NationStates Jolt Archive

I'm hearing about how the "two Americas" are so deeply divided, more so than anytime since the Civil War. I hear that this election was decided on "moral values" of the candidates. What I ask, is why now?

America is fighting a war against terrorism and is stuck in a mess in Iraq. Why did the electorate get so divided, and why are they so concerned with moral values now, of all times? Surely 1996 or 2000 would be a more appropriate time for such domestic concerns?

It's easier to piss people off with a bunch of wars. Besides remember Murphy's law "Anything that can go wrong, will."

To people who haven't noticed, we've been sharply divided for five or six years now. It wasn't so apparent during the Clinton administration because he didn't pursue so many plans that were so radically different from what was expected of him when he was elected, and because he was such a talented speaker that he managed to sway a number of people who would have been outspoken against him to his side. Bush has neither of those, so the idfference has become more ponounced as democrats that could have been convinced by good speeches and moderate positions were instead divided by extreme positions and no attempt at persuasion from the other side.

The government encourages this division of political beliefs
to preoccupy Americans from voting outside one of the ruling
parties. With the competition surrounding the two major parties
it becomes a system where Americans don't want the other guy
too win. Not only do the parties attempt to convince 3rd party
candidates to not run in the elections, but the media impels
voters to not "waste" their vote on a 3rd party nominee.

I believe that the lack of adherence to Federalism in our current system exacerbates the problem....it is not necessary for Kansans to believe as New Yorkers and v\v. Laws enacted at the federal level applying to all of us increase antipathy. Just because 60% of the people believe that we should live one way and 40% believe we should live another does not mean that the majority is "correct". This is the problem with strong centralization of government- when even a minority of people is marginalized, that still leaves a hell of a lot of angry and dissatisfied citizens.

The outer states of the US get barraged with the world-wide dislike of America, they see it in the news daily, they are told so all over the internet, etc. I think the more cosmopolitan states in the US with more contacts to people outside of the US don't really like Bush because they care more for what others think about the US whereas the people in the middle and south arent directly affected by terrorism or the opinion of the world. Shows if the city that had to suffer under 9/11 was pro-Kerry all the time. While the western world moves forward and realizes civil rights each year, the US are slowly falling back to medieval times. Some sort of rennaissance of the ugly side of christianity.

This country has always been divided. Right now it is a little more so then usual, but we have always been divided.

Part of it is also that politicians convinced everyone that moral issues were the real issues, not pragmatic concerns like the economy. And it worked...guys kissing is apparently more important than dozens of people dying in Iraq daily... (a slightly hyperbolic statement, but not much)

It might be a little strong to say we on the coasts of America 'care' what the rest of the world thinks about who we elect as president. Suffice it to say we just haave a more global awareness.
apparently, the folks in the south and midwest, can see more clearly, through the benefit of objective distance, the true terrorist threat, (spoken facetiously)
It is amazing to me that the people who voted on moral values voted for a liar.

America has always been a divided nation, that's something that occurs when the people have a right to the freedom of speech. We just hear more about it now because we have an inflammatory media very similar to that of the yellow press at the end of the 19th century. What our media has that the yellow press didn't is 24 hour coverage, and as such we hear about any mildly intersting non-story constantly as if it's a big deal.

That's it!

I think this "division" is a lot of hype. The main problem as I see it is the increasing vitriolic, venemous personal attacks on the candidates and the general incivility towards others. People need to realize that you can disagree on issues without making it personal.

The outer states of the US get barraged with the world-wide dislike of America, they see it in the news daily, they are told so all over the internet, etc. I think the more cosmopolitan states in the US with more contacts to people outside of the US don't really like Bush because they care more for what others think about the US whereas the people in the middle and south arent directly affected by terrorism or the opinion of the world. Shows if the city that had to suffer under 9/11 was pro-Kerry all the time. While the western world moves forward and realizes civil rights each year, the US are slowly falling back to medieval times. Some sort of rennaissance of the ugly side of christianity.

We are not falling back. Just so you get this clear, the issues of gays and abortion are so nit-picky on the scale of human rights, yet they're the only things left in the US for the HR people to deal with, believe me, we're doing them a favor by keeping them in business! If we didn't what would they protest?

We are not falling back. Just so you get this clear, the issues of gays and abortion are so nit-picky on the scale of human rights, yet they're the only things left in the US for the HR people to deal with, believe me, we're doing them a favor by keeping them in business! If we didn't what would they protest?

Rationalization for your beliefs by denial of of right and wrong. What fun!

Seriously, just so you get this clear - the issues of us "gays" (it sounds so derogatory when you say it, for some reason. I wonder why) and abortion are not so nit-picky on the scale of human rights in America. Both dramtically affect the lives of uncounted millions. I hardly call that "nit-picky". If you didn't waste the worlds time by rationalizing your beliefs by denying what is fundamentally right and wrong, the "HR people" would move on to other issues relating to human rights, domestic or otherwise.

America has always been divided through socio-economic lines. The rich and the poor. The whites and the blacks. The straights and the gays. Men and women. Old vs. young. Religion vs. Reason. All dividing points for the American civilization. While I fully respect each and everyones personal opinion, I must voice mine - and that this division has been present throughout the history of America, and won't be disappearing anytime soon.

The cause of the more recent division can be pointed towards Bush. I'm not trying to make this a personal attack on him as a person, but what his campaign did was target those who dislike the idea of homosexuality, and those that value their Religion - or their presumed believe in said respective Religions.

Below is an image of a flyer that has been circulated by the Grand Old Party in more than two states:

http://chuckcurrie.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/gopflyer_web.JPG

Methods like this were the methods used by Bush's campaign to get himself re-elected; and while I must acknowledge the cunning ability of Bush and his campaign staff at mobilizing their base and even the Democrats base in the rural areas of the country, I must say that this is the proof that Bush should not be in office.

We are at a crossroads. It is here where we decide wether we will go down the path of Reason, or follow Religion blindly and let the presumed teachings of Paul furnace hatred into our souls towards each minority that presents itself. I do admit that I am overstating some things to an extent, this is essentially the dilemna.

I'm only 17, and cannot vote - but if I did, it would have been for Kerry, recognizing his flaws I still believe that Kerry has demonstrated that he is courageous, sober, competent, and dedicated to fighting the ever widening socio-economic gap that is even more present in our country today than ever before. This is the time where we need Kerry. This is the time where we need to be united, and Bush unfortunately has not done that.

I am gay, and as much as I would enjoy the ability to marry someone when I so choose - it is not something that drives my political reasoning. I weigh all the options, all possible outcomes - and if Bush demonstrated that he was the man we needed to fight the socio-economic crisis that is present in our civilization I would have voted for him, but he hasn't. If he could have proved the he would not act so rashly in his decisions to excercise his military command position, I would have voted for him - but he hasn't. If he could have proved that he would work towards gaining more American jobs, and enact measures to send the deficit and economy in the right direction, I would have voted for him - but he hasn't and unfortunately probably won't.

Free Trade is a mixed blessing. Overall, it makes things better for a good deal of Americans - but for the ones that lose their jobs and livelyhood due to the loss of the jobs that have been migrated elsewhere it has and will be a terrible ideal. Neither Kerry nor Bush could have completely fixed these problems, but it would take a central government to ensure that all those affected by job migrations would be able to be retrained, go back to school, and support their families, not a more limited one rich with tax cuts which is what Bush wants.

But that is a whole nother argument and I would rather not get into it in this thread, so if you wish to talk about Free Trade then start another thread and telegram me please.

As a note, Andaluciae, I was not trying to make an attack on you as a person or your character, I was just responding with the sarcasm that you included in your post.

And to everyone, I want to reiterate that I was not attempting to attack President Bush, although I do dislike his policies. I was merely pointing out my opinion on the issues and what I would have done with my vote had I been able to utilize it.

[Edits were made to further clarify things and correct errors that I spotted.]

America has always been a divided nation, that's something that occurs when the people have a right to the freedom of speech.
So you think that all nations which have freedom of speech are so divided socially and politically?