NationStates Jolt Archive

Damn, I found it!
I came across a song, written in 1989, that seems to perfectly describe the country we Americans are living in today!!

(LET'S PLAY) U.S.A. - by Peter Schilling

Where, oh where, is Mickey Mouse?
Alive and well in the White House.
What's the word on common sense?
It's been sitting on the fence.

Have you seen the mastermind?
Someone's bashed it from behind.
Leaders, saints and honest men.
What's become of them today?

Let's play...
U.S.A.
Let's play...
U.S.A.
How I love the life I lead.
Can not think and can not read.
Watch our values slip away,
Play the game of U.S.A.

Even though we lost the race
To get the first man into space,
We will be the first country
To run automatically.
Soon the robots we create
Will be starring on the Great White Way.

Let's play...
U.S.A.
Let's play...
U.S.A.
How I love the life I lead.
Can not think and can not read.
Watch our values slip away,
Play the game of U.S.A.

Won't it be a lot of fun,
Every man would own a gun.
Shoot the ones whose point of view
Makes a point that bothers you.

Go on and pollute the land,
Clean air will be sold in cans.
Did you hear the masterplan?
One nation under DisneyLand.

Let's play...
U.S.A.
Let's play...
U.S.A.
How I love the life I lead.
Can not think and can not read.
Watch our values slip away,
Play the game of U.S.A.

Let's see, he whines about "our values slip away", yet the last time I checked a core tenet of our country was for every man to own a gun. Interesting paradox there. Besides which, there are very few "leaders saints and honest men" in the world, or even in american history. It's obvious he can't think by the nature of the song.



Even though we lost the race
To get the first man into space,
We will be the first country
To run automatically.

Pink Floyd said this better.

That's quite hilarious! :D

As I don't live in America, I wouldn't know if it described the place well or not. But here's a good song to describe the world we live in: Amerika by Rammstein. The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.

Ever heard Randy Newman's "Political Science"? I'm sitting in with a band at a Christmas party in a couple of weeks, and we're playing it. Here are the lyrics.

Political Science
Lyrics by randy Newman


No one likes us
I don't know why.
We may not be perfect
But heaven knows we try.
But all around even our old friends put us down.
Let's drop the big one and see what happens.

We give them money
But are they grateful?
No they're spiteful
And they're hateful.
They don't respect us so let's surprise them;
We'll drop the big one and pulverize them.

Now Asia's crowded
And Europe's too old.
Africa's far too hot,
And Canada's too cold.
And South America stole our name.
Let's drop the big one; there'll be no one left to blame us.

Bridge:
We'll save Australia;
Don't wanna hurt no kangaroo.
We'll build an all-American amusement park there;
They've got surfing, too.

Well, boom goes London,
And boom Paris.
More room for you
And more room for me.
And every city the whole world round
Will just be another American town.
Oh, how peaceful it'll be;
We'll set everybody free;
You'll have Japanese kimonos, baby,
There'll be Italian shoes for me.
They all hate us anyhow,
So let's drop the big one now.
Let's drop the big one now.

Ever heard Randy Newman's "Political Science"? I'm sitting in with a band at a Christmas party in a couple of weeks, and we're playing it. Here are the lyrics.

Political Science
Lyrics by randy Newman


No one likes us
I don't know why.
We may not be perfect
But heaven knows we try.
But all around even our old friends put us down.
Let's drop the big one and see what happens.

We give them money
But are they grateful?
No they're spiteful
And they're hateful.
They don't respect us so let's surprise them;
We'll drop the big one and pulverize them.

Now Asia's crowded
And Europe's too old.
Africa's far too hot,
And Canada's too cold.
And South America stole our name.
Let's drop the big one; there'll be no one left to blame us.

Bridge:
We'll save Australia;
Don't wanna hurt no kangaroo.
We'll build an all-American amusement park there;
They've got surfing, too.

Well, boom goes London,
And boom Paris.
More room for you
And more room for me.
And every city the whole world round
Will just be another American town.
Oh, how peaceful it'll be;
We'll set everybody free;
You'll have Japanese kimonos, baby,
There'll be Italian shoes for me.
They all hate us anyhow,
So let's drop the big one now.
Let's drop the big one now.

LOL. Sounds like he's frustrated with the world glaring at us all the time, heh. Loved it.

As I don't live in America, I wouldn't know if it described the place well or not. But here's a good song to describe the world we live in: Amerika by Rammstein. The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.
Well heres the thing: Thats not America's problem. American Corporations make money through their global presence. Its not our fault the world buys our products, buys our culture, buys our food. If you have a problem with it, find an alternative, otherwise, too bad.

Anyone know a site where I can download either of these?

Well heres the thing: Thats not America's problem. American Corporations make money through their global presence. Its not our fault the world buys our products, buys our culture, buys our food. If you have a problem with it, find an alternative, otherwise, too bad.

But there is no alternitve becuase your American markets chokes anyone even atemting to resist or create an alternitve. The reason that people are so angry with America these days is that they let their economic dominance become cultural dominance. America is stiffiling the rest of the worlds creativity and only it can stop this.

As I don't live in America, I wouldn't know if it described the place well or not. But here's a good song to describe the world we live in: Amerika by Rammstein. The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.
*pats* I V Stalin on shoulder*
Good. Thats the spirit. :)

Here's "Political Science" http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/political.php
And here's "Amerika" http://www.zvuki.ru/M/P/30577 Scroll down to the playlist and find it.

But there is no alternitve becuase your American markets chokes anyone even atemting to resist or create an alternitve. The reason that people are so angry with America these days is that they let their economic dominance become cultural dominance. America is stiffiling the rest of the worlds creativity and only it can stop this.
That is easily the most absurd piece of economic jibberish I have ever heard.

What happened to Japan? China? India?

What happened to Thai electronics? Irish electronic? Belgian arms manufacturing? German manufacturing?

For God sake, America's market percentage (total American products as a percentage of the world's) has gone down steadily since the early 1950s (yes this includes a transit from a manufacturing to a service economy, but the point remains).

Are you seriously suggesting that American corporations have the power to stop well thought out products from hitting the market? If that is the case, then how come every nation still has its own companies?

Our economic dominance comes from both historical reasons (explosion in market share following WW1 and WW2. See: Ford, GMC, etc), but also from brilliant marketing and development (see: Microsoft).

American cultural dominance can only occur when people buy into American culture. Its not America's fault that the world buys Hollywood movies, eats a American super-corporations food chains, buy American corporations prescription drugs, automobiles, or processed foods. Its not America's fault that the world buys its music. Its not America's fault that the world buys American clothing.

Countries do this because American corporations are smart. They advertise well, they price cheaply enough to be popular, they are well made. You cannot be dominant if your not selling good products. If other countries aren't making quality products, that is really their problem. You want to say that situations like Bridas being bumped out of Afghanistan by UNICO because UNICO was able to present a united American-Russian-Saudi front is a bad thing? No, its called market strength.

To claim America is "stiffiling the rest of the world's creativity" is so...absurdely ignorant, I cannot even begin to imagine what type of economics classes (if any) you have taken to have such wild ideas. Honestly, you need to get in some better classes.

On this topic, surely "American Idiot" by Green Day, is also an appropriate song.

Countries do this because American corporations are smart. They advertise well, they price cheaply enough to be popular, they are well made. You cannot be dominant if your not selling good products. If other countries aren't making quality products, that is really their problem. You want to say that situations like Bridas being bumped out of Afghanistan by UNICO because UNICO was able to present a united American-Russian-Saudi front is a bad thing? No, its called market strength.



The vast majority of your post is correct, except for one thing: Your country uses and sometimes abuses its political strengh to make sure that US companies gain over their competitors. There is that old story of how Saudi Arabia was going to buy some Airbus planes, then Bill Clinton called the Saudi, reminded them of who kept the Saudis in power. The Saudi then canceled their orders of Airbus planes, and ordered boeing planes.
The United States government has admitted to using commercial espionage, for instance using surveillance of phone calls to determine that a French competitor of a US firm was bribing Brazilian officials to obtain an air traffic control radar contract (it was later revealed that the US firm was also bribing officials). It is generally believed that most large intelligence agencies are involved in the practice. A commission of the European Parliament suspects that ECHELON, a communications espionage system operated by the NSA and agencies of the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia and New Zealand, is used for political espionage and occasionally to help American companies against European competitors.

Offcourse, other countries aren't innocent (FRANCE!!) on this; But the US has simply exagerated, especially in the usage of ECHELON.. gee, you spy your own friends?!

Ok perhaps I am being a little to harsh. There ARE alternitves but you produce the most stuff. BUT America is far better at pushing it out across the world. And its not just produce, culture is the bigest export and this is why people get cross. You push out your ideas and very few people get to push any other ideas back. So much media comes from the US to the ROTW but very little goes the other way.

The vast majority of your post is correct, except for one thing: Your country uses and sometimes abuses its political strengh to make sure that US companies gain over their competitors. There is that old story of how Saudi Arabia was going to buy some Airbus planes, then Bill Clinton called the Saudi, reminded them of who kept the Saudis in power. The Saudi then canceled their orders of Airbus planes, and ordered boeing planes.

This is actually a common myth. The Saudis themselves were the ones who changed the order because Boeing significantly dropped its prices and after Clinton gave them an okay on making such a large deal with Saudi Arabia, one which might adversely effect Israel. A better example for your stance would be America in conjuction with the CARs, and the oil companies attempting to build a pipeline therein.


The United States government has admitted to using commercial espionage, for instance using surveillance of phone calls to determine that a French competitor of a US firm was bribing Brazilian officials to obtain an air traffic control radar contract (it was later revealed that the US firm was also bribing officials).
Actually industrial espionage is usually conducted by US firms themselves, I find this anecdote highly unlikely, unless it was the case that the US was tapping phones on a corrupt set of officials for whatever reason (and it could be any one of many). Remember also, what we call bribery is, in most developing parts of the world, totally acceptable. When the Saudi's visited the Taliban in the mid 90s, they left behind a series of luxury jeeps for top Taliban officials. The ATT from Pakistan to Afghanistan routinely bribes all involved officials to keep its illegal smuggling operations going.


It is generally believed that most large intelligence agencies are involved in the practice. A commission of the European Parliament suspects that ECHELON, a communications espionage system operated by the NSA and agencies of the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia and New Zealand, is used for political espionage and occasionally to help American companies against European competitors.

Offcourse, other countries aren't innocent (FRANCE!!) on this; But the US has simply exagerated, especially in the usage of ECHELON.. gee, you spy your own friends?!
Everyone spies on everyone else. Hoover was chief of the FBI as long as he was for one reason: He had dozens of file cabinets full of every black mark against every politician in Washington and beyond for his entire tenure. No one dared go against him.

Most intelligence agencies spy on everyone. America is no different. We spy on everyone, and they spy on us. Its just how the world works today, and has worked for decades. What must be remembered is that ECHELON was first and foremost a defense system. It was meant to share intelligence about potential problems. When American companies use espionage, its usually because they hire old CIA/FBI agents (see: Every major oil/weapons company in the US) to run an intelligence...I mean Security...department for them. This is a new part of the Corporation game.

Ok perhaps I am being a little to harsh. There ARE alternitves but you produce the most stuff. BUT America is far better at pushing it out across the world. And its not just produce, culture is the bigest export and this is why people get cross. You push out your ideas and very few people get to push any other ideas back. So much media comes from the US to the ROTW but very little goes the other way.
America is no longer the main manufacturing nation in the world, and we haven't been for decades. China and India both produce a vastly larger amount of products than America does. America's real economic dominance is that we A) Have a service economy, and B) promote international corporations. Its not that we produce the most, its that our country owns the most of what gets produced, and the factories that produce it. Culture is in and of itself not an export. America exports: Its music, its sports, its food, its clothing, and its entertainment directly. We cannot force other nations to buy these products, but they do.

As for the media, there really is no Media superpower in the world because of the media's inherent locality complex. Media rarely expands beyond the national level, as local issues are what drives popularity, hurting international media. Unless you mean media as in video and audio products, in which case yes, America does produce a huge volume of this type of entertainment. At the same time, Bollywood in India is a massive film maker. Germany, England, and France all produce huge volumes of film. At the same time, almost every nation in the world produces its own music. American products can supplement, but never subjugate those local based products.

The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.
In that case, convince your stupid friends to quit eating at Mickey D's and wearing Abercrombie & Fitch. Damn, everyone complains about the "Americanization" of the world, without registering that they are part of the new culture. I, as an American, am more than willing to let other people bury their own culture in order to wear the latest American fashions. Puts money in my pocket. Besides, no one makes you buy our products. So don't be a fucking moron. If it says "made in U.S.A, Taiwan, China, Korea, etc." its probably American. AHAHAHAH!

As I don't live in America, I wouldn't know if it described the place well or not. But here's a good song to describe the world we live in: Amerika by Rammstein. The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.
True its a re hash of some swedish group and i think they nicked it as well its true though :D

In that case, convince your stupid friends to quit eating at Mickey D's and wearing Abercrombie & Fitch. Damn, everyone complains about the "Americanization" of the world, without registering that they are part of the new culture. I, as an American, am more than willing to let other people bury their own culture in order to wear the latest American fashions. Puts money in my pocket. Besides, no one makes you buy our products. So don't be a fucking moron. If it says "made in U.S.A, Taiwan, China, Korea, etc." its probably American. AHAHAHAH!
As a fellow American I profusely apologize for the post quoted above and would redirect offended persons to my two part explanation earlier in this post. Again, I apologize for this...argument by a fellow American.

As a fellow American I profusely apologize for the post quoted above and would redirect offended persons to my two part explanation earlier in this post. Again, I apologize for this...argument by a fellow American.

I'd like to say, as a non-American, that if more people were this rational the forums wouldn't keep turning into flaming-matches

well done to Tremalkier

LOL. Sounds like he's frustrated with the world glaring at us all the time, heh. Loved it.
You have no idea of the concept of sarcasm, do you?

As a fellow American I profusely apologize for the post quoted above and would redirect offended persons to my two part explanation earlier in this post. Again, I apologize for this...argument by a fellow American.
Oh, for God's sake quit trying to be so damned politically correct about this. It is quite simple. If you buy American products, then you are part of the problem. America is not the problem, the problem is that people are gorging on the products of our culture.

By the way, your two part explanation is, unfortunately, worthless. Simply put, I don't know where you got your information from. The USA still holds the position as the leading industrial nation in the world. In every measurable capacity the USA outproduces China, which is currently experiencing a great deal of trouble supplying electricity for itself, and India, which consists of a few cities surrounded by millions of acres of nothing. Granted, China and India have higher industrial growth rates, but they are so far behind currently due to a lack of simple efficiency that it will be decades before they catch up. Not to mention that you failed to grasp an important fact. In order to constitute a strong industrial power, a nation must be able to produce enough to supply its own people, or at least be able to import sufficient quantities of needed goods. However, China and India have such quickly growing populations that they simply cannot keep up. They are not growing quickly enough to achieve equilibrium.

And America does, unfortunately, have an enormous media influence on the rest of the world, because media does refer to music as well as movies you twit. When you can go to Kuwait and see girls dressing like Britney Spears, America is influencing other nations. Now take your ridiculous analysis and use for the only thing it is good for: toilet paper.

gee, you spy your own friends?!

everybody spies on each other these days.

I'd like to say, as a non-American, that if more people were this rational the forums wouldn't keep turning into flaming-matches

well done to Tremalkier
And you fail to realize, all of you, that my post was not an argument. What it did consist of was a quick explanation of why the rest of the world is turning into the USA. It is because all of you buy our products, and then bitch about the fact that other people buy them. Either don't buy the damn things, or quit complaining about them.

At the same time, Bollywood in India is a massive film maker. Germany, England, and France all produce huge volumes of film. At the same time, almost every nation in the world produces its own music. American products can supplement, but never subjugate those local based products.

But very little of Bollywood or European cinema gets beyond Europe or Indea. Why? Becuase America buys up everything. America pumps its culture throught the world and it does it to such an exent that no one can do the same with their own peoples culture. Americas economic dominance has become cultural dominance. I am not complaining about American cultural content. I like Friends/Star Trek etc they are all good. But so much of it going so far across the world is a problem. Tell me American's, whats the last significent British TV show to make it to your shores most recently. "MI5" You heard of it (the TV show not the organisation, known as Spooks over here)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HadesRulesMuch
In that case, convince your stupid friends to quit eating at Mickey D's and wearing Abercrombie & Fitch. Damn, everyone complains about the "Americanization" of the world, without registering that they are part of the new culture. I, as an American, am more than willing to let other people bury their own culture in order to wear the latest American fashions. Puts money in my pocket. Besides, no one makes you buy our products. So don't be a fucking moron. If it says "made in U.S.A, Taiwan, China, Korea, etc." its probably American. AHAHAHAH!

Quote:
As a fellow American I profusely apologize for the post quoted above and would redirect offended persons to my two part explanation earlier in this post. Again, I apologize for this...argument by a fellow American.


:headbang: Why would you apologize for something that is true? Obviously, if American companies were losing money by selling their products overseas, they would call it a day and stop the 'Americanization' of the world. However, it is up to the rest of the world to stop this, not America. If the majority of of other countries really didn't like our culture they would send us packing.

american culture sucks half of england is obese because of it the hamburger has DOUBLED in size and its not the publics choice if we go to mackie d,s or not because there the only fast food restaurants down the streets these days
:mad:

It's not that the world's media doesn't reach the US; it's that the World media is bought by American companies, Americanized, then redistributed across the world. Examples: Anime/Manga (you can't tell me American isn't different from Japanese) and TV shows like "Who Wants To Be A Millionaire" or "American Idol". Music is really the only place where original artists have a chance. We listen to Elton John (well, I don't, but y'know) and Ramstein.

american culture sucks half of england is obese because of it the hamburger has DOUBLED in size and its not the publics choice if we go to mackie d,s or not because there the only fast food restaurants down the streets these days
:mad:

::chuckle:: Hmm, I was in the UK for a month about a year and a half ago. Went to the typical tourists spots and such, plus little towns like Woodhouse Eves to visit an old friend. Didn't step foot in a single fast food place the whole time. Avoided the Burger Kings and McDonald's like the plague. I ended up eating a lot of curry and a lot of French food in the bigger towns. The smaller towns had fewer choices, but there always was a local place to get a meal.

If you think it isn't your choice, you aren't looking hard enough for an alternative. Either that or you've succumbed to the problem of: "it sure is quick and easy, even if I don't like it." Of course, if given the choice of curry for lunch five days a week year on end (or god forbid, steak and kidney pie,) I'd probably be tempted for a quarter pounder now and then too.

Oh, for God's sake quit trying to be so damned politically correct about this. It is quite simple. If you buy American products, then you are part of the problem. America is not the problem, the problem is that people are gorging on the products of our culture.

I am actually one of the most heavily anti-PC people on this Forum. I believe it to be a worthless and unnecessary piece of our modern culture. The problem isn't buying American products, in fact, there isn't really a problem at all. People buy our products for reasons ranging from price, to quality, to the fact they just like it. There is no such thing as "gorging on the products of our culture". If they like the products, let them buy them.


By the way, your two part explanation is, unfortunately, worthless. Simply put, I don't know where you got your information from. The USA still holds the position as the leading industrial nation in the world. In every measurable capacity the USA outproduces China, which is currently experiencing a great deal of trouble supplying electricity for itself, and India, which consists of a few cities surrounded by millions of acres of nothing. Granted, China and India have higher industrial growth rates, but they are so far behind currently due to a lack of simple efficiency that it will be decades before they catch up. Not to mention that you failed to grasp an important fact. In order to constitute a strong industrial power, a nation must be able to produce enough to supply its own people, or at least be able to import sufficient quantities of needed goods. However, China and India have such quickly growing populations that they simply cannot keep up. They are not growing quickly enough to achieve equilibrium.


America has not been the leading Manufacturing country in the world for years, as I have stated before. This information is collaborated by any number of releases and studies by the State department as well as non-public organizations. The US is the leading COMMERCIAL nation in the world. We sell the most products, move the largest volumes of materials, etc. We do not produce most of what we sell. That is why there is all of this "offshore production" hysteria. In terms of raw output of products, China has been outproducing us since their major manufacturing infrastructure was created around 3 decades ago. Even before that raw American production had been dropping since Eisenhower. To constitute a strong MANUFACTURING (see: India, China) power, a nation must merely produce large volumes of product. To constitute a major COMMERCIAL (see: US, Japan) power, a nation must merely sell those products, and own their production. Your argument regarding populations does not actually have anything to do with economic power. I heavily suggest you take some economic courses and see the varying types of economies in the world, from manufacturing, to service, to agricultural, etc, and the various conditions those names imply.


And America does, unfortunately, have an enormous media influence on the rest of the world, because media does refer to music as well as movies you twit. When you can go to Kuwait and see girls dressing like Britney Spears, America is influencing other nations. Now take your ridiculous analysis and use for the only thing it is good for: toilet paper.
Media to be exact means entertainment and news. In terms of News, the traditional meaning of media, America has almost no world wide influence behind its economic papers, such as the Wall Street Journal. In terms of entertainment, my argument speaks for itself. We provide a huge volume of music and film, however that only supplements most nations indigeneous production. For instance, almost every foreign country has its own indigeneous television stations. Some are American owned, but that is relatively rare. When you go to Kuwait and see girls like Britney Spears, you better realize that your actually in one of Kuwait's worker complexes, as the indigeneous population for the most part follows a the same dress policy as Saudi Arabia, though it is of course significantly less stringent. Their culture still defines much of their clothing.

The fact is, your argument is not backed up by fact, nor does it show a real knowledge of any of the situations you wrote of, as such my countering of your points is completely ab absurdo. Until you have read the necessary literature, and studied those situations, you are in no way capable of judging my analysis, which is based on knowledge of the situations on the ground.

american culture sucks half of england is obese because of it the hamburger has DOUBLED in size and its not the publics choice if we go to mackie d,s or not because there the only fast food restaurants down the streets these days
:mad:

Not so! My town doesn't even have an american-owned fast food chain resteraunt. It also claims to have the highest pub-to-person ratio in England! :D

But very little of Bollywood or European cinema gets beyond Europe or Indea. Why? Becuase America buys up everything. America pumps its culture throught the world and it does it to such an exent that no one can do the same with their own peoples culture. Americas economic dominance has become cultural dominance. I am not complaining about American cultural content. I like Friends/Star Trek etc they are all good. But so much of it going so far across the world is a problem. Tell me American's, whats the last significent British TV show to make it to your shores most recently. "MI5" You heard of it (the TV show not the organisation, known as Spooks over here)?
No the cause of Bollywood's lack of success is that it is:
A) Not marketed abroad with any regularity
and
B) Does not have any appeal beyond the culture that it is centered in, as opposed to Hollywood's pan-Western appeal.

As for British shows making it to America, I point you towards the fact that I have on my TV, BBC America on right now (Monty Python, how could I resist). Other shows that have made the jump include Whose Line is it Anyway, and any number of reality shows. Whose Line is it Anyway has already had enough success to spawn the birth of a now widely known celibrity in Wayne Brady.

Again, America cannot be faulted that other nations find its shows interesting enough to bring them into their own borders. The fact that massively popular shows like Friends, Seinfeld, The Simpsons, etc are shipped abroad is a testament to their originality and mass appeal, not to any American conspiracy.

As I don't live in America, I wouldn't know if it described the place well or not. But here's a good song to describe the world we live in: Amerika by Rammstein. The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.

Then stop it yourselves instead of blaming us. You're the ones buying into it.

american culture sucks half of england is obese because of it the hamburger has DOUBLED in size and its not the publics choice if we go to mackie d,s or not because there the only fast food restaurants down the streets these days
:mad:

*cough* personal responsibility *cough*

Then stop it yourselves instead of blaming us. You're the ones buying into it.
Si finis bonus est, totum bonum erit.

If the end is good, everything will be good

Not so! My town doesn't even have an american-owned fast food chain resteraunt. It also claims to have the highest pub-to-person ratio in England! :D
That good sir, is a town to be proud of.

Again, America cannot be faulted that other nations find its shows interesting enough to bring them into their own borders. The fact that massively popular shows like Friends, Seinfeld, The Simpsons, etc are shipped abroad is a testament to their originality and mass appeal, not to any American conspiracy.

so are you then suggesting that if america were to make nuclear bombs, or something that appears more harmful than movies and shows, and other countries "bring them into their own borders" that america isnt at all to blame? be it nukes or tv shows nothing enters another country without the 2 nations coperating with eachother which in my opinion would put blame on both of them. as for corpations like mcdonalds coming into forign markets, i dont know how they do it, i dont know how anyone could allow a horrible fast food chain like that into their town or city. (im a vegitarian brutally apposed to fast food, other than the odd sub sandwhich place). dont you think america should have to practise social responsibility even if it is providing quality entertainment or "quality" foods at cheap american prices? i'll admit that im a canadian and i havent taken any ecconomics class, but that also means that i havent been corrupted from such "education".

Tremalkier, i look forward to your reply as i find your points legitamit and from a much different prespective and walk of life than my ideologies. i assume you've watched "super size me" if you havent i highly recommend it. i also highly recommend "The Corperation" i downloaded it and watched it (3 hour long documentary) and it blew my mind. i was never for big business or globalization but now i oppose it. feel free to chew up my post just be nice about it im not on here to be trashed im just trying to discuss.

As an American, I concur. A culture of ignorance has been cultivated and encouraged. Our downfall is our own.

As a fellow American I profusely apologize for the post quoted above and would redirect offended persons to my two part explanation earlier in this post. Again, I apologize for this...argument by a fellow American.
See, now that's just sad. especially since the bulk of what he said is more or less true.

It's not that the world's media doesn't reach the US; it's that the World media is bought by American companies, Americanized, then redistributed across the world. Examples: Anime/Manga (you can't tell me American isn't different from Japanese) and TV shows like "Who Wants To Be A Millionaire" or "American Idol". Music is really the only place where original artists have a chance. We listen to Elton John (well, I don't, but y'know) and Ramstein.
*Sighs* If people didn't like the TV shows than they wouldn't watch. If they didn't watch then the TV station would change their programming to suit their customers wants. Unless, of course, the customers are weak-willed sheeple who can be led around by the nose.

Where, oh where is Mickey mouse?
alive and well in the White House.

Where, oh where is Mighty Mouse?
he is alive and well in the White House.
Santa- Nita.

True its a re hash of some swedish group and i think they nicked it as well its true though :D

If you really want anti-capitalist songs, listen to The (International) Noise Conspiracy (could be them you're talking about, as they're Swedish), or others like them. Rammstein aren't really anti-capitalist, they're just tongue-in-cheek, but with a good point.

Well heres the thing: Thats not America's problem. American Corporations make money through their global presence. Its not our fault the world buys our products, buys our culture, buys our food. If you have a problem with it, find an alternative, otherwise, too bad.

I don't have a problem with American companies, or the American culture. I'm not criticising them. I'm criticising the rest of the world. It doesn't *need* America. If every country became autarkic (ie. had a self-sufficient economy), then the world would be in a far better shape. I realise that this isn't going to happen, but countries allow American influences to pervade their cultures far more than they need to. One thing that I do have a problem with about American companies is that they don't realise quite how much they're eroding other cultures, or they do, but they don't care because they're just interested in their profit margins.

In that case, convince your stupid friends to quit eating at Mickey D's and wearing Abercrombie & Fitch. Damn, everyone complains about the "Americanization" of the world, without registering that they are part of the new culture. I, as an American, am more than willing to let other people bury their own culture in order to wear the latest American fashions. Puts money in my pocket. Besides, no one makes you buy our products. So don't be a fucking moron. If it says "made in U.S.A, Taiwan, China, Korea, etc." its probably American. AHAHAHAH!

I'm not sure any of my friends *do* eat at Mickey D's. And none of them wear Abercrombie & Fitch. I realise these are just examples, but the only American things I'm really interested in are music, and then not to a great extent, and....that's it. I have no interest in fashion. The vast majority of the stuff I wear isn't American. Either that, or, considering the price I pay for them, the shops make a loss. You can't make a profit on a pair of jeans when you're selling them for 20p (I shit ye not). I'm not a fucking moron; I appreciate that Americanisation (it's an 's', not a fucking 'z'!) isn't going to be stopped in my lifetime (sadly). I respect America a lot. It's the main reason for the global economy we have today (even if I think a global economy is a bad idea - it provides me with a lot of stuff I wouldn't otherwise have, so I can't really complain). But it doesn't mean we have to live with America everywhere.
And I do buy alternatives; it's not difficult at all. I currently live in Leicester. The nearest McDonald's to me is 30 seconds walk from at least 3 places where I can get a) cheaper, b) tastier, c) more filling, and d) larger meals. This is the case in most places in the UK. People who say they have no choice are talking bollocks.

Capitalism really does suck. If only people were sensible, and weren't brainwashed from an early age that money is the only important thing in life.

Where, oh where is Mickey mouse?
alive and well in the White House.

Where, oh where is Mighty Mouse?
he is alive and well in the White House.
Santa- Nita.


Nope, can't see Duhhhh-bya wearing red tights and a yellow cape "Here I come, to savve the dayyyy" in spite of his cheerleading days at Yale, I can't see the tights and cape.

Mighty Asshole is more like it, when talking about Bush.

::chuckle:: Hmm, I was in the UK for a month about a year and a half ago. Went to the typical tourists spots and such, plus little towns like Woodhouse Eves to visit an old friend. Didn't step foot in a single fast food place the whole time. Avoided the Burger Kings and McDonald's like the plague. I ended up eating a lot of curry and a lot of French food in the bigger towns. The smaller towns had fewer choices, but there always was a local place to get a meal.

If you think it isn't your choice, you aren't looking hard enough for an alternative. Either that or you've succumbed to the problem of: "it sure is quick and easy, even if I don't like it." Of course, if given the choice of curry for lunch five days a week year on end (or god forbid, steak and kidney pie,) I'd probably be tempted for a quarter pounder now and then too.

I was in Bangkok, Thailand, about two years ago, for three weeks. I'd planned on this trip for years, and finally, I made it happen. I had always wanted to go to Thailand, to see the Grand Palace, the old Buddhist temples...and I got to see it all. Including Patpong, and the Floating Market. the only thing I didn't get to see was The Bridge Over The River Kwai...the tour was booked every day but one, for the entire time I was there, and I already had a different tour prepaid and booked for that day.

While I was there, though, I strenuously avoided the Mickey D's and the Pizza Hut that were around. i'll admit, curiousity drove me into one of the Mickey D's once, just wanted to see if the menu was the same. It wasn't...not quite. Close...full of unhealthy shit...but some of it was different unhealthy shit. I mainly went in there because I wanted a soda...and a restroom.

Mostly, I intentionally went out of my way to enjoy the indigenous culture and foods of the country I was in. i mean, what the fuck is the point of going to a foriegn country, and then surrounding yourself with American bullshit? No, I wanted to EXPERIENCE Thailand...and Thai culture.

I wish I coulda stayed longer than three weeks. I'd love to go back. Even language wasn't too much of a barrier for me, I knew some basic Thai phrases, and a friend had made up some flash cards for me, in English and Thai, to help me out. Additionally, most of the folks in the larger cities, like Bangkok, at least were able to speak in broken English...so, between my broken Thai, and their broken English, I was able to get around sufficiently.

Mighty Asshole is more like it, when talking about Bush.
:D :D :D :D :D :D
So it was written. So it shall be. From this day on he will be known by this name.
Mighty Asshole, President of the USA.

I don't have a problem with American companies, or the American culture. I'm not criticising them. I'm criticising the rest of the world. It doesn't *need* America. If every country became autarkic (ie. had a self-sufficient economy), then the world would be in a far better shape. I realise that this isn't going to happen, but countries allow American influences to pervade their cultures far more than they need to. One thing that I do have a problem with about American companies is that they don't realise quite how much they're eroding other cultures, or they do, but they don't care because they're just interested in their profit margins.

*Chokes*
Are you seriously suggesting the world move into total regional isolation? The fact is the world economy allows every region the flexibility to play to its strengths. I cannot even really begin to explain how bad an idea what you are suggesting is, its....just so totally unreasonable and absurd. I mean, your suggesting we reverse the most common trends of human nature!

Ok perhaps I am being a little to harsh. There ARE alternitves but you produce the most stuff. BUT America is far better at pushing it out across the world. And its not just produce, culture is the bigest export and this is why people get cross. You push out your ideas and very few people get to push any other ideas back. So much media comes from the US to the ROTW but very little goes the other way.

That is because of the Xenophobia of Americans, and the self-assured "superiority" Americans feel over the ROTW. The ROTW is insignifact, and not to be considered. Except, of course, where their money is concerned. don't worry, this isn't Americans doing this...it's American corporations. As insignificant as you, the ROTW and your cultures are to American corporations, remember that we Americans, likewise, are insignificant to the omnipotent American corporations. We get fucked over, too.

I just downloaded this song and Rammstein's "Amerika," which someone brought in to my German class last week. Both are pretty good.

I just downloaded this song and Rammstein's "Amerika," which someone brought in to my German class last week. Both are pretty good.
Good choices. So, you liked this Schilling song, eh? Besides Major Tom, it was my favorite on the album on which it came. I hadn't heard it in years, and while on a rant about Bush, remembered the song, and got thinking...sheesh, that song was prophetic, because we are now living in the America that Schilling was singing about back there in 1989.

*Chokes*
Are you seriously suggesting the world move into total regional isolation? The fact is the world economy allows every region the flexibility to play to its strengths. I cannot even really begin to explain how bad an idea what you are suggesting is, its....just so totally unreasonable and absurd. I mean, your suggesting we reverse the most common trends of human nature!

Yes. Why not? The world is massively overpopulated, modern industry is killing off the natural world, and something needs to be done. If every country started to become autarkic, then population would reduce, by around 4 billion, and there would be far less industry. People really don't appreciate how few modern conveniences they really need, and by reducing them, I can only see that humanity would advance.

Yes. Why not? The world is massively overpopulated, modern industry is killing off the natural world, and something needs to be done. If every country started to become autarkic, then population would reduce, by around 4 billion, and there would be far less industry. People really don't appreciate how few modern conveniences they really need, and by reducing them, I can only see that humanity would advance.

i dont really see how if each country established auturky, how would the population be reduced? if the countries are sufiencent the people wouldnt die, although we all know a lot of people will one day have to die if we expect to last, as a species, very much longer.

i agree, the world would be a better place if every country was self sufficient. i personally think that the down fall of man kind will prove to be the industrial revolution as it has clearly seperated man from beast. we no longer obay by the laws of natural selection, instead we are above, gods amoung insects. in my opinion a more perfect world would be one where man lives in balance with the land. i once heard a statistic that the world could only sustane 150,000 people at our current rate of consumption (meaning without ever running out of materials or anything), thats pretty scary since there is 4+ billion people overly consuming this planet. i think that humanity has over developed, we never should have reached these numbers or had such technology as we are clearly unable to handle the responsibilities that comes with the great power granted by our inteligence and industrial power. i suppose my idea of a perfect world would be more of something like original native north americans. small tribes living off the land, never taking more then they needed, travelling or woundering as needed. they respected the earth, eachother, and the other inhabitants of this planet. they respected their elders and passed information through story and were taught by elders. its too bad the stupid white man came in and stomped all the F' over them and built a mcdonalds on top of their sacred lands (metaphorically of course). sure in this world people would actually have to work, instead of being fat lazy peices of shit, but is that such a bad thing? do we need mircowaves, tvs, computers, dish washers and our cushy heated homes with fabricated matresses? the obvious anwser is no, and the price of luxury is far to great for me to bare. i personally have no problem putting in some serious hours to dirrectly benfit me and "the tribe" as apposed to our current system of being exploited by the land and buiding owners where they see the fruits of our labours rather than us.

Again, America cannot be faulted that other nations find its shows interesting enough to bring them into their own borders. The fact that massively popular shows like Friends, Seinfeld, The Simpsons, etc are shipped abroad is a testament to their originality and mass appeal, not to any American conspiracy.

I did not say it was an American conspiricy. What I did say is that American culture is by far the most wide spread in the world and the reason for this is the financial and technological resorces it commands (and to a far lesser extent the historical influence on nations like Japan and now Iraq). I have nothing against the content of said culture, there is just far too much of it. Tell me, how many British televison shows get transported across the Atlantic and played by American channels (Not BBC America) at prime time. Not many, espically when compared with the number of American programs that recieve that treetment over here.

i dont really see how if each country established auturky, how would the population be reduced? if the countries are sufiencent the people wouldnt die, although we all know a lot of people will one day have to die if we expect to last, as a species, very much longer.

i agree, the world would be a better place if every country was self sufficient. i personally think that the down fall of man kind will prove to be the industrial revolution as it has clearly seperated man from beast. we no longer obay by the laws of natural selection, instead we are above, gods amoung insects. in my opinion a more perfect world would be one where man lives in balance with the land. i once heard a statistic that the world could only sustane 150,000 people at our current rate of consumption (meaning without ever running out of materials or anything), thats pretty scary since there is 4+ billion people overly consuming this planet. i think that humanity has over developed, we never should have reached these numbers or had such technology as we are clearly unable to handle the responsibilities that comes with the great power granted by our inteligence and industrial power. i suppose my idea of a perfect world would be more of something like original native north americans. small tribes living off the land, never taking more then they needed, travelling or woundering as needed. they respected the earth, eachother, and the other inhabitants of this planet. they respected their elders and passed information through story and were taught by elders. its too bad the stupid white man came in and stomped all the F' over them and built a mcdonalds on top of their sacred lands (metaphorically of course). sure in this world people would actually have to work, instead of being fat lazy peices of shit, but is that such a bad thing? do we need mircowaves, tvs, computers, dish washers and our cushy heated homes with fabricated matresses? the obvious anwser is no, and the price of luxury is far to great for me to bare. i personally have no problem putting in some serious hours to dirrectly benfit me and "the tribe" as apposed to our current system of being exploited by the land and buiding owners where they see the fruits of our labours rather than us.

there's something to be said for that...but I do not think a retreat to caveman status does anyone any good. I think we need a system where we and our "tribe" in this case, our families...see more of the fruits of our labors than the corporations...there is a very valid thing to say. but I believe this can be accomplished without giving up many of our modern conveniences we have come to enjoy...we just need to give up greed. Good luck!

Capitalism, by necessity, purposefully creates deprivations for some. I mean, if EVERYONE had a million dollars...then what would a million dollars buy? See what I mean? I just think there needs to be a way to get at the people who are so grossly wealthy that they and 500 generations of their family will never have to work, while others struggle from paycheck to paycheck, and are often forced to choose between food and medical care...or heat and clothes...or any number of other scenarios.

there should be a more equal distribution of those items necessary for survival, that none would need for basic survival items...and if people are then able, through the fruits of their labors, to get some luxuries, great. But no one ought to be rolling in dough like Bill Gates while others starve on street corners...that is just disgusting.

As I don't live in America, I wouldn't know if it described the place well or not. But here's a good song to describe the world we live in: Amerika by Rammstein. The Americanisation of the world really does need to be stopped.

Rammstein is awesome! Not too many here in America have heard of them though. And the song above is quite hillarious indeed!

there's something to be said for that...but I do not think a retreat to caveman status does anyone any good. I think we need a system where we and our "tribe" in this case, our families...see more of the fruits of our labors than the corporations...there is a very valid thing to say. but I believe this can be accomplished without giving up many of our modern conveniences we have come to enjoy...we just need to give up greed. Good luck!

Capitalism, by necessity, purposefully creates deprivations for some. I mean, if EVERYONE had a million dollars...then what would a million dollars buy? See what I mean? I just think there needs to be a way to get at the people who are so grossly wealthy that they and 500 generations of their family will never have to work, while others struggle from paycheck to paycheck, and are often forced to choose between food and medical care...or heat and clothes...or any number of other scenarios.

there should be a more equal distribution of those items necessary for survival, that none would need for basic survival items...and if people are then able, through the fruits of their labors, to get some luxuries, great. But no one ought to be rolling in dough like Bill Gates while others starve on street corners...that is just disgusting.


so you agree with me than that capitalism is essentially the problem here? the comunists in russia had the right idea, you know, before it was completely currpted by stalin and his goons. communism (by definition of marx) was ment to be implimented in an industrially thriving country (britian was his target at the time) which was half to blame for the eventual failure of communism in russia. but one thing must be said about communist russia, when the stock market crashed just before the 30s (causing The Great Depression, 10+ horrible years in american history) almost every country in the world was dramatically impacted, especially america because it was so dependant on the stock market (which is the back bone of the modern capitalist system) but russia was completely uneffected because it wasnt capitalistic at all. as you said capitalism is designed to make some very very wealthy and some very very poor. what we need is a more social system in which the wealth is more properly destributed. not just by taxing the rich and putting the poor on welfare but by having a lot more government control on all corperations, thusly controlling the value of things (such has oil and laybour) to better and properly destribute wealth. in my opinion the owner of the business should get more then the employees. but i say they shouldnt make more then twice as much. so say i own a business and the business turns a profit of 500,000 a year, that should be spilt evenly amoungst all of the empolies cause they are the ones that did all the work and make your business possible. but since you did make the business and to help promote people to make new businesses the owner should get double. so if there was 4 people in this business, including the owner, 3 of them would make 100k and the owner would make 200k. imagine...