NationStates Jolt Archive

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?

Unpopular speech is the kind in need of the most protection. The "V chip" is present in every TV sold today. Parents can program their TV to censor programming for their children. If they can't be bothered, Fuck 'em. I shouldn't have to watch disney channel crap because you squirted out a squalling infant.

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?

Obviously some people want to see it. In fact, more than don't. Thats how capitalism works. If everyone was as "moral" as you, the networks wouldn't show things that offended them.

No-one forces you to buy a TV. Parents should be responsible for what their own children see, not the government.

desperate housewives= awesome.
and there are a lot of parental control devices available.

It shows contraception in a positive light? GASP!! The HORROR! THE HORROR! should be shown in a positive light more frikkin often...

The exeptions to free speech include slander, sedition, antagonism, and adult commercial advertising. Not one thing in there stopping people from talking about "evil" things. A 40 year old having sex with a 17 year old is disgusting, but as I understand it he went along with it? That is not rape. Also, media is included with freedom of the press, not freedom of speech. Its stragne, I know, but as newspapers were essentially the only media of the time no one thought to say freedom of the "media" instead of press. You have a good moral point, in my opinion, behind this all but your argument is way off. I think its gross too, but these people have the right to do that until we take it away form them.

P.S. I don't watch Desparate Housewives, but I defend the rights of those who choose to.

Solution: Do not allow your kids to watch "evil" shows. Wrap them up in cotton wool - don't do it to the rest of the society.

I think its gross too, but these people have the right to do that until we take it away form them.
Good luck. The supreme court will shoot you down.

You can't censor everything. Children will always run into this sort of thing, if not from TV then from other forms of media or their peers. What really needs to be done is for the parents to teach the kids to censor themselves. They need to be taught that what they're seeing isn't necessarily an accurate representation of reality and to not copy everything they see.
Rape, aldultery, and abusive drinking aren't caused because someone saw it on TV and decided to imitate it.

im not real fond of censorship. ill let the market decide what should be offered on TV.

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?


You're an idiot.

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.



Yawn.

Whole country? Ex-squeeze me? Baking powder?

Unless you are forced by eeeeeeeeeevil liberals to watch this program, you are not being shown it.

You are making the choice to pick up your remote, flick, get offended, keep watching, and work yourself into a foaming frenzy. Most sensible people would turn over and remember not to watch it again.

Commando, I dont like those shows either. But censoring them will only make the problem worse!!

I feel that preachers and priests incite the public in a way that causes a great deal of discrimination and derision based on superficial and artificial differences.

I find it offensive when someone calls something that I find entertaining harmless fun "evil".

Why don't we control that speech?

Commando, I dont like those shows either. But censoring them will only make the problem worse!!Seconded

Great point, all people need to do is change the channel if they dislike what they see on tv.

Good luck. The supreme court will shoot you down.

Yes, for sure. I didn't mean I was actually planning on it. The point is that if the supreme court did decide that they didn't have that right, they wouldn't have that right anymore. Everyone talks about rights, but what are they exactly? Something that someone told you you could have two hundred years before you were born? The only rights anyone truly has is the rights that everyone else is willing to let them have. If my free speech is suppressed and I take it to court and even to the supreme court, if the court doesn't help me then I don't truly have that right. The only way then to save me would be by phtsical force. Its a shame that with all of our civilization, nothing can truly be enforced without physical force.

Yeah, just use the V chip. Or don't watch TV, with your moral values the only thing I can imagine that would be completely non-offending would be the bible. And why are you on the internet? Like the internet is rife with morals or something. *tsk's*

If you hate sex and immorality on TV you hate America.
There, I said it.

But seriously, the entire point of freedom of speach is to protect all points of view. I don't agree with what you say, but will defend to the death your right to say it. Sound familiar?

What if people go together and decided that christianity is bad for society and should not be shown in a positive light on TV? You'd be foaming at the mouth and screaming freedom of speach.

You know what I think the funniest part of this post is? The fact that he describes the show in such detail that one can only conclude that he watches it.

You know why these fundamentalists hate us? They hate our freedom.

You know what I think the funniest part of this post is? The fact that he describes the show in such detail that one can only conclude that he watches it.

I haven't watched the show and I refuse to but I have heard others describe it.

I haven't watched the show and I refuse to but I have heard others describe it.
Hearsay is inadmissible.

You know why these fundamentalists hate us? They hate our freedom.

How have I brought religion into this? A religious person or atheist could agree with me.

How have I brought religion into this? A religious person or atheist could agree with me.
This atheist can't.

Desperate Housewives is only a hit because 1) It's a scripted series as opposed to just another "Reality Show" which people are bound to get tired of and 2) It touches on sexual and morally questionable subjects in a vein that's more graphic than what's ever been seen in American drama until recently.

And even then, it's still relatively puritannical and tame compared to what you might see in European television.

Now this is for anyone else reading because I don't expect Commando2 or any of his like-minded ilk to read this, much less respond in a rational, diplomatic manner.

Banning anything that is a long ways off from blatant unabashed pornography from public viewing (as opposed to private viewing such as cable channels) just because it one finds it objectionable (ie Will and Grace portraying gays as normal people with normal lives as opposed to bestial child molesters like every fundamentalist views them) is not going to make the issue go away. It's the same reason abstinence-only education never works; just because you don't talk about doesn't mean it's not still there, and people will come across it anyways eventually.

And as the legendary PTL Ministries Scandal might point out, those who proclaim moral outrage the loudest are seldom the most pious.

I haven't watched the show and I refuse to but I have heard others describe it.
You find company with people who watch it?

Ya no Commando2, your type is already winning the battle against anime.... with it having 2 be censored for TV and all (tho it's not as censored as badly as possible i still dislike censorship of anything)

You find company with people who watch it?
For research purposes only I'm sure.

You find company with people who watch it?

I have debated this subject before and I've taken notes from both sides.

Ah. So, correct me if I'm wrong, but what you're saying is...

"Yeah. Freedom of speech is okay. But only if it follows this set of moral criteria. Yes, my moral criteria. No, not anyone else's moral criteria, mine, and once they break it they deserve to lose any sort of freedom of speech rights they have."

Wow. Bit zealous, huh?

How have I brought religion into this? A religious person or atheist could agree with me.
I highly doubt most athiests play the immorality card whenever they don't like something.

Also, this show is freedom of speech. The fact that it is speaking to a large number of people is immaterial. It is expressing something you are free to agree with, disagree with, or turn off. You have the right not to listen, you don't have the right to force others to do the same.

Ah. So, correct me if I'm wrong, but what you're saying is...

"Yeah. Freedom of speech is okay. But only if it follows this set of moral criteria. Yes, my moral criteria. No, not anyone else's moral criteria, mine, and once they break it they deserve to lose any sort of freedom of speech rights they have."

Wow. Bit zealous, huh?


Its shows like this that are spreading AIDS and causing murders(abortions) because of their promotion of this crap! I value life more than this fake freedom they hide behind.

Its shows like this that are spreading AIDS and causing murders(abortions) because of their promotion of this crap! I value life more than this fake freedom they hide behind.
AIDS is spread by the exchange of bodily fluids, not television signals. Abortion isn't murder, it's a good way to make sure more murderers aren't born. The higher rate of abortion has been linked to lower violent crime rates because unwanted children aren't being abused and neglected, thus priming them for a life as a criminal.

Commando2, you seem stupid to me. Very stupid.

Personally, I don't like soap opera type stuff, it's just stupid and boring.

about this:

My arguement on the ban the [offensive symbol, whatever it may be] threads is basically the same one I'd use here. Who gave you the authority to ban this show?

Its shows like this that are spreading AIDS and causing murders(abortions) because of their promotion of this crap! I value life more than this fake freedom they hide behind.
But wait, you complained the promoted contraceptives. Wouldn't they stop both disease and pregnancy? Your argument fails.

Also: TV doesn't make anyone do anything. TV for the most part simply shows general trends in culture. Sure it can through in a few funny or annoying catchphrases along the way, but for the most part it is simply attempting to reflect current trends. It may expose people to things they aren't normally familiar with, including so called immorality. If you are really all that faithful to begin with I find it hard to believe a half hour broadcast will lead you down the road of decadence.

:mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: Personally, I don't like soap opera type stuff, it's just stupid and boring.

about this:

My arguement on the ban the [offensive symbol, whatever it may be] threads is basically the same one I'd use here. Who gave you the authority to ban this show?
he did. BUt seriously, I agree with you.

DOWN WITH SOAP OPERAS!!! DOWN WITH STUPIDITY!!!

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?

Either, turn off the teevee, or change to another channel, because "cultural marxism" is on the airwaves, everywhere.

The exeptions to free speech include slander, sedition, antagonism, and adult commercial advertising. Not one thing in there stopping people from talking about "evil" things. A 40 year old having sex with a 17 year old is disgusting, but as I understand it he went along with it? That is not rape. Also, media is included with freedom of the press, not freedom of speech. Its stragne, I know, but as newspapers were essentially the only media of the time no one thought to say freedom of the "media" instead of press. You have a good moral point, in my opinion, behind this all but your argument is way off. I think its gross too, but these people have the right to do that until we take it away form them.
Legally its jail bait unless he us 18.
Try sleeping with a 7 year old who went along with it than tell me that isn't rape. Same deal...both underage but went along with it.

The exeptions to free speech include slander, sedition, antagonism, and adult commercial advertising. Not one thing in there stopping people from talking about "evil" things. A 40 year old having sex with a 17 year old is disgusting, but as I understand it he went along with it? That is not rape. Also, media is included with freedom of the press, not freedom of speech. Its stragne, I know, but as newspapers were essentially the only media of the time no one thought to say freedom of the "media" instead of press. You have a good moral point, in my opinion, behind this all but your argument is way off. I think its gross too, but these people have the right to do that until we take it away form them.

I don't think she's 40, try mid 20s and she is hot. If you know a 17 year old guy who wouldn't have sex with her, you know a 17 year guy old who is either gay or has a medical condition that should be looked into.

By the way she did a bikini pictorial in Maxim that was droolafull :p

Legally its jail bait unless he us 18.
Try sleeping with a 7 year old who went along with it than tell me that isn't rape. Same deal...both underage but went along with it.
I'm not really into 7 year olds, so I won't conduct that experiment, but it would be hard to find a jury to convict a woman of statutory rape for screwing a willing 17 year old male.

morally questionable TV shows dont cause AIDS, if you want to blame something you should blame the lack of contraseption being used, but, oh wait, that would upset jesus...looks like its STDs all round then.

Commando2, you've dodged this basic fact like a bullet, but I see your agenda loud and clear and I'm on to you.
You are a militant winger who wishes to legislate morality.
Iran would be the perfect nation for you to move to, where the government's idea of ethics is heavily enforced by the fascist police state in power. It's also in favor of everything you propose... or didn't you realize that?
Is this the America you wish for?
Plain and simple (and let's not bullshit a bullshitter, mmmkay?), you are a Christian zealout cut from the same cloth as your tyrannical Islamic counterparts.
And an idiot for forgetting that without these rights you complain about, you'd be practicing under the government's chosen religious sect, statistically not probable that it would be your current Christian branch.

The flipside to having civil liberties is having personal responsibility. It's nice that you appear to have convictions, but it's sad (and un-American) for you to think it's okay to legislate them for everyone else.
Do you think God gave us free will only so we could form governments to undermine his decision?

I'm not really into 7 year olds, so I won't conduct that experiment, but it would be hard to find a jury to convict a woman of statutory rape for screwing a willing 17 year old male.

I think a woman would have a hard time not finding an willing 17 year old. I remember when I was 17, I was willing as hell. I woke up willing, I walk around all day willing, and I went to bed willing.

Soap Operas must be banned because they suck and the acting is really bad. ;)

Soap Operas must be banned because they suck and the acting is really bad. ;)
But they have such brilliant plot twists, evil twins, amnesia, dead characters coming back.

Its shows like this that are spreading AIDS and causing murders(abortions) because of their promotion of this crap! I value life more than this fake freedom they hide behind.

You were saying that a show depicting use of contraceptives is a bad thing, but now you blame AIDS on the same show? I don't recall anyone getting AIDS from properly using a condom, do you?

Do you think God gave us free will only so we could form governments to undermine his decision?

You're a genius, you know that, don't you?

This seems to be a recoring theme, not just in the media. Extreme social and political freedoms lead eventually to a socitety which is held together on the basis of the lowest common denominator. Why that is is beyond me. Any ideas people?

This seems to be a recoring theme, not just in the media. Extreme social and political freedoms lead eventually to a socitety which is held together on the basis of the lowest common denominator. Why that is is beyond me. Any ideas people?
Because it's profit driven and the lowest common denominator sells to the majority of sheeple.

You're a genius, you know that, don't you?
Whether that statement was sarcastic or not, I fully stand by my previous statement.

Because it's profit driven and the lowest common denominator sells to the majority of sheeple.
Ditto. Stupidity sells, plain and simple, becuase most people aren't very gifted.

Because it's profit driven and the lowest common denominator sells to the majority of sheeple.

Thing is, I am fairly certian that there is a highest common denominator. Something/someone who everyone can agree was good or is a good thing so why does that never work?

Ditto. Stupidity sells, plain and simple, becuase most people aren't very gifted.

Then how come Yes Minister and The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy were so sucessful?

Whether that statement was sarcastic or not, I fully stand by my previous statement.

That was not the least bit sarcastic, I thought it was very well said.

Thing is, I am fairly certian that there is a highest common denominator. Something/someone who everyone can agree was good or is a good thing so why does that never work?
The more sophisticated you get the more people won't get it. But everyone has an instinctive lust for sex and violence.

Then how come Yes Minister and The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy were so sucessful?I don't know what Yes Minister is, but was Hitch Hiker's Guide as successful as The Davinci Code?, or a some of Steven King's work?

As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children.
Here's an idea for you:DON'T LET YOUR KIDS WATCH THAT STUFF. *You* are the one responsable for monitoring what your kids watch. Not the government. You can't watch your kids all the time? SO WHAT? Tell them they can't watch it, and punish them if they do, and THEY WON'T WATCH IT. Oh, and you see that little black and white box in the upper left corner of the screen that shows up when the show starts? That's the rating. It tells you how mature the viewers of the show should be. G? Fine, let kids watch it. PG? Maybe... PG-13? You might want to see it for yourself and see if your kid can handle it. R? Just say no.

See, if parents actually ACTED LIKE PARENTS and monitored what their kids watched, and took approriate action, this sort of thign WOULDn'T BE A PROBLEM.

Of course, I'm a bit...irritated...at people who want more censorship on TV. I am an otaku, a lover of anime. Most anime comes over here fine. How, due to overly sensitive people, anime also gets its fair share of cuts and edits, many of which are either ridiculous(Disco Guns in Gundam SEED, the Hammer Gun in One Piece, the POINTING FINGERS OF DOOM in Yugioh,(all of which are in palce of guns), just about ANY word instead of "death", "die", or "kill"("Shadow Realm" & "another dimension" being the most stupid, "taken away" and "gone" being the most overused), replacing GOOD music and diaolauge with crappy ones) or pointless(blood edits(oh noes! Blood! WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE!), religous references(oh noes the Pope will get us if we don't remove religous symbols), changing of "marine" to "navy" in One Piece(erm, wha?)). Go surf around a couple "(insert anime here(DBZ, Shaman King, One Piece, and Yugioh are good palces to start) Uncensored" sites, and you'll see what I mean.

After seeing all the butchering that just goes on in anime, I'm really not in the mood for MORE TV censorship. I'm a firm believer in "it's the PARENTS' job to make sure that their kids aren't watching/playing/listening to anything they don't want them to, NOT the government's".

Commando2, I agree with you wholeheartedly, most of the programs on TV are crap, pure and simple. But really, it's not up to the governement to decide what you should and should not watch. That matter is best left up to their parents. Those programs aren't meant for the younger age group, anyway. You're right, though. It is crap. People like Howard Stern disgust me (that's saying something. Do you know how hard it is to disgust a 16 year old?)

Its shows like this that are spreading AIDS and causing murders(abortions) because of their promotion of this crap! I value life more than this fake freedom they hide behind.

you're blaming desperate houswives on AIDS and "murder" (abortion is murder in your view) ?
glaiven

Then how come Yes Minister and The Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy were so sucessful?
You're speaking of a medium here that's rediculously undersold in the market (books)...
NationStates isn't an accurate reflection on our society's average intelligence.
More people watch mind numbing reality television shows every evening than read a single novel all year long.

Anyone think it wrong that a whinging minority dictates what everyone else can and can't watch?

If you don't like it, switch over.

a $500,000 fine for someone accidentally flashing a nipple. Jeez, what is wrong with you yanks?

That was not the least bit sarcastic, I thought it was very well said.
Damn, then thanks for the high compliment!

morally questionable TV shows dont cause AIDS, if you want to blame something you should blame the lack of contraseption being used, but, oh wait, that would upset jesus...looks like its STDs all round then.
i completely agree, i just couldn't find the proper way to say it
so they're saying that abortion is murder, but you can't use contraceptives because jesus says so? prolife is not black and white (i actually got that from a christian church), but i don't know where i'm going

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?

I hate to be blunt but if u dont like the T.V shows then why dont u simply not watch them. the fastest way to bring down the show is to not watch it.

Anyone think it wrong that a whinging minority dictates what everyone else can and can't watch?

If you don't like it, switch over.

a $500,000 fine for someone accidentally flashing a nipple. Jeez, what is wrong with you yanks?
I flash my nipples all the time, and they haven't fined me yet.

Maybe its because I am a man, and the aforementioned instances did not occur on TV... :confused:

I love it when people concern themselves with things that will never bother them. Freedom of speech may be what they "hide" behind, but they are legally allowed to do so.
Think about it this way. Without freedom of speech, none of us could write in this forum.
FUCKER. FUCKER. FUCKER. go kill yourself and save us the trouble of having to listen to your incessant whining about shows that don't concern your life.

Its shows like this that are spreading AIDS and causing murders(abortions) because of their promotion of this crap! I value life more than this fake freedom they hide behind.

Holy shit, what dreamworld are you living in? TV shows can spread diseases and kill people? Fucking shit, your TVs must be super intelligent or something.

Seriously, what the hell are you talking about?

If you censor everything and make it forbidden, there is just more motivation to seek it out. You're shooting yourself in the arse.

a $500,000 fine for someone accidentally flashing a nipple. Jeez, what is wrong with you yanks?

What, are you serious!?! Don't you know that if a small child sees a nipple, his/her head will explode!?! Thats murder, and everyone involved should receive the death penalty RIGHT NOW, no court, no trial!!! Infact, we should stone anyone who wears any garment woven from 2 fibers of different types, and burn foul sodomites!!!

(for those of you that think Bush is an inteligent leader and is doing a good job, the previous statement was very sarcastic)

Hey Catholics: If you think this sounds extremist/stupid/whatever, you should listen to yourselves once or twice.

You're speaking of a medium here that's rediculously undersold in the market (books)...
NationStates isn't an accurate reflection on our society's average intelligence.
More people watch mind numbing reality television shows every evening than read a single novel all year long.

Yeah, people on NationStates seem to have rather eccentric or odd tastes in entertainment.

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?


Maybe also they should have it so that if you criticize the government on tv you go to jail, because after all, it is a dangerous problem for society if people are allowed to criticize the government, because it might spark a civil war or make people unpatriotic, which would let the terrorists destroy our country.

Commando, you're a genius! *sarcasm*
Hey, guess what! The TV has an "off" button. It might even be on your remote. And to all those who say boffing a seventeen year old is rape-most states the age of consent is seventeen or even lower. In some states it's as low as fourteen (at least for marraige). In some states it suddenly becomes okay if you marry him/her.

Oh, Commando, this sound familiar at all: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or of the right of the peopleto assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

It doesn't say "laws against things I don't like." It says "NO LAW". In case you haven't heard of it, it's called the "First Amendment." This comes from one of the documents the country was founded on called "The Bill of Rights." If you want to run a nation by religious law, talk to the Taliban or move to Iran. Why are liberals always accused by people like you of being unpatriotic if we want to change, when apparently you aren't happy here either? I don't mind if you want to live by your rules, but don't even try to insist that I do.

As for people who try to claim this county was supposedly founded on christianity, I have a little info for you. It wasn't.
"I don't find in our particuliar superstition of Christianity on redeeming feature." -Thomas Jefferson
"The goernment of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." - George Washington

...And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but doesn't the Bible also tell of acts which are illegal, and thus it too should be branded as evil?

http://www.icicom.up.pt/blog/muitaletra/arquivos/flames.jpg
Before the mods punish you, I just wanted to say that the American concept of Freedom of Speech dosen't extend to privately owned message boards :p

Before the mods warn you, I just wanted to say that the American concept of Freedom of Speech dosen't extend to private-owned messageboards :p

Especially private owned boards in other countries! ;)

Just because you think it's immoral doesn't mean it is. Commando2 is a dumb name. Censorship will not protect your kids. They will then activley seek out forbidden content which will almost invariably be worse than what you have censored. I have never seen any of the shows you blindly condemn (except for one episode of Desperate Housewives. I was not impressed.) so I will not pass judgement on them. You're like the judge who declares a suspect guily just upon hearing the charge. I like similes. And smilies. :) :)

Before the mods punish you, I just wanted to say that the American concept of Freedom of Speech dosen't extend to privately owned message boards :p
Can you abbreviate 'privately owned' as 'pwned?' (^_^)

Censorship will not protect your kids.

That's right!

Besides it's the job of the parents to be the censors! ;)

Hmmm I wonder if he has even listened to Stern!

I'd love to see the look on those censorship-advocaters' faces if everything on TV was uncensored.

:eek:x10000000

People should listen to this guy (Commando2)! My son's favourite TV shows are Desperate Housewives, Will & Grace and Sex and the City!

Not a bad influence you say? Why just last week my son cheated on his husband because he was so desperate after he realised he was gay performance artist. Then he moved to New York so he could have sex while in the city. Here he befriended a middle-aged sexpot, a hot brunette who had a penchant for romance (but still had lots of sex) and some other chick that was obviously a lesbian but for some reason was banging guys too.

He also started playing video games, notably Super Mario Brothers. He is now a plumber and in his spare time runs around jumping on people's heads while throwing turtle shells at innocent bystanders, all the while muttering "she's in ANOTHER castle? FFS!".

What has society become?

Just wanted to pose some thought questions to hopefully stimulate thinking and provide some kind of structure to the issue of censorship...

What does it mean to censor?

- to remove erroneous, vulgar, obscene, or otherwise objectionable material

What constitutes such material:

erroneous: derived from error; untrue
vulgar: crudely indecent; lewd
obscene: repulsive; disgusting
objectionable: arousing disapproval

Potential Problems with Censorship


Identifying material as objectionable.
- What is the criteria for considering something is objectionable in the first place? Personal shock? Cultural influence? Religious dogma? Feelings?
- Is there a universal standard?

Determining the degree of objectionableness.
- Once it is determined that something is in fact objectionable, how is the extent of such offensiveness measured?
- Is explicitness a factor?
- Is there anything completely objectionable? (As in everyone would/should consider it objectionable)

Determining under what conditions objectionable material should be censored.
- Does the mere presence of something erroneous, vulgar, obscene, or otherwise objectionable make it appropriate for censorship?
- Should the age, maturity, religious beliefs, or any other factors of the audience be considered?
- Should the mood of the presentation of such material be considered? (whether such material is presented in an approving light or in a negative light)
- Who's responsibility is it to censor for a child? The child himself, the parents, the government, someone else? How about for a teenager? How about for an adult?

Imposing restrictions.
- Is it appropriate to impose censorship restrictions on other people? If so, when and why? If not, why not?
- Is it appropriate to restrict censorship? If so, why and to what degree? If not, why not?

Other Thought Questions

Does having the legal right to do something make it morally justifiable?
- In other words, if I am not restricted from doing something, does that mean it's automatically ok for me to do it? Are there things that I should not do even if I have the freedom and ability to do them?

What exactly is meant by "free speech"? Is there such thing as abusing the right to free speech?

When does freedom of speech become harassment, if ever?

What responsibility does the one presenting objectionable material have, if any?

What responsibility does the government have, if any, to censor objectionable material?

What is the appropriate response to objectionable material?


Again, these questions are intended to help stimulate and structure further discussion about censorship. Feel free to answer, clarify, or ignore them. If you do choose to answer, please provide your logical basis, and if applicable, evidence for what you say. Have a great day!

I'd love to see the look on those censorship-advocaters' faces if everything on TV was uncensored.

:eek:x10000000


I might even start watching TV again...hehe

You're an idiot.

/signed

researchers have discovered 3 Main similarities amoungst people who complain about shows on TV, and it paints a depressing picture:

1: Too Lazy to change the channel
2: Too Stupid to understand content warnings
3: Too Nosey to stay out of other peoples business.


of course there is the
Commitee for
unstigmatised
nationally
televised
swearing

Yes Minister is a televison show.

Yes Minister is genius.

EDIT: What the hell?!?!?! Neo Cannen, how the hell did you message appear before mine, then move below it afterwards!?!??!

You're speaking of a medium here that's rediculously undersold in the market (books)...


Yes Minister is a televison show.

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?

In best Karen voice, "Honey, what is this?"

While I understand that the more sophisticated television becomes, the less people watch it, but I think that there must be a highest common denominator, a level which is higher than desperate housewives, sex and the city, big brother etc but which people can still understand.

People should listen to this guy (Commando2)! My son's favourite TV shows are Desperate Housewives, Will & Grace and Sex and the City!

Not a bad influence you say? Why just last week my son cheated on his husband because he was so desperate after he realised he was gay performance artist. Then he moved to New York so he could have sex while in the city. Here he befriended a middle-aged sexpot, a hot brunette who had a penchant for romance (but still had lots of sex) and some other chick that was obviously a lesbian but for some reason was banging guys too.

He also started playing video games, notably Super Mario Brothers. He is now a plumber and in his spare time runs around jumping on people's heads while throwing turtle shells at innocent bystanders, all the while muttering "she's in ANOTHER castle? FFS!".

What has society become?
:D
Great, that made my day!

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.

I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light. As if people want to see this junk. Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time. I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL! This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?

1) If you don't like it.... don't watch it. TV is NOT compulsary.

2) Take responsibilty for your own actions. If you have children, YOU should decide what they watch... don't leave it up to someone else to be the 'grown-up'.

1) If you don't like it.... don't watch it. TV is NOT compulsary.


His point is not that he doesn't like it. Its that there are too many people who watch it because they don't know any better. Ergo the morals of these programs are spreading and are seriously damaging society.

His point is not that he doesn't like it. Its that there are too many people who watch it because they don't know any better. Ergo the morals of these programs are spreading and are seriously damaging society.

That's rubbish, though.

The 'morals' aren't 'spreading'... the people who WANT to watch those shows do... the people who DON'T want to watch those shows... well, they don't.

His point is not that he doesn't like it. Its that there are too many people who watch it because they don't know any better. Ergo the morals of these programs are spreading and are seriously damaging society.

Should other meida and works which express morals offensive to him also be censored: take for example the works of Nietzsche?

That's rubbish, though.

The 'morals' aren't 'spreading'... the people who WANT to watch those shows do... the people who DON'T want to watch those shows... well, they don't.

Think about it. These programs are being watched by the masses and so the morals and ideas are being absorbed (ok not by all of them, but a large percentage) Ergo these morals are being taken in and damaging society.

Should other meida and works which express morals offensive to him also be censored: take for example the works of Nietzsche?

I didn't sugest censorship as an alternitve. My idea is to simpley produce more, better quality media. Instead of the desprate housewives type.

Anyone think it wrong that a whinging minority dictates what everyone else can and can't watch?

If you don't like it, switch over.

a $500,000 fine for someone accidentally flashing a nipple. Jeez, what is wrong with you yanks?
In their defense, Janet Jackson's breasts aren't all that attractive.

I didn't sugest censorship as an alternitve. My idea is to simpley produce more, better quality media. Instead of the desprate housewives type.

The original poster did, however suggest censorship (Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned.).

Ifyou are making an argument based on aesthetics rather than on morality, then what happens if given the choice people still prefer to watch the 'desparate housewives'* type programme rather than your prefered alternative?



* whatever that may be, I don't even have a TV, nevermind the ability to watch US programmes.

While I understand that the more sophisticated television becomes, the less people watch it, but I think that there must be a highest common denominator, a level which is higher than desperate housewives, sex and the city, big brother etc but which people can still understand.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer? That show was cancelled.

Think about it. These programs are being watched by the masses and so the morals and ideas are being absorbed (ok not by all of them, but a large percentage) Ergo these morals are being taken in and damaging society.

No, neo - they make those programmes because THAT IS WHAT SELLS... which means... there MUST BE a market for it.

Society isn't being damaged... the people are just getting what they want... and people like Commando don't like it, because it shows that even some of the holier-than-thou types must be watching sex and violence.

So - it comes back to a lack of responsibility.

Basically - he is saying that christians shouldn't have to control their own libido... he wants the government (or anyone) to do that for him.

Think about it. These programs are being watched by the masses and so the morals and ideas are being absorbed (ok not by all of them, but a large percentage) Ergo these morals are being taken in and damaging society.
Perhaps the shows only mirror the existing moral state of society. Or perhaps people who have a predisposition to be "immoral" also have a predisposition to watch the "immoral" shows. Or maybe people are just lazy idiots who can't be bothered to think for themselves.

The original poster did, however suggest censorship (Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned.).

Ifyou are making an argument based on aesthetics rather than on morality, then what happens if given the choice people still prefer to watch the 'desparate housewives'* type programme rather than your prefered alternative?

I would like to make the following points about what the original poster said

1) I do agree that desprate housewives and other programs of the same vain are damaging society. But that does not equate to cencoring them. The thing to censor is the advertising. No billboard advertising, and only TV advertising after the watershead (9 PM in the UK)

2) My arguement was on the basis of morality. I believe it is possible to make shows which are perfectly fine in terms of morality and still popular. Eg, sea of souls, spooks, yes minister etc. I think that other programs may have the right to exist, but dont force them in everyone elses faces (Saturation advertising of things like big brother/desprate housewives)

I would like to make the following points about what the original poster said

1) I do agree that desprate housewives and other programs of the same vain are damaging society. But that does not equate to cencoring them. The thing to censor is the advertising. No billboard advertising, and only TV advertising after the watershead (9 PM in the UK)

2) My arguement was on the basis of morality. I believe it is possible to make shows which are perfectly fine in terms of morality and still popular. Eg, sea of souls, spooks, yes minister etc. I think that other programs may have the right to exist, but dont force them in everyone elses faces (Saturation advertising of things like big brother/desprate housewives)

You need to take a business course, neo.

Have you any idea how expensive advertising is?

They KNOW the audience is there... they ARE targetting it, just to let it know WHEN and WHERE the show will be.

They aren't trying to make new 'converts' with their advertising... they are supplying a product to an existing demand.

No, neo - they make those programmes because THAT IS WHAT SELLS... which means... there MUST BE a market for it.


But there is ALSO a market for the perfectly normal. non sex/drugs/vilonce stuff. So why do they not get as much attention. Why dont they get the kind of saturation adveritsing that desprate housewives and the like gets

2) My arguement was on the basis of morality. I believe it is possible to make shows which are perfectly fine in terms of morality and still popular. Eg, sea of souls, spooks, yes minister etc. I think that other programs may have the right to exist, but dont force them in everyone elses faces (Saturation advertising of things like big brother/desprate housewives)

Surely Yes, Minister* is a bad example here as it shows that the only way to get things done in the vast majority of episodes is to be a conniving, backstabbing, two-faced cheat who is prepared to manipulate others without care just so long as it forwards your own ends?


* The only program in your list that I have actually seen.

You need to take a business course, neo.

Have you any idea how expensive advertising is?

They KNOW the audience is there... they ARE targetting it, just to let it know WHEN and WHERE the show will be.


Targeting it by shoving it in peoples faces. I dont know if any of you live anywhere near Croydon, but I do. And if you drive down a certain part you will see, not one, not two, not three but FOUR big billbord advets for desprate housewives within under a mile of one another. I know because I was driving through said part the other day.

Surely Yes, Minister* is a bad example here as it shows that the only way to get things done in the vast majority of episodes is to be a conniving, backstabbing, two-faced cheat who is prepared to manipulate others without care just so long as it forwards your own ends?


Yes but its laughing at all. Also its not the content, but the type of humour. The jokes and comic timing is amazingly sophisticated and was still very popular. Dispelling the myth that only dumbed down humour can work.

But there is ALSO a market for the perfectly normal. non sex/drugs/vilonce stuff. So why do they not get as much attention. Why dont they get the kind of saturation adveritsing that desprate housewives and the like gets

The 'splash' advertising goes to what makes the money, Neo.

There are some other shows, sure... and they get made, and they get watched...

But the shows that are in biggest demand, are those ones you hate so much (which I have to admit... I've never even seen... so, I can't comment on the content)... so theya re the ones that are made most... and, thus, advertised the most... they NEED to maximise profits.

The 'splash' advertising goes to what makes the money, Neo.

There are some other shows, sure... and they get made, and they get watched...

But the shows that are in biggest demand, are those ones you hate so much (which I have to admit... I've never even seen... so, I can't comment on the content)... so theya re the ones that are made most... and, thus, advertised the most... they NEED to maximise profits.

You obviously know nothing about British television. Spooks was one of the most sucessful drama series in recent memory. So much so that it has become one of Britains most sucessful television exports (reaching the US, the rest of Europe and parts of Asia with great sucess). That was in very high demand while it was on. So why didn't THAT get splash advetising.

Also if they are so popular, why do they need so much adverising?

And also my point about splash advertising is this. If you are advertising a program that by its nature, it is agreed should be restricted (shown late etc) should therefore there not be restrictions on where the advertising for that show can be shown.

It would be nice if there were some reasonable way to restrict advertising. Almost no one likes advertising anyway. Of course that might kill TV, but I wouldn't mind too much. :D

Sadly I don't see how to restrict advertising significantly without seriously impeding free speech. Any ideas?

You obviously know nothing about British television. Spooks was one of the most sucessful drama series in recent memory. So much so that it has become one of Britains most sucessful television exports (reaching the US, the rest of Europe and parts of Asia with great sucess). That was in very high demand while it was on. So why didn't THAT get splash advetising.

Also if they are so popular, why do they need so much adverising?

And also my point about splash advertising is this. If you are advertising a program that by its nature, it is agreed should be restricted (shown late etc) should therefore there not be restrictions on where the advertising can be shown.

It didn't need to. As Spooks is on the BBC and freely available to all, it would already be highly advirtised on all bbc owned radio stations, both local and national, its own tv channels and would be spread by word of mouth. However, Desperate Housewives is different. Because it originally started on E4 (a pay channel) they advirtised it to try and get people to subscribe to E4, so it was a joint advert, but as with all programmes like that it moved to Channel 4 after a time. Here it was advirtised to try and get people to watch Channel 4 (for those who don't know, its the third biggest free view channel in the UK) and so fight for viewers. They don't just advirtise the programme, they advirtise themselves.

EDIT: don't me started on typos, i'm tired and fed up...

Actually, if we just outlawed advertising alltogether ay least the BBC would probably survive, if not much else. This idea seems better the more I think about it.

Sadly I don't see how to restrict advertising significantly without seriously impeding free speech. Any ideas?

Well this is my logic, a program like desprate housewives, I am sure that everyone can agree, should be restricted in certain ways (Shown late etc) because of its content. So then also the advertising for said program should be restricted by similar peramiters.

Well this is my logic, a program like desprate housewives, I am sure that everyone can agree, should be restricted in certain ways (Shown late etc) because of its content. So then also the advertising for said program should be restricted by similar peramiters.

I agree - I just don't think you're going far enough. It would make me really happy if I could somehow justify preventing them from advertising at all. :D

Lately if you turn on the tv all you see is immorality, whether it be Howard Stern, Sex and the City, Desperate Housewives, or Will and Grace. And if you try to censor these sickening shows, they hide behind free speech. However, what these horrible shows really are is a dangerous problem to society, not free speech. Free speech is saying what you want and being able to say it, not showing the whole country evil on tv.
This is shaping up to be interesting...
I'll take the obvious example here. Desperate Housewives is a disgusting, perverted show that I think should be banned. Why? Because it shows immoral sex, adultury, sodomy, contraception, and abusive drinking in a positive light.
:rolleyes:
As if people want to see this junk.
Well, judging by the profits made, turns out people do.
Little kids are watching tv, and their parents can't be there for them 100% of the time.
That's what the vchip thing is for.
I believe most people can agree most of the things this show depicts are disgusting and inappropriate for children. The one that ticks me off the most is the adultury part. They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like. And they also show a 40ish year old lady having an affair with a 17 year old kid. THATS RAPE, AND RAPE IS ILLEGAL!
This junk about statutory(sp?) rape is just that, junk. If it's consensual and they're of age, it's consensual. I don't find that too hard to understand, but it seems somebody in the government does...
This show is evil, and unfortunatly many vunerable kids will see it. And studies have proven kids who see immoral sex on tv will be more likely to engage in that bad behavior. What has become of our country?
Yes, what?
Do tell...

I find Howard Stern absolutely disgusting. But that doesn't mean he should be closed. Plenty of people enjoy watching these sorts of things, and whether or not I do, there are others whom I don't have the right to decide for.

Oh, by the way, i'm surprised you didn't pounce on 'Will & Grace", what with the homosexuality and such.

People should listen to this guy (Commando2)! My son's favourite TV shows are Desperate Housewives, Will & Grace and Sex and the City!

Not a bad influence you say? Why just last week my son cheated on his husband because he was so desperate after he realised he was gay performance artist. Then he moved to New York so he could have sex while in the city. Here he befriended a middle-aged sexpot, a hot brunette who had a penchant for romance (but still had lots of sex) and some other chick that was obviously a lesbian but for some reason was banging guys too.

He also started playing video games, notably Super Mario Brothers. He is now a plumber and in his spare time runs around jumping on people's heads while throwing turtle shells at innocent bystanders, all the while muttering "she's in ANOTHER castle? FFS!".

What has society become?

Brilliant.

While I understand that the more sophisticated television becomes, the less people watch it, but I think that there must be a highest common denominator, a level which is higher than desperate housewives, sex and the city, big brother etc but which people can still understand.

There is. It's called 24. :D

Bottom line, the right to completely free speech outweighs the right of people to not be offended. I'm no big fan of gratuitous (and that's the key word, for me) sex, violence and crude language in movies, tv, games and so forth, but if I think a programme is going to be too gory or whatever for me, I just don't watch it. I'm not arrogant enough to think that everyone in the world shares, or should share, my values, opinions and tastes on subjective things.

The trouble is, there is almost no way to set a universal boundary as to what is acceptable and what is unacceptable that will be agreed upon by everyone, because people are just too different. I don't like what the KKK has to say (and this is only referring to offensive speech, not threats or actions - that's a different thing altogether) but I'd rather let them vent their bigotry and just tune them out than risk someone suddenly deciding that, say, expressing a liking for the music of U2 was also offensive and should be banned, or that displaying a print of a Monet painting is offensive and should be illegal.

I'm going to go to an entirely different problem now.




They make the wifes husband a bully so you don't feel bad for her when she cheats on him. And you don't see the negative consequences of her actions, you only hear what she feels. I don't want our nations youth hearing what some dirty prostitute feels like.


Ignorance breeds apathy, breeds misunderstanding, breeds hate.

There are reasons here, horrific as they may be-simply look.

I'm going to go to an entirely different problem now.







Ignorance breeds apathy, breeds misunderstanding, breeds hate.

There are reasons here, horrific as they may be-simply look.

How am I breeding hate by saying I don't want to hear what some filthy cheating infidel has to say?

How am I breeding hate by saying I don't want to hear what some filthy cheating infidel has to say?

You're not breeding hate by saying you don't want to hear what they have to say. However, most people are understandably pissed off when they are called filthy cheating infidels.

You're not breeding hate by saying you don't want to hear what they have to say. However, most people are understandably pissed off when they are called filthy cheating infidels.

Well they deserve it if they commit adultury. Sorry though, that was too strong an attack.

Well they deserve it if they commit adultury. Sorry though, that was too strong an attack.

I would think that they deserve to be forgiven. Not to mention that you shouldn't be judging them. Isn't that the Jesus thing to do?

If you hate sex and immorality on TV you hate America.
There, I said it.

Amusingly enough, a goodly chunk of the world views our television fare as prudish and our obsession with not showing nudity as childish.

I would think that they deserve to be forgiven. Not to mention that you shouldn't be judging them. Isn't that the Jesus thing to do?

Yeah, I agree with Gorbov. I have not read it myself, but apparently the Bible states that if someone accepts Jesus, they should be forgiven, right? You haven't even given people the opportunity to do so before you launched into an attack on them.

How am I breeding hate by saying I don't want to hear what some filthy cheating infidel has to say?

By breeding ignorance.

Pretend we decided we didn't want to hear what the filthy jews had to say during WW2, and you have some idea.

You obviously know nothing about British television. Spooks was one of the most sucessful drama series in recent memory. So much so that it has become one of Britains most sucessful television exports (reaching the US, the rest of Europe and parts of Asia with great sucess). That was in very high demand while it was on. So why didn't THAT get splash advetising.

Also if they are so popular, why do they need so much adverising?

And also my point about splash advertising is this. If you are advertising a program that by its nature, it is agreed should be restricted (shown late etc) should therefore there not be restrictions on where the advertising for that show can be shown.

You're probably right, N eo... what do I know about British TV... after all, I only lived there for a quarter of a century, right?

I can tell you, however, that Coupling far outstripped 'spooks' in terms of translation to the US - even spawning a (short lived) american version, and being currently on it's 'fourth season' release in the US.

Perhaps you missed the point that the shows that are being specifically hunted, don't need to advertise so much - whereas the shows that people will tune int 'because they like that kind of thing' have to set up a noticable presence to recroup their costs - and 'splash' advertising gains that prominence.

I have a very simple and effective suggestion. Get rid of your TV.
That way you can ensure that no evil liberal is going to force your kids to watch it.

It's your job to look after your kids. If you can't, don't get kids at all. You can't simply tell something should be a common rule just because you think so.
I don't watch Desperate Housewives, but will defend those who do. It's their choice whether or not they want to watch it, not your.

You're not breeding hate by saying you don't want to hear what they have to say. However, most people are understandably pissed off when they are called filthy cheating infidels.



Well they deserve it if they commit adultury. Sorry though, that was too strong an attack.


Does that mean it's okay if I call Commando a bigoted, narrow-minded,fascist nut-case? I suppose by his rules it does. He seems to think it's okay when he does. Whaaaa! I wanna be able to name call too!

I'm not for censorship at all, and I think that Commando2 is an idiot and probably would have been knocked out by natural selection if it weren't for modern medical technology, but that's a different debate.

Throughout this thread the idea has been that shows like Desperate Housewives, Will & Grace, etc. are having an effect on society's morals.

Did it ever occur to you, that society's morals are what these shows are based on? People like to watch what they know, and what we know is crime, violence, sex, drugs, and all the wonderful things that make the world go round.