NationStates Jolt Archive

Something tells me without all this divorce, child abuse, and if parents went to eat dinner with their kids every night and actually paid attention to them this stuff wouldnt happen. Why do you think that crime 50-60 years ago was so much lower?

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/

i think it wasnt talked about but it still happened

...because people back then were afraid that their neighbor would turn them in as a communist. Look kids, let's all be a nice, happy family and no one will call us Red.

Uh, yea, I guess.

Could you provide statistics on the crime rates for the time period you want to examine? Especially dealing with the types of crimes you're referring to.

Could you provide statistics on the crime rates for the time period you want to examine? Especially dealing with the types of crimes you're referring to.

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/

It's a myth the crime rates were lower. The world is a far less dangerous place now than it was, but in addition, crime is reported on more than 10 fold more. It was one of the few things Moore had right in Bowling for Columbine.

I never really understood why he said 'People want guns because they feel unsafe. But it's actually safer now than it was. So we should ban guns because they are unsafe' but whatever.

It's a myth the crime rates were lower. The world is a far less dangerous place now than it was, but in addition, crime is reported on more than 10 fold more. It was one of the few things Moore had right in Bowling for Columbine.

I never really understood why he said 'People want guns because they feel unsafe. But it's actually safer now than it was. So we should ban guns because they are unsafe' but whatever.

Yeah well back than you never heard of murder and child abductions and rape. Its just because now with parents and teachers not paying attention to their kids they grow up oppresed.

Yeah well back than you never heard of murder and child abductions and rape. Its just because now with parents and teachers not paying attention to their kids they grow up oppresed.
Or it just wasn't reported. Rape certainly wasn't (and still isn't to a great extent).

It's a myth the crime rates were lower. The world is a far less dangerous place now than it was, but in addition, crime is reported on more than 10 fold more. It was one of the few things Moore had right in Bowling for Columbine.

I never really understood why he said 'People want guns because they feel unsafe. But it's actually safer now than it was. So we should ban guns because they are unsafe' but whatever.

While I'm not a massive fan of Moore's, I'll offer my interpretation of what he meant there:

People in the US are often extremely afraid of their neighbors. We have a history of it. This is what he was showing in Canada, with the open-door policy (There's some of that in small towns, too). They had MORE GUNS than we did, which is a statistic that likely explains why he's still in the NRA. He's not against guns, from what I've seen. He just recognizes that the US isn't as good around guns as Canada is, which is true.

Ironically, Heston, while Moore was a putz in shrugging it off, stated the truth, albeit not very effectively. The US has a lot of violence and a lot of aggression and a lot of fear because we have a great deal of racism (and other issues) running around, in all directions. Every single group seems to be against every other group. Every race has plenty of people against every other race. Sects vs. sects. Philosophies vs. philosophies. Rich vs. Middle Class vs. Poor vs. Welfare. Man vs. woman vs. hermaphrodite vs. other. Homosexual vs. bisexual vs. heterosexual vs. trisexual. Vanilla vs. Chocolate vs Strawberry. Team vs. Team. Game vs. Game. Cigarettes vs. Booze vs. Pot vs. Shrooms.

The Us/Themism in this, and every other country its heavy in, has negative results.

Yeah well back than you never heard of murder and child abductions and rape. Its just because now with parents and teachers not paying attention to their kids they grow up oppresed.
were you alive then? how do you know who heard what? you really cant go by reruns of the andy griffith show

and what makes you think that kids were more closely watched in the past? when i was a kid i went out to play and my parents wouldnt see me til the next meal time. anything could have happened to me and they wouldnt have known it. i dont think my family was any exception for the time (i was born in '57)

While I'm not a massive fan of Moore's, I'll offer my interpretation of what he meant there:

People in the US are often extremely afraid of their neighbors. We have a history of it. This is what he was showing in Canada, with the open-door policy (There's some of that in small towns, too). They had MORE GUNS than we did, which is a statistic that likely explains why he's still in the NRA. He's not against guns, from what I've seen. He just recognizes that the US isn't as good around guns as Canada is, which is true.

Ironically, Heston, while Moore was a putz in shrugging it off, stated the truth, albeit not very effectively. The US has a lot of violence and a lot of aggression and a lot of fear because we have a great deal of racism (and other issues) running around, in all directions. Every single group seems to be against every other group. Every race has plenty of people against every other race. Sects vs. sects. Philosophies vs. philosophies. Rich vs. Middle Class vs. Poor vs. Welfare. Man vs. woman vs. hermaphrodite vs. other. Homosexual vs. bisexual vs. heterosexual vs. trisexual. Vanilla vs. Chocolate vs Strawberry. Team vs. Team. Game vs. Game. Cigarettes vs. Booze vs. Pot vs. Shrooms.

The Us/Themism in this, and every other country its heavy in, has negative results.

Moore is one of the only people in the US that can see the dangerous path the are sliding down. Rampant Racism and facism, a virtual Theocracy, gun violence. Its all terrible.

I hope Moore runs for President in 2008, I know I would vote for him.

Something tells me without all this divorce, child abuse, and if parents went to eat dinner with their kids every night and actually paid attention to them this stuff wouldnt happen. Why do you think that crime 50-60 years ago was so much lower?
So let me get this straight, you're saying that problems such as divorce, child abuse, crime, and violence could all be solved by families eating dinner together? Right.....

I think you're making wildly speculative claims that don't make any sense to justify your nostalgia of a time that didn't even exist. Yeah its different now than it was in the 50's. But it was different in the 50's than it was in the 40's or 30's or any time period before that. Things change, they aways have and always will. Simply saying "Thing used to be better" doesn't help anything at all.

Yeah well back than you never heard of murder and child abductions and rape. Its just because now with parents and teachers not paying attention to their kids they grow up oppresed.
how are kids growing up oppressed because their parents don't pay attention to them... that doesn't even make sense.

and things like that happened, it wasn't reported as often. hell, lots of things like that aren't reported to this day.

For the rise in crime rates, an enormous chunk of the pie can be attributed to the war on drugs.
For non-violent criminals arrested for marijuana alone, these "crimes" account for over 700,000 arrests per year (www.norml.org).
Many more murder and theft arrests are directly caused by the shadow market this "war" has created (400 billion dollars per year worldwide).

Crime rates were about the same during Prohibition as well.

Why do you think that crime 50-60 years ago was so much lower?

http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/

mainly they weren't. many types of crime were vastly under-reported back then. additionally, we have since started various "war on whatevers", which amount to creating new crimes (and therefore new criminals) as well as harsher enforcement.

any actual increase in crime is almost certainly traceable to the decaying urban centers and the falling wages that have been a feature of american society for decades.

mainly they weren't. many types of crime were vastly under-reported back then. additionally, we have since started various "war on whatevers", which amount to creating new crimes (and therefore new criminals) as well as harsher enforcement.

any actual increase in crime is almost certainly traceable to the decaying urban centers and the falling wages that have been a feature of american society for decades.
not only that, but most child abductions are done by the non custodial parent after a divorce. when there was no divorce, there were no non custodial parents to abuct a child. they all just lived in misery

no one would ever report a rape 50 years ago if it werent utterly forced upon them. no parent would believe that grandpa was touching little johnny.

additionally, we have since started various "war on whatevers", which amount to creating new crimes (and therefore new criminals) as well as harsher enforcement.
Unfortunately, when you turn things that aren't criminal into real crimes, you create very real criminals.
History repeats itself.

Unfortunately, when you turn things that aren't criminal into real crimes, you create very real criminals.
History repeats itself.

In other words, legalize it.

In other words, legalize it.
Or better yet, decriminalize and regulate it, like alcohol and tobacco.
You see, dealers aren't checking ID's. Weed is easier to get for high school students than a 6 pack.

Or better yet, decriminalize and regulate it, like alcohol and tobacco.
You see, dealers aren't checking ID's. Weed is easier to get for high school students than a 6 pack.

Oh I know.

Yeah well back than you never heard of murder and child abductions and rape. Its just because now with parents and teachers not paying attention to their kids they grow up oppresed.
hey kids, it's Fun Facts and Reality Time!

FACT: over 85% of child rapes are perpetrated by a heterosexual male who is in some way related to the victim (father, uncle, stepfather, boyfriend of child's mother, etc). of the remaining cases, about 10% are perpetrated by a teacher, priest, coach, or person known to both the child and the child's family.

FACT: a child in America is more likely to be beaten by a family member than to be beaten by any stranger, including peers on the playground.

FACT: the most common reason why a woman in America will be in the emergency room is because her lover or husband is beating her.

FACT: the majority of reported child abductions are cases in which one parent or guardian kidnaps the child from the other parent or guardian.

tell us again how the magic pill for murder, rape, and violence is to have quaint family dinners.

well, uh, maybe after having a good dinner, maybe that family member will change his/her mind about raping them...?