NationStates Jolt Archive

If the universe meets a minimum size requirement, there is a 100% chance of an Earth nearly exactly the same as our own, give or take a few particles. Don't believe me? I'll prove it.

Say, for example, the universe had only 4 possible particle arrangements.

X0
0X

0X
X0

X0
X0

0X
0X


Still with me? Well, there is an equation to determine, provided they are arranged randomly, in, say, a square or cube shape, and you know the size of the particles, the distance between any given pattern and its identical twin.

Obviously, in our universe, there are an exceedingly large number of particle combinations in a given space, say, 1x1 inches. You don't have to do the math to figure out that there's a buttload of particle combinations in an object the size of Earth.

But, even so, the theory goes that if the universe is a minimum size of so-and-so, there will be an identical arrangment of particles exactly such-and-such distance from Earth. Granted, this distance is so unimaginably huge that the Sun will have died long before we reached the halfway point even if we were travelling at light speed.

If the universe meets a minimum size requirement, there is a 100% chance of an Earth nearly exactly the same as our own, give or take a few particles. Don't believe me? I'll prove it.

Say, for example, the universe had only 4 possible particle arrangements.

X0
0X

0X
X0

X0
X0

0X
0X


Still with me? Well, there is an equation to determine, provided they are arranged randomly, in, say, a square or cube shape, and you know the size of the particles, the distance between any given pattern and its identical twin.

Obviously, in our universe, there are an exceedingly large number of particle combinations in a given space, say, 1x1 inches. You don't have to do the math to figure out that there's a buttload of particle combinations in an object the size of Earth.

But, even so, the theory goes that if the universe is a minimum size of so-and-so, there will be an identical arrangment of particles exactly such-and-such distance from Earth. Granted, this distance is so unimaginably huge that the Sun will have died long before we reached the halfway point even if we were travelling at light speed.

Wheres your proof ? not saying it could not happen but you don’t include the math … the formula’s

Links to information

The “minimum” size … probability at range

So you make a vague un-substantiated claim with no supporting evidence yay

I'll dig out my old Scientific American and find it.

I'll dig out my old Scientific American and find it.
Ja, I was about to say it's in SciAm somewhere. I forget exactly what it said.

Ah, here we go. (http://www.sciamdigital.com/browse.cfm?sequencenameCHAR=item2&methodnameCHAR=resource_getitembrowse&interfacenameCHAR=browse.cfm&ISSUEID_CHAR=CA29952C-2B35-221B-6C8F91F472F302EA&ARTICLEID_CHAR=CA31F23A-2B35-221B-6B2E1550FC30AE50&sc=I100322)

moo moo moo I like camel cheese.

If the universe meets a minimum size requirement, there is a 100% chance of an Earth nearly exactly the same as our own, give or take a few particles. Don't believe me? I'll prove it.

Say, for example, the universe had only 4 possible particle arrangements.

X0
0X

0X
X0

X0
X0

0X
0X


Still with me? Well, there is an equation to determine, provided they are arranged randomly, in, say, a square or cube shape, and you know the size of the particles, the distance between any given pattern and its identical twin.

Obviously, in our universe, there are an exceedingly large number of particle combinations in a given space, say, 1x1 inches. You don't have to do the math to figure out that there's a buttload of particle combinations in an object the size of Earth.

But, even so, the theory goes that if the universe is a minimum size of so-and-so, there will be an identical arrangment of particles exactly such-and-such distance from Earth. Granted, this distance is so unimaginably huge that the Sun will have died long before we reached the halfway point even if we were travelling at light speed.

I think i see what you mean, i'll try to rephrase it.
For a given volume, consider every possible combination of particles. If you now build a universe with a volume this given volume * the amount of combination + 1, then at least two of these volumes will be the same.

faults:
1) Is it required that there is a finite amount of combinations? For simplification, i'll use a 3D eucledean space, time seperated from space and newton's model. To have a finite amount of combinations, energy would have to be quantized (as in quantummechanics). space itself would also have to be quantized (think of a grid here). Basicly, if the theory used to describe fundamental 'particles' (don't think of them as balls, they can be anything), allows any characteristic of these particles to be continueous, then the amount of combinations becomes infinite and the proof does not hold.
2) If (1) is satisfied, then the conclusion that there is a 'second earth if the universe is big enough' is still wrong. It only garantees there exist at least two volumes of space that are be exactly the same, nothing specifies that the earth has to be in one of these volumes.

1) Is it required that there is a finite amount of combinations?
I suppose then, that the question isn't if there is a finite amount of combinations, but whether there is a finite amount of particles.

If the universe meets a minimum size requirement, there is a 100% chance of an Earth nearly exactly the same as our own, give or take a few particles. Don't believe me? I'll prove it.

Aside from the fact that 'nearly exactly the same' isn't defined here (how nearly exactly the same? 95? 99? 99.99.....9?) there is the possibility that Earth may be the only instance of a particualar arrangement in space, with other non-Earth arrangements recurring.

Secondly, parallel to failing to define what 'nearly exactly the same' means, this idea takes into account only the position of the constituent parts, and no mention is made of their speed. Thus, although an identical arrangement to Earth may exist at one instant, this does not mean that it will remain coherent for any longer than an instant.