NationStates Jolt Archive

Why do I keep hearing news out of the good ol UK about Nazi this or Nazi that. From the dumb royalty to the mayor of London. You guys forget that nearly a million Brits died in WWII?

Why do I keep hearing news out of the good ol UK about Nazi this or Nazi that. From the dumb royalty to the mayor of London. You guys forget that nearly a million Brits died in WWII?

You forget that we were on the winning side, and so get to play with all the Nazi toys forever - from the Swastikas to the goosestepping to the tiny little moustaches, all of them belong to us now.

What do you mean, Nazi this or Nazi that? Could you be more specific?

What do you mean, Nazi this or Nazi that? Could you be more specific?A certain young Royal 'inadvisedly' choosing a Nazi (Africa Corps?) uniform as fancy dress, several weeks back, and London's Mayor describing (IIRC) some prominent Jewish figure as having some quality or other of a Concentration Camp guard, wasn't it?

In both cases I'm fairly certain no offence was meant, just a 'brain not in gear' moment for each. The former probably had no consideration apart from it being a 'comedy' uniform, the second might easily have been a random association during the heat of the moment that just happened to be the most ill-chosen he could have made, given the target of the comment... Though I don't know much about the latter, I quite like 'Red Ken' (in principle) and he's never struck me as the kind of person who'd intentially stoop to such depths, so I'm assuming it was an honest error...

A certain young Royal 'inadvisedly' choosing a Nazi (Africa Corps?) uniform as fancy dress, several weeks back, and London's Mayor describing (IIRC) some prominent Jewish figure as having some quality or other of a Concentration Camp guard, wasn't it?

In both cases I'm fairly certain no offence was meant, just a 'brain not in gear' moment for each. The former probably had no consideration apart from it being a 'comedy' uniform, the second might easily have been a random association during the heat of the moment that just happened to be the most ill-chosen he could have made, given the target of the comment... Though I don't know much about the latter, I quite like 'Red Ken' (in principle) and he's never struck me as the kind of person who'd intentially stoop to such depths, so I'm assuming it was an honest error...

Red Ken didn't realise the guy was jewish, but he was from a newspaper which everybody knows is borderline fascist. I think he was justified in calling him a nazi bastard
As for Prince Harry, I just thought it was funny the way all the extreme right newspapers were the ones screaming loudest for his blood.

As for Prince Harry, I just thought it was funny the way all the extreme right newspapers were the ones screaming loudest for his blood.
It was funnier when somebody on here kept insisting that Harry really was Nazi, and the guy kept saying things like "I knew the British royalty would see the light eventually!"

'Red Ken'

Oooh. I just had a flashback to Kate Bush singing 'Ken is the leader of the GLC' in the Comic Strip Presents... - Robbie Coltrane playing Charles Bronson playing Ken Livingstone: genius, pure fucking genius.

Why do I keep hearing news out of the good ol UK about Nazi this or Nazi that. From the dumb royalty to the mayor of London. You guys forget that nearly a million Brits died in WWII?

I think that for the English saying that someone is a Nazi is like saying that that person is a tuff person to deal with.
But I really don't know if that is accurate or not.

I think that for the English saying that someone is a Nazi is like saying that that person is a tuff person to deal with.
But I really don't know it that is accurate or not.

We would say someone is a nazi if we think they are being too strict.

Do you really think we would forget that nearly one million of us died in WW2? The reason we mock the Nazi's so is because it is a way to hid the scars of this country, after all, they did cause us eventually to dissolve the Empire

Red Ken didn't realise the guy was jewish, but he was from a newspaper which everybody knows is borderline fascist. I think he was justified in calling him a nazi bastard
As for Prince Harry, I just thought it was funny the way all the extreme right newspapers were the ones screaming loudest for his blood.

he didn't actually call him a nazi bastard. the great red ken said to the tabloid jouranlist words to the effect of "You are justifying the job that you are doing by saying that it's your job. That's the attitude of a concentration camp guard".

Do you really think we would forget that nearly one million of us died in WW2? The reason we mock the Nazi's so is because it is a way to hid the scars of this country, after all, they did cause us eventually to dissolve the Empire

i don't hate nazis because WW2 led to the dissolution of the empire. I hate them because they're nazis. The dissolution of the empire was basically a good thing for most of the empire's citizens.

he didn't actually call him a nazi bastard. the great red ken said to the tabloid jouranlist words to the effect of "You are justifying the job that you are doing by saying that it's your job. That's the attitude of a concentration camp guard".

I heard that on the radio, Blair wants Red Ken to publicly apologise

We would say someone is a nazi if we think they are being too strict.

Oh, okay. Thanks.

A certain young Royal 'inadvisedly' choosing a Nazi (Africa Corps?) uniform as fancy dress, several weeks back, and London's Mayor describing (IIRC) some prominent Jewish figure as having some quality or other of a Concentration Camp guard, wasn't it?

In both cases I'm fairly certain no offence was meant, just a 'brain not in gear' moment for each. The former probably had no consideration apart from it being a 'comedy' uniform, the second might easily have been a random association during the heat of the moment that just happened to be the most ill-chosen he could have made, given the target of the comment... Though I don't know much about the latter, I quite like 'Red Ken' (in principle) and he's never struck me as the kind of person who'd intentially stoop to such depths, so I'm assuming it was an honest error...

The young Royal was at a private fancy dress party, the photo was taken by another guest, on a camera phone and then sold to the papers. What somebody wears to a fancy dress party makes no difference to me, it's not even an issue. The fact was that somebody was trying to make a bit of cash out of it and the British tabloids will always jump on any opportunity like this to drum up sales and outrage.

Ken Livingstone made his angry remark about and to a journalist who was constantly doorstepping him (not a prominent public figure) who works for the Standard, a paper which has conducted a ten year campaign against him. I think it was quite appropriate really, it may well have let the journo know how much annoyance he was causing him.

I heard that on the radio, Blair wants Red Ken to publicly apologise

Blair can kiss ken's newty red arse. And he does too, to get him back in the party. I don't think he has anything to apologise for, and he relies on his actions for his political power rather than focus group opinion, so i don't think he needs to apologise. London'll vote him back in whether or not.

I heard that on the radio, Blair wants Red Ken to publicly apologise

Like Ken has ever been known to follow Tony's orders. :D

Tony didn't even want him to stand for the job of mayor, what did that do? It made Ken all the more determined to go for it.

I heard that on the radio, Blair wants Red Ken to publicly apologise

I hope Ken asks Blair to apologise for Iraq.

Blair can kiss ken's newty red arse. And he does too, to get him back in the party. I don't think he has anything to apologise for, and he relies on his actions for his political power rather than focus group opinion, so i don't think he needs to apologise. London'll vote him back in whether or not.
Most likely. However, it doesn't bode well for Labour as a whole does it. They aren't exactly haveing a gd time at the opnion polls from time to time. Red Ken is always gonna be in the Party, no matter what , its like Peter Mandelson.
Also, why when I post does everyone jump all over it?

I hope Ken asks Blair to apologise for Iraq.

Hear hear!

Hear hear!

OK, just a point here. Blair went to Iraq because, in my opnion, he actually di believe that Bush would help the country. Bush, on the other hand, went there for oil!

Most likely. However, it doesn't bode well for Labour as a whole does it. They aren't exactly haveing a gd time at the opnion polls from time to time. Red Ken is always gonna be in the Party, no matter what , its like Peter Mandelson.

Only ken rocks and pete sucks. I'm voting LibDem next chance i get. As long as it doesn't let a tory in.


Also, why when I post does everyone jump all over it?
Maybe cos your posts are terrible?
(j/k)

OK, just a point here. Blair went to Iraq because, in my opnion, he actually di believe that Bush would help the country. Bush, on the other hand, went there for oil!

nah, blair went to iraq so he'd look hard like his hero, thatch. what a wanker.

nah, blair went to iraq so he'd look hard like his hero, thatch. what a wanker.

Bush, hard? Dunno where you are looking mate :) Bush couldn't look hard if he tried *COUGH COUGH* Pretzel*COUGH COUGH*

Maybe cos your posts are terrible? Yeah you'd better b jokin, lol

Whose jumping on your posts? We just followed up your post with our own comments on it what was said...

Surely that's the whole point of a thread? It's not like you were being flamed or 'owt.

Whose jumping on your posts? We just followed up your post with our own comments on it what was said...

Surely that's the whole point of a thread? It's not like you were being flamed or 'owt.

I was just commenting on how I make a legitimate point, and then it gets demolished, even if that is the point of a thread, give others their opninos to have a chance

A legitimate point?

You pointed out something you'd heard on the radio, ie: not even your own opinion necessarily. A reporter was relaying Tony Bliars opinion, seeing how he's the prime minister of this country and known for grandstanding and lying in public, I believe it's fair of us to comment on it.

It's Tony Blair who has been shredded not you. ;)

A legitimate point?

You pointed out something you'd heard on the radio, ie: not even your own opinion necessarily. A reporter was relaying Tony Bliars opinion, seeing how he's the prime minister of this country and known for grandstanding and lying in public, I believe it's fair of us to comment on it.

It's Tony Blair who has been shredded not you. ;)

Yeah, you are right, I wasn't really concentrasting

Bush, hard? Dunno where you are looking mate :) Bush couldn't look hard if he tried *COUGH COUGH* Pretzel*COUGH COUGH*

Yeah you'd better b jokin, lol

He didn't say his hero was Bush. He said his hero was Thatcher. Who comes from my town. Sorry.

He didn't say his hero was Bush. He said his hero was Thatcher. Who comes from my town. Sorry.

Wait a sceond. You're from Grantham, Linclonshire? NO FUCKING WAY! OK, if you do, then which schoold within the town did Isaac Newton go to? What are the names of the tow main shopping centres? If you tell me these, than I have actually found someone else form Grantham on Nationstates, OMG!

This is the internet. Anyone can find that out. ;)

MAyb, but this is Grantham, offically among the most boring towns in Britain! Why woudl you look? I know, because I live there, oh the shame!"

he didn't actually call him a nazi bastard. the great red ken said to the tabloid jouranlist words to the effect of "You are justifying the job that you are doing by saying that it's your job. That's the attitude of a concentration camp guard".In that case, and with the assumption that he didn't know the guy was Jewish (as stated above) I redouble my assertion that it was an off-hand remark to exactly the wrong audience...

I was helping someone out with their computer once and, on completion and proud of my achievements, jovially said "Anything else I can help you with? Whitewash your house? Farm the desert? Invade Poland?" I got a funny look from her, which I thought was due to my wacky humour going over her head. Later I remember her surname... Needless to say, it was a polish one. Probably 3rd gen British, at least, but I think I might have touched a nerve. Not perfectly sure, as nothing more was ever said about that, but it seems likely in hindesight. C'est la vie! (With apologies to all Frenchies... ;))

Wait a sceond. You're from Grantham, Linclonshire? NO FUCKING WAY! OK, if you do, then which schoold within the town did Isaac Newton go to? What are the names of the tow main shopping centres? If you tell me these, than I have actually found someone else form Grantham on Nationstates, OMG!

Don't answer him - he's a stalker. Lincolnshire has a lot of trailer trash, in my ignorant opinion.

You forget that we were on the winning side, and so get to play with all the Nazi toys forever - from the Swastikas to the goosestepping to the tiny little moustaches, all of them belong to us now.
Yes have ypu ever impersonated Hitler its oh so much fun.

I dont really care about the Jews complaining about Prince Harry's antics i was more concerned for the British Soldiers(and the Commonwealth)who fought it.

Aaand since the Royals are Boche they really wanted the Hun to win.
Churchill was not impressed. ;) :p :eek: :( :confused:

he didn't actually call him a nazi bastard. the great red ken said to the tabloid jouranlist words to the effect of "You are justifying the job that you are doing by saying that it's your job. That's the attitude of a concentration camp guard".

What seems to have got missed in all this shit-storm is that fact that concentration camps were in fact a British invention first used during the Boer wars - the Jews hardly have an exclusive claim to the experience of being put in them.

he didn't actually call him a nazi bastard. the great red ken said to the tabloid jouranlist words to the effect of "You are justifying the job that you are doing by saying that it's your job. That's the attitude of a concentration camp guard".

I know but do you think I could be bothered to write that all out?

What seems to have got missed in all this shit-storm is that fact that concentration camps were in fact a British invention first used during the Boer wars - the Jews hardly have an exclusive claim to the experience of being put in them.
yeah 4000 Boers died in the fighting out of a fighting force of 60000, 30000 women and children died in the camps.

It was funnier when somebody on here kept insisting that Harry really was Nazi, and the guy kept saying things like "I knew the British royalty would see the light eventually!"
dat was me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(or a different puppet, but i'm fairly sure it was this one)

dat was me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(or a different puppet, but i'm fairly sure it was this one)

Muppet!

The reason you might hear about Nazi related news from Britain is because the subject is so sensitive, and we will never forget WWII.
If we thought Nazi's were 'no big thing' you'd have heard nothing about it.

...concentration camps were in fact a British invention...yeah 4000 Boers died in the fighting out of a fighting force of 60000, 30000 women and children died in the camps.Not our finest hour, the invention of the concentration camp, but I think it's topped by the invention of the Death/Extermination Camp* idea.

Not that the 'concentration' of people (the lazy persons' method of controlling undesirable elements) provided conducive conditions, but it wasn't intended to be fatal to all concerned (even though it inevitably was for some).

* - Whichever term you 'prefer'

You forget that we were on the winning side, and so get to play with all the Nazi toys forever - from the Swastikas to the goosestepping to the tiny little moustaches, all of them belong to us now.

All your Nazi are belong to us!!

Ah because Prince Harry wore a Nazi costume to a fancy dress party and the mayor of London said a reporter was like a 'concentration camp guard' means that all us Brits love NAZI's!

Ah because Prince Harry wore a Nazi costume to a fancy dress party and the mayor of London said a reporter was like a 'concentration camp guard' means that all us Brits love NAZI's!

Well, of course it does ;)

Seriously.. what is wrong with those critics ? Why can one not compare a Jew to a Nazi if this Jew actually behaves like a nazi ? Why can one not dress up as one (albeit in a historically incorrect way) ? After all, almost everything can be offensive and painful to groups of people. Former US-presidents ? Hey - didn't he hold slaves ? Offensive ! An East Indies company trader ? Hey - didn't they massacre that tribe because they dared to also sell their spices to the Portugese ? Offensive ! A Roman Catholic priest ? Hey - didn't they burn witches ? Offensive !

Nazi's are a part of history. Not a pretty part, but part of history nonetheless. Perhaps people should stop yelling 'outrage' whenever people refer to it, and instead take real steps to ensure history doesn't repeat itself.

Well, of course it does ;)

Seriously.. what is wrong with those critics ? Why can one not compare a Jew to a Nazi if this Jew actually behaves like a nazi ? Why can one not dress up as one (albeit in a historically incorrect way) ? After all, almost everything can be offensive and painful to groups of people. Former US-presidents ? Hey - didn't he hold slaves ? Offensive ! An East Indies company trader ? Hey - didn't they massacre that tribe because they dared to also sell their spices to the Portugese ? Offensive ! A Roman Catholic priest ? Hey - didn't they burn witches ? Offensive !

Nazi's are a part of history. Not a pretty part, but part of history nonetheless. Perhaps people should stop yelling 'outrage' whenever people refer to it, and instead take real steps to ensure history doesn't repeat itself.

I find your use of the phrase "offensive!" offensive. Please consider this before your next (offensive!) post.

I find your use of the phrase "offensive!" offensive. Please consider this before your next (offensive!) post.
I find one of the words in your post o********, but it's so o******** that I can't even tell you which.

After all, almost everything can be offensive and painful to groups of people. Former US-presidents ? Hey - didn't he hold slaves ? Offensive ! An East Indies company trader ? Hey - didn't they massacre that tribe because they dared to also sell their spices to the Portugese ? Offensive ! A Roman Catholic priest ? Hey - didn't they burn witches ? Offensive !

As an english catholic, I'm still smarting from the large number of my people that were disposessed, murdered, persecuted and denied civil rights from the time of Henry VIII until the end of the 19th century. I find it offensive that anyone should dress up as the people who were reponsible for these crimes, ie the royal family of england. So next time the queen dresses up as the queen, I'll be writing in to the Daily Mail to express my disgust and horrification and such.

I find one of the words in your post o********, but it's so o******** that I can't even tell you which.

I find your offense at my offense offensive.

Well, of course it does ;)

Seriously.. what is wrong with those critics ? Why can one not compare a Jew to a Nazi if this Jew actually behaves like a nazi ? Why can one not dress up as one (albeit in a historically incorrect way) ? After all, almost everything can be offensive and painful to groups of people. Former US-presidents ? Hey - didn't he hold slaves ? Offensive ! An East Indies company trader ? Hey - didn't they massacre that tribe because they dared to also sell their spices to the Portugese ? Offensive ! A Roman Catholic priest ? Hey - didn't they burn witches ? Offensive !

Nazi's are a part of history. Not a pretty part, but part of history nonetheless. Perhaps people should stop yelling 'outrage' whenever people refer to it, and instead take real steps to ensure history doesn't repeat itself.

You've http://humanities.byu.edu/elc/student/idioms/idioms/images/hit_nail_on_head.jpg :cool:

I don't see why the mayor should apologise.. he didn't know the reporter was a Jew, he said he was like a 'concentration camp guard' because he was hanging outside waiting for him.

He wasn't making any racist/anti-somatic comment.. and he shouldn't apologise.

It also annoys me how some sections of the media exaggerate things wildly... calling the remarks 'shocking' and calling for his resignation. It baffles me how things get blown way out of proportion like that.

Why do I keep hearing news out of the good ol UK about Nazi this or Nazi that. From the dumb royalty to the mayor of London. You guys forget that nearly a million Brits died in WWII?

why do I keep hearing news out of the good ol US that Baptist churches want swiss people to die in tsunamis, that 36% of high school kids think the govt should check newspaper stories before they're published and the president......well, too many quotes to list really......

As an english catholic, I'm still smarting from the large number of my people that were disposessed, murdered, persecuted and denied civil rights from the time of Henry VIII until the end of the 19th century. I find it offensive that anyone should dress up as the people who were reponsible for these crimes, ie the royal family of england. So next time the queen dresses up as the queen, I'll be writing in to the Daily Mail to express my disgust and horrification and such.

that is possibly the funniest post i've read this week :D

I think our use of Nazi gear is more of an attept to block out the pain of penalties against Germany!

I think our use of Nazi gear is more of an attept to block out the pain of penalties against Germany!

eh?

I don't see why the mayor should apologise.. he didn't know the reporter was a Jew, he said he was like a 'concentration camp guard' because he was hanging outside waiting for him.

Even if he had known the man was a Jew.. would that have made a difference ? He thought the man was behaving like a concentration camp guard, period. The fact that someone is a Jew/gypsy/homosexual etc does not make it impossible for them to behave that way. Yes, one can argue the accusation may hit them harder because of history - but then again, being the victims, they should also know better than everybody else that this behaviour is bad.

eh?

The English national football (soccer - to some backwards people) team has a habit of losing in the final stages of major competitions to the German team via penalty shoot-outs.

I think the word has possibly just lost some (though never all) of its original meaning.

I personally don't use it lightly, but i can think of numerous people i've known who wouldn't think twice about calling someone (eg: teachers at school) a "nazi". By saying this they aren't actually accusing them of being a member of the nazi party, they just mean they're particularly strict, authoritarian, maybe sadistic, etc.

But it's still not a word for public/polite conversation.

Red Ken is a loudmouth, basically. Always has been unafraid to state what is on his mind. I don't think he meant to offend as much as some people believed he did, though.

Prince Harry is not a Nazi in my personal opinion - just a complete and total prick that someone should have kicked up the arse a long time ago.

The English national football (soccer - to some backwards people) team has a habit of losing in the final stages of major competitions to the German team via penalty shoot-outs.

Ohh, yep I agree that must be why we use 'Nazi gear' then.

Personally i think that the papers a lining up Ken as the bad guy in case London doesnt manage 2012. Then, waa it was all Kens fualt, not anything to do with our great nation which is fualtless.

And i will always support Kens desiscions because he supports skyscrapers in the capital.

Red Ken is a loudmouth, basically. Always has been unafraid to state what is on his mind. I don't think he meant to offend as much as some people believed he did, though.
Unfortunately he's got the dreaded vote of confidence from Boris Johnson: I reckon he's in real trouble now.

Unfortunately he's got the dreaded vote of confidence from Boris Johnson: I reckon he's in real trouble now.

Yeah, when someone far enough left to have "Red" constantly used before his first name gets a vote of confidence from Boris Johnson, it may be time to resign. ;)

I'm disgusted that the Royal family had such a cheap and crappy costume. With all their money they should be hiring better fancy dress than that - looks like he made it himself !!!!!

Unfortunately he's got the dreaded vote of confidence from Boris Johnson: I reckon he's in real trouble now.
but boris is lovely - everyone likes boris.

but boris is lovely - everyone likes boris.

especially scousers.

but boris is lovely - everyone likes boris.

For his Politics or for the fact that he has messy yellow hair and speaks with a really stereotypical British accent?

especially scousers.

Ooooh... :D

but boris is lovely - everyone likes boris.
Boris is cool, but he's currently the popular hand of doom: anything he touches at the moment develops a tendency to fall apart and die a horrible death.

A fate many would not welcome for poor little Ken.

I don't see why the mayor should apologise.. he didn't know the reporter was a Jew, he said he was like a 'concentration camp guard' because he was hanging outside waiting for him.

He wasn't making any racist/anti-somatic comment.. and he shouldn't apologise.

It also annoys me how some sections of the media exaggerate things wildly... calling the remarks 'shocking' and calling for his resignation. It baffles me how things get blown way out of proportion like that.
He had been told that the reporter was Jewish BEFORE he made the comment.

In light of this information, and in view of his past and continuing support for Palestinian extreamists I feel that his comment was deliberatly anti-semitic and goes to show his personal feelings. As well as the inquiries into this by the Labor Party he should be prosecuted under existing UK anti racisim laws

In no way was any section of the media exaggerating what he had said. This comment was offencive and has no part in public life. He has shown that he is not fit to stand as a parish councellor never mind the Mayor of London, and no, I'm not Jewish!

He had been told that the reporter was Jewish BEFORE he made the comment.

In light of this information, and in view of his past and continuing support for Palestinian extreamists I feel that his comment was deliberatly anti-semitic and goes to show his personal feelings. As well as the inquiries into this by the Labor Party he should be prosecuted under existing UK anti racisim laws

In no way was any section of the media exaggerating what he had said. This comment was offencive and has no part in public life. He has shown that he is not fit to stand as a parish councellor never mind the Mayor of London, and no, I'm not Jewish!

antisemitic my arse. it riles me that every time someone says *maybe the israeli occupation of palestine isn't a great idea* people start yelling antisemitism.

He had been told that the reporter was Jewish BEFORE he made the comment.

In light of this information, and in view of his past and continuing support for Palestinian extreamists I feel that his comment was deliberatly anti-semitic and goes to show his personal feelings. As well as the inquiries into this by the Labor Party he should be prosecuted under existing UK anti racisim laws

In no way was any section of the media exaggerating what he had said. This comment was offencive and has no part in public life. He has shown that he is not fit to stand as a parish councellor never mind the Mayor of London, and no, I'm not Jewish!

I'm pretty sure he wasn't told he was Jewish before he made the comment to the reporter.. do you have any sources to prove otherwise?

Anyway as a previous poster said, he maybe Jewish but so what.. he can still act like a 'concentration camp guard'.

No offence but it’s people like you who exaggerate and blow things way out of proportion.

He had been told that the reporter was Jewish BEFORE he made the comment.

In light of this information, and in view of his past and continuing support for Palestinian extreamists I feel that his comment was deliberatly anti-semitic and goes to show his personal feelings. As well as the inquiries into this by the Labor Party he should be prosecuted under existing UK anti racisim laws

In no way was any section of the media exaggerating what he had said. This comment was offencive and has no part in public life. He has shown that he is not fit to stand as a parish councellor never mind the Mayor of London, and no, I'm not Jewish!

Saying that he should be in a concentration camp would be offensive, because that would be a direct reference to him being Jewish, as well as being threatening.

Saying that he was like a concentration camp guard is not offensive, though. As I understand it, this comment was in response to the reporter saying that he was "just doing his job".

I'm not particularly anti-PC, but this is just ridiculous.

Oh my, what if he was told he was Jewish before he made that remark. I certainly know that in my head whenever i find out someones jewish i mentally pin a star of david to their forehaeds, so i never forget, and from then even when said jewish person pisses me off lots, i always remember that they are from an extra sensetive and harshly oppressed minority, whos feelings should be protected at all costs, and therefore am always careful to chose which words i use around them.

But perhaps thats just me, maybe Ken doesnt do that, i cant imagine why.

did Ken refer to the reporter as a concentration camp guard or a nazi?

If he said nazi, well..... that was just stupid really. Got to be VERY pc these days in the UK.

If he said concentration camp guard, well... tough for the reporter. Saying your just doing your job is no excuse.

Interesting point... don't they have concentration camps in Isreal or in the occupied territories for the palestinians?

This is what he said:

On tape, Mr Livingstone, who once worked as a freelance restaurant critic on the paper, is heard asking Mr Finegold if he is a "German war criminal".

Mr Finegold replies: "No, I'm Jewish, I wasn't a German war criminal. I'm quite offended by that."

The mayor then says: "Ah right, well you might be, but actually you are like a concentration camp guard, you are just doing it because you are paid to, aren't you?"

I really don't see what all the fuss is about..

I think the word has possibly just lost some (though never all) of its original meaning.

I personally don't use it lightly, but i can think of numerous people i've known who wouldn't think twice about calling someone (eg: teachers at school) a "nazi". By saying this they aren't actually accusing them of being a member of the nazi party, they just mean they're particularly strict, authoritarian, maybe sadistic, etc.

But it's still not a word for public/polite conversation.

This is indeed an effect of using the term often. But I would like to put forward the following question: "If you are calling someone a Nazi, are you primarily insulting or warning them ?"

Your post implies (apologies if that is not your intention) that you consider members of the nazi party to be evil by definition. The image most media seem intended to distribute is in line with this: nazi's are all coldblooded killing machines that comitted countless atrocities. As such, calling someone Nazi is primarily an insult.

But.. the cold blooded image is not correct, and in fact even dangerous. Dangerous since it tries to sweep one of the most important lessons (IMO) one can learn from WO II (and from a lot of other historic events for that matter) under the carpet: one does not need to be a stereotypical evil person to do evil things. Many nazi's were people just like your neighbour, one of your highschoolfriends or that sweet lady that walks her dog in the park every morning. And yet they participated in horrifying evil deeds. Many non-naziparty Germans must have seen trucks and trains filled with maltreated deported Jews, gypsies etc driving past their homes towards the camps. But for some reason their brains shut those images out. And when the realisation of what they allowed to happen - and even helped to happen -finally dawned after the war may were shocked and horrified. Not all of course. There were many true bastards. Some even don't think they did anything wrong till this day. But those will not be offended/shocked by being called nazi anyway...

So for me, calling someone a Nazi is not an insult. It's a warning that they should step back and take a good look at themselves. It goes without saying that good education on the subject is necessary for this to be effective though...

Hmm.. a rather emotional post. Apologies to those who take offense.

Jews never seem to stop bloody whining and complaining.
The way they go on makes me wish that someone would finish off what Hitler started.

Even if he had known the man was a Jew.. would that have made a difference ? He thought the man was behaving like a concentration camp guard, period. The fact that someone is a Jew/gypsy/homosexual etc does not make it impossible for them to behave that way. Yes, one can argue the accusation may hit them harder because of history - but then again, being the victims, they should also know better than everybody else that this behaviour is bad.

I may be wrong, because living in my cardboard box with no contact with the outside world, I haven't actually heard about that incident, but I have read this thread so I think I have the gist of it; forgive me if I haven't. But I think possibly what's more offensive than the fact that he likened a Jew to a concentration camp guard is the use of the Nazis as an insulting term of address; it's almost taking the years of atrocities and horror too lightly, and applying them to rather trivial things. It's more like a lack of respect, perhaps. From what I've heard, through, there was a massive overreaction to it.
But yeah, my problem would not be so much that the guy was a Jew, but that the other guy reached for that similie. I don't know, though, I'm a bit undecided.
I find it hard to distance myself from history, and I think things like WW1 and WW2 should never be taken lightly; I don't think some jokes about it are very appropriate, but I also would not have a problem with someone ripping it out of Hilter, which may seem a bit inconsistant. However, as a Brit myself I have noticed that alot of the time our culture is to deal with disasters through humour (sorry, this is a bit of a thread-jack). I don't think it means we don't care; it's just the British way. Example: (sorry Americans, but this did actually happen) September 11th was this huge disaster and everyone was really sad and our hearts went out to America, they really did... but September 12th, the jokes started. "Did you hear about the New Yorker who ordered a jumbo?" etc. Has anyone else noticed this?
Sorry for the ramble and change of subject...
Yes... Nazis are bad...

Jews never seem to stop bloody whining and complaining.
The way they go on makes me wish that someone would finish off what Hitler started.

oh dear.

I'm disgusted that the Royal family had such a cheap and crappy costume. With all their money they should be hiring better fancy dress than that - looks like he made it himself !!!!!
He did make it himself. The Deutsches Afrika Korps never wore the swastika armband. I too was disappointed at his lack of effort. His costume was an insult to the NSDAP.

Jews never seem to stop bloody whining and complaining.
The way they go on makes me wish that someone would finish off what Hitler started.

ohhh very nice.

I don't think that would be a good idea all the time, but sometimes when they are always going on and on and on about how bad everything is for them I just want someone to shut them up totally.

I don't think that would be a good idea all the time, but sometimes when they are always going on and on and on about how bad everything is for them I just want someone to shut them up totally.

yet you still clump all jewish people together. A few pricks on TV do not represent an entire segment of society.

Jews never seem to stop bloody whining and complaining.
The way they go on makes me wish that someone would finish off what Hitler started.

You are a moron.

A certain young Royal 'inadvisedly' choosing a Nazi (Africa Corps?) uniform as fancy dress, several weeks back, and London's Mayor describing (IIRC) some prominent Jewish figure as having some quality or other of a Concentration Camp guard, wasn't it?

I've been to fancy dress parties as Hitler before. I don't see why it's such a big issue. Hitler's practically a joke anyway, and the people who lived through it? Well, they'll all be dead soon anyway, so I don't care what they think.

"Blah blah blah you'd be speaking german now if it wasn't for blah blah blah"

This is what he said:

On tape, Mr Livingstone, who once worked as a freelance restaurant critic on the paper, is heard asking Mr Finegold if he is a "German war criminal".

Mr Finegold replies: "No, I'm Jewish, I wasn't a German war criminal. I'm quite offended by that."

The mayor then says: "Ah right, well you might be, but actually you are like a concentration camp guard, you are just doing it because you are paid to, aren't you?"

I really don't see what all the fuss is about..

Ken really should have considered how his comments here would have been twisted by the corrupt British press to make him out to be anti-semitic. Once the journalist said he was Jewish, he should not have extended his comments. Surely, he has been in the public eye long enough to know that these things run and run. The same goes for Prince Harry, surely he must have thought that all it took was for one photo to be leaked to the press. In cases like these, people in the public eye cannot claim ignorance, after all, Britain has the fiercest, most intrusive press in the world and sadly, its influence on public opinion here and abroad is far too strong. The main lesson to be learned by Ken and others is to think before they speak.

I've been to fancy dress parties as Hitler before. I don't see why it's such a big issue. Hitler's practically a joke anyway, and the people who lived through it? Well, they'll all be dead soon anyway, so I don't care what they think.

"Blah blah blah you'd be speaking german now if it wasn't for blah blah blah"The trouble is that the "public eye" is on Harry, whereas (no offence, but) they probably care diddly-squat about you. Like Harry (hopefully) did, you mentally tallied up if anyone at the party would be offended and went along to it knowing that you weren't out to cause offence and none would be taken. (I assume you didn't take the bus there, in full Fascist regalia :))

Harry, though, had someone at the party who took the photo and an entire British press ready to grab at the opportunity to make sensational headlines out of the matter. The nearest to that that you would suffer would have been if one of your sneakier friends had given your (hypothetical) ex-POW/Gestapo-beaten grandad the news of your escapades and he'd gone ballistic about it... the Randomtown Evening Standard and Herald might have got involved if he'd have had an heart-attack, but normally wouldn't bother.

Additional: I support Harry's right to have donned that joke uniform (obviously I wouldn't support him if he actually did fancy being the next Oswald Mosely) as I would anybody else, and the faux pas was partly Harry forgetting about his position and partly the opportunists and rabid sensationalists that took it way over the top...

I still reckon our Harry cut a deal with the photographer for about 30% of the £100,000 total that was paid for the photo. Pocket money. Score

Ken really should have considered how his comments here would have been twisted by the corrupt British press to make him out to be anti-semitic. Once the journalist said he was Jewish, he should not have extended his comments. Surely, he has been in the public eye long enough to know that these things run and run. The same goes for Prince Harry, surely he must have thought that all it took was for one photo to be leaked to the press. In cases like these, people in the public eye cannot claim ignorance, after all, Britain has the fiercest, most intrusive press in the world and sadly, its influence on public opinion here and abroad is far too strong. The main lesson to be learned by Ken and others is to think before they speak.

Ken made his name for himself by not being shy about speaking out and or saying outrageous things. He's well used to the amounts of publicity that saying the wrong or the right thing can get him. I'm sure that he is well aware of how they can run and run, but this will not stand him in bad stead at all, as it will just keep his name in the public eye all the more. If Ken didn't say silly or outrageous things every so often we'd have tired of him a long time ago.

The fuss isn't about the offence caused, that was unintentional. The sad thing is that Ken won't apologise, even though he admits that he was offensive. The jornalist asked for an apology, and Ken shouldn't be excused from that. Hes a stubborn bastard, and I can't wait for the next mayor elections. All he's done is upset about 90% of London and brought in a congestion charge. Great work there.
All the journalist did was ask Ken for a comment, like most journalists naturally do. If a politcian can't control himself in front of the media, then who can?
I'm also totally shocked about your comments on the Jews. Some of the Nazis here even want them to be exterminated. Why are people unwilling to say that Jews/gypsies/homosexuals died in the holocaust? Because it victimises a people that they hate? Instead they point the finger of blame to the British. The predjudices here are terrible.