NationStates Jolt Archive

All those who love philosophy, or even those that simply love to chat about nething can come and so do at THE PHILOSOPHERS CONSTITUTION.

Anybody is welcome, and we await your joining of this great organisation.

Emperor Gaius, The Holy Empire of Amariius

you posted this yesterday didnt you?

yes i did, and you replied. you must be really bored. Anyway, i think that this proves my last answer. We do exist.

Emperor Gaius

still havent proven you exist though

If he has shown that "we" exist, that means that he exists as well.

he hasnt shown anything exists apart from me

Exist- "to have being, to manage to live, to occur in a specific place under specific conditions"

I am here, in this place, under these conditions. I am living, because "nothing" cannot type, and so someone, or something must be typing. That something is me. Something which is not a "being" is nothing, and nothing cannot be. Therefore i be, and and am a being because of that.

Therefore, i have proved my existence.

Emperor Gaius

he hasnt shown anything exists apart from me
When did he show that you existed? I missed it.

When did he show that you existed? I missed it.
i know i exist, but he hasnt proven anything else exists

Exist- "to have being, to manage to live, to occur in a specific place under specific conditions"

I am here, in this place, under these conditions. I am living, because "nothing" cannot type, and so someone, or something must be typing. That something is me. Something which is not a "being" is nothing, and nothing cannot be. Therefore i be, and and am a being because of that.

Therefore, i have proved my existence.

Emperor Gaius
shaky

how do i know im not dreaming?

hallucinating?

its pretty much impossible to put beyond doubt that anything else exists, theres always some way of putting doubt

The only thing this idiotic conversation "proves" is that "proof" is too high a standard for knowledge.

the only thing this proves is that you need to go back and do basic philosophy...

Neo did a thread on this last night, cant remember what its called, but the arguments were there..until it degenerated

All those who love philosophy, or even those that simply love to chat about nething can come and so do at THE PHILOSOPHERS CONSTITUTION.

Anybody is welcome, and we await your joining of this great organisation.

Emperor Gaius, The Holy Empire of Amariius
idiotic, non-philosophy question: link?

idiotic, non-philosophy question: link?

He's recruiting for a region. Wrong forum.

He's recruiting for a region. Wrong forum.
ooh i thought it was his forum :headbang:

I possess both extension and quality

I exist

All things exist as Ideas

I possess both extension and quality

I exist

All things exist as Ideas

but how can you prove to me that you exist physically.

as a person sitting in front of a computer somewhere, and not a creation of my imagination

but how can you prove to me that you exist physically.

as a person sitting in front of a computer somewhere, and not a creation of my imagination

Well, now here is a falsifiable theory!

So, your problem is that you are "okay" believing in physical existence in general, you're just not sure about this person from Nationstates? Well, that's easily settled. Just arrange to meet in person.

That should settle it.

Well, now here is a falsifiable theory!

So, your problem is that you are "okay" believing in physical existence in general, you're just not sure about this person from Nationstates? Well, that's easily settled. Just arrange to meet in person.

That should settle it.
nope, it still has flaws

i am fully able to accept that something physically exists, but does the world i am in physically exist?

even if i met him whos to say he is an actuall physical being?

theres no way of putting it beyond all doubt

theres no way of putting it beyond all doubt

Right. And that is why proof fails as a universal standard of knowledge. We know plenty of things that we do not know "beyond all doubt."

Tell me the conditions under which you would be "completely" satisfied of another person's existence, on your own terms. What are they? How could it be "proven" (or, for that matter, conclusively disproven)?

Right. And that is why proof fails as a universal standard of knowledge. We know plenty of things that we do not know "beyond all doubt."

Tell me the conditions under which you would be "completely" satisfied of another person's existence, on your own terms. What are they? How could it be "proven" (or, for that matter, conclusively disproven).
the existence of anyone but myself can neither be completely proven nor disproven to me

although i take it on face value that other people exist, because i dont want to depress myself

the existence of anyone but myself can neither be completely proven nor disproven to me

Then there is no point worrying about it.

Then there is no point worrying about it.
well, the guy did say it was a region for philosphers

and thats philosophy

but youre right, who cares if its all fake, not as if i know anything else or could change it

well, the guy did say it was a region for philosphers

and thats philosophy

Yes. But it is not very responsible philosophy. Philosophers should learn to talk about things that actually mean something in the world. Talking about something that cannot possibly add to knowledge is utterly ridiculous.

if its not responsible philosophy then why is my philosophy lecturer teaching it?

trying to prove that we all exist is a pretty important thing...

if its not responsible philosophy then why is my philosophy lecturer teaching it?

I never said philosophers are responsible. Most of the ones that I have met are anything but.

trying to prove that we all exist is a pretty important thing...

WHY?

I never said philosophers are responsible. Most of the ones that I have met are anything but.



WHY?
because if nobody else exists, then what the hell am i seeing?

because if nobody else exists, then what the hell am i seeing?

What difference does it make if you have no hope of ever seeing anything else? Even if you could know that nobody else exists, it would not tell you anything about what you are seeing, or about what is "real."

The answer to the question tells you nothing. Moreover, the question cannot be answered. So why ask it?

why ask anything?

because youre curious, doesnt necessarily mean youre going to get a definite answer though

people ask "does god exist?"

you arent going to get a definite answer either way, but people still ask because its human nature to be inquisitive

why ask anything?

because youre curious, doesnt necessarily mean youre going to get a definite answer though

Curiosity is a desire for knowledge. I understand the curiosity about human existence... but once you realize there can be no answer (or at least no meaningful one), then what you are doing is no longer philosophy. It is merely idle speculation.

people ask "does god exist?"

If this is anything other than idle speculation, then it has to admit some sort of evidence... revelation is evidence: people believe in god, in part, because they believe in a history of divine intervention which has been written down and reported by other human beings.

They may also believe in god because they think only such a notion adequately explains the complexity in the world, or its existence at all.

But what does it "explain" to think that nothing exists? What evidence is there for non-existence?

How would I tell the difference between a world that exists and one that does not exist?

If there is no difference, then they are identical to one another. It is a meaningless distinction.

because if nobody else exists, then what the hell am i seeing?
If nobody else exists, then why the hell did I buy this expensive dress for New Year's?

Curiosity is a desire for knowledge. I understand the curiosity about human existence... but once you realize there can be no answer (or at least no meaningful one), then what you are doing is no longer philosophy. It is merely idle speculation.

and speculation is fun


If this is anything other than idle speculation, then it has to admit some sort of evidence... revelation is evidence: people believe in god, in part, because they believe in a history of divine intervention which has been written down and reported by other human beings.

They may also believe in god because they think only such a notion adequately explains the complexity in the world, or its existence at all.

But what does it "explain" to think that nothing exists? What evidence is there for non-existence?
theres no evidence for non-existence, same as theres no evidence for existence

its just fun to speculate on it - nothing more, nothing less

If nobody else exists, then why the hell did I buy this expensive dress for New Year's?
my head hurts

philosohpy involves too much thinking :(

How would I tell the difference between a world that exists and one that does not exist?

If there is no difference, then they are identical to one another. It is a meaningless distinction.
how do you know there is no difference?

ah...screw that

and speculation is fun


theres no evidence for non-existence, same as theres no evidence for existence

its just fun to speculate on it - nothing more, nothing less

Sure. Fun to speculate on.

Hence, irresponsible philosophy. Intellectuals are paid to think because they are supposed figure things out that benefit the world. Not just have fun.

how do you know there is no difference?

ah...screw that

I don't. But then again, I'm not the one having arguments about whether or not the world exists. I want those people to tell me what they are arguing about... which would amount to telling me how I could tell the difference between an existing world and a non-existing one.

Sure. Fun to speculate on.

Hence, irresponsible philosophy. Intellectuals are paid to think because they are supposed figure things out that benefit the world. Not just have fun.
im not paid anything so i can think what i want :p

im not paid anything so i can think what i want :p

Sure thing! It's even better when you are drinking and smoking whatever you want as well.

I'm sorry if my ire at the state of professional philosophy has spilled over too much in your direction.

Sure thing! It's even better when you are drinking and smoking whatever you want as well.

thats generally what i try to to :)

I'm sorry if my ire at the state of professional philosophy has spilled over too much in your direction.
no problems

Here's a good philosophical quaestion.
What is the best form of government?
Anarchists of the world unite!

"People demand freedom of speech to make up for their freedom of thought for which they lack"
-Soren Kierkegaard

(I'd cut/paste the exact quote but my net is kinda shaky)