NationStates Jolt Archive

Well, I don't know how to expand on a sentence that says it all for me. Other than that California, Canada, and the U.S. would be placed in a VERY awkward diplomatic position.

Who to wage war on? California? Canada? Both? Bomb Iran in the mean time?

Well, I don't know how to expand on a sentence that says it all for me. Other than that California, Canada, and the U.S. would be placed in a VERY awkward diplomatic position.

Who to wage war on? California? Canada? Both? Bomb Iran in the mean time?
Invade California, bomb Luxembourg. They know what they did.

I think Washington and Oregon are close enough to us politically to join as well - lets all get together, light up a rocket, hold hands and have a love-in!!

Yayayayayaya!! and I can then drive sans-border all the way to Mexico!!!

Here I come Rosie's taco's!!! (San Jose del Cabo - check it out!!) :D

If I were Canadian and this happened, I would be pretty cheesed off, as California has a higher population than all of Canada, and they could pretty much take over the government without even trying, especially if Oregon and Washington also joined Canada.

I think Washington and Oregon are close enough to us politically to join as well - lets all get together, light up a rocket, hold hands and have a love-in!!

Yayayayayaya!! and I can then drive sans-border all the way to Mexico!!!

Here I come Rosie's taco's!!! (San Jose del Cabo - check it out!!) :D
RomeW's sig...

http://threepeas.net/snow/images/new_map.jpg

RomeW's sig...

http://threepeas.net/snow/images/new_map.jpg

I like it!
We just need Alaska It looks so lonely being, part of the U.S:p

Well, I don't know how to expand on a sentence that says it all for me. Other than that California, Canada, and the U.S. would be placed in a VERY awkward diplomatic position.

Who to wage war on? California? Canada? Both? Bomb Iran in the mean time?

only the state of texas was the ability to vote to break away from the union. should another state attempt to do it, there would be serious repercussions (see US Civil War).

It would be a great day for Canada and for California and whichever other states had the presence of mind to follow suit.

RomeW's sig...

http://threepeas.net/snow/images/new_map.jpg
It's beautiful!!!! *wipes a joyous tear from his eye* We must start on this annexation at once! :fluffle:

Would Arnie still be the governor, if California moved to Canada. He's not Canadian after all.

If I want to live in Canada, I will go to it, not the other way around!

It's not beautiful. It's not.

I like my women of the non-plastic / non-bitch kind, annex Cali and they're all gonna head north, a frightening thought to say the least.

On the other hand, why don't you take Alberta off our hands? We don't want em.

Would Arnie still be the governor, if California moved to Canada. He's not Canadian after all.

We can employ him as some sort of sideshow / circus freak.

RomeW's sig...

http://threepeas.net/snow/images/new_map.jpg

The maps incorrect, texas would be floating alone in the atlantic bearing the label
"Awesomeland" or
"The Empire of Texas"

yea, we in the south tryed that a while back, but it didn't work out too well, maybe we should try it again....

We can employ him as some sort of sideshow / circus freak.

Like make him Prime Minister :p

The maps incorrect, texas would be floating alone in the atlantic bearing the label
"Awesomeland" or
"The Empire of Texas"

I believe native texans prefer "The Republic of Texas"

RomeW's sig...

http://threepeas.net/snow/images/new_map.jpg
*snicker* I could see it happening! :D

Here's a weirder thought, what if California voted to be a province of Canada?

Refer to the document signed at Appomattox Court House, Virginia on 9 April, 1865 for the answer to this question.

Refer to the document signed at Appomattox Court House, Virginia on 9 April, 1865 for the answer to this question.
Link?

It's not beautiful. It's not.

I like my women of the non-plastic / non-bitch kind, annex Cali and they're all gonna head north, a frightening thought to say the least.

On the other hand, why don't you take Alberta off our hands? We don't want em.
hey- no generalizations. i am made of flesh, 100%. and whats wrong with Alberta? i have them to be the most entertaining of people..... what about PE islanders? now those are the people that you dont want.

[QUOTE=Occidio Multus]hey- no generalizations. i am made of flesh, 100%.[QUOTE]

I'm just stereotyping, don't take offence, none intended.


I saw another version of the 'jesusland' map that included Alberta into jesusland. I'm trying to find it now...

[QUOTE=Occidio Multus]hey- no generalizations. i am made of flesh, 100%.[QUOTE]

I'm just stereotyping, don't take offence, none intended.


I saw another version of the 'jesusland' map that included Alberta into jesusland. I'm trying to find it now...
i know you were kidding. but i meant it about alberta. what do you see wrong with it?

only the state of texas was the ability to vote to break away from the union. should another state attempt to do it, there would be serious repercussions (see US Civil War).
Is that a threat?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Newnewmap.jpg

What's wrong with Alberta?

Keeping it short:
-It is the birthplace of the Reform/Alliance/Conservative (or whatever the name of the day may be, they can't seem to make up their minds) party.
-Ralf Klein.
-Look at their voting track record and you'll see they have more in common with the US than with Canada. Seriously.

Nothing against the Albertain people, just like any other place on earth they have their share of good people and assholes.

Albertans will always be more Canadian then Californians ever will be. Even if they did join us, it would really shift the political landscape towards favoring the southeast. Then there's all the debunking that needs to be done to get their brains away from eagles and stripes towards leafs and beavers. On the plus side, I could eat grapes 24/7. I'd love that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Newnewmap.jpg

What's wrong with Alberta?

Keeping it short:
-It is the birthplace of the Reform/Alliance/Conservative (or whatever the name of the day may be, they can't seem to make up their minds) party.
-Ralf Klein.
-Look at their voting track record and you'll see they have more in common with the US than with Canada. Seriously.

Nothing against the Albertain people, just like any other place on earth they have their share of good people and assholes.


Can the US have it then? It sounds cool.

Seedless grapes are a good thing.

Ofcourse I would never actually advocate them joining us, and as much as Ralfy annoys me, Alberta is part of Canada.

US Democrats = Canadian Conservatives

All I ask if that if you take CA, you let me flee there as well!

It would really help Canada's agricultural industry. And it would really hurt the U.S.'s agriculture. It would hurt US trade through the Pacific due to the lack of an easy path south of the Rocky Mountains. Canada's largest naval base would be in San Diego. There would be a lot of Mexicans in Canada

I don't think Canada would be -too- sad about gaining the world's fifth largest economy, great trade waters, and more direct access to the southern half of America.

However, as much as the middle states hate us, they'd never let our money go.

Here's a weirder thought, what if California voted to be a province of Canada?
Refer to the document signed at Appomattox Court House, Virginia on 9 April, 1865 for the answer to this question.
Link?
Appomattox was where Lee surrendered to Grant to end the American Civil War and settle once and for all the question of whether or not states can leave the union.

yea, we in the south tryed that a while back, but it didn't work out too well, maybe we should try it again....

This time we have like 90% of the military bases and like 2/3's of the armed services.

Plus, with all the gun control, it's not like most northern states could even take the civilian population of the south on.

If I were Canadian and this happened, I would be pretty cheesed off, as California has a higher population than all of Canada, and they could pretty much take over the government without even trying, especially if Oregon and Washington also joined Canada.

No worries there...once they get a taste of that BC Bud, they won't remember they were ever Americans, and peace would reign supreme.

http://threepeas.net/snow/images/new_map.jpg

Works for me.

It can't. There, that's simple. It's illegal for a state to leave the union.

Would Arnie still be the governor, if California moved to Canada. He's not Canadian after all.

He wouldn't be governor anymore. He'd be prime Minister of the province of California. And he would technically become Canadian, if California became a province.

It's not beautiful. It's not.

I like my women of the non-plastic / non-bitch kind, annex Cali and they're all gonna head north, a frightening thought to say the least.

On the other hand, why don't you take Alberta off our hands? We don't want em.


Actually you do since we are 25% of the federal budget.

I am sure the states would want alberta, probably the only province they would want. Maybe ontario and perhaps BC as well, but the rest of the country is full of socialist hippies, fishermen, farmers and retarded french people.

With alberta the states would sudddenly have the 2nd largest oil supply in the world + a very strong little economy that pumps out about 15 billion a year in a surplus. (USD)

I would call this new nation calicandia

Well Alaska is a state in the US and its distance from the rest of the US is comparable to the distance of California to Canada so I can see it makes sense.

[...]retarded french people.


Thanks for sharing your prejudice.

You know, that kind of attitude is why many Québécois wanted to separate in the first place. Luckily, I like to think you only represent a minority of Canadians.

He wouldn't be governor anymore. He'd be prime Minister of the province of California. And he would technically become Canadian, if California became a province. Actually he'd be the Premier of the Province of California. Prime Minister is the leader of the country. I don't think we have any rules stating that the PM needs to be born in Canada do we?

Well, I don't know how to expand on a sentence that says it all for me. Other than that California, Canada, and the U.S. would be placed in a VERY awkward diplomatic position.

Who to wage war on? California? Canada? Both? Bomb Iran in the mean time?

Don't scare yourself, but if you look at that red/blue state thing on the county level, most of California's surface area is red.

They elected Arnold, didn't they?

Parts of some of the urban centers would want to join Canada, but most of the state would not.

Remember what happened the last time someone tried to secede from the United States during a Republican administration?

Remember what happened the last time someone tried to secede from the United States during a Republican administration?

Remember what happened the last time someone tried to seced from the US during a Democrat administration? ;)

Damn, why are you so damn partisan? You honestly see yourself as more Republican than American, and you see half the country as some other nationality. Just like a lot of Democrats too. Both parties, man... get over yourselves, its tiring.

Actually he'd be the Premier of the Province of California. Prime Minister is the leader of the country. I don't think we have any rules stating that the PM needs to be born in Canada do we?

I don't think we have any such laws, no. Who would care anyway? Anyone who's lived long enough in Canada to call it his home can be prime Minister if you ask me.

So in anglophone provinces you call them "Premier"? Interesting. The reason I said he'd be prime Minister of California is because here in Québec, we have a federal AND a provincial Prime Minister.

I don't think we have any such laws, no. Who would care anyway? Anyone who's lived long enough in Canada to call it his home can be prime Minister if you ask me.

So in anglophone provinces you call them "Premier"? Interesting. The reason I said he'd be prime Minister of California is because here in Québec, we have a federal AND a provincial Prime Minister.
Actually, we call him "premier" in english and "prime minister" in french. The French language has no distinction between the provincial and federal denomination.

It can't. There, that's simple. It's illegal for a state to leave the union.

I thought the US was a fedral system, where power starts at a state level and is then given to the central gov, not the other way around. If a state refuses to grant power to the central government it becomes an independent nation does it not? (I'm not saying it would happen, just asking isnt that how it works)

Thanks for sharing your prejudice.

You know, that kind of attitude is why many Québécois wanted to separate in the first place. Luckily, I like to think you only represent a minority of Canadians.


Well i dont think that would such a terrible thing IMO, the rest of canada has always carried quebec.

I thought the US was a fedral system, where power starts at a state level and is then given to the central gov, not the other way around. If a state refuses to grant power to the central government it becomes an independent nation does it not? (I'm not saying it would happen, just asking isnt that how it works)


That's the way it was in 1785. It is no longer that way.

It's not beautiful. It's not.

I like my women of the non-plastic / non-bitch kind, annex Cali and they're all gonna head north, a frightening thought to say the least.

Why on earth would they head north? Do you honestly think someone would leave, say, San Diego to live in your frozen wasteland?

Well i dont think that would such a terrible thing IMO, the rest of canada has always carried quebec.
Nonsense!

It's true nowadays that we recieve more than we give to the federal, but it was always so. Besides, you can say that we milk the federal for every cents they're willing to give us.

Also, our biggest problem in Quebec is redundancy. Everything the federal puts forth, we do again because of the sacrosanct principles on provincial jurisdiction. The federal inplants a GST, we put forth a QST. The federal gives money to non-worker? We do the same! And so on, and so forth. If we got rid of all that doubling, we'd be on par with Alberta.

That's the way it was in 1785. It is no longer that way.

Its still a federal governement is it not (oppisite to a unitary government?) How does it work now?

Well i dont think that would such a terrible thing IMO, the rest of canada has always carried quebec.

Yes, that's why Québec has been one of the two founding provinces of Canada, along with Ontario. From which we inherited half of their debt, thanks to the british deciding we should help pay in equal parts for the good of the new nation.

You really think Canada can just go along and lose 1/4 of it's population just because some ignorant fool like you is prejudiced against francophones?

I believe the rest of Canada should be thanking us instead of throwing rocks. The bloc may be stuck in eternal opposition, but we're the reason the conservatives will never be in power anytime soon, except perhaps in a minority government.

Yes, that's why Québec has been one of the two founding provinces of Canada, along with Ontario. From which we inherited half of their debt, thanks to the british deciding we should help pay in equal parts for the good of the new nation.

You really think Canada can just go along and lose 1/4 of it's population just because some ignorant fool like you is prejudiced against francophones?

I believe the rest of Canada should be thanking us instead of throwing rocks. The bloc may be stuck in eternal opposition, but we're the reason the conservatives will never be in power anytime soon, except perhaps in a minority government.
Psst... He comes from Alberta.
He hopes for the conservative to win.
Your argument helps him in his mind.

Psst...don't pay any attention to Jayastan. He's one of those Albertans who think that just because they're a 'Have' province now, they must always have been. They convieniently forget when other provinces used to shovel money their way to get their oil and gas industry going. And now that it is, some Albertans think they have the right to thumb their noses at everyone else.

Nonsense!

It's true nowadays that we recieve more than we give to the federal, but it was always so. Besides, you can say that we milk the federal for every cents they're willing to give us.

Also, our biggest problem in Quebec is redundancy. Everything the federal puts forth, we do again because of the sacrosanct principles on provincial jurisdiction. The federal inplants a GST, we put forth a QST. The federal gives money to non-worker? We do the same! And so on, and so forth. If we got rid of all that doubling, we'd be on par with Alberta.


No you wouldnt

I think that the rest of the US would be sad to see us go, considering that we make up 13% of the nation's gross domestic product and have the sixth largest economy in the world.

Psst...don't pay any attention to Jayastan. He's one of those Albertans who think that just because they're a 'Have' province now, they must always have been. They convieniently forget when other provinces used to shovel money their way to get their oil and gas industry going. And now that it is, some Albertans think they have the right to thumb their noses at everyone else.


Hello? In the last 50 years, the federal government has given more money to alberta than it has received 7 times. Those years were in the mid 80s after the NEP. The NEP was created by the fucking federal government asshole.

How did the government start up anything in alberta? The oil and gas industry was entirely formed by private business, get your facts straight retards.

No you wouldnt
And how, pray tell, do you come to that conclusion?

I think that the rest of the US would be sad to see us go, considering that we make up 13% of the nation's gross domestic product and have the sixth largest economy in the world.


Thats not unlike alberta's GDP approaching the GDP of all of quebec, when alberta has a quarter of the population.


ACTUALLY!!! we will trade you quebec for cali, straight up!

Hello? In the last 50 years, the federal government has given more money to alberta than it has received 7 times. Those years were in the mid 80s after the NEP. The NEP was created by the fucking federal government asshole.

How did the government start up anything in alberta? The oil and gas industry was entirely formed by private business, get your facts straight retards.
These kind of ad hominem attacks combined with your racial slurs really paint you in a bad light, man.

Remember what happened the last time someone tried to seced from the US during a Democrat administration? ;)

Damn, why are you so damn partisan? You honestly see yourself as more Republican than American, and you see half the country as some other nationality. Just like a lot of Democrats too. Both parties, man... get over yourselves, its tiring.


The whole theme of this thread from the beginning was partisan.

Abraham Lincoln was..... a Republican!

There haven't been any other secession attempts since then.

Canada IS another nationality though.

And how, pray tell, do you come to that conclusion?


Well lack of business, employment, industry comes to mind.

Isnt quebec or rather montreal doing "GREAT" now? What with its 8% unemployment and all...

Abraham Lincoln was..... a Republican!

And the republican of those days were the liberal party. If Lincoln was alive today, he would be a democrat.

:rolleyes:

These kind of ad hominem attacks combined with your racial slurs really paint you in a bad light, man.


If you say so, pretty hard to whine about me calling people lazy french when you know its true.

People in quebec have a very over valued sense of what that province's value is.

8% unemployment, 25 years of sucking cash out of canada, tends to annoy people. Crap like booing the american national athem at hockey games and the like paints the province of quebec in a bad light.

And the republican of those days were the liberal party. If Lincoln was alive today, he would be a democrat.

:rolleyes:
Republicans of those days weren't a liberal party. It was Northern conservatism vs Southern conservatism.

If you say so, pretty hard to whine about me calling people lazy french when you know its true.
Actually, I know it's not true. Your racism is showing.
Beisdes, how in the blue hell did you manage to *know* I "know it's true". Are you some kind of God? A psychic? Do tell..

People in quebec have a very over valued sense of what that province's value is.
And Albertans, based on your comments, do too. We can swing poo at each other all day long, it won't change nothing.

8% unemployment, 25 years of sucking cash out of canada, tends to annoy people. Crap like booing the american national athem at hockey games and the like paints the province of quebec in a bad light.
I'll grant you the booing of the national anthem was crass. It came from years of frustrations and recent souring of the Canada-Us relations, but it was inexcusable.

If you want to be annoyed at people sucking cash out of Canada, I'll redirect you to the maritimes. Besides, we have 25% of the population, it's normal that we get a big chunk of the federal grants.

Hello? In the last 50 years, the federal government has given more money to alberta than it has received 7 times. Those years were in the mid 80s after the NEP. The NEP was created by the fucking federal government asshole.

How did the government start up anything in alberta? The oil and gas industry was entirely formed by private business, get your facts straight retards.

Taken from a Frazer Institute article:The federal government finances industrial development programs in Canada’s poorer regions by transferring monies out of its more prosperous regions. This is what happened on behalf of Alberta from 1957 to 1964 when the oil and gas industries were getting their development kickstarts.

Call it what you will: industrial development programs, corporate welfare, or whatever phrase you prefer. The private oil and gas industry in Alberta did not do it on its own. Yet, now that Albertans reap the benefits of a successful equalization program, many of you mock provinces that haven't been so lucky. Oh, and by the way, Alberta was lucky in many ways: the obvious way is the oil and gas reserves, but the other way that they received their payments before the era of clawbacks. Thus, revenue generated by oil and gas during the period you received equalization wasn't clawed back by Ottawa, but allowed to go back into the industry. Provinces who are only now developing their oil and gas capabilites (such as Saskatchewan, Nfld, and Nova Scotia) have the federal government currently taking back about 70 cents in equalization for every dollar in energy royalties.

And please don't call me an idiot. It should be obvious to you that I am not, despite the fact I am disagreeing with you. You may continue to call me an asshole if you really feel the need, but I prefer bitch.

Actually, I know it's not true. Your racism is showing.
Beisdes, how in the blue hell did you manage to *know* I "know it's true". Are you some kind of God? A psychic? Do tell..


And Albertans, based on your comments, do too. We can swing poo at each other all day long, it won't change nothing.


I'll grant you the booing of the national anthem was crass. It came from years of frustrations and recent souring of the Canada-Us relations, but it was inexcusable.

If you want to be annoyed at people sucking cash out of Canada, I'll redirect you to the maritimes. Besides, we have 25% of the population, it's normal that we get a big chunk of the federal grants.


Nope the maritimers do have a excuse, the provinces in that area have very limited natural resourses and industry. Besides, we have only 2 million of them and they tend to move and get jobs in places like alberta, BC and ontario.

Quebec has almost as much natural resourse value as alberta. They have highly developed manufacturing unlike the maritimes. Yet the province sucks out the vast majority of the money out of canada.

And i know exactly the value of albertains compared to quebecers. Right now 1 albertain = 3 quebecers, soon to be 4 to 1. Shouldnt be so but it is.

Alberta's GDP will soon be EQUAL to that of quebecs, while alberta has 1/4 the population.

Provinces who are only now developing their oil and gas capabilites (such as Saskatchewan, Nfld, and Nova Scotia) have the federal government currently taking back about 70 cents in equalization for every dollar in energy royalties.


Man, no wonder development of the industry is so slow in Canada. I always though it was because you guys were just bone idle, but it turns out you have a communist government.

Imagine how rich Canada could be if the government stopped stealing that money.

Taken from a Frazer Institute article:The federal government finances industrial development programs in Canada’s poorer regions by transferring monies out of its more prosperous regions. This is what happened on behalf of Alberta from 1957 to 1964 when the oil and gas industries were getting their development kickstarts.

Call it what you will: industrial development programs, corporate welfare, or whatever phrase you prefer. The private oil and gas industry in Alberta did not do it on its own. Yet, now that Albertans reap the benefits of a successful equalization program, many of you mock provinces that haven't been so lucky. Oh, and by the way, Alberta was lucky in many ways: the obvious way is the oil and gas reserves, but the other way that they received their payments before the era of clawbacks. Thus, revenue generated by oil and gas during the period you received equalization wasn't clawed back by Ottawa, but allowed to go back into the industry. Provinces who are only now developing their oil and gas capabilites (such as Saskatchewan, Nfld, and Nova Scotia) have the federal government currently taking back about 70 cents in equalization for every dollar in energy royalties.

And please don't call me an idiot. It should be obvious to you that I am not, despite the fact I am disagreeing with you. You may continue to call me an asshole if you really feel the need, but I prefer bitch.


True, but the monies invested were VERY limited back then, how limited are the monies invested into quebec? ARe they funding industry? Gee i think not, twist another quote a little better in the future.

And to think that those limited start up funds built the oil + gas industry is fucking nuts.

Also dont forget programs like the NEP which almost wiped out the industry here in alberta.

I am not against funding provinces like the maritimes which have limited resourses to begin with.

Quebec has LOTS of resourses, lots of heavy industry. We should NOT be sending transfer payments to that province.

What the monies alberta is sending is paying for are social services for quebec, such as nationalized day care and a drug plan, that is BULLSHIT.

Its still a federal governement is it not (oppisite to a unitary government?) How does it work now?

Well, after the Civil War, there were several Amendments to the Constitution and some changes in interpretation of the existing ones.

Now it's Federal government has all power it wants, State's get what's left over.

Man, no wonder development of the industry is so slow in Canada. I always though it was because you guys were just bone idle, but it turns out you have a communist government.

Imagine how rich Canada could be if the government stopped stealing that money.

welll a little over the top dude, but the government is a little too socialist in my view...

Well, I don't know how to expand on a sentence that says it all for me. Other than that California, Canada, and the U.S. would be placed in a VERY awkward diplomatic position.

Who to wage war on? California? Canada? Both? Bomb Iran in the mean time?

Well leagally we cannot have another province without a refendum that would fail...so we could accept Cali as a territory, that way it would only get one seat in the house and one seat in the sentat. But the crime levels in California are totally unacceptable, so they are not ready to join confederation.

Man, no wonder development of the industry is so slow in Canada. I always though it was because you guys were just bone idle, but it turns out you have a communist government.

Imagine how rich Canada could be if the government stopped stealing that money.


LOL, YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT...THATS FUNNY HA HA HA.....ha ha....ha

Canadas economy is in the best condition of any G8 nation, and the inquiry by the opposition here has cost almost half the scandal itself.

If you consider the Canadian way communit you are an idiot.

LOL, YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT...THATS FUNNY HA HA HA.....ha ha....ha

Canadas economy is in the best condition of any G8 nation, and the inquiry by the opposition here has cost almost half the scandal itself.

If you consider the Canadian way communit you are an idiot.


no the scandal created by the corrupt liberals caused the scandal. And we should be far and away in the best shape.

What will happen when our oil runs out? We should be planning for that and taking chunks out of the debt, instead of spending now...

no the scandal created by the corrupt liberals caused the scandal. And we should be far and away in the best shape.

What will happen when our oil runs out? We should be planning for that and taking chunks out of the debt, instead of spending now...

We are. By law, any surplus in the budget must go towards paying down the debt. That's one reason the Liberals have been under-estimating the surplus for the last decade or so - it's not just incompetence. It gives them an excuse to not give tax cuts, not budget the surplus away into healthcare (etc), and when they (surprise) find they had a larger budger than they expected, it all goes to paying down the debt.

And they've gotten away with it until this year, when suddenly everyone noticed they underestimated the budget surplus by 4-5 times. Not that they'll do anything different when they lay down this year's budget on the 23rd.

Not so sure about California, but I'd gladly take Washington, Oregon, Idaho, Montana, Michigan, Wisconsin, Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine.

no the scandal created by the corrupt liberals caused the scandal. And we should be far and away in the best shape.

What will happen when our oil runs out? We should be planning for that and taking chunks out of the debt, instead of spending now...

The liberals have the national debt to GDP ratio down to 42% from 68% where the conservativs left it. You just can't seem to proove in any way that the liberals are corrupt can you ?

We are. By law, any surplus in the budget must go towards paying down the debt. That's one reason the Liberals have been under-estimating the surplus for the last decade or so - it's not just incompetence. It gives them an excuse to not give tax cuts, not budget the surplus away into healthcare (etc), and when they (surprise) find they had a larger budger than they expected, it all goes to paying down the debt.

And they've gotten away with it until this year, when suddenly everyone noticed they underestimated the budget surplus by 4-5 times. Not that they'll do anything different when they lay down this year's budget on the 23rd.


Dude thats bullshit, you should say any surplus not BUDGETED, will go to the debt. :rolleyes:

We are. By law, any surplus in the budget must go towards paying down the debt. That's one reason the Liberals have been under-estimating the surplus for the last decade or so - it's not just incompetence. It gives them an excuse to not give tax cuts, not budget the surplus away into healthcare (etc), and when they (surprise) find they had a larger budger than they expected, it all goes to paying down the debt.

And they've gotten away with it until this year, when suddenly everyone noticed they underestimated the budget surplus by 4-5 times. Not that they'll do anything different when they lay down this year's budget on the 23rd.

Paul Martin and Ralph Goodale will save Canadians money this way. You do know that just supporting the debt is where 30% of the governments yearly budget goes. So when the debt is gone, the dollar will be strong, inflation will stop, and people will pay less taxes because that 30% will be gone.

On states that can legally seccede, I believe Vermont has that right in addition to Texas. Vermont had to approve its continued existence as a US state every so often if I recall correctly.

On states that can legally seccede, I believe Vermont has that right in addition to Texas. Vermont had to approve its continued existence as a US state every so often if I recall correctly.

I'd love it if one day, Vermont just showed up and dropped off a resignation at the White House. "Yeah, we're kinda tired of the whole United States thing".

I'd love it if one day, Vermont just showed up and dropped off a resignation at the White House. "Yeah, we're kinda tired of the whole United States thing".
:D

Dude thats bullshit, you should say any surplus not BUDGETED, will go to the debt. :rolleyes:

Sigh. Look it up Jayastan. Surplus is unbudgeted money. It's the left over money you have when you tax more than you spend.

I repeat, Canada has a law that says budget surplus must go to paying off the national debt.

Paul Martin and Ralph Goodale will save Canadians money this way. You do know that just supporting the debt is where 30% of the governments yearly budget goes. So when the debt is gone, the dollar will be strong, inflation will stop, and people will pay less taxes because that 30% will be gone.

I did the math on it last March. Even if we have $10 billion dollar surpluses every year, it'll take the rest of my life to bring our national debt to zero. But I agree - this has to be done. Giving out tax cuts and minimizing the amount we pay on debt kills us on interest payments. Much as it hurts my pocketbook and bank account, Canada's economy is healthier in the long run because we are being responsible and paying down the debt.

I'd love it if one day, Vermont just showed up and dropped off a resignation at the White House. "Yeah, we're kinda tired of the whole United States thing".

www.vermontcanada.org

I did the math on it last March. Even if we have $10 billion dollar surpluses every year, it'll take the rest of my life to bring our national debt to zero. But I agree - this has to be done. Giving out tax cuts and minimizing the amount we pay on debt kills us on interest payments. Much as it hurts my pocketbook and bank account, Canada's economy is healthier in the long run because we are being responsible and paying down the debt.

HERE HERE, ESURING THAT OUR CHILDREN CAN LIVE BETTER LIVES THOUGH OUR SACRIFICE, THATS THE CANADIAN WAY!

HERE HERE, ESURING THAT OUR CHILDREN CAN LIVE BETTER LIVES THOUGH OUR SACRIFICE, THATS THE CANADIAN WAY!

well, not the shouting about it bit... ;)

Sigh. Look it up Jayastan. Surplus is unbudgeted money. It's the left over money you have when you tax more than you spend.

I repeat, Canada has a law that says budget surplus must go to paying off the national debt.


and again the liberals use a loop hole by increasing spending before getting the surplus, look that up..

Gee how much has spending gone up in the past 5 years? I think it would outpace inflation...

and again the liberals use a loop hole by increasing spending before getting the surplus, look that up..

Gee how much has spending gone up in the past 5 years? I think it would outpace inflation...

Spending is slowly increasing because of political pressure from the provinces and the opposition parties, including the Conservatives and Stephen Harper, to return funding to areas like education, healthcare, and the military, which the Liberals slashed after they took office after Mulrooney's PC's got wiped off the map.

After the Liberals began to have back-to-back surpluses they couldn't just keep telling the provinces that there wasn't any more money for transfer payments, etc.

The Liberal budget slashing of the 90's means that municipalities and provinces have crumbling services and infrastructure. It's the price we pay for the overspending of Trudeau and Mulrooney and others. Services and infrastructure all need to be rebuilt. Our population is growing. It's not surprising that our budget is growing as well. But the point is, the surplus is growing every year as well, so at least they recognize that they need to have revenue before they spend, and that they need to pay off the national credit cards before the lenders stop lending.

Jayastan, just what is it you're mad about? First you complain about not paying off the national debt. I explain that we have a law that requires the surplus to pay it down. Now you're complaining that sometimes the budget gets increased before the surplus is announced. Yes, that's where Canada's contignency funds come in. They help to pay for unexpected expenses, like the SARS outbreak in Toronto. Yes, part of the surplus has to also go back into refilling the contingency fund, but jeez Jayastan, that's what contigency funds are for! Wouldn't we look awfully stupid if we didn't have money put aside for emergencies?

Spending is slowly increasing because of political pressure from the provinces and the opposition parties, including the Conservatives and Stephen Harper, to return funding to areas like education, healthcare, and the military, which the Liberals slashed after they took office after Mulrooney's PC's got wiped off the map.

After the Liberals began to have back-to-back surpluses they couldn't just keep telling the provinces that there wasn't any more money for transfer payments, etc.

The Liberal budget slashing of the 90's means that municipalities and provinces have crumbling services and infrastructure. It's the price we pay for the overspending of Trudeau and Mulrooney and others. Services and infrastructure all need to be rebuilt. Our population is growing. It's not surprising that our budget is growing as well. But the point is, the surplus is growing every year as well, so at least they recognize that they need to have revenue before they spend, and that they need to pay off the national credit cards before the lenders stop lending.

Jayastan, just what is it you're mad about? First you complain about not paying off the national debt. I explain that we have a law that requires the surplus to pay it down. Now you're complaining that sometimes the budget gets increased before the surplus is announced. Yes, that's where Canada's contignency funds come in. They help to pay for unexpected expenses, like the SARS outbreak in Toronto. Yes, part of the surplus has to also go back into refilling the contingency fund, but jeez Jayastan, that's what contigency funds are for! Wouldn't we look awfully stupid if we didn't have money put aside for emergencies?


ummmmmmm your not listening to what i said, you ramble on while my point is simple. That law is BS, as the feds could just budget the surplus to nothing.

Canada, should have 20 billion dollar surpluses not 5 ~ 6 they have now with all the spending increases to crap like national day care or gun registries or other crap programs...

ummmmmmm your not listening to what i said, you ramble on while my point is simple. That law is BS, as the feds could just budget the surplus to nothing.

Canada, should have 20 billion dollar surpluses not 5 ~ 6 they have now with all the spending increases to crap like national day care or gun registries or other crap programs...

But they don't budget it all the way out, do they? We've had 8 consecutive budget surpluses, most over 5 billion.

Now I agree that they could be much more fiscally responsible - what government couldn't? - but man, you're just not happy about anything. Every other country in the G8 has got budget deficits and trade deficits out the ying-yang. Come on, the Liberal government has got plenty of faults, but they are doing some things right. I'm even further west than you are Jayastan, and even I can see that.