NationStates Jolt Archive

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.

Actually, they did imagine it. That's where cyberpunk and games such as Shadowrun and Call of Cthulhu came from and became so popular during their times. It's why DnD is so popular now. It's why movies, video games, plastic surgery, and many forms of escape are booming businesses. It's why, despite our ability to look forward and see it, there isn't a damn thing anyone can do to stop humanity's self-induced destruction.

No matter how you look at it, we saw it comming. And chose to ignore it.

As a current 31 year old, all I can do is say "the good old days weren't always good, tomorrow ain't as bad as it seems".

You're railing against the older generation is the same as has been done since the first tribes came together thousands of years ago. The perspective may change in terms of religion, technology, politics, economics, etc. But it's all basically the same thing.

We all go through this phase. Good luck. :)

We all go through this phase. Good luck. :)

It's not a "phase" for everyone. Not everyone goes through it and not everyone ever passes it.

Excuse the double-post.

You have to realize something: This is the world we sought and the world we created. It's up to you what you do with it and whether or not you choose to use other worlds to find what you feel you cannot in this one.

These are the cards you are dealt, and it's up to you how you call the hand.

I know a lot of people have trouble believing it, but there is always hope, no matter how small it may be. We can still figure things out. We're not doomed yet.

I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
I don't know where you live or why you are so bitter at such an early age, but your view of the world is seriously deficient. There is always opportunity for those willing to focus on the possible, as opposed to seeing only problems.

Why are you so bitter and pessimistic? Millions of people the world over, with problems far greater than yours still manage to set goals, work toward them with vigor and hope, achieve most if not all of them, and be very happy in the process. I strongly suggest you get over yourself, get out of your little bubble of self-pity, and tackle some of the problems instead of just moaning about them.

Ok

1. I'm only 14
2. I'm going to land a record deal with my band
3. Never have never will touch drugs
4. Don't smoke never will
5. I wish I could kill anyone who does that

So no not all young people are like what you say.

I'm 21 and I don't know how good I've got it, I like to bitch about the fact that I have no future and my parents ruined everything and so on and so forth...

but on the other hand my house isn't sliding down a hill on the crest of a wave of mud and furniture so maybe I should stop complaining all the damn time.

:-D I'm glad you don't all know about "shelter drills" and hiding in the hallway of your schools in case of a nuclear explosion -- crouching out of the way of windows because god knows, when a nuke goes off, you don't want to be hit by flying glass.

Seriously, hang in there. It looks bleak now, but things have a way of calming down and working out.

I agree with Markreich. Thing is, the world isn't so bad. I've always been an optimist; I've always looked forward. Maybe this is a result of being raised on Star Trek, and maybe that's a bad thing; I don't give a damn. I'd rather have my hope than your angst any day, because I know what happens when I become depressive. (Read:seriously pisses off anyone who ever cared about me.)

I don't know where you live or why you are so bitter at such an early age, but your view of the world is seriously deficient. There is always opportunity for those willing to focus on the possible, as opposed to seeing only problems.

Why are you so bitter and pessimistic? Millions of people the world over, with problems far greater than yours still manage to set goals, work toward them with vigor and hope, achieve most if not all of them, and be very happy in the process. I strongly suggest you get over yourself, get out of your little bubble of self-pity, and tackle some of the problems instead of just moaning about them.

Well said. :)

However I do believe to some extent that the market is getting rather crowded. Probably due to the population boom of all the warring periods compared to the rate of a growing economy. However, when their generation is retired and gone, and leave a large gap, guess which generation is going to be taking over?

We might have been the 'caught between'. But there's still many ways of making a good life. We are in the information age. Where the world is our limits. Instead of looking only at your nation, why not try getting a job or starting a business elsewhere in the world?

:-D I'm glad you don't all know about "shelter drills" and hiding in the hallway of your schools in case of a nuclear explosion -- crouching out of the way of windows because god knows, when a nuke goes off, you don't want to be hit by flying glass.

Seriously, hang in there. It looks bleak now, but things have a way of calming down and working out.

If you hide under the desks it makes you easier to vacuum

If you hide under the desks it makes you easier to vacuum


Also easier to put your head between your legs and kiss your butt goodbye.
;)

Well said. :)

However I do believe to some extent that the market is getting rather crowded. Probably due to the population boom of all the warring periods compared to the rate of a growing economy. However, when their generation is retired and gone, and leave a large gap, guess which generation is going to be taking over?

We might have been the 'caught between'. But there's still many ways of making a good life. We are in the information age. Where the world is our limits. Instead of looking only at your nation, why not try getting a job or starting a business elsewhere in the world?
Good point! :)

Instead of being patronising, maybe you guys could pay attention to what he's saying.

Call me pessimistic, but a lot of what Sblargh says resonates with me (although perhaps without quite so much angst and self-pity - sorry champ, but although you make some decent points, there's also a fair amount of teenage resentment in there). Like it or not, globalisation is turning the world into a place where the individual is an impotent being. Corporations are increasingly coming to control the world we live in, the news we read, and the art we view. The sad reality of it is that for the children of the 80s/90s, the future of the world is not a particularly inviting one - we are staring down the barrel of overpopulation, resource shortages, and serious and nigh-on irreparable environmental damage.

I'm 19, and in less than a month I won't be a teenager anymore, so don't brush off what I'm saying as a whinging kid who's had it all handed to him. I'm not, and I haven't. I'm a child from a family that was brought perilously close to the poverty line when corporate action left my father out of work in a cutthroat employment market that only values young talent, and has no concept of loyalty or security. I'm a young man studying at university to get a degree that has even odds of never being used, living in a political system where my vote counts for effectively dick and leaders with badly-hidden agendas routinely abuse public money to lie to the people and pursue unjust, illegal foreign policy under false pretences. (Australia, if you were wondering.) I'm a future employee of faceless megacorporations, which may well force me to sign documents dictating how my external life is to be lived (it already happens). I'm a quivering bundle of neuroses living in a world where popular culture tells me how to look, how to dress, and how inadequate I am should I not meet those guidelines. (Thankfully, there's less of that now I'm out of high school.) And finally, I'm a person living in a world that has only a finite amount of oil and old-growth forests (to name only two of our dwindling resources), each of which are vanishing rapidly.

I'm not blaming anyone, nor am I pointing the finger. I'm merely saying that before anyone (particularly anyone older than, say, 30) dismisses Sblargh's opinion as mere teenage bitching, they should take a good look around.

EDIT: Looking back at that, I forgot to say that I for one am hopeful that we can turn some things around. I choose not to sit in my room and smoke pot - that's not going to help anything, although escapism is a pleasant thing. But the problems facing the "youth of today" (never thought I'd say that seriously) are huge, and it's easy to see why they seem almost insurmountable.

I´m not saying all young people are like me, there are those few who got lucky, in the internet, a world wide media, there is sure lots of examples of people who are happy and all.
But I look in my neighbourhood, in my college, in my family, and no one there has a future, very few pretend to be optmistic, but you can see that is a fake when one opens a newspaper. And don´t give me the "people are worse then you and still going through it", I´m not saying my generation have a real problem, one that you can touch, you see, this is the problem, nothing is real, the system will be a great deal for some 10% and the rest will struggle in a pathetic low end job until die of boredom. We are not walking toward a cliff, we are already falling. This is the end of history. You don´t get it, it´s not like I don´t have legs, I do, I just don´t have nowhere to go.

I know that much I said is self pitty and teenage angst. Is that RIGHT NOW I´m really depressed, so I don´t know how to express myself otherwise. I´m right now in that struggle against poverty line, because we, brazilians, also elected a dumb president.

I´m not saying all young people are like me, there are those few who got lucky, in the internet, a world wide media, there is sure lots of examples of people who are happy and all.
But I look in my neighbourhood, in my college, in my family, and no one there has a future, very few pretend to be optmistic, but you can see that is a fake when one opens a newspaper. And don´t give me the "people are worse then you and still going through it", I´m not saying my generation have a real problem, one that you can touch, you see, this is the problem, nothing is real, the system will be a great deal for some 10% and the rest will struggle in a pathetic low end job until die of boredom. We are not walking toward a cliff, we are already falling. This is the end of history. You don´t get it, it´s not like I don´t have legs, I do, I just don´t have nowhere to go.
Out of curiosity, what do you define as "a future"? You keep saying no one has a future, but what do you mean by that exactly?

Edited to add:
For all those saying the world is an awful place and we're headed downhill, you do realize that you're just accepting what the media (which has already been derided in this thread) is spoon-feeding you. Yes, there are awful things happening in the world, and some people can be horrible. But there are also a lot of great things in the world. I'll never understand why people choose to look at one side and not the other.

It's actually always like that. When we're older well either be complaining about the next generation. It's always been like that and always will be.

Young people don't have any ambition
True and untrue - I look at most of the kids in 'Honors' and 'A' level classes (and some 'B'), and I see ambition . . . only problem is that it seems like this is only like 30% of kids in my school so, yeah, a bunch are still left w/o ambition

I mean, I do TONS of things; and I'm not called ambitious?!?!

True and untrue - I look at most of the kids in 'Honors' and 'A' level classes (and some 'B'), and I see ambition . . . only problem is that it seems like this is only like 30% of kids in my school so, yeah, a bunch are still left w/o ambition

I mean, I do TONS of things; and I'm not called ambitious?!?!
Don't most people lack ambition? I mean, ambition is supposed to be an extraordinary quality.

My only ambition in life was to go to university
now I'm there I have no idea what to do next

My only ambition in life was to go to university
now I'm there I have no idea what to do next

Get a job.
Get married.
Have kids.
Retire.
Die.

Out of curiosity, what do you define as "a future"? You keep saying no one has a future, but what do you mean by that exactly?

Edited to add:
For all those saying the world is an awful place and we're headed downhill, you do realize that you're just accepting what the media (which has already been derided in this thread) is spoon-feeding you. Yes, there are awful things happening in the world, and some people can be horrible. But there are also a lot of great things in the world. I'll never understand why people choose to look at one side and not the other.

The future are my adult years. I´m 19 now and my teenage years have all be blown up in a pathetic fake world. Looking back I can´t remember much, but everyone saying you that complaining about the world is a bad thing and really futile teenagers that don´t have the slightest clue of what the world is becoming. In the future I see these same teenagers growing up to fight each other for the few good jobs and trying to explain to their sons why they don´t have what I had when I was young. Makes me want to cry imagining my son saking me why my parents could buy me a nice little middle class life while I try to explain he that "middle class" and "poor" are the same thing in this new world of his. Of course I try to make things better, but, you know, it´s really hard, for example, going to a protest against corporation X with another thousands of people, really big stuff and then getting home at night, proud that you made something good to the world, and finding out that no news media talked about it. And the next morning reading in the newspapaer only that corporation X donated a few bucks to someone. And then you look around... teenager years are gone, soon college will be gone, gotta find a job, gotta live and to that, gotta surrender to the same corporation you were fighting. And this humiliation, only so you can live enough to try to explain to your son why he can´t have a christmas present this year.

No jobs? There are lots of jobs, you just have to go out and get one, and life is what you make of it, if you sit around and say shit like oh, we are in the 3rd lost decade (btw, saying stuff like that just makes you sound like a nerd) of course you won't have any ambition, you just have to go out there and do stuff. And as for being on drugs, what's wrong with that, a little pot never hurt anyone, it's when you start doing stuff like blow and ice that your life gets fucked up.

My only ambition in life was to go to university
now I'm there I have no idea what to do next

I wish I had the power to say so much in two lines. This is what I been trying to say.

For all those saying the world is an awful place and we're headed downhill, you do realize that you're just accepting what the media (which has already been derided in this thread) is spoon-feeding you. Yes, there are awful things happening in the world, and some people can be horrible. But there are also a lot of great things in the world. I'll never understand why people choose to look at one side and not the other.

With all due respect, I'm not the one being spoon-fed here. I've simply done a great deal of research and observation, and I've drawn my own conclusions - just because they're not saccharine and Disney doesn't make me stupid or wrong.

And as for looking at both sides - while nothing makes me happier than hearing about GIs in Iraq giving starving kids chocolate, I find it hard to let that overshadow the brutal geopolitical and corporate reality that is the illegal invasion of said country. </sarcasm>

Get a job.
Get married.
Have kids.
Retire.
Die.

i feel better now

With all due respect, I'm not the one being spoon-fed here. I've simply done a great deal of research and observation, and I've drawn my own conclusions - just because they're not saccharine and Disney doesn't make me stupid or wrong.

And as for looking at both sides - while nothing makes me happier than hearing about GIs in Iraq giving starving kids chocolate, I find it hard to let that overshadow the brutal geopolitical and corporate reality that is the illegal invasion of said country. </sarcasm>
You obviously missed the part where I said "one side and not the other." Anyone who can't see evil in the world just isn't paying attention. There are a lot of bad things going on in the world (tsunami, anyone?). Doesn't mean there are only bad things. And it also doesn't mean we can't stop the bad things.

I also didn't mean to imply that you were stupid or wrong. My best friend from college was the consummate pessimist, and he was in no way stupid. When I said "I don't understand" I literally meant I don't understand.

Ok

1. I'm only 14
2. I'm going to land a record deal with my band
3. Never have never will touch drugs
4. Don't smoke never will
5. I wish I could kill anyone who does that

So no not all young people are like what you say.
You want to kill smokers? Go fuck yourself! :upyours:

The future are my adult years. I´m 19 now and my teenage years have all be blown up in a pathetic fake world. Looking back I can´t remember much, but everyone saying you that complaining about the world is a bad thing and really futile teenagers that don´t have the slightest clue of what the world is becoming. In the future I see these same teenagers growing up to fight each other for the few good jobs and trying to explain to their sons why they don´t have what I had when I was young. Makes me want to cry imagining my son saking me why my parents could buy me a nice little middle class life while I try to explain he that "middle class" and "poor" are the same thing in this new world of his. Of course I try to make things better, but, you know, it´s really hard, for example, going to a protest against corporation X with another thousands of people, really big stuff and then getting home at night, proud that you made something good to the world, and finding out that no news media talked about it. And the next morning reading in the newspapaer only that corporation X donated a few bucks to someone. And then you look around... teenager years are gone, soon college will be gone, gotta find a job, gotta live and to that, gotta surrender to the same corporation you were fighting. And this humiliation, only so you can live enough to try to explain to your son why he can´t have a christmas present this year.
So you're just going to give up? I'll ask what I did in another thread: how can we ever hope to change things if we don't believe we can change them?

we are staring down the barrel of overpopulation, resource shortages, and serious and nigh-on irreparable environmental damage.
I heard that the Pentagon estimates that low lying lands in Europe will be convered by the sea in 20 years.

"We cannot be sure of having something to live for unless we are willing to die for it."
Ernesto Che Guevara

I heard that the Pentagon estimates that low lying lands in Europe will be convered by the sea in 20 years.

FUCK, i live in such a nation :eek:
(the lowest of them all...)

I heard that the Pentagon estimates that low lying lands in Europe will be convered by the sea in 20 years.

that's just wishful thinking :p

"We cannot be sure of having something to live for unless we are willing to die for it."
Ernesto Che Guevara

and indeed he did

that's just wishful thinking :p

Or possibly, if you believe one particularly retarded conspiracy theory floating around about the tsunamis in the Indian Ocean, a threat.

FUCK, i live in such a nation :eek:
(the lowest of them all...)

There you go, Sblargh, I've found you a job. Selling snorkels to Dutchmen. :D

Your life is what you make of it. You don't like the political/social/economic system? Then CHANGE it. Easy to do, just get 100,000 people that believe the same as you and camp on your representives door step until they change it. If done correctly, you can change the world. Don't beleive me? Look up Ghandi, Martin Luther King, and scores of others that changed the world thru peaceful intervention.

Of course i'm forgetting that this is the "ME" generation. (If it does not personally affect you, you don't care)

Or possibly, if you believe one particularly retarded conspiracy theory floating around about the tsunamis in the Indian Ocean, a threat.

lol, haven't seen that one yet...

That's pretty much all you can do, I'm afraid. I must congratulate you on your English though, I thought you were a native speaker for a while. Speaking of which, have you thought about being an interpreter or something like that? The military always needs interpreters. But, as for Brazil, I've been there once. Stayed for a week in Cuiaba (think that's how you spell it). It was a mission trip to build a church. Most people think that the youth in America is sheltered, I agree. I'm 21 now and I don't think I've ever felt so heart broken for something or someone. But I couldn't help but notice the simple pleasures they enjoy. Like, kicking a soccer ball around in the street barefoot. I played with those kids everyday. Most Americans wouldn't even think of allowing their child to do that much less do that themselves. People take things way too seriously sometimes. Some people take themselves way too seriously. You don't need to be a corporate genius or an astronaut or President in order to say you've had a good life. Find that special someone who makes you happy in everyway, don't worry you'll find them when you least expect it. It happened to me as well. If I believe in anything, I believe in love. I believe that's the only thing that's holding this world together is the few rebels who refuse to see the world is coming to an end. Life isn't a destination, it's a journey. Everyone should know that. Take a look at your life so far. Can you imagine being on this earth for 5 times that amount of time? A lot of things can happen in 100 years. I can say, just wait until you have kids. You think that there's nothing to do but die, lol you have alot of stuff to do. Trust me. And just when you think that you can relax, something else will come along that you'll have to attend to. It's God's way of helping us cope. But hopefully, since the youth are getting smarter persay, they'll already know this.

As a punker I subscribe to "No Future" as much as the next man. We have fucked up so badly and for so long that there is not much hope for our youth, nor our species.

Still, it doesn't hurt to look at the bright side now and again. Drugs are fun, so is playing on NS, playing golf in the street or whatever takes your fancy. You may not believe in God, but that is no reason to suspect that you aren't here for a reason. Do what you feel like and don't take the whole moronic job/school/career rat race so seriously.

Your life is what you make of it. You don't like the political/social/economic system? Then CHANGE it. Easy to do, just get 100,000 people that believe the same as you and camp on your representives door step until they change it. If done correctly, you can change the world. Don't beleive me? Look up Ghandi, Martin Luther King, and scores of others that changed the world thru peaceful intervention.

Of course i'm forgetting that this is the "ME" generation. (If it does not personally affect you, you don't care)
Ghandi and Martin Luther King where extrordinary individuals and i dont think many people have the courage that they had to change the world...

The problem with the world today is that so many people have insights like these that they feel would make it better - yet how many do something about it? Like most people, I would think, I've had several thoughts for how I think the world could be better (I won't list them here because I don't wanna change the topic) but people can't be bothered to co-ordinate making themselves heard in 9 out of 10 cases. In some cases, it's just impossible due to restrictions.
It's a vicious circle. Mind inspires self, self motivates person, person seeks change, change restricts some people, some people are angered in mind, mind inspires self again... etc. It's that "Person seeks change" step. talking about it does little unless you make those who can make it a reality listen.

Basically, this post is as much an insight as it is a waste of time.

Ghandi and Martin Luther King where extrordinary individuals and i dont think many people have the courage that they had to change the world...

I think that's his point

and besides its easier now to find like-minded people that it was back then, just look at the forums

Reading abit, your Brazilian aren't you? (Sblargh)

Don't blame the crappy leaders and crappy country.

I guess it's quite similar to mine, thats why people complain why there's so many Asian migrations to 1st world nations taking their jobs because it's hella better. :p

IMO, read more books. Read many many many more books, and learn how to better yourself in everything that you do. Find a niche in the market and make it yours. Probably even start off a business.

If not, travel. Get an insight on whats happening round the world. There's billions of good idea's. But not many takes off. One of my dad's hobbies last time was to visit patent's office. And then flip through to find good marketable Ideas. Then try and sell them.

----------------- Just for some background -----------------

I've stayed in Jakarta, Indonesia, and my sister-in-law is from there. To a country where people are struggling, the country has no ability to feed itself (no dole, no welfare shit, if you don't work you farking starve), poverty is abound. It's incredibly hard to work for people and earn a decent living. Normal wages is worse. (depends if your country has minimum wage. Mine don't :p).

But to those of my friends who made it out of poverty in Indonesia, is usually those that work doubly harder than the rest and then start their own business,many failed along the way, but to those that do, they made it and for generations to come of their children, they'll be well fed. But they never stopped trying. But if you do start your own business, there's unlimited money you can get per month. Either than that, the only hope you have is work in a foreign company, and earn in US dollars.

Don't know how? Read more books. Books are knowledge passed down by people who has made it. Although It might not work for your circumstance, but it would definitely give you an upperhand over all those who don't read books.

I'm ambitious to a level of zealousity. Maybe it's because I'm Chinese (we like to gamble), but have been living overseas for the past 4 generations. If I go back to China, i"ll be a second class citizen. To where I am (Malaysia), I'm already a second class citizen. Never getting the rights as a normal citizen. But hell, life's shit. My father managed to work his way out of poverty, I'm greatful, but I want to do him proud and make a legacy.

Will I acheive it? I wouldn't know. But I will not remain a mindless fool, and complain that the government does nothing for me, And that all the jobs are taken. My friends and neighbours are going nowhere. I do not want to be like them. I would not be like them. . If I don't get a job, I'll make a job myself.

Ghandi and Martin Luther King where extrordinary individuals and i dont think many people have the courage that they had to change the world...

Excuse the double post but someone please give this man an award for getting straight to the point :)

And Styvonia, I was typing that while Bramia had submitted the post, I wasn't disregarding what he said because I hadn't seen it until I submitted the post.

*snips a very long, very depressed and extremely normal teen-to-young-adult rant about stuff they don't have because their parents' generation did <insert random thing here>*

You are inheriting more than your parents's parents did or my parents did for that matter. We are the inheritors of a recession, not the great depression. Rather than giving us a global war as a legacy, we have a bunch of petty squabbling in the middle east (which I might say has been going on since Biblical times and may very well continue until the world really does end). We and you have inherited superior technology and superior medicine, things which allow you to live in unheard of luxury compared to what the generations that came before mine had.

We all reap the fruits of uncontrolled industrialization that came not from your parents, nor theirs, but another generation or so before THEM. We have much, much more than your parents could have hoped for in their long-haired hippy days and we have it BECAUSE they sold out and toed the line. We have the things you take for granted every day of your life BECAUSE a significant portion of the technologically priveledged world lives to work instead of the other way around. Big business may rake in the cash for these things, but it is at your fingertips, available for the money that your parents make so that you may consume and take it for granted. They didn't have most of these things you couldn't imagine living without when they were your age.

Teen angst and confusion are not anything new or specific to your generation. It's a part of the human condition. Even I was a whiney, angsty little drama llama from time to time when I was a teen. It's normal. Every generation looks at the social symptoms of progress and starts going on about how the sky is falling and that the end is nigh. Of course, the end never came. The bad things are fairly static. The good things increase as the generations move by on the tide of the decades. You and I are priveledged, spoiled and pampered by the standards of the generations that came before our generations (I'm assuming that you're around 13 - 16, part of the generation that my generation has sired rather than my own, which were sired by the baby boomers).

I see no reason that anyone should "take it easy" on either your generation OR mine considering how amazingly good we have it and how RICH our inheritance actually is.

Some of you are commenting on how the world is techonologicially (I'm American and i still can't spell! :( ) better off and it also is econmically, but I think that that is part of the problem. Yet another generation is taught with the capitalist zeitgiest of you are your paycheck. I'm only 15, but I look at my father who is in his fifties and its seems more important to him that he has a bigger house than his neighbor, a nicer car than having something real. Something with meaning.

If you couple the money equals happiness mentality with the rise of technology it makes the world depressing. You can go on the internet and you see how infinitely small you are to the giant corperations. Feeling of futility is becoming the norm.

I think the problem isn't the economy or the politics (...) but its the mind set.

I personally have never seen this pessimism in myself. Nor have I seen it in many of my friends. But that's not to say that it doesn't exist, or isn't the prevalent attitude amongst teens. And that is a good thing, to still have people with hope and ambition. People who truly do believe they can change the world for the better. Although we may be in the minority, we're enough, we always have been.

This angsty attitude is, in fact, a typical teenage attitude. To feel such angst about the future, it is such a transitional time in one's life. To go from the care of the parents to self-dependence. One see's a load of hard work on the road ahead and despairs, but fear not, for the work, though hard, is spread out.

Admittedly I've groused over the lack of the great duty for our generation. We lack the great external challenges of the past. No WWII, no Cold War (and the various positions of support that people found themselves on that) just some stupid cave dwelling terrorists in a far away land. Nothing like Star Wars, or the Lord of the Rings. Nothing Epic.

But that doesn't matter. The world now needs us to fine tune it. And in doing so there is opportunity, and there is hope, that we can. And we will succeed. Just so long as we spend out time doing and not grousing.

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.
Why ARE you so bitter and depressed? I'm in high school right now, and life has never been better. I have goals, a part time job and an optimistic outlook for the future. Perhaps you should see a doctor if you are this severely depressed.

Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s...

Tell me more about this mythical golden age. Your idiosyncratic ideas on history interest me.

This is not a joke, or an insult. It is not an answer I am spoonfeeding you, but something to be thought upon in how you live your life. Here is my advice to you.

1) Stop being a pussy. I was one, once.

That is all.

"What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live!"

Im not like that, and I dont know anyone like that.

I grew up on a cattle farm in Kansas. We didn't have cable TV, video games, or computers. The hours were long and the payoff was minimal, but I had 4-H, school, friends, faith, music, books, and a lot of fresh air and good food.

I was taught, in case of nuclear attack, to curl up in a ball under my desk at school or my bed at home. Later we found out they taught everyone this so that the bodies would be in nice little balls and easy to find. During the Bay of Pigs crisis my parents sat down and had a long talk with me about the potential of the crisis. I was ready to die and hadn't even hit puberty yet.

When I was older, I watched friends and family drafted and sent to a place called Viet Nam. Some of them never came home and the ones who did were changed forever. My husband spent 12 years in the Marines and is a Nam vet. He has bad days, but he has a lot more good ones than bad ones. He is kind, loving, gentle, and extremely gifted.

In college my intended major was veterinary medicine. With a brand new degree in zoology and a GPA of 3.7 I was told that I had the wrong genetalia to be a vet. I couldn't understand why you needed one of "those" to treat sick livestock so I threw a hissy and quit school. A few months later I straightened up and went back and got my degree in accounting. When I hit the job market the unemloyment and tax rates were extremely high. I worked hard, took what I could get, and worked my way up.

Due to a little run-in with cancer at 15, I couldn't have children so I adopted 4 of the best kids ever put on this earth. Now I have 9 (2 of which are adopted) of the most beautiful grandchildren in the world. 2 1/2 years ago I lost my beautiful daughter to a brain aneurysm. I think of her every day and it is not to be believed how much it hurts. But, I have her 2 children to hold and love whenever I want, so I know I am blessed.

Yup, things are tough. I look at my oldest son with a degree in computer engineering making 5 times what I do as an accountant with 30 years experience. But, he earns every penny he makes.

There are no guarantees. Except the guarantee that if you don't try you'll never gain anything. And there is everything to gain.

Some of you are commenting on how the world is techonologicially (I'm American and i still can't spell! :( ) better off and it also is econmically, but I think that that is part of the problem. Yet another generation is taught with the capitalist zeitgiest of you are your paycheck. I'm only 15, but I look at my father who is in his fifties and its seems more important to him that he has a bigger house than his neighbor, a nicer car than having something real. Something with meaning.

If you couple the money equals happiness mentality with the rise of technology it makes the world depressing. You can go on the internet and you see how infinitely small you are to the giant corperations. Feeling of futility is becoming the norm.

I think the problem isn't the economy or the politics (...) but its the mind set.

Yes, that IS a very serious factor, but at the same time, all of us can choose to reject the "income as a measure of personal worth" mentality. I rejected it by the time I hit 12 years of age and that didn't hinder my ability to succeed in becoming a functional member of society. Granted, a lot of people don't understand MY value system, but it has never been neccessary for my well-being to be understood.

Anyone who cannot accept and understand their own smallness and insignifigance in comparison with the rest of existance is going to have a hard time coping. That has been true throughout all human history. Understanding how small we truely are, knowing that with or without us that the universe, our world, our neighborhoods and even our loved ones will go on is a part of growing up and maturing. I came to understand this before puberty and while it was a little depressing at first, but as I actually came to accept it and absorb all of its implications, I also came to find more valid ways to feel my own self worth. Entire philosophies and religions have been formed and evolved over these inevitabilities.

Everyone finds their own way to give their lives meaning and to measure their personal worth. Those who can't or won't do this for themselves are more or less doomed to be morose, pathetic and meaningless for the entirety of their lives. These are NOT things that society can do for us. These are not things our parents and friends can give us. These are things that only we can and must answer and achieve for ourselves.

Perhaps it is a little more difficult to do this when the world is given to you from birth on a silver platter and your life has been made too easy. I don't know. But I do know that no matter how much I have been given, I have always burned with the desire to understand and appreciate it and the efforts that went into it.

If you live your life through the media, rolling around in every tragedy and injustice like a dog does on garbage, then yes, I'd say it would be very easy to be sucked under into a very dark and hopeless view of the world. But the reality is both darker AND brighter than what your television shows you. Remember that human triumphs and goodness don't make good ratings, thus aren't adequately represented by the media. Most of the world will never know that some quiet middle aged woman in New Zealand saved a neighbor child from drowning or that some young, great-hearted guy from Sweden saved the lives of a few people in Thailand by donating blood and supplies to some Red Cross operation.

It's so EASY to ignore these things and take them for granted. How many of you know the names of the two scientists that gave the world a working vaccine for polio? Did you know one of them refused to patent his vaccine because he felt it belonged to the world, not just to him or some massive company? That was made by the fathers of some of your baby boomers. THAT is part of your inheritance. Freedom from the fear of a disease that cripples and kills painfully.

We all have a great deal to be thankful for. And some of that thankfulness rightfully belongs to the people the thread originator is complaining about as the thieves of his birthright. It kind of... no... cancel the kind of. It really irritates me to hear this whiney carping about how horrible the preceeding generations are, most especially any given generations PARENT generation is when the whiners almost without exception live lives of priveledge and luxury. I'm sorry if I come off as being cold and condemning, but honestly I have no sympathy at all about this particular thing.

The problem is kis today don't eat enough pie!

I am not very good at expressing what I mean so I apologise in advance.

I feel some of the people here need to step back and take a look at their situation and realise that the world is their oyster. They are able to do absolutely anything they wish. You are sitting there criticising the world and what it has become, but are doing nothing to improve it. You need to aspire, have dreams, and aim high.
The World is perhaps at the best stage it has ever been at from a human perspective. Ignore the future problems, and what maybe, and live for the moment, for if you permenantly dwell on the future, and possible problems, then you will never do a thing. You have to accept there is a risk to doing everything, and occasionally ignore the risks to progress yourself, and others.

I hope is well enough explained?

EDIT: I am 16, not an adult, so this is just my perspective

I am not very good at expressing what I mean so I apologise in advance.

I feel some of the people here need to step back and take a look at their situation and realise that the world is their oyster. They are able to do absolutely anything they wish. You are sitting there criticising the world and what it has become, but are doing nothing to improve it. You need to aspire, have dreams, and aim high.
The World is perhaps at the best stage it has ever been at from a human perspective. Ignore the future problems, and what maybe, and live for the moment, for if you permenantly dwell on the future, and possible problems, then you will never do a thing. You have to accept there is a risk to doing everything, and occasionally ignore the risks to progress yourself, and others.

I hope is well enough explained?

EDIT: I am 16, not an adult, so this is just my perspective


That's a pretty healthy, positive and intelligent perspective. Hats off to you.

No one can deny that the world we live in is a pretty fucked up place. The thing is, it has become increasingly fucked up. The older generation needs to put into motion plans for fixing or at least controlling the damage that has been done. For example, the war needs to end. People need to stop living in fear. The "terror alert" is useless. We have either become uncontrollably paranoid or permanently cynical. We are sick of being told to get back to our normal lives, but be paranoid, but do whatever we want, but we could get arrested for it, but get back to normal "or the terrorists win."

I never imagined that I would sit in my 11th grade US history class and stare blankly at the television, watching a plane crash into the World Trade Center. I never imagined that I would spend a week trying to get the image of the smoldering Pentagon out of my mind.

I admit that my generation has the opportunity to fix these problems, but that opportunity is too far away. Those thirty-somethings in power need to realize that we are not just going through a phase. We fear for our lives. We do not have enough of a voice to stop this madness before the damage is irreparable. We need someone to get things moving in order for us to accomplish anything. It is not entirely our responsibility.

Things aren't just fucked up for us; they're fucked up for everybody. Those in power need to take responsibility for what they have done before they say "oh the next generation can fix it." We can't fix a problem that you continue to promote.

It's easy to become discouraged with the way the media portrays our world. there are untapped sources of oil, under the oceans, that may very well sustain our use for untold years. This is no excuse for trashing the environment, but gives hope that we won't see a global war over this resource.

With many baby-boomers heading for retirement, I've heard predictions of a job-glut in the market around 2010. Great news for Generation Y. Right now, new hires in nursing are receiving sign-on bonuses and yearly (or more often) cost-of-living increases. Heard a story on NPR (evil left-wing media, even) about how mining jobs, starting at about $17 per hour, are experiencing a shortage of workers. Hard work, but at decent pay for those without a college education.

My advice to anyone who has no direction in life (this was where I was in college, no less) is, if at all possible, to work in a so-called "real" job for a while, and find out what you really want to do. Now that I've been in the "real world," I'd like to go back and learn database management. Not too exciting, but I realise my talents lie there. Too bad that I can't afford tuition. The job market should turn around. Get a college degree (any degree) and get out there.

Despite the global war on terror, we live in a much more secure world than that of our parents. To have grown up without the threat of nuclear annihilation is something our parents wished to give to us. And succeeded. If you want inspiration, look at the people who are rebuilding Iraq and Afghanistan. These people have hope, despite great obstacles.

The world has always been a fucked up, scary, and harsh place. The people that suceed have to burn through all the bullshit, the people that don't either sputter out on drugs or go insane. If you can post on this internet forum you have it infinitely better then 90% of the world who is starving, dying of AIDs, and getting genocided.

IMO, the war on global terrorism is serious.

But nothing to get paranoid about. If it hits, well.. shit. It it doesn't, hurrah.

Because it's not in your hands. And your more likely to die of cancer, and getting runned down by a car then terrorists.

But I think Maubachia has said it best. I can't imagine living during the cold war era's, especially in America. Where the nuclear threat is very real. And the day when suddenly the alarms ring out, that you have to head to the bunkers is awfully scary.

If I lived during that time, I would have preferred to run to the hills and stay a quiet life rather than work in a city. :p

In this day and age if you are not a college educated upper middle class professional you are fundamentally screwed. If you do not have a upper middle class parent who can pay your way though college you are fundamentally screwed.

For the youth in America your future depends on remember the following question:

Do you want fries with that?

Precisely my point Johnistan. The people posting here have it good. The world is very much their oyster. They have computers, a house, phonelines, electricity. With hard work and a bit of thought they could do anything they like.
They need to consider their views on the world, and realise there are people out there who would give anything to live in "our world of no future" as they put it

Do you want fries with that?


Yes please...and a medium Dr. Pepper

Precisely my point Johnistan. The people posting here have it good. The world is very much their oyster. They have computers, a house, phonelines, electricity. With hard work and a bit of thought they could do anything they like.
They need to consider their views on the world, and realise there are people out there who would give anything to live in "our world of no future" as they put it


We have a future, I'll admit that much. We just need the generation which is currently in power to get its damn act together so we DON'T end up getting screwed. We have been through a considerable amount of shit, however. I think we're still kind of pissed off.

Yes please...and a medium Dr. Pepper

"Wou'd like some cheese of that burger?" :D

I never imagined that I would sit in my 11th grade US history class and stare blankly at the television, watching a plane crash into the World Trade Center. I never imagined that I would spend a week trying to get the image of the smoldering Pentagon out of my mind.

I admit that my generation has the opportunity to fix these problems, but that opportunity is too far away. Those thirty-somethings in power need to realize that we are not just going through a phase. We fear for our lives. We do not have enough of a voice to stop this madness before the damage is irreparable. We need someone to get things moving in order for us to accomplish anything. It is not entirely our responsibility.


The problem with this, Fruit, is that we "thirtysomethings" aren't in control of much of anything. We do what we can where we can and how we can. But the people who are truely in control are in the "fiftysomethings" and aren't ready or willing to relinquish the reins to the next generation. Some of them are doing okay while others are hellbent on making things as bad as any of us can imagine.

I know this might sound wierd to you, being in school and all, but "thirtysomething" by modern standards is really young still. The world has always been run by "old men" and that hasn't changed yet, nor, I suspect, will that change anytime in my lifetime.

Pardon my cynicism, but our lives have ALWAYS been in danger. There have always been diseases, war and other threats to our health and wellbeing. Every generation has lived under the shadow of some major life-threatening cataclysm either manmade or natural. Imagine the terror your grandparents lived in from the threat of bombing and the horror your parents lived with as children, living with the nuclear threat. Yet somehow we all made it through, most of us happy, well-adjusted and prosperous.

It just sounds so much to me as if some of your generation has this mistaken idea that all the horrors of history are yours and yours alone, thrust on you by your parents' generation and that it's up to everyone that ISN'T your generation to turn the world into some sparkling utopia. But the reality is that utopia cannot exist while humans are included in it because humans by nature are imperfect, violent, opportunistic and generally resistant to any condition in which an utopia might exist. So every new crop of kids is going to face a new threat. That's reality.

How you FACE your generation's Great Threat is your deal. Ultimately we are all individually responsible for our own lives and the ways in which we individually deal with them. If you as an individual choose the path of indignant shock and horror, that is your choice and the consequences you live with as a result of your way of looking at the world are yours and yours alone.

~I~ have lived my life knowing that at any time that I could die in some dreadfully unpleasant way, be it a nuclear warhead striking in DC (not far from my home in in VA), some gang banger shooting or stabbing me, being struck by a car, truck or bus crossing the street to have lunch at the Iranian restaurant with my boyfriend or dying on a plane on one of my vacations. So many ways to unexpectedly buy the big one. But I'm okay with that. Part of living is the uncertainty of how much time I might have. I don't know. No one really does. So rather than mourn my life and worry about it, I live it well. Because I have a choice in that. I dictate how WELL I will live while I have the luck to be breathing. I never take it for granted.

Ten years ago I got "the dreaded phonecall" from someone who had been my lover three years before that. I was freaked beyond all comprehension. I AND my boyfriend went immediately to get tested for the dreaded virus despite our having been monogamous for the duration of our relationship. The shadow of death passed over us. It's that simple. Life goes on. Don't tell ME about how awful your generation has it. Because I've known as much horror as you can imagine and it doesn't frighten me at all. It's life. Get used to it. Quit bitching and do something joyous with your time.

In this day and age if you are not a college educated upper middle class professional you are fundamentally screwed. If you do not have a upper middle class parent who can pay your way though college you are fundamentally screwed.

For the youth in America your future depends on remember the following question:

Do you want fries with that?


I don't have upper middle class parents who are paying my way through college. I live in Georgia and I'm mooching off the HOPE scholarship and the Pell Grant while going into debt with three separate loans just to pay for college. I'll be screwed when I get out if I don't get a job. The screwing hasn't really started yet. ;P

yes we are all very fortunate to have computers and internet and electicity, but I have to wonder why are you bitching and being moody and selfish instead of helping those who don't have as much as you do?

It seems to me that the system is inheirentally fucked up so that the gap between the rich and the poor is steadily increasing and there is nothing to be done about it. We need a new system

yes we are all very fortunate to have computers and internet and electicity, but I have to wonder why are you bitching and being moody and selfish instead of helping those who don't have as much as you do?

It seems to me that the system is inheirentally fucked up so that the gap between the rich and the poor is steadily increasing and there is nothing to be done about it. We need a new system
If there's a new wave, I'll be the first in line. But it'd better work this time.

Megadeth wrote that in the '80s. People knew it then, people know it now. The world sucks major league ass sometimes.

The problem with this, Fruit, is that we "thirtysomethings" aren't in control of much of anything. We do what we can where we can and how we can. But the people who are truely in control are in the "fiftysomethings" and aren't ready or willing to relinquish the reins to the next generation. Some of them are doing okay while others are hellbent on making things as bad as any of us can imagine.

I know this might sound wierd to you, being in school and all, but "thirtysomething" by modern standards is really young still. The world has always been run by "old men" and that hasn't changed yet, nor, I suspect, will that change anytime in my lifetime.

Pardon my cynicism, but our lives have ALWAYS been in danger. There have always been diseases, war and other threats to our health and wellbeing. Every generation has lived under the shadow of some major life-threatening cataclysm either manmade or natural. Imagine the terror your grandparents lived in from the threat of bombing and the horror your parents lived with as children, living with the nuclear threat. Yet somehow we all made it through, most of us happy, well-adjusted and prosperous.

It just sounds so much to me as if some of your generation has this mistaken idea that all the horrors of history are yours and yours alone, thrust on you by your parents' generation and that it's up to everyone that ISN'T your generation to turn the world into some sparkling utopia. But the reality is that utopia cannot exist while humans are included in it because humans by nature are imperfect, violent, opportunistic and generally resistant to any condition in which an utopia might exist. So every new crop of kids is going to face a new threat. That's reality.

How you FACE your generation's Great Threat is your deal. Ultimately we are all individually responsible for our own lives and the ways in which we individually deal with them. If you as an individual choose the path of indignant shock and horror, that is your choice and the consequences you live with as a result of your way of looking at the world are yours and yours alone.

~I~ have lived my life knowing that at any time that I could die in some dreadfully unpleasant way, be it a nuclear warhead striking in DC (not far from my home in in VA), some gang banger shooting or stabbing me, being struck by a car, truck or bus crossing the street to have lunch at the Iranian restaurant with my boyfriend or dying on a plane on one of my vacations. So many ways to unexpectedly buy the big one. But I'm okay with that. Part of living is the uncertainty of how much time I might have. I don't know. No one really does. So rather than mourn my life and worry about it, I live it well. Because I have a choice in that. I dictate how WELL I will live while I have the luck to be breathing. I never take it for granted.

Ten years ago I got "the dreaded phonecall" from someone who had been my lover three years before that. I was freaked beyond all comprehension. I AND my boyfriend went immediately to get tested for the dreaded virus despite our having been monogamous for the duration of our relationship. The shadow of death passed over us. It's that simple. Life goes on. Don't tell ME about how awful your generation has it. Because I've known as much horror as you can imagine and it doesn't frighten me at all. It's life. Get used to it. Quit bitching and do something joyous with your time.

I just wish that the government would realize that "hey, this stuff is actually going to affect the college students that we're always bragging about." I just feel like people want to assume that we college students are in a bubble, where we can play frisbee and hacky-sack , and go to class, and all get along like we're happy and shit. Personally, I am not horrified. I am deeply confused.

My major pretty much demands that I begin working in the government or corporate sector as soon as I graduate. It feels very weird to have my generation talking about "not selling out" and hating the government, and I actually plan to work with these dreaded entities. I'm kind of like... "huh? o.O These guys are going to give me money, and you want me to say screw them? oh HELL no!"

Meh. Screw it. My allergies are acting up a bit too much for me to clearly express a complete thought today. Maybe tomorrow.

I don't have upper middle class parents who are paying my way through college. I live in Georgia and I'm mooching off the HOPE scholarship and the Pell Grant while going into debt with three separate loans just to pay for college. I'll be screwed when I get out if I don't get a job. The screwing hasn't really started yet. ;P

Oh I’m sure there willl be a job for you,... Oops sorry that one just got shipped to China. Or that one,... No, outsourced to India. Perhaps that one,... Damn! Outsourced to Malaysia!

You remember that question I told you memorize? :D

In this day and age if you are not a college educated upper middle class professional you are fundamentally screwed. If you do not have a upper middle class parent who can pay your way though college you are fundamentally screwed.

For the youth in America your future depends on remember the following question:

Do you want fries with that?
All you're doing is giving yourself an excuse to fail.

All you're doing is giving yourself an excuse to fail.


You want fries with that platitude. :D

Oh I’m sure there willl be a job for you,... Oops sorry that one just got shipped to China. Or that one,... No, outsourced to India. Perhaps that one,... Damn! Outsourced to Malaysia!

You remember that question I told you memorize? :D

I'm pretty much guaranteed a job when I graduate because of the nature of my major and because I'm female. Outsourcing won't affect me because I have to actually physically be there to do the work. ^_^

"Wou'd like some cheese of that burger?" :D



Yes please :D

To all the apparent-nihilists on this thread (thread initiator included):

Welcome to reality. If you like it, enjoy your time on Earth. If not, then stop posting on a relatively insignificant forum (in the grand scheme of things, at least) and do something about it. Like help those less fortunate than you. If you are unfortunate enough to be number 7,000,000,000 on the list of "Most Fortunate on the Planet," then you probably aren't reading this, anyway.

To all the apparent-nihilists on this thread (thread initiator included):

Welcome to reality. If you like it, enjoy your time on Earth. If not, then stop posting on a relatively insignificant forum (in the grand scheme of things, at least) and do something about it. Like help those less fortunate than you. If you are unfortunate enough to be number 7,000,000,000 on the list of "Most Fortunate on the Planet," then you probably aren't reading this, anyway.


Would you like some fries while you wait for the "Mother Ship". :D

Would you like some fries while you wait for the "Mother Ship". :D

dude, lay off the drugs....

I haven't read all the pages of this thread (I really can't be bothered.), but I have to say this to any teenagers who think their 'depressed' (BTW, this is for people who have lots of stuff (for use of a better phrase.)):

You may well be, but think of the million+ homeless from the tsunami in the east. At least you have a home! And clean water, and a bed. Think about it.
Also, 'depression' can screw up relationships. I know this. I used to think I was depressed, then a friend slapped some sense into me. I learnt a lesson from this, she was the only one I had left in my life after my phase. Now I'm patching relationships up with my ex-friends, although I don't think it'll be what it once was. You lose close friends, even familly.
Don't screw up peoples lives by 'depression', especially self-harm, that f**ks up your life forever. Trust me on that, I know.
Just think what you have, and what others don't. I'm sure you have more.

Anyway, the point is: Don't do something you'll regret, talk to someone, that's what I did. It'll help. Just think. Everyone has a future, and you shall make yours happen. No matter how screwed up your life is now, it'll happen....

(BTW, I'm 14.)

dude, lay off the drugs....


:p

I haven't read all the pages of this thread (I really can't be bothered.), but I have to say this to any teenagers who think their 'depressed' (BTW, this is for people who have lots of stuff (for use of a better phrase.)):

You may well be, but think of the million+ homeless from the tsunami in the east. At least you have a home! And clean water, and a bed. Think about it.
Also, 'depression' can screw up relationships. I know this. I used to think I was depressed, then a friend slapped some sense into me. I learnt a lesson from this, she was the only one I had left in my life after my phase. Now I'm patching relationships up with my ex-friends, although I don't think it'll be what it once was. You lose close friends, even familly.
Don't screw up peoples lives by 'depression', especially self-harm, that f**ks up your life forever. Trust me on that, I know.
Just think what you have, and what others don't. I'm sure you have more.

Anyway, the point is: Don't do something you'll regret, talk to someone, that's what I did. It'll help. Just think. Everyone has a future, and you shall make yours happen. No matter how screwed up your life is now, it'll happen....

(BTW, I'm 14.)

You're forgetting about those who suffer from depression due to a chemical imbalance. It's not something you can just slap out of somebody. Sorry, but the idea that being depressed is stupid is well, quite rude. Also, please don't mock self-harm. Some of the most common reasons for self-harm are abuse and PTSD. These are actually very serious.

It's not a "phase" for everyone. Not everyone goes through it and not everyone ever passes it.
That is very true. The condition you describe is called 'emotionally &/or developmentally arrested'. Some people go a lifetime thinking & emoting like adolesents.

Okay gang! Here's the opinion of what most of you would call an "Old Woman". though I look in the mirror and I see that I have aged, I really don't believe that my spirit has done much aging, yes matured, but not aged. I'm 48 years old, older, but not so old that I'm not out there in the real world. It is my opinion that it is my generation that gave our children their hopeless out look on life. (Well, most of my generation).

I grew up in a generation where we believed we could do damn near anything! 1972-1973 we bitched, and compained so much about the Vietnam war that the draft was recalled, and our children started to come back home. Technology went through the roof. There were no cell phones, CDs and DVDs, or PCs. Microwave ovens were just beginning to be popular, we all remember washing dishes by hand, there were few automactic dish washers. The telephone lines were regulated so it cost a small fortune to speak to someone in the next town if it was long distance. Of course we knew nothing about AIDS, but the mortality rate was much higher back then becauce we didn't have the advanced medical knowledge we have now. I could go on and on for hours telling you about the advances the world made because of the people of my generation. But while we were out there making the world a better, more efficiant place to live we forgot to make our own home a place to nuture and grow strong spirited children.

Mom and dad both worked, we still do (we ain't retired yet, and my die working if our economy gets any worse.) We sat you in front of a TV with cable, gave you a cell phone to speak to us, bought you prepackaged food to warm in a microwave, we dressed you in the best of clothes, sent you to racially integrated schools, and gave you the freedom to choose your own religion. We did it all for you, or so we thought. We wanted to give the best of the world to you, we wanted to shield you from the reality of the hard, not so perfect world out there.

But we forgot to involve you in our world, forgot to teach you the values that drove us to make the world in our likeness. We left you alone, by yourselves to figure it out by yourselves. We figured money could buy everything! We forgot to hug you when you fell, we weren't there, we were at work making the money to pay for your hospital bills. Your chicken soup came from a can, not the heart. We gave you TV programs that painted a picture for you instead of buying you books, and teaching you to dream your own vision of the world. Our motto was "it's the clothes that make the man", and forgot to teach you about the man inside. We killed the spiritual God whatever name you give it, and replaced it with the almighty dollar, and the micro chip. It's all our fault!

But there is hope. . .

The world is now yours. It's up to you to bitch and moan about how horrible it is, or change it. . . We tried, we screwed up. I pray to the powers that be that you find it in yourselves to do a better job than we did. You are YOUR childrens future.

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.

Yes .. and you'll say it to the generation that comes after you. Circle of life and all that.

What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future.

We are Generation X ... listen to our music, look at the goth culture of our day, look at our anger and ask yourself "Why?" ... I think we understand.

We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay?

Oh we realize it and don't like it much either.

Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs

Huh? You must be thinkin' about the 50s.

it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it.

Actually, we were the first generation to not be better off than the generation before us in the history of the US. We got pretty pissed about that.

Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s

Little before my time, but I've read some history. The 60s and 70s sucked ass. Vietnam war, civil rights riots, rampant unchecked inflation, Presidential assassinations clouded in mystery, fear of nuclear annihilation, Oval Office scandal worse than a little misguided foreplay, National Guardsmen shooting at college students, poor state of education, and on top of all that, seriously ugly clothes ... oh yeah ... glorious times.

The WWII generation had an objective!

Yeah, sure, but they're pretty much almost dead by now. I wouldn't complain too much about your great-grandparents.

But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.

Not really. The 70s created that. The 80s did pretty much suck ass as well and sent our economy into a tailspin that took 14 years to recover from (and another 4 months to ruin again), but it was getting better socially. Gen X - or the "MTV generation" if you will - came to the staggering realization at an early age that they (we) would never be better off than our parents (who were already pretty much poor themselves) and it gave us something to cling to. The 80s made a few people incredibly wealthy and Reagan's trickle-down economics ensured that the poor would stay poor and get more poor and that the ranks of the poor would quadruple coming into the 90s.

I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future.

Yeah ... we do. I'm not sure you do.

Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me.That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.

Well, you live in a time very similar to the 1980s. We had to go through it, too. It will pass and you'll get a few decent years before someone comes along and fucks it all up again.

It's ok, though. You'll get to hear it all over again from the next generation.

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.

My young friend, you have raised a number of valid points but they are are not all the facts. From what you have written I see that you are experiencing depression which is affecting your ability to see the complete picture.

There are always oppositions and frustrations in life. But it is exactly this resistance that impels a motivated person forward. A 'can do' attitude will get you a lot closer to your goals and dreams than a hopeless surrender which assures defeat and destruction of hope.

At least part of your depression, if not all, is likely due to taking drugs. They may initially offer a temporary neurochemically induced euphoria but that is paid for with the recriprocal state of mind when their effect wears off.

Why not try to set aside all mood/mind altering substances for a few months? You will be amazed to see how this will elevate you ability to perceive life from a more balanced perspective.

I am a 51 year old American from NYC. When I was a young man I had inherited a world on the verge of nuclear anihilation where people of any color but white were second class citizens as were all women.

Active resistence to what seemed to be unalterable has changed much of this. The order of things was changed for the better. There is still work to be done, boundries to be pushed back and other inequities and inhumanities to be attacked. But we live in a much better world than the one we inherited.

With continued effort by succeeding generations such as yours. You too may one day hand a better world to your children and grandchildren. You have more strength and opportunity than you currently see.

Peace.

My young friend, you have raised a number of valid points but they are are not all the facts. From what you have written I see that you are experiencing depression which is affecting your ability to see the complete picture.

There are always oppositions and frustrations in life. But it is exactly this resistance that impels a motivated person forward. A 'can do' attitude will get you a lot closer to your goals and dreams than a hopeless surrender which assures defeat and destruction of hope.

At least part of your depression, if not all, is likely due to taking drugs. They may initially offer a temporary neurochemically induced euphoria but that is paid for with the recriprocal state of mind when their effect wears off.

Why not try to set aside all mood/mind altering substances for a few months? You will be amazed to see how this will elevate you ability to perceive life from a more balanced perspective.

I am a 51 year old American from NYC. When I was a young man I had inherited a world on the verge of nuclear anihilation where people of any color but white were second class citizens as were all women.

Active resistence to what seemed to be unalterable has changed much of this. The order of things was changed for the better. There is still work to be done, boundries to be pushed back and other inequities and inhumanities to be attacked. But we live in a much better world than the one we inherited.

With continued effort by succeeding generations such as yours. You too may one day hand a better world to your children and grandchildren. You have more strength and opportunity than you currently see.

Peace.


You know what it's like to grow up in a global WTF moment. When you were a teenager/college student, did you wonder what the hell was going on as well?

I'm 21 and I don't know how good I've got it, I like to bitch about the fact that I have no future and my parents ruined everything and so on and so forth...

but on the other hand my house isn't sliding down a hill on the crest of a wave of mud and furniture so maybe I should stop complaining all the damn time.
The bitching at your parential units is natural. It is a hard transition from the idealism of the adolescent years into "reality". Some lose all their idealism. They are the 'yuppie' types. Try to hang onto yours. It's better to have some balance

The bitching at your parential units is natural. It is a hard transition from the idealism of the adolescent years into "reality". Some lose all their idealism. They are the 'yuppie' types. Try to hang onto yours. It's better to have some balance


It's also difficult for parents to allow a legal adults (18-19 years old, in college or graduating from highschool) to behave like adults because of some weirdass programming that all of them seem to have..

Now see what is true about the first post is that it was a better time during the 40's, 50's, 60's, and 70's. Where if you can dream you can make it happen. Now all of those dreams are big corporations that no longer care about people but care about the bottom line. What we need is a depression. Where big companies go flop and new one's can get started. If we want to stay with the american dream that is what needs to be done.

He is also right about adults. You guys did live in a time where almost anything was possible. Now when you ask someone under 21 if you think that it is possible to dream something up and do it they laugh at you. They also laugh at you when you ask if you think you will get social security when you retire. To me that is sad. I really see a future where big coroporations run everything and all we are is consumers. Unless we have a depression.

All those of you raging against previous generations:

Life's not so bad. You're here because you were the first miniscule little sperm to make it to an egg. All the other 200,000 or so who took that first journey with you died in the hostile conditions of your mother's womb, burned up by protective chemicals before they had any chance to emerge and start whining about how awful everything is.

This is, in all, a pretty damned good time to be alive. We've got the best healthcare ever known, even if some people can't afford it, we've got a half-decent code of laws and people who spend their lives upholding them (and that only came into being a couple of hundred years ago), if you get a job you'll get some of the best working conditions ever... the list just goes on. If you're reading this you have a computer AND the internet. You've got a machine that can get you all the information in the world in minutes. NO previous generation grew up with that, and our parents gave them to us. And then you turn around and moan about them.

If you want to moan, try going back to 1800's London, when the infant mortality rate was 70%. Seven out of ten kids died before they turned five, the streets were BLACK with soot from factories, and the average life expectancy for the working class was about forty. That's bad. Don't sit in your nice central-heated house (paid for by mumsy and dadsy, or it was for the first 16 years of your life at least), infront of your computer, on your high-speed internet conection, and start moaning about how rough you've got it. I'm 20 years old, and frankly I'm glad to have anything at all.

All those of you raging against previous generations:

Life's not so bad. You're here because you were the first miniscule little sperm to make it to an egg. All the other 200,000 or so who took that first journey with you died in the hostile conditions of your mother's womb, burned up by protective chemicals before they had any chance to emerge and start whining about how awful everything is.

This is, in all, a pretty damned good time to be alive. We've got the best healthcare ever known, even if some people can't afford it, we've got a half-decent code of laws and people who spend their lives upholding them (and that only came into being a couple of hundred years ago), if you get a job you'll get some of the best working conditions ever... the list just goes on. If you're reading this you have a computer AND the internet. You've got a machine that can get you all the information in the world in minutes. NO previous generation grew up with that, and our parents gave them to us. And then you turn around and moan about them.

If you want to moan, try going back to 1800's London, when the infant mortality rate was 70%. Seven out of ten kids died before they turned five, the streets were BLACK with soot from factories, and the average life expectancy for the working class was about forty. That's bad. Don't sit in your nice central-heated house (paid for by mumsy and dadsy, or it was for the first 16 years of your life at least), infront of your computer, on your high-speed internet conection, and start moaning about how rough you've got it. I'm 20 years old, and frankly I'm glad to have anything at all.
Not to mention wise beyond your years. :)

I do agree though that in the 60's and 70's you didnt have to worry about all the things we have too now, you could do all most anything u wanted....stupid 80's i knew that they were evil.

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.

I'm 21, so I'm right in the middle of the two generations. And I think that you are absolutely correct. The values of the older generation stink. THe world is about how you put it. IF you accept a certain worldview. The thing is, the older generation also accepted this world view, but they didn't have the guts to follow it to it's logical conclusion. They are happy so long as nothing happens to them and they could keep making money. Personally, I don't buy into that worldview, so I'm not so despondent. For more information, I suggest reading How Should We Then Live? by Francis Schaeffer.

It's also difficult for parents to allow a legal adults (18-19 years old, in college or graduating from highschool) to behave like adults because of some weirdass programming that all of them seem to have..

I hate to burst your bubble, but my 86-year-old grandmother still treats my 67-year-old dad like he's 17....

Parents feel like you're a kid for life. But eventually, they learn to humor us and let us make our own mistakes -- after all, they have to have the last "Didn't we say this would happen?" ;)

I hate to burst your bubble, but my 86-year-old grandmother still treats my 67-year-old dad like he's 17....

Parents feel like you're a kid for life. But eventually, they learn to humor us and let us make our own mistakes -- after all, they have to have the last "Didn't we say this would happen?" ;)

Actually, you didn't burst my bubble...you just proved that the "weirdass programming" never wears off,lol

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.
to my mind, our parents' generation (i'm assuming we're about the same age - i'm 19, and that our parents are of the same generation - born in the 50s) had something to aim for: a great change. they caused a social upheaval in the 1960s and 70s that changed the face of the planet, changed world politics, changed the way people behave and act in their lives and towards each other, and created an awareness of the environment. people like my parents, hippies - my dad a leading vietnam war protester in london :) - instigated this change. it was exciting... for them.
the legacy they have left us is of an arguably better world, and a world in which an individual can accomplish more if they try - particularily women. but there is no radical change left - nothing to fight for; at least not with such vigour or scope. sure our generation can get involved in changing the third world for the better, or bitching about the environment, but it's just not the same.
that is not to say there are no issues worth fighting for today: the fact that western our cultures (particularily the usa from what i hear) are practically run by large corporations, amongst other similar heated socio-political issues, is worth fighting for to change - but there is none of the culture of change that was associated with their generation. nowadays only a few, informed young people (like ourselves and other NSers for eg ;) ) care about these issues at all. for most people, certainly looking at my own friends, the world that our parents left us is just fine - in their eyes it has its problems but they are for someone else to worry about. thus these problems go largely unchecked with nobody else seeming to care, and we get more and more frustrated.
i hope that this rings a bell with you cos its what i think, at least, and i kinda agree with your original post... what ive just ranted about is maybe kinda a "rational" explaination for it. maybe it is our politics? maybe we are idealists. maybe its just that we are young and younger people, stereotypically, want change. i don't know, but hopefully you'll see that you are both not alone in thinking this and that there is a perfectly good reason for your opinion.

edit: god that was a long post. essentially what im saying is that some people in our generation want/need change, but previous generations did such a good job of it in the 60s & 70s that there's almost nothing left worth fighting for - or at least for the majority of our generation. hence we get frustrated and angry.

Eternity is now. It is not in the future. If you want to do something, do it now. All this talk is just delaying the decision making. Theology and intellectualism is never going to become reality if it is not acted upon. You all are a bunch of procastinators like I am.

Just for fun, and for good discussion, I would like to post a quote from the movie Fight Club, a lot of the premise of the movie is parallel to this thread. Mind you, that this is about the end of the previous gen. and the current group of young people.

TYLER
"We're the middle children of history, with no special purpose or place. We don't have a great war in our generation, or a great depression. The great depression is our lives. The great war is a spiritual war."

JACK
"We were raised by television to believe that someday we'll all be millionaires and movie stars and rock stars -- but we won't. And we're learning that fact."

TYLER
"And we're very, *very* pissed-off."

this is like the ultimate nihilism movie, it rocks, but it also serves as another example of the feelings of this generation

Ahh, the wonderful period of "what the hell is going on?" Everyone has a moment of, thinking to themselves, "wow, this is fucked up" about one part of life.

I agree that older generations left us with shit. But instead of bitching, do some good for the next generation. Otherwise you're just a hipocrit.

i agree with u 110%. it's not a phrase, its just waking up and relizing shit no matter wat its a dead end life. rather the country or the system its all the same there is no point. maybe some just see it sooner then others. but we all see it even older people see it around there 50 they see there is no true point to life and the future shit the future is never. instead of going futher into it trying to better it we just ruin it more and retreat backwards. u know why when i hear gun shots i don't do shit? b/c the news is telling me that there either going to be an attack on my nation that will kill me or my loved onces or there some deadly viruse that makes it unsafe to go out. the only reason people see it as a phrase is b/c u occupy ur head with ur bills and work. but when u got nothing to do other then algebra and reports u start to think. There are a couple of us that are different who want to be different Ohhh god u don't want to see the onces who follow the herd, it just makes me think if we are the future THE FUTURE IS FUCKED BIG TIME :( :headbang:

Hi. I haven't read ALL the pages, but I read the first three or so, so I have an idea what's being discussed here.

I turned twenty three months ago. I've been diagnosed with severe major depression (cyclothymic) since summer 2003. It turns out I've actually had depression on and off for the past 8 years, but never understood what it was. I get intense periods of suicidal ideation for no reason whatsoever, and the worst trigger for me is...you guessed it: the MEDIA. I'm not just some whiny little brat. Yeah I've had a better life than most, though my parents never had enough money for things, and my mother made every single piece of clothing for me, my sister, herself, and my dad, during my first 8 years of life, because she didn't have the money to buy them outright.

That aside, I hope you get that I'm not just a whiny kid, I'm genuinely clinically depressed. I no longer watch TV, unless I'm home for the holidays or the occasional weekend (I'm at university). I can't watch anything, because everything reduces me to a sobbing wreck, including movies lol. Can you believe it? I can't really watch any movies anymore, not even the most light-hearted ones. I can't read the papers very often, or hear about the news too much. It's not as bad as when I was first diagnosed - my doctor forbid me to watch TV, read newspapers, or listen to the radio, because he feared I would kill myself if I did.

Depression is unbearable sadness, loneliness, tiredness, and in my case, anger. The tiredness was so bad sometimes, that I slept 16 hours in a day, lay down in the middle of the street when I felt I couldn't go any further. The sadness was so bad I couldn't take anymore, and attempted suicide at least 6 times in the past 4 months alone. I got so angry, I had to isolate myself so as not to hurt the people I loved, and the isolation only made me feel even more depressed and lonely.

My point is, this is a horrible, unrelenting mental illness, and it's only because of my medication being changed that I am pretty much on an even keel at the moment. the real point is:

THIS ILLNESS IS ENDEMIC IN THE YOUTH OF TODAY. I have this mental illness because everyone in my mother's family has it, it's genetic, and for me, it will never truly go away, I can only learn coping strategies. For other people of my generation, this illness is just as bad, just as un-asked-for as it is for me, but for them, it is a reflection of the effect that our times is having on them.

I'm not saying "pity us", I'm just saying that whatever goes on in the world, whether people are far worse off than me or not, for people with this illness THAT DOES NOT MEAN A DAMN THING ANYMORE, because it simply does not register on the brain. For some people, the world is in such bad shape, they have gone completely numb, and withdrawn into themselves...or as the older generations might say, "lazy", "indolent", "reckless". One of the reasons I think it's so bad for THIS generation is that the world is smaller than ever before in history. The march of "progress" that is globalisation leaves nowhere for people to go, to gather their thoughts and set up a new way of being, thinking, living. If the world is going to change at all, it has to start from the ground up this time - not through any specific group of people fightin for something specific. I think it's time for change on a global scale, and it has to start with US, OUR generation, but to me it still seems impossible at this time of my short life.

I've forgotten what the stats are, but more kids than ever have this illness, and it has increased in incidence by a factor of 10 since the second world war.

I hope you got my point somewhere in there, lol. I used to be really fluent in my speech, really good, but I lost my edge when I hit depression. Sorry, I've gone on a bit haven't I? sorry.

Hi. I haven't read ALL the pages, but I read the first three or so, so I have an idea what's being discussed here.

I turned twenty three months ago. I've been diagnosed with severe major depression (cyclothymic) since summer 2003. It turns out I've actually had depression on and off for the past 8 years, but never understood what it was. I get intense periods of suicidal ideation for no reason whatsoever, and the worst trigger for me is...you guessed it: the MEDIA. I'm not just some whiny little brat. Yeah I've had a better life than most, though my parents never had enough money for things, and my mother made every single piece of clothing for me, my sister, herself, and my dad, during my first 8 years of life, because she didn't have the money to buy them outright.

That aside, I hope you get that I'm not just a whiny kid, I'm genuinely clinically depressed. I no longer watch TV, unless I'm home for the holidays or the occasional weekend (I'm at university). I can't watch anything, because everything reduces me to a sobbing wreck, including movies lol. Can you believe it? I can't really watch any movies anymore, not even the most light-hearted ones. I can't read the papers very often, or hear about the news too much. It's not as bad as when I was first diagnosed - my doctor forbid me to watch TV, read newspapers, or listen to the radio, because he feared I would kill myself if I did.

Depression is unbearable sadness, loneliness, tiredness, and in my case, anger. The tiredness was so bad sometimes, that I slept 16 hours in a day, lay down in the middle of the street when I felt I couldn't go any further. The sadness was so bad I couldn't take anymore, and attempted suicide at least 6 times in the past 4 months alone. I got so angry, I had to isolate myself so as not to hurt the people I loved, and the isolation only made me feel even more depressed and lonely.

My point is, this is a horrible, unrelenting mental illness, and it's only because of my medication being changed that I am pretty much on an even keel at the moment. the real point is:

THIS ILLNESS IS ENDEMIC IN THE YOUTH OF TODAY. I have this mental illness because everyone in my mother's family has it, it's genetic, and for me, it will never truly go away, I can only learn coping strategies. For other people of my generation, this illness is just as bad, just as un-asked-for as it is for me, but for them, it is a reflection of the effect that our times is having on them.

I'm not saying "pity us", I'm just saying that whatever goes on in the world, whether people are far worse off than me or not, for people with this illness THAT DOES NOT MEAN A DAMN THING ANYMORE, because it simply does not register on the brain. For some people, the world is in such bad shape, they have gone completely numb, and withdrawn into themselves...or as the older generations might say, "lazy", "indolent", "reckless". One of the reasons I think it's so bad for THIS generation is that the world is smaller than ever before in history. The march of "progress" that is globalisation leaves nowhere for people to go, to gather their thoughts and set up a new way of being, thinking, living. If the world is going to change at all, it has to start from the ground up this time - not through any specific group of people fightin for something specific. I think it's time for change on a global scale, and it has to start with US, OUR generation, but to me it still seems impossible at this time of my short life.

I've forgotten what the stats are, but more kids than ever have this illness, and it has increased in incidence by a factor of 10 since the second world war.

I hope you got my point somewhere in there, lol. I used to be really fluent in my speech, really good, but I lost my edge when I hit depression. Sorry, I've gone on a bit haven't I? sorry.


That's OK that's what these forums are good for. When ever you fell the need spew away it's very therapeutic.

Would you like fries with that long post? :D

Hi. --------------- sorry.
I believe there are two chief reasons why the incidence of depression has risen since the second world war.

First: The ability to diagnose depression is far easier now. The condition is also far more recognizable now.

Second: The culture has changed. People no longer unhealthfully repress their "unhappy" emotions as part of the stigma against feeling bad that used to exist. Many people of our grandparents generation would often totally ignore their emotions and were often perennially grumpy. Our generation on the other hand was raised in a far more open about emotions society. We are raised to listen to our emotions more, and if we are feeling emotions that are unhealthy, we know that there is always somewhere we can go for help and that we don't have to do it on our own.

i agree with u 110%. it's not a phrase, its just waking up and relizing shit no matter wat its a dead end life. rather the country or the system its all the same there is no point. maybe some just see it sooner then others. but we all see it even older people see it around there 50 they see there is no true point to life and the future shit the future is never. instead of going futher into it trying to better it we just ruin it more and retreat backwards. u know why when i hear gun shots i don't do shit? b/c the news is telling me that there either going to be an attack on my nation that will kill me or my loved onces or there some deadly viruse that makes it unsafe to go out. the only reason people see it as a phrase is b/c u occupy ur head with ur bills and work. but when u got nothing to do other then algebra and reports u start to think. There are a couple of us that are different who want to be different Ohhh god u don't want to see the onces who follow the herd, it just makes me think if we are the future THE FUTURE IS FUCKED BIG TIME :( :headbang:

You sure you don't follow a herd of some sort? Everyone does, I can assure you that.

I went through a stage of being really depressed about life, thought I'd get nowhere, all the "die an old lonely man" bollocks.

I got over it dramatically and now I'm loving everything about life.

How? Hmm, dunno. A bit of luck, a lot of drive. If you feel like you have a purpose and a worth, you stop sitting there naval-gazing and thinking about how you hate yourself.

Yeah,
The first rule of fight club is . . . You do not talk about fight club.
The second rule of fight club is . . . You do not talk about fight club.
I look around, I look around, I see a lot of new faces here tonight.
[laughter]
Shut up. Some of you have been breaking the first two rules.

You sure you don't follow a herd of some sort? Everyone does, I can assure you that.
So true ... look at the massive growth of places like hot topic that are making millions of people who are trying to be different but just end up being more the same
counter culture has become the majordy ... what does that make it counter of?

and always remember "you are unique like everyone else"

edit: god that was a long post. essentially what im saying is that some people in our generation want/need change, but previous generations did such a good job of it in the 60s & 70s that there's almost nothing left worth fighting for - or at least for the majority of our generation. hence we get frustrated and angry.

But there are still so many EPIC things to fight for and against. Every issue the generations that come before resolve is replaced by two more of equal or greater signifigance in some global hydra of scientific, social and economic ills.

We do not yet live in a world free of widespread and lethal disease.

We do not yet live in a world where economic and social inequities have been destroyed.

We have not discovered every great scientific and technological advancement (and never shall).

We have not yet found a "cure" for war.

Hell, we've yet to implement a practical alternative to fossil fuels FFS...

There is FAR from "almost nothing left to fight for". There is so much left to advance and discover that you'd be hard-pressed NOT to find a cause to espouse. But I doubt that was the point the original poster was making. THAT was more of a drawn out "the world is hosed, I got nothing to live for and it's all my parents' fault, f*ck you very much you old bastiges" statement.

Meh, world without a future my arse. That's what virtually every generation has thought, just look at their writing. The beat generation were writing about it in the 50s, Herman Hesse and Andre Gide were writing about it in the 20s, hell, Tugenev was writing about it in the 1860s.

You're not standing at the edge of an epoch, you're standing at the edge of puberty.

This whole thing is scaring me. Everyone is so sure the world is doomed.

What would I know - I'm a teenager.

Ima go play some counterstrike. :D

Taken as an average, most people on Earth are currently sleeping, fornicating, making adobe bricks for their house, or field stripping their AK-47 right now. (apologies to Neal Stephenson, from whom those stats are lifted)

Anybody with the electronic access to this forum is better off than a Great Many other people on this miserable ball o' mud.

The only thing you have to fear is fear of squirrels.

Juke,

T.V.A.

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.

EDIT: This is one persons opinion, there are those of us out there that are a little more optimistic

You're not standing at the edge of an epoch, you're standing at the edge of puberty.

Not sure which is more frightening.

Hi. I haven't read ALL the pages, but I read the first three or so, so I have an idea what's being discussed here.

I turned twenty three months ago. I've been diagnosed with severe major depression (cyclothymic) since summer 2003. It turns out I've actually had depression on and off for the past 8 years, but never understood what it was. I get intense periods of suicidal ideation for no reason whatsoever, and the worst trigger for me is...you guessed it: the MEDIA. I'm not just some whiny little brat. Yeah I've had a better life than most, though my parents never had enough money for things, and my mother made every single piece of clothing for me, my sister, herself, and my dad, during my first 8 years of life, because she didn't have the money to buy them outright.

That aside, I hope you get that I'm not just a whiny kid, I'm genuinely clinically depressed. I no longer watch TV, unless I'm home for the holidays or the occasional weekend (I'm at university). I can't watch anything, because everything reduces me to a sobbing wreck, including movies lol. Can you believe it? I can't really watch any movies anymore, not even the most light-hearted ones. I can't read the papers very often, or hear about the news too much. It's not as bad as when I was first diagnosed - my doctor forbid me to watch TV, read newspapers, or listen to the radio, because he feared I would kill myself if I did.

Depression is unbearable sadness, loneliness, tiredness, and in my case, anger. The tiredness was so bad sometimes, that I slept 16 hours in a day, lay down in the middle of the street when I felt I couldn't go any further. The sadness was so bad I couldn't take anymore, and attempted suicide at least 6 times in the past 4 months alone. I got so angry, I had to isolate myself so as not to hurt the people I loved, and the isolation only made me feel even more depressed and lonely.

My point is, this is a horrible, unrelenting mental illness, and it's only because of my medication being changed that I am pretty much on an even keel at the moment. the real point is:

THIS ILLNESS IS ENDEMIC IN THE YOUTH OF TODAY. I have this mental illness because everyone in my mother's family has it, it's genetic, and for me, it will never truly go away, I can only learn coping strategies. For other people of my generation, this illness is just as bad, just as un-asked-for as it is for me, but for them, it is a reflection of the effect that our times is having on them.

I'm not saying "pity us", I'm just saying that whatever goes on in the world, whether people are far worse off than me or not, for people with this illness THAT DOES NOT MEAN A DAMN THING ANYMORE, because it simply does not register on the brain. For some people, the world is in such bad shape, they have gone completely numb, and withdrawn into themselves...or as the older generations might say, "lazy", "indolent", "reckless". One of the reasons I think it's so bad for THIS generation is that the world is smaller than ever before in history. The march of "progress" that is globalisation leaves nowhere for people to go, to gather their thoughts and set up a new way of being, thinking, living. If the world is going to change at all, it has to start from the ground up this time - not through any specific group of people fightin for something specific. I think it's time for change on a global scale, and it has to start with US, OUR generation, but to me it still seems impossible at this time of my short life.

I've forgotten what the stats are, but more kids than ever have this illness, and it has increased in incidence by a factor of 10 since the second world war.

I hope you got my point somewhere in there, lol. I used to be really fluent in my speech, really good, but I lost my edge when I hit depression. Sorry, I've gone on a bit haven't I? sorry.
man i sympathise with that - same here buddy :headbang: (well near enough)
in addition to my stupidly long-winded earlier post, id like to add a note on the effects of globalisation. there is too much competition today, and this is one of the causes of my depression. i just can't get away from this idea that i am competing with the world for everything - if i want a job, i've got to fight for it, with probably hundreds of other people (who are probably also more qualified than me too). this idea of competition has been drummed into me, and my generation, since kindergarten - always having to be better than everyone else - partly because this is how our parents' generation behaved as yuppies after the hippies lost momentum (like the original post said). eventually, a few years back i just said fuck it, other people can be better than me and beat me, cos im gonna loose out in the end - its the nature of the world: somebody will be better than me always, and somebody else will stab me in the back (metaphorically) if i do get anywhere in life. that's when the depression started...
you can't get away from competition in today's world, and its on a global scale. there is no longer any job security either, so competition gets thrown at you more and more often - even if you do manage to get the job you wanted.
plus, that's all life seems to be (uh-oh i appear to be ranting): you are born, you work hard for not enough reward, and then you die. sure there are a few interesting and rewarding bits inbetween - like family, friends, life experiences; but that does't detract from the fact that you are, in today's modern world, born to work and then die.
teenage angst? maybe. depression talking? probably. but if more and more people my generation are getting depresssed, then maybe this is something more- maybe there is a probem with society after all?

man i sympathise with that - same here buddy :headbang: (well near enough)
in addition to my stupidly long-winded earlier post, id like to add a note on the effects of globalisation. there is too much competition today, and this is one of the causes of my depression. i just can't get away from this idea that i am competing with the world for everything - if i want a job, i've got to fight for it, with probably hundreds of other people (who are probably also more qualified than me too). this idea of competition has been drummed into me, and my generation, since kindergarten - always having to be better than everyone else - partly because this is how our parents' generation behaved as yuppies after the hippies lost momentum (like the original post said). eventually, a few years back i just said fuck it, other people can be better than me and beat me, cos im gonna loose out in the end - its the nature of the world: somebody will be better than me always, and somebody else will stab me in the back (metaphorically) if i do get anywhere in life. that's when the depression started...
you can't get away from competition in today's world, and its on a global scale. there is no longer any job security either, so competition gets thrown at you more and more often - even if you do manage to get the job you wanted.
plus, that's all life seems to be (uh-oh i appear to be ranting): you are born, you work hard for not enough reward, and then you die. sure there are a few interesting and rewarding bits inbetween - like family, friends, life experiences; but that does't detract from the fact that you are, in today's modern world, born to work and then die.
teenage angst? maybe. depression talking? probably. but if more and more people my generation are getting depresssed, then maybe this is something more- maybe there is a probem with society after all?

Okay, now I'm getting this serious notion that we as a species have become victim to our own overwhelming success. No other animal in nature has so many offspring that spend the time to get depressed about having to compete and work to survive. Good freaking God. Perhaos the ACTUAL problem here is that we have made it TOO EASY to survive and breed in modern technologically advanced nations.

When I was a teen, I vyed with immigrants from Mexico, Puerto Rico, Korea and a number of other countries for "crappy jobs" in retail and food service so that I could afford to go out and get the clothes I wanted to wear (as opposed to the utterly atrocious fashion accidents my parents supplied me), to get the occasional 8-track and see the occasional movie with my friends, most of which got all this gratis because their parents spoiled them.

I won't lie and tell you I wasn't mildly resentful about having to get real jobs to cover my cool points while a lot of my peers were getting a complete free ride. I was. But my resentment was a childish thing directed at my parents because I didn't yet understand that they were preparing me for the real world that I was going to be facing in the not-too-distant future. I was never depressed about having to compete, only vaguely peeved and resentful.

If there is a problem with society to blame for all of this "woe is me" crap, then perhaps you might want to consider that it comes more from having too much time to agonize over how horrible you have it and how bleak your future is going to be and not enough actual work, competition and effort put out by yourself rather than going "wah wah wah I'm going to have to DO something, my world is over and it's all society's fault". If you want to point the finger of blame for your drama and depression at some other entity than yourself, maybe you should be saying "make it harder, challenge me, force me to grow" instead of this amazingly pathetic "pity me, I'm being robbed" crap.

This is as appalling as all the kids in MY generation that were put on ritallin for being "hyper" and all this modern wailing about all the ADHD garbage. If your kids aren't paying attention, they're not being challenged. If your kids are "hyper" they're obviously not getting enough exercise/discipline. Get a freaking clue and quit looking for someone else to blame. I'm so amazingly SICK of this sociological and psychological quackery.

SOME people have genuine chemical imbalances that can't be corrected with a liberal program of exercise, reasonable diet and discipline. SOME. But these are a serious minority.

Okay, now I'm getting this serious notion that we as a species have become victim to our own overwhelming success. No other animal in nature has so many offspring that spend the time to get depressed about having to compete and work to survive. Good freaking God. Perhaos the ACTUAL problem here is that we have made it TOO EASY to survive and breed in modern technologically advanced nations.

When I was a teen, I vyed with immigrants from Mexico, Puerto Rico, Korea and a number of other countries for "crappy jobs" in retail and food service so that I could afford to go out and get the clothes I wanted to wear (as opposed to the utterly atrocious fashion accidents my parents supplied me), to get the occasional 8-track and see the occasional movie with my friends, most of which got all this gratis because their parents spoiled them.

I won't lie and tell you I wasn't mildly resentful about having to get real jobs to cover my cool points while a lot of my peers were getting a complete free ride. I was. But my resentment was a childish thing directed at my parents because I didn't yet understand that they were preparing me for the real world that I was going to be facing in the not-too-distant future. I was never depressed about having to compete, only vaguely peeved and resentful.

If there is a problem with society to blame for all of this "woe is me" crap, then perhaps you might want to consider that it comes more from having too much time to agonize over how horrible you have it and how bleak your future is going to be and not enough actual work, competition and effort put out by yourself rather than going "wah wah wah I'm going to have to DO something, my world is over and it's all society's fault". If you want to point the finger of blame for your drama and depression at some other entity than yourself, maybe you should be saying "make it harder, challenge me, force me to grow" instead of this amazingly pathetic "pity me, I'm being robbed" crap.

This is as appalling as all the kids in MY generation that were put on ritallin for being "hyper" and all this modern wailing about all the ADHD garbage. If your kids aren't paying attention, they're not being challenged. If your kids are "hyper" they're obviously not getting enough exercise/discipline. Get a freaking clue and quit looking for someone else to blame. I'm so amazingly SICK of this sociological and psychological quackery.

SOME people have genuine chemical imbalances that can't be corrected with a liberal program of exercise, reasonable diet and discipline. SOME. But these are a serious minority.
working to survive is one thing, and is evidently absolutely necessary. constantly competing with the rest of the world is quite another thing - no job security, employers' ability to practically hire and fire at will (in the UK we are nearing economic full-employment so this is easy), etc.

But there are still so many EPIC things to fight for and against. Every issue the generations that come before resolve is replaced by two more of equal or greater signifigance in some global hydra of scientific, social and economic ills.

We do not yet live in a world free of widespread and lethal disease.

We do not yet live in a world where economic and social inequities have been destroyed.

We have not discovered every great scientific and technological advancement (and never shall).

We have not yet found a "cure" for war.

Hell, we've yet to implement a practical alternative to fossil fuels FFS...

There is FAR from "almost nothing left to fight for". There is so much left to advance and discover that you'd be hard-pressed NOT to find a cause to espouse. But I doubt that was the point the original poster was making. THAT was more of a drawn out "the world is hosed, I got nothing to live for and it's all my parents' fault, f*ck you very much you old bastiges" statement.
no it wasn't and you missed my point entirely (sorry for the double post btw). the generatons in the 60s and 70s fought for the same issues you list above (mostly) and changed the world beyond recognition - i actually praise that generation for what they did. however these issues were not 'solved' or 'completed' by them, but left hanging with questions still unanswered and still unsolved. however, because these issues are not as prevalent or as bad today as they were then, many people in my generation seem to think nothing of them - that the world is ok as it is.
i did say, in fact, that there are many issues still worth fighting for, but the situation is not as dire as it was back then; thus nobody seems to care nowadays. these issues are still worth fighting for - absolutely, and more besides, but because so few people seem to care nowadays some of us get frustrated and angry.

no it wasn't and you missed my point entirely (sorry for the double post btw). the generatons in the 60s and 70s fought for the same issues you list above (mostly) and changed the world beyond recognition - i actually praise that generation for what they did. however these issues were not 'solved' or 'completed' by them, but left hanging with questions still unanswered and still unsolved. however, because these issues are not as prevalent or as bad today as they were then, many people in my generation seem to think nothing of them - that the world is ok as it is.
i did say, in fact, that there are many issues still worth fighting for, but the situation is not as dire as it was back then; thus nobody seems to care nowadays. these issues are still worth fighting for - absolutely, and more besides, but because so few people seem to care nowadays some of us get frustrated and angry.

Okay, so millions dead and more homeless and hurt in the wake of the recent tsunami, the rampant pandemic of AIDs, no cure for cancer, global deforestation, entire nations being exploited and kept in a state of technological disadvantage and war in the Middle East aren't as big a deal as Viet Nam, cold war, polio, Three Mile Island and Appartheid (sp?)?

working to survive is one thing, and is evidently absolutely necessary. constantly competing with the rest of the world is quite another thing - no job security, employers' ability to practically hire and fire at will (in the UK we are nearing economic full-employment so this is easy), etc.

Working ALSO gets you out of the house, encourages you to meet and interact with other human beings, gives you something to take pride in and allows you to learn and grow. Competeing with others is a normal, healthy thing to do and allows you to expand your abilities and test yourself.

SURE there's always going to be someone better at something than you are. But that is by no means an excuse to throw it away and stop striving to better yourself. Are you always going to win? No. Are you always going to get what you want? No. Is that a bad thing? No. In reality, those things hardest fought for are the things we most dearly cherish and value. Get it too easy and you take it for granted.

Okay gang! Here's the opinion of what most of you would call an "Old Woman". though I look in the mirror and I see that I have aged, I really don't believe that my spirit has done much aging, yes matured, but not aged. I'm 48 years old, older, but not so old that I'm not out there in the real world. It is my opinion that it is my generation that gave our children their hopeless out look on life. (Well, most of my generation).

I grew up in a generation where we believed we could do damn near anything! 1972-1973 we bitched, and compained so much about the Vietnam war that the draft was recalled, and our children started to come back home. Technology went through the roof. There were no cell phones, CDs and DVDs, or PCs. Microwave ovens were just beginning to be popular, we all remember washing dishes by hand, there were few automactic dish washers. The telephone lines were regulated so it cost a small fortune to speak to someone in the next town if it was long distance. Of course we knew nothing about AIDS, but the mortality rate was much higher back then becauce we didn't have the advanced medical knowledge we have now. I could go on and on for hours telling you about the advances the world made because of the people of my generation. But while we were out there making the world a better, more efficiant place to live we forgot to make our own home a place to nuture and grow strong spirited children.

Mom and dad both worked, we still do (we ain't retired yet, and my die working if our economy gets any worse.) We sat you in front of a TV with cable, gave you a cell phone to speak to us, bought you prepackaged food to warm in a microwave, we dressed you in the best of clothes, sent you to racially integrated schools, and gave you the freedom to choose your own religion. We did it all for you, or so we thought. We wanted to give the best of the world to you, we wanted to shield you from the reality of the hard, not so perfect world out there.

But we forgot to involve you in our world, forgot to teach you the values that drove us to make the world in our likeness. We left you alone, by yourselves to figure it out by yourselves. We figured money could buy everything! We forgot to hug you when you fell, we weren't there, we were at work making the money to pay for your hospital bills. Your chicken soup came from a can, not the heart. We gave you TV programs that painted a picture for you instead of buying you books, and teaching you to dream your own vision of the world. Our motto was "it's the clothes that make the man", and forgot to teach you about the man inside. We killed the spiritual God whatever name you give it, and replaced it with the almighty dollar, and the micro chip. It's all our fault!

But there is hope. . .

The world is now yours. It's up to you to bitch and moan about how horrible it is, or change it. . . We tried, we screwed up. I pray to the powers that be that you find it in yourselves to do a better job than we did. You are YOUR childrens future.
Bravo, I am 15 teetering on the balance of optimism and seeking my goals that I have had since I was knee-high to a grasshopper (I love that expression) and succumbing to the depression of "reality" and dropping them all to spiral into a destructive fit. So I see where he's coming from. But I know that yeah our world is fucked up, it always has been, it always will be, that's life we can't change that. However if we actually TRY then we stand a hell of alot better chance at fixing our problems now. I realize that you will get depressed sometimes I do it often enough -_- but the key is to rise above that and come up with goals, and grand revolutions, even if they don't bear fruit, dreams keep us going. Screw the world that tells you you will fail, you won't if you strive and don't give up. I know you've probably heard this rhetoric many times in the past but still it is something we should all take to heart. So what I'm trying to say is, maybe the past was better in some aspects, maybe it's better now, that shouldn't be the topic of debate. We should figure out what to DO to make now better than ever before. Why don't we all go out and work on that being our goal for the year eh?

Not to mention wise beyond your years. :)

OK sir that's 2 platitudes with cheese on this thread and one Don't Bitch About Not Having A Future sandwich with tsunami sauce, would you like fries with that? :D

So true ... look at the massive growth of places like hot topic that are making millions of people who are trying to be different but just end up being more the same
counter culture has become the majordy ... what does that make it counter of?

and always remember "you are unique like everyone else"
Abercrombie for Goths and Emos.

But seriously, the counterculture has shifted to the main culture. Which means the old main culture is actually the counterculture...at least among youth.

Abercrombie for Goths and Emos.

But seriously, the counterculture has shifted to the main culture. Which means the old main culture is actually the counterculture...at least among youth.

Hot Topic = Okay place to buy socks and the occasional Tee-Shirt while listening for dirt on the local piercing and tattoo places.

Hot Topic = Okay place to buy socks and the occasional Tee-Shirt while listening for dirt on the local piercing and tattoo places.
and it's horrendously overpriced. As well as tailored to a specific segment of society, just like Abercrombie.

The only true place to buy new clothes is Sams's Club!

Abercrombie for Goths and Emos.

But seriously, the counterculture has shifted to the main culture. Which means the old main culture is actually the counterculture...at least among youth.
Exactly ... does this mean we are going to see an outbreak of flower patterns? (dont see that much anymore) or maybe busness suits ... whole bunch of punks in suits.

Lol (that or that horrible mohawk style will come back ... 80's punk ... that would make me want to throw up)

and it's horrendously overpriced. As well as tailored to a specific segment of society, just like Abercrombie.

The only true place to buy new clothes is Sams's Club!
Unless you are a hick like my dad ... then it is fleet farm all the way!

Exactly ... does this mean we are going to see an outbreak of flower patterns? (dont see that much anymore) or maybe busness suits ... whole bunch of punks in suits.

Lol (that or that horrible mohawk style will come back ... 80's punk ... that would make me want to throw up)
Will come back? Try is back. I wasn't aware that it died. Silly Washington.

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future.
This is one of the most pathetic thing I have ever heard.
You're lazy, spoiled and weak. You don't know how good you have it. You and I, we're not any worse off then the kids of the 1950's or the 1820's for that matter!

If you're looking for excuses to ruin, not just your life, but the lives of those around you, you need to look harder. Blaming the world in general is the most common, the easiest and the most pathetic.

Why are you so bitter and pessimistic? Millions of people the world over, with problems far greater than yours still manage to set goals, work toward them with vigor and hope, achieve most if not all of them, and be very happy in the process. I strongly suggest you get over yourself, get out of your little bubble of self-pity, and tackle some of the problems instead of just moaning about them.

You know, I think that's the problem. In industrialized countries everything is too easy for young people. They don't have to worry about day to day survival, for most the only problems they have is trying to fit in with the cool crowd.

For generations previous, and still in many parts of the world, every day is a struggle, a fight to find food, maybe clothes, a place to sleep in, trying not to get killed. Even in places like the US and Europe, living meant going to work in the farm, the mine, the factory, and knowing that your days weren't safe at all.

Ironically it's that struggle that makes life seem like worth living. And it's not like young people don't appreciate what they have, but what else is there for them to accomplish?

Exactly ... does this mean we are going to see an outbreak of flower patterns? (dont see that much anymore) or maybe busness suits ... whole bunch of punks in suits.

Lol (that or that horrible mohawk style will come back ... 80's punk ... that would make me want to throw up)

LOL The old punk woman with a relaxed 18" red and blackmohawk in charcoal grey pinstriped female business suit walking down the corridors of Raytheon was me. Been there, done that, found more comfortable clothes to wear when I was done with my government contracting.

Hands off 80s alternative fashion, it's MINE all mine I say!!! Muhuhahahahaaa! And if any of that barf gets on my New Rocks, you'll be licking it off, so yarf in the other direction.

...As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future...


I suppose this is the point:
I was born in Italy in '69, so I was a young boy when the 80s cames. When I was teenager/20yrs old, I feelt like your self. The media reffered to my generation like the one with no interest, just looking at expansive shoes, nights in disco and industrial "pre-cooked" music. In these years there was explosions of McDonnalds all around the world, to watch at music becomes more important than to listen at, all guys had the same brand of sunglasses and so on...

But not *all* the guys where so schematic. I wasn't interested in Madonna, McDonnald and cocktail.. Me and my friends preffered (in example) listen at The Cure, eat in old "Osteria" and drink red wine (in italy wine was cheap and popular, and considered a old fashioned drinking by young people).

Now I can say I was in right! No one, now, can think that to have dinner with BigMac and Coke is smarter then have home-made "pasta" and a glass of good red wine, and most of the people now consider the 80s something like a dark age for the culture and humanity in general.

In short, I consider that the worst is passed, I can look at the light in the bottom of the tunnel and I suppose that in a few time we'll stand in the sunlight :-)

About the parents:
My parents was born during the WWII ('40s), in europe the '40s wasn't easy years, when they was child they knew what does it mean to be hungry. I think that they dreamed for the children an infancy with all the *things* they missed.
Is my opinion that is not fault of my (our) parents. Simply in the 80s the industries discovered a new and bigger market: the teen-agers (and the young people at all) and "adults" was not prepared for that.

Finally:
The world is in a very dangerous age, we have wars, terrorists, famine, racism, to find a work is more difficult, the mass is becoming unstable and scared, but I can see that the people thinking is changed and there is no way to stop the ideas, to halt the thinking.
I think that the worst things we have seen in the past few years are the last attempt of a dying monster.
So take it easy, sit by the river and wait :-)

I think what nobody is addressing is that the world is the smallest it has ever been. Don't know about you, but I'm getting claustraphobic...and my answer to that is to get some distance for a while.

Hmm. I just talked with my housemate about the topic of this thread. We agree that the world is in shit state, and we don't know where it's headed. I don't know if I'm going to be alive in six months...how the hell can I plan anything around that?

I've had enough of a world where people hate each other, where people keep killing and killing for non-renewable natural resources, where a person's life has no value, but their capacity to serve as a slave in a corporation does. Are we not people anymore? Are we RESOURCES now? because I tell you, that is how things are coming across to us.

I'm not a F*CKING resource, I'm a PERSON, and I want some bloody kindness in this world. Where is the kindness in our world these days? The news reports few acts of kindness or heroism, few situations where people have battled the odds and survived unspeakable hardship.

I don't care about me anymore, I just want to see others happy and smiling. I'm thinking about joining a volunteer aid agency after university. If I can help just a few people to smile again, my life's work is accomplished. If I live to that point.

You say it like we have less kindness then before … me has a feeling that most of that belief is based in nostalgia then in reality

The news doesn't report nice things because they're crap stories. Do you think FOX news is going to win the ratings war by suddenly leading with the headline "Old Lady helped across road! Drivers stop!"?

Bad news sells. That's why, despite only three terrorist attacks since 9/11, none on the US homeland, there's a constant shifting of the 'Alert' levels

I don't care about me anymore, I just want to see others happy and smiling. I'm thinking about joining a volunteer aid agency after university. If I can help just a few people to smile again, my life's work is accomplished. If I live to that point.

Vana, people by and large are fatalistic and morbid. I think that's something that's been going on all throughout human history, though. It's easier to see it on a larger scale now thanks to the media and the internet.

You don't need to wait to make another human being smile. Though joining a volunteer agency of some sort to add your time and efforts to benefit others is a truely cool thing and I highly encourage it. Really... you can spread happiness very easily any time at all simply by smiling yourself. I'm serious. Next time someone rings up your order or waits on you, try smiling at them and saying "hey thanks" and meaning it. I can say with great confidence that you'll see a smile and make not just that person, but the next several people that person waits on much happier for a brief time (about as long as it takes for someone else to frown and be rude).

You might think nothing of it. You might pooh pooh at the idea as too insignifigant to bother with. But really, it's a HUGE thing that makes a very large difference in the happiness of others. A lot of what makes people feel disenfranchised and dehumanized by their jobs is the way their CUSTOMERS treat them. I very vividly recall my days in retail and food service as a teen and often compare them with what I observe in my daily life with other people. And I remember most fondly those days when some of my customers just smiled or wished me a good day and meant it.

If you think that people are impersonal and mean to one another more often than not and you dislike that, there is NOTHING stopping you from changing that for the people around you no matter what your situation. If you DO try to make a positive difference, even in such a small way as giving someone a sincere smile and a couple of kindly words, you YOURSELF will feel better too. Or you could continue to agonize over what a fucked up shitty world you're stuck living on and spread the feelings of confusion, dissatisfaction and tension.

<shrug>

Vana, people by and large are fatalistic and morbid. I think that's something that's been going on all throughout human history, though. It's easier to see it on a larger scale now thanks to the media and the internet.

You don't need to wait to make another human being smile. Though joining a volunteer agency of some sort to add your time and efforts to benefit others is a truely cool thing and I highly encourage it. Really... you can spread happiness very easily any time at all simply by smiling yourself. I'm serious. Next time someone rings up your order or waits on you, try smiling at them and saying "hey thanks" and meaning it. I can say with great confidence that you'll see a smile and make not just that person, but the next several people that person waits on much happier for a brief time (about as long as it takes for someone else to frown and be rude).

You might think nothing of it. You might pooh pooh at the idea as too insignifigant to bother with. But really, it's a HUGE thing that makes a very large difference in the happiness of others. A lot of what makes people feel disenfranchised and dehumanized by their jobs is the way their CUSTOMERS treat them. I very vividly recall my days in retail and food service as a teen and often compare them with what I observe in my daily life with other people. And I remember most fondly those days when some of my customers just smiled or wished me a good day and meant it.

If you think that people are impersonal and mean to one another more often than not and you dislike that, there is NOTHING stopping you from changing that for the people around you no matter what your situation. If you DO try to make a positive difference, even in such a small way as giving someone a sincere smile and a couple of kindly words, you YOURSELF will feel better too. Or you could continue to agonize over what a fucked up shitty world you're stuck living on and spread the feelings of confusion, dissatisfaction and tension.

<shrug>

booslandia, just ignore everything I said okay? I don't wanna whine anymore, I'm just gonna go.

Do you think you are clever? No, you are not. Anybody with a brain cell can tell you bad news sells, but *I* do NOT have to kiss ass and agree.

Here's some news for you - SURPRISE, I'M NOT AN AMERICAN.

:)

Honey, just because you don't live in America doesn't mean that your media isn't trying to sell something. I didn't see anyone asking you to kiss anyone's ass, though frankly the notion is briefly crossing my mind as I type... as is the notion that the post I made just prior to this one is going to be utterly wasted on you.

If your professed vocation is to put a smile on someone else's face, you're really setting your cause back a few steps. Or do the smile-recipients have to be homeless and hungry to qualify?


booslandia, ignore everything I wrote....just ignore it....it's easier if you ignore it.

and by the way, I DO smile at people, I am an expert at faking happy during those times when I'm not. Everybody says I'm a nice guy, I'm always happy, I'm really kind, etc. I'm glad, but at the same time I have a mental illness I have been hiding for 8 years, and I'm tired of faking it.

Ah, I see. Well then, I'll ignore the old post and concentrate on this one.

People can usually tell an insincere grimace and platitude pair from an honest smile and word. Get well soon.

Do you think you are clever? No, you are not. Anybody with a brain cell can tell you bad news sells, but *I* do NOT have to kiss ass and agree.

Here's some news for you - SURPRISE, I'M NOT AN AMERICAN.

:)


Gosh. Well done. Me either. I'm a Brit. But it doesn't change anything, regardless if you choose to kiss ass and agree. Oh, and 'ass' is American.

Nice stuff happens, but frankly people don't want to know about good stuff going on with other people. It's human nature. If you've had a shit day, the last thing you want to hear is that some lucky bastard just won 15 million quid and never has to work again. Bad news means you can feel sorry for people, so you can feel better about your own sad pathetic life.

I don't see what's supposed to be so shit about the world today. The very fact that you're in a university should really tell you that, since it's inly been about 80 years since 'proles' like most of us have been able to get into them. And since you can go and join an aid agency, that implies that perhaps not everything is hopeless. Aid agencies are charaties, so people have been giving money to help others. God, what hell is this, where people will spend their money for the good of those who cannot help themselves?

We're not resources. That's why we get paid to work. And we're better off than almost any previous generation. Things could be better, but they aren't as terrible as you seek to make out. Now stop feeling so damned sorry for yourself and grow up.

aaaaaahh, forget everything I said, I'm just confused about everything in my life. I'm sorry, im sorry, im sorry, im sorry.

aaaaaahh, forget everything I said, I'm just confused about everything in my life. I'm sorry, im sorry, im sorry, im sorry.

*hugs* Calm down, Vana. Just step back a few paces and breathe a bit. It's not ever going to be all okay, but sometimes it does look and feel a little better.

Jesus, dude, relax. I don't want you to run around censoring yourself.

And faking it isn't a good idea. Let it out occasionally or you'll just fuck yerself up.

Thanks Booslandia. I'm not normally this stupid, I promise! lol
Sometimes my mouth and hands dont connect to my brain before I come out with utter crap, lol.

Jesus, dude, relax. I don't want you to run around censoring yourself.

And faking it isn't a good idea. Let it out occasionally or you'll just fuck yerself up.

No lie. Just wait till you guys end up witnessing one of MY OMGzWTF moments.

lol, really Boo? shall I bring some snacks while we watch, lol? Nasopotomia, I' apologise for what I said earlier, it was a little more than pathetic of me. Sorry.

No lie. Just wait till you guys end up witnessing one of MY OMGzWTF moments.

That sounds kind of sexy.

Thanks Booslandia. I'm not normally this stupid, I promise! lol
Sometimes my mouth and hands dont connect to my brain before I come out with utter crap, lol.

Heheheh we all have our moments. Trust me. Mine are priceless. You'll see eventually. One of these days you're going to be innocently reading a thread here, drinking something and scratching your head trying to figure out WTF the posters are thinking and you'll catch me being amazingly offended on one of those PMSey days... and I'll apologize beforehand for the mess you'll make from snarfing whatever it was you were drinking across your keyboard and screen.

lol, really Boo? shall I bring some snacks while we watch, lol? Nasopotomia, I' apologise for what I said earlier, it was a little more than pathetic of me. Sorry.


No problem, dude. I hate Americans too :D

cheers, boo, you gave me a new word to use...snarfing!!!! ^_^

"if only I could, I'd make a deal with God, and get him to swap our places" - Kate Bush, ' Running Up That Hill "

I love Kate Bush, she helps me think clearly :)

see, I'm mildly bi-polar, lol, when I'm dperessed I'm a twat, when I'm not I'm a VERY bouncy person, hehe!

dont worry about PMS...I lived alone with my mum and sister for four years, and somehow survived!!

That sounds kind of sexy.

lol, really Boo? shall I bring some snacks while we watch, lol?

ROTFL no it's not sexy and no, I highly recommend not having food or drink around when witnessing a Boo-hissy. There's not much funnier than seeing a middle aged Goth woman stoned on Midol get morally outraged and try to type a coherent textual assbeating. It's been known to cause people to flood their sinuses with anything from milk to rum-and-Coke.

To me, I've kind of given up hope on changing the world.

There's some things in life you can do about, most you can't. No point harbouring over the things you can't.

No problem, dude. I hate Americans too :D

<Turns Nasopotomia over her knee and gives him a good spanking for being a Yank-hater> You are not allowed to hate me for being an American. You can hate me for being a mouthy bitch, but that's an entirely different deal.

ROTFL no it's not sexy and no, I highly recommend not having food or drink around when witnessing a Boo-hissy. There's not much funnier than seeing a middle aged Goth woman stoned on Midol get morally outraged and try to type a coherent textual assbeating. It's been known to cause people to flood their sinuses with anything from milk to rum-and-Coke.

I don't know, sounds kind of hot.

<Turns Nasopotomia over her knee and gives him a good spanking for being a Yank-hater> You are not allowed to hate me for being an American. You can hate me for being a mouthy bitch, but that's an entirely different deal.

NOW she's being sexy

that's a very funny image boo, lol, but yeah, I don't want coke running out of my nose, lol!!

what's midol? =|

naso, lol, I don't hate americans, just the american government. most americans are nice individually :) but I think the american government has done its people wrong, especially abroad.

It's not a "phase" for everyone. Not everyone goes through it and not everyone ever passes it.
Yes, some people don't have what it takes to survive.

NOW she's being sexy

ARGHLE!!! Damn you perverted kids!!! <runs around in a circle making inarticulate sounds of frustration and messing up her gigantic 80's hair>

Grrrrrr! I shoulda known you'd take it as a reward, you pervy Britlet! Bad Naso! No Naso-biskit for j00!

ARGHLE!!! Damn you perverted kids!!! <runs around in a circle making inarticulate sounds of frustration and messing up her gigantic 80's hair>

Grrrrrr! I shoulda known you'd take it as a reward, you pervy Britlet! Bad Naso! No Naso-biskit for j00!

Shouldn't you be happy that you've got a bunch of younger men talking about how sexy you are?

naso, lol, I don't hate americans, just the american government. most americans are nice individually :) but I think the american government has done its people wrong, especially abroad.


In total agreement there, m8. Just for the record, I don't HATE Americans. I just thoroughly dislike them. :D

It's the sickening plague of lies that the US right-wing media has spread around it's people, and the truly despicable actions of the neo-con politicians (and let's just not get started on the democracy-killing CIA) that really pisses me off. But even so, things aren't as bad as the creator of this thread seems to believe.

that's a very funny image boo, lol, but yeah, I don't want coke running out of my nose, lol!!

what's midol? =|

naso, lol, I don't hate americans, just the american government. most americans are nice individually :) but I think the american government has done its people wrong, especially abroad.

Coke in the sinuses hurts. It takes HOURS to be rid of the smell of it too. Ugh.

Midol = over-the-counter medication to get rid of cramps and bloating for women during that week when the Blood Faerie comes calling.

I hate my government too. It sucks. I wish it actually worked the way it was intended to work, but neither I nor anyone I know seems to have any bright ideas about how to fix it. But that's fuel for a full on political rant-discussion of its very own.

I agree with you there naso. It's not that the world is in worse state than ever, it's just that we hear about stuff more, so it SEEMS worse. Hmm.

I would actually love to go to america, I really would. Problem is I am half english half portuguese and look 100% like an arab - that has got me stopped at all the airports I've been to in Europe...I dont know what it would be like if I tired to get into america, lol!

Shouldn't you be happy that you've got a bunch of younger men talking about how sexy you are?

LOL! You've got a point, Sdaer... but I was too busy thinking about things that mattered more to me than my own oversized ego.

<Tries to stuff the ego back into the closet and considers renting a storage shed for it.>

LOL! You've got a point, Sdaer... but I was too busy thinking about things that mattered more to me than my own oversized ego.

<Tries to stuff the ego back into the closet and considers renting a storage shed for it.>
I got a storage shed … will rent for cheep ;)

I think people judge on fation, people would be more comfterble with teens dressed in suits out side a shop than teens dressed in jeans
/tea-shirt.
people are just to shallow to young people

LOL! You've got a point, Sdaer... but I was too busy thinking about things that mattered more to me than my own oversized ego.

<Tries to stuff the ego back into the closet and considers renting a storage shed for it.>

Wow, you've got a really big...ego.

If I had my way, I'd be wearing skirts...I have the legs for a kilt so I'm told :D
as for skirts, they look so cool on blokes!

I would actually love to go to america, I really would. Problem is I am half english half portuguese and look 100% like an arab - that has got me stopped at all the airports I've been to in Europe...I dont know what it would be like if I tired to get into america, lol!

I couldn't look any less like someone the airport security could possibly concieve a terrorist should resemble and I get hell every time I go to get on a plane. As much as I think that America is one of those must-see places (most ESPECIALLY destinations like New Orleans, Las Vegas or San Francisco), I don't think it's a very friendly or fun place for visitors just now. Though the dollar IS pretty weak ATM and you could make your money stretch pretty far...

<subsides into a happy fantasy of shopping in the NoLa French Quarter as a European...>

Wow, you've got a really big...ego.

Massive... just... massive. It's so big it has its own weather system. No, wait, that's my hair.

Massive... just... massive. It's so big it has its own weather system. No, wait, that's my hair.

Your hair rules!

I WANT HAIR WITH A WEATHER SYSTEM!!!!

>_<

*cries like a girl who isn't allowed to have barbie for christmas*

I would actually love to go to america, I really would. Problem is I am half english half portuguese and look 100% like an arab - that has got me stopped at all the airports I've been to in Europe...I dont know what it would be like if I tired to get into america, lol!

That's just typical. The US government happily provided the IRA with 80% of it's funding through the 1970s and 80s, but won't let anyone who even looks un-WASP through an airport without hassle now.

This terrorist threat has been hopelessly overstated, and then used to generally pick on people. Just look at this damned ID card system they're trying to push through here. THAT could be pretty nasty.

My shoes have a weather system...

I will fight the ID card campaign every single step of the way, I think it's hideously wrong!

Your hair rules!

Aweeee....! Dammit stop that. I'm going to have to buy a zipcode just for the ego if you keep feeding it.

You wouldn't believe how much time I have to spend to make my hair look cool though. If I had to let it go so that it was a colour found naturally on women's heads and stop shaving the sides, I'd look like a big red sheep in serious need of shearing sat on my head. >.<

It wouldn't be so bad if it was voluntary, like they say. But if it is, then what's the point in it at all?

The ID cards, I mean. Not Boo's hair.

It wouldn't be so bad if it was voluntary, like they say. But if it is, then what's the point in it at all?

The ID cards, I mean. Not Boo's hair.

LOL Naso!

Yes well... if it's something George the Second is pushing, then it's bound to be both compulsory and unfairly restrictive. I tell you, Sweden is looking better and better every year....

Sweden's got the highest suicide rate in the whole world. I mean, WHY?

Why would anyone hate to be alive in SWEDEN?! A land where supermodels make up nine tenths of the population? Where the most common job is ladies sauna attendant? A place where those two GO TOGETHER!!!? What are the Swedes doing?

I keep on hearing how young people today don´t have any ambition in life, how we are always depressed, on drugs, etc. etc. etc.
What I have to say is that you don´t have the slightest idea of what is to live in a world without a future. I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc. But, cmon, look at the world we live! We are in the middle of the third lost decade and you still haven´t realized that the yuppie generation left us a world in decay? That the enormous amount of effort you people put in being futile has paid in your sons? Sure, you lived in an golden era where everyone had jobs, it was normal to have an ideal and dreams actually could come true in the future if you worked hard enough to do it. Now, look at the world WE live in! Do you see any dream coming true in this rotten place? Damn, you people had a good world in the 60s and 70s, I agree that at least we aren´t in a world war (yet), but at least they had goals in life! The WWII generation had an objective! Sure was hell, but for christ´s sake, they were fighting for a better future! As the now bashed hippies were fighting for a better future! But then came the 80s, the first lost decade. The decade where our parents decided that all that hippy stuff was bullshit and started to dedicate themselves at making stupid money at the costs of the spirits of their sons.
You killed your sons future.
I repeat, you don´t imagine what is to live in a world without a future. In a point on history where everything and everywhere and everyone is just a dumb slave of some corporation. Where the ones in power are gathering more and more power and the ones being opressed think that it´s just right.
The few ones who try to fight against it don´t even have the right to a resistence. People protest, politicians laugh at the hand made banners, the media ignore and that´s it.
The art is controled by a corporation, the media by another, the science by another one.
Do you say I´m always depressed. Hell yeah I´m always depressed! I´m at college just wondering the hell life will be because simply there are no more jobs. Can´t even get out on the streets at night because someone, somewhere, for some reason, wants to kill me. To listen to quality music gotta find an obscure record store in a place that is not that lovely, because the mainstream stores only sells trash. And then going back there next month, only to find out that it closed.
Withou the internet, you cannot even begin to grasp some fraction of real information, as the media only presents you with futile, manipulated "facts".
I´m sorry the bad english, and sorry the long message. It´s just that... I don´t know, it´s sad to live in this world, just saying to take easy on your kids, because you destroyed their future when you chose to buy a big car instead of caring about the future of the planet. And I know that part of this text is just teenage angst. but I ask you please to try to understand me, as it´s the least you can do for changing my world into a wasteland.
Because you enjoyed your youth, you have your job, you had your kids, you lived the best makind had to offer and you left to us a world where even sex can kill.
That´s it, I will stop writing now as I am sure no one will read the whole text anyway. And sorry again the bad english, it´s not my mother language.

you ought to stop feeling sorry for yourself.

Aweeee....! Dammit stop that. I'm going to have to buy a zipcode just for the ego if you keep feeding it.

You wouldn't believe how much time I have to spend to make my hair look cool though. If I had to let it go so that it was a colour found naturally on women's heads and stop shaving the sides, I'd look like a big red sheep in serious need of shearing sat on my head. >.<

Mmm...That's why I like being a guy. I spend exactly 1 second on my hair to get it ready. Put a hat on top, and it's done up. That easy.

Sweden's got the highest suicide rate in the whole world. I mean, WHY?

REALLY? OMGz... why indeed... My Swedish friends seem so HAPPY and well-adjusted.

Well, exactly. It's probably because you get darkness for six months of the year in the north. Presonally, it's a sacrifice I'd be willing to make, as I sit in the ladies sauna, loofahing the backs of bronzed blonde models, but clearly it's not as good as I imagine it is.

Sweden's got the highest suicide rate in the whole world. I mean, WHY?

Why would anyone hate to be alive in SWEDEN?! A land where supermodels make up nine tenths of the population? Where the most common job is ladies sauna attendant? A place where those two GO TOGETHER!!!? What are the Swedes doing?Well it's kind of cold there and the sun is not shining exactly like in Australia.

But saunas!

Well, exactly. It's probably because you get darkness for six months of the year in the north. Presonally, it's a sacrifice I'd be willing to make, as I sit in the ladies sauna, loofahing the backs of bronzed blonde models, but clearly it's not as good as I imagine it is.

No full sunlight for half the year plus all the beautiful Swedes? Where's the bad part?

I don't want to add to the depressive tone of this thread. Yes, the world has problems and is gradually deteriorating at most levels.

That only means that there is greater opportunity to make a difference.

"Men will get no more out of life than they put into it." -- William J.H. Boetcker

Impossible appearing situations are the greatest opportunities for meaningful acheivement and accomplishment. You can look at the problems we face as hopeless if you chose, but if that is what you choose, you pronounce the certainity of your own doom. If, however, you choose to do something about it, you have infinite capacity for accomplishment.

The future is and will be what we make of it. I will grant you that change is a slow process and that there are many barriers, but none of them is insurmountable with God's help.

I don't want to add to the depressive tone of this thread. Yes, the world has problems and is gradually deteriorating at most levels.

That only means that there is greater opportunity to make a difference.

"Men will get no more out of life than they put into it." -- William J.H. Boetcker

Impossible appearing situations are the greatest opportunities for meaningful acheivement and accomplishment. You can look at the problems we face as hopeless if you chose, but if that is what you choose, you pronounce the certainity of your own doom. If, however, you choose to do something about it, you have infinite capacity for accomplishment.

The future is and will be what we make of it. I will grant you that change is a slow process and that there are many barriers, but none of them is insurmountable with God's help.


Still, that is no excuse for the older generation to refuse to even attempt some form of damage control. If you know you're causing harm, and you're able to minimize or completely stop it, it's completely illogical to continue what you are doing, assuming someone else will come behind you and fix it.

Still, that is no excuse for the older generation to refuse to even attempt some form of damage control. If you know you're causing harm, and you're able to minimize or completely stop it, it's completely illogical to continue what you are doing, assuming someone else will come behind you and fix it.


No arguments here. Being 30 I'm kind of a "tweener", but I do what I can to make the world a better place. Of course, one of the major problems is that we don't al agree on what "a better place" looks like. And even when we do, finding agreement on how to get there is also a challenge. I do my best to change the world for the better, within my scope of influence. As I'm fond of saying on several other sites..."If you don't like the world, change it." even if it is one little piece at a time.

Sblargh: I agree with your basic points, but I do disagree with you saying we have no ambition. I also don't condone drug use, but that's a side note.

But I disagree that it is hopeless. You say that attending a protest won't do anything because the media doesn't report it. You neglect that now, with the internet, we can make our own media. You're doing it here. Your views would never get covered in the media, but you just got them out to hundreds or thousands of people, who can get it out to more.

It won't be easy, but there is a chance we can be saved. Imagine those behing the Iron Curtain during communism like Vaclav Havel and Andrey Sakharov. They were facing up against one of the most powerful entities ever to have existed on the Earth, with only their ideas, their cunning, and their words. And they won. They probably didn't expect to win, and it took them decades, but they won.

Imagine Gandhi, facing up against the British Empire.

Imagine Martin Luther King, Jr. facing up against long-held prejudices.

Imagine Daniel Cohn-Bendit, who, while he failed, starting a simple student protest that swelled into 2/3 of the nation of France, and came so close to ousting the government and establishing a new one.

Imagine the guy in front of the tank in China, who, again, while he failed, shook the world.

Imagine Viktor Yushchenko, who was poisoned and had his election victory stolen from him taking his nation to the streets and overturning a fraudulent election.

All without violence. We can do it, we just need to get out shit together. And drugs and lack of ambition won't help us there.


"Hope is a state of mind, not of the world. Hope, in this deep and powerful sense, is not the same as joy that things are going well, or willingness to invest in enterprises that are obviously heading for success, but rather an ability to work for something because it is good."- Vaclav Havel

Okay, so millions dead and more homeless and hurt in the wake of the recent tsunami, the rampant pandemic of AIDs, no cure for cancer, global deforestation, entire nations being exploited and kept in a state of technological disadvantage and war in the Middle East aren't as big a deal as Viet Nam, cold war, polio, Three Mile Island and Appartheid (sp?)?
Working ALSO gets you out of the house, encourages you to meet and interact with other human beings, gives you something to take pride in and allows you to learn and grow. Competeing with others is a normal, healthy thing to do and allows you to expand your abilities and test yourself.

SURE there's always going to be someone better at something than you are. But that is by no means an excuse to throw it away and stop striving to better yourself. Are you always going to win? No. Are you always going to get what you want? No. Is that a bad thing? No. In reality, those things hardest fought for are the things we most dearly cherish and value. Get it too easy and you take it for granted.

i was gonna tackle your counterarguements point by point, but you simply do not understand what i (we) are saying - just like the original post said.

Somebody's been sitting around reading Fight Club too many times. I mean, come on, looking up to the WWII generation because they were "goal oriented" seems a little ridiculous. Okay, that's not a direct quote, but I don't think the average 18-year-old shipping out in 1942 was really thinking that his life was all that improved by the "objective" of surviving his tour.

Big wars do not make life better. Nor do Great Depressions, Cold Wars, or any of the other numerous crappy things that have happened in the past. And what's the complaint now, that we've hit some cultural doldrums in the past twenty years? The greatest obstacle to our individual happiness is that we've got no major adversity to transcend? We've seen the end of communism, we've seen 9/11. This is not the husk of an era.

Ambition and drive are not cultural traits. If you're sitting around, waiting for the world to set a fire under you, you're probably going to die sitting around. The world is what it is, and it don't care if it meets your expectations. Blaming the world for lack of opportunity is like the C-student blaming the teacher for not offering enough challenges. Great people will rise under any circumstance, be it the roaring twenties or the boring nineties. In a hundred years, people will probably look back on Gates in much the same manner as we look back on Ford or Carnegie today.

I'm sorry, but as a dude in my early twenties I fall under this "echo boom" "gen y" label, and I got to say that you're using the New Yorker "we" in your monologue. Meaning mostly "you."

Taken as an average, most people on Earth are currently sleeping, fornicating, making adobe bricks for their house, or field stripping their AK-47 right now. (apologies to Neal Stephenson, from whom those stats are lifted)

Anybody with the electronic access to this forum is better off than a Great Many other people on this miserable ball o' mud.

Posting in an internet forum is better than fornicating?!?

Beats me... :D ;)

OK, I'm 35 I've been "young" recently, and am moving into middle age.

I personally have seen that (with exceptions) ambition comes and goes in waves, My year had drive the one behind us stayed that way, because they couldn't be bothered. My niece has plans to be the PM.

It is never too late, and you live in a time where birth is not a bar to achivement. (Not that it ever was read up on Takio for a good example).

If you dont like it, get up of your Ass and do some thing. if you aren't trying then you have no right to complain.

PS print your whinges about parents and older people, your children will say the same about you.

It's like you went into my head.
It's true and the future generations are damnd.
Very sad thing.

Let me point something out about the USA and it's little politics for "minors".

I can sign a contract with the military, go off to Iraq, and get killed, and yet I can't decide where to live completly. I can't go and apply for financial aide in the USA if I don't get along with my mother until I'm 24!

Background: Nebraska and a few other states, from what I hear (Neb. I expierenced) will not let me sign documents because I'm not their defined "Age of Majority" (which is 19, instead of the federally set 18). I couldn't move there because I don't get along with my mother and my father has no parental rights to me.

As for federal financial aide, I already stated that my mother and I do not get alone, and custody of me was given to my sister without court papers or such. FAFSA will not allow me to use anyone's but my mothers tax info on my application. (Read: I can't get federal money until I'm 24). Sure, there might be ways around this, but lets take into account that it takes ages to get anything done in this country.

On top of that, Bush won a second election, in which he shouldn't have been in. The first election, Bush lost the popularity vote, but won Electoral votes... Now this is bull. So much for a democracy, eh?

As for depressed? What's to be expected? I'm depressed most of the time, but I refused to drink, do drugs, or smoke. Any typical 18 year old would have done some of these, but I generally stay away from each item.

I'd like to know why people choose to put words into my mouth and stereotype me, making it harder for ME to get a job. My life isn't hard enough folks?

Don't tell me to get goals. Don't tell me all that crap. And do not tell me that there are people out there that their problems are a hell of a whole lot worst. No one's problems are bigger than their own. There is hardly an exception.

Sorry for being long winded.
FLD

P.S. After reading some more replies, I noticed someone brought religion into this. I'm Atheist... respect that.

i was gonna tackle your counterarguements point by point, but you simply do not understand what i (we) are saying - just like the original post said.

By all means, elaborate. Make yourself clearer. Because I do want to understand what you're saying and why.

3. Never have never will touch drugs
4. Don't smoke never will



u will combine both when u visit holland on your band tour:)

Let me point something out about the USA and it's little politics for "minors".

I can sign a contract with the military, go off to Iraq, and get killed, and yet I can't decide where to live completly. I can't go and apply for financial aide in the USA if I don't get along with my mother until I'm 24!

You can't apply for financial aid in North Korea at all. In China, if you have more than one child then the government charges you 'birth tax', so many infant girls are instead abandoned to their deaths. So don't complain that you'll have to wait for a while to get government hand-outs, or that YOU don't get on with a parent.

Background: Nebraska and a few other states, from what I hear (Neb. I expierenced) will not let me sign documents because I'm not their defined "Age of Majority" (which is 19, instead of the federally set 18). I couldn't move there because I don't get along with my mother and my father has no parental rights to me.

Wait the extra year, then. What a tremendous burden you clearly bear. Gosh, my heart bleeds for you. To hell with the 1.8 million suddenly-homeless people in India, who've just had their entire lives ruined and now have to rely on the charity of others to survive. They just don't know the pain you suffer at all, do they?

As for federal financial aide, I already stated that my mother and I do not get along, and custody of me was given to my sister without court papers or such. FAFSA will not allow me to use anyone's but my mothers tax info on my application. (Read: I can't get federal money until I'm 24). Sure, there might be ways around this, but lets take into account that it takes ages to get anything done in this country.

At least something gets done in the end. Get a paper round or something. Plenty of countries supply no finacial aid at all. Others, like China or India, even if you DO get a job the pay is a total pittence.

On top of that, Bush won a second election, in which he shouldn't have been in. The first election, Bush lost the popularity vote, but won Electoral votes... Now this is bull. So much for a democracy, eh?

There was still a vote. Over 50 million of your fellow citizens voted for him. He won this time, fair and square. I hate Bush too, but he did win according to your system. And let's face it, you could have a system like the Soviet Union did. One man (Stalin), one vote (suprisingly, called for Stalin.) Or the Ukrainian version, where you simply poison the other candidate and rig it completely.

Try to remember that for over 35,000 years no-one came up with an idea for democracy at all, and when they did there were no votes for women, slaves or the working classes. Sure, your system's not perfect, and your current President is an asshole, but you've got it better than most of the generations before you.

As for depressed? What's to be expected? I'm depressed most of the time, but I refused to drink, do drugs, or smoke. Any typical 18 year old would have done some of these, but I generally stay away from each item.

Well done. Keep it that way. You clearly can't afford them anyway, and they'd make you more depressed in the end. But it seems you DO have access to a computer and the internet, not to mention a power supply, and presumably fresh water and food, since you're alive to moan about it. That is, once again, far more than most previous generations ever had. Including some of the members of own.

I'd like to know why people choose to put words into my mouth and stereotype me, making it harder for ME to get a job. My life isn't hard enough folks?

Your life's not that much harder than most people, you just like to moan about your terrible misfortunes.

Don't tell me to get goals. Don't tell me all that crap. And do not tell me that there are people out there that their problems are a hell of a whole lot worst. No one's problems are bigger than their own. There is hardly an exception.

Um... OK. Where exactly do you get this idea from? How do you think charities WORK? Some of us are able to realise that other people do have worse problems than we do. Others are so wrapped up in themselves that they can't see beyond having to wait a few years for federal aid.

I don't mean to spoil your delusional little world of self-pity, but pull your head our your ass and take a look around. Two hundred years ago black Americans were PROPERTY. There were NO worker's rights. There were no unions, no safety controls, no computers. Water wasn't purified. People died of diseases we now easily prevent. YOUR LIFE DOESN'T SUCK. You're going through a normal piece of adolecent rebellion against everything that's come before you, and you'll either grow out of it or remain emotionally retarded for the rest of your life. The better option is to shut up, grow up and learn to appreciate what you've got, instead of moaning about what you've not.

P.S. After reading some more replies, I noticed someone brought religion into this. I'm Atheist... respect that.

I'm an atheist too, and you're right that religion has shit all to do with this. I won't demand anyone draws comfort from blind faith. However, you could stop moaning about your own life and recognise that perhaps you don't have things quite as bad as you'd like to believe.

man this guys makes a good point, i can't wait to destroy my kids future, and then they can destroy my grandchildrens future.....suppose if my children die and my grandkids come live with me...i can setroy their future too. So much fun!

Okay, prepare for a really unpleasant rant including a great deal of very harsh TMI-ish personal information. I feel it needs to be said though. I feel that a number of you lack the proper perspective.

I am part of the first batch of Generation X (as people insist on calling us), born 39 years ago to someone I will never know and adopted out to a middleclass American couple of the Baby Boomer Generation.

My adopted mother was a heavy drinker with serious issues, which she took out on me for the entirety of the time I lived under my parents' roof and attempted to continue to take out on me until at the age of 25 I told her that if she ever tried to speak to me again that I'd go to court to get a restraining order. My adoptive father was a passive-agressive enabler who stood by and gave silent consent to my adopted mother's drinking, verbal and physical abuse for the entirety of this time.

NOTHING I did or said was right and EVERYTHING I did or said was grounds for a severe beating with a liberal side order of verbal attack. I'm not just talking spanking and grounding, I'm talking hairpulling, beating with whatever was handy until said object broke, closed fist punching, face slapping, public humiliation in front of both my peers and theirs and a constant barrage of "you're never going to be anything but a stupid, lazy, filthy whore" on a daily basis.

Add to this the fact that I was a child in the 60s and 70s, brought up in a world where we were under threat of nuclear war, where there were no clearcut female role models, where racial intolerance between blacks and whites was still very common and where two-provider families were just becoming a widespread condition and you get an even more dark, dire and confusing set of conditions in which to grow up.

Now understand that as a child, I thought ALL of this was normal. This was MY world. No daycare. Just an empty house that I had to clean before my adopted mother came home to beat and belittle me, homework to be completed, dinner to prepare and dog to be walked, fed and groomed. That was MY world before I hit adolescence. The world was going to end, there was nothing I could do about it but shit needed to be done anyway, so I did it. Period. No whining, no self pity, no bullshit.

I hit adolescence and was scared out of my head because my parents and my school didn't bother to explain what "certain physical changes" were. I thought I was sick when I got my first period. I was horrified because it was dirty, which was only reinforced by my adoptive parents. Along with everything that had to do with sex. Even that paled when placed beside the amazing crap going on in the world outside my house. Riots in New York from blackouts. Crazy people killing each other over skin colour and money in Africa. Three Mile Island melting down up in Jersey. Thalidamide babies. Lead paint poisoning. Russia threatening the "free world" with nuclear annihalation. Gas shortages so severe that you could only buy it on even or odd numbered days depending on your turn. No jobs.

But I just went on, studied hard, did what I had to and held secret dreams of growing up to be an artist and maybe becoming an ecologist. I still loved the world, as fucked up as it was and as screwed as my life was. I understood implicitly that there would always be bad things along with the good things and that as insignifigant and flawed as I was that I could and would make a difference in the world, no matter how slight that was. And knowing this made me happy and determined to do that.

Since then, I never allowed any adversity, be it personal or global interfere with my pursuit of what I embrace -- which is life. I staunchly refuse to be deterred in living well and making my little differences, be they something as small and simple as a sincere smile to someone I don't know or more complicated (and perhaps less practical, yet somehow deeply important to me), such as writing or painting when I have the chance. Yes, I get sad, frightened or angry when I see the state of the world, especially when faced with things like 9-11 or this tsunami... but I accept that it is all part of life and refuse to allow it to become an excuse to be mediocre or fulfill my adoptive mother's lifelong assertions that I'd never become anything worthwhile.

I've done so many things, seen so many things, learned so much and felt so much that it defies retelling. I've never allowed anyone to tell me "this is not for you" or "you can't do this because <insert bogus excuse here>". I have not merely survived, I have LIVED. And I've done this because I refuse to accept excuses or limitations. You'll never accomplish anything if you sit around whining about how bad you have it and how horrible the world is. Pointing your finger and blaming your parents, no matter how shitty they are, will not make your life or the world you live in any better. Excuses don't give you any accomplishments to cherish or new experiences to enjoy. I KNOW all this because I've lived through things and times that would make your toenails curl and still come out on top.

Your birthright is still yours. It is the capacity to think, marvel and do. So why not try making some use of it?

This whole thread reminds me of that song by justing timberlake....do do do do do,...do do do do......do do do do.......cry me a river!

Crikey, Boo.

She's had a pretty shit time of it, yet whenever I read one of her posts they are chirpy, fun and upbeat (apart from that one, but I'm not going to have a go about you depressing me with your rough time. Just this once). She doesn't feel the need to mope about claiming she's in the worst position in the world, and frankly I'll bet that most of you, sat at your mother's PC's, using mumsy's electricity and phone line to sit here and tell us how bad everything is, have gone through half the shit she has. And yet she flounces around these forums like a ray of sparkling sunshine.

So now, will all you damned teenagers stop telling us that this world's all fucked up and there's no point living?

Crikey, Boo.

She's had a pretty shit time of it, yet whenever I read one of her posts they are chirpy, fun and upbeat (apart from that one, but I'm not going to have a go about you depressing me with your rough time. Just this once). She doesn't feel the need to mope about claiming she's in the worst position in the world, and frankly I'll bet that most of you, sat at your mother's PC's, using mumsy's electricity and phone line to sit here and tell us how bad everything is, have gone through half the shit she has. And yet she flounces around these forums like a ray of sparkling sunshine.

So now, will all you damned teenagers stop telling us that this world's all fucked up and there's no point living?

Eesh, Naso, sure, it sucked to be me as a kid, but the message was that even though it sucked, I wasn't about to let it suck me down and to this day refuse to use it as an excuse. And it's far from the worst. So many people have had a far rougher go of it than I did. Some of them even came out of their childhood hells even better than I did. Hell, some of them walked out of it looking normal LOL!

And since when was I ever a shiney ray of sunshine? Oh my goth!! LOL! I always thought I was a snarky old meaniehead...

And since when was I ever a shiney ray of sunshine? Oh my goth!! LOL! I always thought I was a snarky old meaniehead...

Ah, I was just hoping you'd spank me again so we can run away together to Sweden. We can keep your ego in the sauna.

Ah, I was just hoping you'd spank me again so we can run away together to Sweden. We can keep your ego in the sauna.

Bwahahahaaa! OMGz you kill me, Naso. *HUGS!* But my ego... she is too large to fit in the sauna... maybe we can store it in Greenland...

Besides, if I ran off to Sweden, one of my friends there would be doing the spanking and I'd be too tied up to discipline you as you so plainly need. LOL!

I'm a firm believer that life is TEN percent what happens to you and 90 percent how you respond to it. I find that a lot of the bad things that happen are self-fulfilling prophecies. If you want something bad to happen to you, it will happen.

For every example of someone strung out on drugs, depressed, or whatever you want to bring up, I can bring up examples of people who can and have overcome many worse obstacles. I don't think this world is without hope. After all, we lived through a Cold War in which our world was always teetering on the edge of MAD. Believe me, that wouldn't have been a simple "oh my nation got n00ked. I'll just create a puppet and start over." It would have been a cataclysmic destruction of all of mankind.

I've watched my aunt die from complications of diabetes. I've watched my grandfather die of lung cancer. My mother is a non-entity in my life. My father and I have moments in which we barely tolerate each other. Everyone has a cross to bear and not everyone thinks the world's going to end.

I'm a firm believer that life is TEN percent what happens to you and 90 percent how you respond to it. I find that a lot of the bad things that happen are self-fulfilling prophecies. If you want something bad to happen to you, it will happen.

For every example of someone strung out on drugs, depressed, or whatever you want to bring up, I can bring up examples of people who can and have overcome many worse obstacles. I don't think this world is without hope. After all, we lived through a Cold War in which our world was always teetering on the edge of MAD. Believe me, that wouldn't have been a simple "oh my nation got n00ked. I'll just create a puppet and start over." It would have been a cataclysmic destruction of all of mankind.

I've watched my aunt die from complications of diabetes. I've watched my grandfather die of lung cancer. My mother is a non-entity in my life. My father and I have moments in which we barely tolerate each other. Everyone has a cross to bear and not everyone thinks the world's going to end.
Excellent insight. Happiness, like love, is a decision. How old are you?

Eesh, Naso, sure, it sucked to be me as a kid, but the message was that even though it sucked, I wasn't about to let it suck me down and to this day refuse to use it as an excuse. And it's far from the worst. So many people have had a far rougher go of it than I did. Some of them even came out of their childhood hells even better than I did. Hell, some of them walked out of it looking normal LOL!

And since when was I ever a shiney ray of sunshine? Oh my goth!! LOL! I always thought I was a snarky old meaniehead...

I've got to say your story touched me. And not in the "Uncle John" kind of way. It's always struck me how the amount of suffering someone has suffered in their life is inversely proportional to the amount of backbone they actually display. I'm not a goth myself but I do hang out with that crowd through a very good friend of mine and I've always noticed that those who've had real shit to deal with in their lives always have greater clarity than those who've come from the standard upper-middle-class oh-my-life-has-no-direction kind of upbringing. It's strange how we as humans only seem to be able to define our lives through periods of suffering.

Erm, honestly, I'm really not a goth. *Cough*

Excellent insight. Happiness, like love, is a decision. How old are you?I'm 31. I'll be 32 in July.

I'm 31. I'll be 32 in July.
That's still very good insight for 31. I hope you are able to keep it. :)

You can't apply for financial aid in North Korea at all. In China, if you have more than one child then the government charges you 'birth tax', so many infant girls are instead abandoned to their deaths. So don't complain that you'll have to wait for a while to get government hand-outs, or that YOU don't get on with a parent.

True, I have more chance to actually LIVE... but what point is there in living? We all die anyhow. As for my little age and FAFSA argument, my point is I can die for the country, but I can't make use of the tax money, which by the way I pay some too, made available to others because my mother is an asshole.

Wait the extra year, then. What a tremendous burden you clearly bear. Gosh, my heart bleeds for you. To hell with the 1.8 million suddenly-homeless people in India, who've just had their entire lives ruined and now have to rely on the charity of others to survive. They just don't know the pain you suffer at all, do they?

I never said I actually had it worse then most (maybe most in the USA when I was a minor).

There was still a vote. Over 50 million of your fellow citizens voted for him. He won this time, fair and square. I hate Bush too, but he did win according to your system. And let's face it, you could have a system like the Soviet Union did. One man (Stalin), one vote (suprisingly, called for Stalin.) Or the Ukrainian version, where you simply poison the other candidate and rig it completely.

Bush shouldn't be there in the first place. If you're going to make something, make it work like you intend it to. Obviously there isn't enough people out there with actual inteligence to vote. They pick based on their party, they don't listen to the issues. Half the population doesn't even follow the politics unless it directly affects them. I hear some even voted for him to "feel safer". How is it safer when we are in war? They lack the logic.

Your life's not that much harder than most people, you just like to moan about your terrible misfortunes.

You're right, I do like to bitch about my own problems. All your post has done so far is point out, "HEY! I don't give a shit." How is anyone expected to be happy with that type of attitude on most of USA.

Um... OK. Where exactly do you get this idea from? How do you think charities WORK?

Charities work like this, Big corporations donate to them to get tax deductions and to improve their actual look. They don't much care...

I don't mean to spoil your delusional little world of self-pity, but pull your head our your ass and take a look around. Two hundred years ago black Americans were PROPERTY.

To some, they still are... and stereotyped to police (that I know of, really)

There were NO worker's rights.

You're right, I have it better now in this sense, but it's still not the best. 5.15 minimum wage? Would help, but some of the work I do for that little amount of money is just bull. I had to dig through trash regularly for that amount, I had to pick up after people who can't keep their children in check on messes, who have no regards in other peoples desires, etc.

The better option is to shut up, grow up and learn to appreciate what you've got, instead of moaning about what you've not.

I will express my single right of free speech, so no, I will not shut up. It makes me feel better. Expression is perhaps the best thing to do for a depressed individual, as long as someone pays attention. Here you are saying "Shut up, get over it. I don't care." Nice to know you don't mind suicides, nice to know you're an asshole.

As for your last part, I know I don't have it as bad, but still, I can die for my country, and yet no one will listen to me. I can vote for president, but said president doesn't want to listen to me.

Before anyone else tells me to shut up, do something about it if you feel it is bad, too late. I am. I'm part of an anti-tobacco group, I will support laws against drugs, tobacco, and alcohol.

I apologize for any typographical errors, grammer errors, or any general errors. It is late in the night (or early in the morning, however you look at it) and much less I don't think much when assholes like this one pisses me off.

"Oh, what you've got isn't so bad. It's not like you're fighting wars, or are getting screwed over by aged politicians who's policies while ruin things for you later in life, or are having to grow up in the most schism-torn time in our nation's history since the Civil War, or- oh, wait..."

As much as those who have a few decades on us won't bring themselves to admit/realize, our generation has been shafted by their mistakes. If we could do anything now, we'd let all hell break loose. Thanks to your idea that we don't really apply because we don't know any better, we can't do jack.

Well, not now. We'll have our payback later. We'll turn all of America into the society you so pity. Immoral? Try free. The people who do things like drugs and alcohol and buying sex on the corner aren't doing it because they're social masochists. The actually enjoy it.

The way I see things, we should make it so these things aren't so limited anymore. Legalize prositution, it'll lower the crime rate and make citizens happier, so long as we watch for STDs. Legalize marijuana and make it an import, our economy could use the boost. We can already vote and get married at age eighteen, why not legally drink alcoholic beverages too?

But I digress. The point is, we already know about all the harmful things these drugs and beers and whores could potentially do to us, but we don't really care. If it comes, let it come! We had a good time while we did.

You see, doing these things that are fun now but harmful in the long run fit into a perfect little plan. You live life to the fullest and wildest while your in your prime of life and without responsibilities. Once those troubles come along, you have that many fewer years to suffer the suppository society you've drugged us with.

Don't even start about how it's immoral. That's what we call an opinion. Not a fact. It's no more plausible an argument than to say that it will cause extraplanar monstrousities to rise from the ocean and slaughter humans while being fought back by skyfaring humanoids.

Guess what? The last laugh's on you. If any of us who've had to suffer this get into political power, you can kiss social security goodbye. You will be penniless and die suffering the way you deserve: paying back our generation.

The following post has been made late at night while I am tired and impatient and brooding and is therefore highly flammable. Apologies to anyone who disagrees for legitimate reasons that I couldn't get my argument across in a more civil manner at this hour.

"Oh, what you've got isn't so bad. It's not like you're fighting wars, or are getting screwed over by aged politicians who's policies while ruin things for you later in life, or are having to grow up in the most schism-torn time in our nation's history since the Civil War, or- oh, wait..."

As much as those who have a few decades on us won't bring themselves to admit/realize, our generation has been shafted by their mistakes. If we could do anything now, we'd let all hell break loose. Thanks to your idea that we don't really apply because we don't know any better, we can't do jack.

Well, not now. We'll have our payback later. We'll turn all of America into the society you so pity. Immoral? Try free. The people who do things like drugs and alcohol and buying sex on the corner aren't doing it because they're social masochists. The actually enjoy it.

The way I see things, we should make it so these things aren't so limited anymore. Legalize prositution, it'll lower the crime rate and make citizens happier, so long as we watch for STDs. Legalize marijuana and make it an import, our economy could use the boost. We can already vote and get married at age eighteen, why not legally drink alcoholic beverages too?

But I digress. The point is, we already know about all the harmful things these drugs and beers and whores could potentially do to us, but we don't really care. If it comes, let it come! We had a good time while we did.

You see, doing these things that are fun now but harmful in the long run fit into a perfect little plan. You live life to the fullest and wildest while your in your prime of life and without responsibilities. Once those troubles come along, you have that many fewer years to suffer the suppository society you've drugged us with.

Don't even start about how it's immoral. That's what we call an opinion. Not a fact. It's no more plausible an argument than to say that it will cause extraplanar monstrousities to rise from the ocean and slaughter humans while being fought back by skyfaring humanoids.

Guess what? The last laugh's on you. If any of us who've had to suffer this get into political power, you can kiss social security goodbye. You will be penniless and die suffering the way you deserve: paying back our generation.

The following post has been made late at night while I am tired and impatient and brooding and is therefore highly flammable. Apologies to anyone who disagrees for legitimate reasons that I couldn't get my argument across in a more civil manner at this hour.

Well, I posted this earlier, but it just seemed right to post it again to respond.

I'm 21, so I'm right in the middle of the two generations. And I think that you are absolutely correct. The values of the older generation stink. The world is about how you put it. IF you accept a certain worldview. The thing is, the older generation also accepted this world view, but they didn't have the guts to follow it to it's logical conclusion. They are happy so long as nothing happens to them and they could keep making money. Personally, I don't buy into that worldview, so I'm not so despondent. For more information, I suggest reading How Should We Then Live? by Francis Schaeffer.

I've got to say your story touched me. And not in the "Uncle John" kind of way. It's always struck me how the amount of suffering someone has suffered in their life is inversely proportional to the amount of backbone they actually display. I'm not a goth myself but I do hang out with that crowd through a very good friend of mine and I've always noticed that those who've had real shit to deal with in their lives always have greater clarity than those who've come from the standard upper-middle-class oh-my-life-has-no-direction kind of upbringing. It's strange how we as humans only seem to be able to define our lives through periods of suffering.

Erm, honestly, I'm really not a goth. *Cough*

Suuuuure you're not. But hey, you don't have to be. I've always made it a point to tell people (Goth and otherwise) that Goth is not an automatic ticket to being cool, or smart, or sexy... or anything really. It's merely a lifestyle/cultural subset... or for many, it's a skin-deep phase to be worn and discarded like last season's trends. Though that last does not fit my personal definitions of Goth, I feel compelled to include it as it's how a goodly number of people percieve it.

People are only truely focussed when they feel there is some crisis to solve. In our modern, convenient world, it's kind of difficult to avoid being distracted by petty little things that really mean nothing... unless we percieve that there is a very dire set of consequences coming if they don't do a particular thing and do it better than well. This is why I personally think that medicating people for ADHD is utterly bogus and that the "disease" isn't a valid, real disorder. To me, ADHD is a fancy way of explaining/excusing the natural human tendency to be lazy and unfocussed in the absence of an external force that neccesitates that we get off our asses and actually get things done. You don't need to medicate for that. You just have to make an effort. Problem is, a lot of people refuse to do so and rather than allowing more lazy, unfocussed people to reach a point in their downward slide that they finally realize that if they don't get their shit together they'll no longer be meeting their basic living needs they give them an excuse to continue their unproductive behaviors. Of course, this is a disease of the middle and upper classes. If a poor person is lazy and unfocussed, he ends up on the street drinking cheap rotgut and talking to imaginary friends. The poor can't afford excuses. They're too busy just trying to get by from day to day.

Well, exactly. It's probably because you get darkness for six months of the year in the north. Presonally, it's a sacrifice I'd be willing to make, as I sit in the ladies sauna, loofahing the backs of bronzed blonde models, but clearly it's not as good as I imagine it is.
Sweeden, perfect land for vampire kirbies...nevermind it doesn't work at all, blah!

Crikey, Boo.

She's had a pretty shit time of it, yet whenever I read one of her posts they are chirpy, fun and upbeat (apart from that one, but I'm not going to have a go about you depressing me with your rough time. Just this once). She doesn't feel the need to mope about claiming she's in the worst position in the world, and frankly I'll bet that most of you, sat at your mother's PC's, using mumsy's electricity and phone line to sit here and tell us how bad everything is, have gone through half the shit she has. And yet she flounces around these forums like a ray of sparkling sunshine.

So now, will all you damned teenagers stop telling us that this world's all fucked up and there's no point living?
(sorry for the double posts, but hey, when nobody is talking what do you do eh?)
In my experiences most of the happy people I know have gone through times like those described in Boo's post. Everyone deals with it differently, but I haven't seen a single person who once able to put it behind them, didn't become a happy clam. I actually had a conversation about this not too long ago. I believe it is due to the fact that they know that their life is good, or at least better than it was, so life can't be all that bad can it? So everyone out there should cheer up, with the fear of being overly repetitive, your life can't be all that bad, even those in our situations don't have it all that bad, hell even those who are in the "worst" situations imaginable have something to make them realize that life isn't all that bad, it's just harder to see ;)

"Oh, what you've got isn't so bad. It's not like you're fighting wars, or are getting screwed over by aged politicians who's policies while ruin things for you later in life, or are having to grow up in the most schism-torn time in our nation's history since the Civil War, or- oh, wait..."

*sigh* You'll see things very differently in 10, maybe 15 years. IF you bother to go out and educate yourself. Schools don't properly educate people on real history and it's almost impossible to properly understand what has happened as recently as 30 years ago without talking to those who lived it, studying the old news and literature of the time and looking at the time period from a number of different angles. What you get in school is a sanitized, biassed and often inaccurate set of highlights of a certain time and place. In contrast to your vibrant, living and gritty reality, history as taught in school is a halcyon place where nothing was ever as bad as what you live in.

As much as those who have a few decades on us won't bring themselves to admit/realize, our generation has been shafted by their mistakes. If we could do anything now, we'd let all hell break loose. Thanks to your idea that we don't really apply because we don't know any better, we can't do jack.

I've probably got more than a couple decades on you. Let me clue you in on something -- it wasn't Generation X. WE are still trying to worm our way into the social power structure. But there isn't room for us there quite yet. We're the ones that were raised by hippies before they'd fully sold out, the war-mongering conservatives before they stopped believing that the commies were out to get us and the beats before they stopped being bitter about being tied down.

Everyone always goes on and on about how they don't count and how they are so disenfranchised and how everyone should just wait in terror for them to get THIER turn at the world steering wheel... honestly, when you look at it from the outside you just have to shake your head and say "well fuck it, none of these moes are going to do it ALL right" and just go about your daily business, adjusting for each bump in the road as you see it coming.

Well, not now. We'll have our payback later. We'll turn all of America into the society you so pity. Immoral? Try free. The people who do things like drugs and alcohol and buying sex on the corner aren't doing it because they're social masochists. The actually enjoy it.

Okay, that didn't make a great deal of sense. Though if you're saying that people should get their heads out of their asses and stop trying to keep everyone else from partying their own way, I say "hell yeah! Bring on the pot and the hookers for everyone that wants them". These things aren't MY form of recreational bliss, but I can see how they'd appeal to a lot of other people.

The way I see things, we should make it so these things aren't so limited anymore. Legalize prositution, it'll lower the crime rate and make citizens happier, so long as we watch for STDs. Legalize marijuana and make it an import, our economy could use the boost. We can already vote and get married at age eighteen, why not legally drink alcoholic beverages too?

I'm a huge supporter of the legalization and regulation of both prostitution and marijuana. My take on this is that you CAN'T make people stop doing either thing and the current state of prohibition isn't working any better than prohibition of alcohol did in the days of my grandparents. Legalizing and regulating these things would do a world of good, I think.

Prostitutes could have good health plans and protection from violent johns without having to resort to putting themselves at the mercy of pimps. Their customers could be relatively well assured that they wouldn't be getting and transmitting nasty venereal diseases back to their families because, like restaurants, prostitutes could be given routine inspections to keep their licences to operate.

Marijuana would become, like cigarettes and alcohol, an excellent tax revenue for the state governments. Farmers would benefit, having a legal and lucrative new crop to add to their land's yield. Consumers would benefit, having a safe, legal and standardized market for pot that ensured that they weren't being sold bad, old or impure weed. Hell, even older, larger businesses like the Philip Morris Company (owners of both Kraft Foods AND Marlboro Tobacco) could cash in. More potent, powerful grades of pot could be designated for medical use and prescribed by doctors to sufferers of glaucoma, arthritis and other ailments that pot has been documented to be beneficial in treating. No one loses here.

But I digress. The point is, we already know about all the harmful things these drugs and beers and whores could potentially do to us, but we don't really care. If it comes, let it come! We had a good time while we did.

Actually, legalizing these things takes a great deal of the harm out of them for reasons I have breifly covered above and does no real harm in the longer run that leaving them illegal and uncontrolled does not already do, but far worse.

You see, doing these things that are fun now but harmful in the long run fit into a perfect little plan. You live life to the fullest and wildest while your in your prime of life and without responsibilities. Once those troubles come along, you have that many fewer years to suffer the suppository society you've drugged us with.

Blame society if you will, but the reality is that you do not HAVE to partake in everything that is available in modern society. Alcohol is widely available, yet I do not choose to drink. My only uses for alcohol are to clean my sound equipment with grain and to slightly season my foods and sauces with some wines and brandies. That is MY choice. Living the "wild and free life" was always an option and it obviously still is. But those who choose it need to understand that it carries consequences. No one is forced to do anything anymore. Everything is a choice. If your choices screw you later, that is your fault, not your society's. It's called personal responsibility. You should try it some time.

Don't even start about how it's immoral. That's what we call an opinion. Not a fact. It's no more plausible an argument than to say that it will cause extraplanar monstrousities to rise from the ocean and slaughter humans while being fought back by skyfaring humanoids.

Guess what? The last laugh's on you. If any of us who've had to suffer this get into political power, you can kiss social security goodbye. You will be penniless and die suffering the way you deserve: paying back our generation.

Morality has very little to do with anything anymore. People who use the word to make something more or less palatable are usually trying to either sell you something or bully you into doing something THEIR way without having a real selling point.

Social security? Honey, I've paid that huge horking chunk of my income out every paycheck for the last 20+ years and never had a hope of seeing it again. And you might want to get a clue REAL soon that no one, not my generation or the one before it, or even the one that comes after yours owes you a damned thing. You are on your own. Just like my generation. Just like the Baby Boomers. Just like those that came before them.

The following post has been made late at night while I am tired and impatient and brooding and is therefore highly flammable. Apologies to anyone who disagrees for legitimate reasons that I couldn't get my argument across in a more civil manner at this hour.

Perhaps you should exercise one more bit of wisdom and present your views when you know you're going to be more lucid. You DID have some nuggets of wisdom buried in your anti-old-people rant, you know. It would have been truely interesting and kinda cool to see what you think about these issues without all the "you suck and the world owes me" wah-wah-ing that they were drowned in. Perhaps you could try again when you're not feeling tired, cranky and bitchy?

I agree that young people don´t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc.

Speak for yourself... I have plenty of ambitions, I'm only depressed when it's reasonable to be depressed ('Oh, your dog's dead', 'oh, your mother has cancer', 'oh, it's going to cost you £900 to fix your car'...), I never, ever go near drugs, never have never will, and scorn anybody who can only have fun when using them. In addition, according to the stereotypical view of youth, I'm not disrespectful, I don't add the word 'fuck' after every other word, I don't sleep around and I don't tear around the streets at 90mph in my car.

Older people stereotype younger people based on the few that are in the newspapers. We all know that your best shot at getting in the newspaper is by doing something bad. Don't help them stereotype youth by doing it yourself.

(sorry for the double posts, but hey, when nobody is talking what do you do eh?)
In my experiences most of the happy people I know have gone through times like those described in Boo's post. Everyone deals with it differently, but I haven't seen a single person who once able to put it behind them, didn't become a happy clam. I actually had a conversation about this not too long ago. I believe it is due to the fact that they know that their life is good, or at least better than it was, so life can't be all that bad can it? So everyone out there should cheer up, with the fear of being overly repetitive, your life can't be all that bad, even those in our situations don't have it all that bad, hell even those who are in the "worst" situations imaginable have something to make them realize that life isn't all that bad, it's just harder to see ;)

Heeee!

Well I think people need comparisons to really understand things. Our minds and senses are set up in such a way that we require dualism to grasp anything. If there isn't any darkness, how do we understand and recognize light? Light CREATES darkness. It casts shadows. And in this instance, we are provided with a contrast that allows us to understand both.

How can anyone really appreciate a good time if they've never in their lives really suffered? This is why so many middle class people are so pointlessly dissatisfied with their own good fortune. If they were brought up with an abundance of good food, in nice houses, by good, loving families... where is the contrast that allows them to understand how truely good they have it? Instinctively, their minds create dissatisfactions and problems in the search for the contrast they require. Drama happens. But drama isn't a real indicator that allows them to appreciate the magnitude of their good fortune. So they have it all, but they are unable to enjoy it and they lack happiness as a result. There was never any hard work or pain involved in aquiring it, so they cannot savor it.

They see the "dark" outside of their comfortable lives, but they don't understand that either, as it is too abstract and far away to actually impact them. It's not like snow, in that they've rolled in it and played with it and even tasted it and know its basic physical properties, so that when they look out the window, they know it's cold, slippery and wet. Suffering, pain and privation are just uncomfortable abstracts until you have actually experienced them personally. Seeing these things on TV or the movies doesn't come close to giving you any real idea what these things are like. Seeing someone die on television isn't remotely like seeing someone die in real life up close and personal. It's not just that you can't smell it or touch it either. There is a detatchedness to TV and movies that is not present in reality. Skipping breakfast and lunch and being hungry for dinner isn't anything like being TRUELY hungry either. There is just no real comparison to give the children of the priveledged that they could accept or WOULD accept.

If I didn't think it was too harsh for them, I'd pack children who whine about how horrible their middleclass lives are off to peace-corps style summercamps in places like India, Thailand and Africa so that they would be able to witness these things firsthand AND find out how hard it is to REALLY work at something that actually meant something. As it stands, I think it would do them all good to quit whining and volunteer a few hours every weekend at a soup kitchen or homeless shelter or some other charity service that puts them directly into contact with people far less fortunate than themselves. That might give them a very small taste of what they so obviously need to understand. I think they'd have a lot more fun and enjoyment out of their normal lives in the wake of seeing how much they really do have because of their parents' work and care.

Speak for yourself... I have plenty of ambitions, I'm only depressed when it's reasonable to be depressed ('Oh, your dog's dead', 'oh, your mother has cancer', 'oh, it's going to cost you £900 to fix your car'...), I never, ever go near drugs, never have never will, and scorn anybody who can only have fun when using them. In addition, according to the stereotypical view of youth, I'm not disrespectful, I don't add the word 'fuck' after every other word, I don't sleep around and I don't tear around the streets at 90mph in my car.

Older people stereotype younger people based on the few that are in the newspapers. We all know that your best shot at getting in the newspaper is by doing something bad. Don't help them stereotype youth by doing it yourself.

Heheheh! Yay Ghar! I like you. You've got a good head on your shoulders. YOU don't have to go to Privation Camp. ;) Wanna be Privation Instructor? *gigglesnort*

Hey there, recent Nation States member, long term friend of Nasopotomia and concerned person. Throughout this topic, specifically through posts made by Hive Legion and Demortes, I have seen how truly ignorant others in my generation really are. Yes, I am a teenager and sadly I share a generation with the likes of those typical teenagers, examples of which are found on this thread. I am shocked by the depth to which some of these self-absorbed ingrates feel able to speak. As I sit on my expensive, fast computer, with high-speed broadband, in a heated room with electricity, snacking on delicious foods with running hot water, flushing toilets, a warm bed, ample food and a roof over my head then I feel genuinely privileged to live in the year I do, in a more economically developed country.

First of all, “young people don’t have ambitions, are always depressed, always relying on drugs to have fun and etc.” I can see why some of the moronic youngsters on here would make you think that, but that’s not a fair comment. Like Ghargonia, I have many ambitions; if I do get depressed then I try to express it without coming onto a huge forum and demanding all people older than me die a suffering, miserable death. I have never taken drugs, and I doubt that I ever will and most certainly not to have fun. I admit that the majority of young people fall into the ignorant, incomprehensible, boorish and thuggish ignoramuses you see stereotyped by the media, but there are people such as myself and Ghargonia who do not fall into that stereotype and are forever trying to escape it. I for one appreciate what I have and resent idiots who think their angst is a genuine reason to hate life. With that in mind, I want to address these upstarts.

Demortes firstly, yes you do have the right to free speech and if you have problems then it’s understandable that you wish to ‘bitch’ about them. However as Nasopotomia pointed out, your problems hardly justify your complete and utter hatred of your life, I do get depressed myself of course, everyone does, but why not write a Journal? Or at least if you post that kind of self-absorbed moaning on a forum then be prepared to accept that most people aren’t going to care. Believe me, if you bothered to think about things a little harder then you would realise that you don’t have it anywhere near as bad as most people. Just look at Booslandia's story, it’s touching and tragic and she doesn’t feel a compulsive need to bitch and whine to everyone she can find about how ‘hard done to’ she was and she actually WAS ‘hard done to’.

Another example of many, my parents were young in the days when everyone was still scared of getting blown apart by a nuclear weapon. They were literally on the edge at points, and one night there was an electrical fault and the nuclear warning alarm went off, there was widespread panic and fear. Fast forward to 2005 and we are no longer in that state of constant fear, where you lie awake at night worrying that somebody might just drop the big one. Sure there are still nukes, and it’s a threat to a degree but nothing like it was back in those days. Here are a few more facts for you to consider about how well you have it;

♠ 1915: 63% of people died before 60, down to 12% in 2004

♠ 1900: 140 deaths per 1,000 births, down to 5.7 deaths in 1999

♠ 1901: life expectancy for newborns was 45 for boys, 49 for girls, up to 75 (boys), 80 (girls) in 2000

♠ 1914: 10% of people own a house, up to 68% in 1999

♠ 1900: 89% of homes privately rented, down to 10% in 2000

Still think that you’re life is an unbearable pile of crap? If so then why not go to one of the countries hit by the Tsunami, whole villages just destroyed and a problem that has suddenly arisen which will affect generations to come and tell them about your issues with life and see if they give two shits. Perhaps try going an LEDC to Africa where diseases such as AIDS, which we can keep under control more easily in MEDCs, are huge epidemics that can wipe out mass numbers and don’t stop spreading. Be thankful that you have your rights of free speech to bitch about how much you hate your life; free speech isn’t a universal right. I don’t think that Nasopotomia doesn’t care about people committing suicide either, his point was one that I agree with, that you DONT have a lousy life, you have all kinds of rights that you’re lucky to have and by bitching about it so much you’re coming across as an juvenile boorish upstart who can’t cope with minor issues and imperfections in your life and so expects the rest of the world to indulge you’re childish temper tantrums and angst filled rants. Best learn it now, the rest of the world has bigger problems to deal with and your issues are meaningless to them.

Hive Legion you should probably take note here too, especially when you say “You will be penniless and die suffering the way you deserve: paying back our generation.” I feel very concerned. The efforts of the generations before us have made it possible for you to sit on your arse, using the internet through a computer and bitch about they should die a horrible death. Other generation’s owe us nothing, in fact we owe it to those people out there who actually did work to make the world a better place, one where you are free to say what you’re saying now and be safe, healthy and live in relative comfort. Instead people like you insist that things have never been worse, and that people have shafted you because you ‘don’t know any better’ well to be honest from your inflammatory ageist rant then you clearly don’t know any better. The little disclaimer in your post, and indeed in Demortes, saying that you cannot be civil because you’re writing your posts so late and in blind anger shows you aren’t choosing your words carefully and being civil. Perhaps you should calm down, take a good hard think about things and come back and make a post when you CAN think to the best of your ability and be civil. ;)

Older people stereotype younger people based on the few that are in the newspapers. We all know that your best shot at getting in the newspaper is by doing something bad. Don't help them stereotype youth by doing it yourself.

Now this kid knows what he's talking about. Those of you too wrapped up in adolecent moaning to see how good you have things, learn from this and Inc Lunacy. They're MATURE. They've looked at what they've GOT to weigh up their lives, rather than sitting there moaning about what they've not.

What most of you seem to be complaining about is that some peopole in the world have it better than you do. GET USED TO IT. Start looking at all those worse off; you find there's a lot more of them. 90% of the population of Africa, for starters. 1.8 million people in India who've just been added to their homeless figures. The 90 million people in China who really CAN'T get jobs because there, there aren't any. And the few of them that can use the net can't even view this site, because their government censors the net.

Bush may be a dickhead, but having him in charge of our country is NOT as bad as having a completely unaccountable dictator, or an Ayatolla who cannot possible be consoidered wrong because he speaks with the voice of God. Grow up, go to school and then go get a job.

And those of you who say 'there's no more jobs'; here's some shock news. PEOPLE RETIRE. Those in the older generation will soon enough. And then people will need to fill those jobs, and here's the next news flash: THAT'S YOU. That's how the job market works, dickheads.

The 90 million people in China who really CAN'T get jobs because there, there aren't any. And the few of them that can use the net can't even view this site, because their government censors the net.


Yep, that's right, there's no jobs in China. No economic boom there, nosiree. And the internet is completely monitored by the CCP Central Committee, with all even remotely critical sites censored. Yessiree, there's not a chance in hell anyone living in China could ever view this site. :rolleyes:

And there are what, like 50 trillion people in China? This means that the 90 million represent a 0.00000032 percent unemployment rate, which is pretty good, I guess.

And there are what, like 50 trillion people in China? This means that the 90 million represent a 0.00000032 percent unemployment rate, which is pretty good, I guess.

Unless you happen to be one of those 90million people unemployed, or a partner, or child of said person in which case I doubt you'd appreciate that the figures are 'pretty good'. Plus those 'figures' you're quoting are a little silly, just guessing that it's 50 trillion people over 90million, either yourself or Nasopotomia need to find out accurate unemployment figures for China and overall population if you REALLY feel you must compare them. Besides, China's not entirely the issue, although some of the whiners in this topic would be worse off if they did live there. The real issue is that these people have an inability to think outside their own 'terrible lives' and see that in a comparison to all the people in the world, and all the other positions they could be in then things aren't all that bad for them after all.

Naw, I agree with you completely. I was hoping my numbers would be more than a little silly.

Heh, well I didn't mean the numbers you made up were all that silly, more that using a figure Nasopotomia made up, in comparison with one you made up and producing an average from them is going to be so inaccurate that it can't be taken seriously.

Guys, no matter who you are, there is always going to be someone worse off than you. Hell, the tsunami victims aren't that screwed compared to some people. In other words, let's stop saying "oh well these people are worse off than you, so you have no right to bitch."

What I want to say is "Hey...yeah,you..head moron in charge...do some damage control or else there's not going to be anything left to work with when my generation is in power." Individuals can't do everything. We need some cooperation from the powers that be. In other words, the government needs to take responsibility for its own actions, rather than coming up with a new pack of lies every 6 months to cover shit up.

Like I said, you can't wait for my generation to be in power before fixing anything. Damage control is a good thing, right?

Bejing reports Chiinese unemployment at 90 million. Hoever, if you include the unemployed, and also those who must roam around China trying to find what work they can (like temps, only without an agency to help. Imagine looking for a needle made entirely out of hay, in a field full of haystacks, but not knowing what part of Europe the field is in), then you end up with about 200,000,000.

In the US, unemployment is about 7 million, isn't it?

Guys, no matter who you are, there is always going to be someone worse off than you. Hell, the tsunami victims aren't that screwed compared to some people. In other words, let's stop saying "oh well these people are worse off than you, so you have no right to bitch."

What I want to say is "Hey...yeah,you..head moron in charge...do some damage control or else there's not going to be anything left to work with when my generation is in power." Individuals can't do everything. We need some cooperation from the powers that be. In other words, the government needs to take responsibility for its own actions, rather than coming up with a new pack of lies every 6 months to cover shit up.

Like I said, you can't wait for my generation to be in power before fixing anything. Damage control is a good thing, right?

Unfortunately, the Head Moron in Charge of my country isn't listening to his citizens, he's listening to "God" and a pack of advisors that he THINKS are reading the news. Our government is completely out of touch with the real world and the real desires of the people it governs. But this isn't the George W. Bush Is An Insane Fucknut thread, so I won't go on about it here.

Guys, no matter who you are, there is always going to be someone worse off than you. Hell, the tsunami victims aren't that screwed compared to some people. In other words, let's stop saying "oh well these people are worse off than you, so you have no right to bitch."

I agree that everyone does has a right to complain, and there is always someone worse off, but the degree to which some people in this topic are bitching is just far too far and ingrateful and selfish for it to be considered any more than angst.

What I want to say is "Hey...yeah,you..head moron in charge...do some damage control or else there's not going to be anything left to work with when my generation is in power." Individuals can't do everything. We need some cooperation from the powers that be. In other words, the government needs to take responsibility for its own actions, rather than coming up with a new pack of lies every 6 months to cover shit up.

It's a nice idea, but I don't see it happening. The government is more interested in keeping itself in power, and keeping the country running at the moment, the future is too uncertain for them to do a lot to it. I mean up until 26th December did any governments forsee the need to send such whopping amounts of money to Thailand, now however millions of lives depend on this money. The future is too uncertain for the government to put a lot of damage control in. For example within our lifetimes it is likely that natural gas reserves will run dry, and the all of a sudden we'll be screwed. Who knows if a sudden natural disaster could occur, or if a sudden terrorist attack will do untold damage? They'd struggle to put all that damage control in even if they WERE interested in what our generation wanted, which of course they aren't because most of us can't even vote, and hell even when you can they're not going to care about you all that much more.

I don't know exactly who this head moron is, the one who's pulling all the strings, but I'm pretty sure he or she isn't reading this thread.

Anybody else think that the success of the X-Files and other conspiracy-style film, tv, and lit (not to mention the widespread portrayal of Cheney as the mastermind puppeteer) has a good deal to do with people wanting to have some individual or organization that's accountable for the all of the major wrongdoings of our time? Nobody every says, "You know, there's not some secret powerbroker who's out to ruin the environment and destroy my job, there's just a lot of regular folks who do things like buy coffee in styrofoam cups from Dunkin Donuts and eat at places like McDonald's that encourage a national monoculture, not to mention unsavory labor and agricultural practices, and buy their goods from Wal*Mart, which stocks outsourced goods and destroys local business."

Unless you're like 8, Salad, I think we're part of the same generation. And when we come to power, the world isn't going to be rocked and remade. It'll be the same damn play with brand new players.

And when we come to power, the world isn't going to be rocked and remade. It'll be the same damn play with brand new players.

I totally agree with that bit, there's no point pretending the next generation is going to be any better than the last at this game. After all, with the impending energy crisis, shifting climates and all the other issues that our generation will be faced with what makes you think we won't be worse?

I don't know exactly who this head moron is, the one who's pulling all the strings, but I'm pretty sure he or she isn't reading this thread.

Anybody else think that the success of the X-Files and other conspiracy-style film, tv, and lit (not to mention the widespread portrayal of Cheney as the mastermind puppeteer) has a good deal to do with people wanting to have some individual or organization that's accountable for the all of the major wrongdoings of our time? Nobody every says, "You know, there's not some secret powerbroker who's out to ruin the environment and destroy my job, there's just a lot of regular folks who do things like buy coffee in styrofoam cups from Dunkin Donuts and eat at places like McDonald's that encourage a national monoculture, not to mention unsavory labor and agricultural practices, and buy their goods from Wal*Mart, which stocks outsourced goods and destroys local business."

Unless you're like 8, Salad, I think we're part of the same generation. And when we come to power, the world isn't going to be rocked and remade. It'll be the same damn play with brand new players.

I know that we're not going to fix the world. I've known that probably my whole life. I'm not referring to the destruction of the environment, although that is something we each need to worry about. I'm referring to very important, widespread laws and such that are getting pushed through with little or no input from voters. I do blame the government for most of the legal wrongdoings in my life. They're the ones making the laws, interpreting them, and enforcing them, so I think it's right to blame them if unjust legislation gets pushed through. I'm not simply referring to the federal government. I'm also referring to local elected officials and the small amount of corrupt law enforcment officers that I (and my family) have had to deal with.

All I'm really trying to say is don't tell us how bright we're going to make the future if you're going to keep piling on new problems while we can't do anything about them.

You must admit that our parents' generation has bragged constantly about how bright our future is going to be, and how many problems out generation could solve. They want us to find a cure for cancer, AIDS, diabetes, etc. I want us to accomplish this as well, but I don't expect it to happen. Even the Bush administration publicly appears to have high hopes for our generation. Every generation does this to the one following it. We need to stop. The hopes get crushed; disappointment turns into bitterness, and bitterness turns into apathy. The apathy is what we're dealing with now. Most of us are either apathetic, deluded, or just plain confused.

I know that we're not going to fix the world. I've known that probably my whole life. I'm not referring to the destruction of the environment, although that is something we each need to worry about. I'm referring to very important, widespread laws and such that are getting pushed through with little or no input from voters. I do blame the government for most of the legal wrongdoings in my life. They're the ones making the laws, interpreting them, and enforcing them, so I think it's right to blame them if unjust legislation gets pushed through. I'm not simply referring to the federal government. I'm also referring to local elected officials and the small amount of corrupt law enforcment officers that I (and my family) have had to deal with.

All I'm really trying to say is don't tell us how bright we're going to make the future if you're going to keep piling on new problems while we can't do anything about them.

You must admit that our parents' generation has bragged constantly about how bright our future is going to be, and how many problems out generation could solve. They want us to find a cure for cancer, AIDS, diabetes, etc. I want us to accomplish this as well, but I don't expect it to happen. Even the Bush administration publicly appears to have high hopes for our generation. Every generation does this to the one following it. We need to stop. The hopes get crushed; disappointment turns into bitterness, and bitterness turns into apathy. The apathy is what we're dealing with now. Most of us are either apathetic, deluded, or just plain confused.

Fair enough to blame the government, but that's not our parents fault. Certainly not here, anyway; I'm a Brit. And the apathy and confusion bit just sound like general adolescence to me.

be ambitious, write a book

hehe, so I can make a movie...

Wait, I also want to write a book...

Do something with music, I suck a that!

Although, I had an idea...

...

be original!

Fair enough to blame the government, but that's not our parents fault. Certainly not here, anyway; I'm a Brit. And the apathy and confusion bit just sound like general adolescence to me.

*GRIN* You youngins don't have a corner on the apathy and confusion market. LOL I think apathy and confusion are one of those pandemic diseases in America at the very least, and suspect that that little disease is just as common in the other first world nations on all levels and age groups.

There are days when I see so much of it that I am possessed of this frightful urge to run screaming through town shrieking "WAKE THE FUCK UP!!!" through a bullhorn the whole way. Of course that would only get me arrested for disturbing the peace... but that doesn't stop the thought from crossing my mind.

Bejing reports Chiinese unemployment at 90 million. Hoever, if you include the unemployed, and also those who must roam around China trying to find what work they can (like temps, only without an agency to help. Imagine looking for a needle made entirely out of hay, in a field full of haystacks, but not knowing what part of Europe the field is in), then you end up with about 200,000,000.

In the US, unemployment is about 7 million, isn't it?

What? Beijing most certainly does not report Chinese unemployment at 90 million. Where on Earth did you get that figure from? The most recent figures I could find were 8.21 million in urban areas:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2004-12/18/content_2349397.htm

As for the 200 million figure, I really, really want to know where you get that from.

There are days when I see so much of it that I am possessed of this frightful urge to run screaming through town shrieking "WAKE THE FUCK UP!!!" through a bullhorn the whole way. Of course that would only get me arrested for disturbing the peace... but that doesn't stop the thought from crossing my mind.


Personally, I prefer running naked through the streets wearing a billboard. Actually, that reminds me. Where's that 'Ever been arrested' thread...

:-D I'm glad you don't all know about "shelter drills" and hiding in the hallway of your schools in case of a nuclear explosion -- crouching out of the way of windows because god knows, when a nuke goes off, you don't want to be hit by flying glass.

Seriously, hang in there. It looks bleak now, but things have a way of calming down and working out.
in my highschool days we had similar things. they were called lockdowns and were to keep us safe from people coming in to shoot up our school.

school shootings seem a little more likely than nukes...

in my highschool days we had similar things. they were called lockdowns and were to keep us safe from people coming in to shoot up our school.

school shootings seem a little more likely than nukes...

Yeah I always liked the lockdowns. Funny thing was if you were say taking a pee you were trapped outside with the gunman. Happened to me a couple times (during a drill) and I would just walk around the halls making loud scary noises, then leave.

in my highschool days we had similar things. they were called lockdowns and were to keep us safe from people coming in to shoot up our school.

school shootings seem a little more likely than nukes...

We had lockdowns too. There was a homeless guy who kept wandering in through our wide-open front doors and our non-working metal detector.

We did get stuck on lockdown for something really stupid,though. We were herded into the cafeteria and gym because they thought there was a natural gas leak. What the fuck?!

I was trying to come up with these quotes the other day and couldn't remember them. A friend helped me find them. When you consider the challenges facing us to be impossible, remember the following...

"Every noble work is, at first, impossible." -- Carlyle

"It is difficult to say what is impossible, for the dream of yesterday is the hope of today and the reality of tomorrow." -- Robert H. Goddard

"The impossible is often the untried." -- Jim Goodwin

"Something which we think is impossible now is not impossible in another decade." -- Constance Baker Motley

"Today's accomplishments were yesterday's impossibilities." -- Robert H. Schuller