NationStates Jolt Archive


The Impact of Marx

Andaluciae
14-01-2005, 19:23
While it shall be said that I am a vehement anti-marxist and counter-revolutionary of the most die-hard variety, I also believe that Marxism is fundamentally flawed and wrong, but I will admit that the writings of Marx have had fairly positive impact on some parts of the world, namely the western nations.

Starting in the late nineteenth century and early twentieth century the progressive movement sprang up in many western nations. It's goal was to alleviate the problems that an industrialized society laid upon the shoulders of the working class. This movement elected three Presidents in the US, and affected change nationwide. Oddly enough this movement was led, and mainly composed of successful middle class folk. Why would such people care so deeply for their fellow man? For those off of whom they were benefitting so nicely?

The answer is simple, these people were at the least subconsciously fearful of what a Marxist revolution would do. Being far-sighted and well educated, they decided that the best way to prevent such a movement was to alleviate the misery of that underclass which Karl Marx foretold would rise up. And as such progressive legislation and rule came into existence.

The first of the progressive US Presidents was Theodore Roosevelt. A man of abundant energy and great change. The trusts that existed then were powerful monopolies, and they were also despised by many. Violent clashes between workers and the trusts occured on several occasions. Roosevelt was able to push through some of the strongest anti-trust legislation heard of at that time. He was able to see and worry about the future.

A second progressive President was Woodrow Wilson. An academic, his reforms took what Roosevelt had done and pushed it further. His reforms, while publicly stated as idealistic, were far more realistic in as a response to fears of communism. Espescially when the USSR was erected in Russia, the fear of the middle and upper classes was intensified.

A third progressive President, and possibly the most critical of all was Franklin Roosevelt. A man who valued the American system of free enterprise very strongly, and desired above all to protect this system. Roosevelt is once quoted as saying "I'm that kind of liberal because I'm that kind of conservative."

I'm going to have to say that the importance of the Marxist is vital in helping to feed the reforms that have raised the quality of life in western nations. There, I admitted that the indirect effects of Marxism in some places have been pretty good.
John Browning
14-01-2005, 19:50
* sound of tumbleweeds rolling through the forum *
BlatantSillyness
14-01-2005, 19:55
Im a little disappointed that a thread entitled "the impact of marx" doesnt in fact feature a picture of Karl Marx falling out of a window and comically squashing someone.
Alien Born
14-01-2005, 20:00
I am no marxist, nor follower of Marx (as the two are completely differnet beasts) either

Starting in the late nineteenth century and early twentieth century the progressive movement sprang up in many western nations. It's goal was to alleviate the problems that an industrialized society laid upon the shoulders of the working class.
*snip*
The answer is simple, these people were at the least subconsciously fearful of what a Marxist revolution would do. Being far-sighted and well educated, they decided that the best way to prevent such a movement was to alleviate the misery of that underclass which Karl Marx foretold would rise up.
*big snip*
I'm going to have to say that the importance of the Marxist is vital in helping to feed the reforms that have raised the quality of life in western nations. There, I admitted that the indirect effects of Marxism in some places have been pretty good.

The social conditions revolution, i.e. the start of a concern for the living conditions etc. of the workforce dates back well befor Marx. There were people such as Cadbury, Salt, and Wedgewood in England who tried to create ideal communities for their workers (See Bournville and Saltaire as examples)

You assume that the middle classes would only act out of pure financial self interest, which I doubt. Self interest, maybe, but this would include feeling good about yourself, and believing that you were a member of a decent and reasonable human race. The motivation behind social welfare reform is not clearly based in the writings of Marx or the threat of a proletariat revolution. It is more based, IMHO, on mans sympathy with fellow man.

Given these divergent views, I can not agree that Marx had any influence at all in the raising of the standard of living.

Respectfully
Alien Born
John Browning
14-01-2005, 20:03
Im a little disappointed that a thread entitled "the impact of marx" doesnt in fact feature a picture of Karl Marx falling out of a window and comically squashing someone.


Aaaaaaauuuugh! * SPLAT * :eek:

(note: no violent graphic image link in this post)