NationStates Jolt Archive

America will fall at some time. I'm not saying it will happen anytime soon, I have no idea when it will happen but it will. And when it does happen who do you think will replace them as the world's top dog and more to the point, why do you think that. I think its going to be Brtain. Not just because I am a Brit but right now our economy is supiror to the rest of Europe and America (in terms of growth) and politicaly we are more world widely respected than America (I believe America is more feared than respected) and our armies know how to win the battle for hearts and minds that the American's cannot (Despite patrolling a larger sector of Iraq with smaller numbers of troops, the British army have suffered far less attacks by insurgents than have the Americans).

Russia. A bunch of hairy people in Siberia living on only Vodka are supermen who are too hardy to be killed.

It could well be China. They have the biggest army in the world and their economy is extremely strong.
I don't want to say what I think about the british army.

Probably China, unfortunately.

Europe as a whole if Britain gets more involved. Britain and France even have nukes. And it is a collection of strong nations which is already challenging America as a superpower. But without Britain more involved it sucks with Germany and France the only real powers backing it.

China. Europe is in decline and China is rising spectacularly right now.

Edit : Siljhouettes, wtf happened?

Eire , with thier guiness and pies they'll be sure to take over the world.


and the Meek

Eire , with thier guiness and pies they'll be sure to take over the world.


and the Meek

Guiness?. Terrible stuff. I'll stick with my English beer.

Also. I'm rather disappointed how many countries have failed to nuke each other. So many stand offs.

Europe in decline? yeah right, the euro is rising. It just got ten new member states. I don't really see any reason why I should believe that Europe is declining.

China and Russia aren't that bad, but then I think it's really a close call between Europe (as a whole), Russia or China.

Europe in decline? yeah right, the euro is rising. It just got ten new member states. I don't really see any reason why I should believe that Europe is declining.

China and Russia aren't that bad, but then I think it's really a close call between Europe (as a whole), Russia or China.

Russia aren't that spectacular now. And what about India. They're rising faster than China.

Europe in decline? yeah right, the euro is rising. It just got ten new member states. I don't really see any reason why I should believe that Europe is declining.

China and Russia aren't that bad, but then I think it's really a close call between Europe (as a whole), Russia or China.
Population patterns, for one. Falling birthrates (over a long period of time) combiend with an aging population means huge strains on overgenerous welfare states. There would be even less room to spend on a military budget like the US or (potentially) China. If Europe is in bad population shape, Russia's in worse. I think their population is supposed to start to plummet soon.

And, by the way, if you could explain to me how a strong currency means a strong country, it would be nice. By that logic, Britain should be the world's superpower, no?

Not to mention that China has one of (if not THE) largest population density of any nation in the world. They also have one of the largest populations, too.

Ah nuts theres a group I didnt put on their that I wanted to and forgot. The Central Asian powers (Kahazakstan etc). They have lots of nautral resorces which they havent fully extracted yet (Oil) and so it would seem that they too are high contenders for this position.

Well, it is true that Russia is the richest country in the world but that money is of no use because they should also dig it up from the ground.

Assuming it happens today, China. If Europe unites into a super-state a day later, Europe will become the most powerful nation in the world. China is still not economically powerful enough. However, it wouldn't be long before they overtook Europe.

Of course, if America simply disappeared, most countries would suffer some economic decline anyway. China especially.

Not to mention that China has one of (if not THE) largest population density of any nation in the world.

Actually, Britain has a considerably higher population density than China.

Not to mention that China has one of (if not THE) largest population density of any nation in the world. They also have one of the largest populations, too.

China's population density is nothing special, unless you are comparing it to America I guess. But it does have the largest population. Though India is gaining fast there and is crammed into a third of the space.

Not to mention that China has one of (if not THE) largest population density of any nation in the world. They also have one of the largest populations, too.
Actually, Singapore has the largest population density in the whole world. It was something like 4500 people per square kilometer last time I checked.

I'm going to vote India. It has a population of about a billion, most are willing to do factory work. Some are graduates of India Institute of Technology, one of the best science and engineering schools in the world, and they will drive the high tech sector. Plus it's a nuclear power, and has close ties with rich nations like the USA.

I'm going to vote India. It has a population of about a billion, most are willing to do factory work. Some are graduates of India Institute of Technology, one of the best science and engineering schools in the world, and they will drive the high tech sector. Plus it's a nuclear power, and has close ties with rich nations like the USA.
I wouldn't talk too much about their high-tech. Remember what's happened to many of their space-rocket-tests?

Plus it's a nuclear power, and has close ties with rich nations like the USA.

Aren't these ties somewhat strained by the fact that America supports their arch rival (Pakistan)

I vote Canada. Not out of any kind of practical (or realistic) considerations, but simply because I would really like Canada to be the next superpower.

China will be the next super power. No question about it, they've got the resources, they've got the people, they've got everything needed.

And why are we talking about population density? It's rather pointless. China's population on the other hand is just plain gigantic.

I wouldn't talk too much about their high-tech. Remember what's happened to many of their space-rocket-tests?

Yeah. Also keep in mind that they are one of about 5 or 6 places to be able to afford rocket tests. I can only think of NASA, the ESA and whatever Japan and Russia are running that are able to put that kind of money in.

China will be the next super power. No question about it, they've got the resources, they've got the people, they've got everything needed.

And why are we talking about population density? It's rather pointless. China's population on the other hand is just plain gigantic.

And India's is also. Whoa. Everyone in those two countries should just have a giant fight. A third of the world. That would own. Hmmm. This was not at all relevant.

I wouldn't so much say that America supports Pakistan as that they have a mutual understanding in the Afghan / Al-Qaeda conflict. I would think actually that India would have much closer ties to the US as we have sacrificed so many good jobs to them in the form of outsourcing.

I would like to say euroupean supernation but it would never happen, or certainly not with labour in charge of britain! but britain is fairly powerful and if we could shake of the all emposing americanizm in our politics then we could mabey build our selves up. Personally id love to see the english and the swiss team up! swiss army knives and english snipers! :sniper:
but to be serious i dont think any part of europe existing now on its own could do it, we need a new empire of a few countrys, possible not all europe though.
There is also the possibility that japan will invent some star wars killer satilite thing...

I think it depends on when America declines. If that happens in the short term, the European contingent will be the next superpower. Given enough time, it will be China. Since I don't think America is going to implode in the next few years, I voted for China.

That would be ace. Hahaa, I can just imagine America falling and there being a big struggle for power, and then japan just cruising in with a load of spaceships and lasers.

Either India, China or Pakistan could well become superpowers, if they didn't fight between each other.

I wouldn't talk too much about their high-tech. Remember what's happened to many of their space-rocket-tests?
Indian scientists and engineers who graduate India Institute of Technology can market their skills all over the world and make a killing. Kids applying to that school pick MIT and other fine institutions as their second choice.

Aren't these ties somewhat strained by the fact that America supports their arch rival (Pakistan)
I think we're still cool with India. It's not like we're trying to intervene in Kashmir or anything.

The superpower should be Great Britain, because we were the ultimate superpower in the world; we had the empire on which the sun truly never set, and we created America - we should take back our mantle.

The superpower should be Great Britain, because we were the ultimate superpower in the world; we had the empire on which the sun truly never set, and we created America - we should take back our mantle.
When You guys take back the USA, can I govern the collony of New Jersey?

sorry for breaking the mold but my opinion is that if the United States falls, as in losses power then breaks up, it will be a religous state that next becomes a superpower and it will be roughly were america is

Although I'm no exert on the matter, I believe that if and when the USA falls, the power vacuum will be taken by China because of its large armed forces and the fact that the USA can no longer exert political influence over it; I also believe that an Islamic super-state will be formed between the countries in the Middle East, again because of the loss of American influence and military power. It is quite possible, in my view, that these two 'super-powers' could fight it out, although who would win is a matter for conjecture

China. Period. Europe is simply getting to old and its getting a large amount of arab immigrants who don't seem to be fitting into normal European culture. Watching the future of Europe will be quite intersting really.

Britain is a joke though.

sorry for breaking the mold but my opinion is that if the United States falls, as in losses power then breaks up, it will be a religous state that next becomes a superpower and it will be roughly were america is

Nope. China will replace America as the next superpower by around 2020-2050 anyway. If America literally "falls" as in succumbs to a revolution/civil war, it won't be the religious portion of America that becomes the most powerful of the remnants. Areas like New England and California will be the most powerful of any splitting of the United States.

China. Period. Europe is simply getting to old and its getting a large amount of arab immigrants who don't seem to be fitting into normal European culture. Watching the future of Europe will be quite intersting really.

Britain is a joke though.

Why? We ruled HALF THE WORLD!

China. Period. Europe is simply getting to old and its getting a large amount of arab immigrants who don't seem to be fitting into normal European culture. Watching the future of Europe will be quite intersting really.

Britain is a joke though.

Salvondia has a point - if the nations in Euope do not unite in a single power, and this seems fairly unlikely with the continued resistance of Great Britain, Europe may well fall before an Islamic onslaught, or even a Chinese One.

Britain as a world-power does seem to now be a joke - with a vastly shrunk armed forces and decreasing political power within the world, I find it hard to see what power Britain will be able to exert in 50-75 years time

It could well be China. They have the biggest army in the world and their economy is extremely strong.
I don't want to say what I think about the british army.

What's wrong with the British army?We have the world's two best trained and most succesful special ops units, we have superior training to most armies, we have the best Military Intelligence sections, we just rock. America had to create two special ops units to imitate the SAS:the rangers and 'Delta Force'.

What's wrong with the British army?We have the world's two best trained and most succesful special ops units, we have superior training to most armies, we have the best Military Intelligence sections, we just rock. America had to create two special ops units to imitate the SAS:the rangesr and 'Delta Force'.
How long have the SAS been around?

Why? We ruled HALF THE WORLD!
The emphasis in this should be on 'ruled'. We DID rule half of the world, but we dont now, and we have to face this. Great Britain is no longer the super-power it was 100, or even 50 years ago, that it was. We have been superseded by many other countries

What's wrong with the British army?We have the world's two best trained and most succesful special ops units, we have superior training to most armies, we have the best Military Intelligence sections, we just rock. America had to create two special ops units to imitate the SAS:the rangers and 'Delta Force'.

I agree entirely! A fellow Briton! Woohoo!

How long have the SAS been around?

Since World War 2 - that was when they were originally 'created'.

The SAS have been around since the early stages of WWII. The Rangers were kind of 'overhauled' to imitate SAS tactics and training due to massive successes. Delta Force...God they suck.

What's wrong with the British army?We have the world's two best trained and most succesful special ops units, we have superior training to most armies, we have the best Military Intelligence sections, we just rock. America had to create two special ops units to imitate the SAS:the rangers and 'Delta Force'.

Although the British Army is certainly well-trained, and has some excellent intellignce services, our armed forces have shrunk to a fraction of their former power, and will do so even further once Labour's defence cuts are fully enacted. Unless this is reversed drastically, we will not have the military power to fight with, only intelligence power

Britain is a joke though.

And what makes you say that, we have a strong and technologicly advanced military forces, a strong governing body (the monarcs, not the politicians) but is charles gets the throne we're all screwed. A large portion of the international space station was designed and built here. Our welth is domonent, currently the Gbp is worth roughly twice the euro and doller. Anyone notice what language you aree ALL using? oh yeh, ours! So i sure as hell wouldnt call britain a joke or we'll get our missile subs on you!

I personalluy hope that America falls soon. Maybe that will help get our sh*t together. I think that when we fall it will be just what we needed to finally see the faults with our country. And maybe we will get back on the right track again. USA derailed a long time ago but no one wants to tell us.

I picked Europe just because they seem to know what they are doing. They have started the Euro and they just seem to know whats wrong and what battles to fight.

What's wrong with the British army?We have the world's two best trained and most succesful special ops units, we have superior training to most armies, we have the best Military Intelligence sections, we just rock. America had to create two special ops units to imitate the SAS:the rangers and 'Delta Force'.

Yoda Speak

Special Forces Makes an Army Not.

End Yoda Speak

If our founding fathers came back to life they would all have heart attacks and die becuase of what we did to the USA.

The SAS have been around since the early stages of WWII. The Rangers were kind of 'overhauled' to imitate SAS tactics and training due to massive successes. Delta Force...God they suck.


What proof do you have that Delta Force 'suck'? Like all special forces units they have had their successes and failures, and are still a well-trained and efficent military unit

And what makes you say that, we have a strong and technologicly advanced military forces, a strong governing body (the monarcs, not the politicians) but is charles gets the throne we're all screwed. A large portion of the international space station was designed and built here. Our welth is domonent, currently the Gbp is worth roughly twice the euro and doller. Anyone notice what language you aree ALL using? oh yeh, ours! So i sure as hell wouldnt call britain a joke or we'll get our missile subs on you!

Thank you! Thank you! It's true; British Pound Sterling is the WORLD'S STRONGEST CURRENCY!!!!!!! THE RAF CAN DEFEAT AIR FORCES OVER 5 TIMES IT'S SIZE - LOOK AT THE LUFTWAFFE. And when Howard is in power, we can build up our armed forces again. (However, i do agree about Charlie. He's an idiot.)

The SAS have been around since the early stages of WWII. The Rangers were kind of 'overhauled' to imitate SAS tactics and training due to massive successes. Delta Force...God they suck.
Ok, Rangers were around before the Normandy invasion. One could say they started at about the same time. As for Delta, why do you think they suck? In the book Blackhawk Down the rangers had high praise for the Delta guys. Anyone a Ranger looks up to has to be good. I mean really good.

And what makes you say that, we have a strong and technologicly advanced military forces, a strong governing body (the monarcs, not the politicians) but is charles gets the throne we're all screwed. A large portion of the international space station was designed and built here. Our welth is domonent, currently the Gbp is worth roughly twice the euro and doller. Anyone notice what language you aree ALL using? oh yeh, ours! So i sure as hell wouldnt call britain a joke or we'll get our missile subs on you!

Actually, American English is hard for Oxford English speakers to understand at first, when spoken anyway. Indeed linguists have predicted English English will become a dialect of American English and not the other way around.

In the meantime the Monarchs in England are nothing but a Figure Head puppet show and have no control. The equivlanet worth of currencys has little to do with the power of a nation. England doesn't have the population or the economic power to even pretend to be a super power.

I think China. There's over 1 billion people, it's a sleeping giant (maybe just awakening!), that's bound to make it's mark in the future. Just think, if even just 25% of its population rise to equal in economic status to Europe and North America, they will be a serious serious economic player. Militarily, their army is huge, and no doubt will only become more technologically advanced as time goes on.

(I would have loved to had said Europe, but even if we do get our act together and manage to run an efficient supra-national body with real power on all fronts (not very likely even in the medium-term!), our population is largely in decline.)

Thank you! Thank you! It's true; British Pound Sterling is the WORLD'S STRONGEST CURRENCY!!!!!!! THE RAF CAN DEFEAT AIR FORCES OVER 5 TIMES IT'S SIZE - LOOK AT THE LUFTWAFFE. And when Howard is in power, we can build up our armed forces again. (However, i do agree about Charlie. He's an idiot.)


The Luftwaffe? We defeated them in World War II, but that was 60 years ago - im no expert, but would the RAF still be able to defeat the Luftwaffe now?

And is the Pound Sterling the strongest Currency in the world?

I agree, ana rmy cannot be run with pure special forces. Consider this, our military has some of the best 'normal' military forces around. Did you see the pictures of the way Amercans fought in Iraq?They were doing everything wrong!They were spraying whole magazines in long bursts, blasting away like f*cknuts. Did you see the British?Short, controlled bursts.Use of grenades (PROPERLY), good tactics. The Americans just blew shit up, the British cleared houses rather than reducing them to rubble.

The Luftwaffe? We defeated them in World War II, but that was 60 years ago - im no expert, but would the RAF still be able to defeat the Luftwaffe now?

And is the Pound Sterling the strongest Currency in the world?

Yup, 'tis.

Thank you! Thank you! It's true; British Pound Sterling is the WORLD'S STRONGEST CURRENCY!!!!!!! THE RAF CAN DEFEAT AIR FORCES OVER 5 TIMES IT'S SIZE - LOOK AT THE LUFTWAFFE. And when Howard is in power, we can build up our armed forces again. (However, i do agree about Charlie. He's an idiot.)

I think it would just be hilarious if harry got it, soon! hes have battleships play chicken and pick fights with canada or something

Yup, 'tis.

...and don't anybody forget it.

Howard is never getting power. His party can't stay unified long enough to remove the daggers from each others backs.

Plus the Americans did not take the advice we offered about making peace in Iraq, as we had vastly superior knowledge in this type of situation, ie Northern Ireland, and they simply made the situation in Iraq far worse than it had to be

Thank you! Thank you! It's true; British Pound Sterling is the WORLD'S STRONGEST CURRENCY!!!!!!! THE RAF CAN DEFEAT AIR FORCES OVER 5 TIMES IT'S SIZE - LOOK AT THE LUFTWAFFE. And when Howard is in power, we can build up our armed forces again. (However, i do agree about Charlie. He's an idiot.)

The RAF would kindly have to bend over the table and spread its legs if it decided to enguage in an air war with America. Period. It would be unable to project its power anywhere outside of Europe and North America and would get its army handaly stopped in any country with a decent production base and American designed weaponry (like say, Japan).

I love it.


"OMG Am3R1c4 P'//Nz j00!"

Plus the Americans did not take the advice we offered about making peace in Iraq, as we had vastly superior knowledge in this type of situation, ie Northern Ireland, and they simply made the situation in Iraq far worse than it had to be

Precisely.

The RAF isnt the world power that it once used to be. We have to recongise this

If the Americans had listened to us over Iraq, or at least adopt our tactics learned from N. Ireland they might not have lost so many men. It's almost a sure thing they wouldn't have lost so many men.

Britain is a joke though.

Hey. Don't make us get together with some friends and burn down the White House again.

:p

The Luftwaffe? We defeated them in World War II, but that was 60 years ago - im no expert, but would the RAF still be able to defeat the Luftwaffe now?

And is the Pound Sterling the strongest Currency in the world?

Harrier jet, Euro fighter. Are you saying that these arent some of the strongest, most advanced planes in the world with some of the best trained pilots anywhere. and thats just raf's airforces, the regement (the large, ground forces of Raf, not the army) are all trained well above the levels of even american comandos

Harrier jet, Euro fighter. Are you saying that these arent some of the strongest, most advanced planes in the world with some of the best trained pilots anywhere. and thats just raf's airforces the regement (the large, ground forces of Raf, not the army) are allk trained well above the levels of even american comandos

Yes, the RAF is still well-trained, but with the massive defence cuts now, their quality is being eroded away, and might well be able to be defeated by sheer quantity if not quality

Is it just me, or is everybody here vastly underestimating the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland and the British Empire?

Harrier jet, Euro fighter. Are you saying that these arent some of the strongest, most advanced planes in the world with some of the best trained pilots anywhere. and thats just raf's airforces the regement (the large, ground forces of Raf, not the army) are allk trained well above the levels of even american comandos

The Harrier certainly not. The Euro fighter is nifty but not exactly up to spec when compared with the F-22. Likewise when you start dealing with modern jet warfare its not the jet so much as the missile that matters. When you're lobbing missiles at eachother over the horizion you can be a friggin floating blimp so long as your missile outranges the other guy's missile by a mile.

Is it just me, or is everybody here vastly underestimating the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland and the British Empire?

Possibly, but our power has been vastly eroded over the past 50 years - we hardly have an empire anymore, for example

*looks at your signature*

We ain't bad... but the best we can do is poke the rest of the world in the eye. :D

Since World War 2 - that was when they were originally 'created'.

Australia also has its own SAS that trains with the British SAS.

Is it just me, or is everybody here vastly underestimating the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland and the British Empire?
I think if Great britain ever resolve the conflicts of Ireland, to keep the whole country or lose it, we could well increse our standing as a world power increadibly

Hmmm, I guess that when America falls it'll take Europe with them. The anti-americanism (which is going way too far) is making the Europeans blind for how much they rely on the USA. And if Europe doesn't make many changes soon (because of the baby-boom) they will have fallen long before the US of A begins to crumble. If America falls, Europe will fall too.

I guess that the new superpower will be born in Asia, they are more capitalist then the western world and have been growing much. It's hard to choose between China and India. I guess China but it'll take some years for them to become economically strong. Don't forget the rest of Asia too, nations like Singapore, Taiwan, South Korea and Japan are strong too (in economical terms, military matters less and America will continue to be stronger in military temrs then the rest of the world for a while.)

I think their main-advantage is the Keynesianism of the Western World, they aren't fully capitalist and they could afford that since the rest of the world was in a much worse shape then the Western World, but now they'll have to choose a better system (I would say the system of Friedrich Hayek) if they want to survive.

Is it just me, or is everybody here vastly underestimating the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland and the British Empire?

We may rock, but we have no Empire. Perhaps you've been in suspended animation these last 50 years?

*looks at your signature*

We ain't bad... but the best we can do is poke the rest of the world in the eye. :D

My signature? Whats wrong with my signature?

The Harrier certainly not. The Euro fighter is nifty but not exactly up to spec when compared with the F-22. Likewise when you start dealing with modern jet warfare its not the jet so much as the missile that matters. When you're lobbing missiles at eachother over the horizion you can be a friggin floating blimp so long as your missile outranges the other guy's missile by a mile.

Yes, i notice that America is so very interested in missiles, it just made a great move! It just got rid of the Tomca, the only aircraft in the world capable of carrying the wolrd's best missile - the Phoenix. Great move there, yankees!

Is it just me, or is everybody here vastly underestimating the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland and the British Empire?

You are simply vastly over-estimating it. Europe and Great Britain are not on war footing, nor are they on industrial footing either. If Europe or Britain rolled on the steam and abandoned a lot of their social welfare nets and focused on military/economic power they'd be quite strong. They don't and they likely won't.

Yoda Speak

Special Forces Makes an Army Not.

End Yoda Speak

Funny that, As it seems that’s all Yoda used in battles all over Space....

I personally believe if the US goes, then the EU and the rest of the gang will look to Asia.

My signature? Whats wrong with my signature?

>_< Crap.

Post lag, I was replying to Britannic Colonies. :p

We may rock, but we have no Empire. Perhaps you've been in suspended animation these last 50 years?

We do still have an Empire! Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Northern Irealnd, Cayman Islands, etc. And notice who is Austalia's head of state? The Queen!

>_< Crap.

Post lag, I was replying to Britannic Colonies. :p

Ah, i see - thanks, sorry for the mix-up :D

Funny that, As it seems that’s all Yoda used in battles all over Space....

I guess you didn't notice all those nifty clone troopers running around?

We do still have an Empire! Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Northern Irealnd, Cayman Islands, etc. And notice who is Austalia's head of state? The Queen!

Like I said, we may still have an empire, but one of the main functions of thr empire was to aid us in fighting by sending troops, aid etc - would these sountries still do this today? Canada might, as would Gibraltar, but the rest.....?

Harrier jet, Euro fighter. Are you saying that these arent some of the strongest, most advanced planes in the world with some of the best trained pilots anywhere. and thats just raf's airforces, the regement (the large, ground forces of Raf, not the army) are all trained well above the levels of even american comandos
How do they match up to the F22 and the JSF?

Hallo everyone!

I vote Canada. Not out of any kind of practical (or realistic) considerations, but simply because I would really like Canada to be the next superpower.

I agree! I would love for Canada to rule (I am a Canadian after all). Still, I voted for the European Superpower.

Of course... I'm writing my thesis on Canada-EU relations and integration... So maybe I am a bit biased.

China seems well-placed, but I think that their large population could actually end up hindering their rise. Even with the tremendous Chinese growth, they have serious technological and environmental issues that would have to be solved before they become the be-all and end-all.

Breathe Deep, Seek Peace, God Bless!
K.T.

P.S.: By the way... Are we talking about a military superpower, economic superpower, cultural superpower or some combination thereof?

P.P.S.: What about a group of equal powers? Somehow I feel inclined to hope that at some point the world can cooperate and form multiple centres of greatness.

We do still have an Empire! Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Northern Irealnd, Cayman Islands, etc. And notice who is Austalia's head of state? The Queen!

We only have any real power over the UK and Gibraltar. Australia has no allegiance to the Commonwealth in truth, and the Cayman Islands? P|-H34r them!I'm pretty proud of being English (I'm not going to say British and sound like some BNP f*ckwit) but even I'll accept we have no Empire.

Alot of you are going about this a little jingoistically and illogically. Kwangistar has a good point, and most of your arguments about strong states have very little to DO with actually having a strong state. The Euro is going up? That's actually hurting you because you cannot sell goods to America as much any more.

The only thing capable of becoming a super power after America would be a European super state. You say that the end of America is inevitable, and that might be a little too soon to say, history says your right(after a few more hundred years). It's far too soon to say what the geopolitical world is going to LOOK like in a few hundred years, much less in a few decades!

Whatever replaces us is going to have alot to do with how we go down, don't you think? The world is too small nowadays for it's sole superpower to fall without ripples being felt everywhere else. So how will America go down?

Europe IS in decline due to it's low birth rates, and it's certainly got problems before it's going to become a super-power. The way it's dealing with islamic immigration is a key issue - Europe could very easily be muslim in a century or too. The trick is to make sure European values of democracy and diplomacy are kept during such a great change. A multicultural Europe might kill it or make it stronger...

China is on it's way out, period. This is their last big hurrah, and I think anyone who supports China as the next big thing and is happy about it is too nationalistic to keep their eyes open. It's quite ironic to cheer on your far-flung motherland from the peace, safety, and freedom of America or Europe, and I have a feeling that's what alot of you are doing. China's growth is gargantuan, but at what cost? They are abandoning the very communist ideals that have kept most of their population from rising up in the country. This 'capitalist police state' cannot last for long, the more growth that happens in China, the wealthier the commoner is going to get and the more he and she are going to be demanding rights very soon. China can't survive that - whatever comes from the ashes of China might replace America or Europe, but not China. China, right now, is a step backwards - a militaristic, (relativly)single cultured, tyrannical state. Compare that with the democratic, relatively free cultures it's competing with. It's simple social darwinism. Democracy isn't just great because it sounds nice, democracy is great because it's STRONGER.

If America went down right now(which most of you seem to be assuming, since you are going off of current data like 'our money is strong!' to guess who's going to be the next big thing) there isn't going to BE a replacement super power. America IS the world right now, like it or not - we go down, you go down. In a few decades, Europe could be strong enough to be a co-power, but they've got the failure of their socialist utopia to fix first(one of the key reasons for declining birth rates), and the integration of a huge ammount of people who do not share their views on democracy. If China did try and take control, it would last for a few years at best, the world would not generally like the idea of a Communist Superstate telling them what to do. A new China, one that is more open and democratic, would be a powerhouse, but I don't think it could culturally take on the reigns of the world until that new China matured, it's population divirsified, and at least until all modern day chinese communist leaders have died of old age to put the lasts nail in that coffin.

My votes for Europe just because I'd prefer to keep the status quo - civil, political and economic rights.

We do still have an Empire! Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Northern Irealnd, Cayman Islands, etc. And notice who is Austalia's head of state? The Queen!

You're not really familiar with the fact that the Queen has no power anywhere are you?

How do they match up to the F22 and the JSF?

That is a good point but we are talking about when america falls, no other nation could seriously hold up against the RAF or joint air forces of Europe

Britain! We did it once, we'll do it again! VOTE ME IN 2030!

P.P.S.: What about a group of equal powers? Somehow I feel inclined to hope that at some point the world can cooperate and form multiple centres of greatness.

Isn't that otherwise known as the UN? Fat lot of use THAT body is...

I guess a combination of economical and military. Economically it'll be Asia, Military it'll just continue to be the USA. They are way ahead of the rest of the world (possible exception being Israel, but in the sky they pwn Israel too (they pwn everyone with the JSF (their personal version, they have a stripped down version for Denmark and the Netherlands to make it cheaper)

I agree with Nova Terrace on most parts. I don't think that America will just go down in a boom, I think they'll continue to be strong for a lot of years (the whole america goes down is just wishful thinking from the anti-americans) China needs some reforming (they currently aren't that capitalist, in the coastal zones, but in the backland they are still quite communist (as a result they are more poor there,) and I think that China itself realizes that they will have to reform in order to survive (and I think they will reform.)

You're not really familiar with the fact that the Queen has no power anywhere are you?
Actually, she can technically lay claim to any part of land in the Commonwealth she wants... and who signs our laws? The queen!

I think that Great Britian has had its time in the sun as dominant world-power, and i think that the USA may be coming to the end of its reign as dominant super-power. I guess its time for the next country to step up and take its place

Eh, technically, BC.

In reality? She's a figurehead, a tourist attraction and not much more.

If she refused to sign the laws presented to her, the Royal Family would be out on their asses.

If she tried to 'lay claim' to anything, the country would politely tell her to bugger off.

I think that Great Britian has had its time in the sun as dominant world-power, and i think that the USA may be coming to the end of its reign as dominant super-power. I guess its time for the next country to step up and take its place

That comment, alas, cannot be argued with. *sigh*

Actually, she can technically lay claim to any part of land in the Commonwealth she wants... and who signs our laws? The queen!

And if she refuses to she can legally be deposed and replaced. The right to claim land is no longer actually listened to by anyone, she could say it's her land but she'd get laughed at.

Eh, technically, BC.

In reality? She's a figurehead, a tourist attraction and not much more.

If she refused to sign the laws presented to her, the Royal Family would be out on their asses.

If she tried to 'lay claim' to anything, the country would politely tell her to bugger off.

That's not the point! lol

:D

Europe- it has a large industrial base to bulid on.

Actually, she can technically lay claim to any part of land in the Commonwealth she wants... and who signs our laws? The queen!
Thats right and its a common misconception that the queen is powerless because with have a prime minister, she can kick him out on will, he has to ask for everything, even for an election!the queen is still running the game, shes just keeping her cards close to her cheat and not letting anyone know it.

Thats right and its a common misconception that the queen is powerless because with have a prime minister, she can kick him out on will, he has to ask for everything, even for an election!the queen is still running the game, shes just keeping her cards close to her cheat and not letting anyone know it.

Tou see? We know quite a lot more than a little about British politics...

Thats right and its a common misconception that the queen is powerless because with have a prime minister, she can kick him out on will, he has to ask for everything, even for an election!the queen is still running the game, shes just keeping her cards close to her cheat and not letting anyone know it.

Mr President, the Evil Dictator of Britain has WMD's and could easily use them as a 1st strike weapon on the USA, we must invade her before she has a Chance to use those Weapons on the American Population!

Thats right and its a common misconception that the queen is powerless because with have a prime minister, she can kick him out on will, he has to ask for everything, even for an election!the queen is still running the game, shes just keeping her cards close to her cheat and not letting anyone know it.

The Primne Minister can kick her out. Then he could declare a Republic!!!FOR GOD'S SAKE PLEASE DO IT NOW!

Mr President, the Evil Dictator of Britain has WMD's and could easily use them as a 1st strike weapon on the USA, we must invade her before she has a Chance to use those Weapons on the American Population!

Oh, dear God. Not again! Just remember who is responsible fro your country's existence - Britain.

The Primne Minister can kick her out. Then he could declare a Republic!!!FOR GOD'S SAKE PLEASE DO IT NOW!

I have to agree - say that the Queen did somehow kick out the PM and take power - would the public really stand for such an action -yes, we may love our monarchy, but do we really wan them in power? We cant even vote for them

There are encouraging signs, though, amongst the disparate great powers - Europe, North America, China, Russia and the Sub-Continent - of increased co-operation, greater diplomatic ties etc. Obviously these have always existed between various combinations of these regions. Despite the genuine horror of the wars being waged - and I'd like to have said 'wrongly or rightly', but these wars have gone too long, with no clear result, or end - I believe that if we utilise the massive combined strength of the most powerful nations and institutes, like the UN, the G8 etcetera, who all have, at the most cynical, a vested interest in stability, then how can we fail?

The bottom line is that people are decent, and almost every one of us just wants to get on, have fun, and so on. If we work at it, we can end the suffering, I think.

If this country becomes a Republic, the very next night it will be back to a monarchy as I impose myself on the throne with an army of ninjas and much stabbing.

President Tony Blair? Pass the FNP90 and don't spare the smoke grenades!

I think the US should be declared a rogue, criminal state.Refuse to accept it's independance and treat it as a member of the British Empire!

I have to agree - say that the Queen did somehow kick out the PM and take power - would the public really stand for such an action -yes, we may love our monarchy, but do we really wan them in power? We cant even vote for them

Guilloutine,guilloutine,guilloutine,
Guilloutine,guilloutine,guilloutine,
Guilloutine,guilloutine,guilloutine,
Guilloutine,guilloutine,guilloutine,

If this country becomes a Republic, the very next night it will be back to a monarchy as I impose myself on the throne with an army of ninjas and much stabbing.

President Tony Blair? Pass the FNP90 and don't spare the smoke grenades!

Please no! Have mercy! Nor President Blair! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!

The Primne Minister can kick her out. Then he could declare a Republic!!!FOR GOD'S SAKE PLEASE DO IT NOW!
You really expect Tony Blair to ever try to do that? and yeh we're still gonna have him around for a while (even after may) No politician would even attempt it because the british would be appauled and kick them out! also id expect queenie to give a f*ckin slap

I think the US should be declared a rogue, criminal state.Refuse to accept it's independance and treat it as a member of the British Empire!

An interesting idea, and it would be great if it happened, but unfortunately I dont think it will :(

I think the US should be declared a rogue, criminal state.Refuse to accept it's independance and treat it as a member of the British Empire!

I second that comment! Three cheers that country!

Oh, dear God. Not again! Just remember who is responsible fro your country's existence - Britain.

I don't mind, alot of Australians are very patriotic and still love there Queen. We saw in both WW1 and WW2 how hard Australians fight for there Empire, and by god we will do it again!

How about King James then? :D

I give Blair 3 years before he tries it, if he gets back into power :P

An interesting idea, and it would be great if it happened, but unfortunately I dont think it will :(

I much prefer the US's little brother, Canada. Such a nice kid!We should get them both back. But no, that isn't going to happen if they don't learn the rules of cricket, stop being loud and boorish and learn to love tea.

I don't mind, alot of Australians are very patriotic and still love there Queen. We saw in both WW1 and WW2 how hard Australians fight for there Empire, and by god we will do it again!

Here, Here - I have always respected Australian troops for their steadfast courage and abilities in battle, and for the courage to stick around with an imperial fossil like Great Britain

I much prefer the US's little brother, Canada. Such a nice kid!We should get them both back. But no, that isn't going to happen if they don't learn the rules of cricket, stop being loud and boorish and learn to love tea.

I see Canada as a little brother that still keeps in contact, and the USA as a nephew who rebelled when he was a teenager and is now more powerful than we used to be, and lets us hang around because we are family

I really hope one day Britain regains some of it's power. Think of it, a G8 member with an empire..... :)

Here, Here - I have always respected Australian troops for their steadfast courage and abilities in battle, and for the courage to stick around with an imperial fossil like Great Britain

Imperial Fossil? How dare you?!?!

I really hope one day Britain regains some of it's power. Think of it, a G8 member with an empire..... :)

What a beautiful prospect... *sigh - his eyes go misty*

I see Canada as a little brother that still keeps in contact, and the USA as a nephew who rebelled when he was a teenager and is now more powerful than we used to be, and lets us hang around because we are family

No. The US is the bastard child of an illicit affair who somehow managed to get rich, so you suck up to them.

I don't mean that as an insult.

Heh, I hope this thread lasts a bit. I'm looking to get my 500th post :)

No. The US is the bastard child of an illicit affair who somehow managed to get rich, so you suck up to them.

He's right. Blair is up Bush's a*s

Imperial Fossil? How dare you?!?!

Now now, all we need is an eccentric rich man, some amber, and we'll have an Empire again.

Unfortunately it will eat a lot of people.

No. The US is the bastard child of an illicit affair who somehow managed to get rich, so you suck up to them.
Just outta intrest if UK is the mother does that make denmark the farther? interesting...

Now now, all we need is an eccentric rich man, some amber, and we'll have an Empire again.

Unfortunately it will eat a lot of people.

lol

Yeah, it was a quiet affair.But the UK was also diddling Spain and France.

No. The US is the bastard child of an illicit affair who somehow managed to get rich, so you suck up to them.

I don't mean that as an insult.

None taken, I quite agree

Heh, I hope this thread lasts a bit. I'm looking to get my 500th post :) Hey, good luck. ;)

As for my opinion, It was a tough call between China and SuperEurope. I chose China because here in US we (majority) only know limited biased viewpoints.

How many posts do I need to become a member of jolt? 50?

Getting close...

There are some pretty darn clever people in the US, but they're kind of put down by the ultra-loud idiot groups. I think in the end that's going to cause the end of the US. I suspect another civil war.

Getting close...

There are some pretty darn clever people in the US, but they're kind of put down by the ultra-loud idiot groups. I think in the end that's going to cause the end of the US. I suspect another civil war.

Another US Civil War? Hmmm, I dont think so, I think those rivalries have healed over by now

Woo, I'm a Member now, and 50 posts

Hey, just like pro wrestling!

*sends over some BBC reporters, buys popcorn and Diet Coke*

Post again and see :D

This is getting more than slightly random...

Another US Civil War? Hmmm, I dont think so, I think those rivalries have healed over by now

Woo, I'm a Member now, and 50 posts

Not along North-South divides, but I think that the resurgence of Nazism in the US, and the masses of ultra-radical Christians may have a little bit to do with it.

Ok, so back on track - I see the polls show many people think that there will be a European super-state. Im not sure, but if we can get over our petty squabbles, and possibly lose the influence of the USA, we might create a Euro-state

Not along North-South divides, but I think that the resurgence of Nazism in the US, and the masses of ultra-radical Christians may have a little bit to do with it.

There is no resurgence of Nazism in the US nor are there massses of ultra-radical Christians.

I think the ball is still in play in America in regards to future civil wars, but I doubt any future civil war will have anything to do with Nazism or ultra-radical christians.

I have a few points one of which is that Britain is a part of Europe and so should be included in that aswell dont forget but my main point also on britain is that many people speak of large armys being there reason for desicons e.g China however Britain has never had a large army and had relied more upon voulenteers during war time meaning people are helping our econmy 1 year and winning us a war the next :sniper:

@Ankhment: It's the blind anti-americanism which will bring Europe down, we tend to forget how much we depend on the US of A.

BABY KILLER!

*throws rock*

WOMAN OPPRESSOR!

*throws one back*

*crowd gathers*

It is a hot topic, as they say.

Ok, so back on track - I see the polls show many people think that there will be a European super-state. Im not sure, but if we can get over our petty squabbles, and possibly lose the influence of the USA, we might create a Euro-state

Frankly, this just about the longest period of peace in European history. I sincerely doubt that the people of Europe are going to be able to get over a history that bloody by saying "We've just got to pull together" when just 50 years ago it was quite easy for the Germans and the Italians to say "We've got to kill everyone but us."

:rolleyes:

The KKK, that gets both categories in one. KKK splinter groups, again. The Southern Bible-belt states are filled with scary-ass ultrachristians (TM).

@Ankhment: It's the blind anti-americanism which will bring Europe down, we tend to forget how much we depend on the US of A.
I personally believe thaat, should the US bugger off and die that the world can turn to the Asian states like Japan and (you'll hate me for this) China, given enough time.

I have a few points one of which is that Britain is a part of Europe and so should be included in that aswell dont forget but my main point also on britain is that many people speak of large armys being there reason for desicons e.g China however Britain has never had a large army and had relied more upon voulenteers during war time meaning people are helping our econmy 1 year and winning us a war the next :sniper:

Its not neccasarily how much military power a country *has* but how much they *can* have. Britain's maximum military potential and Britiain's maximum reach with that power is a faint shadow of the kind of military China could support and the kind of reach China could have.

Likewise the kind of power a unified Europe could have and the kind of reach it could have is staggering. But Europe is a falling star, not a rising one.

The KKK is nothing. Also there aren't that many uber-christians, the uber-christians also aren't that bad at all (offcourse the only part of America which you see on European Television are crazy cowboys, KKK klansmen and black people in Ghetto's)

:rolleyes:

The KKK, that gets both categories in one. KKK splinter groups, again. The Southern Bible-belt states are filled with scary-ass ultrachristians (TM).

There are also Neo-Nazis and a plehtora of small groups. These groups exist in all countrys but no one is talking about a resurgence of Nazism in Germany just because there are a few Neo-Nazis running around.

[QUOTE=Salvondia]Frankly, this just about the longest period of peace in European history. I sincerely doubt that the people of Europe are going to be able to get over a history that bloody by saying "We've just got to pull together" when just 50 years ago it was quite easy for the Germans and the Italians to say "We've got to kill everyone but us."[QUOTE=Salvondia]

True, however we may have to pull together despite of our shared and bloody histories of we are threatened by an outside threat. Our futures may depend on pulling together if threatened by a rising super-power, wether it be China or Middle-Eastern, or even Asian

Not true. Funny, but as a response to the anti-American thing all the US Northerners have started doing a similar thing with Europe, along the lines of:
"STFU AlL j0o E\/4 c iz D4 Cr4z13s!"

European media isn't all anti-US, not all of us hate the US.


Just the sensible ones.







Just kidding.

Pfff when I hear everyone talking about America here in the Netherlands the main opinion is that they are either cowboy, KKK or uberchristian...

True, however we may have to pull together despite of our shared and bloody histories of we are threatened by an outside threat. Our futures may depend on pulling together if threatened by a rising super-power, wether it be China or Middle-Eastern, or even Asian

External threats faced Europe before. The last time you were united was under Rome. And Rome fell to external, and internal, threats.

Europe today Is simply in a bad position for its collective future as a combined group. The future of the indavidual in Europe is rather good. Good schools, Good companies, Good exports, Good infrastructure and good defensive abilities. Being a super-power is one thing, Being successful is better.

I'm sorry but if Britain does so the Americans will just laugh and ignore it.

In any case, I think the arrival of a European Superstate is not happening. Its possible but its not probable. Europeans have such different cultures and such a history with each other they will never agree with each other on crucial decisions. They will love their own individual countries rather than a Superstate. Power will probably be shared in the Superstate and they will bicker amongst themselves.

And even if they do work together, their falling populations and slow birthrates will weaken them even more. These welfare-focused states won't have the money or the manpower to invest heavily in the military, whilst China has the manpower and, given time, will aquire the money as it has many resources to exploit and many workers for warfactories once it has industrialized.

America will not fall anytime soon and when China becomes industrialized and powerful, an alliance with them together might be probable.

Americas high tech and airpower combined with Chinas manpower might be an impressive force to take over the world, given that nukes are destroyed in the target nations before invasion. With Chinas manpower it can both fight and occupy territories. Together with Americas sattelite technology and information and surgical airstrikes and well trained special forces, this will be a powerful combination.

And to the author of this thread, do you know why there are less insurgent attacks on the British army in Iraq than Americans? Even with the Brits having a smaller army and a larger area to patrol? Because they are patrolling the SHI'ITE arab territory and maybe the Kurdish territory. These are populations which hated the Saddam regime, since it oppressed these peoples. They want a new democratic government in Iraq, since SHI'ITES are the largest ethnic population in Iraq and if Iraq becomes a democracy the SHI'ITES will be the most powerful.

On the other hand, the Americans are patrolling the SUNNI arab territory (ever heard of the Sunni Triangle?) which are the most violent arabs, given that the Saddam regime backed the Sunnis up (Saddam was a Sunni) and the Sunni arabs liked the old regime. This is why they want to fight the Americans, and thus more insurgent attacks.
The Sunnis weren't oppressed and abused as much as the other peoples under Saddams regime and had a RELATIVELY good life under it. And what happened when Saddam was thrown out of power? The good life dissapeared. They hate the Americans now, despite us giving them a gift (not apparent now, but will be in the long term, given that democracy succeeds).

Pain comes before a beautiful outcome. Look at the big picture.

Pain comes before a beautiful outcome. Look at the big picture.

I see a grenade going off.

*looks at the big picture*

A grenade going off in a battlefield.

I'm depressed now.

I'm sorry but if Britain does so the Americans will just laugh and ignore it.

In any case, I think the arrival of a European Superstate is not happening. Its possible but its not probable. Europeans have such different cultures and such a history with each other they will never agree with each other on crucial decisions. They will love their own individual countries rather than a Superstate. Power will probably be shared in the Superstate and they will bicker amongst themselves.

And even if they do work together, their falling populations and slow birthrates will weaken them even more. These welfare-focused states won't have the money or the manpower to invest heavily in the military, whilst China has the manpower and, given time, will aquire the money as it has many resources to exploit and many workers for warfactories once it has industrialized.

America will not fall anytime soon and when China becomes industrialized and powerful, an alliance with them together might be probable.

Americas high tech and airpower combined with Chinas manpower might be an impressive force to take over the world, given that nukes are destroyed in the target nations before invasion. With Chinas manpower it can both fight and occupy territories. Together with Americas sattelite technology and information and surgical airstrikes and well trained special forces, this will be a powerful combination.

And to the author of this thread, do you know why there are less insurgent attacks on the British army in Iraq than Americans? Even with the Brits having a smaller army and a larger area to patrol? Because they are patrolling the SHI'ITE arab territory and maybe the Kurdish territory. These are populations which hated the Saddam regime, since it oppressed these peoples. They want a new democratic government in Iraq, since SHI'ITES are the largest ethnic population in Iraq and if Iraq becomes a democracy the SHI'ITES will be the most powerful.

On the other hand, the Americans are patrolling the SUNNI arab territory (ever heard of the Sunni Triangle?) which are the most violent arabs, given that the Saddam regime backed the Sunnis up (Saddam was a Sunni) and the Sunni arabs liked the old regime. This is why they want to fight the Americans, and thus more insurgent attacks.
The Sunnis weren't oppressed and abused as much as the other peoples under Saddams regime and had a RELATIVELY good life under it. And what happened when Saddam was thrown out of power? The good life dissapeared. They hate the Americans now, despite us giving them a gift (not apparent now, but will be in the long term, given that democracy succeeds).

Pain comes before a beautiful outcome. Look at the big picture.

There are fewer attacks on British troops because we don't wear helmets with "all your country are belong to us" on. And so what if we patrol a Shi'ite area, I think it's fair compensation for being dragged into a war the public didn't want.

Plus, the Americans are utterly insensitive when they are occupiers. I've seen a video taken in some random place and some troops are on a convoy. They hear firing from behind, so they all start blasting away with M60's at absolutely nothing. Turns out it was a soldier in the convoy firing at what he thought was an insurgent.


It was just a random guy on the street. Sweet move, America.



Your big picture is a f*cknut American president of the world. I CANNOT STAND any of those Americans who want WORLD DOMINATION!!! They seem to think that because they have a big army the world is rightfully theirs, and we should all go screw ourselves if we don't like the idea.

I'm angry now.

-snip-


Thats one big joke about China and America right? America and China will never get along in a military alliance. Our people and our culture are far more different and we don't trust eachother. We get along trading goods and selling our contracts to their factories but we're not going to be co-ordinating air and land assualts anytime soon.

It'll be China, no question about it. It's economy, already on a major upswing, will grow at an incredible rate, and surpass the U.S.'s in a decade or so.

I am totally against a European superstate, but if it DOES come into being, it WILL be a European superstate that becomes the world power. Britain and France are both nuclear powers, and the European economy is mostly good.

Super-power will be the next superpower, because I will rename America that after I overthrow the government and replace it with a libertarian state

I am totally against a European superstate, but if it DOES come into being, it WILL be a European superstate that becomes the world power. Britain and France are both nuclear powers, and the European economy is mostly good.

:rolleyes:

Nope.

A European Superstate would never work. Who would lead it all huh? Do you think the French would ever want any Germans leading their country? A British Queen claiming royal rights of the superstate? Ultimately, it would be a big homosexual, liberal mess.

A European Superstate would never work. Who would lead it all huh? Do you think the French would ever want any Germans leading their country? A British Queen claiming royal rights of the superstate? Ultimately, it would be a big homosexual, liberal mess.

Gentlemen, we have our first troll.

Now Endicott... piss off.

A European Superstate would never work. Who would lead it all huh? Do you think the French would ever want any Germans leading their country? A British Queen claiming royal rights of the superstate? Ultimately, it would be a big homosexual, liberal mess.

Sounds like Amsterdam.

Perhaps it will be both China and a European super-state in the future, and they might have to battle it out - I cant see them settling it peacefully

how come britain gets to even be in the poll? they already had their world leader empire stage, and they fell. got their asses kicked by a bunch of untrained rebels in a couple countries. how about someone new and non-white. i picked china.

Troll. Wow.

Don't be mad at me for being right.

A European Superstate would never work. Who would lead it all huh? Do you think the French would ever want any Germans leading their country? A British Queen claiming royal rights of the superstate? Ultimately, it would be a big homosexual, liberal mess.

Wow, that was so stupid that if you don't get why it's stupid, you're a retard.

A European Superstate would never work. Who would lead it all huh? Do you think the French would ever want any Germans leading their country? A British Queen claiming royal rights of the superstate? Ultimately, it would be a big homosexual, liberal mess.


Homosexual? Liberal? The Queen claiming 'royal rights'? How would that happen?

Gentlemen, we have our first troll.

Now Endicott... piss off.

He does have a point about the leader of Europe. Very few Germans would be happy with a French of English president of Europe. Likewise very few Frenchmen would ever be happy with a German president.

Wow, that was so stupid that if you don't get why it's stupid, you're a retard.

Define Retard.

Define Retard.

You just did.

Nuff said.

Perhaps we could leave this troll behind and get back on track

A European Superstate would never work. Who would lead it all huh? Do you think the French would ever want any Germans leading their country? A British Queen claiming royal rights of the superstate? Ultimately, it would be a big homosexual, liberal mess.

The problem is that there ar only two ways a European suprstate could come into existance,

The peaceful way: after the econmy of europe stabalizes the EU make all countrys join together, a head of country is elected by each country then a head of Europe is elected (preferabley using the french system of 2 voted) No one person can become a head of country and Europe.

The Violent way: One insane country decides to attack and claim as much land as possible, it manages to seize a majority of europe quickly and be in charge, it then comes to an agreement with the remainder and a decade later a European superstate is created

The problem with the last one is that it would take time and resources, leaving us vulnerable to outside influences, also it wouldnt be england that rises up.

He does have a point about the leader of Europe. Very few Germans would be happy with a French of English president of Europe. Likewise very few Frenchmen would ever be happy with a German president.

Pssssssst...

It alternates. Don't tell anyone now.

China..

With nukes. China

Without nukes.. Kinda evens the levelling ground. Don't know how advance their weapons are, but because of sheer numbers of forces, massive production and factories, and probably IF overseas Chinese in nearly every corner of the world cooperate, they can probably overrun but not conquer countries.

I like the peaceful way that you outlined, it seems a good way to create a Euro-state; unfortunately we British seem to want to ruin this way by keeping out of a Euro-state

Pssssssst...

It alternates. Don't tell anyone now.

You went ahead and exposed the secret.

Though I am less than estatic about it, I voted for China. They simply have a huge population, a lot of resources, a growing economy, a large military, and more ambition than is healthy for their neighbors.

As has been pointed out by others, Europe has some looming problems with demographics and an aging population. Add to that the fact that a European superstate would need to be formed and kept stable and Europe as a major power is not looking incredibly likely.

Of course, we might all be underestimating Japan. Perhaps when the war for world power ignites they will unleash killer samurai robots with lasers that can slaughter all who oppose them with ease. Or have I watched too much anime lately?

You went ahead and exposed the secret.

I enabled the hidden message for your computer.

Though I am less than estatic about it, I voted for China. They simply have a huge population, a lot of resources, a growing economy, a large military, and more ambition than is healthy for their neighbors.

As has been pointed out by others, Europe has some looming problems with demographics and an aging population. Add to that the fact that a European superstate would need to be formed and kept stable and Europe as a major power is not looking incredibly likely.

Of course, we might all be underestimating Japan. Perhaps when the war for world power ignites they will unleash killer samurai robots with lasers that can slaughter all who oppose them with ease. Or have I watched too much anime lately?

Repeat with me.

There is no such thing as too much anime.

Havent we overlooked Godzilla as well?

The next superpower will be Bora Bora.

Repeat with me.

There is no such thing as too much anime.

Only watching bad anime.

Good anime, You can watch till you go blind. :p

Pssssssst...

It alternates. Don't tell anyone now.

It doesn't matter if it alternates, switches changes etc... Europe doesn't even speak one language, it has a huge variance in its cultures etc... a Unifed single state won't happen peacefully. The EU can't force it upon its members and the politcians in Germany, France, England, Italy, Spain et all likely don't want to give up their little fiefdoms and power.

Perhaps when the war for world power ignites they will unleash killer samurai robots with lasers that can slaughter all who oppose them with ease. Or have I watched too much anime lately?
Nah, Gundams seem like a pretty real possibility


And does anybody have their vote for Switzerland? Seriously, all nations will end up decimating each other while Switzerland sits back and keeps growing in strength

The next superpower will be Bora Bora.

I believe you mean the Sovereign Principality of Sealand! (http://www.sealandgov.com/history.html)

Interesting......Switzerland as a world-power? Well, who knows, I honestly dont know much about them or their military or economy

If this were to ever happen, improbable as it is, I'd have to say that Japan would take over. Face it, Japan has been imperialistic, and expansion minded since their first days.

However, the United States will probably never fall. The economy is far too strong by now, the government is almost fail safe, and the hearts and minds of its citizens would not let it. Though other great civilizations have fallen, they were all in positions that were unfavorable for their advancement. The difference for America is its isolation. We are boardered by Canada and Mexico, both of whom would never attack us cause they don't have the strength needed, and any other nations who would wish to attack us would need to sail here, and would be caught in time, and no one's foolish enough to nuke the Americans, cause they have more than enough to end the world like 5 times over. The same was once said for Rome and Greece, but, they did not have such favorable geographic positioning, over conquest led to the stretching of their forces, and economy. The US does neither.

Fear our STS and STA Moosiles!

If those things can level a pickup truck while standing still on a highway, imagine what they can do to an airplane when propelled past the speed of sound!

And does anybody have their vote for Switzerland? Seriously, all nations will end up decimating each other while Switzerland sits back and keeps growing in strength

With their army knives! lol

It doesn't matter if it alternates, switches changes etc... Europe doesn't even speak one language, it has a huge variance in its cultures etc... a Unifed single state won't happen peacefully. The EU can't force it upon its members and the politcians in Germany, France, England, Italy, Spain et all likely don't want to give up their little fiefdoms and power.

I think we should all go back to speaking latin, or at least italian (i love the language) but even if we didnt their is ALOT the same about the laungages and cultures of europe, but the way i metioned before the figureheads of the countrys would still have control over their regions, its more like a bigger, better, fairer, all encompassing EU

China 1st and Russia 2nd for me. Mostly cause if the US goes down Europe and Canada will be hurt real bad economically. China, Russia and maybe India depeneding on when it happens could cut themselves off from the US without significant economic loss.

No one's foolish enough to nuke the Americans, cause they have more than enough to end the world like 5 times over.
Never underestimate human stupidity - and don't ya just love the concept of MAD?

If this were to ever happen, improbable as it is, I'd have to say that Japan would take over. Face it, Japan has been imperialistic, and expansion minded since their first days.

However, the United States will probably never fall. The economy is far too strong by now, the government is almost fail safe, and the hearts and minds of its citizens would not let it. Though other great civilizations have fallen, they were all in positions that were unfavorable for their advancement. The difference for America is its isolation. We are boardered by Canada and Mexico, both of whom would never attack us cause they don't have the strength needed, and any other nations who would wish to attack us would need to sail here, and would be caught in time, and no one's foolish enough to nuke the Americans, cause they have more than enough to end the world like 5 times over. The same was once said for Rome and Greece, but, they did not have such favorable geographic positioning, over conquest led to the stretching of their forces, and economy. The US does neither.

While the US is not going to "fall" as in dissapear in the blink of an eye. I sincerely doubt it will last as it is today for another 500 years. I also sincerely doubt we will still be the superpower in the world by 2050. China will have replaced us by then. We won't exactly be Andorra, but we won't be #1. That aside #2 isn't a bad spot either.

With their army knives! lol
The fact is that they're a neutral nation, and with all the other nations attempting to take each other out in their vie for supremacy, Switzerland is left standing

Oh, and actually, the mobile suit (gundam) technology is not that far out there. In the most technilogically advanced states, the military's knowledge is usually 10 years ahead of what the public knows, so, they are probably already making leaps into this sort of tech. All you really have to do is make the thing, use robot tech to automate it (we already have fairly good tech on that), and write an operating system that we can handle. Not that difficult because nowadays, almost everything is done by computer. We are closer to achiveing that then you would think.

Than again, I'm a die hard MS Gundam fan, soooo.....

Getting close...

There are some pretty darn clever people in the US, but they're kind of put down by the ultra-loud idiot groups. I think in the end that's going to cause the end of the US. I suspect another civil war.
There's not going to be a civil war. The US is going to change, but it remains to be seen whether we become more liberal or more conservative. The change, however, will come through politics and culture, not violent revolution.

This conversation assumes that there will be a superpower after America falls, or indeed that nations will even exist long enouph for such events to fold.

In the era of globalizaion, that is a dangrous assumption.

The US is going to change, but it remains to be seen whether we become more liberal or more conservative.
Forget both of those, I'm hoping for a libertarian future

The violent way of uniting Europe?

Anyone thinking of Napoleon? When he wanted to invade Russia he went with an army of french and other recruits of the countries he conquered. The recruits didn't really want to fight for a french dictator. Loyalty wasn't to France and there was much opposition

However, the United States will probably never fall.

The chance of that happening is 0. The US will fall. They always fall.

While it is going to change, and human stupidety dows reign supreme, the Chinese would end up doing something so stupid that they'd get attacked by someone (US, of course) before they could become a superpower. I won't let it fall, I'll see myself dead, and if I'm already, I'll return.

America won't fall silly.

I think we should all go back to speaking latin, or at least italian (i love the language) but even if we didnt their is ALOT the same about the laungages and cultures of europe, but the way i metioned before the figureheads of the countrys would still have control over their regions, its more like a bigger, better, fairer, all encompassing EU

An all encompassing EU means taking power away from the countries. Otherwise its just a farce.

An all encompassing EU means taking power away from the countries. Otherwise its just a farce.

Ever heard of federalism?

Ever heard of federalism?
Federalism (or at least federation) used to mean 'a series of independent countries united by an international treaty' - nowadays it means 'stronger central government'

Ever heard of federalism?

And it was in essence a farce. Notice that when The United States was Federalists and states tried to pull out suddenly the Central government got real powerful?

I'm back to haunt this thread.

An all encompassing EU means taking power away from the countries. Otherwise its just a farce.
Thats like saying having a president is taking power away from the govorners of the states

America won't fall silly.

What goes up must come down.

My view is that China will become the next superpower. They have the population, the military, and a good economy. The only thing that's holding them down is their current government. Once they step out of the communist picture OR if they perfect communism in the right way, then they very well could be the ones who overthrow the USA. If they go with a democracy, their population density would be great with a free market. Up goes the RMB!

STOP HAUNTING MY HAIR!

>_>
<_<

O_O

*hands out guns to everyone*

I cannot see Europe becoming a superstate in the near future, not with the way Germany and France continually make a mockery of its rules and regulations. The USA won't fall any time soon. Who ever said Israel must have been drunk. Britain has had it's time as a superpower, and acts to closely with the US and has a legacy of Empire which is still a raw subject in many parts of the world. I have to say it'll be China, and I think soon, with or without the USA falling. The USA own massive amounts of money to China.

Oh, and actually, the mobile suit (gundam) technology is not that far out there.

Maybe.. But it's a good question of it's practicality. And also must cost a bomb to create one.

Thats like saying having a president is taking power away from the govorners of the states
The President is (Along with Congress and the Supreme Court).

I cannot see Europe becoming a superstate in the near future, not with the way Germany and France continually make a mockery of its rules and regulations.

What rules and regulations do Germany and France continually make a mockery of? I think Europe has a very good chance of being a superstate, whether or not America falls.

And it was in essence a farce. Notice that when The United States was Federalists and states tried to pull out suddenly the Central government got real powerful?

Several countries in Europe (most notably Germany) are federalist. There is great experience in the area and a strong central government needn't excercise that power over the states - the power it can be given is the one which needs common goals, such as foreign policy, defence and the environment. Federalism has worked before and can work again.

The President is (Along with Congress and the Supreme Court).
And yet it works, my point made precisely. What we're basically talking about is a united states of europe

This poll isn't fair, because India was miss-spelled, but I was not fooled. I voted for India for a number of reasons.
1. Curry prevents Alzheimer's disease. Most rulers are older people of an age where Alzheimers is a potential difficulty. Indian old people are not forgetful.
2. Indians are mathematical geniuses. Mathematics is the skill most needed in the age of computers.
3. China's army is TOO big, there is a point at which too large an army is a self-defeating method.
4. and perhaps most importantly Indian moles of all religions and caste groups are already present in the United States in capacities rangeing from gas station owner to hotel owner to radio news reporter on NPR (at least two NPR reporters are of Indian origin!)
5. Indians are very logical and have produced great art, but they are also very practical people. The skills needed to actually take over the world are many. While I have great respect and likeing for the Chinese, they just don't infiltrate the way Indians do.
6. None of you people seem to even SUSPECT the Indians of being capable of world domination. That last just shows how clever they are!
7. Even more importantly, the Indians can function regardless of the presence of any government or none at all. India is not the world's largest functioning democracy,it's the world's largest functioning ANARCHY!
I"M WARNING YOU PEOPLE!!! DON"T BE FOOLED!!!

Hey Nastalata, good to see you're on the forums al last. I can't be bothered to read all your posts on this thread, tell me, are you defending America here? Cos that's what it looks like. You said in SPAM you were fighting for Britain.

This poll isn't fair, because India was miss-spelled, but I was not fooled. I voted for India for a number of reasons.
1. Curry prevents Alzheimer's disease. Most rulers are older people of an age where Alzheimers is a potential difficulty. Indian old people are not forgetful.
2. Indians are mathematical geniuses. Mathematics is the skill most needed in the age of computers.
3. China's army is TOO big, there is a point at which too large an army is a self-defeating method.
4. and perhaps most importantly Indian moles of all religions and caste groups are already present in the United States in capacities rangeing from gas station owner to hotel owner to radio news reporter on NPR (at least two NPR reporters are of Indian origin!)
5. Indians are very logical and have produced great art, but they are also very practical people. The skills needed to actually take over the world are many. While I have great respect and likeing for the Chinese, they just don't infiltrate the way Indians do.
6. None of you people seem to even SUSPECT the Indians of being capable of world domination. That last just shows how clever they are!
I"M WARNING YOU PEOPLE!!! DON"T BE FOOLED!!!

If they're so clever, how come they can't even negotiate with their neighbour without risking nuclear warfare?

*haunts hair*
Wooooooooooo!

India...Interesting idea that. curry is very good.

I still say the UK would be able to take some chunks out of US territory if it went into decline. So we should take some of OUR land back....Never mind we stole it in the first place.

There seems to have been a huge turnout for Canada :D

If they're so clever, how come they can't even negotiate with their neighbour without risking nuclear warfare?

Because their neighbour is just a tad bit more hot-headed.

There seems to have been a huge turnout for Canada :D

Canada rules! YEAAAH!

I like the peaceful way that you outlined, it seems a good way to create a Euro-state; unfortunately we British seem to want to ruin this way by keeping out of a Euro-state

The Euro-State is bad for us. We would have to adopt the euro. And lose our valuable pound sterling. BAD! We would have to put up with tonss of centralisation and regulation. BAD! But we would have a human rights tribunal. GOOD!

Thats like saying having a president is taking power away from the govorners of the states

They did. Likewise right now Germany has a President. Not a govenor. Reducing the postion of Germany's leader to that of a Governor is reducing the postions power. Period.


And yet it works, my point made precisely. What we're basically talking about is a united states of europe

Likewise Europe is not the United States. I doubt that a United States of Europe would function in the same way the USA does. Oh well, even if *did* come to pass, it would not be the world's super power.

Because their neighbour is just a tad bit more hot-headed.

Talking of which, who voted for Pakistahn?

It'll probably be the European Union or China.

Me.




































Kidding.

Hey Nastalata, good to see you're on the forums al last. I can't be bothered to read all your posts on this thread, tell me, are you defending America here? Cos that's what it looks like. You said in SPAM you were fighting for Britain.

No i was talking about the idea of a super europe. btw can i borrow no logo on mon?

Likewise Europe is not the United States. I doubt that a United States of Europe would function in the same way the USA does. Oh well, even if *did* come to pass, it would not be the world's super power.

How would a United States of Europe not be the world's superpower? The combined economies of all the European countries are greater than anywhere else at the moment and if they became one country it would be greater than the sum of its parts.

No i was talking about the idea of a super europe. btw can i borrow no logo on mon?

Borrow no logo, wth are you on about?

How would a United States of Europe not be the world's superpower? The combined economies of all the European countries are greater than anywhere else at the moment and if they became one country it would be greater than the sum of its parts.

Its demographics are horrible. Its future is guarenteed to be down hill of where it is today. It has no ability to broadcast its power. Likewise though it may be the most powerful for a short time, we're talking at most 20 years. It depends on the status of the US anyway. if the USA is "MIA" then Europe would have an utterly shitty economy, as would the rest of the world...

I believe it will be a far east alliance, China, India, Japan, and Southeast Asia. All with surging economies and huge populations (2 out of 4 people in the WORLD are already from China and India alone).

I believe it will be a far east alliance, China, India, Japan, and Southeast Asia. All with surging economies and huge populations (2 out of 4 people in the WORLD are already from China and India alone).

Surging economies and huge populations are, in the end, contradictory.

Probably The United Federation of Europe, hopefully China.

Surging economies and huge populations are, in the end, contradictory.

Er. No they're not.

Surging economies and huge populations are, in the end, contradictory.
What are you talking about? Maybe in a per-capita measure, but in an absolute measure, they're not.

Why there's no Soviet Union? (rebuilt:)

Surging economies and huge populations are, in the end, contradictory.

That may be, but it's apparently not slowing them down.

For the guy who was concerned about Switzerland becoming a super power:

I live in Switzerland. They are filthy rich but do not have the land or human resources to become a Superpower. Military is conpulsory for 2 years or so. However, it is a mountanous terrain here with no natural resources (except snow if u count that). Switzerland won't be able to produce machines of war (be it airplanes, tanks, guns) without trading with another country. Most of the tactics employed by the swiss are defensive (they are scared Germany or France or Italy will want to invade, despite no one wanting to).

Guns given to soldiers are heavy and outdated, mostly heavy mobile machine guns (defensive). A new tactic is to make lighter assault guns for rapid troop movement but that is a slow idea. Tunnels are lined with explosives so if an invasion comes the swiss can blow it up, and make the soldiers cross over the mountains. Artillery can destroy them as they slowly cross the terrain. (and maybe cause some avalances :cool: )

It will be hard to invade switzerland with a land force as the territory is very hard to pass (unless u have a plenthora of paratrooping-skiiers)

The swiss military is geared for defense and not for invading another country.
It does not have enough material resources to produce enough instuments of war needed to conquer a country.

Of course, aerial bombing might surpass conquering the country by land, and them cutting the tunnels will bring themselves to a disadvantage as they are trapped in their valleys whilst bombers continue to wreck their (small) fields (grain or grazing lands) and they starve to death.

Of course, everything is possible. I've heard of airhangers built inside the mountains. They can transport goods by airlift (although sooner or later they will run out of petrol... and the supply lines will be destroyed as they have destroyed their tunnels.

What are you talking about? Maybe in a per-capita measure, but in an absolute measure, they're not.

Sorry, didn't make myself clear. What I meant is that it would be impossible for a world superpower to be as densely populated as China is, because eventually the money needed to sustain its population would reach astronomical levels.

I believe it will be a far east alliance, China, India, Japan, and Southeast Asia. All with surging economies and huge populations (2 out of 4 people in the WORLD are already from China and India alone).

Good idea. But most likely wouldn't happen. The countries are more distant to each other compared to EU.

If they're so clever, how come they can't even negotiate with their neighbour without risking nuclear warfare?

For a very long time the U.S. and the Soviet Union could not negotiate without risking nuclear war, I'd say that that is a two way street, you may as well ask why the Pakistanis can't negotiate without risking nuclear war.
Better yet, why not ask who'se damn fault it is that either country HAS nuclear weapons.
I remember being at university and seeing absolute SCADS of nuclear science students from BOTH countries.
Americans from politically suspect families couldn't do that course of study.

Sorry, didn't make myself clear. What I meant is that it would be impossible for a world superpower to be as densely populated as China is, because eventually the money needed to sustain its population would reach astronomical levels.
You realize that China only has 20 more people per square Km than the EU at this time? Both China and the EU have over 80 more people per square Km than the US.