufacturing industries of the early 1900's.

Uncontrolled Capitalism. Such a great system.

You're poll is stupid. I don't support it and I'm from a first world country.

It doesn't say "third-world" country. It says third country. As in not the first two mentioned.

I would welcome Australia into the union, but why would they want to. It seems like they have a pretty good thing going.

Ah, scuzzi. It's just there's a bit in the news lately between the unions and the government about changing the minimum wage laws.

Yup. Spaam was right about what I meant. Although I see your point, we may not have a decent minimum wage much longer if things keep going.

I'm curious about what people think of this. Especially by a country break down. Just some information that would be interesting if Australia were to become a US state:

Australia would be the second or third largest state by population in the US. Australia would probably have about 34 electors in the electoral college (by my guess). The US would be the largest country in the world by land area, with a land area of 17 318 269 km² compared to Russia's 17,075,200 km².

I wonder if Australia did become a US state:
Who would be governor?
What would happen to the ALP and coalition?
Would Australia be red or blue?
Would more people move to America from Australia than the other way around?

I think the idea is kind of arrogant - not to start flinging mudd or anything - but Australia can take care of itself, there is no reason it should or even would consider becoming a state of another country when their country is fully capible of taking care of itself and it's governing bodies. It's like saying that we should make England, Germany, Canada, or some other fully economically developed country a state that is part of the US. I'm an American and I am against it. It's belittling an entire nation. Although I would not be opposed to an actual world council that had true power with representation from all nations, but that is completely different.

The way the votes break down is interesting. 88% of Australians are against it, 66% of Americans are against it, and 100% of all other countries.

So I guess the Americans want Australia more than Australia wants America. :p

Are we kidding? Different people, different cultures and, last-but-not-least, TWO continents!

Bush's arm will have grown long indeed if he thinks his imperial ambitions can reach us here :)

yes I love LOTR quotes ;)

I can't think of a single reason why any sane Australian would want their country to become a part of the USA. They're already a part of the British Commonwealth and a fair number of them don't even want to retain that nowadays.

I'm vehemently against any sign of Australia becoming a state of the US. After all, it would be more regulated than Australia ever was under the iron rule of British Commonwealth, as the colonies and later as a dominion. In fact, I would rather support Australia becoming a republic, given how dire a situation the British Royal Family is in and how Charles is likely to become the next King.

But I am content for Australia to remain as an independent nation. Australia is not as close to the US as one might think it is. Sure, its military and political ties to the US are second only to Britain, but in terms of economicall Australia and the US are far apart; only the recent FTA has sought to bring the two economies together. Right now, Australia has far closer economic and social ties to Southeast Asia, especially Indonesia, given the recent tsunamis.

On a practical note, It would be near impossible for the US to admininister any form of government over Australia given the distance between them and the logisitics. Look at Alaska, Hawaii and Puerto Rico. I doubt these three have the same government type as the rest of the states since they're separate from the mainland. Well, Australia is twice as far as Hawaii and its already got an established form of government that will take years to change.

I'm surprised so many Americans are against it. Any reasons?

We already have Texas. We don't need another large state that's half desert with unbridled machismo and a poor enviromental record.

We already have Texas. We don't need another large state that's half desert with unbridled machismo and a poor enviromental record.

Ah, but we're MORE than half desert :p

And we have, uh, er... kangaroos!

But more seriously, no fucking way. We have enough right wing lunatics here NOW, without encouraging them any further.

actually, Australia would be 6 states...we should annex New Zealand too... (another state, maybe 2), plus part of Canada north and west of Quebec (add another 7 states) and then we should annex Mexico, thus solving the immigration crisis forever... for another 13 states...

wouldn't the US Flag look really spiffy with another 28 stars.. might as well add DC and Puerto Rico to make it an even 30 extra ... an 80 Star banner would look very imposing

I assume if you read the above you are familiar with parody?

Of course the US wouldn't annex Australia and naturally Australians don't want to be Americans. But history is about change, so who can tell what the future will bring.

I still like the idea of Australia annexing us...lol...