NationStates Jolt Archive

Personally, I believ the war is bad for many reasons....

How about you?

Now, why would ANYONE say war is good? Even the most conservative of people surely think of war as a last resort

Personally, I believ the war is bad for many reasons....

How about you?

I'm bad for many reasons too!!!!

War is a it depends kinda thing, but usually bad!

it's fun to be able to voice my opinions without backing them up, I'd post alot more often if I could do this alot!!!

Aware that this may get a bad response but whatever, I'm too new to care.

So far as the loss of human life goes and the fact that it hurts everybody, yes war is a terrible thing.

But I am one of those who see's humanity as a complete and utter [sexual conduct] wit, I kinda hope that there will be another great war, above and beyond the scale of WWII and far more horrific than the first. My main reason behind this is a false hope that maybe then we will learn.

But so far as it goes right now we just build and build the machines and devices designed only for killing until we reach a critical mass, then it really hits the fan. (Napoleonic Wars, American Civil War, Crimean War, WWI&II).

But as I said, maybe one of these days the destruction and death toll of one of these things will finally be enough for us to see what were doing wrong...

Aware that this may get a bad response but whatever, I'm too new to care.

So far as the loss of human life goes and the fact that it hurts everybody, yes war is a terrible thing.

But I am one of those who see's humanity as a complete and utter [sexual conduct] wit, I kinda hope that there will be another great war, above and beyond the scale of WWII and far more horrific than the first. My main reason behind this is a false hope that maybe then we will learn.

But so far as it goes right now we just build and build the machines and devices designed only for killing until we reach a critical mass, then it really hits the fan. (Napoleonic Wars, American Civil War, Crimean War, WWI&II).

But as I said, maybe one of these days the destruction and death toll of one of these things will finally be enough for us to see what were doing wrong...

A chilling vision of things to come :eek:

(man I'm spammy!)

war, violence, its all unnecessary.

Aware that this may get a bad response but whatever, I'm too new to care.

So far as the loss of human life goes and the fact that it hurts everybody, yes war is a terrible thing.

But I am one of those who see's humanity as a complete and utter [sexual conduct] wit, I kinda hope that there will be another great war, above and beyond the scale of WWII and far more horrific than the first. My main reason behind this is a false hope that maybe then we will learn.

But so far as it goes right now we just build and build the machines and devices designed only for killing until we reach a critical mass, then it really hits the fan. (Napoleonic Wars, American Civil War, Crimean War, WWI&II).

But as I said, maybe one of these days the destruction and death toll of one of these things will finally be enough for us to see what were doing wrong...

A war greater? That would decrease Earths population down to less than half, start a nuclear war...Forgive me, NO human will exist.

war= idiocy.
how can anyone call themselves 'civilised' if they solve their problems with violence. the only problems that can be solved by war are problems CAUSED by war, and i'm sure there are other ways to handle those without resorting to violence and destructon.

war= idiocy.
how can anyone call themselves 'civilised' if they solve their problems with violence. the only problems that can be solved by war are problems CAUSED by war, and i'm sure there are other ways to handle those without resorting to violence and destructon.
Exactly...

War and violence have always occured throughout human history. This will never change.

I hope it doesn't.

Of course it can change. The UN was supposed to wasn't it?

War Violence, hell its all part of our nature why should we repress it in some Freudian bullshit way.

Frankly your a bunch of cowards, War, civil war especially is wholly necessary, the whole pacifist movement is based on the idea that all men are rational beings willing to compromise and have a strong sense of self preservation, this is all stupid assumptions, Some times things need changing and forming protest circles and mass chants is not enough.
War Frees the oppressed, and civil war is often a necessary mechanism by which the needs of the majority or any other marginalised group in society at a time previously expresses its wants and will.

Honestly you don’t know what you saying, if a man such as Hitler were to rise to power in your country or one Adjacent and where to threaten you, you would fight. Cowards that’s all you are.

How can a man call him self civilised while he stands back and does nothing in the face of oppression

F***k oppression. If you could prevent war, would you?

War is bad but sometimes necessary to prevent further evils.

"Peace doesn't keep itself" Machiavelli.

Peace can be kept with the better education of the youth, and the unpoisoning of their minds(such as introducing them to guns, letting them watch war movies)

Assuming that everyone could sit down and talk things out with those they disagreed with and come to reasonable compromise, then war would not be necessary. Unfortunately, there are those whos ideals of compromise are limited to exactly what they want in an agreement. Also there are circumstances where a reasonable compromise would not be well received by the public, or the reasonable compromise would do more overall harm than good to one of the countries.

When several countries/parties/groups of people come to an impass in negotiations and the situation is not able to be prevented from escalating, war ensues. Whether it is a revolution, a civil war, and world war or whatever.

It all starts with greed and oppression from one person to another, and no form of government can prevent greed or oppression.

War Violence, hell its all part of our nature why should we repress it in some Freudian bullshit way.

Frankly your a bunch of cowards, War, civil war especially is wholly necessary, the whole pacifist movement is based on the idea that all men are rational beings willing to compromise and have a strong sense of self preservation, this is all stupid assumptions, Some times things need changing and forming protest circles and mass chants is not enough.
War Frees the oppressed, and civil war is often a necessary mechanism by which the needs of the majority or any other marginalised group in society at a time previously expresses its wants and will.

Honestly you don’t know what you saying, if a man such as Hitler were to rise to power in your country or one Adjacent and where to threaten you, you would fight. Cowards that’s all you are.

How can a man call him self civilised while he stands back and does nothing in the face of oppression

i have never assumed that all people are rational, in fact that's the whole point. war is by its very nature destructive and i see it as unnessescary and self-perpetuating. i believe that i am right so by protesting and chanting i try to inform others of my moral objection, and hope that they agree, but without forcing my opinions an anyone else.

as for the 'cowards' comment i ask you to consider the courage needed to stand against a society who would be willing to use violence against you.

First, the governments could get rid of their army.

i have never assumed that all people are rational, in fact that's the whole point. war is by its very nature destructive and i see it as unnessescary and self-perpetuating. i believe that i am right so by protesting and chanting i try to inform others of my moral objection, and hope that they agree, but without forcing my opinions an anyone else.

as for the 'cowards' comment i ask you to consider the courage needed to stand against a society who would be willing to use violence against you.

Also, maybe torture

there's a south american country with no army.

Peace can be kept with the better education of the youth, and the unpoisoning of their minds(such as introducing them to guns, letting them watch war movies)

That worked really well in the roman era. No guns, no movies, decent education, and pax romana is about the biggest misnomer of all time.

War, by this I mean members of one social group (nation, religion, tribe) fighting physically against another, is part of human behaviour. Where there is no official war, local petty wars break out (drug gang wars, soccer hooliganism, inter family feuds etc.) It is not a good thing, but it is part of our nature.

I do not believe that we can in any short to medium term (up to 1000 years say) change this nature without genetically engineering the competitiveness that drives the human race out. If this is the option, then war for me, is the lesser of two evils.

How about everyone does that?

there's a south american country with no army.

Which one?

if no-one had an army no-one would need an army. but who wants to go first?

Which one?
i can't remember, but it's one with a double-barrel name.

I do not believe that we can in any short to medium term (up to 1000 years say) change this nature without genetically engineering the competitiveness that drives the human race out. If this is the option, then war for me, is the lesser of two evils.


I agree, if given the choice of genetically engineering people to not be hostile or having such an overbearing government where there is no freedom to be greedy or oppressive, war is the lesser of the evils.

America deff. won't....

Germany has an army, but is unwillining to use it in any war.

if no-one had an army no-one would need an army. but who wants to go first?

More to the point, if no-one had an army, then the first one to invent one wins.

The problem is not the army, it is the desire to win.

The desire to win? makes sense...

But why war with biochemical weapons, nuclear weapons?
How about stun weapons, or virtual reality wars?

this is all hypothetical bollucks, man will allways be at war with someone, the primevil needs to be part of a group and the futhermore need for that group to have outsiders and enemies overides all this tree hugging crap.

i can't remember, but it's one with a double-barrel name.

French Guiana? (if that is how it is spelt in English.) This is the only double barrelled name that I can think of here.

Hum
no regular military forces; Gendarmerie
Military manpower - availability: males age 15-49: 52,294 (2004 est.)
Military manpower - fit for military service: males age 15-49: 33,914 (2004 est.)
Military expenditures - dollar figure: NA
Military expenditures - percent of GDP: NA
Military - note: defense is the responsibility of France

source (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/fg.html#Military)

They just have the French Army to defend them. The same type of situation probably applies to Puerto Rico.

war can be good it does help control our population and what about someone like Hitler comes to power in some country and starts killing "lesser races" is it wrong to stop that and lets say that he was right and there are lesser races would it then be wrong to kill them for evolutions sake (well no but you get the point) and what about all those jobs that will be lost. If you ask me the only way world peace can be assured is to have the world conquered and a dictator taking complete control and making a police state so we can never be divided and what about all those people who aren't American we all want our country to be great but what if we live in a tiny nation is it wrong to unify others to be great is it wrong to conquer a people and build schools and hospitals also (talking about all those people who hate violence) is it wrong for someone to kill the man who raped there daughter of course not! violence happens in nature monkeys kill each other and eat meat because they like it and lets look at ant's they are one of the only other animals to have war's they do it because they get rid of rivals if they didn't all of them would die and think if there's no violence how would we have rights how could there be revolutions and what about greed if we didn't have this we would still live in caves because why would you want to try to better yourself basically if we didn’t have these we would be lower than animals

this is all hypothetical bollucks, man will allways be at war with someone, the primevil needs to be part of a group and the futhermore need for that group to have outsiders and enemies overides all this tree hugging crap.
man is at war with himself and will only win when he stops fighting with everybody else.

i disagree, i feel no need to have enemies, in fact, i actively avoid making enemys it's easier to tolerate. as for those who will not let themselves be tolerated, they can be ignored.

War's only good if you're on the right side.

What is the right side?

This brings up the issue of nationalism.

if no-one had an army no-one would need an army. but who wants to go first?
oh yeah and let a man with a pointy rock rule the world

man is at war with himself and will only win when he stops fighting with everybody else.

i disagree, i feel no need to have enemies, in fact, i actively avoid making enemys it's easier to tolerate. as for those who will not let themselves be tolerated, they can be ignored.

Unfortunatley, until the entire world sees it the same way as you, and until ignoring the intolerables is an option, there will be war.

I Always thought I'm not a pasifist, but everytime I disguss 'bout war with my friends
I end up as one... Funny I haven't found a single reason for war... I mean i Have found reasons but they aren't good enough... Still I believe war can be a good thing... Maybe I just don't wan't to be a pasifist :rolleyes:

So basically, war is invincible.

I Always thought I'm not a pasifist, but everytime I disguss 'bout war with my friends
I end up as one... Funny I haven't found a single reason for war... I mean i Have found reasons but they aren't good enough... Still I believe war can be a good thing... Maybe I just don't wan't to be a pasifist :rolleyes:

Follow your heart...
Do you want people to die or live?

War itself sucks. Some of the side-effects of war though, might not suck.

War itself sucks. Some of the side-effects of war though, might not suck.
not if your winning

not if your winning

Why is it always about victory?

Follow your heart...
Do you want people to die or live?


Maybe I should... :)
I can't still believe I'm Anti-war... :confused:
I never thought myself that way... Maybe I never had an opinion on it...
Don't know... Or something...

Why is it always about victory?
Because frankly, victory kicks ass.

But the addiction to victory is the cause of fights, treachery...etc

But the addiction to victory is the cause of fights, treachery...etc
Yeah, but at least if you're the victors you don't run the risk of being relocated to camps. And you get more stuff.

But why should people be relocated to camps?

But the addiction to victory is the cause of fights, treachery...etc
even better if you keep winning

even better if you keep winning

You want to see people in pain, dying and cursing at former friends?

How do I quit this game?

someone send me a telegram please!

But why should people be relocated to camps?
I'm not saying people should be relocated to camps, just that if you lose the risk is far greater than if you win.

Personally, I find war to be amazingly good. People have a good time and generally have 'a blast.'

Unless you lose.

You want to see people in pain, dying and cursing at former friends?
if its worth it then yes!!!!!

One Conch, I sent you a telegram.

How do I quit this game?

someone send me a telegram please!
Press the little button in the corner with an "x" on it?

But so far as it goes right now we just build and build the machines and devices designed only for killing until we reach a critical mass, then it really hits the fan. (Napoleonic Wars, American Civil War, Crimean War, WWI&II).



Umm...Cold War anyone? It didn't "hit the fan". Infact building killing machines like nukes might have been the only thing to stop it from getting into war.

And i think war is bad, but sometimes necessary.

if its worth it then yes!!!!!
I'm sory, but that means you are a sadist

How do I quit this game?

someone send me a telegram please!
you send me a cheque and never bother anyone again

I'm sory, but that means you are a sadist
well you would say that

(sorry for double post)

wether you agree or not her's how i see the pattern
imperialism (with lots of little wars)--world war1--(germany gets short end of stick)--world war2--not enough time passed to identify the rest but the cold war's in there too.

well you would say that

(sorry for double post)

How can you enjoy watching people suffer?

Personally, I find war to be amazingly good. People have a good time and generally have 'a blast.'

Unless you lose.
oooh first post quick run its a trap (Men in dark suits carry me off)

How can you enjoy watching people suffer?

rollerball anyone?

oooh first post quick run its a trap (Men in dark suits carry me off)
MIB !!! Ahhhhh!! Aliens...

Back to the subject at hand...

How can you enjoy watching people suffer?
I don't enjoy that I enjoy having things

how many peaple here are wo/men its intresting to see the results when you look at what sex supports what side of the argument

War is just another means of diplomacy.
That's all.
It's the most extreme...but it is still just diplomacy.

I'm male

War is just another means of diplomacy.
That's all.
It's the most extreme...but it is still just diplomacy.
even when if I walked up to a stranger and punch them (takes notes for court case)

diplomacy is the settlement of disputes without violence.
to say that war is diplomacy is a contradiction of terms.

even when if I walked up to a stranger and punch them (takes notes for court case)
Punch for a reason?

also male

I'm male
hey!!! me to I fought I was the only one

Punch for a reason?
Hell no well maybe

War is sometimes necessary to remove bad, bad people or to stop evil movements (not bowel movements.. hehe).

If it is possible to do so without war, then war should be avoided. Sometimes, however, bad people do not honor rhetoric...

hey!!! me to I fought I was the only one

Just because I'm anti-war doesn't mean I'm a girl.

ye it does

hooray for male peacenicks. (and female, they're great)

Why won't he fight?
He's a Pussyfest!
No dumbass, he's a pacifist.

ye it does
Just because I don't enjoy people's arms being cut off, doesn't mean I'm a girl.

Just because I'm anti-war doesn't mean I'm a girl.
your telling me if your country came under attack you would say lets be freinds?

and when the attacker comminted war crimes you would still be saying that?

and you would say that Goerge Bush

Just because I don't enjoy people's arms being cut off, doesn't mean I'm a girl.
i don't enjoy that unless its done very funny

your telling me if your country came under attack you would say lets be freinds?

and when the attacker comminted war crimes you would still be saying that?

and you would say that Goerge Bush
If someone attacked my country, I would surrender.

i don't enjoy that unless its done very funny
That's wrong

i don't enjoy that unless its done very funny
how could that possibly be funny?
sick dude, really sick.

War is within the Human nature, one must always prove that they are bigger then the other there is no way to stop it. Where there is a Ying there is a Yang, Peace and War you can't have peace without war, if there was no war Life would be uneventful and boring, Peace would be nice, but have you ever heard the saying there is always the greatest calm before the storm? no matter where you go there will be violence even in animals, it is a fight for survival and if there was no war there would be no push for technology to where it is today, Computers were made to save file space and to lock down information in war times. vehicles where made to combat in war. so If there was a no war we would probably still be in the stone age. Human's thrive for power in anyway they can get it. Even if it includes killing people, everyone has that killer instinct just it hasn't or wont awaken in some of us, it will in others.

That's just my little blurb on this subject anyway.

War is within the Human nature, one must always prove that they are bigger then the other there is no way to stop it. Where there is a Ying there is a Yang, Peace and War you can't have peace without war, if there was no war Life would be uneventful and boring, Peace would be nice, but have you ever heard the saying there is always the greatest calm before the storm? no matter where you go there will be violence even in animals, it is a fight for survival and if there was no war there would be no push for technology to where it is today, Computers were made to save file space and to lock down information in war times. vehicles where made to combat in war. so If there was a no war we would probably still be in the stone age. Human's thrive for power in anyway they can get it. Even if it includes killing people, everyone has that killer instinct just it hasn't or wont awaken in some of us, it will in others.

That's just my little blurb on this subject anyway.

You are correct, but how about virtual reality war? No one would die, but you would still win.

your telling me if your country came under attack you would say lets be freinds?

and when the attacker comminted war crimes you would still be saying that?

and you would say that Goerge Bush

We would stop on the beach, have a quiet drink, soak up a little sun, discuss the relative merits of short and long boards. Have a nap in the afternoon. Then have a party at night. Hey, why do you think Brazil does not go to war very often. We have much better things to do. Any invader coming here would just get seriously confused.

War is within the Human nature, one must always prove that they are bigger then the other there is no way to stop it. Where there is a Ying there is a Yang, Peace and War you can't have peace without war, if there was no war Life would be uneventful and boring, Peace would be nice, but have you ever heard the saying there is always the greatest calm before the storm? no matter where you go there will be violence even in animals, it is a fight for survival and if there was no war there would be no push for technology to where it is today, Computers were made to save file space and to lock down information in war times. vehicles where made to combat in war. so If there was a no war we would probably still be in the stone age. Human's thrive for power in anyway they can get it. Even if it includes killing people, everyone has that killer instinct just it hasn't or wont awaken in some of us, it will in others.

That's just my little blurb on this subject anyway.

don't you think we can out-grow war. alot of barbaric practices have disappeared with the developement of the human race's moral outlook. Why can't the same apply to war?

ok a man walk's down the road and slip's on a bannana funny

someone slides down a hill misses all the sharp rocks and trees then they get up but slip over and breaks there leg funny

someone try's to give you a flying kick but misses and kicks a gangster funny

someone is on a sesaw and goes to get off it but a kid jumps on it and hits him in the nads funny

someone walkes into a glass door funny you get the picture

don't you think we can out-grow war. alot of barbaric practices have disappeared with the developement of the human race's moral outlook. Why can't the same apply to war?

Yes, such as cannibalism. It died out.

War is within the Human nature, one must always prove that they are bigger then the other there is no way to stop it. Where there is a Ying there is a Yang, Peace and War you can't have peace without war, if there was no war Life would be uneventful and boring, Peace would be nice, but have you ever heard the saying there is always the greatest calm before the storm? no matter where you go there will be violence even in animals, it is a fight for survival and if there was no war there would be no push for technology to where it is today, Computers were made to save file space and to lock down information in war times. vehicles where made to combat in war. so If there was a no war we would probably still be in the stone age. Human's thrive for power in anyway they can get it. Even if it includes killing people, everyone has that killer instinct just it hasn't or wont awaken in some of us, it will in others.

That's just my little blurb on this subject anyway.

If there was no war life would be uneventful and boring??? I'd hate to see your idea of very exciting.
There is push for technology for reasons other than war. Admitidally, most of those reasons now are commercial reasons but it is a better motive than for war. You're right that it's porbably impossible to completly eliminate the killer instinct but we can certainly reduce it. If 1 person a year needs to be violoent, it is better than 100. If one person every 100 years needs to be violent it is better than 1 every year and so on.
We wouldn't be here today if we hadn't made war in the past, but likewise we wouldn't be here today if we hadn't swung from trees in the past, and you don't see many people swinging from trees today.

You are correct, but how about virtual reality war? No one would die, but you would still win.
your playing one well kinda

Excatly. Why doesn't Bush sit down, make a nation, Osama Bin Laden makes a nation and they invade eachother? No deaths...

Yes, such as cannibalism. It died out.
ahah! cannabalism died out because everyone who did it died out think of the Aztec's one of the reasons they died out was because the sacrefices destroyed there econamy and miletery ability

Excatly. Why doesn't Bush sit down, make a nation, Osama Bin Laden makes a nation and they invade eachother? No deaths...
well everyone would type godmod at bush for having the peaple's support

ahah! cannabalism died out because everyone who did it died out think of the Aztec's one of the reasons they died out was because the sacrefices destroyed there econamy and miletery ability

No...the sacrifices were religious. They died out because the spanish attacked with more advanced weaponry...the WAR destroyed a great civilization.

Excatly. Why doesn't Bush sit down, make a nation, Osama Bin Laden makes a nation and they invade eachother? No deaths...

or they could play paper-scissors-rock.

well everyone would type godmod at bush for having the peaple's support
So?

or they could play paper-scissors-rock.
Or, they could go into an arena and fight THEMSELVES!! If the leaders of a country had to fight in the war with the army, do you think there would be war? No, I don't...

ahah! cannabalism died out because everyone who did it died out think of the Aztec's one of the reasons they died out was because the sacrefices destroyed there econamy and miletery ability
how would that lessen their military ability? alot of the sacrifices were people they had beaten in battle. more civilisations wiped because of war.

War and violence have always occured throughout human history. This will never change.

I hope it doesn't.
Looks like you've found your first bloodthirsty war-loving bastard.

You hope that people will always kill each other in wars? WEll, someday I hope that you get to fight in one.

war, violence, its all unnecessary.
HAH!
God, I love you liberal thinkers and your toplofty idealism. Do you really think, for a moment, that those in power will stop being greedy, grasping, and selfish? If so, then you need a history lesson. You see, aleader that is content with what he has will never garner the support of the people. Expansion is always the key. it always brings the people together. Conflict expands industry, strengthens economies.

Nationalism plays a great part in this. Just look at the support the great expansionists had from the people. Hitler, Stalin, both had entire nations firmly under their heel. Alexander the Great, Caesar. Caesar was assassinated, true, but by jealous high-ranking members of the Senate, etc. All indicators show that the people loved him. Theodore Roosevelt, in the US, with "big stick" diplomacy. There are many, many more. To garner the support of the people, there must be conflict.

Clinton avoided conflict throughout his two terms. As a result, he was never able to garner even 50% of the popular vote. When 9/11 comes along, Bush has 92% of the vote for his swift actions that would have been resoundingly opposed had he not had the specific circumstances.

Thus, I say that war, although costly for human life, is good. You may think me unfeeling, but the truth is that there are over 6 billion humans on this planet, and most of them aren't doing anything to help anyone else or the planet. In fact, we can't even feed everyone as it is. I'd say death would be far better than the slow suffering of starvation.

War revitalizes economies, brings people together as a nation. If it is for a good cause, at least. Vietnam taught us THAT lesson. Not only that, but war is the ONLY way to oppose a determined expansionistic power. We could not have stopped Hitler or Stalin with sanctions. We can not stop civil wars in Africa with sanctions. However, with brute force we may, just possibly, be able to end a conflict.

how would that lessen their military ability? alot of the sacrifices were people they had beaten in battle. more civilisations wiped because of war.
True. The Aztecs sacrificed people of conquered nations, and only rarely there own. Disease and superior technology possessed by Europeans did all the work.

Looks like you've found your first bloodthirsty war-loving bastard.

You hope that people will always kill each other in wars? WEll, someday I hope that you get to fight in one.

hear, hear.

HAH!
God, I love you liberal thinkers and your toplofty idealism. Do you really think, for a moment, that those in power will stop being greedy, grasping, and selfish? If so, then you need a history lesson. You see, aleader that is content with what he has will never garner the support of the people. Expansion is always the key. it always brings the people together. Conflict expands industry, strengthens economies.

Nationalism plays a great part in this. Just look at the support the great expansionists had from the people. Hitler, Stalin, both had entire nations firmly under their heel. Alexander the Great, Caesar. Caesar was assassinated, true, but by jealous high-ranking members of the Senate, etc. All indicators show that the people loved him. Theodore Roosevelt, in the US, with "big stick" diplomacy. There are many, many more. To garner the support of the people, there must be conflict.

Clinton avoided conflict throughout his two terms. As a result, he was never able to garner even 50% of the popular vote. When 9/11 comes along, Bush has 92% of the vote for his swift actions that would have been resoundingly opposed had he not had the specific circumstances.

Thus, I say that war, although costly for human life, is good. You may think me unfeeling, but the truth is that there are over 6 billion humans on this planet, and most of them aren't doing anything to help anyone else or the planet. In fact, we can't even feed everyone as it is. I'd say death would be far better than the slow suffering of starvation.

War revitalizes economies, brings people together as a nation. If it is for a good cause, at least. Vietnam taught us THAT lesson. Not only that, but war is the ONLY way to oppose a determined expansionistic power. We could not have stopped Hitler or Stalin with sanctions. We can not stop civil wars in Africa with sanctions. However, with brute force we may, just possibly, be able to end a conflict.
That is insane. Population growth, yes it is bad. Would you rather starve to death, or be lying in a pit surrounded by friends, while seeing that your leg has been ripped off, your eye is gouged out, and see that your other leg is on fire? All wars will eventually lead to a nuclear war...Do you want that? Nuclear war will affect the world. Also, economys lower because of war.

Rah, rah, war.

War produces a bit of healthy competition between nations. That's good for industry and science. Tell me, would we have discovered fission without the Jerries and Hirohito putting a burr under our saddle? Would we have faked a lunar landing if it hadn't been for the Cold War? It's like saying that Bird and Magic would have been the stars they were if they hadn't been driven by their rivalry.

War counters the pesky nusiance of population growth. And it's more moral than birth control or abortion. Unlike a tsunami, you can start a war.

War is a good way of stimulating the economy through large contracts to the defense industry. (Don't worry, this money will trickle down to everyone. Eventually.)

War is always a good distraction. It plays well on the CNN.

You can't have war heroes without war. Everyone likes heroes. Also, you can't have war movies without war. Everyone likes war movies.

Liberals aren't happy unless they have something to bitch about. War is good for that.

War creates jobs. Independent contractor jobs. Jobs in medicine, rehabilitation, and physical therapy. Jobs as undertakers. Many of these jobs may be outsourced to other nations, however. But don't worry, there's plenty of jobs at home too. Jobs as recruiting officers. It's hard work to counter the falling reenlistment rates.

Rah, rah, war.

War produces a bit of healthy competition between nations. That's good for industry and science. Tell me, would we have discovered fission without the Jerries and Hirohito putting a burr under our saddle? Would we have faked a lunar landing if it hadn't been for the Cold War? It's like saying that Bird and Magic would have been the stars they were if they hadn't been driven by their rivalry.

War counters the pesky nusiance of population growth. And it's more moral than birth control or abortion. Unlike a tsunami, you can start a war.

War is a good way of stimulating the economy through large contracts to the defense industry. (Don't worry, this money will trickle down to everyone. Eventually.)

War is always a good distraction. It plays well on the CNN.

You can't have war heroes without war. Everyone likes heroes. Also, you can't have war movies without war. Everyone likes war movies.

Liberals aren't happy unless they have something to bitch about. War is good for that.

War creates jobs. Independent contractor jobs. Jobs in medicine, rehabilitation, and physical therapy. Jobs as undertakers. Many of these jobs may be outsourced to other nations, however. But don't worry, there's plenty of jobs at home too. Jobs as recruiting officers. It's hard work to counter the falling reenlistment rates.

i disagree.

i disagree.

Well, that makes two of us.

War is the most natural state of man. In childhood, it is unusual to find children who do not resolve disputes among their peers through conflict (males more often physical, femlaes more often psychological). As adults, the conflict shifts more fully to the psychological/non-physical. That is to say that the conflict becomes a matter of beatng others at anything. This is largely to society's growing anathema on violence. However, violence remains unavoidable. It is instinctual. And when it becomes bottled up by a society that restricts it and a lack of war, it must be vented. Some vent it by picking fights, some vent it by violent crime, and others vent it by creating the books, games, and movies that will be blamed for violence within a year. While it is possible to limit violence on the individual level however, it can never be reduced on the country level. The stakes are simply too high. War has traditionally boiled down to two main causes: expansion and survival (although which side is fighting for which varies with the tide of battle). However, truly beginning with the French Revolution, war itself was remade, and a new purpose was added to war. This new purpose was benevolence. As the French army ceased to be individual groups with limited goals and became a moving, evolving body that fought not for conquest, but to overthrow outside governments, war itself changed. This new goal added to war was forcibly altering a country's way of life, as percieved to be beneficial to them. And thus we have non-religious ideological struggles. And while these struggles are fought primarily to better the other state (generally by overthrowing the existant regimes) those opposed are quick to point out how the 'so-called helper government is gaining from the struggle'. These people need to stop yelling and start thinking. Few and far between are the people who help others in this world without getting a benefit out of it, whether it be something so immaterial as recognition or a good feeling, to something as material as a tax write-off. That doesn't mean that they did what they did for the benefit, but they sure as hell take the benefit. Back to the point, war can never be eleiminated. The most idealistic will say that war can be stopped if everyone is educated to believe the same thing. The first problem with this, one easily proven just by looking around these boards, is that hundreds of years of education have failed to educate even a small number of people to believe the same thing about spelling, much less about their entire way of thinking. More importantly though, there was a time when everybody (that could make a decision on the matter) believed the same thing. In fact there have been many. The crowns of Europe usually walked hand in hand together in terms of belief. Even while they stood opposite another on the field of battle. In short, man is a nasty, brutish creature, and the only way to get us to stop killing ourselves (violent crime) is to give us someone else to kill (war). The proof is in the numbers. Most wars are closely matched by a drop in crime rates.

All that said, war is a bad thing, it remains as mass killing. But, there are many thing out there that are worse.

A teacher of mine once said something that initially got the class in an uproar (although there were only about five people there). He said that you have to love Hitler. And after he said that he waited a moment just to get a reaction, and then finished his thought. Hitler is the only way to deal with the idealists. Because Hitler is the only thing in the past hundred years that just about everyone will agree was evil. And it's hard to say that a war that got rid of him can not be justified. Perhaps the greatest single line on the issue runs something like "it is good that war is so terrible, otherwise we should love it too much."

Simple answer to this question:

War is always bad but sometimes necessary.

Simple answer to this question:

War is always bad but sometimes necessary.


Not necessary... :D

Not necessary... :DThere are occasions, and have been in recent history, when it is necessary.

Usually it involves an irrational person on the "other side" instigating the conflict in the first place, but not always.

Simple answer to this question:

War is always bad but sometimes necessary.

people advocating a war often hide behind nessescity, but are in fact looking after their own interests, want disguised as need.

There are occasions, and have been in recent history, when it is necessary.

Usually it involves an irrational person on the "other side" instigating the conflict in the first place, but not always.

who decides which one is 'irrational'

people advocating a war often hide behind nessescity, but are in fact looking after their own interests, want disguised as need.I won't argue with the fact that there are a lot of times in history when "necessity" was used as the argument for war, when in reality it was for nothing more than their own interests.

However, there are times when it has proved to be necessary.

I'm not sitting here arguing how often it's necessary, other than to say, it's not often; All I'm saying is that it is, sometimes, necessary.

Like I said: "War is always bad, but is sometimes necessary."

War Violence, hell its all part of our nature why should we repress it in some Freudian bullshit way.

Frankly your a bunch of cowards, War, civil war especially is wholly necessary, the whole pacifist movement is based on the idea that all men are rational beings willing to compromise and have a strong sense of self preservation, this is all stupid assumptions, Some times things need changing and forming protest circles and mass chants is not enough.
War Frees the oppressed, and civil war is often a necessary mechanism by which the needs of the majority or any other marginalised group in society at a time previously expresses its wants and will.

Honestly you don’t know what you saying, if a man such as Hitler were to rise to power in your country or one Adjacent and where to threaten you, you would fight. Cowards that’s all you are.

How can a man call him self civilised while he stands back and does nothing in the face of oppression

I have one thing to say to you. You are a genius.

My point is human kind was founded on bloodshed. The three world wars showed that no matter what war exists (the first ww is neanderthals vs cromagnums sceond is ww1 and third is ww2 at least in my philosophy). Humans are a people of violence. Listen to Hobbes, humans are evil and should have the least amount of rights. Animals have "wars" over territory. My question for you is "Are humans animals?" Those who say no i pity your patheticness. Hawks kill each other, dogs fight, rabbits fight until both are dead (makes me think that they are only alive because of their reproduction rate), cats just die from almost everything else, lions fight, almost every animal has "wars"

The means justify the end. Wars will always take place, this we cannot change even if the UN is in place. Not every nation will cooperate with it and we have to remember that men r selfish and only think of themselves, further backing up my point about the UN's wasted efforts. Depending on what side you r on, u will have different reasons of going to war, and u must always remember: history is written from the winner's point of view, never from the losers, we don't kno what their reasons r.

i disagree.

Concise rebuttal, but not really a complete one. Could you explain why?

I think war while bad in many respects, mainly that humans die, can lead to the greater good.

Had the ancient Greeks just let Darius take over Greece, perhaps Democracy as we know it would have been gone or at least severly hindered. Since the greeks fought, this new idea had a chance to blossom.

Had no one fought Hitler, it is quite possible he would have destroyed an entire culture and people (Jews) because of his designs.

In the course of humanity , there are times when people are called to defend them selves. Not everyone in the world recognizes your rights. IF they are not defended, they will be lost. It is unfortunate that war has to happen but it is not all bad. It brings people together. It does creates greater technology. It brings about medical advances. It does employ many people, machinists, soldiers, nurses, doctors, secretaries.

While we should preach tolerance and intelligent debate, we must also prepare for those tyrants who will not listen to the call of freedom and equality but the draw of power and greed. It is an unfortunate dilema but an unescapable one. At least as far as i can see.

That is insane. Population growth, yes it is bad. Would you rather starve to death, or be lying in a pit surrounded by friends, while seeing that your leg has been ripped off, your eye is gouged out, and see that your other leg is on fire? All wars will eventually lead to a nuclear war...Do you want that? Nuclear war will affect the world. Also, economys lower because of war.

What have you been smoking? What was the last war that ended in nuclear violence? Answer WW2. What was the last american war? Answer second gulf war. What countries have nukes? Answer all of the following:
Germany (they invented it, it was made in america first though)
Russia (Of course comrade)
America (You should have known this)
China (sure but they cant win a war.)
North Korea (black market)
Libya (almost, getting uranium hexaflouride from Nk)
Britain (Not to sure about this one)
France (Drop le bomba)

Thats all i know. That is 8 countries, 10 most out of about 250 so if i attack lets say etheopia they would nuke me?

War cannot be bad, as there are no moral absolutes - even war is ambiguous. To the defeated, war is bad, to the victor war is good. To the guy whose shot dead (and related others) its bad, to the person who's not being enslaved by the enemy nation it's good.

War stimulates human ingenuity and industry like no other activity. Good.

War kills on an enormous scale. Bad.

So, I'd say that on an individual, or even exceedingly short term level war is probably not so good. For our species, its usually good. Hell, every singly major war or advance in weapons tech has had social luddites screaming "We're all gonna die!" since the invention of the crossbow. They've all been wrong so I don't really see the human race ever annihilating itself through war.

I have one thing to say to you. You are a genius.

My point is human kind was founded on bloodshed. The three world wars showed that no matter what war exists (the first ww is neanderthals vs cromagnums sceond is ww1 and third is ww2 at least in my philosophy). Humans are a people of violence. Listen to Hobbes, humans are evil and should have the least amount of rights. Animals have "wars" over territory. My question for you is "Are humans animals?" Those who say no i pity your patheticness. Hawks kill each other, dogs fight, rabbits fight until both are dead (makes me think that they are only alive because of their reproduction rate), cats just die from almost everything else, lions fight, almost every animal has "wars"

Physically yes we are animals. But humans are much much more than a dog or lion. Animals will not die for love of an idea like freedom. We are rare in that we like the idea of monogomy. We hold eloquent speakers just as highly as we do great athletes. We have reunions with our extended family whereas most animals do not. We are loyal to things and people who are kind to us. Animals are loyal to the strongest only. We believe in things that cannot be percieved by the senses. We have a mind that can concieve things that an animal would not fathom. Very often we act like animals, but that does not mean we are.

that was fun...well i need to go. have a good one

Concise rebuttal, but not really a complete one. Could you explain why?

I think war while bad in many respects, mainly that humans die, can lead to the greater good.

Had the ancient Greeks just let Darius take over Greece, perhaps Democracy as we know it would have been gone or at least severly hindered. Since the greeks fought, this new idea had a chance to blossom.

Had no one fought Hitler, it is quite possible he would have destroyed an entire culture and people (Jews) because of his designs.

In the course of humanity , there are times when people are called to defend them selves. Not everyone in the world recognizes your rights. IF they are not defended, they will be lost. It is unfortunate that war has to happen but it is not all bad. It brings people together. It does creates greater technology. It brings about medical advances. It does employ many people, machinists, soldiers, nurses, doctors, secretaries.

While we should preach tolerance and intelligent debate, we must also prepare for those tyrants who will not listen to the call of freedom and equality but the draw of power and greed. It is an unfortunate dilema but an unescapable one. At least as far as i can see.

American propaganda got to him/her. Hitler didnt kill only the jews. I hate when people say it or make fun of my German heritage by saying that they are 1/2 Jewish 1/2 nazi because they say they are 1/2 jewish 1/2 catholic (impossibility. Jews and catholics have different beliefs on the messaih so cant happan) and 1/2 german. Those two (the ones who say 1/2 jewish 1/2 nazi and 1/2 jewish 1/2 nazi) are the only people i hate for insulting my religion (100% fanatic Roman Catholic) and race (German).

I hate democracy

Last paragraph was awesome. The V-2 made rocket ships, the nuke made nuke power plants (Ha ha you lost green peace) and the civil war made morphine (ha take that government) the medievalian wars during the 1400s made guns.

Physically yes we are animals. But humans are much much more than a dog or lion. Animals will not die for love of an idea like freedom. We are rare in that we like the idea of monogomy. We hold eloquent speakers just as highly as we do great athletes. We have reunions with our extended family whereas most animals do not. We are loyal to things and people who are kind to us. Animals are loyal to the strongest only. We believe in things that cannot be percieved by the senses. We have a mind that can concieve things that an animal would not fathom. Very often we act like animals, but that does not mean we are.

Humans are animals. Sentient (or whatever that word is) but animals none the less. If a dog was bipedal (superior walking style) and sentient then they still would go to war. Going to war over ideas are for the pathetic and stupid, i mean if the action not life threatening then dont have a reaction. The french rev showed this to us. Wars that would be ok for beliefs would be if there was one during the industrial reveloution since it endangered the employee and their family's lives.

before war was to stop evil from taking over. Such as WWII. Then war got too plitical and now is just corruption and profit. now the only reason that wars are caused is to the person's benifit, so they can gain money and power. Its not to help others anymore which is the sad thing.

who decides which one is 'irrational'
The winner. The greatest right of the victor is that they get to write the accepted history about it.

War cannot be bad, as there are no moral absolutes - even war is ambiguous. To the defeated, war is bad, to the victor war is good. To the guy whose shot dead (and related others) its bad, to the person who's not being enslaved by the enemy nation it's good.

War stimulates human ingenuity and industry like no other activity. Good.

War kills on an enormous scale. Bad.

So, I'd say that on an individual, or even exceedingly short term level war is probably not so good. For our species, its usually good. Hell, every singly major war or advance in weapons tech has had social luddites screaming "We're all gonna die!" since the invention of the crossbow. They've all been wrong so I don't really see the human race ever annihilating itself through war.

Good and bad dont exist

You used the verb annihilate wrong

i know i contradicted myself

annihilate:v: The process of which a particle of antimatter destroys a peice of matter of the same mass and release an enormous amount of energy. When destroyed the particles never exist again.
That is why virtual pairs are virtual.

So two opposing subjects engage each other and are both wiped out with a discharge of energy?

Forget annihilate as a verb - read metaphor.

Actually I do believe in moral absolutes and my initial post was simply a devils advocation. I do still believe, however, that war can still be right and just, even on occasion wars of aggression, in order that the principles built on those moral absolutes are protected. For the most part though I agree - so many wars have been superflous and merely for the purpose of national aggrandisement.

I think it was George Patton who said "War is hell." I could be wrong about that, but even the warfighters think it's hell.

That said, sometimes it's unavoidable.

What is the right side?

This brings up the issue of nationalism.

Obviously, the "right" side is the one that gives you the most advantages. In a USA vs Ukraine war, you wouldn't want to be on Ukrain's side.

don't think us humans are the worst species are chimpanzees they:

kill chimp women and chimp children when they cross into the wrong territory ive seen monkeys rip a baby's arm off and let it go just because it could never survive without it

they form mobs and brutally murder any other chimp's for no reason

there strategy to eat other monkey's is to go strait for the baby's and just shove the adult monkeys out of the way just because the baby's are weaker target's

they sometimes play with there food alive!!!

there are tons more horrific things they do but these are the ones of the top of my head now your honestly telling me that we can be different we have only 2% difference in DNA and its a miracle that these things only appear a little in us so how can we possibly have peace

War is fun, but very, very bad. Peace! :cool:

The problem with War is that it both deserves and doesnt deserve its bad rap.

Would the world be alot better if we could all get along? Yes.
However we cant, back then War was complicated.

Now Wars can be fought by evil against a even greater evil. Its all to complicated and sometimes all to necesary.

hmmm i think war is bad, but can be a necessary evil. for example, if the U.S. hadn't entered WWI, there's a good chance the Allies would've gotten their asses handed to them, and then Britain couldn't have paid us back for all the supplies and whatnot, and then our economy would've sucked. so we were faced with a difficult choice.

I think it was George Patton who said "War is hell." I could be wrong about that, but even the warfighters think it's hell.

That said, sometimes it's unavoidable.

Actually, it was Sherman.

War is horrible, but there are worse things than war.

what is worse than war? :confused:
generally war includes almost all the bad things; death, destruction, suffering, loss of personal property, dignity and loved ones.
whatever you name that is worse than war, i'm sure that war can cause it.

Now, why would ANYONE say war is good? Even the most conservative of people surely think of war as a last resort

Where do you live?
War is the easiest way for acomplishing your goals, economic, powerhungry or whatever.. Plus, there are milions of idiots who can't wait to try paint ball game with real gunes or some detective plots with real flesh into it..
There are many many half-brains that get the chill over the tought of war.. And many of those who simply don't care about anybody but themselves.

Sure, war can be interesting game, but the only thing I would fight against are maybe some evil aliens or something like that.

games like that should be recognised for their value as regards strategic thought. their is some violent content, but for many, like myself it is out weighed by the intellectual stimulation provided.

let's look at the U.S its will run into massive debt in the future (there are tons of stuff about this) so it invades Iraq and Afganistan and gives there oil to western company's this may sound bad but try think of a world without America being the world superpower it would cause mass instability and dozens of wars with far more loss of life.

let's look at the U.S its will run into massive debt in the future (there are tons of stuff about this) so it invades Iraq and Afganistan and gives there oil to western company's this may sound bad but try think of a world without America being the world superpower it would cause mass instability and dozens of wars with far more loss of life.
How would america not being a superpower cause that?
i find the implication that we of "the rest of the world" could not survive without america "watching our backs" insulting.

personally. i think war is a natural part of human life. wars have always existed and always will. :sniper: My uncle in in iraq right now. now although i worry about him, he says that we need to be there and (because he knows things about the situation that most of us dont know) i must agree with him. plus war always helps the economy. We are at war to protect or future, and it may be bad, and people may die, it happens.
jsmck

An old, old saying, no idea who came up with it first, though Churchill, Lenin and Clausewitz all seem to have used it.
'A just peace assumes that rational negotiators speaking from ratioanal positions can always make a satisfactory compromise. If history teaches us one thing it's that they aren't and they can't.' Seems to sum things up nicely. War is always terrible; sometimes the alternative is worse. Get over it.

let's look at the U.S its will run into massive debt in the future (there are tons of stuff about this) so it invades Iraq and Afganistan and gives there oil to western company's this may sound bad but try think of a world without America being the world superpower it would cause mass instability and dozens of wars with far more loss of life.

A country cannot sustain its economy without invading and raiding other countries for their resources... And is vital for world stability.

I just fell off my chair here. :D

War is needed to stop people from gaining too much power the world will NEVER be united as one, there will always be disagreements which will cause violent reactions, The UN itself is crumbling and if that cant stay together which they are supposed to Prevent war, then how is the rest of the world supposed to follow, It's like if someone pushes you, your first reaction is to push them back even though you know its wrong and it goes back in forth till one loses it and fires a nuke at them, or just full out invasion, The best way to end a conflict unfortunatly is by force,

Think of it this way, if you get into an arguement with someone and you knock them out, are the able to argue? No. Therefore technically you have won the arguement. you will always win an arguement by showing your brute force because others will be afraid to stand against it. And then eventually someone or a country will rise against it and BOOM you have a war.

there seems to be a large number of pessimists posting on this thread. maybe war is influenced by the negative outlook of those involved. every man for himself is not a healthy policy, in my opinon.

Personaly I never have used violence to solve my problems, neither economic social.. guess its not the way.

the world is f**king tired of wars.. we´ve been fighting each-other for too long!

wouldn't the world be a much nicer place if we all stopped exploding each other? surely problems of unfair distribution of rescources or over-population would be better solved by woking together instead of intentely plotting each others demise.

What countries have nukes? Answer all of the following:
Germany (they invented it, it was made in america first though)
Russia (Of course comrade)
America (You should have known this)
China (sure but they cant win a war.)
North Korea (black market)
Libya (almost, getting uranium hexaflouride from Nk)
Britain (Not to sure about this one)
France (Drop le bomba)


Nope. You are correct on most accounts and yes you have pointed out that libya doesn't have them yet. But the nations with nukes are (not including North Korea)

Russia
USA
China
Britain
France
Pakistan
India

North Korea can now officially become part of that list and Israel are still heavily suspected of it.

Germany though, nope, they have NEVER had nuclear weapons, a program maybe, never actually built the bomb though. Same as Japan really.

Both now have the capability to build several in a short amount of time but both opt out of joining the nuclear arms race due to their recent history.

in the context of 2005, war is unnecessary.but war is definately a bad thing, there is no way you can say that good things happen during war.(maybe you gain some oil.) the outcome of war is never good either. Usually there are thousands of lives lost, land ruined, cities demolished, etc. now in the case of a civil war or revolutionary war, good things may come from it. especially if you wage war to protect yourself from a totallitarian dictatorship (dick cheney). war=bad.

in the context of 2005, war is unnecessary.but war is definately a bad thing, there is no way you can say that good things happen during war.(maybe you gain some oil.) the outcome of war is never good either. Usually there are thousands of lives lost, land ruined, cities demolished, etc. now in the case of a civil war or revolutionary war, good things may come from it. especially if you wage war to protect yourself from a totallitarian dictatorship (dick cheney). war=bad.

Its sad but war will always be necessary. There will always be some person who wants to take over using hostile force and people to follow them, which will cause other countries in the world to get upset and cause war. and Virtual war cant really work, there could be hacks and people just "respawning" their guy and the war would go on forever.