NationStates Jolt Archive

Republicans for the most part seem to think that the rest of the world's opinions, especially Europe's, don't matter at all. Now, I know that the US is a very strong world super power, more so than Europeans care to admit, but that doesn't mean that Europe is irrelivant, does it? The EU is extremely powerful, so naturally we would want them as our allies, and listen to them occasionally, wouldn't we?

Note: This isn't a thread meant to bash America. If you want to beat on America, take it somewhere else. I just want answers why Republicans think most of Europe can just be ignored.

Because America is the greatest nation in the world. Why is America the greatest nation in the world? Because it is one nation under God.
Why doesn't Europe matter? Because it is not under God.

You should know that.

-end sarcasim-

I'm not bashing America. That truly seems to be their way of thought...

why don't we care about the opinion of europe?
our diminishing respect for europe could have something to do with the fact that they don't seem to care if dictators stay in power or not.

Because America is the greatest nation in the world. Why is America the greatest nation in the world? Because it is one nation under God.
Why doesn't Europe matter? Because it is not under God.

You should know that.

-end sarcasim-

In fact: Adam and Eve were yanks... And it wasn't an apple, it was a hamburger.

In fact: Adam and Eve were yanks... And it wasn't an apple, it was a hamburger.

Spot on.

why don't we care about the opinion of europe?
our diminishing respect for europe could have something to do with the fact that they don't seem to care if dictators stay in power or not.


ROFL! And the US cares? If so, why do you support Saudi Arabia? Why do your companies rushed to get contracts with lybia? Why do you supported so many dictators in the past, just as you do know? YEA RIGHT.

why don't we care about the opinion of europe?
our diminishing respect for europe could have something to do with the fact that they don't seem to care if dictators stay in power or not.

Anyone who thinks Bush invaded Iraq simply because he was concerned about Saddam being a ass hole to his people is extremely naive.

Just bear in mind the US supported old Uncle Saddam when he was taking on Iran.

hey, we can't fight every freaking dictatorship in the world at once. I'm not saying america has in the past or now put as much pressure, military and otherwise on every dictatorship that we should have, but at least we are trying to do something about some of them. Europe dosen't seem to want to do anything about any of them.

I was glad to see Saddam topple, but there is no way in hell you can make me believe Bush went to war because America cared so much about Iraqi people...

Bush's motives for taking out saddam may or may not have been purely for the good of the Iraqi people, but In my mind it's better to do the right thing for the wrong reasons then to do nothing at all.

I'll tell you the reason. I am an American, and the reason why Republicans don't care about anyone elses opinion is because they really can't comprehend the existence of anyone else. My reasoning? Has anyone been to Africa? If you haven't spent any time there, how can you think about the horrible tragedies there?
That is why Republicans don't listen to Europe. Democrats, generally have a higher education, so though they may never be exposed to Europe, they still know and understand European thought and politics. Ask any liberal Democrat, and they will say that they would like the US to be modeled a little more like a European country. Or like Canada.

One of the main slogans of the American Revolutionaries was "No Taxation without Representation". I would imagine that the reverse"No Representation without Taxation" makes no less sense.

There will of course be Americans who have a slightly xenophobic streak, much as every nation has it bigots, every village its idiots.
But perhaps what many Americans mean when they say that "the rest of the world doesnt matter" is that the rest of the world has its right to an opinion, but that Americans pay the tax so Americans get the representation.

Seems fair to me....

Bush's motives for taking out saddam may or may not have been purely for the good of the Iraqi people, but In my mind it's better to do the right thing for the wrong reasons then to do nothing at all.

Is it the right thing though? If you just went around invading every country that abused human rights and/or was a dictatorship, then you would run the real risk of making the world a much more dangerous place.

We don't think other nations should interfere in our elections. Only we're allowed to interfere in other nations' elections. :)

can ne1 xplan me wot europe is ?

I'm an american. I serve in the military, and i will try to answer your question. While i can't speak for all americans i can speak for myself and many people i have talked to.
The reason we are listening less and less to Europe is because we see Europe getting more more hypicritical as time goes by. You criticis america for doing things in our own intrest when you do the exact same things.
On top of that we feel that you are only conserned about your own well being. You criticis us for removing Sadaam when the man has been commiting genocide for over 2 decades. We see Europe as content to just sit back and watch evil dicatators take over the world. We see it as you have lost the will to go and lay your life on the line for someone else. This is frustrating when we have laid down our lives time and time again in Europe. Before anyone goes off about how the US on entered ww2 after we were attacked is right. We were attacked by Japan. We still did not have to particiate in Europe. We did though. We came to your aid and together we defeated Hitler. We were prepaired to stand next to you and fight to keep Stalin out of western Europe. We've been there for you. So where are you now?
These are some of the reasons that might explain why we have distianced ourselfs from europian opnion.

can ne1 xplan me wot europe is ?

They are a bunch of guys that discovered a new land that already had people on it and decided that they needed it more so the citizens they didn't want would have a place to go. That land was called, America. :)

hey, we can't fight every freaking dictatorship in the world at once. I'm not saying america has in the past or now put as much pressure, military and otherwise on every dictatorship that we should have, but at least we are trying to do something about some of them. Europe dosen't seem to want to do anything about any of them.

You can't pick and choose. Unless the US pledges to take on every dictatorship, your argument doesn't stand.

I'm not saying we should take them all on at once. that would be impractical impossible, and just plain stupid. but like I said- at least we got rid of one dictatorship. It may be quite I while before we can get rid of another one but at least Bush seem's to be trying.

"You can't pick and choose. Unless the US pledges to take on every dictatorship, your argument doesn't stand."

Again,
Regretably the US does not have the capacity to take them all on. as for picking and choosing, why not? are you saying if you cant get rid of all the dictatorships in the world you shouldn't get rid of any of them? thats absurd. should a doctor refuse to get rid of part of a tumor just because he can't get rid of the whole thing?

You can't pick and choose. Unless the US pledges to take on every dictatorship, your argument doesn't stand.

So instead we should just sit back and take care of our selves. Quick Franky get the popcorn its another genocide. Start up the betting polls. I put $20 on 150 million dead. I got a better idea why don't we put Sadaam in power of your country and see how you like it.

I'm an american. I serve in the military, and i will try to answer your question. While i can't speak for all americans i can speak for myself and many people i have talked to.
The reason we are listening less and less to Europe is because we see Europe getting more more hypicritical as time goes by. You criticis america for doing things in our own intrest when you do the exact same things.
On top of that we feel that you are only conserned about your own well being. You criticis us for removing Sadaam when the man has been commiting genocide for over 2 decades. We see Europe as content to just sit back and watch evil dicatators take over the world. We see it as you have lost the will to go and lay your life on the line for someone else. This is frustrating when we have laid down our lives time and time again in Europe. Before anyone goes off about how the US on entered ww2 after we were attacked is right. We were attacked by Japan. We still did not have to particiate in Europe. We did though. We came to your aid and together we defeated Hitler. We were prepaired to stand next to you and fight to keep Stalin out of western Europe. We've been there for you. So where are you now?
These are some of the reasons that might explain why we have distianced ourselfs from europian opnion.

It's not that Europe doesn't care about the likes of Saddam. It's just very cautious about how to deal with pricks like him and does exactly as it is told by the UN (after all, how would an international body like that function if every member did as it damn well pleased?). I suppose nobody wants to start World War 3 and so diplomacy and peaceful means are tried tiredlsly to make life freer for the oppressed.

you actually believe Bush went to war with Iraq to get rid of a dictator?

FOR THE LAST TIME:
It would be nice if we knew for sure that bush's motives for taking out saddam were entirely pure. but my point is at least he did it. It is better to stop someone from murdering someone else because their target owes you money than not to do it at all.

FOR THE LAST TIME:
It would be nice if we knew for sure that bush's motives for taking out saddam were entirely pure. but my point is at least he did it. It is better to stop someone from murdering someone else because their target owes you money than not to do it at all.

lol. I really don't think your argument is valid.

"It's not that Europe doesn't care about the likes of Saddam. It's just very cautious about how to deal with pricks like him and does exactly as it is told by the UN (after all, how would an international body like that function if every member did as it damn well pleased?). I suppose nobody wants to start World War 3 and so diplomacy and peaceful means are tried tiredlsly to make life freer for the oppressed."

The US is not a servent of the UN. apparently europe is
there is a point where you are too cautious you know, like when your so cautious you don't get anything done.

Republicans for the most part seem to think that the rest of the world's opinions, especially Europe's, don't matter at all. Now, I know that the US is a very strong world super power, more so than Europeans care to admit, but that doesn't mean that Europe is irrelivant, does it? The EU is extremely powerful, so naturally we would want them as our allies, and listen to them occasionally, wouldn't we?

Note: This isn't a thread meant to bash America. If you want to beat on America, take it somewhere else. I just want answers why Republicans think most of Europe can just be ignored.

Because they are ignorant and they think they rule the world

I was born and raised in Florida and later moved to CA, and I don't give a rat's *** about what Oregans think; don't expect me to care about foreigners :p

edit: btw, I'm sure that the great people of Oregon are decent, intelligent people. I just don't care about what they think. :D

Before I go I should point out that trying diplomacy after it has already failed multiple times is rather redundant and gets you nowhere, especially with people like saddam.

So instead we should just sit back and take care of our selves. Quick Franky get the popcorn its another genocide. Start up the betting polls. I put $20 on 150 million dead. I got a better idea why don't we put Sadaam in power of your country and see how you like it.

He's right! We need to stand up and do something against injustice! Now lets see... Why not have most of the worlds nations wage war on the states and overthrow that 'evil' place and stop them from enforcing their rule on the world. What with all the 'terrorism' they do in overthrowing the governments and leaders of other countries because they won't fall in line with the US morals/capatilism/etc. Oh, and the Weapons of Mass Destruction they have! My my, yes. Let's all take up arms and do something.

Sorry, don't mean to sound a jerk here - though I'm prolly succeding at it. Just a little twist I think more should think about. Not that I think war on the States is the way, heh. I'm a peace loving Canadian....Eh? ;)

"Because they are ignorant and they think they rule the world"
and democrats are ignorant and think the world rules us.

...What with all the 'terrorism' they do in overthrowing the governments and leaders of other countries because they won't fall in line with the US morals/capatilism/etc...

that isn't terrorism. its liberation. and we don't do it because they don't fall in line with our ideals, we do it because they treat thier own people like shit.

The US is not a servent of the UN. apparently europe is
there is a point where you are too cautious you know, like when your so cautious you don't get anything done.

First off, if the US has no care at all for the functioning of the UN as an interntional body then why doesn't it remove itslef from the security council and cancel its membership?

However, you are right about being to cautious. It is possible. But it is also possible to be too brash and hasty.

Before I go I should point out that trying diplomacy after it has already failed multiple times is rather redundant and gets you nowhere, especially with people like saddam.

Again agreed. But has the war made the world a better and safer place? The Iraqis have been liberated, sure, but they continue to live in a huge trouble spot of the world and the stability of the region has certainly taken a shaking.

Anyway, the evidence to prove that Saddam Hussein was a major threat to the world was not sufficient enough for Europe (and other countries) to go rushing in at America's side. That is the real reason why Europe has not supported the war in Iraq and I think it is a valid one...

I was born and raised in Florida and later moved to CA, and I don't give a rat's *** about what Oregans think; don't expect me to care about foreigners :p

edit: btw, I'm sure that the great people of Oregon are decent, intelligent people. I just don't care about what they think. :D
OW!!!! YOUVE HIT ME RIGHT THROUGH THE HEART!!!! AHHH THE PAIN, THE PAIN!!! :D (I'm speaking as fellow American, and as an Oregonian.)

That is why Republicans don't listen to Europe. Democrats, generally have a higher education, so though they may never be exposed to Europe, they still know and understand European thought and politics. Ask any liberal Democrat, and they will say that they would like the US to be modeled a little more like a European country. Or like Canada.

Understanding european thought is what makes them liberal Democrats.
The world would be one big socialist group hug if you collectively had your way. As soon as europeans (and the UN) can openly admit that helping America "achieve" socialism is their main goal, I could at least start to respect them.

Look, it's not that the US cares less and less about Europe, truth of the matter is that the US has never cared about Europe's or anyone else's opinion when it runs contrary to their interests.

When you play along the US and its interests, it doesn't matter if you are the bloodiest dictator, the US will listen to you and will support you. If you go against US interests, even if you are a democracy and try to do what's best for your people, the US won't care and will either ignore you, or performe several degrees of violence against you ranging from economic sanctions and diplomatic pressure to war.

The US has no principles when it comes to foreign policy, just interests.

(First of all, I'd ask you not to generalize with the word 'Republicans')
We need to consider all issues, but at the end of the day, American opinion is supreme in the United States. Other people don't have a vote here just as we don't have a vote in their nations.

Democrats are ignorant and think the world rules us.
I beg to differ.
Anyway, back to the main topic... what I want to know is why Republicans seem to think that doing some of the things they do won't cost much (for ex. George Bush putting the country $200 billion in debt when he started with [Again, not sure] a $400 billion surplus... :headbang: )

Bush's motives for taking out saddam may or may not have been purely for the good of the Iraqi people, but In my mind it's better to do the right thing for the wrong reasons then to do nothing at all.

No, its not a matter of 'right' and 'wrong' when going to war. Its a matter of 'is it the last resort?' (if we are being attacked dead on) and 'can we win?' (if we are not being attacked). Both of these factors must be met.

1) If neither are met then there is no war (unless you are a total, total bastard idiot).
2) If the first is met but not the second you surrender or give up and form a geurilla war afterwards.
3) If the second but not the first is met, you are likely a dictator like Saddam picking on a weaker country, or are at the very least 'strategically opportunistic' (which is just a PC term for being a prick). This option usually ends up backfiring on the one who uses it, creating a well-earned aura of hatred towards the perpetrator.
4) If both are met then war is inevitable and you may in fact win. The enemy was a moron.

In both of these cases the answer is a resounding NO so there should have been NO WAR as stipulated in the first case. However, one was started and now we can't win, barring a big-arsed miracle.

Its a simple comparison of risk/benefit. Even Bush Sr. said in his memoir that Iraq would be plunged into civil war and utter chaos if we ousted Saddam. The risks now, were the same then. Of course NOW the risks are a grim reality.

"Because they are ignorant and they think they rule the world"
and democrats are ignorant and think the world rules us.

Actually they only want the US to follow International LAW and the UN.

Ya know...the reasons why we were so mad as Saddam....because he broke international law and disrespected the UN...sound familiar...?

PS Why didn't we finish off Osama bin Laden before we went off to save the Iraqis? :confused:

that isn't terrorism. its liberation. and we don't do it because they don't fall in line with our ideals, we do it because they treat thier own people like shit.

Liberation is the camoflage. The vaulted 'good cause' that's feed to the people to make them beat their chest and think they're doing good. Every nation that ever did wrongful things had a pious and good reason to camoflage the truth and continue with their own 'evils'. otivce how the US has only worked to "liberate" countries with resources for them to control or because they're communist (My god the threat to capitalism!) or they have a grudge or some such? Why not help a nation the US stands nothing to gain from save the pious helping of others if they're only concerned with well being of others?

PS Why didn't we finish off Osama bin Laden before we went off to save the Iraqis? :confused:

We could put our entire army in Afghanistan and not find bin Laden.

Look, it's not that the US cares less and less about Europe, truth of the matter is that the US has never cared about Europe's or anyone else's opinion when it runs contrary to their interests.

When you play along the US and its interests, it doesn't matter if you are the bloodiest dictator, the US will listen to you and will support you. If you go against US interests, even if you are a democracy and try to do what's best for your people, the US won't care and will either ignore you, or performe several degrees of violence against you ranging from economic sanctions and diplomatic pressure to war.

The US has no principles when it comes to foreign policy, just interests.

*appaludes* Thank you for voicing that! *bows down*

the world does not seek to matter to republicans because they have been raised with a limited education about the rest of the world apart from their own country. It is a matter of education. They seem to be ignorant because they want to be ignorant.

p.s. I am not a religious person, but I repented november 3rd when bush won the election. did you?

We could put our entire army in Afghanistan and not find bin Laden.
... we almost had him, another 6 months and he would be ousted (instead of our dear Saddam :) ) and then we wouldn't have too much work (Iraq + Afghanistan is tiring us out, and we just cant keep up)

Democrats, generally have a higher education, so though they may never be exposed to Europe, they still know and understand European thought and politics.
:eek: :rolleyes:
Really? Funny, because I thought Dems relied on the minority vote, and I do believe you normally claim that minorities are disadvanted. Not to mention that the one educational group that supported Gore most strongly was the part of the population without a high school diploma.

Now, as to why "Republicans don't care about the rest of the world." First off, that is a stereotype, and might contribute to why we are disenchanted with quite a bit of the world. Second, perhaps it is just that we see that the EU member nations are acting in their own best interests, just as we are. We don't stop them, and if we tried to it would be an outrage. However, they actively campaign to prevent the US from removing a dictator who is a threat to, at the least, his own people, and quite possibly many more people around the world. I can't see how it has helped us in any way, so how could we be doing it to help ourselves?

Now, we do care about world opinion, but not so much that we let it lead us blindly on. I don't see any reason to believe that Europe makes better decisions than the US. It has had its share of major blunders, including causing two World wars, and therefore I don't see any reason to accept European judgement over our own. Especially since European nations were making millions off the "Oil for Food" deals with Saddam. Granted, the US was making money too, but you noticed that we have not griped about it.

Now, I would also like to point out that the US funds more humanitarian aid projects, in Africa and elsewhere, than any other nation in the world. Not to mention that we form the backbone, and fill the wallet, of the UN. Of course, that is all irrelevant because "everyone" knows the US is full of "evil capitalist pigs", as opposed to greedy socialist dictators. Like Charon. I would say that we do notice the lack of respect and utter contempt shown us by other nations, despite our contributions, and so we in turn respond in like kind. It is a cycle that may be broken, but not until we can convince the wonderful, tolerant nations of Europe to give us our due, or at least quit asking us for money if they are going to turn around and spit in our face.

(First of all, I'd ask you not to generalize with the word 'Republicans')
We need to consider all issues, but at the end of the day, American opinion is supreme in the United States. Other people don't have a vote here just as we don't have a vote in their nations.

It is sad when we generalize but its a pain in the ass to split the Repubs into different groups. When so many traditional Republicans are mad at the prez's economic policy, which flies in the face for what the repubs were suppose to stand for, the need to clarify is obvious, but its a hassle when it comes to posting.

I guess 'Republicans' will just have to stand for "the current administration and its supporters". No time to single every opinion out.

Then again, then the generalization sounds more like an insult, then it be bad.

And although foreign nations don't vote in American politics they DO become the victims of our foreign policy. Oh yes, and America does swing its big iron club around and influences how other nations do things all the time.

:eek: :rolleyes:
Really? Funny, because I thought Dems relied on the minority vote, and I do believe you normally claim that minorities are disadvanted. Not to mention that the one educational group that supported Gore most strongly was the part of the population without a high school diploma.

etc., etc.,



Ah yes, but aren't educated people also a minority? :D

The majority of people out these aren't highly educated.

Understanding european thought is what makes them liberal Democrats.
The world would be one big socialist group hug if you collectively had your way. As soon as europeans (and the UN) can openly admit that helping America "achieve" socialism is their main goal, I could at least start to respect them.

As soon as America can openly admit its real goal is to force capitalism and its self-righteousness on the world, I could at least start to respect it.

Look, it's not that the US cares less and less about Europe, truth of the matter is that the US has never cared about Europe's or anyone else's opinion when it runs contrary to their interests.

When you play along the US and its interests, it doesn't matter if you are the bloodiest dictator, the US will listen to you and will support you. If you go against US interests, even if you are a democracy and try to do what's best for your people, the US won't care and will either ignore you, or performe several degrees of violence against you ranging from economic sanctions and diplomatic pressure to war.

The US has no principles when it comes to foreign policy, just interests.

Indeed, that is very true.

"You must be the only ambassador in the world to have named a horse* after his country's foreign policy."
- David Lange to American ambassador, Prime Minister of New Zealand 1984-1989

*Horse called Lacka Reason

Ah yes, but aren't educated people also a minority? :D

The majority of people out these aren't highly educated.
My point exactly. In fact, in the 2000 election, college graduates supported Bush over Gore, while Gore did have a bare majority in the post-graduate area. Thus, the "majority" of Dems are not highly educated, they are underpriviledged, poor minorities, and the "post-graduates" actually only vote Dem by a small margin, which would thus lead one to believe they make up a very small number of voters compared to the number of registered Dems.

I would also like to point out that the US funds more humanitarian aid projects, in Africa and elsewhere, than any other nation in the world

Of course. It is the only superpower, and it happens to be a western democratic one. But if you were to actually go by the sizes of countries(economy, population etc.) to determine how much foreign aid they give in comparison to each other, I think there is a possibility the United States wouldn't fare as well. I look at my own 'socialist leaning', 'UN pussy', 'liberal haven'. It is very small for a country, only 4 million people. Yet we give large sums of foreign aid to help in our region.

Of course it isn't going to be in the same quantity as the US, but there is one hell of a major size difference. Thus I don't think your point is all that valid.

Look, it's not that the US cares less and less about Europe, truth of the matter is that the US has never cared about Europe's or anyone else's opinion when it runs contrary to their interests.

When you play along the US and its interests, it doesn't matter if you are the bloodiest dictator, the US will listen to you and will support you. If you go against US interests, even if you are a democracy and try to do what's best for your people, the US won't care and will either ignore you, or performe several degrees of violence against you ranging from economic sanctions and diplomatic pressure to war.

The US has no principles when it comes to foreign policy, just interests.

Your right we're so evil. Forgive us father for we have sinned. We should be more like the Ever gracious Europians who are like the Red cross of the world. They stop what ever interests they have and help out everyone elses intrests. They are such saints.
:)

Ya anyways all joking aside lets not kid ourselves into thinking that Europian countries aren't always looking out for their best intrests. Its like the pot calling the kettle black.

The one educational group that supported Gore most strongly was the part of the population without a high school diploma.
... Maybe thats because they weren't done with HIGH SCHOOL :headbang:

My point exactly. In fact, in the 2000 election, college graduates supported Bush over Gore, while Gore did have a bare majority in the post-graduate area. Thus, the "majority" of Dems are not highly educated, they are underpriviledged, poor minorities, and the "post-graduates" actually only vote Dem by a small margin, which would thus lead one to believe they make up a very small number of voters compared to the number of registered Dems.

As far as I'm concerned its 'who runs the best campaign' is 'who gets the most support'.

I'm not to well-versed in the voting demographics and I could really care less. The majority of voters on either side are made up of the functionally retarded.

I'm not to well-versed in the voting demographics and I could really care less. The majority of voters on either side are made up of the functionally retarded.
:D That could be true

Based on your supporting details, HadesRulesMuch, I'm guessing your a Republican, no? :( Specifically this one ...as opposed to greedy socialist dictators.

Of course. It is the only superpower, and it happens to be a western democratic one. But if you were to actually go by the sizes of countries(economy, population etc.) to determine how much foreign aid they give in comparison to each other, I think there is a possibility the United States wouldn't fare as well. I look at my own 'socialist leaning', 'UN pussy', 'liberal haven'. It is very small for a country, only 4 million people. Yet we give large sums of foreign aid to help in our region.

Of course it isn't going to be in the same quantity as the US, but there is one hell of a major size difference. Thus I don't think your point is all that valid.
And I think it is. When Kofi Annan casually asks the US for 1 billion dollars as he did for humanitarian aid in Africa, and we actually give it to him. I'd say that our actions speak louder than your words. As I have said before, the US funds exactly 1/4, by itself, of the UN's budget. That is nothing to sneeze at. A little gratitude would be nice, rather than a "please sir, may i have some more", followed by tossing the bowl of soup into our faces.

why don't we care about the opinion of europe?
our diminishing respect for europe could have something to do with the fact that they don't seem to care if dictators stay in power or not.

ya, I'm so sick of Europe's apathy to the belligerence of America backed dictators. When Noriega was filling American streets with cocaine did Europe do anything? No. It was all up to us to tell him that the deal was off because people here were catching on.

And they totally rolled over on our work in Cambodia.

Y'know, I'm just baffled how Europe can expect us to believe that they have anything worth saying to us when they are so tolerant of our pet dictators. No country with a conscience would tollerate such dictators, and American's understand that because we know what a morality based government is really all about. Europe could learn a lot by our example.

Based on your supporting details, HadesRulesMuch, I'm guessing your a Republican, no? :( Specifically this one
Well done. You guessed it. You could also have looked at my location, which might have cleared something up.

However, my facts are indeed "facts", as you said, so I think it is irrelevant what my political inclination is. What IS important is that I make a valid point, and that the common steretypes toward the US can go both ways. That would be the significance of that remark you quoted.


By the way, you are a new guy, so I'll give you a warning. Don't follow the all too familiar tactic of attacking a single line in a post. Rather, read the entire thing, and don't ignore the content because the poster disagrees with you. Objectivity is a wonderful thing.

I'm signin off, hope u guys continue to have a nice chat :D

... Maybe thats because they weren't done with HIGH SCHOOL :headbang:
I'm not quite sure I follow you. Are you diagreeing with me on something? Or agreeing on it? I don't really quit understand where you are going with this...

By the way, you are a new guy, so I'll give you a warning. Don't follow the all too familiar tactic of attacking a single line in a post. Rather, read the entire thing, and don't ignore the content because the poster disagrees with you. Objectivity is a wonderful thing.
Attacking? No, all I meant to do was clear up an unclear fact to the rest of us :D,
PS. A new guy? I think not...

I'm not quite sure I follow you. Are you diagreeing with me on something? Or agreeing on it? I don't really quit understand where you are going with this...
lol, I was just stating the obvious... but I think the jist of it was that I was leaning towards disagreeing

And the world gets put on the backburner agains as americans argue amongst themselves. Kind of ironic considering the name of the thread.

And the world gets put on the backburner agains as americans argue amongst themselves. Kind of ironic considering the name of the thread.
:D now that you mention it ;)

lol, I was just stating the obvious... but I think the jist of it was that I was leaning towards disagreeing
Well, in that case what was your point?

I said that the majority of Dem voters were not people with a high education. I also pointed out that high school dropouts, of all the demographics, supported Gore most strongly, while post-graduate degree voters were almost even divided between Bush and Gore, with Gore having a slight lead. And Bush held the lead in people with a college degree...

And the world gets put on the backburner agains as americans argue amongst themselves. Kind of ironic considering the name of the thread.
And I would state that I believe it is immensely important for people to understand the opinions and positions of people they disagree with, so that they can understand the other more. Perhaps you Europeans don't believe in that, and would prefer to stick with a faulty impression, but I want the truth.

Republicans for the most part seem to think that the rest of the world's opinions, especially Europe's, don't matter at all. Now, I know that the US is a very strong world super power, more so than Europeans care to admit, but that doesn't mean that Europe is irrelivant, does it? The EU is extremely powerful, so naturally we would want them as our allies, and listen to them occasionally, wouldn't we?

Note: This isn't a thread meant to bash America. If you want to beat on America, take it somewhere else. I just want answers why Republicans think most of Europe can just be ignored.
As a Republican, I don't think the world doesn't matter. In fact, I think it matters more than ever. It's just that we disagree with eachother, and it is natural for most humans to shut out those they can't talk to. In any case, Europe is now more important than ever. It has a list of economic and strategic reasons that simply didn't exist in the Cold War, though I will admit that Central and Eastern Europe have taken on a new importance to the US.
Just remember, though, that the Cold War is over, and so are the preceding Euro-centric conflicts. The US can't cater as much to European opinion, because while it is important, there are a lot more places in this world that have become large on the world stage.

And I would state that I believe it is immensely important for people to understand the opinions and positions of people they disagree with, so that they can understand the other more. Perhaps you Europeans don't believe in that, and would prefer to stick with a faulty impression, but I want the truth.


woooo calm down. Happy thoughts. :) I'm an American here. Just trying to promote peace and happiness around the globe. :cool:

As a Republican, I don't think the world doesn't matter. In fact, I think it matters more than ever. It's just that we disagree with eachother, and it is natural for most humans to shut out those they can't talk to. In any case, Europe is now more important than ever. It has a list of economic and strategic reasons that simply didn't exist in the Cold War, though I will admit that Central and Eastern Europe have taken on a new importance to the US.
Just remember, though, that the Cold War is over, and so are the preceding Euro-centric conflicts. The US can't cater as much to European opinion, because while it is important, there are a lot more places in this world that have become large on the world stage.

Ah...I get it now... They're called "freedom-fries" because Europe is important and the cold war is over!

But of course! *slaps forehead*

hey, we can't fight every freaking dictatorship in the world at once. I'm not saying america has in the past or now put as much pressure, military and otherwise on every dictatorship that we should have, but at least we are trying to do something about some of them. Europe dosen't seem to want to do anything about any of them.

I think some dictators should be left on there own( unless they are invading other nations). In most cases the people will eventually overthrow the dictators regime. It my take time, but it always happens. Can anyone think of a dictatoral regime that lasted more then 100 years? Nations that fought for there freedom ( peacefully or in a revolution) are the ones that are still around. As evil as some dictators are, it is better in the long run if we isolate them and let the people of there own country take care of it.

Look, it's not that the US cares less and less about Europe, truth of the matter is that the US has never cared about Europe's or anyone else's opinion when it runs contrary to their interests.

When you play along the US and its interests, it doesn't matter if you are the bloodiest dictator, the US will listen to you and will support you. If you go against US interests, even if you are a democracy and try to do what's best for your people, the US won't care and will either ignore you, or performe several degrees of violence against you ranging from economic sanctions and diplomatic pressure to war.

The US has no principles when it comes to foreign policy, just interests.

five stars

Ya anyways all joking aside lets not kid ourselves into thinking that Europian countries aren't always looking out for their best intrests. Its like the pot calling the kettle black.
Agreed! Fortunately I'm not European either. Tum Dee Doom!