NationStates Jolt Archive

You know, I was recently stuck in traffic, and managed to find a very weak (surprising...not!) stream of Air America. Being that I needed something to laugh about, I decided to listen in. This...I think it sounded like a woman...called Randy (Randi?), made a comment that made me think. It was something to the effect that he/she in specific, and Air America in general, are on the air for the express purpose of getting more Dims elected.

Now this got me thinking (after a hearty laugh, which almost made me spill my Frappucino...yummy.) I started to think of all the doom scenarios that were portrayed, not just here by Yours Truly, but by many others, regarding Air America and its survival chances, plus its express purpose.

I came to a conclusion, and I am sure my fellow Conservatives around the forum might agree...Air America needs to survive.

Think about it. Thanks to Air America, George W Bush was re-elected, this time with a clear majority, and no hanging chads. True, Ohio took a little longer than necessary to certify its vote. True, the sKerry team was ready to challenge the results in Ohio, which were pretty much unassailable, while the Bush team decided not to challenge the results in Minnesota and Wisconsin, which went for Kerry by much smaller margins, thanks to massive Democrat fraud in Wisconsin (slashed tires? c'mon!)

Thanks to Air America, a 51-49 Republican majority in the Senate became a 54-46 Republican majority, almost filibuster-proof. A scant Republican majority in the House became a much larger Republican majority (sorry, I don't have the numbers handy right now.)

No, we on the Right need Air America. Thanks to Air America, and with no small help from the Hollywood and media elites, the American people were able to see with their own eyes exactly how out of touch the Left is. James Taranto, in OpinionJournal.com's Best of the Web (http://www.opinionjournal.com/best/), reminds us that, thanks to the First Amendment of the US Constitution, self-expression is a highly-protected civil right, which works both ways. It allows the Left to express its views, subversive and irritating as they may be; and it allows the Majority to see how the Left works...call it "spot the idiots," if you may.

So, to all of you at Hot Air America, I say "thank you, and keep it up." Maybe if you keep it up, by this time in 2007, we can look at a super majority for Republicans in the Senate.

Elf.

Jerrymandering really should be made a crime. That's possibly one of my biggest beef's with the political system today. How can you reasonably expect a representitive body when you scientifically exclude anyone who won't vote for you? Far, far, far too many "safe" seats in Congress these days. Its sick, the House of Lords has a higher attrition rate...You have to DIE to leave the house of lords!

Jerrymandering really should be made a crime. That's possibly one of my biggest beef's with the political system today. How can you reasonably expect a representitive body when you scientifically exclude anyone who won't vote for you? Far, far, far too many "safe" seats in Congress these days. Its sick, the House of Lords has a higher attrition rate...You have to DIE to leave the house of lords!
i utterly agree with you. of course jerrymandering will never be outlawed, POLITICIANS would have to vote for it.

Im still waiting for the evidence that Air America had anything to do with Bush being reelected. Why would a radio station that very few people listen to and that is only listened to by people who are going to vote democrat no matter what affect the elections?

Minnesota voted for Kerry by 4%. Ohio voted for Bush by 2%.

And the current Senate GOP majority is 55-45.

And the GOP only picked up 4 seats in the House (out of a total of 435).

And how many undecided but eventual Bush voters do you think actually listened to Air America?

Jerrymandering really should be made a crime. That's possibly one of my biggest beef's with the political system today. How can you reasonably expect a representitive body when you scientifically exclude anyone who won't vote for you? Far, far, far too many "safe" seats in Congress these days. Its sick, the House of Lords has a higher attrition rate...You have to DIE to leave the house of lords!
I thought it was spelled Gerrymandering, after Elbridge Gerry...

Im still waiting for the evidence that Air America had anything to do with Bush being reelected. Why would a radio station that very few people listen to and that is only listened to by people who are going to vote democrat no matter what affect the elections?

Actually, it was Michael Moore. :headbang:

By the way, I have proposed a UN Resolution. EVERY CHILD GETS A LOLIPOP ACT. I would appreciate any support.

Actually, it was Michael Moore. :headbang:
yep, no one cared about Air America, but I was switched from Undecided to Bush by Fahrenheit in late October...

I was recently stuck in traffic... ...a hearty laugh, which almost made me spill my Frappucino...
Drinking a hot drink in traffic? How very irresponsible.

Even here in NYC Air America is considered a joke. They closed in 5 out of their 6 original markets, and couldn't make payroll after three months. That, and Al Franken is simply not Rush Limbaugh. I think AA should exist, if it can pay the bills... but that's like anything else.

I don't listen to either side, preferring NPR and 98.5 (the Bone!).

No, we on the Right.... the Left works...
Using large generalisations like this is not helpful.

That, and Al Franken is simply not Rush Limbaugh.

Yeah, Rush is twice the man. Maybe even three times.

What do I know? I get all my news from WFAN.

During the past NFL season I would see the funniest commericals ever for Air America. It showed all of the hosts with soundbites, then Al Franken said "If you are going to bring it up, back it up!" I almost lost my shit from laughing so hard.

BTW Is it just me or has Janine Garafolo (spelling???) turned into the ugliest woman in showbiz? (Not saying she was attractive before by any standards)
Her and Randi Rhodes (spelling??) could become the new spokeswomen for ED drugs! :)

yep, no one cared about Air America, but I was switched from Undecided to Bush by Fahrenheit in late October...
Funny, I thought that film made Bush look bad.

Allow me to ask you something, since you seem to be on of those nasty flippant righties, who likes to think that you're somehow endowed with divine providence because your abject falure of a president got re-elected by a 3% margin (clear majority?) and calls that a "mandate". The country is more divided than EVER before, and it occurs during the watch of a man who initially ran on the statement "I'm a uniter, not a divider."

What I want to ask you is this. What is your fucking problem with democrats? And, don't give me "tax & spend", or "welfare queen", or any of the other repo talking points. Just tell me what the democratic party has done to you that makes you like being such a dickhead. All I want is honesty, without all the stupid rhetoric.

In the interest of fairness, I'll explain why I hate the repo-lican party, and conservativism. It's simple, the USA is currently the most powerful economic entity on earth, and all the conservatives want is more. Their gleeful willingness to stomp on others, including people who are actually on their own side of the fence (John McCain anyone?) to meet their goals is offensive. I know you're going to bring up the democratic primaries, but it was the right wing media, more than any democrat, that truly brought down Howard Dean. Also, their staunch defiance of the idea that every citizen of the richest country in the world should have things like good education, and health care tells me that simple greed is the only thing that seems to get them out of bed in the morning. The right-wing's treatment of the proletariat is nothing short of a desire for a master/slave relationship between workers and white collar, fat ass, desk jockeys. Essentially, the right, and the republican party of the present seem to stand for feeding corporate greed and corruption, and putting the screws to the people who actually work for a living. Tax cuts be damned straight to hell.

The basic assumption that was made about Air America is the part that makes me laugh.

Rush Limbaugh is actually liked by a large number of people (instead of looking at the red/blue State map, look at the red/blue County map). His air coverage is better in the rural and suburban areas, and so is his intended audience. In most of the red counties (which are largely rural and suburban), Bush won by a 2 to 1 margin. It is only the voters in the urban areas that brought the overall margin to within a few percentage points.

The people in those areas are hearing news that he knows they want to hear. Do you honestly think that people who go to a Baptist church on a regular basis would want to hear what Al Franken has to say?

Even if the government paid for Al Franken to be on in a wider coverage area than anyone else in the US, it is unlikely that people in those areas would tune in to listen.

So the basic assumption seems to have been that "if only these poor benighted people heard the voice of Al Franken, and heard the message of the Democratic Party, they would arise from their stupor and vote Democrat".

It's a bad assumption. Rush became popular for one reason - a lot of people in those rural and suburban areas didn't think that the government was representing them - that it was interfering in their personal lives. They don't want political correctness. They don't want it taught in their schools. They don't want interference in their lives.

It's one thing to go around saying, "Bush got us into a war in Iraq". But it has, for the past decade, before there was any war, been far easier to say, "look what the Democrats want to teach your child in school". Saying that to a person of unknown political background is one thing. But saying it over and over again to Southern Baptists and Pentacostals is a recipe for making people really angry - angry enough to vote against anyone who advocates for teaching those things (and it doesn't matter what those things are - they just have to be something they don't like).

The same people who believed in this assumption also believe that Kerry lost because he wasn't "on message", or that the Democrats failed to "get out the message".

What message? What message can Al Franken actually let past his lips that a wide majority of conservative Americans and conservative Christians and recently more affluent suburbanites will accept?

A lot of people have viewed their basic life beliefs - the way they live, worship, and work - as being under fundamental attack from the Democratic Party. The Democratic Party has done NOTHING to dispel this notion - nothing to assure people that, to the contrary, they protect these basic views on life.

Telling them that they are wrong, and stupid, and ridiculing them on Air America (which I've listened to and heard plenty of ridicule) is a one-way ticket to making sure that these people are PERMANENTLY alienated.

Air America should be allowed to exist as was mentioned before. SHould they be taken seriously? No. They are not finacially solvent because even liberals wont listen to them. Also it not like liberals do not have an outlet. Slate, CNN, Chevy Chase, NYT, all lean a little left. (i know fox is leaning right) I think AA doesnt do well because they are not needed. NPR is fine for most liberals.

Funny, I thought that film made Bush look bad.

I detest Bush, but Moore did screw the pooch with Farenheit. He put too much focus on picking the nits to the detriment of the glaring problems.

Example: Drawing attention to the FOIA documents he'd gotten served only as an attempt by Moore at self-glorification and to imply that he had the inside dirt. All he needed to say was that the Bin Ladens were investors in Bush's firm. We didn't need the obscure and inconclusive paper trail that links the Bin Ladens in some way to an Air Reserve pal of GWB.

Allow me to ask you something, since you seem to be on of those nasty flippant righties, who likes to think that you're somehow endowed with divine providence because your abject falure of a president got re-elected by a 3% margin (clear majority?) and calls that a "mandate". The country is more divided than EVER before, and it occurs during the watch of a man who initially ran on the statement "I'm a uniter, not a divider."

What I want to ask you is this. What is your fucking problem with democrats? And, don't give me "tax & spend", or "welfare queen", or any of the other repo talking points. Just tell me what the democratic party has done to you that makes you like being such a dickhead. All I want is honesty, without all the stupid rhetoric.



A 3% victory is a clear majority. What part of statistics don't you have a grasp of?

You wonder what our F-ing problem is with democrats? Well, I think your 2nd paragragh (2nd sentence) sort of explains it all. It is your overall attitude that turns alot of us off. What with your doom and gloom attitude about this country, you'd think we'd be a third world nation by now. Some of the members this past election were a little over the top in their hatred for the president. It says alot about yourself when you can almost balefully hate a man whom you do not personally know. Then you have your parties leaders whom call the President basically treasonous. But that's another issue. Some of you also talk about how conservatives are racist, but you have a KKK member as one of your senior leaders?

Funny, I thought that film made Bush look bad.
Well, it certainly tried to, but, the manner of presentation just pissed me off. Like the waiting in the school room scene. There's plenty of precedent for the President just waiting. Hell, FDR went back to sleep after learning that Germany had just invaded Poland! How Moore spent the entire time speculating, and rambling. I really couldn't take Moore seriously throughout the film, and that just hurt his side for me. Such intense hatred and negativism turned me off.

Another thing is El Rushbo is a much more dynamic character. Yes he is a conservative. He also is a sports man (regardless of the mcnabb story). THe sports thing alone helps him get listeners. He is so paasionate and excitable that people will listen to him just for the debates. Nothing against al franken but its hard to compete with that.
Also, rush was able to capitalize on a dying AM market and revitalize it. Al franken now has to fight his way in. I am not a fan of AA but they do have it tough

I detest Bush, but Moore did screw the pooch with Farenheit. He put too much focus on picking the nits to the detriment of the glaring problems.

Example: Drawing attention to the FOIA documents he'd gotten served only as an attempt by Moore at self-glorification and to imply that he had the inside dirt. All he needed to say was that the Bin Ladens were investors in Bush's firm. We didn't need the obscure and inconclusive paper trail that links the Bin Ladens in some way to an Air Reserve pal of GWB.


I think that the worst part of both Bowling for Columbine and Fahrenheit 911 was Moore's blatant willingness to play fast and loose with the truth.

His remarks later about how it wasn't important to be truthful, and how these were both intended as comedy instead of as documentary makes me wonder how he could get an award for Best Documentary.

A program on PBS like Frontline produces "documentary". So does the BBC. Each may have a certain amount of bias. But they don't often resort to the sort of lies and logical fallacies that Moore counts on.

Moore is the Riefenstahl of the Democratic Party. It doesn't matter if it's truthful or accurate - it only matters if it excites the Party members. And anyone who doesn't like it is obviously an antisocial idiot.

Allow me to ask you something, since you seem to be on of those nasty flippant righties, who likes to think that you're somehow endowed with divine providence because your abject falure of a president got re-elected by a 3% margin (clear majority?) and calls that a "mandate". The country is more divided than EVER before, and it occurs during the watch of a man who initially ran on the statement "I'm a uniter, not a divider."

What I want to ask you is this. What is your fucking problem with democrats? And, don't give me "tax & spend", or "welfare queen", or any of the other repo talking points. Just tell me what the democratic party has done to you that makes you like being such a dickhead. All I want is honesty, without all the stupid rhetoric.



Did you actually say proletariat?

Its funny whe nyou say we are more divided than ever. I thought the civil war and the 60 years before that would have topped now. Unless liberals have taken to the streets?

Also, do the democrats have to have "done" something for me to be conservative? I didnt realize republicans are actually disenfranchised dems.

Why am i conservative? Well thats simple, i beleive in induvidual responsibility, not social care taking. I agreethat our less fortunate need help but we do not need to baby them. They need to still try to succeed. I hate it when people say that republicans dont care or are greedy. We do care but im not going to cry over every person who will not try. Also, yes we are a super power but that doesnt mean China isnt coming up on us. And they are very unethical. I dont know who we are stomping on but i dont think that what you say is true. If it is your abandonement of john kerry isnt really admirable. Or talking about how if the blue states succeeded that the redstates would have nothing. Or that bush voters are really smart enough to understand the situation. I hope i didnt use any talking points not that they are not true

Yeah, Rush is twice the man. Maybe even three times.

What do I know? I get all my news from WFAN.

I don't know, Al Fraken has considerable body mass as well. :D

BTW Is it just me or has Janine Garafolo (spelling???) turned into the ugliest woman in showbiz? (Not saying she was attractive before by any standards)
Her and Randi Rhodes (spelling??) could become the new spokeswomen for ED drugs! :)

She was vaguely cute in "Mystery Men"... I think it's too much sprouts and screaming at the red states on election night... (ARGH!! KANSAS YOU ARE SO STUPID!!!)

You know, I was recently stuck in traffic, and managed to find a very weak (surprising...not!) stream of Air America. Being that I needed something to laugh about, I decided to listen in. This...I think it sounded like a woman...called Randy (Randi?), made a comment that made me think. It was something to the effect that he/she in specific, and Air America in general, are on the air for the express purpose of getting more Dims elected.

Now this got me thinking (after a hearty laugh, which almost made me spill my Frappucino...yummy.) I started to think of all the doom scenarios that were portrayed, not just here by Yours Truly, but by many others, regarding Air America and its survival chances, plus its express purpose.

I came to a conclusion, and I am sure my fellow Conservatives around the forum might agree...Air America needs to survive.

Think about it. Thanks to Air America, George W Bush was re-elected, this time with a clear majority, and no hanging chads. True, Ohio took a little longer than necessary to certify its vote. True, the sKerry team was ready to challenge the results in Ohio, which were pretty much unassailable, while the Bush team decided not to challenge the results in Minnesota and Wisconsin, which went for Kerry by much smaller margins, thanks to massive Democrat fraud in Wisconsin (slashed tires? c'mon!)

Thanks to Air America, a 51-49 Republican majority in the Senate became a 54-46 Republican majority, almost filibuster-proof. A scant Republican majority in the House became a much larger Republican majority (sorry, I don't have the numbers handy right now.)

No, we on the Right need Air America. Thanks to Air America, and with no small help from the Hollywood and media elites, the American people were able to see with their own eyes exactly how out of touch the Left is. James Taranto, in OpinionJournal.com's Best of the Web (http://www.opinionjournal.com/best/), reminds us that, thanks to the First Amendment of the US Constitution, self-expression is a highly-protected civil right, which works both ways. It allows the Left to express its views, subversive and irritating as they may be; and it allows the Majority to see how the Left works...call it "spot the idiots," if you may.

So, to all of you at Hot Air America, I say "thank you, and keep it up." Maybe if you keep it up, by this time in 2007, we can look at a super majority for Republicans in the Senate.
actually DIEBOLT computer hackers and Ken Blackwell had alot more to do with Bushs "re-election" then AirAmerica did which only came on the air in april so theres no way it couldve affected the election in such a short timespan

Actually, it was Michael Moore. :headbang:
no it wasnt it was voter disenfranchisement

Even here in NYC Air America is considered a joke. They closed in 5 out of their 6 original markets, and couldn't make payroll after three months. That, and Al Franken is simply not Rush Limbaugh. I think AA should exist, if it can pay the bills... but that's like anything else.

I don't listen to either side, preferring NPR and 98.5 (the Bone!).
AirAmerica is the highest rated station in NY actually and your news is incredibly ancient and false. They recovered fully from this little bump in the road and are adding markets at lightening speed in new cities everyday. Do try to keep up

During the past NFL season I would see the funniest commericals ever for Air America. It showed all of the hosts with soundbites, then Al Franken said "If you are going to bring it up, back it up!" I almost lost my shit from laughing so hard.

BTW Is it just me or has Janine Garafolo (spelling???) turned into the ugliest woman in showbiz? (Not saying she was attractive before by any standards)
Her and Randi Rhodes (spelling??) could become the new spokeswomen for ED drugs! :)
no the ugliest woman would be Annthrax Coultergeist

Air America should be allowed to exist as was mentioned before. SHould they be taken seriously? No. They are not finacially solvent because even liberals wont listen to them. Also it not like liberals do not have an outlet. Slate, CNN, Chevy Chase, NYT, all lean a little left. (i know fox is leaning right) I think AA doesnt do well because they are not needed. NPR is fine for most liberals.
enough with the foxnews lies already--airamericas finances are in excellent shape as are their ratings and theyre even beating Rush Windbag in many areas--pull your head out of your ass

I think that the worst part of both Bowling for Columbine and Fahrenheit 911 was Moore's blatant willingness to play fast and loose with the truth.

His remarks later about how it wasn't important to be truthful, and how these were both intended as comedy instead of as documentary makes me wonder how he could get an award for Best Documentary.

A program on PBS like Frontline produces "documentary". So does the BBC. Each may have a certain amount of bias. But they don't often resort to the sort of lies and logical fallacies that Moore counts on.

Moore is the Riefenstahl of the Democratic Party. It doesn't matter if it's truthful or accurate - it only matters if it excites the Party members. And anyone who doesn't like it is obviously an antisocial idiot.
just substitute foxnews everytime you say Moore and republican everytime you say democrat and youd be right about something for the first time in your life

A lot of people have viewed their basic life beliefs - the way they live, worship, and work - as being under fundamental attack from the Democratic Party. The Democratic Party has done NOTHING to dispel this notion - nothing to assure people that, to the contrary, they protect these basic views on life.
You make a good point, but remember that there are alot of Americans who think that their basic life beliefs are under fundamental attack from the Republican Party.

Why don't you all just vote Libertarian? That way the government is guaranteed to leave you alone.

What with your doom and gloom attitude about this country,
Such intense hatred and negativism turned me off.
So you need to have everything sugary and optimistic? This is the real world.

Why am i conservative? Well thats simple, i beleive in induvidual responsibility, not social care taking.
This is one of the things i don't like about conservatives (I'm not a socialist, BTW). You say that you are for "induvidual responsibility" and "government staying out of people's lives", but this goes out the window on social issues as you regulate sex lives and ban drugs. Libertarians are the only people who can legitimately make the above claims.

Did you actually say proletariat?

Its funny whe nyou say we are more divided than ever. I thought the civil war and the 60 years before that would have topped now. Unless liberals have taken to the streets?

Also, do the democrats have to have "done" something for me to be conservative? I didnt realize republicans are actually disenfranchised dems.

Why am i conservative? Well thats simple, i beleive in induvidual responsibility, not social care taking. I agreethat our less fortunate need help but we do not need to baby them. They need to still try to succeed. I hate it when people say that republicans dont care or are greedy. We do care but im not going to cry over every person who will not try. Also, yes we are a super power but that doesnt mean China isnt coming up on us. And they are very unethical. I dont know who we are stomping on but i dont think that what you say is true. If it is your abandonement of john kerry isnt really admirable. Or talking about how if the blue states succeeded that the redstates would have nothing. Or that bush voters are really smart enough to understand the situation. I hope i didnt use any talking points not that they are not true

Bush won by the narrowest percentage margin for an incumbent since 1916, and he had more votes cast against him than any President in history. So yeah, this country is a bit divided.

Clinton's foreign policy allowed the sale of missiles to China. Bush's economic policy is allowing the sale of the U.S. economy to China.

It's kind of hard to 'try to succeed' if you're poor when 1)college tuition is going up by 10-15% a year and 2)the Republicans (in both the WH and Congress) are looking to cut financial aid (reducing funding for Pell grants and such). Capitalism's dirty little secret is it NEEDS slavery to work. Of course, if slavery is illegal, Wal-Mart will have to make do with paying $5.15/hr wages.

Oh, and if you hadn't noticed, the Dems spent the last quarter of 2001 through 2003 pandering to Bush. Otherwise, IWR would have been filibustered, among other things. It was only when Howard Dean scared the establishment with his grassroots fundraising ability when the Dems "became out of touch," as the RW talking point goes. Of course, when the Dems were sucking up to Bush, they got so much farther in the 2002 midterm elections :rolleyes:

actually DIEBOLT computer hackers and Ken Blackwell had alot more to do with Bushs "re-election" then AirAmerica did which only came on the air in april so theres no way it couldve affected the election in such a short timespan

At least spell Diebold right :rolleyes:

thanks to massive Democrat fraud in Wisconsin (slashed tires? c'mon!)


massive fraud? A bit an overstatement I think. Three guys acting on their own. MASSIVE FRAUD!!!!!!!! OH N000ZZZZ!!!

how about two people fire-bombing an abortion clinic? Massive terrorist attack?

Drinking a hot drink in traffic? How very irresponsible.
Uh...Frapuccino is a cold drink.

During the past NFL season I would see the funniest commericals ever for Air America. It showed all of the hosts with soundbites, then Al Franken said "If you are going to bring it up, back it up!" I almost lost my shit from laughing so hard.

BTW Is it just me or has Janine Garafolo (spelling???) turned into the ugliest woman in showbiz? (Not saying she was attractive before by any standards)
Her and Randi Rhodes (spelling??) could become the new spokeswomen for ED drugs! :)
ED drugs are supposed to make things "come up", if you know what I mean.

I haven't seen Randi Rhodes (sp), but Janeane Garofalo definitely has a face made for radio.

Funny, I thought that film made Bush look bad.
Actually, F9/11 made the Left look like a bunch of loons.

After-the-election remarks by Chappaquiddick Ted, Jean Francois Kerry et al have only reinforced that notion.

However, in a great development, since the election, we have not heard much from either Jabba the Moore or Count Chocula Soros.

Allow me to ask you something, since you seem to be on of those nasty flippant righties, who likes to think that you're somehow endowed with divine providence because your abject falure of a president got re-elected by a 3% margin (clear majority?) and calls that a "mandate". The country is more divided than EVER before, and it occurs during the watch of a man who initially ran on the statement "I'm a uniter, not a divider."

What I want to ask you is this. What is your fucking problem with democrats? And, don't give me "tax & spend", or "welfare queen", or any of the other repo talking points. Just tell me what the democratic party has done to you that makes you like being such a dickhead. All I want is honesty, without all the stupid rhetoric.

In the interest of fairness, I'll explain why I hate the repo-lican party, and conservativism. It's simple, the USA is currently the most powerful economic entity on earth, and all the conservatives want is more. Their gleeful willingness to stomp on others, including people who are actually on their own side of the fence (John McCain anyone?) to meet their goals is offensive. I know you're going to bring up the democratic primaries, but it was the right wing media, more than any democrat, that truly brought down Howard Dean. Also, their staunch defiance of the idea that every citizen of the richest country in the world should have things like good education, and health care tells me that simple greed is the only thing that seems to get them out of bed in the morning. The right-wing's treatment of the proletariat is nothing short of a desire for a master/slave relationship between workers and white collar, fat ass, desk jockeys. Essentially, the right, and the republican party of the present seem to stand for feeding corporate greed and corruption, and putting the screws to the people who actually work for a living. Tax cuts be damned straight to hell.
Put down the cup of Leftist Kool-Aid, and do some critical thinking.

Why I dislike the Dims? Simple, while they continuously claim to be for the "working people," the Dim millionaires come up with ideas and laws that effectively prevent normal Americans from being able to improve their lot in life. The War on Poverty and Great Society of LBJ? They gave us 40+ years of RISING poverty rates, and ever-increasing numbers of welfare queens who gamed the system once they realized that the Government would pay them to have as many children as they could, rather than get educated.

Do you realize that the top 50% of taxpayers pay 96% of the tax load? The so-called "progressive" tax (straight out of the Communist Manifesto,) has only succeeded in becoming a massive vote buying program for the Left. After all, why would the bottom 50% of taxpayers be concerned with the tax load of the top 50%, when they (the bottom 50%) are getting a free ride? In fact, this scheme serves to effectively keep the bottom 50% of taxpayers squarely in the bottom, since any move up in the scale is punished by higher taxes...which brings me to the point, what is so wrong with you and I keeping more of what we earn through our work? If you don't work, I guess then you have a problem with it, since it would mean that the welfare checks will be smaller.

Like I said, once you put down your Kool-Aid, you might actually realize that capitalism is the true reason this country is great, and government ought to be smaller.

actually DIEBOLT computer hackers and Ken Blackwell had alot more to do with Bushs "re-election" then AirAmerica did which only came on the air in april so theres no way it couldve affected the election in such a short timespan
Good to see we have the ultimate Kool-Aid drinker offering his so-called opinion, which consists of the usual collection of conspiracy theories.

Err America did influence the election. Quite a few of us on the Right actually tune in on ocassion, just to hear what the latest crackpot theories from the Left are. Consider it gathering intelligence, if you may. It didn't hurt our case when Jabba the Moore and Hollyweird threw their opinions into our face and demanded that we follow their lead.

no it wasnt it was voter disenfranchisement
Prove it. Go ahead, prove it. I know you can't prove it, because it didn't happen, but try to prove it.

AirAmerica is the highest rated station in NY actually and your news is incredibly ancient and false. They recovered fully from this little bump in the road and are adding markets at lightening speed in new cities everyday. Do try to keep up
Hmmmm, another statement you can't prove. Sorry to tell you (no I am not sorry,) but WABC cleans WLIB's clock in every time slot, with the dual punch of Limbaugh and Hannity.

massive fraud? A bit an overstatement I think. Three guys acting on their own. MASSIVE FRAUD!!!!!!!! OH N000ZZZZ!!!

how about two people fire-bombing an abortion clinic? Massive terrorist attack?
How about shots being fired at a Bush campaign headquarters? How about union thugs invading and smashing another Bush campaign office? How about a liberal coming into yet another Bush campaign office and punching a volunteer?

Hmmmm, another statement you can't prove. Sorry to tell you (no I am not sorry,) but WABC cleans WLIB's clock in every time slot, with the dual punch of Limbaugh and Hannity.


Here's some proof...

From the Wallstreet Journal:

...with an infusion of new financing and new management, the radio network has won high ratings in some of its local markets and has garnered the support of radio-industry giant Clear Channel Communications Inc. It has signed three-year contracts with its top two stars, Al Franken and Randi Rhodes, and raised an additional $19 million from private investors. People familiar with the situation say Air America is also finalizing a deal that would get it back on the air in Los Angeles via KXTA-AM, a Clear Channel sports station.


From the Washington Times:

Companies such as Air America and Democracy Radio are enjoying market success with such talk-show hosts as Al Franken, Ed Schultz, Randi Rhodes and Janeane Garofalo. Clear Channel Radio has moved into the progressive-talk arena, with three of its stations -- in Cincinnati, Detroit and Washington -- switching formats in the past month.

Gabe Hobbs, Clear Channel Radio vice president of programming, news/talk/sports, told United Press International progressive talk is experiencing vigorous growth, largely because the recent round of the format's expansion took place during the contentious election year of 2004.

"People had a heightened interest in electoral politics," he said, "and we used that opportunity to fill a need and launch a new format."

Hobbs said talk stations typically take 18 months to two years to become established, but progressive talk is connecting considerably faster for Clear Channel.

"Our stations are getting there in 30 to 90 days," he said. "That's remarkable considering most of the talent, no one knows who they are."

Here are some ratings...

A Few Markets of Interest
Albuquerque: Share: 1.9 AQH: 12,147
Ann Arbor: Share: 2.2 AQH: 6,490
Boulder: Share: 1.6 AQH: 34,229
Madison: Share: 2.9 AQH: 13,288
Portland, OR: Share: 3.7 AQH: 71,691
Sacramento: 1.6 AQH: 27,429
San Diego: 2.3 AQH: 57,130

AQH: The statisical average number of persons who listened to a station for a minimum of five minutes within a given week.


So, it seems to me that you righties sre just doing what you always do; Saying whatever you want to be true enough times that, in your own twisted mind, it becomes true.

Actually, F9/11 made the Left look like a bunch of loons.

After-the-election remarks by Chappaquiddick Ted, Jean Francois Kerry et al have only reinforced that notion.

However, in a great development, since the election, we have not heard much from either Jabba the Moore or Count Chocula Soros.

The problem with Moore is that he's more about the self-promotion than the issues at hand. Moore is not a part of his films: no matter how much he wants it to be otherwise, his involvement in those stories and events should be simply that of reporter. Stepping out of that role and into the role of agitator, especially to the degree that he does, makes him nothing more than ridiculous.

It's like watching a film of some fat, out-of-shape slob huffing and puffing on a roaring bonfire, as though he somehow needs to get the flames higher, when all he really needs to do is point a camera at the fire and say: "check it out."

A lot of people have viewed their basic life beliefs - the way they live, worship, and work - as being under fundamental attack from the Democratic Party.

Under attack in what way? It seems to me that the Republicans/conservatives were the ones who promoted interference in how others lived, worshiped, and worked, though they were good at inducing a paranoia that it was the other way around.

with the dual paunch of Limbaugh and Hannity.

There, fixed it for you … ;)

government ought to be smaller.
Why do conservatives always say this? You cannot calim to be in favour of small government if you want big wars, regulation of our sex lives and social authoritarianism.

If you want to legitimately claim to be for small government, be a libertarian.

no the ugliest woman would be Annthrax Coultergeist

Sorry but you are blinded by your anti-conservatism. Janine definately takes the ugly prize. Second is Randi Roads.

AirAmerica is the highest rated station in NY actually and your news is incredibly ancient and false. They recovered fully from this little bump in the road and are adding markets at lightening speed in new cities everyday. Do try to keep up

There is no station called "Air America". Learn the call letters.

BTW the station El Rushbo is on is the top rated news station in NYC.

Why do conservatives always say this? You cannot calim to be in favour of small government if you want big wars, regulation of our sex lives and social authoritarianism.

If you want to legitimately claim to be for small government, be a libertarian.
But Republicans like be Hyprocits wrapped up in a enigma. That way they can play the "underdog" card. Its the only way Rush could get listeners. "They are out to get them" They put Liberal where "they" is and that explains them.

... It was something to the effect that he/she in specific, and Air America in general, are on the air for the express purpose of getting more Dims elected....


Ow wow. I get it!!

Dems = Dims!

Gosh, that is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO witty!

HA!

Ha! Ha!

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!


Did ya think that one up all by yourself?


Hey - maybe that can be the next debating topic: Dims versus Repugnicants! That would just be soooooooooooooo...... mature!


:rolleyes:

AirAmerica is the highest rated station in NY actually and your news is incredibly ancient and false. They recovered fully from this little bump in the road and are adding markets at lightening speed in new cities everyday. Do try to keep up

Um... what?

In New York, Air America's programming is heard on WLIB. They're rated in 24th place.
http://www.fmqb.com/Article.asp?id=17912

Little bump?
Air America is now in 40 cities, according to Howard Kurtz of the Washington Post. Limbaugh has over 600 stations, and Hannity is not far behind.
http://newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/1/3/84042.shtml

As for keeping up: Step one for liberals -- Stop believing your own propoganda. It keeps getting conservatives elected. :D

As for keeping up: Step one for liberals -- Stop believing your own propoganda. It keeps getting conservatives elected. :D
The statisctics show that conservatives actually believe more propaganda. Millions of them still think that Saddam had connections to al-Qaeda and WMDs, long after it has been proven otherwise.

Republicans are doing well. Maybe Democrats should start believing more of their own propaganda and they will do well!

Here's some proof...

From the Wallstreet Journal:

...with an infusion of new financing and new management, the radio network has won high ratings in some of its local markets and has garnered the support of radio-industry giant Clear Channel Communications Inc. It has signed three-year contracts with its top two stars, Al Franken and Randi Rhodes, and raised an additional $19 million from private investors. People familiar with the situation say Air America is also finalizing a deal that would get it back on the air in Los Angeles via KXTA-AM, a Clear Channel sports station.


From the Washington Times:

Companies such as Air America and Democracy Radio are enjoying market success with such talk-show hosts as Al Franken, Ed Schultz, Randi Rhodes and Janeane Garofalo. Clear Channel Radio has moved into the progressive-talk arena, with three of its stations -- in Cincinnati, Detroit and Washington -- switching formats in the past month.

Gabe Hobbs, Clear Channel Radio vice president of programming, news/talk/sports, told United Press International progressive talk is experiencing vigorous growth, largely because the recent round of the format's expansion took place during the contentious election year of 2004.

"People had a heightened interest in electoral politics," he said, "and we used that opportunity to fill a need and launch a new format."

Hobbs said talk stations typically take 18 months to two years to become established, but progressive talk is connecting considerably faster for Clear Channel.

"Our stations are getting there in 30 to 90 days," he said. "That's remarkable considering most of the talent, no one knows who they are."

Here are some ratings...

A Few Markets of Interest
Albuquerque: Share: 1.9 AQH: 12,147
Ann Arbor: Share: 2.2 AQH: 6,490
Boulder: Share: 1.6 AQH: 34,229
Madison: Share: 2.9 AQH: 13,288
Portland, OR: Share: 3.7 AQH: 71,691
Sacramento: 1.6 AQH: 27,429
San Diego: 2.3 AQH: 57,130

AQH: The statisical average number of persons who listened to a station for a minimum of five minutes within a given week.


So, it seems to me that you righties sre just doing what you always do; Saying whatever you want to be true enough times that, in your own twisted mind, it becomes true.
Unofrtunately for you, you have proven nothing other than yes, Err America has listeners. If you had bothered to read my statement, you would have noticed that I said WABC (Rush and Hannity) cleans WLIB's (Err America's) clock in NYC in every time slot. I noticed how selective your "markets of interest" were...the sprawling metropolis of Madison, WI...the humongous radio market of Boulder, CO...the very important metro area of Albuquerque. When Err America can claim to have 4,000,000 (that's four million, for those of you in government schools,) listeners nationwide at any one time, then they can lay claim to being a powerhouse.

Unfortunately for Err America, it is competing with its' fellow travelers from the Left, namely NPR.

There, fixed it for you … ;)
Wow, you are so clever! I think the last time I used that tactic, I was in high school!

Ow wow. I get it!!

Dems = Dims!

Gosh, that is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO witty!

HA!

Ha! Ha!

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!


Did ya think that one up all by yourself?


Hey - maybe that can be the next debating topic: Dims versus Repugnicants! That would just be soooooooooooooo...... mature!


:rolleyes:
Wow, it took about 50 posts in the thread before the resident Canadian Lefty came in, took offense and posted a semi-clever retort. Must have been busy lately.

Um... what?

In New York, Air America's programming is heard on WLIB. They're rated in 24th place.
http://www.fmqb.com/Article.asp?id=17912

Little bump?
Air America is now in 40 cities, according to Howard Kurtz of the Washington Post. Limbaugh has over 600 stations, and Hannity is not far behind.
http://newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/1/3/84042.shtml

As for keeping up: Step one for liberals -- Stop believing your own propoganda. It keeps getting conservatives elected. :D
Shhhhhh!!!! Don't tell them the secret!

The statisctics show that conservatives actually believe more propaganda. Millions of them still think that Saddam had connections to al-Qaeda and WMDs, long after it has been proven otherwise.
So I guess that it was someone other than Saddam that gassed the Iranians and the Kurds. And it must have been someone other than Saddam that had a jetliner set-up for hijacking training. And it certainly wasn't Saddam that was paying the so-called Palestinians for suicide bombings in Israel...in fact, where else have we seen that same tactic of suicide bombings? Oh yeah, in Iraq.

Put the Kool-Aid down...trust me on that.

Wow, you are so clever! I think the last time I used that tactic, I was in high school!


So, his "dual paunch" is juvenile but your "Dims" and "Err America" are adult?




Holy hypocricy Batman!!

So, his "dual paunch" is juvenile but your "Dims" and "Err America" are adult?




Holy hypocricy Batman!!
I guess I AM learning something from you Lefties!

I'm just suggesting that you could have posted your point equally effectively without the belittling little names and generalizations. It takes away from the message.


but hey, that's just my opinion.

I'm just suggesting that you could have posted your point equally effectively without the belittling little names and generalizations. It takes away from the message.


but hey, that's just my opinion.
And you certainly have a right to your opinion. But, seeing how easily 75% of the threads in NS are some variation or another of "Bush is evil" or "Repugs are stupid," I believe I have a right to use the same kind of language.

And trust me, the message is getting through, if you read the preceding posts in the thread.

Oh, I'm not going to argue that Air America is great programming as I haven't heard it. However I am not sure that your contention that it won Bush the election has much merit.


Frankly I think that Kerry's piss-poor campaign did that all on it's own. He was not a great choice as I mentioned more than once.

Jerrymandering really should be made a crime. That's possibly one of my biggest beef's with the political system today. How can you reasonably expect a representitive body when you scientifically exclude anyone who won't vote for you? Far, far, far too many "safe" seats in Congress these days. Its sick, the House of Lords has a higher attrition rate...You have to DIE to leave the house of lords!
I see nothing wrong with gerrymandering. A district is a district, and if a politician thinks that the shape of a district can give him more votes, then that's great. But things may change, of course. It's like any other district.

Unfortunately for Err America, it is competing with its' fellow travelers from the Left, namely NPR.
I thought NPR was owned by the US government which is right-wing.

So I guess that it was someone other than Saddam that gassed the Iranians and the Kurds. And it must have been someone other than Saddam that had a jetliner set-up for hijacking training. And it certainly wasn't Saddam that was paying the so-called Palestinians for suicide bombings in Israel...in fact, where else have we seen that same tactic of suicide bombings? Oh yeah, in Iraq.

Put the Kool-Aid down...trust me on that.
What are you trying to say? I'm not drinking "Kool-Aid".

Being against the Iraq war is not the same as thinking that Saddam was a good guy.

You put your Kool-Aid down! ;)

I see nothing wrong with gerrymandering. A district is a district, and if a politician thinks that the shape of a district can give him more votes, then that's great. But things may change, of course. It's like any other district.
The problem with gerrymandering is that it can be used by politicians to make sure that voters will only ever elect people from his party. In America, this is why Illinois and Texas are virtually one-party states.

Jerrymandering really should be made a crime. That's possibly one of my biggest beef's with the political system today. How can you reasonably expect a representitive body when you scientifically exclude anyone who won't vote for you? Far, far, far too many "safe" seats in Congress these days. Its sick, the House of Lords has a higher attrition rate...You have to DIE to leave the house of lords!
In order to outlaw gerrymandering you have to define it, which is not very easy.

Whaaat? You mean the dems didn't win because of Air America? Sheesh, here I thought they lost because Kerry ran a lousy campaign. I thought they lost cause the religious right came out in droves to support the ban on gay marriage, holy crap, you mean all the exit polls were wrong? It was really Air America? Well I'll be damned and here I thought the dems shot themselves in the foot with all the Vietnam stuff and Kerry not being able to take a clear position on any thing, but I guess I was wrong, It was Air America, go figure..lol :D

The problem with gerrymandering is that it can be used by politicians to make sure that voters will only ever elect people from his party. In America, this is why Illinois and Texas are virtually one-party states.
And there is a reason for that: sizable minorities of the other party is virtually nonexistant in either state. I wouldn't go as far as to call them one party states, as Dennis Hastert's district is in the Chicago suburbs, and the Democrats have much of Houston and San Antonio. But I feel that it is a state's right to have those districts how they want. Consider them as speaking louder on what they want to say, which makes gerrymandering a beautiful element of democracy.

And there is a reason for that: sizable minorities of the other party is virtually nonexistant in either state. I wouldn't go as far as to call them one party states, as Dennis Hastert's district is in the Chicago suburbs, and the Democrats have much of Houston and San Antonio. But I feel that it is a state's right to have those districts how they want. Consider them as speaking louder on what they want to say, which makes gerrymandering a beautiful element of democracy.
That's very eloquent of you, but there's no escaping the fact that the voice of minority party supporters is being suppressed by the majority in those states.

This is not states rights. It is a suppression of individual political freedom.

Texas was one of the best examples of gerrymandering. Throughout the nineties, it produced a Democratic majority to Congress.

There still are good examples today. My state, Pennslyvania, 12/19 Representatives are Republican, even though the state voted for Kerry, Gore, and Clinton. In Tennessee, 5 Democrats come to Congress and only 4 Republicans. Massachusettes, admittedly one of the most liberal states, sends only Democrats to Congress.

Texas was one of the best examples of gerrymandering. Throughout the nineties, it produced a Democratic majority to Congress.
Yeah definitely. The people of that state seem to get f**ked around quite a bit by politicans like that.

Exactly; Gerrymandering is the worst kind of politics; the politics of power for self-gain. Politicians exploiting a system not for the benifit of the whole, but of tiny groups of well-connected people. Both sides use it, both sides are diminished by it in my eyes. There is simply no excuse for tainting the system like that.

The next "Contract with America" could be truly ambitious, it could remove the horrific Gerrymandering of districts that so distorts our nation. I personally can't even imagine either party even seriously considering giving up the practice; but that does not make me hate it any less. To me, it is pure corruption.

To me, it is pure corruption.
You are definitely right. New Anthrus seems to be so enamoured with the concept of "states rights" that he sees fit in letting regional politicans do what they like, no matter how corrupt - as long it is blessed with the mantle of non-intervention of national government.

You are definitely right. New Anthrus seems to be so enamoured with the concept of "states rights" that he sees fit in letting regional politicans do what they like, no matter how corrupt - as long it is blessed with the mantle of non-intervention of national government.

Perhaps he does seem it; but it would be rude to simply assume he does without reason, no? Let us put the question to New Anthrus then...

Is this concept and practice known as Gerrymandering good for the citizens of the US?

Is Gerrymandering not corruption, and if not, why? (Note the definition of corruption in this case being the subversion of political power for personal or-clique gain.)

Is the state's right to self determination so important that it should override the need for transperant, representitive government?

The deficit-state tax'n'bomb neocons can drop the "gee, as a friend, I must advise you democrats to become utterly shameless corporate pawns, like ourselves" talking point. It's not working this time.

The man Democrat rank and file actually liked - Dean - is replacing McAffectless, and the party might actually be worth something by the next two year cycle.

Please don't take this as cheerleading for the Dems...it is only by a huge effort that the Republican party has become even more repulsive to me than the Democrats are.

I thought NPR was owned by the US government which is right-wing.

NPR is certainly *not* owned by the US government! It is a public radio station (just like there is public TV). Each of NPR's 760 stations is independently owned and operated, and is a not-for-profit station. This is why we put up with all the pledge drives interrupting our Prarie Home Companion.

http://www.npr.org/about/

NPR supports its operations through a combination of membership dues and programming fees from stations, contributions from private foundations and corporations, and revenue from the sales of transcripts, books, CDs, and merchandise. A very small percentage - between 1-2 percent of NPR's annual budget - comes from competitive grants sought by NPR from federally funded organizations.
http://www.npr.org/about/privatesupport.html

The statisctics show that conservatives actually believe more propaganda. Millions of them still think that Saddam had connections to al-Qaeda and WMDs, long after it has been proven otherwise.

Republicans are doing well. Maybe Democrats should start believing more of their own propaganda and they will do well!

I'm not saying that one party or the other does or does not believe their propoganda. I'm saying that just because I posted that AA is *not* doing well, the poster assumed I was a GOP and that I was out of touch with what AA is doing. (I'm an Independent, BTW.)

Yes, they are. I for one cannot vote for the DEMs in their current incarnation, tho....
Until they become a pro-law enforcement instead of anti-gun control party.
Until they explain how one can be Affirmative Action and Equal Opportunity at the same time.
And until they STOP funding education blindly, assuming more money means smarter kids.

...now, I'm not saying the GOP is without sin. But I have more issues with the DEMs.

What I want to ask you is this. What is your fucking problem with Democrats?
They can't stand anybody who disagrees with them - I've been repetitively assailed by at least three 'smarter-than-thou' Democrats over the past few weeks, all 'coz they can't stand the fact I'm libertarian and advocate *both* economic and social freedom.

With the exception of one Republican I know, most Republicans have managed to get along with me. Heck, we've agreed on a number of issues!

They can't stand anybody who disagrees with them - I've been repetitively assailed by at least three 'smarter-than-thou' Democrats over the past few weeks, all 'coz they can't stand the fact I'm libertarian and advocate *both* economic and social freedom.

With the exception of one Republican I know, most Republicans have managed to get along with me. Heck, we've agreed on a number of issues!
It seems that intolerance is indeed a two lane highway with traffic going in both directions? :eek:

now, I'm not saying the GOP is without sin. But I have more issues with the DEMs.
Wow, the Dems must really suck if the Republicans are better!

It allows the Left to express its views, subversive and irritating as they may be; and it allows the Majority to see how the Left works...call it "spot the idiots," if you may.
So you think that half of your fellow Americans are "idiots"? Interesting.

Perhaps they were unfortunate not to have been born with your superior intellect? You really should show them more "compassion"?

So you think that half of your fellow Americans are "idiots"? Interesting.

Perhaps they were unfortunate not to have been born with your superior intellect? You really should show them more "compassion"?

statistically speaking, half of the population has an IQ of 109 or below. So, yes approximately half of all people lack intelligence. does this surprise you?

statistically speaking, half of the population has an IQ of 109 or below. So, yes approximately half of all people lack intelligence. does this surprise you?
Having an IQ below 109 doesn't make you stupid.

statistically speaking, half of the population has an IQ of 109 or below. So, yes approximately half of all people lack intelligence. does this surprise you?
And of course, anyone who voted for Bush is NOT an "idiot"? :eek:

Oh, I'm not going to argue that Air America is great programming as I haven't heard it. However I am not sure that your contention that it won Bush the election has much merit.You see, we disagree on that. True, given how few markets Err America is on, it didn't quite get the "message" out as well as, say, Rush or Hannity. However, there were plenty of stories throughout 2004 about Err America and its hosts' utterances. You don't have to listen to Err America to know they're way out there, way beyond out in left field. Case in point, Al Franken bum-rushing someone at, I think it was a Dean rally, because that person was heckling. Come on, free speech, anyone?

Frankly I think that Kerry's piss-poor campaign did that all on it's own. He was not a great choice as I mentioned more than once.You see, we actually agree on something. Jean Francois Kerry was the absolute worst candidate the Social-Democratic party could have picked for president, bar none. It goes far beyond all the baggage he brought with him (Swift Boat Vets, anyone?) and even beyond the flip-flopping (which he's still engaged in, by the way.) No, for the Dems to pick a hob-nobbing spouse of a millionaire, whose life choices open him to accusations of being a gigolo or a kept man, and who has never done any work other than government work, it tells me that the party was infused with the kind of arrogance that comes from thinking "we can't lose," and they paid the price (again) for underestimating GW Bush.

Whaaat? You mean the dems didn't win because of Air America? Sheesh, here I thought they lost because Kerry ran a lousy campaign. I thought they lost cause the religious right came out in droves to support the ban on gay marriage, holy crap, you mean all the exit polls were wrong? It was really Air America? Well I'll be damned and here I thought the dems shot themselves in the foot with all the Vietnam stuff and Kerry not being able to take a clear position on any thing, but I guess I was wrong, It was Air America, go figure..lol :D
Good point. Err America simply gives one more voice to the lefties, adding to the choir of NPR/CBS/ABC/NBC/MSNBC/CNN. If the Religious Right came out in droves to vote, you have expressed all the reasons, but Err America and the host I referred to, have expressed it as their main reason for being, the election of more Dems/Libs. Looking at the result of their work, I'd call them a failure.

Good point. Err America simply gives one more voice to the lefties, adding to the choir of NPR/CBS/ABC/NBC/MSNBC/CNN. If the Religious Right came out in droves to vote, you have expressed all the reasons, but Err America and the host I referred to, have expressed it as their main reason for being, the election of more Dems/Libs. Looking at the result of their work, I'd call them a failure.
IMHO it was the Bin Laden tape that sealed the election for Bush....he was trailing until that tape emerged. :eek:

IMHO it was the Bin Laden tape that sealed the election for Bush....he was trailing until that tape emerged. :eek:
No, I think it was Kerry's badly run, lacklustre campaign.

No, I think it was Kerry's badly run, lacklustre campaign.

That, and the 12 point bump Bush got after the GOP convention, versus the (2?) point bump Kerry got. Sure the numbers changed afterwards, but it tells me that people just weren't very excited about Kerry.

In a way, the Democrats remind me of the Linux posse on Slashdot.Org. On Slashdot, most people are card carrying ABM folks... (ABM=Anything but Microsoft). The Dems believe, or want to believe, that no one sane could be anything but ABB: Anybody but Bush.

At the end of the day, Kerry failed the litmus test of being a viable alternative to Bush for (slimly) the majority of voting Americans. His campaign was actually well run, mostly. It was the candidate himself that was the issue. Had Gore's campaign been run like Kerry's, he'd have won in 2000.

I *hope* that Dean works with Air America. Basically, he has to pull the Democratic party a little to the right, and AA with it.
I'm NOT saying that the Dems need to become an imitation of the GOP.
But I am saying that they need to drop gun control and gay marriage (both non-starting issues) and promote law enforcement and financial responsibility, two soft spots in the GOP's armor.

I'm NOT saying that the Dems need to become an imitation of the GOP.
But I am saying that they need to drop gun control and gay marriage (both non-starting issues) and promote law enforcement and financial responsibility, two soft spots in the GOP's armor.


To be fair, I don't think the Dems wanted gay marriage to become a Federal election issue. That was forced to the forefront by the mayor of San Fran, and the courts in Massachusetts more than it was put forth as an action item within the Democratic party, and it was kept there via Bush's call for a Constitutional Ammendment which made it something each legislator could be legitimately questioned on rather than leaving it as a state issue - which the Dems repeatedly indicated was where they felt it belonged.

Air America? Wan't that also the name of the CIA owned and operated cover story/airline which they used to get themselves into and out of places that they weren't meant to be in or doing anything to?

Now it's working in the US as a radio station to keep the family of ex CIA chiefs in power... :p

To be fair, I don't think the Dems wanted gay marriage to become a Federal election issue. That was forced to the forefront by the mayor of San Fran, and the courts in Massachusetts more than it was put forth as an action item within the Democratic party, and it was kept there via Bush's call for a Constitutional Ammendment which made it something each legislator could be legitimately questioned on rather than leaving it as a state issue - which the Dems repeatedly indicated was where they felt it belonged.

I totally agree. But those are both Democrat-country. The party needs to be able to keep itself coherent. That's why the GOP segments off (how, I don't know) the gun nuts, the abortion banners, and the prayer in school crowd from the "mainstream" GOP.

On this issue, the GOP played the DEMs for chumps, the same way they should have roasted Bush on finding Bin Laden instead of trying the "what did you do during Viet Nam" debate.

Under attack in what way? It seems to me that the Republicans/conservatives were the ones who promoted interference in how others lived, worshiped, and worked, though they were good at inducing a paranoia that it was the other way around.

It's not paranoia - both ends of the political spectrum want to take away the rights of the other side. In their purest and most extreme forms, each party wants to attack and take away the ideas that the other side believes are basic rights.

So, it's not paranoia to say that the extreme Republican wants to make gay sex a crime, wants to make all forms of abortion illegal, and wants to let every law-abiding citizen carry a gun in public whenever they wish.

And, it's not paranoia to say that the extreme Democrat wants to control churches and force them to accept the secular view of the world, wants to have government-funded abortion on demand by teens without notifying parents, and wants to turn the millions of law-abiding citizens who own guns into felons in re-education camps.

No, it's not paranoia. It's just the sad fact that although each party claims to be the supporter of individual freedoms, they each are the party of "let's take away the rights of those who didn't support us".

I don't need to listen to more than one Rick Santorum speech about gays to get the feeling that he would throw gays in jail if he had the chance.

I don't need to listen to more than one Dianne Feinstein speech about guns to get the feeling that she would thrown me in jail if she had the chance.

I don't need to listen to more than one rant on Air America about religion to hear the hate - the hatred of religion.

I don't need to listen to more than one Rush Limbaugh rant about gays in Disney World to hear the hate - the hatred of people who are just being who they are.

And yes, each side will sugar coat what they're saying - you have to listen many times, and occasionally, the true hatred slips out.

I'm convinced that a lot of the political "discourse" in America has devolved to:

"the other side is full of stupid, immoral, ignorant assholes"

and

"let's screw with their rights and turn huge numbers of them into felons as soon as we take power"