NationStates Jolt Archive

I really do - I just took my English midterm and I really want to SCREAM!!!!

(And I'm not sure if I have BB or BC for my two quarters) :(

I hate Engish
With spelling like that, I'm not surprised.

Yeah. I mean, the grammar is ok and all, but what the heck is the matter with the spelling? Geez, will someone please do something about that?

With spelling like that, I'm not surprised.
ROFLMAO

mE hate English to_ it's is so ungood;

For some English fun, head to Engrish.com (http://www.engrish.com) for Asian-style grammar.

Me fail english? That's unpossible!

Learned from the George W. Bush School of English :D

My only problem with English and language in general is the insanity of allowing the definitions of words to change over time. It seriously hampers communication. If you have a new concept that isn't elsewhere defined, give it a new word. Oh, for a language of static definitions.

My only problem with English and language in general is the insanity of allowing the definitions of words to change over time. It seriously hampers communication. If you have a new concept that isn't elsewhere defined, give it a new word. Oh, for a language of static definitions.

It's a real pain in the arse if you live to be 1000!!!

English is just a mixture of f-cked up French.

English is just a mixture of f-cked up French.

Is it? I thought it was more similar to German with a handful of bastardized french words (and some others)?

English and French are both derrivatives of German, hence they are both Germanic languages. The history of the Germanic peoples and the family of Germanic languages is really quite interesting. All I can remember is that a German tribe known as the Franks settled what is now France, which is where the word "France" and/or "French" came from. As for the origin of the English, I've no idea, and I'm too lazy to find out. Perhaps someone else can enlighten us. :)

English and French are both derrivatives of German, hence they are both Germanic languages. The history of the Germanic peoples and the family of Germanic languages is really quite interesting. All I can remember is that a German tribe known as the Franks settled what is now France, which is where the word "France" and/or "French" came from. As for the origin of the English, I've no idea, and I'm too lazy to find out. Perhaps someone else can enlighten us. :)
Since you asked so nicely, I will. Having just finished reading "The meaning of everything" by Simon Winchester I feel competent enough to do so. More follows. Just give me a bit of time.

For some English fun, head to Engrish.com (http://www.engrish.com) for Asian-style grammar.

You do of course realise that many shirts being worn by otaku-kids with Asian characters on them are mocking us too? They aren't stupid :p

English was spoken by Anglo-Saxons who went over to England and took over the native Britons. It's Germanic, but Celtic, Viking, French and Latin have kinda changed the language adding lots of new words as it grew and evolved into the mess it is.

French is Latinised Germanic really as they were converted to Catholism earlier than the Germans.

English was spoken by Anglo-Saxons who went over to England and took over the native Britons. It's Germanic, but Celtic, Viking, French and Latin have kinda changed the language adding lots of new words as it grew and evolved into the mess it is.

French is Latinised Germanic really as they were converted to Catholism earlier than the Germans.

Thanks for the info. Do you have any idea where the word "English" came from?

English was spoken by Anglo-Saxons who went over to England and took over the native Britons. It's Germanic, but Celtic, Viking, French and Latin have kinda changed the language adding lots of new words as it grew and evolved into the mess it is.

French is Latinised Germanic really as they were converted to Catholism earlier than the Germans.

Thanks for the info. Do you have any idea where the word "English" came from?

Thanks for the info. Do you have any idea where the word "English" came from?

It's a corruption of "Angle"

The Angles and the Saxons were two seperate groups that invaded Britain at different times.

Learned from the George W. Bush School of English :D

I'm currently enrolled in the George W. Bush Institute of Fuzzy Math.

English and French are both derrivatives of German, hence they are both Germanic languages. The history of the Germanic peoples and the family of Germanic languages is really quite interesting. All I can remember is that a German tribe known as the Franks settled what is now France, which is where the word "France" and/or "French" came from. As for the origin of the English, I've no idea, and I'm too lazy to find out. Perhaps someone else can enlighten us. :)

Wrong.
English is certainly a Germanic language, but French is equally certanly a Romance language (derived from Latin).

http://www.discoverfrance.net/France/Language/DF_language.shtml
http://globegate.utm.edu/french/globegate_mirror/histfren.html

The words "England" and "English" are derived from the Angles.

http://www.wordorigins.org/histeng.htm

English is just a mixture of f-cked up French.

"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that
English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow
words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways
to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."

- currently believed to originate with the legendary James Nicoll.

Picture a bunch of illiterate Saxons forced to learn Norman French, and throw in the slang of other languages over time since then, and you get English.

English and French are both derrivatives of German, hence they are both Germanic languages. The history of the Germanic peoples and the family of Germanic languages is really quite interesting. All I can remember is that a German tribe known as the Franks settled what is now France, which is where the word "France" and/or "French" came from. As for the origin of the English, I've no idea, and I'm too lazy to find out. Perhaps someone else can enlighten us. :)

French is a romance language. You know, Rome. So are Italian and Spanish. English is a Germanic language. Though we take from everyone.

Wrong.
English is certainly a Germanic language, but French is equally certanly a Romance language (derived from Latin).

http://www.discoverfrance.net/France/Language/DF_language.shtml
http://globegate.utm.edu/french/globegate_mirror/histfren.html

The words "England" and "English" are derived from the Angles.

http://www.wordorigins.org/histeng.htm

Beat me to it.

Picture a bunch of illiterate Saxons forced to learn Norman French, and throw in the slang of other languages over time since then, and you get English.

I believe it was only the new Norman court that actually would have spoken Norman French, and then a trickle down occured, rather than the entire population of the country being suddenly forced to learn another tongue.

Hmm French = Frankish?

Picture a bunch of illiterate Saxons forced to learn Norman French, and throw in the slang of other languages over time since then, and you get English.

Well, that's at least a bit closer to reality than "a mixture of f-cked up French"....

Hmm French = Frankish?
No because Frankish is Germanic, French is Latin

No because Frankish is Germanic, French is Latin

Oh okay, just curious. I'm bilingual - french/english.

If someone from 3rd Century England started talking to you, you'd go WTF are you on about?

English has altered hugely since the Saxons. Anyway, English is a mishmash of French, German, Spanish, Italian, Greek, Latin, Norse, and many other languages.

Which is why I love it :D

English English kicks the veritable behind of anything. So many words you can use.

(Sez me with 2 A's for GCSE.)

Let's hop across the frogs and toads in our tea kettle for a packet of fags.

Essex-born bi@tch!!

Are you lot american? coz im english. you lot seem to know more about my country than I do! Bow to the english, you owe your origins to us!!!

Are you lot american? coz im english. you lot seem to know more about my country than I do! Bow to the english, you owe your origins to us!!!

Born in the UK but moved to Canada as a kid. I still hail the accent.

The first inhabitants of the English isles were of course the Celts, who came from the forests and upper valleys of the Danube. They arrived around 7000 yrs ago.
While they have left little trace on modern English, they did however form the basis of Welsh, Cornish, Scots Gaelic and Irish. They also called themselves Britons (at least the ones that settled in the southern areas did) from which we get Britain and British.
Some old words still survive - combe, meaning a deep valley, which can be seen in various English villages and placenames, and torr which still survives today in Welsh, meaning a mountain top. Other words such as crag and dun still can be found.
Also various towns and villages still retain their old Celtic names - London, Dover and Kent among them.
The next big linguistic event was the Roman conquest, 43BC, and they stayed for the next 400 odd years, until 409AD.
To put that in perspective, Britain stayed under British rule for pretty much the same length of time that seperates us from the Renaissance.
Obviously this length of time had a major effect on the language of the Britons, with a hybrid Latin-based language becoming dominant.
This would have continued and perhaps we'd be speaking a language more similar to Spanish or Italian had not the next invasion not taken place.

So on to the next wave of invaders - the Teutons of the 5th and 6th Century. The Romans had gone, and the Celts no position to defend themselves and thus were easy targets for the Scandavians.
There were several waves of these Teutons - Frisians, Jutes, Saxons. All of which were linguistically Germanic.
But perhaps the most important to the English language were the Angles.
According to legend they landed in East Anglia 477AD and spread themselves south and westward pushing the Celts into Wales and Cornwall and up into Scotland.
By 547AD the Angles (originally from what is now Denmark) had established a Kingdom in what is now known as Northumberland.
The result (other than a century or two of bloodshed) was the establishing of the English language. There's still a few words still used today:
The Teutons called the Celts wealas - foreigners - from which we get the word Wales, and Welsh. The Celts first called the invaders Saxons, then Angles; King Aethelbert was known as rex Anglorum, the country became known as Engle, Englisc (-isc was pronounced as -ish) and Englaland. By the 11th Century it had become standardised as England.
This was still what is called Old English, and you would have great difficulty understanding even one word. It was written in Runes - a series of intersecting straight lines. Three runic letters still survive today in our alphabet - B, H, and R.
Still some words can be seen even today - for example: cyse, catte, weall and straet which are now more familar as cheese, cat, wall and street.

Then the Vikings introduced their Norse words in a brutal fashion, raiding and pillaging England in the eighth century; The Danes doing likewise a century later. They first ruled north-east England under a treaty but then went one further by taking the throne in 991AD and rulng for the next 25 years.
They introduced hundreds of their own words into the English language - both, same, seem, get, give, they, them, their as well as most sk words: skirt, sky, scathe, skill, skin and so on. We also got cake from them as well.

The next invasion everyone should know about - 1066AD and the French Norman conquest of Britain. For the next 300 years the French held sway over almost all areas of England. Norman French became the language of England's administration. Old English briefly came to be looked as the language of the peasant and the pleb.
So we get lots of administration and legal terms from them - accuse, adultery, crime, decree, duke(though not earl or lord which are good old 'Old English' words), inheritance, libel, larceny, pardon, parliament, revenue, treasure, verdict, warrant.

The next linguistic invasion took place in the 11th and 12th centuries - Latin. A raft of new Latin words entered around this time, thanks to the Christian missonaries (all of them Latin-speaking) who descended upon Europe and flooded the British isles searching for souls to save.
Most of them, unsurprisingly, are religious in nature and, as the missonaries came to Britain via France, a lot of the words are also French-derived. So we get abbot, angel, antichrist, chalice, cloister, font, idol, pope, priest, prophet, psalm, relic.
God was not the only word they spread. We also get many of the names of plants, fruits and trees hitherto unknown or unfamilar to the British isles: cedar, cucumber, fig, ginger, laurel, lentil, radish. Similarly with exotic animals: elephant, leopard, scorpion, tiger.

Yet even with being despised by the upper class, English did survive and as aways adapted. It borrowed several thousand words from French, transmuting itself into Middle English and finally emerged, fully established into something more like what we have today. By 1365 it has been estimated that English was incorporating over 300 French words every year.
French wasn't being spoken - rather the English was using and adapting French words into the English language.

Then came William Caxton, and the beginning of modern English. In 1474 he created and set up his own printing press. He printed the first english book - The Recuyell of the Historyes of Troye and in so doing helped establish and solidfy the English language.

Now onto the Renaissance and of course William Shakespeare.
Between 1590 and 1610 it has been estimated that around 6000 new words were being added to the English language each year. Most of them were from other cultures, as England started to expand it's borders. Words from around the world were incorporated: from every country in Europe, as well as Latin or Greek, Hindi(guru), Chinese(ketchup), Japanese(shogun), Persian(caravan, turban), Turkish(kiosk, sherbert, yoghurt), Malay(amok, sago) and even good old Irish Gaelic (trousers).

Hope this helps.

Too much to read - too big to quote. I'll just read it....now.

The first inhabitants of the English isles were of course the Celts, who came from the forests and upper valleys of the Danube. They arrived around 7000 yrs ago.

Incorrect. There have been hunter-gatherers in England for more than 10,000 years.

And there is no way of telling what their language was prior to the Roman Occupation- As No-One Wrote Anything Down.

As I recall from my History of the English Language class, modern English is the result of 5 invasions of the England. Now, can I remember what they are...Celts, Romans, Angles & Saxons, Danes/Norse, & the Franks (yay William). The Neoclassical revival of the 18th & 19th centuries also contributed a lot.

Examine certain words? Mutton or sheep? Beef or cattle? Can you guess which one was being eating by the Norman lords & which ones were being tended by the Saxon serfs?

Before the Romans they spoke Galactic Basic and most people picked a little bit of Huttese because black market influence was big at that time. Twi'leks were fluent in Galactic Basic as well.

Before Galactic Basic there was of course Elfish. But the Shire was primarily a quiet place so nobody really knew what they spoke there.

My only problem with English and language in general is the insanity of allowing the definitions of words to change over time. It seriously hampers communication. If you have a new concept that isn't elsewhere defined, give it a new word. Oh, for a language of static definitions.
Don't all languages do that? Spanish and French change from country to country, let alone over time, so does English, Arabic and basically every other language.

With spelling like that, I'm not surprised.
I noticed that too but you only get a bag of coal for second and a whipping for anything after third :(

If someone from 3rd Century England started talking to you, you'd go WTF are you on about?

English has altered hugely since the Saxons. Anyway, English is a mishmash of French, German, Spanish, Italian, Greek, Latin, Norse, and many other languages.

Which is why I love it :D

English English kicks the veritable behind of anything. So many words you can use.

(Sez me with 2 A's for GCSE.)

Languages are a very complex thing: they vary depending on various factores, and on a more general vision, there is not one pure language, just as races.

Did you know the letter 'X' comes from the Japanese character for "Symbol which cannot be pronouced"?

Did you know the letter 'Q' was adopted into the English language in 1599 when an English merchant traded it for the letter 'ﺦ' with a Persian king?

Did you know the word 'Home' is Ancient Greek for "The beginning of a line"? That's why the "Home" button on your keyboard returns you to the start of a line when pressed.

It's a real pain in the arse if you live to be 1000!!!

If you live long enough to speak the language it's a problem. Put a person from an inner city with a person from the southern States, with a person from the midwest, with a person from Boston, with a person from Australia, with a person from London, with a person Canada and see how many misunderstandings there are.

Don't all languages do that? Spanish and French change from country to country, let alone over time, so does English, Arabic and basically every other language.

Just saying its a dysfunctional method of communication.

Don't all languages do that? Spanish and French change from country to country, let alone over time, so does English, Arabic and basically every other language.

No, not all languages do - take contemporary Ltin, for example, where there is pretty much de facto authority (the Vatican) which considers how best to render terms like 'fax machine' or 'cable modem' into the language and publishes a list of new coinages each year.

No, not all languages do - take contemporary Ltin, for example, where there is pretty much de facto authority (the Vatican) which considers how best to render terms like 'fax machine' or 'cable modem' into the language and publishes a list of new coinages each year.

Facimali Machiniod
Cabalus Modemius

NeoLatin is easy

No, not all languages do - take contemporary Ltin, for example, where there is pretty much de facto authority (the Vatican) which considers how best to render terms like 'fax machine' or 'cable modem' into the language and publishes a list of new coinages each year.
Yes. I though about Latin as soon as I posted, but can it still be considered a real language seeing that it doesn't have real "people" that speak it?

Yes. I though about Latin as soon as I posted, but can it still be considered a real language seeing that it doesn't have real "people" that speak it?

Lawyers, the Clergy and Latin teachers are not 'real' people, or are they just not real 'people'?

I guess 'indigenous' or 'native' speakers is what you mean.

Lawyers, the Clergy and Latin teachers are not 'real' people, or are they just not real 'people'?
I think s/he meant 'native speakers'.
edit: :eek: you changed it! cheater!

Lawyers, the Clergy and Latin teachers are not 'real' people, or are they just not real 'people'?

I guess 'indigenous' or 'native' speakers is what you mean.
You are right. I should have written "seeing it doesn't have a 'real' people that speak it". What a difference an article makes!

You are right. I should have written "seeing it doesn't have a 'real' people that speak it". What a difference an article makes!

Yup: this just raises questions as to whether artificial languages like Esperanto or Interlingua should be consider to be real languages or not, despite the fact that there are no native speakers - although it is entirely possible that some speakers grew up with it as part of a bilingual youth.

Yup: this just raises questions as to whether artificial languages like Esperanto or Interlingua should be consider to be real languages or not, despite the fact that there are no native speakers - although it is entirely possible that some speakers grew up with it as part of a bilingual youth.
They definitely are real languages, just as Latin is. A language doesn't need native speakers to justify its existence. :)

Screw English. I should start a petition to get the US national language changed to American, Derived from the American continent but rarely accepted of for its abusive tendencies.

Aaaargh! (exclamative) What am i doing? (interrogative) This is the kind of stuff i hate to do in English Language at school, (declarative) and now i'm reading it in my spare time! What have you done to me!!!

Oh okay, just curious. I'm bilingual - french/english.

There are help groups for curious bilinguists

What have you done to me!!!

"What have you done to me?" - even though it is a rhetorical question, it shuld still receive a question mark, rather than an excess of exclamtion marks.

"What have you done to me?" - even though it is a rhetorical question, it shuld still receive a question mark, rather than an excess of exclamtion marks.

Sorry, got carried away with exclamation marks and forgot about the question mark, but at least no-one can say i ended it with a preposition, which i don't have a problem with anyway.

Split infinitives though, even i don't like them.

Sorry, got carried away with exclamation marks and forgot about the question mark, but at least no-one can say i ended it with a preposition, which i don't have a problem with anyway.

Are they something up with which you will not put?


or

These two guys are standing at the bus stop and one of them asks the other,"What time does the bus come at?", to which he receives the response, "Now, you see what you have done there? - you've finished a sentence with a proposition, which you shouldn't do. Try again and this time try not to make the same mistake". The first guy looks at him and then asks, "What time does the bus come at, you pedantic little shit?"

Are they something up with which you will not put?

Yes, to really annoy me you should use one.[/IRONY]

If English lessons actually taught people how to spell, pronounce and use grammar correctly, rather than all this interpreting shakespeare bollocks, we would be better off.

Probably better to raise a child in a foreign country and have them learn English there.

me fail english? that's unpossible!

My only problem with English and language in general is the insanity of allowing the definitions of words to change over time. It seriously hampers communication. If you have a new concept that isn't elsewhere defined, give it a new word. Oh, for a language of static definitions.


If you were a language student, which I seriously doubt lol, then you would understand that language cannot be static - static languages die, they become irrelevant to immediate life.

Languages evolve, just like organisms. They grow, they shift, they come into contact with other languages and are affected by them, sometimes greatly, sometimes in a minor way. Whichever way, language can not by its very nature be static: language communicates, and seeks to communicate, things which were previously/are incommunicable, ineffable.

Static language is dead language. :)

obviously you failed if you can even get the name of the calss right - j/k just giving you a hard time I have my eng. mid term tomarrow!

My only problem with English and language in general is the insanity of allowing the definitions of words to change over time. It seriously hampers communication. If you have a new concept that isn't elsewhere defined, give it a new word. Oh, for a language of static definitions.
Don't all languages do that? Spanish and French change from country to country, let alone over time, so does English, Arabic and basically every other language.

As Vanaheim-Thorstedding said, this is the distinction between living (English, French, German) and dead languages (Latin, Sanskrit).

(It's partly due to Latin's being dead, that it is useful for scientific naming.)

ROFLMAO
Are you ROFLMFAOWTFBBQKTHXBI?

It's a corruption of "Angle"

The Angles and the Saxons were two seperate groups that invaded Britain at different times.
And the Jutes
This isnt a hit out against you Kan.

France was Celtic as was Britain The word Britain comes from the Latin Prettanic*Sp* which ment Land of the painted people.

As they were all part of the Un-unified Celtic Empire their languages would be the same/similiar.

As for thr splitting of the two langiges :p Gothic and Latin changed it while the Brits got the Latin when the Angles/Saxons/Jutes arrived it changed Britain drasticaly.

Some Brits fled England to France and thats how the Provence? of Breton got its name later on they were with William the Conquerer to 'Liberate" Britain.

Franks came after Romans and conquered France and Germany but the areas of Saxony and Blah kept their autonomy to some extent.
Spoke Frenchish Latin because of the influence of The Roman Empire but were originally from Germany or something.

A half arsed attempt to inform people of the useless information ive picked up on my travels. :rolleyes:

I believe it was only the new Norman court that actually would have spoken Norman French, and then a trickle down occured, rather than the entire population of the country being suddenly forced to learn another tongue.
I heard that up to the 19thC that the laws were written in French so that the common folk couldnt complain when they were being screwed over.
Especially hard for the Irish and Scottish losing their sheep farms and then the kelp. :(

The first inhabitants of the English isles were of course the Celts, who came from the forests and upper valleys of the Danube. They arrived around 7000 yrs ago.
Hope this helps.
The Celts were not the first the Picts wer before them they got shoved North.

I heard that up to the 19thC that the laws were written in French so that the common folk couldnt complain when they were being screwed over.

I really don't believe that the laws were written in French - if anything I would believe Latin before that, but I don't think that was the case either: do you have any corroborative evidence for your claim?