NationStates Jolt Archive

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?

Good is anything else than me.
Hell, I'm the prince of darkness himself. It's quite hard to find a person who's even more rude and narcistic than me.

This is sort of a loaded question isn't it? You can be good to someone, and therefore say that you are a good person... but what you do may adversley affect someone else, and so they might consider you to be bad. I guess that so long as you are pure in your heart as to the nature of your intentions - then you must be a good person. This said, I know that I have done things that I would consider 'good' and that would therefore I suppose qualify me to be a good person, however, I have also done things that most would consider 'bad' and by right I would then I suppose be a bad person. So Im not sure how to judge this one... its a sort of trap-door question isnt it? :confused:

Not exactly. there are three types of people, in the sense of considering people good anyway, there are people that consider people all bad because we are all sinners, then there are the people that think that if the good things we do outweigh the bad then we are good people, then there are the people that define humans as being good, just make bad decisions, now i ask you what do you think defines a good person, whether being any of the above matters i dont know. Whether it is in the heart or its on the outside, i am asking your opinion on what a person must be to be "good" whether it be internal or external or both. It NOT a trap-door question, sorry but i didnt intend it like that.

I think "good" is defined by God, in that He is good, and the source of all goodness.
I think the only human for whom the adjective "good" is an appropriate description is Jesus of Nazareth, and He was God as well.
This gets round the '"good" is a state of mind' idea, by providing an objective standard of goodness, even if we disagree about the details of that standard.
Sorry if this is considered a thread-hijacking, but you did raise a question of ethical philosophy!

Hmm. Good is subjective.

I guess you can take it from a religious point of view, or a ethical one. Even then, I guess it differs on cultures as well.

To me, a good person is one that is ethical, and doesn't disturb others. :p

I think someone who is a good person is kind and considerate of others.

To me, a good person is one that is ethical, and doesn't disturb others. :p
Two questions:
1. Who defines the ethical system by which a person is ethical?
2. Is it possible that people who are not good would be deeply disturbed by someone who is good?

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?

Selfless, altruistic, benevolent, considerate, polite, loving, unpretentious, kind, thoughtful, honest, self-sacrificing, dependable, noble, upright, thorough, even-tempered, pure...

Not exactly. there are three types of people, in the sense of considering people good anyway, there are people that consider people all bad because we are all sinners, then there are the people that think that if the good things we do outweigh the bad then we are good people, then there are the people that define humans as being good, just make bad decisions, now i ask you what do you think defines a good person, whether being any of the above matters i dont know. Whether it is in the heart or its on the outside, i am asking your opinion on what a person must be to be "good" whether it be internal or external or both. It NOT a trap-door question, sorry but i didnt intend it like that.

Having the capacity for a great many 'good' qualities makes a man good. Within all of us lingers to some extent - the ability to enforce morals. We can carry ethics, pride, dignity and honor. We have the good will to accomplish a great many good things in our lives... and I beleive that most people try at some level to utilize this will. We all have, to some degree and at some age or point in our lives a capacity for emotion, for caring, for trust, for feeling --- above all, for love.

Man is a beastly animal though, and though sometimes his will is good, the results are not in any means positive. I do beleive that people are generally good of heart - but we are weak, and we are all very capable of the worst of bad things in certain situations. Our morals are held constantly captive by the pressures of such monsters as power and greed, even the most steadfast of people should know this. The artist can be corrupted for fame, the business man for money, the religious man for stature, the politician for influence - it happens all too often to deny.

I'm not saying that people that have fallen to these vices are in any way bad simply for that - but the simple fact remains, that throughout time this has been one of the only constants. So I fear that though people are good, even the smallest element of bad in them is easily exploited for these things, and its a trait that has seemingly become more easily exploited as we have developed into what we are today. There are of course the lucky few who still have the strength to deny such offerings, but they are few - and lessening in number as time rolls on. But like the stub of a tail-bone on our backside, I think this an endangered trait of mankind if ever one could be indentified - existing, but lost below the surface and nearly intangible with our clumsy hands.

Theres one things saving us from losing this altogether though, because just like pandoras box - the last thing to leave a person, is hope.

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More food for thought:

I fear animals regard man as a creature of their own kind which has in a highly dangerous fashion lost its healthy animal reason -- as the mad animal, as the laughing animal, as the weeping animal, as the unhappy animal.
~ Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, The Gay Science (1882).

Man is the cruelest animal. At tragedies, bullfights, and crucifixions he has so far felt best on earth; and when he invented hell for himself, behold, that was his very heaven.
~ Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, Thus Spake Zarathustra (1885).

The press, the machine, the railway, the telegraph are premises whose thousand-year conclusion no one has yet dared to draw.
~ Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, The Wanderer and His Shadow (1880).

A good person is a person who doesn't deliberately bring pain to others and who minds their own business unless invited to do otherwise. Invited can also mean that while someone has not specifically asked, they may have instead given consent in response to an inquiry.

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?

"Good" is as good does. Without the evidence of kind, compassionate behavior toward others, I don't wanna hear how "good" someone is. :)

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?
"Good" is that which is beneficial to life or the quality of life. Something good can be good for all, a few, or for only one.

Good people --speaking of those apart from myself, on whom I shall reserve judgement for now --are those who do good. In their words and deeds, at any given moment in time, can be demonstrated the quality of good. This is a demonstration of the "essence of their spirit".

I don't believe in "evil"; only love and mistakes. Similarly, I believe in the good of people, and look on "bad" things they may do as mistakes, for which amends can be made.

Selfless, altruistic, benevolent, considerate, polite, loving, unpretentious, kind, thoughtful, honest, self-sacrificing, dependable, noble, upright, thorough, even-tempered, pure...


very good adjectives, its just the adjectives need to be matched with action of a sort, so the only thing i have an objection to in this piece is that i dont know in what way someone is all of those things... like thorough in what way... i dont know maybe this is a dumb question but... i hope you get what i mean.

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?

The concept of "Good" is reliant upon assuming that free will is total, and even then you cannot describe a person as being "good". You can describe an act as "good" but even then is a qualitive scale, as not only are some acts more "good" than others in the way that you would descibe giving all your money to charity as being "better" than picking something up that someone dropped for them, but you also have to allow for how much free will someone has at the time. Would for example, you say that giving all your money to charity while drunk was being "good"? In any case, it is impossible that some people are more naturally "good" than someone else and will live a better life. Suggesting that someone is more inclined to do "good" acts than someone else is deterministic, and therefore means that they cannot be doing "good" beacause to do "good" you have to make a conscious decision to do it.

uuhhhh...i am good in bed. does that count. sorry! had to do it!

Good, in my opinion, simply depends on your point of view. After all, white christian slave owners thought they were doing African slaves a favor by christianizing them. Never mind the fact that the slaves were forced to come over in chains and put in extremely hazardous conditions.

uuhhhh...i am good in bed. does that count. sorry! had to do it!

nice immature answer............. i dont know what you "had to do it!"

Good, in my opinion, simply depends on your point of view. After all, white christian slave owners thought they were doing African slaves a favor by christianizing them. Never mind the fact that the slaves were forced to come over in chains and put in extremely hazardous conditions.


haha, nice answer, we are all deceived by our own outlook on "goodness"

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?

the character of the person, it's who he or she is.

I fear animals regard man as a creature of their own kind which has in a highly dangerous fashion lost its healthy animal reason -- as the mad animal, as the laughing animal, as the weeping animal, as the unhappy animal.
~ Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, The Gay Science (1882).

Man is the cruelest animal. At tragedies, bullfights, and crucifixions he has so far felt best on earth; and when he invented hell for himself, behold, that was his very heaven.
~ Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, Thus Spake Zarathustra (1885).

The press, the machine, the railway, the telegraph are premises whose thousand-year conclusion no one has yet dared to draw.
~ Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, The Wanderer and His Shadow (1880).

Go Nietzsche!
And Ayn Rand!

Good is...


... selflessness

Go Nietzsche!
And Ayn Rand!
Yaaay!

* :fluffle:s Lasc for using her favorite philosopher*

someone who doesnt harm others in any way shape or form (physically, mentally, financally ect.) unless needed.

I think someone who is a good person is kind and considerate of others.
Sounds like the makings of a doormat to me.

I think "good" is just a term made up to describe things that are beneficial to society as a whole. A "good" person would be someone that does lots of beneficial things for society.

Sounds like the makings of a doormat to me.

Well, dormats are good too.

Good is anything else than me.
Hell, I'm the prince of darkness himself. It's quite hard to find a person who's even more rude and narcistic than me.
are you single?

Yaaay!

* :fluffle:s Lasc for using her favorite philosopher*
right back at ya sweetie! :fluffle:

Nietzsche was so on point sometimes that it's downright scary! Easily my most read philosopher as well.

Good can be a lot of stuff depending on who you ask.

Utilitarianism: Causing happiness and not causing unhappiness is good. A good person is one who has caused more happiness than unahappiness.

Deontology: A good action is one that can be universalized. A good person is one whose actions are good.

Religion: A good person is one who does what their religion says.

Human Rights: A good person is one who preserves the human rights of others.

Dungeons and Dragons: Good is a clearly defined side whose signature actions are by their very nature good. Those who refrain from evil are good.

Finally, my views:

Truth: The truth is good. Those who believe lies or are stupid are not good. Those whose thoughts are pure of bias are good.

Reverse Morality: Good is evil and evil is good. I try to be evil, its easier to understand.

Biological: Good and evil are adaptations that let us survive in our society. Good people are those that obey their inbred moral drives.

Reality: Good and evil are unquantifiable but absolute. I know when someone I talk to is evil, and I can never know whether others think the same. Because so many believe themselves to be good but oppose others who also say they are good it is very hard to know if you're good, so I try to be evil so that I can be certain.

nice immature answer............. i dont know what you "had to do it!"
sorry i will attempt to grow up, because who ever wants to hear a joke.

Go Nietzsche!
And Ayn Rand!

Odd that you'd pick philosophers who would so often and so clearly be at loggerheads on so very many issues as your two favorites. . .

A good person is one who intends to do good deeds because of the goodness inherent within those deeds. A good deed is one which treats a person as an end in himself, and not a means to an end. Alternatively, you could say that a good person is a person who makes a habit of acting good, and good deeds are those which are conducive to the happiness of a person.

Go Kant!
And Aristotle!

Taking 'bad' as the opposite of 'good'.

What may seem bad can have good effects while attempts to be be good can do grevious harm. So then can't the issue be that perception is not the determining factor and it would entirely depend on who you asked and when?

Good...

One decent way of evaluating good is that of looking at it like teleological target practice. If it does what it's intended to do, hits the target it was intended to, per se, it is good. In that a good saw cuts wood efficiently, a good chair holds me up and doesn't break, etc.

But when you get to the more abstract bits, it doesn't help you. What is a man intended to do? What is a painting or a book intended to do?

Everyone has a different idea of what it is that a man is supposed to do. They seem to have somethings in common, though. I guess you can separate the mind into 4 very general domains, those of the Intellectual, the Aesthetic, the Moral, and the Spiritual. They each seem to want a certain thing.

The 4 Desires:
The Intellectual domain = Truth
The Aesthetic domain = Beauty
The Moral domain = Moral Goodness
The Spiritual domain = I don't know what word would go here. One-ness, perhaps? I can't come up with a word for the feeling.

I suppose that is sort of a generalization of what it might be that a man is intended to do. I don't know, I can't know, but I can theorize til my head explodes!

EDIT:
Did some philosopher already come up with this, or is this my very own theory?

the definition of a good person is related to the definition of the word BITCH

a bitch is a woman who says NO to you

a good person is one who sees things your way and does things that benefits you.

what? im not cynical

Good...
The 4 Desires:
The Intellectual domain = Truth
The Aesthetic domain = Beauty
The Moral domain = Moral Goodness
The Spiritual domain = I don't know what word would go here. One-ness, perhaps? I can't come up with a word for the feeling.


The question of this post seems to be what that third one is.

I'd like to add another view to my last list

Memnoch the Devil, by Anne Rice: I still don't really get it, but it seems to explain everything. Except Zoroaster.

Another thing: can someone be good in general rather than good at something, or does that destroy the purpose of the word. Same thing with reality. Can something be real in and of itself, or does it have to be really something.

Good is...


... selflessness
I don't agree with that. However...

selflessness is good.

The question of this post seems to be what that third one is.
Shit, you're right! I defined good in terms of itself!
:headbang:
This is why I suck at philosophy. Nihilism is easier than this stuff, just say "Aww fuck it, we'll be dead soon anyway."
:D

"Good" is as good does. Without the evidence of kind, compassionate behavior toward others, I don't wanna hear how "good" someone is. :)

I very much agree with this. The whole idea of an internal "goodness" that's somehow unrelated to a person's behavior just doesn't make any sense. It's all lip service until the goody-goody puts up some community service.

I think "good" is defined by God, in that He is good, and the source of all goodness.
I think the only human for whom the adjective "good" is an appropriate description is Jesus of Nazareth, and He was God as well.
This gets round the '"good" is a state of mind' idea, by providing an objective standard of goodness, even if we disagree about the details of that standard.
Sorry if this is considered a thread-hijacking, but you did raise a question of ethical philosophy!

"gets around" is right. It doesn't address the idea of good at all, unless you can actually get ahold of God and get his input on what good is. To say that goodness is defined by God is like saying that there's only one accurate dictionary in the world, and we lost it, so we don't know what any of the words mean.

the definition of a good person is related to the definition of the word BITCH

a bitch is a woman who says NO to you

a good person is one who sees things your way and does things that benefits you.

what? im not cynical

A bit. If you read (or even listen to the author of) "Diary of an Economic Hitman," he says that what the NSA counts on in getting foreign leaders to do as they ask is that they are corruptable (i.e. bad people). When peole are good (don't do what the NSA tries to bribe and threaten them into doing) they try to drive them out of power.

It is possible for a sufficiently reasonable person to see that someone else following moral behavior will do things that affect the first person adversly.

In my mind, and possibly in mine only good is only a state of mind, in which "good" can only be identified by a matter of opinion rather than fact, as in most things a "good" person is defined by the essence of their spirit rather than the exterior motives, it's all quite secretive until someone willing and open enough is willing to be honest with themselves. "Good" is...

Thoughts?

Good is nothing. There is no bad action or good action unless you're religious like me :) but i believe good is not worshipping satan and not being a pagan or gay or genocidal or suicidal or murderous.

please do not quote me because in almost all aspects of life such as good evil war natural disators i take a neutral opinoun (if thats how you spell it) which causes both sides to hate me

Good is nothing. There is no bad action or good action unless you're religious like me :) but i believe good is not worshipping satan and not being a pagan or gay or genocidal or suicidal or murderous.

What's evil about being gay? Disgusting, annoying, but evil? (note: none of this applies to lesbians)

Anyways, what do people say about the opinion I listed earlier that good and evil are not defined by anything but are completely objective, IE that there are evil people and good people and I know them on sight and there is no connection between that and what they really do.