NationStates Jolt Archive

Check this (http://www.hamasonline.org/MediaC/Iraq/message-from-resistance.wmv) out. It isn't half bad. It is even in English.

Check this (http://www.hamasonline.org/MediaC/Iraq/message-from-resistance.wmv) out. It isn't half bad. It is even in English.
56K WARNING:
That file is 9.8 megs.

Check this (http://www.hamasonline.org/MediaC/Iraq/message-from-resistance.wmv) out. It isn't half bad. It is even in English.


That's actually not too shabby. Impressive.

Thanking many European countries for being against the war in Iraq. Thanking American and British citizens for standing up against the war in Iraq.

Not asking for arms or soldiers.

These people are freedom fighters. Very nice.

56K WARNING:
That file is 9.8 megs.
ooh sorry forgot to warn! It really is quite good though, just ignore the Arab credits in the begining.

ooh sorry forgot to warn! It really is quite good though, just ignore the Arab credits in the begining.

Nod ... thanks for sharing that ... really. It's refreshing to see.

You guys are not serious. This is good? Emotional ramble backed by sappy music? Video of terrorost preparing their weapons? "Put an end to Zionism before it ends the world"? "we will redefine the word 'conquest'"?

c'mon, give me a break.

You guys are not serious. This is good? Emotional ramble backed by sappy music? Video of terrorost preparing their weapons? "Put an end to Zionism before it ends the world"? "we will redefine the word 'conquest'"?

c'mon, give me a break.

It's better than angry words with Arab Battle music in the back where the people say "Let's n00k everybody l0l" and "We will burn every westerner who ever lived!".

Although it's still terrorist propaganda.

Hmm, now the question becomes should I post pics of Hamas' other works.

Propaganda is measured on how well it persuades people to follow a cause. To that end, that was pretty good, though it had some pretty obvious holes.

hmm aside form the point that that is an muslim news station reel that has been cut and then altered (obviously in britain),dubbed and a cheesy classical music background added in (kinda sounded like variations of the british national anthem but i don't know jack about classical music) it is a good piece of propoganda showing how desparate the british immigrants are trying to convince people that iraq is run by them. Thanks from us american soldiers

hmm aside form the point that that is an muslim news station reel that has been cut and then altered (obviously in britain),dubbed and a cheesy clasical music background added in (kinda sounded like variations of the british national anthem but i don't know jack about clasical music) it is a good piece of propoganda showing how desparate the british immigrants are trying to convince people that iraq is run by them. Thanks from us american soldiers
:confused:
What?
"British immigrants"?
I have literally no idea what you are talking about, do explain.

Watching that video made me retarded! (http://www.shol.com/somersetsopa/bowling/images/Somerset%20Special%20Olympics%20Bowling%20004_jpg_jpg.jpg)

Yeah, I guess those brave "freedom fighters" are basically kicking our ass. It has to be true, because it's on the internets!

You guys are not serious. This is good? Emotional ramble backed by sappy music? Video of terrorost preparing their weapons? "Put an end to Zionism before it ends the world"? "we will redefine the word 'conquest'"?

c'mon, give me a break.

Never heard an Army speak to its enemies before? Remember how George Bush was saying, "Bring it On!" and "We will destroy every one of them wherever they are"?

Well, he included that to mean the people who made this film. These people who thanked many for their support, did not ask for global terror, spoke kindly to the US Soldiers and made them a very nice offer of peace.

Oh forget it ... you're blind to it all anyway. You see brown skin and a turban and automatically think "terrorist!"

Just go back to being teabagged by Foxnews. We're better off with you stuck to your couch.

No Isalmic front in their right mind would praise China or France... and it seems odd they both do so in that video and denounce the UN.

Although I must admit that the production itself was quite excellent. I doubt it would affect the all of the target audiences though, since it just was simply not sending the right message to appeal to those outside of whom they already have support anyway.

I think a great deal of Americans may unfortunately take this as gospel, however.

Hmm, now the question becomes should I post pics of Hamas' other works.

This film is about the Islamic Jihad Army, not Hamas. It just happens to be hosted on the Hamas site.

yeah ive seen that before. its pretty good. death to bush. <_<

Oh forget it ... you're blind to it all anyway. You see brown skin and a turban and automatically think "terrorist!"

Just go back to being teabagged by Foxnews. We're better off with you stuck to your couch.

Because anyone who disagrees with you is automatically wrong anda mindless automaton. Duh.

And Johnny Wadd (surprise!) wins the Poor Taste Award.

No Isalmic front in their right mind would praise China or France... and it seems odd they both do so in that video and denounce the UN.

It seems more aimed at leftist European intellectuals who might be swayed to support the occupation of Iraq now that supposedly legitimate elections have occured rather than intended for Domestic viewing.

Because anyone who disagrees with you is automatically wrong anda mindless automaton. Duh.


Yes ... cuz that's exactly what I said ... I didn't say anything about how he clearly didn't pay attention to what was being said ... just saw a bunch of brown skinned men with turbans and automatically charges them as terrorists ...

Boy you're smart.

Never heard an Army speak to its enemies before? Remember how George Bush was saying, "Bring it On!" and "We will destroy every one of them wherever they are"?

Well, he included that to mean the people who made this film. These people who thanked many for their support, did not ask for global terror, spoke kindly to the US Soldiers and made them a very nice offer of peace.

Oh forget it ... you're blind to it all anyway. You see brown skin and a turban and automatically think "terrorist!"

Just go back to being teabagged by Foxnews. We're better off with you stuck to your couch.

If you actually read my post you would realize that it did not include any referances to brown skin, fox news, george bush, or the invasion of Iraq. I happen to be Candian, and I don't get fox, nor would I ever watch it. I'm far from supporting George W., and I'm glad canada stayed out of the war. All I said was that I don't see why you would congradulate a terrorst orginization like Islamic Jihad, who are resposible for the murders of civillians, for a common propaganda video. If you find this kind of tripe convincing, fine. I won't be the one to start flameing, and I'm dissapointed that a guy like you (who's posts I have read, and respected till now) would do so.

Oh forget it ... you're blind to it all anyway. You see brown skin and a turban and automatically think "terrorist!"

Just go back to being teabagged by Foxnews. We're better off with you stuck to your couch.

I don't think I took it too much out of context. :rolleyes:

If you actually read my post you would realize that it did not include any referances to brown skin, fox news, george bush, or the invasion of Iraq.

You did look at the images and automatically called it "video of terrorsts preparing their weapons" when, in fact, you have no idea who or what is being filmed.

Instant, Fox News style allegations without any hard evidence really stick in my craw.

I apologize and ask forgiveness for jumping on you like I did.

just saw a bunch of brown skinned men with turbans and automatically charges them as terrorists ...

Boy you're smart.

exuse me, but this self-same Islamic jihad has "claimed credit" for numerous suicide bombs that resulted in the murder of innocent civilians in Israel. How can you claim that I have libeld them as terrorists when its clear that they are such? maybe the militants in Iraq that this video is about arn't directly related to the ones in palestine, but these are fine distinctions. Anyone who choses to affiliate themselves with murderers doesn't deserve politically correct taxonomy.

It seems more aimed at leftist European intellectuals who might be swayed to support the occupation of Iraq now that supposedly legitimate elections have occured rather than intended for Domestic viewing.

Well, that statement makes sense when you consider Hamas... [meh sorry yes not Hamas]

But there are a great deal of islamophobes among that bunch, and I am sure the majority will not be persuaded to support the insurgency whether with word or with material.

The people who I really think will be affected are Americans who (on the right, left, and whatever else they percieve themselves as being) are under the impression that everything the US has done since Bush was elected was evil and driven by a conspiracy of wealth, which accounts for, IIRC, somewhere between 6 to 27 percent of the population depending who you ask. =/ Some of those will believe this right off and as is.

Remember that in the 2004 elections parties here were basically functioning like fanatical religious fronts.

You did look at the images and automatically called it "video of terrorsts preparing their weapons" when, in fact, you have no idea who or what is being filmed.



Its a funny thing, but propaganda videos are notorious for taking pictures out of context, not explaining what is shown, and using these images for maximum emotional reaction. I guess its *completely* my fault that I "have no idea who or what is being filmed" and I should just give these guys the benfit of the doubt abpout something they gave me no credible information about and assume that the guys in masks with the rockets are on a peacekeeping mission to protect schoolchildren.

Its a funny thing, but propaganda videos are notorious for taking pictures out of context, not explaining what is shown, and using these images for maximum emotional reaction. I guess its *completely* my fault that I "have no idea who or what is being filmed" and I should just give these guys the benfit of the doubt abpout something they gave me no credible information about and assume that the guys in masks with the rockets are on a peacekeeping mission to protect schoolchildren.

Amen.

Disgusting. Filthy beasts..."Fighting for principle"? What principle is that? Murder, death? The principle that democracy is "heretical"? So I guess killing the people of Iraq and establishing a totalitarian regime that butchers innocents is supposed to help them? Anyone who admires this video...You are evil.

Well, that statement makes sense when you consider Hamas...

But there are a great deal of islamophobes among that bunch, and I am sure the majority will not be persuaded to support the insurgency whether with word or with material.

The people who I really think will be affected are Americans who (on the right, left, and whatever else they percieve themselves as being) are under the impression that everything the US has done since Bush was elected was evil and driven by a conspiracy of wealth, which accounts for, IIRC, somewhere between 6 to 27 percent of the population depending who you ask. =/ Some of those will believe this right off and as is.

Remember that in the 2004 elections parties here were basically functioning like fanatical religious fronts.
Hmm. Islmaophobes on the European left? I don't know about that being an american but I always thought Europeans were more sympathetic to many of the issues concerning Arabs such as support for the Palestinan cause. To me it seemed this video was pandering pretty hard to the Europeans calling for the devestment from the dollar and the isolation of the USA.

Its a funny thing, but propaganda videos are notorious for taking pictures out of context, not explaining what is shown, and using these images for maximum emotional reaction. I guess its *completely* my fault that I "have no idea who or what is being filmed" and I should just give these guys the benfit of the doubt abpout something they gave me no credible information about and assume that the guys in masks with the rockets are on a peacekeeping mission to protect schoolchildren.

So you just missed, or ignored, my apology, eh?

Well .. suit yourself then.

So you just missed, or ignored, my apology, eh?

Well .. suit yourself then.
Of course I didn't, I appreciate it. Peace.

Of course I didn't, I appreciate it. Peace.

Groovy then ... all is well with the Universe. Sala'am.

Groovy then ... all is well with the Universe. Sala'am.

Sala'am, aleinu ve'al kol ha'olam, Sala'am Sala'am.

im not even going to get started. not after that arguement was just ended... and im in the middle of another one on the same topic else where...
it was a good production. i believe what htey say is true, when have they crossed into our land?

im not even going to get started. not after that arguement was just ended... and im in the middle of another one on the same topic else where...
it was a good production. i believe what htey say is true, when have they crossed into our land?

Um...let me think. There was that one time, a little over three years ago. September, I think it was? Ah, I don't really remember.

:rolleyes:

man that clip was funny
:D

It was pretty well put together.

That said, I have significant doubt that the US is really trying to take over the world or the "world's energy resources". I don't think that we're "stealing their oil" either. I imagine we are buying it from them.

I believe it's a pretty safe assumption that the masked men holding automatic weapons and rocket launchers are terrorists, or associated with terrorists. Even if they are only fighting US forces, their fellow Jihadists are driving car bombs into markets full of civilians.

Oh forget it ... you're blind to it all anyway. You see brown skin and a turban and automatically think "terrorist!"



Well Einstein, who the heck are the terrorists? Brown skinned perhaps? If it looks like shit, smells like shit, it most likely is shit.


You definately are the living end!

its propaganda, goddamit! as soon as it is recognized as such, you're not supposed to take this stuff seriously! geez!

If you actually read my post you would realize that it did not include any referances to brown skin, fox news, george bush, or the invasion of Iraq. I happen to be Candian, and I don't get fox, nor would I ever watch it. I'm far from supporting George W., and I'm glad canada stayed out of the war. All I said was that I don't see why you would congradulate a terrorst orginization like Islamic Jihad, who are resposible for the murders of civillians, for a common propaganda video. If you find this kind of tripe convincing, fine. I won't be the one to start flameing, and I'm dissapointed that a guy like you (who's posts I have read, and respected till now) would do so.

He's a fake muslim.

Well Einstein, who the heck are the terrorists? Brown skinned perhaps? If it looks like shit, smells like shit, it most likely is shit.


You definately are the living end!
Hey Jhonny, Keruvalia and I have sorted this. No more flaming is needed (though good taste is stricly rationed in your world, I realize)

Um...let me think. There was that one time, a little over three years ago. September, I think it was? Ah, I don't really remember.

:rolleyes:

The ones responsible for that were Saudis...

The ones responsible for that were Saudis...

Who largely fund most Islamofascist terrorist groups...a la the ones in the propaganda film.

Oh forget it ... you're blind to it all anyway. You see brown skin and a turban and automatically think "terrorist!".
What's your deal? Why do you automatically assume that everyone who voted for/supports President George W. Bush, or supports the foreign policy of the United States, or who supports Israel, or the global war on terror, or who isn't swayed by a five-minute video put out by a bunch of anti-semetic, murderous terrorist thugs, is a virulent racist and an Islamophobe?

I, for one, am neither. Are there those who agree with me on certain issues who are? Probably, but quite frankly, you're not doing a lot to dissuade them of their opinions.

You did look at the images and automatically called it "video of terrorsts preparing their weapons" when, in fact, you have no idea who or what is being filmed.

I suppose they were actually Saudi Royal Guardsmen? :rolleyes:

Who largely fund most Islamofascist terrorist groups...a la the ones in the propaganda film.

Still, Iraqis didn't attack america.

Still, Iraqis didn't attack america.

Where did Iraq come from? I thought we were talking about the Saudis?

Where did Iraq come from? I thought we were talking about the Saudis?

My first reply was to your statement that "they" (Iraqis) had crossed into your land on september 11th.
See?

Still, Iraqis didn't attack america.
That's true. Saddam Hussein and his reigeme, however, among committing a host of atrocities against their own population, were supporters of international terrorism.

That's true. Saddam Hussein and his reigeme, however, among committing a host of atrocities against their own population, were supporters of international terrorism.

And yet there was no Al-Queda presence in Iraq before the invasion. Now there is.

My first reply was to your statement that "they" (Iraqis) had crossed into your land on september 11th.
See?

Ah. I see the connection now. My mistake.

Saddam was known to give aid to terrorist organizations, including al Qaeda. Thus, he had a hand in it, though admittedly most of the actual perpetrators were Saudi.

And yet there was no Al-Queda presence in Iraq before the invasion. Now there is.

"The Iraqi government was directly supporting al Qaeda with weapons and explosives. [Ansar] was part of al Qaeda, and given support with money and guns."-Qassem Hussein Mohamed, April 2, 2002, The Christian Science Monitor

And...

On April 27, 2003, The [London] Sunday Telegraph reported that documents discovered in the rubble of Iraq's intelligence agency show a link between Saddam Hussein's regime and al Qaeda. According to papers found by Telegraph journalists, in March 1998 an al Qaeda representative met with officials in Baghdad to discuss a relationship.

Where did Iraq come from? I thought we were talking about the Saudis?
Why would anyone think the Saudi's are funding Arab Nationalists in Iraq? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The Saudi leaders were shitting their pants when Sadam invaded Kuwait, so much so they allowed Americans to attack Iraq from their land, which infuriated their own people, as well as paying for America's war costing the Saudi's somewhere around $80 billion which crippled thier economy. Why would they help their mortal foes reconstitute themselves as a potential threat?

Second, it was not the Saudi government that cooked up 9-11 but those elements wanting to see the Saudi monarchy overthrown, the Al-Quaeda types which are currently waging an armed insurgency against the Saudi government. The house of Saud is ready to come tumbling down like a house of cards any year or even month now. I highly doubt they really want to be putting even more weapons in the hands of young pissed off Arab militants.

Ah. I see the connection now. My mistake.

Saddam was known to give aid to terrorist organizations, including al Qaeda. Thus, he had a hand in it, though admittedly most of the actual perpetrators were Saudi.

Uhm...Are you sure of this? I was under the impression that there were no links. Saddam's and Al-Queada's ideologies don't match. Both are anti-american, but I think that's just about the only thing they have in common.

Why would anyone think the Saudi's are funding Arab Nationalists in Iraq? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The Saudi leaders were shitting their pants when Sadam invaded Kuwait, so much so they allowed Americans to attack Iraq from their land, which infuriated their own people, as well as paying for America's war costing the Saudi's somewhere around $80 billion which crippled thier economy. Why would they help their mortal foes reconstitute themselves as a potential threat?

Second, it was not the Saudi government that cooked up 9-11 but those elements wanting to see the Saudi monarchy overthrown, the Al-Quaeda types which are currently waging an armed insurgency against the Saudi government. The house of Saud is ready to come tumbling down like a house of cards any year or even month now. I highly doubt they really want to be putting even more weapons in the hands of young pissed off Arab militants.

I meant that Saudi money funded the operations of 9/11. I wasn't even near any of this stuff, though I don't doubt the legitimacy of most of your points.

Uhm...Are you sure of this? I was under the impression that there were no links. Saddam's and Al-Queada's ideologies don't match. Both are anti-american, but I think that's just about the only thing they have in common.

read the post directly below the one you quoted.

"The Iraqi government was directly supporting al Qaeda with weapons and explosives. [Ansar] was part of al Qaeda, and given support with money and guns."-Qassem Hussein Mohamed, April 2, 2002, The Christian Science Monitor

And...

On April 27, 2003, The [London] Sunday Telegraph reported that documents discovered in the rubble of Iraq's intelligence agency show a link between Saddam Hussein's regime and al Qaeda. According to papers found by Telegraph journalists, in March 1998 an al Qaeda representative met with officials in Baghdad to discuss a relationship.


"The Sept. 11 commission reported yesterday that it has found no "collaborative relationship" between Iraq and al Qaeda, challenging one of the Bush administration's main justifications for the war in Iraq."
Washington Post, June 17, 2004

"Mr Rumsfeld was asked by a New York audience about connections between Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden.
"To my knowledge, I have not seen any strong, hard evidence that links the two," he said, though he later issued a statement saying he was misunderstood."
BBCnews, Tuesday, 5 October, 2004


It seems to me that this connection has not been proven.

"Mr Rumsfeld was asked by a New York audience about connections between Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden.
"To my knowledge, I have not seen any strong, hard evidence that links the two," he said, though he later issued a statement saying he was misunderstood."
BBCnews, Tuesday, 5 October, 2004

Out of curiosity, do you know where I might find that statement?

And yet there was no Al-Queda presence in Iraq before the invasion. Now there is.
Ever heard of Salmon Pack? Or Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi? Salmon Pack was a terrorist training camp sponsored by Saddam, and Al-Zarqawi was given medical treatment in the hospital run by Saddam's son. The hospital reserved special individuals.

Out of curiosity, do you know where I might find that statement?

Probably on bbcnews.
It seems that the strongest argument for this alleged link at this time is: "Just because we haven't found it, it doesn't mean that it isn't there".

I have also read many articles that say the American media is split over this issue. So obviously, the link has not yet been proven...Probably not even found.

Ever heard of Salmon Pack? Or Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi? Salmon Pack was a terrorist training camp sponsored by Saddam, and Al-Zarqawi was given medical treatment in the hospital run by Saddam's son. The hospital reserved special individuals.

First of all, although the Bush administration has claimed that there is a link between Zarqawi and Al-Queda, they have yet to provide any proof or documents to back it up.
Zarqawi is a symbolic figure in the Iraqi resistance, but he is not a member of Al Queda.

And this Salman Pack (not salmon)...I'm having trouble finding any reliable sources on that.
The only references to terrorist training camps in the town of salman pack are statements on sites which are unreliable sources at best, such as newsmax. (Sites like newsmax and indiemedia are hyperbiased drivel and can't be used as sources).

exuse me, but this self-same Islamic jihad has "claimed credit" for numerous suicide bombs that resulted in the murder of innocent civilians in Israel. How can you claim that I have libeld them as terrorists when its clear that they are such? maybe the militants in Iraq that this video is about arn't directly related to the ones in palestine, but these are fine distinctions. Anyone who choses to affiliate themselves with murderers doesn't deserve politically correct taxonomy.
Let us refer to them as they deserve to be called. They are not suicide bombers...They are homocide bombers.....

Well Einstein, who the heck are the terrorists? Brown skinned perhaps? If it looks like shit, smells like shit, it most likely is shit.


You definately are the living end!
Once again you dolt you make reasonable Americans cringe...Terrorists do not know color and Islamic terrorists come in all shapes ans sizes and skin tones...Adam Catah from Cali. is just one. I do not like terrorists of any type...And any one wearing a mask to hide who the yare can not be very proud of what the yare doing or the yknow it is patently wrong...Could you for once not be so irritating...Try making valid points with out flaming....

And yet there was no Al-Queda presence in Iraq before the invasion. Now there is.
That is patently false....Al-Queda was present in Iraq despite what we have been spoon fed by the media....If the ywere not there before how did they get there afterwards...They cells were planted before the war thus the presence of Al Zarqawi....

Once again you dolt you make reasonable Americans cringe...Terrorists do not know color and Islamic terrorists come in all shapes ans sizes and skin tones...Adam Catah from Cali. is just one. I do not like terrorists of any type...And any one wearing a mask to hide who the yare can not be very proud of what the yare doing or the yknow it is patently wrong...Could you for once not be so irritating...Try making valid points with out flaming....

I did make a valid point.

BTW when was the last time you saw a blue eyed, blond, white dude hijack a jet and crash it into a building, or take a school hostage and knifed babies when they ran out of ammo, or run into an Israeli pizza joint with a vest full of explosives?

Why would anyone think the Saudi's are funding Arab Nationalists in Iraq? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The Saudi leaders were shitting their pants when Sadam invaded Kuwait, so much so they allowed Americans to attack Iraq from their land, which infuriated their own people, as well as paying for America's war costing the Saudi's somewhere around $80 billion which crippled thier economy. Why would they help their mortal foes reconstitute themselves as a potential threat?

Second, it was not the Saudi government that cooked up 9-11 but those elements wanting to see the Saudi monarchy overthrown, the Al-Quaeda types which are currently waging an armed insurgency against the Saudi government. The house of Saud is ready to come tumbling down like a house of cards any year or even month now. I highly doubt they really want to be putting even more weapons in the hands of young pissed off Arab militants.
Contrary to popular belief the Saudi gov. did not pay for the first war...The USA did...The Saudis were supposed to but never did...And the Saudi gov. hosts and supports telethons for Homocide bombers on state run television...

Check this (http://www.hamasonline.org/MediaC/Iraq/message-from-resistance.wmv) out. It isn't half bad. It is even in English.
Are you actually expecting people to take this seriously? I haven't laughed at propoganda so hard in a very long time. "To the US soldiers... laydown your arms and take refuge in our mosques. We will protect you." Yeah while we blow up our own people in our own mosques!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The last propoganda I saw that was that pathetic was some of the bad WW2 nazi crap. What did you guys hire the same advertising agency or PR men? Great misinformation! No sarcasm there!

Once again you dolt you make reasonable Americans cringe...Terrorists do not know color and Islamic terrorists come in all shapes ans sizes and skin tones...Adam Catah from Cali. is just one. I do not like terrorists of any type...And any one wearing a mask to hide who the yare can not be very proud of what the yare doing or the yknow it is patently wrong...Could you for once not be so irritating...Try making valid points with out flaming....

BTW who the f is adam catah? You dolt!

I did make a valid point.

BTW when was the last time you saw a blue eyed, blond, white dude hijack a jet and crash it into a building, or take a school hostage and knifed babies when they ran out of ammo, or run into an Israeli pizza joint with a vest full of explosives?
The vast majority of terrorists in northern Asia and in Eastern Europe are Blond haired or blue eyed or caucasian....

That is patently false....Al-Queda was present in Iraq despite what we have been spoon fed by the media....If the ywere not there before how did they get there afterwards...They cells were planted before the war thus the presence of Al Zarqawi....

And your proof of this?

Zarqawi was not in Iraq before the war, he was in Lebanon...
Of course, my sources are the media, and I admit that I have never seen Al Zarqawi with my own eyes...Maybe Al Zarqawi is a fictional character made up by the massive international conspiracy of all the media and news agencies in the galaxy...Right?

BTW who the f is adam catah? You dolt!
A blond hair blue eyed man from California who released a tape promising that the streets of America would run red with blood if we re-elected Pres. Bush...Or we can mention Johnny Walker Lynn...Another american from California arrested in Afghanistan fighting against Us forces...Or the very large number of white Canadiens and Englishmen and Aussies arrested in Afgahnistan as well....I am all about the USA and all about what we are doing in the world but you have stop flaming man....

BTW who the f is adam catah? You dolt!
A blond hair blue eyed man from California who released a tape promising that the streets of America would run red with blood if we re-elected Pres. Bush...Or we can mention Johnny Walker Lynn...Another american from California arrested in Afghanistan fighting against Us forces...Or the very large number of white Canadiens and Englishmen and Aussies arrested in Afgahnistan as well....I am all about the USA and all about what we are doing in the world but you have stop flaming man....

Are you actually expecting people to take this seriously? I haven't laughed at propoganda so hard in a very long time. "To the US soldiers... laydown your arms and take refuge in our mosques. We will protect you." Yeah while we blow up our own people in our own mosques!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The last propoganda I saw that was that pathetic was some of the bad WW2 nazi crap. What did you guys hire the same advertising agency or PR men? Great misinformation! No sarcasm there!
The Nazis were masters of propaganda. No comparrison to the crude cartoons of buck-toothed, slanty eyed japs which appeared in the American press durring the war.

I did make a valid point.

BTW when was the last time you saw a blue eyed, blond, white dude hijack a jet and crash it into a building, or take a school hostage and knifed babies when they ran out of ammo, or run into an Israeli pizza joint with a vest full of explosives?

I remember quite many bombings, hostage takings, assassinations and murders done by the IRA.
Then we have the Checnyan resistance. Those guys are responsible for more bombings in Moscow than I can count. Their latest act of terrorism was shooting up and then blowing up an elementary school full of children and teachers.
Then we have the ETA in Spain. They've killed quite alot of people in Spain with their bombs.
I also seem to remember a guy that went by the name of "Unabomber" in the US. And that other guy, Timothy Mcveigh (sp?).

There are alot of white guys with bombs out there.

And your proof of this?

Zarqawi was not in Iraq before the war, he was in Lebanon...
Of course, my sources are the media, and I admit that I have never seen Al Zarqawi with my own eyes...Maybe Al Zarqawi is a fictional character made up by the massive international conspiracy of all the media and news agencies in the galaxy...Right?
Zarqawi had an established base of operations in Iraq long before the invasion..And one of Osamma top Lt. was given aid and comfort in Sadam's best hospitals shortly after being wounded in Afghan. during our liberation of that nation as well...Or was Sadam just showing his humantarian side there?

Zarqawi had an established base of operations in Iraq long before the invasion..And one of Osamma top Lt. was given aid and comfort in Sadam's best hospitals shortly after being wounded in Afghan. during our liberation of that nation as well...Or was Sadam just showing his humantarian side there?

Sources?

I remember quite many bombings, hostage takings, assassinations and murders done by the IRA.
Then we have the Checnyan resistance. Those guys are responsible for more bombings in Moscow than I can count. Their latest act of terrorism was shooting up and then blowing up an elementary school full of children and teachers.
Then we have the ETA in Spain. They've killed quite alot of people in Spain with their bombs.
I also seem to remember a guy that went by the name of "Unabomber" in the US. And that other guy, Timothy Mcveigh (sp?).

There are alot of white guys with bombs out there.
I agree with much of your statement here...Except that the Checnyan school massacre was pulled off by an equal mix of Arabs and Chechans...Read the after action reprot for confirmation on this...See the problem with extremism is that the left(the UNA Bomber) and the right( Timothy McVeigh) all have idiots...There are alot of wackos with bombs out there...The wackiness has no color preference...

Sources?
Ok ok...I can not look them up right now but I will try to get back to you on the sources....I promise....The wounded Bin LAden LT. was widely reported by all the media outlets...Zarqawi may be a figment of my imagination...MAny ppl have called me sick and twisted you know...I will se what I can find for you though....Much tired must rest soon....Eyes heavy limbs numb...Drifting..........Nite all.....

Who largely fund most Islamofascist terrorist groups...a la the ones in the propaganda film.

Uhhh yes if we completely ignore the fact that the Saudis own much of the United States...in effect, attacking their own buildings and employees...go figure.

It amazes me how readily the U.S. gives billions in aid to Israel -- a nation led by a mass murderer (sharon), yet attacks and kills thousands (http://www.iraqibodycount.net) of innocents (hey now, brown skin = terrorist so it's a common mistake) in a war that has gone completely unjustified. You know what happens to women who go without veils in ANY middle eastern country? Rape, torture, beating. The customs that surround the manner in which their women dress are a part of their culture as much as blind faith in the governmental oligarchy is for the United States (there's no such thing as a true democracy, it just isn't feasible). Hell, look at the way the U.S. treats homosexuals?
When Bush sr put trade restrictions on Iraq after the gulf, thousands died because of dehydration. The reason? Iraq wasn't able to import replacement parts for their plumbing.
So far the only thing the U.S. has liberated are tens of thousands of lives. Death is a freedom of sorts, though, eh?
I guess this isn't so surprising.
1. Support a distant cause in a distant land with U.S. equipment and troops (++economy)
2. Continue support until cause conflicts with U.S. current beliefs (+economy over an extended period of time)
3. Declare war on the murderous, terrorist, fascist heathens! (temporarily -economy, but +++popular support and +++economy in long run)

Stage 3 Countries: Afghanistan, Iraq
Stage 2 Countries: Israel (among others)
Stage 1 Countries: (too many to list here)

10 years from now- HEADLINE: Israeli Terrorists Strike on U.S. Soil! [insert joe schmoe president/political puppet here] calls for War!


Disgusting. Filthy beasts..."Fighting for principle"? What principle is that? Murder, death? The principle that democracy is "heretical"? So I guess killing the people of Iraq and establishing a totalitarian regime that butchers innocents is supposed to help them? Anyone who admires this video...You are evil.

Are you referring to the totalitarian regime that butchers innocents which the U.S. is currently installing, and solidifying?


Remember, the United States were originally colonies that fought for independence from a much larger global power that was using them for their resources....hmm....sound familiar?

The true freedomfighters and patriots are off fighting the U.S. occupation in Iraq and Afghanistan. By comparison, what does the U.S. have? Their only notable "patriots" were in fact fighting to become rich! Washington, jefferson, and others were the first *capitalists*, and the real reason they wanted freedom was to increase profit.

We live for the buck, we die for the buck.



[/rant]

I agree with much of your statement here...Except that the Checnyan school massacre was pulled off by an equal mix of Arabs and Chechans...Read the after action reprot for confirmation on this...See the problem with extremism is that the left(the UNA Bomber) and the right( Timothy McVeigh) all have idiots...There are alot of wackos with bombs out there...The wackiness has no color preference...

That was exactly my point.
The guy wanted examples of "white terrorists".

Ok ok...I can not look them up right now but I will try to get back to you on the sources....I promise....The wounded Bin LAden LT. was widely reported by all the media outlets...Zarqawi may be a figment of my imagination...MAny ppl have called me sick and twisted you know...I will se what I can find for you though....Much tired must rest soon....Eyes heavy limbs numb...Drifting..........Nite all.....

Nite. Thanks for the debate.

It is not uncommon for the yank newspapers to ignore facts reported by British media sources. There have been very obvious connections made.
Saddam's goals and Al-Quead goals were very much compatible. Saddam was focused on destablizing the area while Al-Quead is focused on destroying Isreal and any power stronger than themselves.
The main core of Al-Quead is from Suadi Arabia since bin laden was from a wealthy family there and exiled. The Suadi's don't actually have any more connection to Al-Quead than other more neutral pinninsula countries.
No Suadi Arabia did not pay any of the costs from the first Gulf War. They were involved to stop further expansion of Iraq, Jordan and a couple of other countries. Egypt was originally approached to join the others before they chose to report the whole incident with their allies, Isreal and USA.

The Nazis were masters of propaganda. No comparrison to the crude cartoons of buck-toothed, slanty eyed japs which appeared in the American press durring the war.
Okay yes those posters were completly hilarious in their inaccuracies. But in hind sight the propoganda from the nazis was pathetic and quite comical!

Why would anyone think the Saudi's are funding Arab Nationalists in Iraq? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. The Saudi leaders were shitting their pants when Sadam invaded Kuwait, so much so they allowed Americans to attack Iraq from their land, which infuriated their own people, as well as paying for America's war costing the Saudi's somewhere around $80 billion which crippled thier economy. Why would they help their mortal foes reconstitute themselves as a potential threat?

There are about 7000 saudi royals, I think. Not exactly sure however. Anyway, there's a lot. Somewhere between a quarter to half of that number hate America passionately. Those are the ones funding terrorism.

All this 'war' and 'terrorism' stuff is silliness. It's all an allusion to Starwars, you know.

What's your deal? Why do you automatically assume that everyone who voted for/supports President George W. Bush, or supports the foreign policy of the United States, or who supports Israel, or the global war on terror, or who isn't swayed by a five-minute video put out by a bunch of anti-semetic, murderous terrorist thugs, is a virulent racist and an Islamophobe?

I, for one, am neither. Are there those who agree with me on certain issues who are? Probably, but quite frankly, you're not doing a lot to dissuade them of their opinions.

Well said. Thank you!!!

Still, Iraqis didn't attack america.

True.

Then again, after we devastated Al Qaeda's infrastructure in Afghanistan, they began moving into Iraq. This was in the period between the wars. We had not invaded, but they were moving people into Iraq. I just read this in Newsweek, not exactly known for being a bastion of pro-Bush propaganda.

And yet there was no Al-Queda presence in Iraq before the invasion. Now there is.

Please refer to my above post.

First of all, although the Bush administration has claimed that there is a link between Zarqawi and Al-Queda, they have yet to provide any proof or documents to back it up.
Zarqawi is a symbolic figure in the Iraqi resistance, but he is not a member of Al Queda.


Zarqawi has personally beheaded foreign hostages, and is a leading figure in organizing bombings and attacks on US forces and Iraqi civilians. A couple of months ago, his group and Al-Qaeda announced an alliance, that Zarqawi would run the "Iraq Chapter" of Al-Qaeda.

Zarqawi has personally beheaded foreign hostages, and is a leading figure in organizing bombings and attacks on US forces and Iraqi civilians. A couple of months ago, his group and Al-Qaeda announced an alliance, that Zarqawi would run the "Iraq Chapter" of Al-Qaeda.

I was wrong: Zarqawi and his group are now in touch with Al Queda. In the same statement they said that they had been in touch with Al-Queda for 8 months. The statement appeared on a website and it has not been confirmed by anyone else...

But all of this does not change the fact that the war was what brought terrorism and organizations like Al Queda to Iraq.
I don't know about this newsweek article you speak of (I don't get newsweek) but I can't find anything on it anywhere else.

I don't know about this newsweek article you speak of (I don't get newsweek) but I can't find anything on it anywhere else.

"After the United States crushed Afghanistan's Taliban regime and tore up Al Qaeda's infrastructure in the winder of 2001-02, would-be holy warriors started eying Iraq as a place where they could make a new stand."

From NEWSWEEK Feb 7, 2005 "Unmasking the Insurgents" by Rod Nordland, Tom Masland and Christopher Dickey.

Now you do! :)

Perhaps all that election rhetoric about Iraq being unrelated to the war on terror wasn't COMPLETELY true....

"One persons terrorist is anothers freedom fighter"

The american government had no good reason to attack iraq and like usual its the innocent people living in iraq and the proud american soldier just trying to do his or her duty while putting their trust in a corrupt governments policy that will pay.
I would say the americans are getting what they deserve but thats like saying the innocent people of iraq deserve to be killed by american bombs.
Too bad that stupid bastard bush didn't choke to death on that pretzel !

I did make a valid point.

BTW when was the last time you saw a blue eyed, blond, white dude hijack a jet and crash it into a building, or take a school hostage and knifed babies when they ran out of ammo, or run into an Israeli pizza joint with a vest full of explosives?
Okay, these involve planes yes, babies yes, food joints yes, and explosives yes:

http://www.mayhem.net/Crime/murder1.html

Most mass murderers are male, white, conservative and come from relatively stable, lower-middle-class backgrounds. They are not usually adopted, illegitimate or institutionalized as children. They are usually people who aspire to more than they can achieve. They see their ambitions thwarted, and blame other people for keeping them down. They feel excluded from the group that they wish to belong to, and develop an irrational, eventually homicidal, hatred of that group. Invariably, they choose to die in an explosion of violence directed at a group they feel oppresses, threatens, or excludes them.

There are three types of mass murderers, the family annihilators, the paramilitary enthusiasts, and the disgruntled workers. They all tend to be young, white, males with easy access to weapons.


BTW, what colour was Hitler, and Stalin?
BTW2 So many of them are Americans.

Wow my thread lives on... Thanks to me nearly 1,000 people viewed insurgent propoganda. Those terrorists totally owe me; I should send them an email asking for a kalishnikov or an RPG as compensation for all my hard work distributing their little film here.

but its gone downhill since keruvalia and I quit the arguing [/pathetic slur]

Wow my thread lives on... Thanks to me nearly 1,000 people viewed insurgent propoganda. Those terrorists totally owe me; I should send them an email asking for a kalishnikov or an RPG as compensation for all my hard work distributing their little film here.
My son and I watched the video and found it very compelling to say the least. Thanks for the post.

but its gone downhill since keruvalia and I quit the arguing [/pathetic slur]
Since when is there ever a shortage of people willing to scream back and forth at each other about the middle east?

COMPELLING!?
you find propaganda compelling?! aughh, I can't argue about this again...but this is sad.

COMPELLING!?
you find propaganda compelling?! aughh, I can't argue about this again...but this is sad.
You know, history is the story of man and guess what....there are always two sides to every story. If anyone can keep an open mind, they can hear the truth in both stories.

Someday, maybe just someday, war will no longer be the answer to man's tainted past.

jihadjihad

http://img205.exs.cx/img205/7577/emotjewboom4tv.gif

You know, history is the story of man and guess what....there are always two sides to every story. If anyone can keep an open mind, they can hear the truth in both stories.

Someday, maybe just someday, war will no longer be the answer to man's tainted past.

You're pretty detached from a whole lotta feelings for a parent.
So, one day, if your son dies in a bus bombing because some dude wanted to get back at your government for anything that ticked him off, I guess your emotional decadence will serve you well.

/not even going to invoke a godwin and ask you about the nazi's point of view
//fuckin' bullshit troll :mp5:
///woe is me, bit like a fish :)

There may always be two (or more) sides to a story. But there are definite cases in history where one side is remembered as the one who was completely reprehensible.

I don't, for example, foresee a time when all people will dispassionately (and uniformly) view Hitler's Germany as morally equivalent in all respects to the Allied nations.

Not that again.

Argh.

You're pretty detached from a whole lotta feelings for a parent.
Totally the opposite. I am very attached, and love my sons dearly.

So, one day, if your son dies in a bus bombing because some dude wanted to get back at your government for anything that ticked him off, I guess your emotional decadence will serve you well.
Do you live in fear of this happening to your loved ones?

Emotional decadence because I believe in peaceful solutions? Perhaps you need to check your motivation for issuing such an accusation?

Perhaps the best solution is that I support my government NOT to go around pissing off other nations, and support my government to look for peaceful solutions to the various ailments of the world. Thank God that my government elected not to send troops into Iraq.

I don't know if you are an American or if you are even qualified to question the emotions of a parent if you are not one yourself?

If I was an American, I would certainly be more fearful for my children ending up as a statistic, be it a retaliation such as 9/11 or as casualty of a war that should never have been fought, such as Iraq.

/not even going to invoke a godwin and ask you about the nazi's point of view
//fuckin' bullshit troll :mp5:
///woe is me, bit like a fish :)
What is this BS? How would I know the fascist view, perhaps you could enlighten me?

There may always be two (or more) sides to a story. But there are definite cases in history where one side is remembered as the one who was completely reprehensible.

I don't, for example, foresee a time when all people will dispassionately (and uniformly) view Hitler's Germany as morally equivalent in all respects to the Allied nations.
Right now, in many of these "Allied nations", the "morality" of George Bush is certainly being viewed in a negative light.

Right now, in many of these "Allied nations", the "morality" of George Bush is certainly being viewed in a negative light.

It all depends on who writes the history, now doesn't it?

Right now, it looks like the insurgency doesn't have a realistic chance of attaining any real political goals. So they will lose.

European nations all of a sudden are cozy with the US again (maybe not their people, but certainly their governments). All is well again, or at least that's the official word from France.

I think Bush, ten years from now, will be smelling as sweet as a daisy.

It all depends on who writes the history, now doesn't it?

Right now, it looks like the insurgency doesn't have a realistic chance of attaining any real political goals. So they will lose.

European nations all of a sudden are cozy with the US again (maybe not their people, but certainly their governments). All is well again, or at least that's the official word from France.

I think Bush, ten years from now, will be smelling as sweet as a daisy.
Ahhh the calm before the storm? Until Bush starts looking for peaceful solutions, the world will keep an eye on his every move?

Okay, these involve planes yes, babies yes, food joints yes, and explosives yes:

http://www.mayhem.net/Crime/murder1.html

Most mass murderers are male, white, conservative and come from relatively stable, lower-middle-class backgrounds. They are not usually adopted, illegitimate or institutionalized as children. They are usually people who aspire to more than they can achieve. They see their ambitions thwarted, and blame other people for keeping them down. They feel excluded from the group that they wish to belong to, and develop an irrational, eventually homicidal, hatred of that group. Invariably, they choose to die in an explosion of violence directed at a group they feel oppresses, threatens, or excludes them.

There are three types of mass murderers, the family annihilators, the paramilitary enthusiasts, and the disgruntled workers. They all tend to be young, white, males with easy access to weapons.


BTW, what colour was Hitler, and Stalin?
BTW2 So many of them are Americans.

Sorry but were we not talking about terrorists?

There are three types of mass murderers, the family annihilators, the paramilitary enthusiasts, and the disgruntled workers. They all tend to be young, white, males with easy access to weapons.


I tend to think of the people who did 9-11 as being middle class single (for the most part) Muslims who held conservative beliefs (for their culture). I also see them as paramilitary enthusiasts (considering the al-Q video tapes we always see).

There's a thread there too.

I would, however, not jump the conclusion in the other direction.

Just because you're a gun owner and a paramilitary enthusiast, or even a Muslim, doesn't mean you're inclined to be a mass murderer.

I have many guns, have been in combat in the military, still enjoy militaria, but I haven't committed mass murder.

European nations all of a sudden are cozy with the US again (maybe not their people, but certainly their governments). All is well again, or at least that's the official word from France.oh boy...

Perhaps the best solution is that I support my government NOT to go around pissing off other nations, and support my government to look for peaceful solutions to the various ailments of the world.
This worked very well for Belgium in the 20th century and Germany in the 17th century.

Sorry but were we not talking about terrorists?
These mass murderers are not terrorists? Hitler and Stalin (two of the worst) are not terrorists?

You need to lose the racist argument?

Ahhh the calm before the storm? Until Bush starts looking for peaceful solutions, the world will keep an eye on his every move?

I think...

Although, I wish we were back in Classical times. No one cared whether you were politically correct or not. Then all they cared about was the phat lewt you brought back from conquering weaker peoples.

Ah, the good ole' days...

Totally the opposite. I am very attached, and love my sons dearly.

Do you live in fear of this happening to your loved ones?

Emotional decadence because I believe in peaceful solutions? Perhaps you need to check your motivation for issuing such an accusation?


Don't need to, and won't. Call me a tinfoil hat nut, but this is an undeclared war between western culture and oriental culture. The victims are the people, and being for or against this or that never saved anyone working in the WTC. I live in fear of this happening again.
Obviously, you've never lost anyone to a violent manner.

The first two years, I just wished there were more of you people, who didn't know the pain caused by such losses.
Then came the waves of antisemitic attacks in france, then in europe as a whole. I started feeling bitter.
Nowadays, I really think you people do not understand jack shit about how this is gonna evolve. I'm still not so bitter to wish any of it on you, but you should understand one thing : it's not the victim's goddamn fault.


Perhaps the best solution is that I support my government NOT to go around pissing off other nations, and support my government to look for peaceful solutions to the various ailments of the world. Thank God that my government elected not to send troops into Iraq.


Yeah, yeah. It's the victim's fault.


I don't know if you are an American or if you are even qualified to question the emotions of a parent if you are not one yourself?

If I was an American, I would certainly be more fearful for my children ending up as a statistic, be it a retaliation such as 9/11 or as casualty of a war that should never have been fought, such as Iraq.


I'm qualified to question your skills as a parent as much as the next man, and I'm not an american.
I'm certainly not showing ANY kind of propaganda to my kids. I AM their propaganda, as their parent. And I don't need videos clamoring for the end of western civilization to do so.
But guess what, americans aren't the only targets of terrorism!
I guess the way you see things is that you need to keep feeding the monster, hoping it will eat you last.


What is this BS? How would I know the fascist view, perhaps you could enlighten me?
I'm not even going to start. Keep living the comfy life, enjoy it while it lasts. You want more enlightenment? Want to hear more about "the other side"? Read Mein fuckin' Kampf. To your kids.

/good parenting in a nutshell...