NationStates Jolt Archive

This was written on another forum by a fellow in response to the statement, "I don't see how people can be Christian and liberal at the same time." Feel free to offer your insights.

Why I'm a "conservative" Christian who votes Democrat. (txt)

I put "conservative" in quotes because that term has a lot of political meanings attached to it that don't necessarily describe me. I believe in God, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, ever three and ever one. I believe that Jesus Christ was God incarnate upon the earth, who showed us how to live by his life, redeemed us from captivity to sin by his death, and demonstrated God's power over darkness and death by his resurrection. I believe that humankind is inherently sinful and separated by God, and is unable to restore itself by its own efforts, but only through the grace of God as expressed through Christ. I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God. That's what I mean when I say I am a "conservative" Christian. Strip away any political meanings you may have attached to that. Perhaps "orthodox" is a better word. Anyway, now that that's out of the way:

The first, and deepest problem is that the Republican party has a number of beliefs that are at odds with Biblical teaching, regardless of what many conservatives would have you think. The conservative mindset is focused on the individual -- individual rights, individual responsibilities, individual consequences. I've heard several talk about people reaping what they sow, that the wealthy deserve their riches and that the poor deserve their plight. Lassiez-faire capitalism, which relies on human greed, is never questioned. This is in stark contrast to the Scriptures, which teach that people should live lives of service and self-sacrifice. In the Bible, it is the wealthy who are condemned, and the poor who are declared blessed. The heart of Biblical instruction is a focus on a collective good, not individual good. One can find dozens of teachings on serving others, both spiritually and physically; one would be hard pressed to find passages that praise individual or personal gain in a material sense, and in fact there are many passages that directly oppose that. (The Prayer of Jabez doesn't count. It's a faddish, theologically unsound conceit based on one verse stripped away from the context of the rest of Scripture.) As far as economic systems go, the apostolic community was closer to communist than anything else (read the book of Acts). And although communism cannot work apart from the grace of the Holy Spirit because it relies on human perfection, capitalism is no better from a spiritual perspective because its basis is the exploitation and idolization of human imperfection, where the one who wins is the one who is greediest and most selfish. Although conservative teaching claims to be in line with Christian doctrine on specific issues of abortion or gay marriage (never mind that the Christian church is far from united on these issues), when it comes to the broader, overarching themes that run all through Scripture, the Republican party falls far short in many places.

Also, I'm puzzled about Christians supporting aggressive, militaristic foreign policy. Although the Bible does not totally condemn the use of force, the New Testament is extraordinarily clear that it should only be used as a last resort. Read Romans 12:14-21, or the Sermon on the Mount, and tell me how that is reconciled with neo-conservative foreign policy. "As far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone." Yes, there is an "as far as it depends on you" that allows for use of force when absolutely necessary. But invading Iraq on shady and constantly shifting reasons that have all been proven wrong, ignoring world opinion, and Bush surrounding onesself with hawkish warmongers (Cheney and Rumsfeld in particular) really doesn't say "as far as it depends on you."

Jesus was pretty bloody liberal O_O

I think its mostly because theres alot of declared athiests in the Democratic party, and on NS. I suppose I should ask WHERE you heard this quote.

Jesus was pretty bloody liberal O_O

Jesus was a hippey - he had long hair, didn't have a job...what more do you want?

I suppose that generally your could be a Christian and vote democrat. The big thing I have against them is their pro-choice agenda and their whole support of gay rights. Neither party is perfect, I just thing that as a Christian my moral views are more in line with the Republicans the the democrats.

I suppose that generally your could be a Christian and vote democrat. The big thing I have against them is their pro-choice agenda and their whole support of gay rights. Neither party is perfect, I just thing that as a Christian my moral views are more in line with the Republicans the the democrats.

Out of genuine interest.. HOW are the general republican and/or right wing moral views more in line with the teachings of Jesus ? The stance on issues like homosexuality and abortion found in the stereotypical left wing obviously disagrees with you, but their central ideas on caring and providing for the poor and sick are far closer to His message than the stereotypical right wing one -as also mentioned in the original post.

Of course, one culd simply solve this dilemma by having multiple parties in the USA with clear ideals, instead of two parties that are so broad they nowadays stand for nothing.

Jesus was pretty bloody liberal O_O

"Liberal" and "Democrat" are not the same thing.

The Democratic party believes in many principles that simply cannot be reconciled within Christianity. Republicans may have a few, but you can compromise.

Even if Jesus was more communist than Marx himself, he'd vote Republican.

Which isn't to say Jesus was more communist than Marx. Personally, I think Jesus would be a perfect moderate...but that's me.

Out of genuine interest.. HOW are the general republican and/or right wing moral views more in line with the teachings of Jesus ? The stance on issues like homosexuality and abortion found in the stereotypical left wing obviously disagrees with you, but their central ideas on caring and providing for the poor and sick are far closer to His message than the stereotypical right wing one -as also mentioned in the original post.

Of course, one culd simply solve this dilemma by having multiple parties in the USA with clear ideals, instead of two parties that are so broad they nowadays stand for nothing.

"The Liberal Conservatives and the Progressive Traditionalists offer very clear alternatives, and I'll wack anyone who says otherwise." :D

I suppose that generally your could be a Christian and vote democrat. The big thing I have against them is their pro-choice agenda and their whole support of gay rights. Neither party is perfect, I just thing that as a Christian my moral views are more in line with the Republicans the the democrats.

The bible states that we should accept all sinners, and that humans are not the children of God until they breathe.

I suppose that generally your could be a Christian and vote democrat. The big thing I have against them is their pro-choice agenda and their whole support of gay rights. Neither party is perfect, I just thing that as a Christian my moral views are more in line with the Republicans the the democrats.

There is nothing in Christ's teaching against allowing others to hold their own religious views.

There is nothing in Christ's teaching against love, the pursuit of love, or being yourself.

Perhaps your moral views come more from other people than from Christ.

I suppose that generally your could be a Christian and vote democrat. The big thing I have against them is their pro-choice agenda and their whole support of gay rights. Neither party is perfect, I just thing that as a Christian my moral views are more in line with the Republicans the the democrats.

Out of curiosity, when did Jesus say "Hey man, FUCK those faggots."

I'm looking through my bible, and I can't find it anywhere. I just see a lot of bullshit about brotherly love and forgiveness. I mean, come on, those CAN'T be good christian morals.

Out of curiosity, when did Jesus say "Hey man, FUCK those faggots."

I'm looking through my bible, and I can't find it anywhere. I just see a lot of bullshit about brotherly love and forgiveness. I mean, come on, those CAN'T be good christian morals.

Brotherly love and forgiveness is hippy liberal bullshit. They can hardly win any votes, you know. You need something strict and moral in order to win votes.

Just think how many people would convert to Orthodox Judaism if they would only reinstitute stoning outside the city gates. Christians would probably join in droves.

Out of genuine interest.. HOW are the general republican and/or right wing moral views more in line with the teachings of Jesus?

you must have missed the part where jesus says "blessed are the warmongers".

or the time that he helped push through an agreement allowing the money-changers and merchants access to just about everywhere, as he considered them good and upright human beings who were blameless in the eyes of the lord.

ooh, and the parable about how it is really easy for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven, as riches are a sign of favor from god himself. and poverty, especially for those who don't share the same skin tone as yourself, is evidence that god disfavors those people and is punishing them.

and that time that jesus handed out a big pile of rocks to the mob and said "let's start this stoning on the count of three!"

i especially liked his highest commandment - to spend all of your time pointing out the flaws in others, as you know that you are perfect in the eyes of god.

some oen voting values isntead of val-yoos, val-yoos are voting basedo n your moral beliefs instead of shit thats good for you and the rest of the people. values and val-yoos are not the same and often at odds. values are what should be voted for in government, not moral beliefs. thats our problem. oh look they are christian: they believe we should kill sinners and abortion doctors and ban homsoexuals but they want to deny us civil rights and invade other countries, but thats ok as long as they deport the homsoexuals there first! then the guy who thinks that things should be controlled and its not right to govern by individual morality doesnt have an icecubes chance in hell of winning

god bless america... with common sense, please

to spend all of your time pointing out the flaws in others, as you know that you are perfect in the eyes of god.

As opposed to pointing out the flaws in others for other reasons?

Jesus was a hippey - he had long hair, didn't have a job...what more do you want?

Good ol' Red Dwarf.

I suppose that generally your could be a Christian and vote democrat. The big thing I have against them is their pro-choice agenda and their whole support of gay rights. Neither party is perfect, I just thing that as a Christian my moral views are more in line with the Republicans the the democrats.

The day a Christian can quote me anything Jesus actually said against abortion or homosexuals is the day I will concede that one cannot be a Christian and vote Democrat.

There is nothing in Christ's teaching against allowing others to hold their own religious views.

There is nothing in Christ's teaching against love, the pursuit of love, or being yourself.


That's why Jesus would never get elected President of the US. :D