NationStates Jolt Archive

I mean no offense to those who enjoy it, but I honestly think that punk (or at least what punk I've heard) has really cliche lyrics sung by artists only pretending to by "angsty"

The music I listen to includes Billy Joel, Bruce Springsteen, and Bon Jovi - could this have any reason why I think like such?

I mean no offense to those who enjoy it, but I honestly think that punk (or at least what punk I've heard) has really cliche lyrics sung by artists only pretending to by "angsty"

The music I listen to includes Billy Joel, Bruce Springsteen, and Bon Jovi - could this have any reason why I think like such?

Bon Jovi?? I'm sorry hon, I'm an old squatter punk from back in the day and the thought of listening to Bon Jovi ranks somewhere up there with getting my entrails pulled out through my ears while drunk Vietnamese women sing in the background. It's really just you dude.

Mainstream punk is so offensive to my ears that I dare not even find the "real" punk out of fear dying from the sensory tragedy.

Some punk is good, but most of it is worthlessly angsty, cliched crap.

I can never tell here whether people are talking about pop-punk or old-style punk.

Well if you are still into Punk Rock , you are about 20 years too late...Punk is Dead

Evidence: Today...Good Charlotte is considered Punk Rock

I rest my case

Well if you are still into Punk Rock , you are about 20 years too late...Punk is Dead
Tell that to all the teenagers at my school who think otherwise

Tell that to all the teenagers at my school who think otherwise

Okay, tell me who do they listen too?

Wait...punk is angsty? What the heck do you consider punk rock?

Punk is sometimes tied with songs of protest or personal inability...but angst? Have you actually listened to any? Methinks you may be confusing it with something else.

I can never tell here whether people are talking about pop-punk or old-style punk.

Yeah, me neither.
The two styles are so different, and yet they're still both just called 'punk''.
Old-school punk and hardcore are awesome, but most of this pop-'punk' is really more like standard pop-rock but with spiked hair and even more commercialism. Yay.

the Dead Kennedys are dead.
Long live the Dead Kennedys.

Punks aren't as near as bad as Goths....

Punks aren't as near as bad as Goths....

:(

We're just misunderstood.
Then again, it might help our social relationships if we weren't wearing so damn much makeup...
Naaah.

Wait...punk is angsty? What the heck do you consider punk rock?

Punk is sometimes tied with songs of protest or personal inability...but angst? Have you actually listened to any? Methinks you may be confusing it with something else.
This is true. Real punk is about rebellion and protest and being a real outsider. This pop-punk/fashion-punk bullshit sucks. All of the songs are cliched. Most of them are about the singer crying in the lunchroom because the girl he loves hates him. And the people who listen to pop-punk, at least when I was in high school, were the preps and other popular kids. If punk was not dead already, it is dead now.

Speaking of Good Charlotte, I have a guilty pleasure of listening to them. They really are not that bad and their songs are catchy. Did you know they are good friends with the guys from Rancid? I don't consider them pop-punk or any kind of punk, just pop.

I mean no offense to those who enjoy it, but I honestly think that punk (or at least what punk I've heard) has really cliche lyrics sung by artists only pretending to by "angsty"

The music I listen to includes Billy Joel, Bruce Springsteen, and Bon Jovi - could this have any reason why I think like such?
Ohhhh...you listen to 'Orgasm Adict' by the Buzzcocks and then tell me their lyrics are cliche!
Or 'That's Entertainment' and 'When you're Young' by the Jam.

Clearly the only option is to find some real music to listen to, and then show your friends the light. So you both have to give up your current preferences.

I just listen to Dropkick Murphys and hope everything comes out for the best

I mean no offense to those who enjoy it, but I honestly think that punk (or at least what punk I've heard) has really cliche lyrics sung by artists only pretending to by "angsty"

That's modern punk. There are a few decent modern bands about but it's tough finding them. Try the older (pre-1995) stuff.

I do it myself, but somehow it's too stupid that people even critisize music styles. The love for music is such a personal thing. Our styles represent the huge magnitude of experiences we've had throughout our lives. So then we seek out those people that have a somewhat similar style, in the hope that we might find some acceptance and understanding. And to show that we like them more than others, we make fun of people with a different style. It gets even more rigid when we connect our music to specific clothing, speech, hairdo, generations, lifestyle and all kinds of stuff, untill it has absolutely nothing to do with the music anymore. We might even hate some songs, not because we don't like them, but because they're from the wrong subculture. Isn't that sad!
I say, keep listening the music you like, and be honest about what you like, whatever others may say.

Theres one band that takes everything bad about mordern rock and somehow and amazingly makes it good. They are called Muse, and are bloody great!

www.muse.mu, check it out, I recommend Falling Down, Unintended, Bliss, Space Dementia, Hate This and I'll Love You, Newborn, Hysteria, Sing For Absolution, and Time is running out!

Theres one band that takes everything bad about mordern rock and somehow and amazingly makes it good. They are called Muse, and are bloody great!

www.muse.mu, check it out, I recommend Falling Down, Unintended, Bliss, Space Dementia, Hate This and I'll Love You, Newborn, Hysteria, Sing For Absolution, and Time is running out!

But they're not punk ;)

I don't get the Clash. Most of their songs don't sound very "punk"-ish to me (Train in Vain or Should I Stay, for example). They never really rip it up like the Sex Psitols or Butthole Surfers.

I don't get the Clash. Most of their songs don't sound very "punk"-ish to me (Train in Vain or Should I Stay, for example). They never really rip it up like the Sex Psitols or Butthole Surfers.

The Clash's sound were definitely not as hardcore as say the Sex Pistols, but they're politics and attitude were the same....I think. So that's why they're punk.

I don't get the Clash. Most of their songs don't sound very "punk"-ish to me (Train in Vain or Should I Stay, for example). They never really rip it up like the Sex Psitols or Butthole Surfers.

There's "1977" "White Riot" and "London's Burning" To name just three. Most of their pre-London Calling stuff is on par or at least close to it. They got tamer as they got older, and the stuff that everyone knows is from this later era.

Any rock but skater rock is better that rap crap.

True, I've not heard their earlier stuff. I'll give it a whirl.

True, I've not heard their earlier stuff. I'll give it a whirl.

You won't be sorry :) Also definitely check out the Dead Kennedy's if you haven't already.

You won't be sorry :) Also definitely check out the Dead Kennedy's if you haven't already.

Yay Dead Kennedys!

They rock.
Minor Threat is good too, if you're into hardcore.

Punks aren't as near as bad as Goths....

But what about early-eighties goth-punk?

Some punk is good and some just sucks [don't even mention all the pop-punbk Good Charlotte type stuff]. The crap kind of punk is the kind that rejects other music "because it is punk rock" to dislike prog or metal or whatever. Real punk should be about change through music, not just being a twat like a lot of it is nowadays...

I just listen to Dropkick Murphys and hope everything comes out for the best

I'd just like to say that I went to high school with Marc Orrell.

Well if you are still into Punk Rock , you are about 20 years too late...Punk is Dead

Evidence: Today...Good Charlotte is considered Punk Rock

I rest my case

Yeah, that does pretty much say it all. I think I have to go curl up in a Ramones T-shirt and cry.

EDIT: It's okay now... I'm having a good Sex Pistols cheer-up. ;)

Wait...punk is angsty? What the heck do you consider punk rock?

Punk is sometimes tied with songs of protest or personal inability...but angst? Have you actually listened to any? Methinks you may be confusing it with something else.

That's what I was thinking. "Angsty?" I can't think of too many "angsty" punk songs or singers. Pop-punk, emo, or screamo, perhaps, but not real punk.

EDIT: And good punk bands have been around up to modern times, and some still are. Not every new band is a cookie-cutter sellout, unless the only place you look is MTV.

But what about early-eighties goth-punk?

Bauhaus?
The Misfits?

Death-rock rocks!

Ever heard of Bloody Dead & Sexy?

Ohhhh...you listen to 'Orgasm Adict' by the Buzzcocks and then tell me their lyrics are cliche!
Or 'That's Entertainment' and 'When you're Young' by the Jam.


I like your taste in music Demented Hamsters.

You won't be sorry :) Also definitely check out the Dead Kennedy's if you haven't already.


And if you like DK check out the Crucifucks.

I appologize for the length of the following content, but this is actually from an essay i just wrote on the state of Punk today and where we original punks all fit into it.

And so it begins...





You know i was sitting in my office today (gotta make that money) and i was going through my collection of music that really influenced me groing up, and i came across this song i havn't heard in a good ten years or something called No More Heros by the Stranglers, this great english punk band that is probably long since defunct. As i listened to the song, which by the way has nothing to do with the title, I started thinking...what has happened to all of the heros. No, i don't mean spider man or the X-Men, they are alive and well, and make Marvel and Sony billions of dollars respectively, but the people i used to look up to during that awkward period of youth known as puberty. So I crawl into the way back machine and set the dial for a good ten years ago and when i pop out i am greeted by a fifteen year old kid wearing a set of powder blue medical scrubs that he has doused in fake blod and written all over with magic marker and spray paint. Atop his head sits a neon lime green beenie with the word "DUNG" written across the front of it and it is covered in safety pins and key rings, and on his feet are a pair of highly polished checkerd black and white wing tips. As i stand there looking at his home made outfit wondering what inspired him to do that, i realized...he's me, or at least he was. Now don't get confused, i am not here to bitch about how things have changed or how punk is "sold out" now, but i do remember what inspired me to do that. When i was that age, i understood two things very very well, one, that because of how far out of town i grew up th only real friend i had was my guitar, and two i didn't give a shit about what anybody else had going on. I wasn't a loner, and i wasn't out for attention, i just wanted to exist. About two weeks before i created this outfit, which would be the first of many home made productions over my remaining three years of highschol, i attempted to keep a low profile and just blend in...but incase you havn't noticed, it is impossible to "blend in" in high school, and that is just the way highschool is. At any rate, i was explaining all of this to describe the mind set i was in. Now up to this point i had grown up on a mix of ZZ Top, Stevie Ray Vaughn, and AC/DC, and i still love those artists, but for that time period in my life, they didn't offer any advice. On the other hand, it was during that time i went on vaction with my parents and on a picnic table at a rest stop in Georgia i found a cassete tape of "The Ramones: Greatest Hits Live" I poped that tape into my little walkman, slapped my head phones on and was immersed in a whole new world. The first Ramones song i ever heard was Pet Cemetary, and the fact that it was beautifully pointless locked me in for good. It wasn't long after hearing the classics like Sedated, Blitzkrieg Bop, Happy Family, Do ya wanna dance, Rock Away Beach, and the other amazing tracks on that album, that i found exactly what i was looking for. Now you have to keep in mind that this was during a time that "Punk" wasn't a fashion statement, and to if you combined the words Pop and Punk in the same sentence people would be horribly confused. When the trip was over and i returned home i went down to my local music store (you couldn't just download music then) and i grabbed everything i could get my hands on. Everything from the Misfits to the stray cats. The bad brains to the toasters. The sex pistols to fish bone. Punk, Ska, Rude Boy, Third wave, I didn't care. It was all amazing. Plus it was right about that time that just under the surface there were some really really great bands like Rancid, goldfinger, guttermouth, the bouncing souls, h2o, pennywise, and the suicide machines boiling just waiting to overflow and spew their delicious sounds in your face. It was this message, this thought process that i truly believe made me everything i am today. One one side of me were the people that were still immersed in grunge, on the other side were people diving into rap, and though both styles of music are great in their own right, i was sitting in the middle in in my own little world of sound. It seemed to me that the people around me were becoming more and more close minded, and my world was growing ever larger. The more and more i listened to the amazing music of the previously mentioned guys, and continually discovered new stuff like anti flag, the drop kick murphey's L.E.S. Stitches, and Tiger army, it also opened me up to reggae and it's masters like bob marley, and funk with it's crowned king George Clinton. So a little more time passes , and i find myself in college. One would think that this is where i would become even more deeply immersed in "Punk" and it probably would have been, but it was also during this time that bands like blink 182 began to break, and greenday decided to conviently copy the sounds of blink, and punk slowly lost it's meaning and became nothing more than a fashion statement and a way to piss off your parents. But there was still some hope, all the great bands that brought me purpose stil existed and still played alot of great concerts in clubs so seedy, the teeny bopper punks wouldn't dare enter, i still had some form of slavation. Then it all came crashing down. Joey Ramone died, I felt like i lost a father and a teacher, I felt like Luke Skywalker must have felt when Vader lopped off Obi Wan's head. Just as i got over that terrible moment, i was hanging out with my good friend Jay, who by the way was the first person i ever shared that Ramones album with, and we decided to go to a show. We had our tickets already cause we bought them like two weeks in advance and we walked up to the local underground club to listen to the music that still meant something to us. When we arrived, we found that the show was completely sold out, which in this case was a good thing because it showed that people were finally starting to support what was going on. Or so i thought. as we stood in line there were two younger kids, a girl and her sister, i would say probably about 18 years old that really wanted to see the show, and you could tell that they wanted to hear it for the music and not just the fashion of it, and somebody said that they had one extra ticket he would be willing to give them, if they could get another they would be set. When they went over to get the ticket he want 40 bucks for what he originally paid five for. That's when it all became clear to me, myself, jay, the two ticketless girls, and a handful of others scattered across the world were all that were left. Jay and I gave them our tickets and walked home. We took off our pyramid spikes, hung up our painted leather jackets, washed the glue out of our hair and retired all of our home made clothing. Two more years have passed since that day, Johny Ramone went on to join Joey, "Punk" has become the new standard on MTV and most of the great ones don't exist any more. I still have all those tapes, transferd all of them to mp3 and have their music at my finger tips, and i still lok at everything with the open yet questioning attitude that that music taught me, but the Hero's are gone, and those that survived were chased out and their image sold to the masses at stores like hot topic. Maybe one day when i go on a road trip i will leave a copy of The Ramones Greatest Hits Live sitting on a picnic table at a rest stop and some one else will grow up with an open mind.

and this is one of my reflective thoughts on the essay written a few days later...




Nothing pisses me off more than when a way of life becomes a fashion trend, and normally the trendy fuckin posers are the ones who knocked the lifestyle ten minutes ago when it wasn’t popular, then when it does become trendy they knock the people who actually live the lifestyle for not being fucking trendy enough. I am an old punk, I have lived under that banner for a long time, but I hung up my spiked bracelet, and put my 16 eyelet Doc Martins in the closet a long time ago. Not because I lost my idealism, but because I have ideals. I still fight for the rights of individuality, and not conforming to the sheepish views of society at large, and in that spirit is why I removed that “style” of clothing. Because that’s exactly what it had become a fucking style. I guess I am just continuing my know more hero’s rant, but seriously…WHAT THE FUCK!!!?


In the end all i can say is Joey and Johnny Ramone are dead and gone, and Johnny Rotten disappeared into oblivion, but deep inside my fire still rages, deep inside i still fly my own flag. Deep inside....PUNK WILL NEVER DIE!

I realized punk was dead when I heard advertising on the radio for the Warped Tour. Now I smile when I hear Guttermouth got kicked off the tour for making fun of fashion punk bands like My Chemical Romance.

I never blamed Bkink or Green Day for killing punk. I always felt they were just making music and they don't even try to be punk anymore. It is the newer crap that really killed punk.

Don't just blame the new stuff...don't get me wrong its crap and i hate it, but even in the begining their was new wave....ew

There's still some bands making good punk and hardcore. Such as Dogwood, the Deal, Hannover Saints, Fewleftstanding, and Rise Against.

Don't just blame the new stuff...don't get me wrong its crap and i hate it, but even in the begining their was new wave....ew
You are right. Maybe I should change that. I feel that this era of pop-punk may not have killed punk, but it is at least raping the corpse.

Punk is more a state of living thana style of music these days. Somewhere about a decade ago, some big executives decided that loud fast guitars would probably sell better if they were played by bands that they could control better. Stuff like Good Charlotte I can ignore because I stopped judging by genre and only on a band-to-band basis. I can go off and listen to Chixdiggit and not worry about the state of punk, and I don't pay the big execs any more than I normally would, which is just about nothing.

Same thing goes for Rap and Hip-Hop music, Rock, Pop, Country, Electronic, and Metal. Genre is simply a frame for an artist to sculpt their own style around.

Punk is still alive, it's just so far underground it takes awhile to find it. As long as there's still some small band of maniacs gathering in a hole-in-the wall tavern spitting piss and anarchy, and those kids in patches are still on the street corner begging change for Colt 45, I'll know punk is still alive and well, somewhere.

i think punk died the minute people got "into the scene" with out understanding the message. i mean it isn't about the clothing or pink hair, fuck man the clash just started that look cause they were bored and it stuck, but the whole meaning of rebirth through chaos, man. as soon as that became diluted in the trend it was the begining of the end

I realized punk was dead when I heard advertising on the radio for the Warped Tour. Now I smile when I hear Guttermouth got kicked off the tour for making fun of fashion punk bands like My Chemical Romance.

I never blamed Bkink or Green Day for killing punk. I always felt they were just making music and they don't even try to be punk anymore. It is the newer crap that really killed punk.
And, you shouldnt blame Green Day at least.
Before the deaced Ramones died, they have stated their are few modern agedd punk bands that get bad rep, because of a Major Lable/popularity. The bands they menchiond are: Green Day and Rancid.
Green Day, have stated they weren't in it for the money. I believe them, considering that they don't spend money often. They all living in relitivly small houses, and have really one good car. They don't have rims and all the shit. And they give alot of their money away. Hell, the Ramones, had once asked Green Day to open for them, before they broke up. The Ramones have called Green Day the band that's closest to how they (ramones) were.
(did that last thing make any sence?!)
But, bands like blink-182 and good charlotte have ruined the scene. I am not trying to make funy of them in anyway. But b182 made 'punk' into potty mouthed people who only drink booze and make fun of thhings. bands like gc, made 'punk' into the poppiest rock possible, with electric instuments.
It's not bands such as Green Day's and Rancid's fault that the bands that look up to them most, are the bands ruining the punk rock scene.

And one thing, the bands who are still in it for their music, and old (30's), yes, have lost their 'punk-cred" such as Green Day, Rancid, NoFX and Bad Religion. But they are doing what they love doing, making music. They write about their lives. It's not their faults they dont do drugs and drink anymore/as much.

i think punk died the minute people got "into the scene" with out understanding the message. i mean it isn't about the clothing or pink hair, fuck man the clash just started that look cause they were bored and it stuck, but the whole meaning of rebirth through chaos, man. as soon as that became diluted in the trend it was the begining of the end
Yeah. I went to a Lars Fredrickson and the Bastards concert wearing a sweater, new jeans, and some Sketchers. I got a lot of angry looks from some of the concert-goers and got punched in the pit. Me and my friends have decided to not put our hair in mohawks and wear jackets with patches on them. We might dress like mods for the next concert we go to.

Yeah, that does pretty much say it all. I think I have to go curl up in a Ramones T-shirt and cry.

EDIT: It's okay now... I'm having a good Sex Pistols cheer-up. ;)

I know...I know....but we will always have our memories...And old punkers never die, they just sell-out

I know...I know....but we will always have our memories...And old punkers never die, they just sell-out
I dont have a problem with selling out. I think people need to do something, if it means "selling out" so be it

And, you shouldnt blame Green Day at least.
Before the deaced Ramones died, they have stated their are few modern agedd punk bands that get bad rep, because of a Major Lable/popularity. The bands they menchiond are: Green Day and Rancid.
Green Day, have stated they weren't in it for the money. I believe them, considering that they don't spend money often. They all living in relitivly small houses, and have really one good car. They don't have rims and all the shit. And they give alot of their money away. Hell, the Ramones, had once asked Green Day to open for them, before they broke up. The Ramones have called Green Day the band that's closest to how they (ramones) were.
(did that last thing make any sence?!)
But, bands like blink-182 and good charlotte have ruined the scene. I am not trying to make funy of them in anyway. But b182 made 'punk' into potty mouthed people who only drink booze and make fun of thhings. bands like gc, made 'punk' into the poppiest rock possible, with electric instuments.
It's not bands such as Green Day's and Rancid's fault that the bands that look up to them most, are the bands ruining the punk rock scene.

And one thing, the bands who are still in it for their music, and old (30's), yes, have lost their 'punk-cred" such as Green Day, Rancid, NoFX and Bad Religion. But they are doing what they love doing, making music. They write about their lives. It's not their faults they dont do drugs and drink anymore/as much.


First of all, i am more retarted for having read this...thank you. Second of all how can you even breathe the name rancid with out mentioning Op Ivy, and how the hell has this conversation gone on with out mention of black flag. Any way, i have three words about green day...FUCK GREEN DAY. Man when i first heard 1,039 smoothed out slappy hours i thought it was one of the greatest albums ever, and i continued to support them, buying prety much everything they recorded up until nimrod, which was also great. Then i went to see them on tour, just as i had done many times before, they were on tour with blink 182, and though i hated blink, it was worth it to see green day...or so i thought. After the show i went home and burned everything i owned that said green day. Those bastards were on stage for two hours and played 8 songs. all they did was fuck around and act "cool" for the motherfuckin teeny boppers. Fuck em! And now they have the audacity to try and come at me with a song called american idiot singing about the redneck agenda! Fuck that shit man, the only thing that song says to me is hey...we are green day and we realize that in ten minutes we wont be the trend any more so we better try and get our old fans back. It almost made me choke as much as when i heard Franko Unamerican from NoFx. Why Why Why must i have to deal with once great bands going down the toilet. I know this is genre jumping but that is like GWAR putting on a reunion show and not wearing the costumes. It's just plain disappointing.

I'm really curious what people think "punk" is (I'll tell you this it's not Blink 182). I always hear the funniest bands when I ask people what bands they think are punk bands.

It seems nobody knows unless they are a real punk.

I'm really curious what people think "punk" is (I'll tell you this it's not Blink 182). I always hear the funniest bands when I ask people what bands they think are punk bands.

It seems nobody knows unless they are a real punk.

But there isn't just one type of Punk Music, or Punk Style or Punk Rocker...Punk is about Individuality and the Freedom to express who you are

I'm really curious what people think "punk" is (I'll tell you this it's not Blink 182). I always hear the funniest bands when I ask people what bands they think are punk bands.

It seems nobody knows unless they are a real punk.

You see I think this question presents a paradox…it really depends on what the individual punk is rebelling against. For example, if the punk is rebelling against “the norm” then you are probably gonna hear a response like the misfits. If it is a political rebellion then bands like Anti-Flag are gonna be the answer. Or if it is just a general rebellion, you have your choice of The Ramones, The Sex Pistols, The Clash, Operation Ivy, Black Flag, and so one. I don’t think the question should be does any one even know what punk music is any more, I think the question should be does any one even know what punk is any more. :sniper:

But there isn't just one type of Punk Music, or Punk Style or Punk Rocker...Punk is about Individuality and the Freedom to express who you are

True True.

But I hear this new crap like Good Charlotte and it makes me want to cry. My mom saw every god damn Ramones and Clash concert in the midwest. Ever. Punk is in my blood, and hearing this new crap is like being raked over hot coals.

Bauhaus?
The Misfits?

Death-rock rocks!

Ever heard of Bloody Dead & Sexy?

Yes. Yes I have.