NationStates Jolt Archive

Obviously John Howard won the last election, but I wan't to know if the outcome would have been different had us teens had a chance to vote. Who would you have voted for and why? And to you Americans, the Australians have a very clear imiage of President Bush. How do you see our Prime Minister?

Well your Prime Minister isn't very high priority when it comes to our news.

Hell, even on the BBC I have yet to seen his name be mentioned.

So I think you have an idea of what Americans think of your prime minister, we don;t think anything of him. Sorry.

It's nice to know that our allies think so highly of us. All we ever see on our news is Bush and Rumsfeld.

Choices for non-Aussies in the poll would have been nice (I'm being polite, ok!). Also descriptions of what the different parties think would have been appreciated.

It's nice to know that our allies think so highly of us. All we ever see on our news is Bush and Rumsfeld.
I'm sorry to hear that you share our suffering. It sucks, doesn't it?

I'm sorry to hear that you share our suffering. It sucks, doesn't it?

That was what I missed a lot when I was in the US. Accessible international news. "Around the world in 80 seconds" just didn't really cut it...

I beg to differ with my American comrades. I heard more about John Howard than any other foreign leader besides the Western European leaders. As I understand it, he won a close race as the more conservative and more American-friendly of the candidates.

ALP (Labour) - Trade Unionists have a very strong traditional hold on this party, they are slightly left wing
Liberal - Right wing, conservative pro-business
National - The Farmer's party, conservative and in government as part of the coalition with the Liberals
Greens - Green issues, gay marrage, maternity and paternity leave
One Nation - Reduce Asian immigrants and taxes
Fishing party - legalise commerical fishing of the great barrier reef
Socialist alliance - Socialist students at uni
Christian party - highly conservative Christians
Family First - Burn all lesbians as witches, cut all welfare payments to anyone not supporting a family, double family payments
Democrats - Left wing social policies

ALB (Labour) - Trade Unionists have a very strong traditional hold on this party, they are slightly left wing
Libs - Right wing, conservative pro-business
Greens - Green issues, gay marrage, maternity and paternity leave
One Nation - Reduce Asian immigrants and taxes
Fishing party - legalise commerical fishing of the great barrier reef
Socialist alliance - Socialist students at uni
Christian party - highly conservative
Family First - Burn all lesbians as witches, cut all welfare payments to anyone not supporting a family, double family payments
Democrats - Left wing social policies
I find it very amusing that the Liberal party in Australia is right-wing, conservative pro-business! Liberal here in America is just about the opposite of that description, and mainly used as a term to describe the Democrat party.

Hate to nit-pick but it's ALP, not ALB...

A little of topic (maybe start another thread?), but, I understand that voting is compulsory in Australia (hence the oft-repeated issue in NS). How does that work, exactly? How do you enforce that? What are the penalties? Does it work?

A little of topic (maybe start another thread?), but, I understand that voting is compulsory in Australia (hence the oft-repeated issue in NS). How does that work, exactly? How do you enforce that? What are the penalties? Does it work?

Well basically, everyone has to register when you hit 18 or get a big mutha of a fine. If you don't vote, you get a big mutha of a fine.

I find it very amusing that the Liberal party in Australia is right-wing, conservative pro-business! Liberal here in America is just about the opposite of that description, and mainly used as a term to describe the Democrat party.

On a global scale, it's not uncommon. "Liberalism" (ie John Adams and other economic capitalism) is right of centre in many places. Social liberalism is most often on the left, though.

If you don't vote in Australia you just get a small fine. If you don't really care who gets elected you just rock up, get your name ticked off and submit a blank ballot. I didn't know that voting wasn't compulsary in America.

I can't believe that the Greens are ahead so far. Can you imagine a bunch of tree-hugging extremists running Australia?

I can't believe that the Greens are ahead so far. Can you imagine a bunch of tree-hugging extremists running Australia?

It'd be great wouldn't it? I would vote Democrats but it looks like they're about to implode.

I can't believe that the Greens are ahead so far. Can you imagine a bunch of tree-hugging extremists running Australia?

It would be a nice change from your current government, which sucks.

A little of topic (maybe start another thread?), but, I understand that voting is compulsory in Australia (hence the oft-repeated issue in NS). How does that work, exactly? How do you enforce that? What are the penalties? Does it work?

A fine unless you wite a letter to the AEC (Australian Electoral Commission) saying you're sorry you didn't get to vote but something prevented you like your car broke down on the way to the polls. I think you are less likely to be fined for a local election rather than a State or Federal election.

I'm Quite happy with my current government. I'd hate to have that slug Kim Beasly running it.

If you don't vote in Australia you just get a small fine. If you don't really care who gets elected you just rock up, get your name ticked off and submit a blank ballot. I didn't know that voting wasn't compulsary in America.

Of course it's not compulsary in America, they don't even let criminals vote! I think Australia is one of three nations world wide with compulsary voting.

If you don't vote in Australia you just get a small fine. If you don't really care who gets elected you just rock up, get your name ticked off and submit a blank ballot. I didn't know that voting wasn't compulsary in America.
You submit a blank ballot?! Any potential for fraud there - someone ticking off a name on your blank ballot or somesuch?

Not compulsory in America. Probably stems from the belief of most Americans that if you don't care enough to vote, then you shouldn't have a say in who gets elected. Since you probably won't be up on the issues anyway.

You submit a blank ballot?! Any potential for fraud there - someone ticking off a name on your blank ballot or somesuch?


No because when the votes are counted the parties provide scrutineers to watch the votes being counted. It's all very formal, votes are counted by at least 5 diffrent people from 5 diffrent institutions at 5 diffrent places at 5 diffrent times but almost always the result can be had within a few hours of the polls closing from the first round of counting, which is almost always right.

The poll just goes to show how left leaning Australians in NS are. As for Inbred Irishman's assertions that the nation would be under diffrent leadership had teenagers been able to vote it's flawed. J. Ho won by such a majority that even if all school students illegally voted in the last election he would still be Prime Miniture. Besides half of them will turn out conservative anyways.

So what do people think hapened on the election yesterday? The Alp re-won WA with Geoff Gallop, Barnett resigned as leader of the coalition.

I should have mentioned that the coalition consists of the Liberals and the Nationals. The Nationals are a farming party from Queensland and are conservative and interested in rural issues.

So what do people think hapened on the election yesterday? The Alp re-won WA with Geoff Gallop, Barnett resigned as leader of the coalition.I think it shows that the same electoral conservatism that's working for the Coalition in the federal elections is working for the ALP in the state elections. I'd imagine most people fell that things in Australia are more-or-less going ok, so why change anything?

Personally, I'm leaning towards voting against the sitting member in the lower house seat. Marginal electorates get all the pork barrelling. In the senate I strategically vote to keep the two big parties in minority (of course, obviously not enough people did that this time around, but I'll be interested to see how it works out anyway).

The poll just goes to show how left leaning Australians in NS are. As for Inbred Irishman's assertions that the nation would be under diffrent leadership had teenagers been able to vote it's flawed. J. Ho won by such a majority that even if all school students illegally voted in the last election he would still be Prime Miniture. Besides half of them will turn out conservative anyways.


:D

I voted for Howard and would again.

:D

I voted for Howard and would again.

I don't have a hand big or furious enough to slap you with :D

I voted Greens. They're the least evil of the major parties... And they totally whipped the liberals in my seat, Melbourne. :cool: Although Labour still won. Bah.

Apathy rules in Australia. Most vote for the person who can give them more money in their pockets (or claim to do so) without ruining their lifestyle.

Here's my problem - if you actually want to have your vote counted for the House of Reps (the lower of the two houses that determines government), you're supposed to number every box on the little green piece of paper. So essentially it boils down to whether you put Labour ahead of Liberal, or vice versa - even if you give the Greens #1, they're not going to end up getting your vote because they don't have a majority.

And actually all the following countries also have compulsory voting:
Argentina, Austria, Belgium, Bolivia, Brazil, Cyprus, the Dominican Republic, Egypt, Greece, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Panama, the Philippines, Singapore, Switzerland (some cantons only) Uruguay, and Venezuela.
There are more, by the way - I just couldn't be bothered wading through the masses of official voting sites and translating them for each country.

Apathy rules in Australia. Most vote for the person who can give them more money in their pockets (or claim to do so) without ruining their lifestyle.If you poll people, they still want their taxes to go to the environment, healthcare, and education ... yet when it comes to elections, they always vote for the person who's promised them the bigger tax cut. :rolleyes:

Howard won for two reasons:
He pulled his "Labour Government = higher intrest rates" crap and:
Latham is a tool.

If you poll people, they still want their taxes to go to the environment, healthcare, and education ... yet when it comes to elections, they always vote for the person who's promised them the bigger tax cut. :rolleyes:

People are greedy little pigs and vote that way. Scare campaigns work really well if you hit the wallet and say "We'll give you more".

Australians, and proably electorates from other countries, seem to have no concept of bigger issues, or the picture as a whole. What I mean is they'll vote on a single issue they saw in an ad, like those interest rate things. That said, politicians are very good at keeping the population ignorant.

And hooray for two party "democracy" huh... Especially when the two parties are almost the same. :eek:

Edit: and Hel, get on msn. :p

Australians, and proably electorates from other countries, seem to have no concept of bigger issues, or the picture as a whole. What I mean is they'll vote on a single issue they saw in an ad, like those interest rate things. That said, politicians are very good at keeping the population ignorant.

And hooray for two party "democracy" huh... Especially when the two parties are almost the same. :eek:

Edit: and Hel, get on msn. :p
Can't, hon, it's not letting me sign in. Bloody Telstra.

It amazes me that my family votes for Liberal. I only did that once, when I decided I really didn't like the Labour candidate for my area. It felt good to write his number in second last (above the Family First candidate). :p

Oh, and how much did the Government spend on advertising during the last election?

politicians are very good at keeping the population ignorant.

And hooray for two party "democracy" huh... Especially when the two parties are almost the same. :eek:


western governments are too good at propaganda.

yea in australia we have 2 main parties, the republican party and, the republican party :p

Can't, hon, it's not letting me sign in. Bloody Telstra.

It amazes me that my family votes for Liberal. I only did that once, when I decided I really didn't like the Labour candidate for my area. It felt good to write his number in second last (above the Family First candidate). :p

Oh, and how much did the Government spend on advertising during the last election?

I'm not surprised. The older generation have much in common with Howard and co, so are blind to his greater faults. Howard does like to blow his trumpet too much (when things are good).

It amazes me that my family votes for Liberal. I only did that once, when I decided I really didn't like the Labour candidate for my area. It felt good to write his number in second last (above the Family First candidate).
*shudder* you voted Liberal? *smacks Hel*
But Family First is evil. Preserving Australia's Christian values my arse. When I have a family those values are the last thing I want near my kids. The worrying thing is that all their people at my polling booth were young. You know, those young trendy Evangelicals. Baptist Britney or something.

Oh, and how much did the Government spend on advertising during the last election?
Not sure, but lots... So thats where the tax money is going...

And screw Telstra. It must be a government conspiracy. ;)

Edit: My mum votes Green. It's so wrong considering how socially conservative she is...
And do your siblings vote Liberal?

If you poll people, they still want their taxes to go to the environment, healthcare, and education ... yet when it comes to elections, they always vote for the person who's promised them the bigger tax cut. :rolleyes:

That was exactly what I saw in the election too.

Btw, I didn't vote Greens - a bunch of headless idiots. And I find the Labour and Liberals too conservative, and too unapologetic. I voted indepedent. Because the independent knows what is gonig on, talks to people, actually freaking listens, freely admits what he believes, and gives the major parties a good kick in the ...

Yeah, I voted indepedent.

EDIT: Family first eh? I was tempted to go and badger their leader with comments like "At this rate, you can hardly teach people about the values you are protecting, what with kids that can't read at thirteen, soaring obesity, poor education systems, increasing numbers of Professionals leaving Australia, poor diplomatic ties with the world, an Anti arabic and Asian stance, or so the governme suggests, and god knows what else! So this is where your Christian values get us, eh?"

I beg to differ with my American comrades. I heard more about John Howard than any other foreign leader besides the Western European leaders. As I understand it, he won a close race as the more conservative and more American-friendly of the candidates.
America-friendly? You could say that. He so far up the Bush rectum, he makes Tony Blair look hostile to the US President.

I find it very amusing that the Liberal party in Australia is right-wing, conservative pro-business! Liberal here in America is just about the opposite of that description, and mainly used as a term to describe the Democrat party.
That's because the American definition of liberal is wrong, and different from the original meaning of the word.

America-friendly? You could say that. He so far up the Bush rectum, he makes Tony Blair look hostile to the US President.
LOL. Have you heard my colonoscopy joke?


That's because the American definition of liberal is wrong, and different from the original meaning of the word.
THANK YOU! I keep saying it but nobody listens. I'm sick of being branded a liberal. At least something like progressive...

If you poll people, they still want their taxes to go to the environment, healthcare, and education ... yet when it comes to elections, they always vote for the person who's promised them the bigger tax cut. :rolleyes:
Don't worry, the phenomenon of people wanting more government services, but less taxes is not unique to Australia!

LOL. Have you heard my colonoscopy joke?


THANK YOU! I keep saying it but nobody listens. I'm sick of being branded a liberal. At least something like progressive...
No, please tell!

I think the most accurate, universal and safest definition of the ideology is "social democratic" or "democratic socialist".

I hope everyone is aware that the Australian Liberal Party are our Conservatives, right.

No, please tell!

Well, GW had a colonscopy a while ago.

The results are finally in. Do you know what they found up there?


*drumroll*


John Howard.

*bows*

That one was good enough to be heard again.
Well, GW had a colonscopy a while ago.

The results are finally in. Do you know what they found up there?

*drumroll*

John Howard.

*bows*
Politicians certainly have a way with words and obfuscation - I have yet to hear them actually SAY something important.
Pri: My sister does...

My sister does...

:'(
Nooooooooooo!

I think that John Howard is one of the best Prime Ministers we've had. Why does everyone hate him so much?

I think that John Howard is one of the best Prime Ministers we've had. Why does everyone hate him so much?

Hate is such a strong word! I would consider myself disinclined towards him on account of his carelessness when handling the truth.

I think that John Howard is one of the best Prime Ministers we've had. Why does everyone hate him so much?
As some one probably more to the right than the left, I'm pleased he's fiscally conservative, but disappointed he's still big government (in terms of taxation), I'm pleased with some of his foreign policy, and displeased with others, I'm pleased with his labour reforms, but displeased that he doesn't seem to have read the growth theory that points out the very important role governments have in long term growth of an economy, especially through funding R&D. In short, I find him to be a mixed bag of policies, not truly an economic rationalist (he's got myopia when it comes to economic policy), oh and I don't much like his social conservatism.

But as to why everyone hates him so much: they don't, or else he wouldn't be in power. It's just that the views about him have become heavily polarized.

I think that John Howard is one of the best Prime Ministers we've had. Why does everyone hate him so much?

Because he's a lying weasel who's Bush's lapdog. He's lied to the australian public on many occasions, on critical issues, and gotten away with it. The incredible thing is there's hardly even a minor scandal each time he does it, and then people forget about it.

One of Labour's major mistakes last election was saying that "a vote for Howard is a vote for Costello". To me, that could only have been a good thing.

You forget, he has NEVER, EVER lied. Never. Ever.
Promise.

Therefore, he must be incompetant. As ultimate responsibility for all these departments ends up in government surely a few ministers should have been sacked over the scandals.

Either way I'm not too fussed over which major party ends up in government, but I do becomed concerned when one party or another ends up in power for more than three elections in a row.

ALP (Labour) - Trade Unionists have a very strong traditional hold on this party, they are slightly left wing

I'd dispute that. Many of the unions they are affiliated with are right-wing, and the ALP's economic policies are at least center-right. (They brought about the privatisation initiatives in the 1980's.)

I can't believe that the Greens are ahead so far. Can you imagine a bunch of tree-hugging extremists running Australia?

It might be because they're the only party that presents an alternative and actually cares about youth issues, hmm?

I'd dispute that. Many of the unions they are affiliated with are right-wing, and the ALP's economic policies are at least center-right. (They brought about the privatisation initiatives in the 1980's.)

That just goes to show how poorly defined the left wing/right wing terms are. My partner and I were having a discussion about something a month or so ago and it turns out she had almost diametrically opposed definitions from mine in some areas.

That just goes to show how poorly defined the left wing/right wing terms are. My partner and I were having a discussion about something a month or so ago and it turns out she had almost diametrically opposed definitions from mine in some areas.

It depends on how you view left/right. I prefer to look at it from a purely economic basis, and Labor are extremely close to the Liberals in that regard.

You forget, he has NEVER, EVER lied. Never. Ever.
Promise.

Therefore, he must be incompetant. As ultimate responsibility for all these departments ends up in government surely a few ministers should have been sacked over the scandals.

Either way I'm not too fussed over which major party ends up in government, but I do becomed concerned when one party or another ends up in power for more than three elections in a row.

The whole government is full of weasels who can't tell the truth to save their lives.

Vanstone - Just filling for the job of immigrant gaoler
Ruddock - Professional Nazi
Downer - His name says it all
Abbott - Christian right bully boy (with one illegitimate kid)
Anderson - National party or wannabe Liberal?
Costello - Another Paul Keating but with his faith in Jesus
Kevin Andrews - Minister for employer advocacy
Howard - God bless America

You submit a blank ballot?! Any potential for fraud there - someone ticking off a name on your blank ballot or somesuch?

Not compulsory in America. Probably stems from the belief of most Americans that if you don't care enough to vote, then you shouldn't have a say in who gets elected. Since you probably won't be up on the issues anyway.

Even if there was a risk of that, I suppose you could just render it invalid by ticking multiple names, or scrawling gibberish all over it. No worries about it getting filled in then...