NationStates Jolt Archive

Yes, this thread has been inspired by the rash of marriage and child threads around recently and I just wondered: What do the people here think of polygamy or polyamoury? Having been in a couple of polyamourous relationships, I have found that (like most relationships) they work really well if the right people are involved. If the wrong people are involved they can be an unmitigated disaster. However, I think that a functioning polyamourous family is a wonderful environment. And no, just beacause there are more than two adults in the relationship doesn't mean that we were all screwing like rabbits 24/7 like some people have assumed. You get asked the weirdest questions and hear the weirdest assumptions when you tell people that you have several people in one group relationship. ;) Questions and comments have ranged from hillarious (When do you get time to cook?) to outright offensive (Don't you think the children are in danger?) and I feel sufficiently thick skinned ;) to be able to open up a (hopefully mature) discussion about it.

SO...

Keeping religion out of it (PLEASE ), what do people here think of poly relationships?

My question is why did you not include polyandry?

Consider it included. :)

It wouldn't work for me, because I prefer the one man/one women relationship. However I dont judge how others should live so long as it is consenting adults. If it works for you, I wish you the best.

I dont judge how others should live so long as it is consenting adults. If it works for you, I wish you the best.
If everyone expressed such sentiments, (cue cheesy cliche) the world would be a much better place.

I for one am very against them. I was chasing after a very good friend of mine, and she left me for another guy without bothering to tell me for months. That isn't all that bad, sure, but he was still in a relationship. For a little under a year now he's just had two girlfriends. All three of them sleep in the same bed in the same room. I do, in fact, see this as wrong. The guy's just being an egoist. His first girlfriend shouldn't have to tollerate that - she only is, I think, because she doesn't have backbone to break up with him. And his new girlfriend has chosen to lower herself to be someone's mistress. I've known his new girlfriend for sometime now, and this type of thing is actually something's she's accustomed to. If I know her as well as I think I do, she WANTS to be lower than equal. I don't think it's healthy to encourage that behavior.

Go ahead and accuse me of being hurt or envious - you wouldn't be wrong. But I can't agree to this. A relationship should be the greatest of friendships. A relationship like this doesn't have that. There's no equality in a relationship of this kind. From my point of view, it's selfish and egotistic to have two boyfriends/girlfriends. To share a boy/girlfriend is to lower yourself.

I'd feel better about this if the two girlfriends were dating each other or other people. If the original question includes that kind of relationship, then I'm a little more for it. But there's a clear distinction to be between free love and polyamooury/polygamy.

I think it's a great idea, and like all great ideas, it's better in theory than in practice. Poly is so far out of the mainstream, if you want to do it, you, and your partners, have to have the sophistication to deal with being that far out of the mainstream. Most people aren't. Most people are socially conditioned to be too self absorbed and jealous and just plain petty for the complexities that would come with a poly relationship. But if you and your partners are not like that, if you can deal, then go for it.

I personally would love such a relationship. I think it would be a better enviroment to raise children in. Childcare would not be a problem. Alienation wouldn't be a problem. There is so much good that could come from such a relationship. But since people are not socially conditioned for this type of relationship, it would be very hard to find suitable partners. Good luck.

If, by chance, there are women out there who are looking for such a long term relationship, let me know.

A relationship should be the greatest of friendships. A relationship like this doesn't have that. There's no equality in a relationship of this kind.

that hasn't been my experience from talking to people who have been in such relationships.

I personally do not think that I could handle either, but I'd prefer the polygamy, as long as I'm the one marrying multiple women...
but there are some of us, who just do not think they could handle something like this.

Good luck with the rest of the post

Aslong as the woman/man is happy with having 2 men/women, It's fine with me.

(I'm sure some women wouldn't mind having multiple husbands, less housework :D )

I for one am very against them. I was chasing after a very good friend of mine, and she left me for another guy without bothering to tell me for months. That isn't all that bad, sure, but he was still in a relationship. For a little under a year now he's just had two girlfriends. All three of them sleep in the same bed in the same room. I do, in fact, see this as wrong. The guy's just being an egoist. His first girlfriend shouldn't have to tollerate that - she only is, I think, because she doesn't have backbone to break up with him. And his new girlfriend has chosen to lower herself to be someone's mistress. I've known his new girlfriend for sometime now, and this type of thing is actually something's she's accustomed to. If I know her as well as I think I do, she WANTS to be lower than equal. I don't think it's healthy to encourage that behavior.

Go ahead and accuse me of being hurt or envious - you wouldn't be wrong. But I can't agree to this. A relationship should be the greatest of friendships. A relationship like this doesn't have that. There's no equality in a relationship of this kind. From my point of view, it's selfish and egotistic to have two boyfriends/girlfriends. To share a boy/girlfriend is to lower yourself.

I'd feel better about this if the two girlfriends were dating each other or other people. If the original question includes that kind of relationship, then I'm a little more for it. But there's a clear distinction to be between free love and polyamooury/polygamy.

I definitely agree with you about the unhealthiness of the relationship that your friend is involved in but I don't really consider that type of relationship to be true polyamory. Most of the healthy, functional polyamorous relationships that I've seen are more like the bit that you described and I bolded. Working polyamorous relationships are some of the most egalitarian that I've seen.

that hasn't been my experience from talking to people who have been in such relationships.

Then good for them. Maybe I've just seen the worst of this kind of thing. I have no problem with letting people do what they want. But sometimes the thing a person wants isn't what's best for them. I don't want to make it illegal, I just think it has the potential to do a great deal of harm.

In my specific case, I stand firm on my opinion. One woman's been forced to share the person she loves while another has basically assumed that she can't do much better. I honestly think the guy's just taking advantage of these two women for his own personal gain and pleasure. I don't agree with seeking pleasure at another's expense.

Again, I realize I'm probably being pessimistic. But I'm not about to just proclaim polygamy as a great and wonderful idea. It has an ugly side like everything else in the world.

I definitely agree with you about the unhealthiness of the relationship that your friend is involved in but I don't really consider that type of relationship to be true polyamory. Most of the healthy, functional polyamorous relationships that I've seen are more like the bit that you described and I bolded. Working polyamorous relationships are some of the most egalitarian that I've seen.

Then consider my stance to be an undecided maybe.

[
Again, I realize I'm probably being pessimistic. But I'm not about to just proclaim polygamy as a great and wonderful idea. It has an ugly side like everything else in the world.[/QUOTE]

There are ugly sides to any type of relationship. Spousal abuse/unfaithfulness/unkindness
Find someone who shares your ideals and spend your lives being honest with each other and being kind to each other. Don't concern yourself about others relationships, if they are ready to ask for help or advise they will. Other than that. let them be.

There are ugly sides to any relationship. Spousal abuse/unfaithfulness/unkindness
Find someone who shares your ideals and spend your lives being honest with each other and being kind to each other. Don't concern yourself about others relationships, if they are ready to ask for help or advise they will. Other than that. let them be.

I agree that all relationships have a down side, that wasn't really my point. But I'm not so sure about those last few sentances. I can't just ignore everyone else. There's a fine line between butting in/helping/leaving 'em alone/not caring/ignoring people. In short, I care about my friends. I care about their feelings and their well-being. And as such, I refuse to just ignore other's relationships. That doesn't mean I have to destroy the relationship. But I'm not afraid to say to someone "that someone is hurting you, even if you don't think so". Sometimes friends need to do that.

I know I've pointed it out every post so far, but I'm sensitive about this kind of thing. There's domestic violence in my extended family and hurtfulness in my friend's relationships. Intervention is sometimes neccessary.

I think it's a great idea, and like all great ideas, it's better in theory than in practice. Poly is so far out of the mainstream, if you want to do it, you, and your partners, have to have the sophistication to deal with being that far out of the mainstream. Most people aren't. Most people are socially conditioned to be too self absorbed and jealous and just plain petty for the complexities that would come with a poly relationship. But if you and your partners are not like that, if you can deal, then go for it.

I personally would love such a relationship. I think it would be a better enviroment to raise children in. Childcare would not be a problem. Alienation wouldn't be a problem. There is so much good that could come from such a relationship. But since people are not socially conditioned for this type of relationship, it would be very hard to find suitable partners. Good luck.

If, by chance, there are women out there who are looking for such a long term relationship, let me know.

Yeah, for polyamory to work people definitely have to give up silly ideas about 'owning' another person and using sex as a weapon. Good communication is also necessary. Good polyamorous relationships actually seem to be less sex based than typical monogamous relationships and more centered around compatibility (this is a generalisation, of course, as there are some good monogamous relationships and some bad poly ones, but when a relationship is no longer defined by sexual exclusivity then usually there has to be a lot more to it than just having a sex partner).

If you live anywhere near a city look around. Things like poly support groups shouldn't be too hard to find with just a bit of digging around.

Arcadian, I can 100% understand what you are saying. In fact it is probably the same thing I would have said in my youth. A lot of time and mistakes have passed since then. If you truly want to be a friend, then simply tell your friend that you are there when they need anything. If you try to interven you will likely lose the friend. I have seen horendous abuse in relationships in the past, but you cant truly help until the person asks.

Arcadian, I can 100% understand what you are saying. In fact it is probably the same thing I would have said in my youth. A lot of time and mistakes have passed since then. If you truly want to be a friend, then simply tell your friend that you are there when they need anything. If you try to interven you will likely lose the friend. I have seen horendous abuse in relationships in the past, but you cant truly help until the person asks.

Yeah, I can agree to that, especially the last sentance. I was just stating my policy against "worry about yourself, ignore everyone else" whether or not that was what you were advocating.

Yeah, I can agree to that, especially the last sentance. I was just stating my policy against "worry about yourself, ignore everyone else" whether or not that was what you were advocating.

Never ignore your friends, by all means let them know that you are there if they need help. All I meant was that when you find the person that truly makes YOU happy, never put that person second to anyone, including your friends.

Never ignore your friends, by all means let them know that you are there if they need help. All I meant was that when you find the person that truly makes YOU happy, never put that person second to anyone, including your friends.

Sounds like a plan. I'm a gonna take a break for a while. Final Fantasy III's callin' my name. G'night.

Yeah, for polyamory to work people definitely have to give up silly ideas about 'owning' another person and using sex as a weapon. ..... but when a relationship is no longer defined by sexual exclusivity then usually there has to be a lot more to it than just having a sex partner).

Amen brotha...or sistah...or kitty....

It wouldn't work for me, because I prefer the one man/one women relationship. However I dont judge how others should live so long as it is consenting adults. If it works for you, I wish you the best.
That's pretty much the way I see it.
It's not for me, as I'm in a happy monogamous relationship, but if it works for you and everyone in the relationship, go for it.
I just wonder how you'd balance it? Like in terms of love and attention. I suppose all partners would have to be immune to jealous rages. :p

I personally have no problem with such relationships as long as they're done right. I, however, have never experienced such a relationship, so perhaps I shouldn't be one to talk. But from what I've seen with others, when done right polyamory can be a perfectly fine thing.

i've had such a relationship, though we obviously were not married to one another. three of us, two males one female, and a mutual three-way relationship. it was the second most loving relationship i have ever been in (my current one has to top the charts :P), and we only broke up because circumstances forced it: two of us wanted college, the other already was starting his career, and the locations were 2000 miles apart. i still speak to the guys, and i will always love them, even though we are no longer involved.

if all parties are clear on the nature of the relationship, there is no reason for it to be a problem. some people can't get past their own possessiveness and need to be the sole owner of their lover, but other people are able to do so. it's like how some people are comfortable with their partner having close friends of the opposite sex, but other people are threatened and suspicious that their partner must be cheating. just a matter of temperment.

Come to think of it, I have a friend in a 3-way relationship. She's a girl, with two bi guys. And they're going absolutely fine as far as I know. And they're all very close, even though the relationship itself isn't overly serious in terms of being long term or whatever.

I wonder if that made sense? :p

I think that I would personally be much happier in a polyamorous relationship, where all of the partners involved are exclusive to each other, than an open, nonmonogamous relationship. I've never tried either, though.

Haven't read the whole forum, so forgive me if I repeat anything. I could never be in a non-monogamous relationship personally, because (having been at the receiving end of it) I think cheating in a relationship is one of the most hurtful things one human being can do to another. If my boyfriend were sleeping with me and another women, that - in my opinion - is cheating.

However, I'm not criticising your point of view and/or way of life. Such things as these are relative; if your partners don't consider it cheating (and therefore hurtful), if they accept and approve the situation, and as long as no one else gets hurt, fair enough! Everyone's moral opinion is different, and everyone is entitled to think as they will. Only if you're going to hurt someone or infringe upon their right to think as they wish is anything of this nature harmful, I suppose :)

What do you guys think about Polygamy in a relationship where there's children involved?

I assume you mean children being raised by the adults within the relationship? I personally don't see how that changes anything at all. In a serious relationship of almost any kind, the idea of children factoring into things is bound to come up.

I think cheating in a relationship is one of the most hurtful things one human being can do to another. If my boyfriend were sleeping with me and another women, that - in my opinion - is cheating.

Even if you know about it and are involved? I don't mean neccessarily having sex with the third (4th, 5th, whatever) person, but being involved positively in the decision to expand the relationship to include others. To my mind, cheating is about lying, scheming and going behind someone's back. Poly is about open and honest discussions and mutuality in decisions. If you know it is going to be hurtful to do something - anything - and you go behind your partners back and do it anyway, that's cheating. Even if there is no sex involved. I would be very hurt if my partner went behind my back to have a meal (for instance) with someone, but if they wanted to have sex with them and told me I'd probably be fine with it. The lying is the issue for me. Yes - I get told I'm strange all the time ;)



What do you guys think about Polygamy in a relationship where there's children involved?

I think it's a good thing. The child(ren) have the opportunity to draw from a larger pool of knowledge and experience. Most of the time there is less of a problem with things like childcare and housework and they learn that there is more to relationships than one male and one female planning to get married and have 2.6 children. My older daughter and I have talked about it and she doesn't mind at all. It was normal for her to have a "villiage" upbringing, so to speak. She doesn't seem to have any mental issues and academically, intellectually, socially and emotionally she is well above the standard level associated with her age. My younger one is only little so I don't know her opinion yet. :)

This has been a surprisingly enjoyable thread so far. To be honest, I was a bit unsure as to the reaction this topic would get. So far it's all been genuine interest and no flames... I hope to see more of it. :)

Well, my libertarian principles don't have any problem with it. There is a vague nagging thought in the back of my mind about who misses out (and the pessemistic gut feeling that it would be me), but that's not really relevant.

As for the whole issue of children, I think there's a lot worse that a child could suffer than having three parents.

An ex-girlfriend of mine married the guy after me (Oooh yeah...this seems to happen a lot). However, he was in the Airborn and shipped off to Iraq (the first time) soon after they were married.

During this time, I discussed with her how polyamoury worked, and we got back together after she agreed with it, and her husband thought it was okay. Things were going great, and her husband and I have a mutual agreement where we just stay out of each other's way (when he returned).

However, what I did not expect was that her best friend soon became involved with her, and she is in a relationship with another girl as well. She's really had no real family of her own, and I feel that her husband, boyfriend (me), and girlfriend make her first actual family.

I personally have always been uncomfortable with lesbianism (and I am perfectly straight. It's just a really bad personal past experiences involving them that attribute to my skewed outlook), and thus I have set up a couple "fourth wall" rules concerning her relationship with her best friend that allows me to accept it, but not to ever be witness to the knowledge of the intimate details of it.

However, her husband recently left (again) for Iraq, and her girlfriend has moved in with her, and I feel slightly ousted at the moment, but I am still pretty happy in the situation I've been in with her for the past 3 years or so. I just don't want her to leave both of us and run away with the girl, as I've known lesbians to do in such situations (I view them like a cult in the way most of them 'work' and act).

It's difficult enough to get TWO personalities to mesh sufficiently to stay together through the struggles of life. I would think that trying to get more than two to do so would increase the potential for friction geometrically. I once had the opportunity to join a polyamorous relationship but decided not to for this very reason.

Even if you know about it and are involved? Not necessarily. But only if you honestly and genuinely don't mind that your partner is involved with these people (and if you are, etc). I realise there are a lot of people like this, but I still think that a (probable) majority would be jealous of such actions, even if they claim otherwise. All I can say from my own point of view is that if my boyfriend ever slept with another woman (or man for that matter!), he'd be very sorry! But that's just my personal view and I don't for a second expect others to have to agree with it :)

To my mind, cheating is about lying, scheming and going behind someone's back. Poly is about open and honest discussions and mutuality in decisions. If you know it is going to be hurtful to do something - anything - and you go behind your partners back and do it anyway, that's cheating. Even if there is no sex involved. I would be very hurt if my partner went behind my back to have a meal (for instance) with someone, but if they wanted to have sex with them and told me I'd probably be fine with it. The lying is the issue for me.Well, I wouldn't be fine if my partner wanted to have sex with someone else whether he openly told me that or not! But I very much agree with everything else you say here. Because of how society views things, sex with people other than your (main?) partner in most cases inherently involves lies and deceit. Personally, I wouldn't like it anyway, but the deceit is - as you say - quite probably the worst part.

If the people involved are genuinely consenting and in favour of and not jealous of a polygmous relationship, I don't see a problem. Though I must say I agree with this ;):It's difficult enough to get TWO personalities to mesh sufficiently to stay together through the struggles of life.
As for children within such relationships, I don't see a particular problem. Even in the traditional nuclear family, children often become very close to third parties (uncles, aunts, friends of families etc), seeing them as perhaps like another mother/father-figure. Presumably this is how they'd see the third (fourth, fifth?) 'part' of a polygamous relationship? If so, I don't really see anything wrong with that. If the kid later grows up and finds what his/her parents are doing unsavory, then that's up to him/her, but I fail to see why polygamous parents would do a bad job of bringing a kid up just because of their relationship situation.

I've been witness to both working and failing multi-partner relationships. One thing that became evident in most of the ones that failed was that it was brought down by one person, and their insecurities/neuroses. Unfortunately, that's all it takes to ruin a relationship is one person deciding things aren't good enough, or they aren't "Getting their way" enough. When its a person who decides everyone needs to revolve around them, it's catastrophic.

On the upside- when it works, it is a beautiful thing. It's harder to find patently bigoted, close-minded individuals in such groupings. That makes open discussion of pretty much any topic easier, and the overall acceptance levels from the ones I've known has been higher. Having always been a fairly physical person myself (not sexually, I just like to have contact with people), I tend to fit in well with them, even if I dont fit well in a relationship. The children I've seen in such environments really don't seem to do so badly either. More parenting for them than there was in MY family upbringing, it was nice to see.

Like most things, if you can't handle it, don't do it. But, don't tell other people what they can and cannot do.

Haven't read the whole forum, so forgive me if I repeat anything. I could never be in a non-monogamous relationship personally, because (having been at the receiving end of it) I think cheating in a relationship is one of the most hurtful things one human being can do to another.
I have to agree, especially if you find out about it from another person and not the person you're in the relationship with.

So now we know how everyone feels about that. What do people think of relationships with animals?

as long as everyone involved is a consenting adult free to leave at any time, why would i object?

im not interested in it but if someone else is and can make it work, more power to them.

the only reservation i would have about children is the inherent instability involved in having no legal framework for their financial and emotional well-being. similar to a single parent who gets involved in live-in relationship after live-in relationship without regard to what it is doing to her childrens emotional state. a bad break-up can lose a child her closest parental figure who, if she had no biological relatiionship to the child, might well be barred from ever seeing the child again. otherwise a long term stable relationship with several sane loving adults can only be good for any child involved.

I think as long as it is by consenting adults and equal. Meaning women and men are able have the multiple wife,husband dealio. I think you would need a disclosure waiver so you don't get a spouse saying what the hell you think your doing. hehe

I'm fine with polyamoury. It's probably not something I'll practice, but that doesn't mean I should tell others not to do it.
Polygamy is different, though. Strictly from a legal standpoint. Let's say, for example, that one woman has two husbands. She goes into a coma. One husband wants her to not be in pain anymore, and wants to pull the plug (sad though it is). The other husband can't stand the thought of her being gone and wants to keep her on life support. What does the poor doctor do?

I'm fine with polyamoury. It's probably not something I'll practice, but that doesn't mean I should tell others not to do it.
Polygamy is different, though. Strictly from a legal standpoint. Let's say, for example, that one woman has two husbands. She goes into a coma. One husband wants her to not be in pain anymore, and wants to pull the plug (sad though it is). The other husband can't stand the thought of her being gone and wants to keep her on life support. What does the poor doctor do?
What happens if a person's only living family are their two adult sons, or two adult daughters, and they are in a coma, one of their children want to pull the plug the other doesnt, the person has left no standing instructions in case of such an event, and thier will gives equal status to both children. What does the poor doctor do?
Equally a person who is a child under the age of consent, goes into a coma, before the law they have two personsn empowered with equal guardianship/custodial rights over them, their living and married biological parents. One parent wants to pull the plug and the other doesnt. What does the poor doctor do?
In both cases, I suspect the 'poor doctor' would continue life support until either both parties whose consent is required want life support withdrawn, or a court order directing the termination of life-support is issued, whatever comes soonest...
I suspect cases of conflict of interest between 'equal claiments' by virtue of marraige, would be dealt with in the same manner as such cases that can and do already arise (ie through biological kinship).

What happens if a person's only living family are their two adult sons, or two adult daughters, and they are in a coma, one of their children want to pull the plug the other doesnt, the person has left no standing instructions in case of such an event, and thier will gives equal status to both children. What does the poor doctor do?
If the person hasn't indicated one of his children to have the right of Attorney, the government decides.
Equally a person who is a child under the age of consent, goes into a coma, before the law they have two parents with equal guardianship/custodial rights, their living and married biological parents. One parent wants to pull the plug and the other doesnt. What does the poor doctor do? Good question.

If the person hasn't indicated one of his children to have the right of Attorney, the government decides.

That's what my post says...the government would decide via the legal system, aka through the courts, the decision of the courts (aka the government) would be in the form of a court order, without which, the doctor (in such a scenario) would not turn off the life support. However if all the kin agreed for life support to be withdrawn, then the courts would never be brought into the issue, and if the parties came to an agreement during court proceedings, the party who initiated court proceedings can withdraw their suite.

Good question.
What do you mean, the question is entirely answered, the answer is the same as for the earlier question, the doctor would not turn off life support in such cases without a court order, unless both parties consented to the life support being withdrawn (ie they withdrew the case from the courts and gave their informed consent to lifesupport being withdrawn). I see no reason why this same solution would not be applied in the case of a person having more than one legal spouse.

What do you mean, the question is entirely answered, the answer is the same as for the earlier question, the doctor would not turn off life support in such cases without a court order, unless both parties consented to the life support being withdrawn (ie they withdrew the case from the courts and gave their informed consent to lifesupport being withdrawn). I see no reason why this same solution would not be applied in the case of a person having more than one legal spouse.
In my defense, I responded to your post while packing my bags to go to English, so I may have been a bit hasty...

Good defence...
In my defense, I responded to your post while packing my bags to go to English, so I may have been a bit hasty...
Fair enough... :D ;)

As long as they know what they are doing, I'm fine with it.