NationStates Jolt Archive


Hagel throws Rumsfeld under the bus.

Incertonia
13-12-2004, 03:29
On Late Edition with Wolf Blitzer today, Republican Senator Chuck Hagel from Nebraska gave Defense Secretary a vote of no-confidence. You can read the entire transcript here. (http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0412/12/le.01.html)

One, Secretary Rumsfeld's response to this young soldier -- that soldier and those men and women there deserved a far better answer from their secretary of defense than a flippant comment. That might work in a news room where you can be cute with the television audience but not when you're putting these men and women in harm's way, who will be wounded, some, some will be killed.

And I wonder what the parents thought. I wonder what the parents thought, the parents who have men and women over there, sons and daughter who are fighting. I don't think they appreciated that answer....

the secretary of defense reports to the president of the United States. I've had my differences with this secretary of defense, and I have been very clear on it.

I don't like the way he has done some things. I think they have been irresponsible. I don't like the way we went into Iraq. We didn't go into Iraq with enough troops. He's dismissed his general officers. He's dismissed all outside influence. He's dismissed outside counsel and advice. And he's dismissed a lot of inside counsel and advice from men and women who have been in military uniforms for 25 and 30 years.

One of the reasons we've got this problem, Wolf, in my opinion, is that we were unprepared for what we were going to face, what we are facing, in a post-Saddam Iraq. And this is just one more manifestation of the problem.

Listen, when I talk to these young troops that come back from Nebraska, National Guard Reserves, active duty, and I sit down with them alone in a room and no one there, no cameras, I ask them -- I was hearing some of these same things over the last year: not the right kind of weaponry, personal body armor they didn't have. They didn't have armor for their vehicles.

But yet too many of our leaders in this administration were going around the country telling and reassuring Americans our troops had everything they wanted. Certainly the Congress was passing a lot of money to make sure they had everything they wanted....

BLITZER: But very briefly to you, Senator Hagel, were you disappointed that the president asked Rumsfeld to stay on?

HAGEL: The president's decision is his decision. He will live with that decision. He'll have to defend that decision. And that's all I want to say about it.
Now let me say this about Chuck Hagel. I wouldn't vote for him if I lived in Nebraska, because on too many other issues, he's far too conservative for my tastes. But that doesn't mean that I don't respect him--he's a man of conviction, especially on the issue of the military and the war in Iraq. And in this case, he's exactly right--Rumsfeld is incompetent, and it's a further condemnation of Bush that he's one of the very few Cabinet officials who is keeping his job.
Lunatic Goofballs
13-12-2004, 03:34
Maybe if they keep saying 'Things are getting better in Iraq. Every day we get closer to our goal.' often enough, it'll come true. :D
Incertonia
13-12-2004, 03:43
That's about the only chance they have for it to happen. It sure ain't gonna happen if they keep going the way they have been thus far.
SS DivisionViking
13-12-2004, 03:47
Maybe if they keep saying 'Things are getting better in Iraq. Every day we get closer to our goal.' often enough, it'll come true. :D
especially if the keep refining the goal with lower and lower expectations, that way if they can just tread water long enough they can declare victory.


... of course george forgets this every now and then and still talks about iraq creating a new democratic middle east by its shining example... bad georgie. read the script, that's why the smart men in the well taylered suits write them for you.
Incertonia
13-12-2004, 04:53
Doesn't anyone want to defend the job Rummy's been doing?
Lunatic Goofballs
13-12-2004, 04:56
Doesn't anyone want to defend the job Rummy's been doing?

I don't think even Rumsfeld can do that. :p
SS DivisionViking
13-12-2004, 04:57
Doesn't anyone want to defend the job Rummy's been doing?

hey now i think his personal realitionship with paul wolfowitz is there own business. if their wifes accept this arrangement then who are we to judge.
Armandian Cheese
13-12-2004, 05:10
Doesn't anyone want to defend the job Rummy's been doing?
You're being too tough on him. Sur he, he failed in the after war planning, but the actual invasion of Iraq and the Afghanistan campaign was handled brilliantly. As for the questioning issue, sure, the Pentagon has screwed up. They haven't delivered the armor necessary. Still, Rumselfd thought they were getting armor as fast as they could. It turns out there was a bureacratic miscommunication with the company that produces the armor.
Zomblevania
13-12-2004, 05:13
I just finished reading Black Hawk Down (book from 1997, events from Oct. 1993) and they go over and over how the Rangers and Delta force guys had to use makeshift armor for their Humvees and other vehicles, or just try and get by without it. A lot of people died because of the lack of armor, kevlar, ballistic glass, whatever. The mistakes that were made in Somalia are well documented. Funny, that was more than 11 years ago, sound familiar?
Incertonia
13-12-2004, 05:34
I just finished reading Black Hawk Down (book from 1997, events from Oct. 1993) and they go over and over how the Rangers and Delta force guys had to use makeshift armor for their Humvees and other vehicles, or just try and get by without it. A lot of people died because of the lack of armor, kevlar, ballistic glass, whatever. The mistakes that were made in Somalia are well documented. Funny, that was more than 11 years ago, sound familiar?Sure does--an army that was supplied and outfitted under a President named Bush, sent to a war zone by a President named Bush, finds itself underequipped and having to scrounge to make do. Uncanny the similarities.
Zomblevania
13-12-2004, 06:07
Sure does--an army that was supplied and outfitted under a President named Bush, sent to a war zone by a President named Bush, finds itself underequipped and having to scrounge to make do. Uncanny the similarities.

Somalia happened on Clinton's watch,
but who's counting?
Lunatic Goofballs
13-12-2004, 06:21
Somalia happened on Clinton's watch,
but who's counting?

Actually, Somalia BEGAN on Bush Sr.'s watch. It Ended on Clinton's watch.
New Granada
13-12-2004, 06:24
You're being too tough on him. Sur he, he failed in the after war planning, but the actual invasion of Iraq and the Afghanistan campaign was handled brilliantly. As for the questioning issue, sure, the Pentagon has screwed up. They haven't delivered the armor necessary. Still, Rumselfd thought they were getting armor as fast as they could. It turns out there was a bureacratic miscommunication with the company that produces the armor.

The invasion of iraq was a non issue. The country had no military to speak of, all the real fighting was always assumed to be against the inevitable insurgency.

This is something rumsfeld was warned of but planned for with extraordinary and (in my opinion) criminal incompetence.
Incertonia
13-12-2004, 07:00
Actually, Somalia BEGAN on Bush Sr.'s watch. It Ended on Clinton's watch.
Thank you. And it was done with Bush's military.