NationStates Jolt Archive

Here on nationstates i have logged many posts in the month i have been on, not because i spam, but because i think i (usually) have something beneficial (i didn't say postive) to say. There are threads I wont even touch though, because people are remarkably hard headed, and, IMHO, get far too upset.

My question to you is this- When you debate, do you think you can change a persons mind? Are you merely just trying to get others to see how you feel about the issue? Do you just find an argument intoxicating? Have you actually changed a persons mind, or had your view reversed in one of these threads? Comment freely, as this is an area of vast interest to me.

I just like to argue.

I just like to argue.
No I don't!

No I don't!
Yes, I do.

Yes, I do.
Shut up.

Shut up.


wont dont you both shut up and go fuck yerselves ;)

I never argue. I say something amazing and everyone instantly agrees.

i would like to let all of you know that you are all wrong.

Shut up.
neo, you can't drag your mental illness here. arguing with your fourth personality soooooo does not count.

I don't much care if I can change a person's mind, because I already know I'm always right.

neo, you can't drag your mental illness here. arguing with your fourth personality soooooo does not count.
Aww, but she won't stop yelling at me!
:(

wont dont you both shut up and go fuck yerselves ;)
Actually, that's sounding like a fairly good idea!
:D

I like to vote in polls multiple times.

Both! I myself cannot resist playing the Devil's Advocate; and, usually, I would say that it is possible to change someone's mind, although this forum makes me weep.

I never argue. I say something amazing and everyone instantly agrees.

I disagree. :)

I know my ability to persuade others into thinking differently about core values is very limited indeed, so I just like to argue and because maybe some of us will see things in a slightly different manner. What else is there?

I inform others of my opinions because they are the TRUTH and if people would just accept my oppinions and abandon the fallacies they cling to they will be happier and more productive. It's actually an altruistic public service I'm performin here.

I don't much care if I can change a person's mind, because I already know I'm always right.did you go the parade?if so, tg me with the details

I disagree. :)

Awww. That isn't fair. I might cry, or do something else, like infanticide. I'm undecided.

Seriously, for a moment.

I like well reasoned argument because it helps me in forming, discarding and adapting my beliefs. If it has the same effect on others then fine, if not, it is their loss.

Both! I myself cannot resist playing the Devil's Advocate; and, usually, I would say that it is possible to change someone's mind, although this forum makes me weep.
explain the weeping

I'm not here to change other people's opinions. I'm here to form my own. Getting somebody to argue the opposite is the easiest way to do it.

Awww. That isn't fair. I might cry, or do something else, like infanticide. I'm undecided.

I don't like to make people cry, so try the something else for my sake. :rolleyes:

I just try to sho wpeople my view, tell them that it's mine alone, and i could be wrong, and i jsut want them to amit the same to me, though they never do. I just want someone to go "Hey, you know, I don't think so, but on the other hand, you might be right." or "I hear what you're trying to say but..." Just something to show that people are actuly understanding my point as i try to do to theirs

I can't be arsed to read 20 pages of long-winded drivel. Give me a snappy quote any day! Sound bites make the world go 'round.

Seriously, for a moment.

I like well reasoned argument because it helps me in forming, discarding and adapting my beliefs. If it has the same effect on others then fine, if not, it is their loss.
thank you for actually answering in a mature manner!!! others - ;)

define well reasoned argument. do you need hard core proof in said WR argument? or do you mean just a trading of opinions?

I don't like to make people cry, so try the something else for my sake. :rolleyes:

Infanticide it is.

explain the weeping

The implication was that whilst in general I would say that it was possible to change someone's mind, this forum is largely an exception - hence the shedding of tears of frustration! The inability of certain of its users to understand anything with the slightest subtlety has also been known to upset me.

I can't be arsed to read 20 pages of long-winded drivel. Give me a snappy quote any day! Sound bites make the world go 'round.
yeah, i have learned the hard way not to bother to read the entire 20 page thread just to make a comment that will be met with" SHUTUP!!! you havent been here long enough!!!! " i also noticed that the same topic will come up again eventually :)



how thats tattoo? ;)

I can't be arsed to read 20 pages of long-winded drivel. Give me a snappy quote any day! Sound bites make the world go 'round.


Tee-hee. Dialect bleed.

I am here pretty much just to argue. I would say about 70% -ish of the time. I enjoy it.

I pick options #2, #3 and #5!

the highlight of my day is Sdaeriji actually picking the choice that he is new on ns

thank you for actually answering in a mature manner!!! others - ;)

define well reasoned argument. do you need hard core proof in said WR argument? or do you mean just a trading of opinions?

No, Hardcore proof is something that is almost always unobtainable for any position.

What I mean by well reasoned argument is an argument that starts from some clear premises, and procedes from these to a conclusion. With the stages in the argument being clear. I do not even demand logical validity in the argument, as we are not logical in our beleif structures.

Simple bald assertion, trading of opinion is rather a waste of time. Opinions should, ideally be justified, so others can weigh them for themselves.

Me i just like to argue, like pretty much everyone else in the world. On a side note, with which i hope to start a bitter argument, this topic, and the ensuing thread is unusually chipper for one of yours, Occidio. What's the deal? No dead cats, no satanists. :(

Me i just like to argue, like pretty much everyone else in the world. On a side note, with which i hope to start a bitter argument, this topic, and the ensuing thread is unusually chipper for one of yours, Occidio. What's the deal? No dead cats, no satanists. :(

for the record, i never talked about satanists.

you want dead cats baby? there are many more stories where those came from....
HOW DARE YOU CALL ME CHIPPER YOU STUPIB SON OF A BITCH???YOU ARE THE ONE FREEZING YOUR ASS OFF IN THE BASEMENT OF SOME SHACK IN A TOWN THAT WARRANTS NOT ONE, BUT TWO STUPIDS IN THE DESCRIPTION!! YOU WANT T O START WITH ME??? NOT ONLY WILL I PUT A HEX ON YOU , I WILL SLIT YOUR THROAT FOR THE HELL OF IT!!! DONT EVER, I MEAN EVER, EVEN JOKE ABOUT ME BEING CHIPPER!! THE ONLY CHIPPER I KNOW IS THE WOOD CHIPPER THAT I SHOVED MEANINGLESS MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY THROUGH. THATS THE ONLY WAY THEY WOULD FIT IN THE CROCK POT!!!
how is that for a bitter argument, dearest? :D
want to come over for dinner?
i will start sicko topic threads anytime you request.

I just like to tease people with my ideas.

Ha, you red my post again!

You're still reading!

ok, I'll be quiet now.

Stop reading.

for the record, i never talked about satanists.

you want dead cats baby? there are many more stories where those came from....
HOW DARE YOU CALL ME CHIPPER YOU STUPIB SON OF A BITCH???YOU ARE THE ONE FREEZING YOUR ASS OFF IN THE BASEMENT OF SOME SHACK IN A TOWN THAT WARRANTS NOT ONE, BUT TWO STUPIDS IN THE DESCRIPTION!! YOU WANT T O START WITH ME??? NOT ONLY WILL I PUT A HEX ON YOU , I WILL SLIT YOUR THROAT FOR THE HELL OF IT!!! DONT EVER, I MEAN EVER, EVEN JOKE ABOUT ME BEING CHIPPER!! THE ONLY CHIPPER I KNOW IS THE WOOD CHIPPER THAT I SHOVED MEANINGLESS MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY THROUGH. THATS THE ONLY WAY THEY WOULD FIT IN THE CROCK POT!!!
how is that for a bitter argument, dearest? :D
want to come over for dinner?
i will start sicko topic threads anytime you request.
Consider one requested. Yes i want to come over to dinner, just so long as i'm alive enough to eat it.
You have a crock pot? i want a crock pot. I've got a hot pot, but that's hardly the same.
I realize i'm replying to each one of your points backwards, but oh well. I'm sory for my mistake. i forgot the supposed satanist was faking. And, purportedly, had a small penis. Poor little fellow. (did you see my double entendre? did ya? did ya, huh?) :fluffle:

edit: well noticed, but i'm actually in the toasty-warm, cinderblock, first floor dorm room of the college campus part of the really shitty town.

Consider one requested. Yes i want to come over to dinner, just so long as i'm alive enough to eat it.
You have a crock pot? i want a crock pot. I've got a hot pot, but that's hardly the same.
I realize i'm replying to each one of your points backwards, but oh well. I'm sory for my mistake. i forgot the supposed satanist was faking. And, purportedly, had a small penis. Poor little fellow. (did you see my double entendre? did ya? did ya, huh?) :fluffle:

edit: well noticed, but i'm actually in the toasty-warm, cinderblock, first floor dorm room of the college campus part of the really shitty town.
i love a man with dyslexia. learning disabilities are so sexy.
you need a crock pot. never put it on high though, last time i did that the stew meat looked like puppy chow.
your double entendre was most excellent. i should cook the satanist for dinner, since he has had little exposure to the world, he should be quite tender.my next disturbing thread will be posted tonight. ihave to think what a.) wont get me in trouble, and b.) what isnt too sick so people can actually respond to it.

i love a man with dyslexia. learning disabilities are so sexy.
you need a crock pot. never put it on high though, last time i did that the stew meat looked like puppy chow.
your double entendre was most excellent. i should cook the satanist for dinner, since he has had little exposure to the world, he should be quite tender.my next disturbing thread will be posted tonight. ihave to think what a.) wont get me in trouble, and b.) what isnt too sick so people can actually respond to it.
I should probably stop conversating, as i have a paper due in am hour and half that i have to start. Oh well, just a rough draft. Do you seriously have access to a wood chipper? because regardless of how little his winky, i doubt it'll make enough of a difference for him to be able to fit in your crock pot. maybe if you have a wok, but still unlikely. Besides which, i don't think he'd be tender enough. Every fake satanist/tool fan who paints their fingernails black i know would either be waaaaay too marbled or waaaay too stringy. They don't work out. It's a fact. ;)

:sniper: :eek: *screams in horror and runs away* :eek: :eek:

Depends. No, not the adult diaper...the mood. Most days, I scan the topics to see if there is anything of interest (to me), and I usually read all the posts first (not always, just usually), before posting myself. Threads with really biased names pull me in, like "Bush is an idiot" or "a sane view of abortion" or "what's up with homeless people? Get a cardboard box, already!" Some days I take some things more seriously than on other days.

Yes, I believe that it is possible to change SOME people's minds about SOME issues. I like talking on NS about issues I haven't really made my mind up on, to get a new perspective, and even on topics I 'thought' I had figured out, fresh eyes can make it new again. I'll admit it...sometimes I enjoy a really good argument, but in the end it's the people who stay reasonable and defend their position well that get the most respect (nod to Alien Born). Opinions are fine...we all have them, and we can't be grabbing statistics to always back them up, but a reasonable attempt should be made to explain the reasoning behind an opinion, rather than hold that belief as sacrosanct.

Most of all, I love the wide variety of opinion...even the neo-nazi types bring a fresh light to certain subjects (comedic value).

Do I get longwinded? Absolutely (and usually). I'm a fast typist and a faster reader, and I apologise for past and future long posts. Will I stop? Na.

Depends. No, not the adult diaper...the mood. Most days, I scan the topics to see if there is anything of interest (to me), and I usually read all the posts first (not always, just usually), before posting myself. Threads with really biased names pull me in, like "Bush is an idiot" or "a sane view of abortion" or "what's up with homeless people? Get a cardboard box, already!" Some days I take some things more seriously than on other days.

Yes, I believe that it is possible to change SOME people's minds about SOME issues. I like talking on NS about issues I haven't really made my mind up on, to get a new perspective, and even on topics I 'thought' I had figured out, fresh eyes can make it new again. I'll admit it...sometimes I enjoy a really good argument, but in the end it's the people who stay reasonable and defend their position well that get the most respect (nod to Alien Born). Opinions are fine...we all have them, and we can't be grabbing statistics to always back them up, but a reasonable attempt should be made to explain the reasoning behind an opinion, rather than hold that belief as sacrosanct.

Most of all, I love the wide variety of opinion...even the neo-nazi types bring a fresh light to certain subjects (comedic value).

Do I get longwinded? Absolutely (and usually). I'm a fast typist and a faster reader, and I apologise for past and future long posts. Will I stop? Na.

word. :cool:

i like to get someone really serious and pissed off and then screw with there minds a little bit and confuse the shite out of them

The implication was that whilst in general I would say that it was possible to change someone's mind, this forum is largely an exception - hence the shedding of tears of frustration! The inability of certain of its users to understand anything with the slightest subtlety has also been known to upset me.
Obviously, that was too subtle as well...

word. :cool:
you just agreed with her because she used "sacrosanct" in her post!!!!

kidding.
listen, do your soon due paper. it is a duty. as for the black nailpolish in our stew....i think his black lip stick might be worse. lets just cook sinahue. she seems like she would taste pretty damn good.


READERS, IF YOU TAKE ME SERIOUSLY, GO INHALE GROUND GLASS. ITS SMARTER. :D

i enjoy argui-- I mean debate. I think people would be suprised at how many young people come here initially to debate with a very limited "conservative/liberal" worldview, and after just a little while (with a little love and care), they leave as full-fledged "anarcho-communist ideologues with a penchant for Noam Chomsky".

Brings a little warmth to my heart just thinkin' about it. :D

i enjoy argui-- I mean debate. I think people would be suprised at how many young people come here initially to debate with a very limited "conservative/liberal" worldview, and after just a little while (with a little love and care), they leave as full-fledged "anarcho-communist ideologues with a penchant for Noam Chomsky".

Brings a little warmth to my heart just thinkin' about it. :D
yes!! oh yes!!! thats EXACTLY what happened to me!!!! and to think, it was you all along, you devil, you.

yes!! oh yes!!! thats EXACTLY what happened to me!!!! and to think, it was you all along, you devil, you.
Not me!!! I'd blame that one on Neo-Anarchists and Dempublicents!! ;)

you just agreed with her because she used "sacrosanct" in her post!!!!

kidding.
listen, do your soon due paper. it is a duty. as for the black nailpolish in our stew....i think his black lip stick might be worse. lets just cook sinahue. she seems like she would taste pretty damn good.


READERS, IF YOU TAKE ME SERIOUSLY, GO INHALE GROUND GLASS. ITS SMARTER. :D
Actually, i was mostly just agreeing with the long-winded bit. Lord knows I enjoy my wordyness. Though sacrosanct was a nice touch. BTW, if anyone knows the miserable bastard who took the name "Sacrosanctia", well, i'm not actually going to do anything about it, as surrepticiously adding an N seemed to work well. So i"m pretty much refusing to finish that sentence as it was originally planned.
That was disjointed.
As for my paper, i really don't wanna. I might just not go to the class altogether, as i got very little sleep, and have already been to the class i needed to go to. THe paper's a rough draft, and i have selective wirter's block.
As for cannibalism, i can't eat anyone, not until i eat my friend Frank. I already informed him that in an emergency , ANY emergency, he's the first to go. He just looks so tasty. I wonder, no, i guess i couldn't make hime into sushi. Oooh. Jerky. :D

If I can change someone's opinion that's great. One more person with the correct opinion. :) But I'll be honest, I just like to argue. That's why I'm here. My friends grow tired of listening to me quickly.

Here on nationstates i have logged many posts in the month i have been on, not because i spam, but because i think i (usually) have something beneficial (i didn't say postive) to say. There are threads I wont even touch though, because people are remarkably hard headed, and, IMHO, get far too upset.

My question to you is this- When you debate, do you think you can change a persons mind? Are you merely just trying to get others to see how you feel about the issue? Do you just find an argument intoxicating? Have you actually changed a persons mind, or had your view reversed in one of these threads? Comment freely, as this is an area of vast interest to me.
i know i can change people's minds on various subjects, because it's happened before. as a matter of fact, about 6 months ago i was the catalyst for a player's decision to reject the God-model he had believed in up until a debate on these forums; i didn't do this intentionally, per se, i was simply arguing my side, but he informed me that i had convinced him. maybe he was lying, i don't actually know, but that's the feedback i got. i know i have also convinced people in the real world during various discussions, generally when we speak about subjects that i am more informed about.

on the other hand, people have convinced me at least as often. much of the time i am just trying on ideas to see how they fit, and somebody will show me the tears in one idea or another. i also tend to argue points specifically because i am hoping somebody will prove me wrong...i feel the need to test out all my beliefs, to make sure they can stand up to intense scrutiny, and so i really want people to attack them with everything they've got. i don't want to hold beliefs simply because i like them, and i don't think any belief is worth holding unless it can stand up in the face of serious critque.

i like to argue (most of the time), though i am disappointed and embarassed by association when the person i am arguing with loses their head. personal insults, specifically, tend to be the weapon of choice for poor debaters and losing arguments, and i am not interested in flinging about random emotive jibes. if i am in the mood for a childish screaming match i can just tell my lover that SSX Tricky is clearly superior to Tony Hawk 4, and watch as the fur begins to fly :).

i know i can change people's minds on various subjects, because it's happened before. as a matter of fact, about 6 months ago i was the catalyst for a player's decision to reject the God-model he had believed in up until a debate on these forums; i didn't do this intentionally, per se, i was simply arguing my side, but he informed me that i had convinced him. maybe he was lying, i don't actually know, but that's the feedback i got. i know i have also convinced people in the real world during various discussions, generally when we speak about subjects that i am more informed about.

on the other hand, people have convinced me at least as often. much of the time i am just trying on ideas to see how they fit, and somebody will show me the tears in one idea or another. i also tend to argue points specifically because i am hoping somebody will prove me wrong...i feel the need to test out all my beliefs, to make sure they can stand up to intense scrutiny, and so i really want people to attack them with everything they've got. i don't want to hold beliefs simply because i like them, and i don't think any belief is worth holding unless it can stand up in the face of serious critque.

i like to argue (most of the time), though i am disappointed and embarassed by association when the person i am arguing with loses their head. personal insults, specifically, tend to be the weapon of choice for poor debaters and losing arguments, and i am not interested in flinging about random emotive jibes. if i am in the mood for a childish screaming match i can just tell my lover that SSX Tricky is clearly superior to Tony Hawk 4, and watch as the fur begins to fly :).

Well, tricky is the screaming shiznit. Bump, BTW.

you just agreed with her because she used "sacrosanct" in her post!!!!

kidding.
listen, do your soon due paper. it is a duty. as for the black nailpolish in our stew....i think his black lip stick might be worse. lets just cook sinahue. she seems like she would taste pretty damn good.


READERS, IF YOU TAKE ME SERIOUSLY, GO INHALE GROUND GLASS. ITS SMARTER. :D
Occidio, how dare you reduce me to a slab of meat!

Well, I guess if I'm going to be reduced to such, I might as well be yummy....

(Add cumin)

Do you REALLY think you can change a person's mind? Or do you just like to argue?

Perhaps you would like to start a thread for us to discuss that. ;)

in the end it's the people who stay reasonable and defend their position well that get the most respect (nod to Alien Born).

Do I get longwinded? Absolutely (and usually). I'm a fast typist and a faster reader, and I apologise for past and future long posts. Will I stop? Na.

Why, thank you, I am most touched.

I can get pretty long winded, despite not being a fast typist. (I am a pretty fast reader though) Will I stop? See above.

Why, thank you, I am most touched.

I can get pretty long winded, despite not being a fast typist. (I am a pretty fast reader though) Will I stop? See above.
good. bump. :D

well. i changed sinahues mind.....it looks like she isnt pissed at me anymore :D

I got into an argument with a room mate of mine over this. I enjoy arguing over issues, particularly ones involving philosophy and politics. I like to analyze them, to pick them apart, to find the Truth.

However, it seems that the way I carry myself - and the way I speak - belittles those I am trying to have my argument/discussion with. I suppose that in some ways, I'm trying to enlighten the other person(s); that in some cases, I think I have all the answers.

But honestly, I just want to bring knowledge to everyone! If I'm proved wrong, I can admit it, and try to assimilate this new understanding into my persona.

Seems I just come off as a self-absorbed asshole, though. Ah well. :headbang:

I know i will never be able to persuade someone, I just argue because I think it's fun, and actually I have persuaded a few people about certain topics, but thats different, thats in RL and I know their weaknesses.

I dont come here to Debate...I come here to engage conversation with females, get them on a private room...and Cyber all the way to heaven...then start again and again...

Change their mind?...

yes I get them to change their mind...From No...to maybe...from maybe to "hmmmmokay".....from there to "encore...encore"...

does it work? yes all the time.

i can change anyone here's mind... if they stand still and i have a claw hammer... but it probably won't be for the better.