NationStates Jolt Archive

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?
Yes. No.


I've thought about it before on multiple occasions. Just because you cannot comprehend slipping into oblivion doesn't mean that I can't.

Oblivion. That's all it will be, in my opinion. Things just stop.

How, though? How is it possible for your memory to just stop?

Sentience is an illusion. A trick of the mind.

There is a beginning, a middle and an end to everything. You are dillusional if you think something as weak and insubstantial as human consiouness is excluded from this principal.

Wait, are you talking to me?

Your born, you live your life, you die...................end of story.

Make the most of your life while you can because the only way you will live on after death is in the hearts and minds of those who loved and knew you in life.

All else is delusional.

The end of it all will likely be very...nothing. But that's better than being stressed out.

Yeah. I tell you what I find scary. Is that I would be conscious for ever. I dont wanna live for ever.

Hmmm, Hell is starting to seem pretty bad, isn't it? Too bad Heaven is just as so.

ill be in the same state i was BEFORE i lived

non-existance. nothing, gone, dead, finished. no thoughts, no memories, nothing

How, though? How is it possible for your memory to just stop?Your brain (and perhaps other squishy bits) makes your memory work. Your brain stops working, your memory stops working. Might as well ask how is it possible for nerves to stop functioning when you die.

A question to you religious folks out there: Do other animals just cease to exist after they die, or do they too go on to Paradise or Heaven or whatever it might be? If they can just cease to exist, and their memories are lost, why can't humans' minds cease to function. Is the difference simply because of our mental capability? Is it possible that we conceived of a Heaven and a hell to comfort our worries about mortality?

How, though? How is it possible for your memory to just stop?
Easy. The neurons in your brain decay.

Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop?

Can you remember anything before you were born? No.
Your mind started from nothing, it can easily finish as nothing.

What do you think will happen to you upon death?

an agnostics golden pharse =no idea

Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

read above

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?
ooh, I know, there is a hell, its called life! :)

What do you think will happen to you upon death?

I'm going to have birdie song played at my funeral.


Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

Yes. No. Easy.

Well, I USED to be an atheist - and I believed that sentience would simply stop. Anyone who says he comprehends it though, is being foolish - you can't, because you have nothing to relate it to. You can intellectually comprehend it - but you can't imagine not being there - because you have never been in a similar situation that you can remember.

One thing that always used to bother me, though. How can we feel things? Oh, I know that there are nerves and things but… what separates humans from very elaborate robots? You can't just say nothing because when you touch something it is somehow not just a simple data collection (damn! How can I put this into language?).

A question to you religious folks out there: Do other animals just cease to exist after they die, or do they too go on to Paradise or Heaven or whatever it might be? If they can just cease to exist, and their memories are lost, why can't humans' minds cease to function. Is the difference simply because of our mental capability? Is it possible that we conceived of a Heaven and a hell to comfort our worries about mortality?

I'm not sure what happens to animals when they die. I believe that there is a heaven and hell. When you die, you'll stand before God for judgement. He'll ask you nothing of religion, persuasion, sexual orientation, or anything like that. I believe he'll ask you two questions.

1) What have you done with my son, Jesus Christ? have you accepted what he did for you?
2) What have you done with your life, my gift to you?

The first question determines where you spend eternity, the second what you'll do in eternity.

^^^From The Purpose driven Life.

I believe there is a completely separate, non-reincarnation type thingy in which you stop to exist but something else does. Meaning- when you die, you don't exist anymore, so you can not be reincarnated. However, something else begins to exist, completely separate from you. It does not have your concionsness, or anything else to do with you- it is just some other alien thingy. It becomes itself, but instead of being you, you are something else. Imagine a row of lightbulbs. One breaks, but the wasteful management people decide to also replace the socket in which the lightbulb was. The lightbulb is your conciousness and the socket is your physical presence. It is replaced by an unrelated socket and lightbulb.

One thing that always used to bother me, though. How can we feel things? Oh, I know that there are nerves and things but… what separates humans from very elaborate robots? You can't just say nothing because when you touch something it is somehow not just a simple data collection (damn! How can I put this into language?).
not that i really know what you are getting at

but what seperates me from my CAT? she feels things.

I'd imagine you simply stop. Of course, this is not a terribly comforting thought, but the search for truth requires that you don't cop out and say arbitrarily that there must be some kind of judgement and reward or punishment.

I would agree that anyone who says he understands nonexistence is lying, as, logically, it cannot be "experienced", and therefore cannot be described.

One thing that always used to bother me, though. How can we feel things? Oh, I know that there are nerves and things but… what separates humans from very elaborate robots? You can't just say nothing because when you touch something it is somehow not just a simple data collection (damn! How can I put this into language?).

Nothing has to seperate us. There is not neccessarily any so-called "human spirit", indeed atheism rather precludes this. Believing that advanced robots would not have equal "feelings" is simply a human bias based on a popular myth.

I have sat and thought about this topic long and hard. It's something that has always bothered me: what becomes of me after death? Is that just the end? My experiences with the supernatural suggests that there IS something more, but what? Is there a heaven? Does God exist? Is there such a thing as a soul?

I've decided that noone can truly know the truth of this matter...it isn't something Science can solve. But I do believe that Rationality, examining the concept itself, can lead each individual to come to his or her own conclusions.

So, what is my conclusion? Something of the mind continues to exist after the body is gone, what that thing may be (Residual energies? The Soul?) and what becomes of if (Heaven? Hell? Aimless Wandering? Reincarnation?) I cannot say. The mind is the most powerful thing we have, far more powerful than any gun or bomb. The average person uses only 10% of its potential, and we know that unlocking just 2% more turns them into savants or psychics. It is theorized that if over 25% is unlocked, our bodies will become pure energy. And if 100%? Well...that's closest Science has ever come to describing the nature of God.

The mind and the soul exist both within the body and separately from it. They are not Physical things...although the mind can be affected by physical ailments. The Brain is a biological computer, but what it creates is more than just electric data. It creates people, beings, personalities. It allows for thought, for reason, for communication. Such a powerful force cannot simply cease to be.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not sure of anything. I believe that there is something beyond death, but I have no proof of that. Just my belief. Until I can prove that belief to myself, all I can do I have faith that this belief is true. And unless I have some life-altering revelation, that is all I will have until the day I die.

My view... I'd love there to be something after death... but I can't believe there is...

Death I would assume is like deep sleep... you don't know you're deeply asleep and so you don't know you're dead... theres no sudden "oh christ its all over" because there isn't that instant... because when it comes its over =/

The exact same thing that happens when your brain is removed and tossed in a dumpster while your body is on life support. Your brain cells lose function and burst/wither/rot. The chemical reactions stop happening. It's no different than when a computer melts down, except that with the computer, sometimes you can find chunks of data that are still in tact.

Death is just death. And yes, you can comprehend it. You just have to stop fearing it to allow yourself it. Like infinity, Saxnot, you just have to have a strong mind to understand it (For me, I'll admit it gives me a slight headache). You can only speak for your own experience in inability. You've never been in my brain or anyone else's.

Now, there's a possibility of some sort of risidual energy being left behind (but that would occurr -as we live-, but we've never detected this sort of energy in any meaningful way (the closest thing is ghost sightings and premonitions and how animals supposedly react to them and the 'chill zones' supposedly formed). However, chances are, that effect doesn't exist and are merely very consistant fabrications, and its certainly not sentient, but more of an imprint in whatever the heck its imprinting itself in, like some sort of electron scorch mark. And, again, probably not real.

Ah but you know what I mean: - the way you can actually feel things. At what point would the Robot stop just recording data and start feeling? Does the computer feel sentience? Do plants? Why? Why not? Because they have no nerves or brains? That doesn't affect sentience.

heres how i explained life and death to all my religious friends who didn't understand how i couldn't think there was something more than just this.

i said that we are all like ferbies (you know, the annoying little toys). instead of having batteries, we have a brain. the bad thing is when our batteries run out, its game over, we can't have them replaced. the body is still there, but theres nothing to run it.

so yeah, when we die, our batteries run out and worms eat at our intestines, yea!

Energy can never be created or destroyed. Humans - and everything else for that matter- are just differently organized forms of energy. Death is just a major point in the shifting from one form of energy to another. Even if the universe itself suffers "heat death" that is not destruction, but rather the return of all energy to a uniform, undifferentiated state. Our forms are ephemeral, but our essence is eternal.

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

Yes, my mind will stop. There is no heaven or hell.

so yeah, when we die, our batteries run out and worms eat at our intestines, yea!
The worms will never get me. I'm gonna be cremated.

The worms will never get me. I'm gonna be cremated.

Agreed, I prefer that form of my dead matter conservation than the other.

I don't believe in anything after death. You just stop feeling. If there is something after death, I'll deal with it. No sense worrying about it now.

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

I believe that I will be born again as a different person, to learn what I need to learn as that person, to complete the path to enlightenment.

The Dalai Lama said it best: The purpose of our lives is to be happy.

There have been several studies, and people do remember aspects of thier previous lives. A study came from the University of Virginia (I think) and there was a lot of evidence collected in support if it.

Energy can never be created or destroyed. Humans - and everything else for that matter- are just differently organized forms of energy. Death is just a major point in the shifting from one form of energy to another. Even if the universe itself suffers "heat death" that is not destruction, but rather the return of all energy to a uniform, undifferentiated state. Our forms are ephemeral, but our essence is eternal.
Thats almost poetic

......... The average person uses only 10% of its potential, and we know that unlocking just 2% more turns them into savants or psychics. It is theorized that if over 25% is unlocked, our bodies will become pure energy. And if 100%? Well...that's closest Science has ever come to describing the nature of God......

Urban myth, I'm afraid. The whole brain is used almost constantly, but most of it is not involved in conscious thought - rather, it deals with all the things the average human doesn't think about.

To 'use' 25 or 100% of your brain, assuming you mean 'use' in a conscious sense, either your body would die, or you'd be incapable of understanding incoming stimulii from outside of your body.

Here's a nice snopes link (http://www.snopes.com/science/stats/10percnt.htm) to explain it all.

of the brain at one time, any sufficiently complex set of activities or thought patterns will indeed use many parts of the brain. Just as people don't use all of their muscle groups at one time, they also don't use all of their brain at once. For any given activity, such as eating, watching television, making love, or reading, you may use a few specific parts of your brain. Over the course of a whole day, however, just about all of the brain is used at one time or another.

I tend to lean towards reincarnation, myself.

Hell, I dunno. Maybe I'll be Reincarnation (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=reincarnation) . Maybe it'll be Janna (http://www.religioustolerance.org/isl_para.htm). Maybe I'll continuously live out a place in the depths of my subconcious for the rest of eternity, my mind consstnatly dividing the time between my last time alive and the first time dead (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0679743464/qid=1102300118/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_b_2_1/103-9997759-0239830). Maybe I'll go back to join the Great Chicken (http://www.filthylies.net/d/20041115.html).

Here's a better question: why should I care? If there's a hell, then God isn't all loving, so it wouldn't matter in the first place.

What I like to do to consider this is try to imagine my non-existence before I was either born or concieved. I don't exist before that, and have no memories of it, and I won't exist after death.

Of course there's also the concept from Final Fantasy 7 that our life essence goes back to the Earth to mix with everything else and become new life. Maybe this is the way things really work, making a video game wrong, and every major religion wrong. But of course these things are impossible to prove either way (faith or no)

Thats almost poetic

Thermodynamics = poetry ;)

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?
i thought about that for a while, then i stopped giving a damn about stuff and my fear of nonexistance went with that

How, though? How is it possible for your memory to just stop?
ask a computer tech, all memory is is a storing of things you know, whipe it and its gone. heard of amnesia

ask a computer tech, all memory is is a storing of things you know, whipe it and its gone. heard of amnesia
Even though chess has got me blocked

Simplest explanation

Your mind is like ram
Volatile
So when power ceases to be applied … memory gone
(I think that is what he was referring too)

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

You are dead, period. I suppose the closest thing to death would be dreamless sleep, except you never wake up.

1° What do you think will happen to you upon death?
2° Will you just cease to exist?
3° What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it.

4° What if you died?
5° Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop?
6° Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?
1) I'll just cease to exist
2) Yes
3) both will cease to exist
4) I guess I'll cease to exist
5) yes.
6) No. Since I ceased to exist before going anywhere, and everybody else that is dead also ceased to exist.

I'll cease to exist and my body will be cremated and sent on a satillite to drift for several hundred years and finally burn up in the atmosphere...

At that point, the energy my body gives off from burning up in the atmosphere will warm up space by the 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 degree.

Thus, my live just made space a warmer place...

As others have said, accepting non-existence is rather easy...

Sure, I can't "understand" it, in the sense that I can know what it would be like (although, I do like the whole "you were nothing before birth, it's just like that" explanation), but I can definitely "understand" it in the sense that I understand how my brain works, and what will happen when it ceases to do so...

Essentially, the human body is nothing more than a machine... It's a complex machine, built of organic parts that all work together to perform a common goal...

This machine is driven by an incomprehensibly complex computer, the human brain...

This computer works much like the computers we're using right now... It just happens to be many, many orders of magnitude stronger...

It is this complexity that makes it seem so much more than just a computer... But this "more-ness" is just an illusion created by the complexity...

Basically, given the time, and technological advancements necessary, we could perfectly recreate the human brain entirely artificially (not anytime soon, of course, but it is possible...)

So as of this point, you've undoubtedly realized that I don't believe in a "soul"... There is nothing inside our bodies that isn't a result of the actual, physical workings of our bodies...

Our "mind" and "consciousness" is nothing more than a complex system of bio-electric impulses racing around a "circuit board", and being stored in "RAM"...

And as such, once the "power" is pulled, all systems shut off... No more juice flowing through the circuits, means no more thought... No more consciousness... Even our "memories" will cease to exist, because they're not stored in anything permanent (like the magnetic storage of a harddrive), but rather in temporary storage (like RAM), that requires constant power to sustain... And regardless, even if our memories were permanently stored somehow, there would no longer be anything to access them... No more processor, no more interface... It's like a computer with the cord pulled from the wall... Sure, it's there, and the stored info is still there, but it is doing nothing, and for all intents and purposes, it doesn't exist (don't mix this up... yes, the computer physically exists, but it's "consciousness" does not)...

Of related importance, is the fact that there may indeed be some residual energy left in the body after death... Possibly enough to carry on brain functions for a brief period of time... In fact, there's an old story that tells of a teacher that was beheaded for some crime (heresy, most likely), and he told his students to watch the execution, and that he would blink his eyes as many times as he could after the deed was done... Well, after the head was cut off (arguably, the point of death), they counted as his eyes blinked quite a few times (I forget the number, somewhere in the teens, I think)... This may or may not just be an urban legend, but I believe that it is possible... After all, our bodies function mainly on bio-chemical signals... Those chemicals can still very well be flowing for a short time after death (once cells begin to die of lack of oxygen and such, we will truly cease to exist... but for the brief time between, we may very well still be "alive" or at least conscious)

Note that my computer-brain analogy isn't something I mean to be taken literally... Our brains are far more complex than that, and I'm just using it as a more comprehensible example... But I believe that the basic operation can be boiled down to roughly the same...

Anyways, to tackle another issue here, namely the thermodynamics one, I've got to point out that yes, technically our "energy" does go on after we die...

However, that "energy" does not equate to a spirit... It is no longer "us"... It is nothing more than energy, plain and simple... It can no more be called a consciousness than the electricity that runs through my lightbulb, or the heat that comes off of my Hot Pocket can be called a consciousness...

What creates "us" is how our human machine uses the energy it contains... Without the function of the body, that energy is nothing more than plain old, purposeless energy...

Once the body stops using the energy, of course that energy must go somewhere (and it does, through heat radiation, and the matter that remains is decomposed by bacteria and such... they turn our dead matter into energy for them to use), but that does not mean that the energy has to be something...

A bleak outlook on life? Only if you're a religiously minded person... For us non-believers, it's just an easily acceptable fact of reality...

i may not be a non-believer.but im not such a fool as to not believe in something beyond death.ask yourself what the answer is,away from your preconcieved notions,away from your fear of the unknown.ask yourself,is there something more.then youll find your answer.and that is the only answer you need to know.

besides,every human culture ever cant be that wrong.

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

By sentence #.

1. I don't know. My assumption is that I will cease to exist as that seems the most logical conclusion in line with what we know, but I am willing to admit that anything is possible.

2. I believe so.

3. As the chemical bonds that hold the shape of my neurons degrade, the memories held within those structures and the 'mind' that encapsulates them will also degrade.

4. I have, thanks. Being an Atheist, or non-theist does not deny introspection. Quit assuming it does.

5. Then I die, your point?

6. Yes, it is quite possible. In fact, among all the possibilities I have heard so far, it is the most fitting of current physical evidence.

7. No. I am not so dogmatic as to deny the possibility, but there is NO evidence to suggest an existance of the afterlife.

besides,every human culture ever cant be that wrong.

You hold a lot of misplaced faith in humanity. Humans are quite capable of lying to themselves and others, quite capable of believing those lies, and quite capable of acting on them. We have 3 and a half pounds of Pattern Recognition wetware stuffed between our ears. We are quite capable of seeing patterns and 'truth' where it does not exist. Hell, there is even a name for this, it's called the 'placebo effect'. You can give a person a sugar pill, but if they believe it to be an aspirin, their body will act like it's aspirin.

How, though? How is it possible for your memory to just stop?

When we switch off a computer, do the contents of its memory go to some kind of afterlife? why are people different?

When we switch off a computer, do the contents of its memory go to some kind of afterlife? why are people different?
Ooh, let's make a practice of this.

Recommended Related Novel (? or play?): Cold Lazarus.

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

I think mind continues upon death. I think there is a heaven and a hell and other realms. I also think that this is the best realm to be in now, as a human. I think there are more than the two choices of heaven and hell upon death. It is possible to end up in those situations and it is possible not to.

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

Physical laws suggest that the bio-electric energy generated by the human brain doesn't just cease. However, with no external perception, the most likely result is a self-induced universe of internal perception. Such perception would be decoupled from linear time and could last a moment or an eternity. This universe of perception is based entirely on the mentality of the person involved.

What this means is that Whatever you believe happens and that you deserve will happen. Atheists go nowhere. Their internal universe collapses as soon as it forms. Judeo-christians go to either Heaven or Hell. Christ said it quite clearly. If you believe in me, you won't die. You'll have eternal life. As many possible perceptions exist as belief systems(whether mass-marketed or not) exist. Pretty basic, really.

besides,every human culture ever cant be that wrong.

human cultures have all completely different ideas. Many think there is a hell and/or a heaven; some prefer reincarnation, etc. In any case, most of them are wrong ;)

Physical laws suggest that the bio-electric energy generated by the human brain doesn't just cease. However, with no external perception, the most likely result is a self-induced universe of internal perception. Such perception would be decoupled from linear time and could last a moment or an eternity. This universe of perception is based entirely on the mentality of the person involved.

What this means is that Whatever you believe happens and that you deserve will happen. Atheists go nowhere. Their internal universe collapses as soon as it forms. Judeo-christians go to either Heaven or Hell. Christ said it quite clearly. If you believe in me, you won't die. You'll have eternal life. As many possible perceptions exist as belief systems(whether mass-marketed or not) exist. Pretty basic, really.


you have to come with more than that... cause it is not really a scientific fact you're talking about ;)
believing in something requires imagination, therefore energy, and you will soon have no more energy, cause your brain decays. So, no, there is no afterlife imo =)

you have to come with more than that... cause it is not really a scientific fact you're talking about ;)
believing in something requires imagination, therefore energy, and you will soon have no more energy, cause your brain decays. So, no, there is no afterlife imo =)

'Soon'? How long is soon? HOw long is soon when time becomes meaningless?

The several minutes of neural activity upon death can contain eternity.

besides,every human culture ever cant be that wrong.

There is one thing that causes every human culture pain and fear:

The one universal truth in life, death...

Not only is it natural for people to fear their own death, it is also natural for people to feel pain that their loved ones have died...

So, belief in an afterlife doesn't have to stem from some subconscious knowledge of a truth... But just from the universal dislike of death... An afterlife is a safety blanket against fear of dying, and against the pain of losing someone...

So it's very easy to see that nearly all human cultures believe in some form of afterlife (be it the Heaven/Hell kind, or the reincarnation kind, or the join the Tao kind, etc)... Because all humans face death, and need this belief to strengthen them against it (generally speaking, of course... we don't all need this false security)...

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist? What will happen to your memory, of your mind?

Seriously, think about it. What if you died? Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop? Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?

Do you remember before you were born? Me Either. When you die you are gone.

I am a Materialist Atheist, I will just leave it at that. :p

Physical laws suggest that the bio-electric energy generated by the human brain doesn't just cease. However, with no external perception, the most likely result is a self-induced universe of internal perception. Such perception would be decoupled from linear time and could last a moment or an eternity. This universe of perception is based entirely on the mentality of the person involved.

What this means is that Whatever you believe happens and that you deserve will happen. Atheists go nowhere. Their internal universe collapses as soon as it forms. Judeo-christians go to either Heaven or Hell. Christ said it quite clearly. If you believe in me, you won't die. You'll have eternal life. As many possible perceptions exist as belief systems(whether mass-marketed or not) exist. Pretty basic, really.


Damn you Lunatic Goofballs! How is it that you so often post the very thing I want to post! I read your words and likes "That's it! Why bother now!".

It's that placebo effect thing previously mentioned. If you want to believe it enough, it will happen. So if you TRULY believe that effect X will happen when your body ceases functioning then it probably will.

I've said it before - there are only two things I'm sure of: I think therefore I am, and life is suffering. Leaving the second personal surety alone, the first part doesn't change just because the vessel I currently inhabit stops functioning.

On the other hand, I could be full of shit, completely wrong and everything just goes black. But that would be an awful waste of a life times worth of experience and energy and not very fun to contemplate. So I'll stick with uncertain continuation.

LG, I'd love to get together and have a beer with ya sometimes. If you're anything like your posts you'd be a kick to hang out with. :D

edit:
Hell, I'm gonna get ripped to shreads by all you atheists out there. Oh, well. Bite me!

I've said it before - there are only two things I'm sure of: I think therefore I am, and life is suffering. Leaving the second personal surety alone, the first part doesn't change just because the vessel I currently inhabit stops functioning.

The crucial bit here is how you define "think"...lol

"I think, therefore I am" also applies to us atheists... As long as we are thinking, we exist...

But again, it comes down to what "thinking" is...

To us, thinking is nothing more than the biochemical reactions in our brain cells... So, as long as that is functioning, we are... As soon as it stops, we aren't...

Basically, to us, that first part does change when the vessel we currently inhabit ceases to function... Our thinking relies on the functioning of that vessel...

If you define the human mind/consciousness as something more, then your stance is correct...

Of course, the above is all rather obvious, but I figured it should be pointed out for the sake of discussion...lol

Any rational atheist won't "rip you apart"... Since the wise of us realize that our stance on things hinges as much on faith as the believers... I mean, I've got no real proof (observable evidence doesn't equal proof) that my mind is nothing more than a series of chemical reactions, yet I believe that is the case... There's your definition of faith...

every human culture ever cant be that wrong.

Humans have an amazing capacity to beleive that only they know the truth of something.

I'll find out what happens when I get there and not a moment sooner. If posible I will send back a postcard, this is however unlikely.

'Soon'? How long is soon? HOw long is soon when time becomes meaningless?

The several minutes of neural activity upon death can contain eternity.


if you say so :rolleyes:

I'd say that several minutes countain several minutes...


"I think therefore I am" (..) doesn't change just because the vessel I currently inhabit stops functioning.

I think therefore I am, not I think therefore I will be. You are not in the range of Descartes' famous quotation; Descartes only wanted to say that if he thinks, it means he exists in the present. Nothing else to search in that quotation.

(I hate when people use great mind to make them say what they want to prove, grmbl)

...

Any rational atheist won't "rip you apart"... Since the wise of us realize that our stance on things hinges as much on faith as the believers... I mean, I've got no real proof (observable evidence doesn't equal proof) that my mind is nothing more than a series of chemical reactions, yet I believe that is the case... There's your definition of faith...


Aww, now I feel all warm and fuzzy. Tanx!

I quite like the idea that there's a place to go to when you die, surely its a bit depressing to think that wen u die you'll just slip into oblivion?

Heaven is a nice idea depite the fact it cant b proved

I think therefore I am, not I think therefore I will be. You are not in the range of Descartes' famous quotation; Descartes only wanted to say that if he thinks, it means he exists in the present. Nothing else to search in that quotation.

(I hate when people use great mind to make them say what they want to prove, grmbl)


and it's gone.

What do you think will happen to you upon death? Will you just cease to exist?

yes.

What will happen to your memory, of your mind?
my personal memories, along with the rest of my cognition, will cease to exist.


Seriously, think about it.

why do you assume that i haven't already given it serious thought? i would argue that nobody who believes in an afterlife has given death sufficient thought, since they are in constant denial of the simple reality of their own existence, and have failed to come to terms with the most fundamental quality of life: it ends.


What if you died?

what do you mean, what if? i WILL die. so will you. it's just a matter of when.


Is it possible to think that your mind could just stop?

is it possible to think it will not, within the boundaries of reason and sanity? how can anybody be so full of themselves that they think their personal consciousness will endure forever (despite all evidence)? why do so many people exist in perpetual fear of death?


Do you think there is a heaven/ hell?
of course not. those are fables for little children.

The average person uses only 10% of its potential, and we know that unlocking just 2% more turns them into savants or psychics...

http://www.snopes.com/science/stats/10percnt.htm

Yeah. I tell you what I find scary. Is that I would be conscious for ever. I dont wanna live for ever.

Hmmm, Hell is starting to seem pretty bad, isn't it? Too bad Heaven is just as so.
I agree
the idea of heaven = the idea of hell

in my opinion the answer is oblivion, when your brain dies, your mind conscience and memory die

I would agree that anyone who says he understands nonexistence is lying, as, logically, it cannot be "experienced", and therefore cannot be described.
Indeed; how can one conceive of not conceiving? (In terms of thought, not reproduction :)). However, as several people have already pointed out, we simply didn't exist before we were born, so why not after we die? Just because we can't comprehend something does not mean it doesn't exist. Look at the concept of infinity - astronomers etc are virtually certain that the universe is infinite, but we can't comprehend what that must be like.

Grr...maybe bringing up the concept of infinity wasn't such a good idea - can we live infinitely? The simple answer is that no one really knows whether there's life after death. If there is a God/reincarnation/whatever, then I suppose we'll all find out sooner or later...if there isn't, then of course, it won't ultimately matter!

(I hate when people use great mind to make them say what they want to prove, grmbl)

dubito ergo cogito, cogito ergo sum, sum ergo Deus est.

The final point of Descartes is the existence of God, therefore I am inclined to believe that Descartes would support the affiramtion that there is something after life.

I quite like the idea that there's a place to go to when you die, surely its a bit depressing to think that wen u die you'll just slip into oblivion?

it seems to me that people often fail to enjoy their lives (or make something out of them) ant then comfort themslves with the idea that there might be something afterwards, in the hope that, if not now, maybe then, they'll do something with their existence.

it seems to me that people often fail to enjoy their lives (or make something out of them) ant then comfort themslves with the idea that there might be something afterwards, in the hope that, if not now, maybe then, they'll do something with their existence.
I agree, were as I say carpe diem

I agree, were as I say carpe diem

Unless you're a vampire, in which case you'll say Carpe Jugulum.

I'm not really sure what will happen to me before I die. I've had theories of course, some more welcome than others.
I'm young and healthy, either i'll live for a long enough time for me to be able to think about it more and do all I want to do before i die, or i'll die young, and won't have to worry about it. We are all going to die, knowing what will happen afterwards is not top on my list of priorities...not at the moment anyway.

How, though? How is it possible for your memory to just stop?

Memory resides in the brain. When your brain no longer functions (usually occurs at death), then your memory ceases to exist. Simple, no?

Unless you're a vampire, in which case you'll say Carpe Jugulum.

*snerk*

Memory resides in the brain. When your brain no longer functions (usually occurs at death), then your memory ceases to exist. Simple, no?
Ah, but when your computer no longer functions, is it not often possible to retrieve the data from within?

Ah, but when your computer no longer functions, is it not often possible to retrieve the data from within?

Hmmm

Ah, but when your computer no longer functions, is it not often possible to retrieve the data from within?

...when that data is stored in a "permanent" fashion such as the magnetic recording of a hard drive, or the grooves of an optical disk (CD, DVD, etc)... But when that data is stored in something that requires constant power to maintain such as RAM, that data is gone the instant the power is shut off (well, technically, there's an incredibly small moment before the electrons leave their places in which the data still exists after the power is shut off, but, meh)

I'm inclined to believe that our memory is much more like RAM than magnetic storage... Yes, thoughts and such would seem to create new neural pathways that ultimately change the physical make up of the brain (in the same way that magnetic recording alters the physical arrangement of the hard drive's surface, or the laser alters the physical shape of the metallic surface of a CD, etc) and would thus appear to be a permanent recording of that thought... But I say that without constant electrical stimulation, the relevance of that physical arrangement is lost, as is the ability of anything to "read" it...

Besides, the cells in the brain quickly die without the support of the body, which means that even if the memory was stored permanently, the medium is soon too corrupted to be read or accessed in any way...

But anyways, here's my dillemma for all of you "eternal paradise" people:

What is time? Well, essentially, it boils down to "the measure of change"... Time doesn't exist if nothing changes... There's no need for it... If everything remains exactly the same, you don't need to differentiate between now, and later... Now essentially is later... And vice versa...

Well, what about paradise? Paradise would likely be the most perfect place you can think of... Perfection is the state where nothing is better... So, a perfect thing has no need for change... If there is nothing better, it cannot change to improve... If it changes for the worse, then it is no longer perfect... So, a perfect thing can never change...

So, if time is change, and perfection can not change, then perfection can not have time...

Perfection can not exist, because it has no time in which to exist...

Hmmm...

(Heh, note that I'm only being half-serious with that stuff... I think it's kind of interesting to ponder, but it might not hold water logically or philosophically...lol)

Energy can never be created or destroyed. Humans - and everything else for that matter- are just differently organized forms of energy. Death is just a major point in the shifting from one form of energy to another. Even if the universe itself suffers "heat death" that is not destruction, but rather the return of all energy to a uniform, undifferentiated state. Our forms are ephemeral, but our essence is eternal.

Pretty. :)

There have been several studies, and people do remember aspects of thier previous lives. A study came from the University of Virginia (I think) and there was a lot of evidence collected in support if it.


A) Links, please?

B) If this is so, then why do several different people all "remember" being the same person?

Energy can never be created or destroyed. Humans - and everything else for that matter- are just differently organized forms of energy. Death is just a major point in the shifting from one form of energy to another. Even if the universe itself suffers "heat death" that is not destruction, but rather the return of all energy to a uniform, undifferentiated state.

True, energy does not disappear. After our death our corpse still holds just as much energy (/matter) as before, and it will gradually give up this energy in the process of decay. But that doesn't mean that we as persons don't stop existing.

Our forms are ephemeral, but our essence is eternal.

Eh essence? What's our essence? (esse = to be, so essence should be 'that which makes us be')

Anyway, in some strange way we are actually immortal. Cell's don't have to die, they just split up and live on in their product. As long as the environment sustains them, cells are immortal. When we die, most of our cells die because their environment (our body) doesn't sustain them anymore, except two: they are the cells we inherit from our parents (the egg, the seed). So in our bodies our parents actually live on, and in the bodies of our children we live on. Makes death a bit less dramatic :)

'Soon'? How long is soon? HOw long is soon when time becomes meaningless?

The several minutes of neural activity upon death can contain eternity.

I'm prepared to except that a humans sense of time is purely subjective, everyone knows that tedious or unpleasent activities seem to take forever and pleasurable ones go quickly. Also, that during times of great stress, like when you're about to have an accident everything seems to slow down, I've experienced this myself when I fell over skiing.

But, even if what you say is true, that as you're on the verge of death you think you're living forever, it's still not life after death. Just a dream that seems to never end, so any 'people' you might interact with in the afterlife are just a figment of your imagination? Seems like a poor mans excuse of an afterlife to me!

A) Links, please?

B) If this is so, then why do several different people all "remember" being the same person?

Here's a link to Dr. Ian Stevenson's page on the University of Viginia web
web (http://www.healthsystem.virginia.edu/internet/personalitystudies/)

And here's another link with some of his books and such (http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm)

to answer your second question, I can think of two possibilities, but this really isn't my field of expertise. One is that it is possible that people who are interviewed later in life, as adults, may have had enough time reading about other people to think that they are that person. Or, that people may have been similar people in a past life, for example, one person may have been Julius Ceasar and another Augustus Ceasar. I know that's a pretty crappy example, but it's the best I could think up on one cup of coffee.

I have a better one: two fireman named 'Bill' who fought the Great Chicago fire started by the cow. Does that make sense? Two different people who shared close enough experiences that could be the reason that they 'claim' to have been the same person.

I agree, were as I say carpe diem

Or Carpe Dime, which explains my deeply founded religious practice of checking phone booth change slots for forgotten coins.

I have 2 ideas -

1 - *GASP* Oblivion. Hell (pun unintended), I need some good sleep
2 - Think asssemtotes (math, when dealing with things that CANNOT equal zero, so it streches out.... Oi, just try to make a graph of y=1/x on a graphng calc and u will see what I mean). We exist infinatly on the edge of death. That is why "dare devil" type stuff appeals to us. We get that much closer to true infinite life.

And I can represent number 2 with math! W00t!
2) Y = subjective length of time
X = objective length of time
y = 1/x

Physical laws suggest that the bio-electric energy generated by the human brain doesn't just cease. However, with no external perception, the most likely result is a self-induced universe of internal perception. Such perception would be decoupled from linear time and could last a moment or an eternity. This universe of perception is based entirely on the mentality of the person involved.

...You ever read the book Hard Boiled Wonderland and the End of the World? :p