NationStates Jolt Archive

I was just thinking about the possibilities of time travel and all the theories surrounding it. So I was just wondering what are any of your opinons on the matter of time travel. Things such as paradoxes, personal beliefes, anything you want.

Forwards- possible
Backwards- no

I seriously doubt it. If it was possible, then we would be overrun by time travelers.

I was just thinking about the possibilities of time travel and all the theories surrounding it. So I was just wondering what are any of your opinons on the matter of time travel. Things such as paradoxes, personal beliefes, anything you want.

Since the laws of physics at this time forbid it, I have to say time travel is impossible. You can go forward, but not backward.

If time travel did come into existince some idiot or group of idiots would probably use it and end up destroying mankind, so time travel isn't a very good idea.

If time travel did come into existince some idiot or group of idiots would probably use it and end up destroying mankind, so time travel isn't a very good idea.

Gee......that sounds really....logical and well-supported. Thanks for adding well-thought-out discussion material! :rolleyes:

If time travel did come into existince some idiot or group of idiots would probably use it and end up destroying mankind, so time travel isn't a very good idea.

therefore, we would all be dead now. I know if time travel were possible, there would be people like me who would go back and screw everything up. since we aren't all dead, time travel will never be possible


or. Time travel is possible, and what we see now IS everything all screwed up

John Titor sounded interesting, but I lost interest after his "sideways-on-time" -padded theories fell flat this month, this year.

therefore, we would all be dead now. I know if time travel were possible, there would be people like me who would go back and screw everything up. since we aren't all dead, time travel will never be possible


or. Time travel is possible, and what we see now IS everything all screwed up

OR

You can travel to the past, but you are unable to change certain things. I think the Grandmother Paradox (http://www.cix.co.uk/~antcom/gp.html) covers this nicely.

Of course, others have pointed out issues with time travel into the past (http://www.friesian.com/paradox.htm) as well

OR

You can travel to the past, but you are unable to change certain things. I think the Grandmother Paradox (http://www.cix.co.uk/~antcom/gp.html) covers this nicely.
If you travelled back and changed anything, you would no longer have a reason to change that thing. Wouldn't that making changing anything at all an instant paradox?

Technically you can't change anything because if you change it than it was always like that and you never actually changed it.

So if history says something happened, then that's how it happened. If you go back in time and make that happened then that's how it always was and always will be.

Meh...

wait wait wait... I'm forgetting something here. Right. I know that forwards time travel is possible, but I can't remember the how... I'm sure it's something to do with approaching light speed and some kind of time dilation effect... what is about 3 seconds to you at that speed can be an age to others... is that it? Or is there something else, or did I just cobble that together from a few sci-fi shows I watch?

Apparently, the best "time travel" technique is simply to run a computer simulation which has all of the pre-requisite information programmed in, but the amount of processing powerr necessary, and the amount of information you'd need to know would be so huge as to make that an impracticality, and it isn't actually time travel anyway. Which to me ruins that plan. it's not time travel if you don't... travel through time.

(By the way, does anyone else hate the "insert" key on the keyboard? Most annoying. Just thought I'd ask.)

All you have to do is go 88 miles an hour.

Right. I know that forwards time travel is possible, but I can't remember the how

You're doing it ... right now ... as you read this message, you are getting older.

Lets see, one method involves being sucked into a black hole, and your time slowing down. Then you would blast out of the event horizon and come out with the rest of the universe forward in time. There is also some method involving spining in a corkscrew-like fashon on a super think infinatly long cylinder, but the chances of making any object infinatly long is not very likely.

Why does everyone seem to have the idea that you would somehow be cloned into the past if you time-traveled backwards? Wouldn't it be more feasible if everything just "unhappened" to you, hence you would never even know that you time-traveled in the first place?

Mmkay ... guys ... energy cannot be created nor destroyed. It has already been proven that there isn't enough energy in the Universe to push a single grain of sand to light speed ... what makes you think we'll be able to find the energy to push an entire human being and his/her spaceship to light speed?!?

Magic elves?

You're doing it ... right now ... as you read this message, you are getting older.

Cheater. I'll remember that whenever you leave an obvious logic hole in your statements. And I always forget to hold a grudge. Consider yourself glared at.

No, but really, disproportionate to the rest of the universe, is the gravity thingy the way to go forwards in time? And what would happen if two things were moving at 55% the speed of light in exactly the opposite direction as each other, and they passed close together. Given that the resultant velocity would be 110% the speed of light, would there be a strange time delay/or advance on seeig things?

If you travelled back and changed anything, you would no longer have a reason to change that thing. Wouldn't that making changing anything at all an instant paradox?

Only if you went back in time with the purpose of changing that thing.

If I travelled back in time and wandered into a forest and cut down a tree that I'd picked at random then there is no paradox preventing me from carrying out that action (unless there was an unknown link between that tree and either myself or the development of the ability to travel back in time).

At least, that is how I understand it to work.

Mmkay ... guys ... energy cannot be created nor destroyed. It has already been proven that there isn't enough energy in the Universe to push a single grain of sand to light speed ... what makes you think we'll be able to find the energy to push an entire human being and his/her spaceship to light speed?!?

Magic elves?

We don't yet know everything there is to know about the universe... for all we know maybe there is something that we will discover that will make FTL travel possible.

Of course, it is also entirely possible that no such thing exists.

Cheater. I'll remember that whenever you leave an obvious logic hole in your statements. And I always forget to hold a grudge. Consider yourself glared at.

:D Sorry. I couldn't resist.

No, but really, disproportionate to the rest of the universe, is the gravity thingy the way to go forwards in time? And what would happen if two things were moving at 55% the speed of light in exactly the opposite direction as each other, and they passed close together. Given that the resultant velocity would be 110% the speed of light, would there be a strange time delay/or advance on seeig things?

Relative observation, I suppose, but an actual warping of space-time requires gravity, not velocity, otherwise light itself would create a warp - but it doesn't and it's the fastest moving stuff in the Universe. You'd basically get the effect of shining two flashlights towards each other. Gotta have mass to have warping ability. If you pushed matter to light speed - even in resultant velocity - it must become energy and, thus, will lose its mass.

For now, though, I would advise just leaving this sort of thing to science fiction. It all breaks down when you apply mathematics to it.

We don't yet know everything there is to know about the universe... for all we know maybe there is something that we will discover that will make FTL travel possible.

Of course, it is also entirely possible that no such thing exists.

True! We do not know everything yet and any good scientist will keep his mind and imagination open to the possibility. Personally, I don't know what the point would be, though.

Even if you could travel at light speed and reconstitute yourself into matter on the other end, it would still take you 120+ years to get anywhere useful - as in getting to other known planetary systems.

Not to mention the acceleration time. You can't just *zap* yourself into light speed. Imagine the g-forces involved! You'd become one with your seat. I'd say you'd need a good century just to get up to speed safely, but I haven't done the actual math ... it could be less than that.

However, there is a rather simple principle in Astronomy which covers past time travel. The further out in the Universe you look, the further back in time you are actually looking. When we look at Sol, we see how it was 8 minutes ago. When we look at a star 1,000 LY away, we're seeing that star as it was in 1005 CE. It may have blown up by now for all we know. So if you do get to Light Speed and set off to go there, you may find nothing there by the time you arrive ... in 1,000 years.

It's one of the reasons why I hate it when people dodge lasers in movies. I mean ... by the time the light from the actual trigger pull reached you eye and your brain processed it, you'd have been dead for nearly 2 seconds. *shrug*

I'm rambling.

Paradox aside, according to economists, it is impossible for mankind to develop the ability to travel back in time. This is illustrated by man's innate greed. The stockmarket fluctuates and periodically crashes. It wouldn't if those with future knowledge were buying and selling at the right times.

Paradox aside, according to economists, it is impossible for mankind to develop the ability to travel back in time. This is illustrated by man's innate greed. The stockmarket fluctuates and periodically crashes. It wouldn't if those with future knowledge were buying and selling at the right times.
Unless they are doing so and also using their foreknowledge to control the market so that it appears as though they have no foreknowledge...

Unless they are doing so and also using their foreknowledge to control the market so that it appears as though they have no foreknowledge...

I'm thinking you have the beginnings of what could become the greatest conspiracy theory ever.

I'm thinking you have the beginnings of what could become the greatest conspiracy theory ever.
Speaking of that, it's time to bump my conspiracy theory thread.
Thanks for inadvertantly reminding me.

Paradox aside, according to economists, it is impossible for mankind to develop the ability to travel back in time. This is illustrated by man's innate greed. The stockmarket fluctuates and periodically crashes. It wouldn't if those with future knowledge were buying and selling at the right times.

Nah... if you could time travel this would be one lame way to make money...

Besides, this kinda falls under the Grandmother paradox. If you played the stock market to your advantage, it would change the fluctuations, meaning that your future self would have never known to come back to this time and make the investments.

If you went into the past, you could not change anything that would ultimately have given you cause to travel into the past or affect your ability to travel into the past.

For instance, you couldn't travel back in time to stop John Lennon from being shot because if you did then your future self would not know that you had to travel back in time to stop him from being killed.

There would be nothing stopping you from going back and grabbing Lennon's killer after the fact and introducing him to the pleasure of a glowing red hot poker where the sun doesn't shine...

Or... there would be nothing stopping you from preventing John Lennon from being shot if you unintentionally interfered in the process but you'd have to have no prior knowledge of what you were about to do (most of the paradoxes appear to stem from going back with an intention to do something).

Until the technicals of the flux capacitor are worked out, we won't be able to do it.

I've heard we're able to SEE what has occured in the past if we can use a strong enough telescope far enough away - to catch the light that is bouncing off the Earth. We could see Columbus discover America this way, for example.

Well, since the only idea of 'time' that the natural world understands is to do with rotations around the sun, we have to assume that the world somehow creates a memory of every single event that happens as it revolves around the sun so as to create some sort of place for a time traveler to travel to.

It seems unlikely that such a thing does happen. Though perhaps this is where alternate dimensions comes into play.... doubtful though.

In my humble opinion, the only backward time travel possible is when the universe stops expanding and it collapses in on itself.

Nah... if you could time travel this would be one lame way to make money...

Besides, this kinda falls under the Grandmother paradox. If you played the stock market to your advantage, it would change the fluctuations, meaning that your future self would have never known to come back to this time and make the investments.

If you went into the past, you could not change anything that would ultimately have given you cause to travel into the past or affect your ability to travel into the past.

For instance, you couldn't travel back in time to stop John Lennon from being shot because if you did then your future self would not know that you had to travel back in time to stop him from being killed.


I like the 'many-worlds' theory and that timeline splitting stuff John Titor and some SF authors have proposed. If you change something, you merely make another reality with the change. It gets rid of a lot of paradoxes.

You're doing it ... right now ... as you read this message, you are getting older.

Wow, you mean all the time i'm spending here is actually wasting my life?!?

:p

Wow, you mean all the time i'm spending here is actually wasting my life?!?

:p

Only a small piece of it. :D

wait wait wait... I'm forgetting something here. Right. I know that forwards time travel is possible, but I can't remember the how... I'm sure it's something to do with approaching light speed and some kind of time dilation effect... what is about 3 seconds to you at that speed can be an age to others... is that it?

It is, yes. Time is relative. As you approach c (the speed of light in vacuum)time will run slower for you. That is to say:
- You travel with a speed near c. According to you, your watch, etc. only 1 year passes.
- For someone at rest on earth however many years will have passed (how many exacty depends on the speed you were travelling with) during your trip.

In essence this is travelling to the future.

Though we cannot build anything that can approach more than a tiny fraction of c, the effect is measurable with atomclocks in jetplanes.

The Alma Mater you are right. this infact proves that travel thru time is real.
But ofcourse its not the same with what ppl know from movies.
after Einstein died there were found 7 note books and in one of them this theory was elaborated.
1 notebook is missing now and has never been revealed to the public.
i can only think of what could that contain..
:(

Forwards- possible

Try NOT moving forwards in time ...

Still an absolute must:

Ripples in the Dirac Sea (1988) by Geoffrey A. Landis
The affecting story of a scientist seesawing inescapably through time, this brilliant work effectively deconstructs most time-travel stories that came before.
Winner of the 1989 Nebula Award for best short story.

(Very very touching!)


And while you're at it:

“Story of Your Life” (1998) by Ted Chiang
A revelation. A story that bases its structure on its own foundational ideas. One of the few first contact stories that actually focuses on the vast amount of work it would be to decipher a truly alien language. It finds a basis for this language in an underlying foundation for physics that is diametrically opposed to our own. The main character is a linguist and this distinctive language definitely affects her mind, her personality, her world view and her life's decisions.
Winner of the 2000 Nebula Award for best novella.