NationStates Jolt Archive

What is the purpose of war?
Sure, there are a few reasons why nations could go to war, but why so much.
These are my reasons for war: 1. Self-defense
2. err (I cannot think of any more :( )

Please, if you have any more reasons bring them forward.

The Purpose of war is not to kill your enemies before they kill you. War is more than just controlled violence, it's violence with a purpose. It's enforcing your government's decision through that violence. It's showing that your government will do what it will regardless or what other nations may decide.

Read Starship Troopers. That will explain all.

First, this belongs in General. I'll move it now. Secondly, war exists because it reamains the most effective means of forcing another mass of people to bend to your will. Read Clausewitz's On War for a more detailed analysis.

"War is simply an extension of politics by other means." My nation's motto. Heeee.

Checkers isn't very exciting. At least that was the conclusion we came to when I asked.

Ideaological rifts, religion, power greed, revenge, and in ancient times, just because. It's all part of human nature, really.

Ideaological rifts, religion, power greed, revenge, and in ancient times, just because. It's all part of human nature, really.

Don't forget hunger, jealousy, self-ishness, etc. :(

Don't forget hunger, jealousy, self-ishness, etc. :(
Oh. Those too. There's probably a lot more out there.

War is basicaly a human instict just on a larger scale. reason's for war: land, wealth, power, freedom, independance, political ideals, religion. One must remember though, not to start a fight if they have nothing to gain by winning. Read Sun Tzu's book "the art of war" it explaines everything. :sniper:

Oh. Those too. There's probably a lot more out there.

Yes. Far too many, if you ask me. I think the saddest is when people go to war simply over a misunderstanding. :(

largely because nobody in power wants to go out and personally have to fight the people in power elsewhere when they want to force others to do what they say.

War is the ultimate expression of national will, be that will for good or evil, it's about making others agree to your demands, when other means of recourse have failed completely.

War exists, because people's idea on issues clash, and sometimes the opposing idea threatens a nation. Self defense against a region is another reason, and protection of one's own political, spiritual, and religious ideas.

This is how World War I started:
(I will assume you know the implications of the Triple Alliance and the Triple Entente)

Austra-Hungary: "Damn you Serbia! You killed Mr. and Mrs. Ferdinand!"
Serbia: "Bite me!"
Germany: "We will defend the Austro-Hungarian Empire. Show em' who's boss!"
Austra-Hungary: "Serbia, you will meet our 10 demands or face destruction!"
Russia: "Dont worry little Serbs, the Motherland will protect you"
Serbia: "We can only accept 8 of your conditions"
Austra-Hungary: "Fuck you! It's go time!"
Russia: "Leave them alone! We must go to war against the Austro-Hungarian Empire"
Germany: "We must defend the Austro-Hungarian Empire! ATTACK!"
Germany: "Damn those French. We defeated you in Franco-Prussian War and we'll do it again!"
Britain: "How dare you declare war on France! I declare war on you Germany!"
Japan: "Um...we're bored of killing innocent Chinese civilians all the time. We declare war on Germany too."

Thus, The Great War begins almost accidentally. Very sad when we look back on it.

largely because nobody in power wants to go out and personally have to fight the people in power elsewhere when they want to force others to do what they say.

Which brings to mind a SciFi novella I once read about war being outlawed and any dispute not resolvable by peaceful means would require the leaders of the nations involved to fight each other to decide. Interesting. I would vote for Aaaanald! :D

because you touch yourself at night

Because we all know how things worked out for Nevile Chamberlain.

Because we all know how things worked out for Nevile Chamberlain.

What is this in response too?

because you touch yourself at night

I do??? :eek:

No WONDER I need glasses! :D

What is the purpose of war?
Sure, there are a few reasons why nations could go to war, but why so much.
These are my reasons for war: 1. Self-defense
2. err (I cannot think of any more :( )

Please, if you have any more reasons bring them forward.

War is human nature. Humans kill others because they have a natural urge to do so. Other humans(cowards) indulge in their natural urge of violence and war by watching violent movies, playing violent games, or watching violent tv programs...

War is human nature. Humans kill others because they have a natural urge to do so. Other humans(cowards) indulge in their natural urge of violence and war by watching violent movies, playing violent games, or watching violent tv programs...

I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one. Look at the world population compared to the number of murderers. I believe we have an instinct to kill [animals] for food, but not fellow humans.

What is this in response too?
Why there is war. Because the concept of Peace is dangerous, had people listened to Mussolini and not chamberlain, there would have been no WWII.

Why there is war. Because the concept of Peace is dangerous, had people listened to Mussolini and not chamberlain, there would have been no WWII.

Very true. Or if Chamberlain had listened to Hitler instead of being an arrogant prick. Hitler offered Britain peace if they would step asside while Germany annexed Poland. Chamberlain is the cause of WWII.

No, that would have allowed Hitler to continue to expand, as Directives 21 and 32 had shown, there was no satiating him. Had they declared war on Germany after Auchluss as Mussolini wanted, there would have been no problem

The Purpose of war is not to kill your enemies before they kill you. War is more than just controlled violence, it's violence with a purpose. It's enforcing your government's decision through that violence. It's showing that your government will do what it will regardless or what other nations may decide.

All government is enforced by violence... That is the nature of government, and the one thing that sets it apart from the rest of our social institutions.

Because it's every living thing's nature to fight for what it wants.

No one's really quite sure. It's a good question.

Some Anthropologists theorize that the ultimate cause of war is competition over resources caused by rising population density. But that's just a theory.

Henlein said supported that thesis in Starship Troopers.

No, that would have allowed Hitler to continue to expand, as Directives 21 and 32 had shown, there was no satiating him. Had they declared war on Germany after Auchluss as Mussolini wanted, there would have been no problem

Hitler would have continued to expand to the East, invoking a war with Russia that Germany would have won by 1942.
Too many people blindly follow the Allied war-time propaganda of Hitler as someone out to conquer the whole world. He was not. He never wanted to fight Britain, he respected them as an Aryan-like people. He had no means of attacking the US or Canada. And I must admit declaring war on America was retarded. But still, all ee wanted more land for his German people, and the Jews moved out of his Reich. Period.

I know that most war is caused by greed.
Oh and thanks for all of the book suggestions, I needed more books to read. :D
One of the reasons I nade this thread was to see why we, as rulers of 'nations', go to war.

ps-another book that discusses war, power, greed,etc. is T.H. White's Once and Future King
I loved that book!

I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one. Look at the world population compared to the number of murderers. I believe we have an instinct to kill [animals] for food, but not fellow humans.

Well you have to take into account that we have almost 7 billion people on this planet and that number is growing at an alarmingly fast rate therefore population control would be a natural reason for humans to kill other humans.

Because it's every living thing's nature to fight for what it wants.
I highly disagree with that.
I do not think that all creatures are corrupt.
Only humans, yet the other beasts of this world are nit all vegetarians.

Well you have to take into account that we have almost 7 billion people on this planet and that number is growing at an alarmingly fast rate therefore population control would be a natural reason for humans to kill other humans.

Now you are changing your tune. Before you were advocating murder simply because we are humans:

War is human nature. Humans kill others because they have a natural urge to do so. Other humans(cowards) indulge in their natural urge of violence and war by watching violent movies, playing violent games, or watching violent tv programs...

I believe that as our resources grow scarce, there will be more killing, but not as means of controlling the population. No one commits murder thinking "Geez, I hope everyone appreciates what I'm doing for them."

And now that I think of it.....how many people have you killed?
Or are you one of thse "cowards" you speak of?

Because it's every living thing's nature to fight for what it wants.

Every living thing, from humans to bacteria, have 2 primary jobs:
1. To reproduce
2. To survive

Every living thing, from humans to bacteria, have 2 primary jobs:
1. To reproduce
2. To survive
3, actually:
1. glorify God
2.Survive
3 help others

3, actually:
1. glorify God
2.Survive
3 help others

I'm speaking in terms of the real-world.
Perhaps in your little churchy world what you said is considered a rational thought, but not here.

Now you are changing your tune. Before you were advocating murder simply because we are humans:



I believe that as our resources grow scarce, there will be more killing, but not as means of controlling the population. No one commits murder thinking "Geez, I hope everyone appreciates what I'm doing for them."

And now that I think of it.....how many people have you killed?
Or are you one of thse "cowards" you speak of?

I never changed my tune. It is because of the human nature to reproduce that many humans are inherently born with natural feelings that leads to them inflicting or at least wanting to inflict damage upon other humans so that the human need of procreation is checked by the human need to destroy other human life. Life is all about balance you see.

Every living thing, from humans to bacteria, have 2 primary jobs:
1. To reproduce
2. To survive

and as far as our genes are concerned, the second is just a means to the first

I highly disagree with that.
I do not think that all creatures are corrupt.
Only humans, yet the other beasts of this world are nit all vegetarians.

There's nothing currupt about it. It's just the way the world works.
From a religious standpoint (which I assume is where you're comming from judging from your last post) the only thing that makes it "corrupt" in humans is that we have a free will and knowledge between right and wrong and that should override our natural tendancies (in which case, it decides whether the fight is justified or not, which again doesn't exclude all war). Either way, my original statement still stands: There is war because it's in all living things' nature to fight for their desires.

I never changed my tune. It is because of the human nature to reproduce that many humans are inherently born with natural feelings that leads to them inflicting or at least wanting to inflict damage upon other humans so that the human need of procreation is checked by the human need to destroy other human life. Life is all about balance you see.

You've gone from a right-wing American to a pussy-ass Liberal.

At first it was: "all people have natural instincts to kill"
And now its: "many people might want to hurt others"

And there is no human need to destory human life. I dont know what kind of Satanic textbook you are learning from, but I suggest putting it away.

War is the result of civilization.

As civilization is built, agriculture develops and improves. As agriculture develops, population density can increase (i.e city forming). As population density increase, human happiness generally goes down and most of the problems of governed society rise from this.

In the earliest times, this manifested in the civilized societies living in their cities, hoarding grain they grew themselves, with the 'uncivilized' barbarians as free nomads living day-to-day, off the land and their herds. Over time, the civilized people take up more and more of the available land; worse, they pollute local water sources, chop down local forests, ruin the land through overfarming (see: Middle East), destroy grazing lands and natural food sources, become breeding grounds for contagious diseases, etc. The nomads decide to end two problems in one swoop by raiding the cities for food and such.

At those times, with language barriers, not to mention all-pervading cultural barriers tied with locality and birth, made diplomacy a not so likely option between large clashing groups of people. What were the other options? The nomads get to say, well, we'll just move out of THIS land, and THIS land, and eventually we'll have no lands for our animals and we'll starve just so the city people can build shit. Or the city people get to say, "hey, let's invite the horse barbarians over for dinner!"

No. So war starts. The city people build walls. They use spears in masses and bows/slings to defend their static location. The nomads come in waves, using group tactics or individual warrior ethic, often on horseback or otherwise lightly travelling. Evolution of tactics, technology, and the eventual rise of smelly, diseased civilization in every corner of the globe.

Thus, war.

Now I'm gonna go play Age of Kings.

You've gone from a right-wing American to a pussy-ass Liberal.

At first it was: "all people have natural instincts to kill"
And now its: "many people might want to hurt others"

And there is no human need to destory human life. I dont know what kind of Satanic textbook you are learning from, but I suggest putting it away.

no human need to kill other humans??....I think im more of a Hitlerist then you are....and please explain to me why my statement turned me into a "liberal pussy"(i think its the liberal pussies who are AGAINST war and violence,not for it :rolleyes: )

P.S: You should also know that Hitler was heavily involved in Satanic Occultism therefore your anti-satanic remark insults the man that you claim to praise(judging by your screename) and please there is no need to use vulgarity against me as I have tryed to just intelligantly argue with you and not turn our conversation into a flame war.

Full Metal Jacket said it best:

"God has a hard on for Marines, because we kill everything we see. He plays His games, we play ours. To show our appreciation for so much power, we keep heaven packed with fresh souls. God was here before the Marine Corps, so you can give your heart to Jesus, but your ass belongs to the corps."

So by causing war, we provide God with fresh souls.

Otherwise, we do so to preserve ideals, to compete with others, and, at the risk of sounding heartless, so somebody else doesn't kill us before we kill them.

Not great reasons, but there you are...

Why is there war? Same question as to why can't we all get along.

Well, I guess that my question was partially answered. Thank you to all of those who participated. Now I shall go read some suggested books.

And remember:

No :mp5: or :sniper: or :gundge:
Thanks :p