NationStates Jolt Archive

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans? And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay. Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.

Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that. Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.

And if you don't like it, Hillary Clinton will run for President in 2008 and you can have another chance. Better luck next time!

Oh yeah... I want to gloat a little bit here...



http://members.cox.net/logan5/Images/7023r.jpg

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans?


"overwhelmingly supported" :rolleyes:

Well it is great news for Europe, Kerry would only divide Europe in pro and contra, with Bush we are sure what we have and some people say that we have to prepare for a millitary conflict with the US, of course fought by satelite states in a third world country.

One thing is sure, the anti European rascisme will even spread further under the leaders that hear voices in their head...

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans? And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay. Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.

Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that. Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.

And if you don't like it, Hillary Clinton will run for President in 2008 and you can have another chance. Better luck next time!

Oh yeah... I want to gloat a little bit here...Well, it only strengthens the perception that USAmericans are naive and easily deceived.
Unfortunately, the immature, dumbass silent majority has yet again prevailed.

Wow ... you just can't trust those crazy EuropeOns. I think we now know why Bush has the majority of American support.

"overwhelmingly supported" :rolleyes:

Well it is great news for Europe, Kerry would only divide Europe in pro and contra, with Bush we are sure what we have and some people say that we have to prepare for a millitary conflict with the US, of course fought by satelite states in a third world country.

One thing is sure, the anti European rascisme will even spread further under the leaders that hear voices in their head...

right... war with Europe :rolleyes: . If you actually believe that, there's a building in England with a biiig clock on it with a great view of a river I'd like to sell you.

Well, I never claimed your brain washing spoon fed propoganda days were entirely over.

I say, well done, right-wing America, and go kick some terrorist butt for us leftist Europeans too scaredy-cat to do it ourselves.

Well, it only strengthens the perception that USAmericans are naive and easily deceived.
Unfortunately, the immature, dumbass silent majority has yet again prevailed.


hahahah ... sore loser :rolleyes:

Well, it only strengthens the perception that USAmericans are naive and easily deceived.
Unfortunately, the immature, dumbass silent majority has yet again prevailed.
That and 'hmmm... so many demographics said that they would be supporting Kerry. Oh my, where have their votes gone?'

Maybe all the people who voted for Bush can join the army and get sent out to Iraq. That will be seen as a great show of support. Don't worry. The brits and the rest can pull out to make room for them all.

The average European isn't a sore loser. The people losing out are the Non-US soldiers in Iraq who are having to clear up one almighty mess left by an army with more pairs of boots than braincells.

I say, well done, right-wing America, and go kick some terrorist butt for us leftist Europeans too scaredy-cat to do it ourselves.


Affirmitive! We will, with or without Europes approval

hahahah ... sore loser :rolleyes:
hahahaha... ignorant kid

Well, it only strengthens the perception that USAmericans are naive and easily deceived.
Unfortunately, the immature, dumbass silent majority has yet again prevailed.

Yeah. Shame on all us stupid, ignoble asses who had the unmitigated GALL to vote for someone other than a member of the liberal elite! I mean, after all ... liberals know SO much better than we how we should vote and live and think, right? Democracy is ok as long as we just rubber-stamp whatever candidate all the liberal elitists think we "should" vote for, right?

hahahah ... sore loser :rolleyes:

Don't get carried away. This was an American election...Europeans can't be "sore losers" in this.

Affirmitive! We will, with or without Europes approval

Your president will ask for our support on his knees in this or another war.

BTW: 4 MORE YEARS OF MICHAEL MOORE FILMS :D I am looking forward to it. Hahahaha

Don't worry. The brits and the rest can pull out to make room for them all.

The Brits and the "rest" won't pull out because they know which side of their toast the butter's on.

Seriously, you shouldn't be so depressed that the best man won

You're right - it is difficult for us Europeans to acknowledge that most Americans not only can't spell but couldn't find Europe on a map (in fact, most have difficulty finding Canada on a map ...) and are overwhelmingly blinded by crude TV ads, the dream of becoming as rich as Dick Cheny or Pres Bush, and the lack of balanced information sources.
God help us, most of them think that Fox News is a news programme! :p

I think Kerry would probably have done very little or nothing different, but at least america wouldn't have a political figurehead who can't eat properly and would lose an argument with his left big toe

Nah. Bush voters are one of four things:

- criminally stupid
- cretinously gullible
- minions of Satan
- a combination of the above

I know I'm right. I can feel it in my guts, y'see.

The people losing out are the Non-US soldiers in Iraq who are having to clear up one almighty mess left by an army with more pairs of boots than braincells.

Whose boots you aren't worthy to even lick! :D

hahahaha... ignorant kid

kid? do i know you? do you know me?

oh how i love the response of sore losers and the one's who didn't get their way when they were so SURE they'd have things their way... what glee! :D

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans?


4% of the vote isn't that overwhelming is it? And who cares how overwhelming the support of americans for him is? He's still a warmongering imbecile.


And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay. Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.

Don't you have propaganda in america? the "War on Terrorism" is totally true then, because Saddam really had WMDs that were going to annihilate Miami or somewhere?
Is it propaganda that Bush initiated the invasion of Iraq, or is it true?
Is it propaganda that Bush didn't ratify Kyoto, or is it true?
Is it propaganda that Bush denies the existence of Global Warming, or is it true?
Is it propaganda that Bush instituted protectionism for US steel industry, or is it true?
Is it propaganda that the people surrounding Bush in the whitehouse are the same people who worked with his father, or is it true?



Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that.


Pardon me, but no you aren't. You obviously aren't. Just like Margaret Thatcher was re-elected by people she was shafting in the UK, same goes for Bush. People voted for him because he claims to be a born-again christian, he's full of war rhetoric and he's against abortion, gay marriage etc.



Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.

The mature, intelligent majority of republican voters? Did you notice how many states were given to Kerry by the exit polls but to Bush by the count? Either Bush cheated (heaven forfend) or people were too ashamed to own up to voting for him.


And if you don't like it, Hillary Clinton will run for President in 2008 and you can have another chance. Better luck next time!


I wonder if you'll ever again have a president that isn't related to another president?

Yeah. Shame on all us stupid, ignoble asses who had the unmitigated GALL to vote for someone other than a member of the liberal elite! I mean, after all ... liberals know SO much better than we how we should vote and live and think, right? Democracy is ok as long as we just rubber-stamp whatever candidate all the liberal elitists think we "should" vote for, right?

you're obviously not who he was talking about, as the quote, i believe, was about the SILENT ignorant masses. I see you are not really too quiet, ergo not talking about you

right... war with Europe :rolleyes: . If you actually believe that, there's a building in England with a biiig clock on it with a great view of a river I'd like to sell you.

Well, I never claimed your brain washing spoon fed propoganda days were entirely over.

Besides you're kiddo flamebait, let me remember you that the Coltan wars in Kongo are allready fought between US, EURO in wich they both use third parties for their industries. Oh, yeah, you never heared of Coltan, must be a bibble person for you instead of cellphone material.

US started it when it armed the genocidists in 94 in Rwanda.

You're right - it is difficult for us Europeans to acknowledge that most Americans not only can't spell but couldn't find Europe on a map (in fact, most have difficulty finding Canada on a map ...) and are overwhelmingly blinded by crude TV ads, the dream of becoming as rich as Dick Cheny or Pres Bush, and the lack of balanced information sources.
God help us, most of them think that Fox News is a news programme! :p

Are you certain that my misspelling wasn't intentional? My, aren't you the rocket scientist ahahahah ... weeeeee

Your generalization of Americans and the Anti-American sentiment proves my point about your brainwashing and spoon-fed propoganda condition nicely, thank you.

Maybe all the people who voted for Bush can join the army and get sent out to Iraq. That will be seen as a great show of support. Don't worry. The brits and the rest can pull out to make room for them all.

Unfortunately that wouldn't help much with the Iraq mess. While the US has some 130,000 troops out there, very few of them are battle-hardened or capable of fighting - which is why the Brits have to go and get them out of the mess they've gotten into in Fallujah.

The Brits and the "rest" won't pull out because they know which side of their toast the butter's on.

Seriously, you shouldn't be so depressed that the best man won
We're not depressed. We're scared. Bush has screwed up so much in four years what's he going to do with another four?! And he's in his stride now!

The brits and the rest would pull out tomorrow if they didn't knew that Iraq would implode without their efforts to lend stability. No butter round here. We try to use margarine.. you know.. keeping the saturates down a little..

Hey Meatopiaa, what do you put in a toaster?

As a peon from Europe, I'd like to extend my sympathies to the American electorate for letting Bush pull the wool over their eyes again.

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans? And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay. Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.

Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that. Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.

And if you don't like it, Hillary Clinton will run for President in 2008 and you can have another chance. Better luck next time!

Oh yeah... I want to gloat a little bit here...



http://members.cox.net/logan5/Images/7023r.jpg

I think it's a sad day, the day that America chose the politics of fear over the politics of hope.

The day that America chose the "under god" as more important than "liberty and justice for all".

The day that people responded to an incumbent's campaign of insults, over a manifesto of propositions.

But, hey - it proves that America TRULY IS the land of opportunity: In America, it doesn't matter if you can't do your job, if people think you are going the wrong way, if more than half of the population consistently tells you they don't approve of you. In America, you can be an utter failure, and STILL be President.

Proud day, America.

Whose boots you aren't worthy to even lick! :D

Is this the mature, intelligent republican debate?

"We don't have to vote for who a liberal tells us to vote for, we can be dumb all by ourselves. Yay the military! Anyone who doubts our right to invade whoever the hell we want is calling into question the bravery of our undereducated hicks in the field".

The 2nd term for US presidents is notoriously when their major scandals happen. If his first term was less scandalous than his second term will be, what the hell is going to happen during bush's second term? He gonna nuke all remotely socialist countries and States?

Unfortunately that wouldn't help much with the Iraq mess. While the US has some 130,000 troops out there, very few of them are battle-hardened or capable of fighting - which is why the Brits have to go and get them out of the mess they've gotten into in Fallujah.

Good point. Whereas we aren't worthy to lick the boots of the american infantry, we need to send 650 of our good boys to help them because with only 130,000 of their soldiers in there, they are getting their asses kicked.

When Jeb and Hillary run in 2008, Nader should run one last time. He'd actually pick up some EVs I bet.

unsurpassable electorate lead,
286-252 if Bush holds Ohio. If Ohio goes to Kerry, it's 266-272, Kerry wins.

overwhelmingly supported by Americans?
51-48% popular vote. You have a strange definition of "overwhelmingly".

been being fed nothing but propoganda
ix nay on the opoganda pay...

He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.
You are feigning ignorance of politics. Only a minority of people actually vote issues.

We are smarter than that.
I hardly think so anymore.

Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.
No, the mature intelligent majority didnt vote. Thus their silence.

And if you don't like it, Hillary Clinton will run for President in 2008 and you can have another chance. Better luck next time!
That will be sweet.

Whose boots you aren't worthy to even lick! :D
I wouldn't try to lick them mate. See in Brit we try and keep the old footwear clean. Unfortunately Americans are treading in so much political bullshit that any attempt to perform aforementioned act would most likely result in diptheria and complications.

which is why the Brits have to go and get them out of the mess they've gotten into in Fallujah. The problem with the US troops is they appear to only have one mode of fighting. That's probably not a terrible thing in battle conditions - it wins wars, but they're in grave danger of losing the peace because they're too heavy handed.

The Brits turn up in a village, get a football out and start a kickabout with the kids.

The Yanks turn up in a Hummer and start kicking the kids about.

One lot gets a better reception than the others, but for some reason this lesson is never learned.

(I should point out for those deficient in the ability to read between the lines that the above was not a statement of fact based on evidence of particular events, but an impression gained from talking to local who've served in Iraq in the last year)

Good point. Whereas we aren't worthy to lick the boots of the american infantry, we need to send 650 of our good boys to help them because with only 130,000 of their soldiers in there, they are getting their asses kicked.

Ahh, but its the Black Watch. They're suuuper dooper! Yup, they gowna go help the Americans kick the eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeevil naysty IIIraqis beehinds.

*takes straw out of mouth and looks at his wife/sister*

I thaynk we gonna beat those pesky IIIraqis.

*Spits on his own shoe*

AAAAH! The terrorists are attacking my shoe! I MUST vote Gorg Dubya

SILENT ignorant masses.It would be fascinating to know what the result would be if everone in the US voted and if all the votes were properly counted.

Good point. Whereas we aren't worthy to lick the boots of the american infantry, we need to send 650 of our good boys to help them because with only 130,000 of their soldiers in there, they are getting their asses kicked.

Good point but the fact is that the Brits are really the highest quality and experienced troops involved in Iraq, compared to them, the marines are boy scouts.
Wow, republicans hate you since they say that you are only good to lick their boots. Jezus such a bastard that said that while your troops have to help theirs bailing out.

awesome! :)

It would be fascinating to know what the result would be if everone in the US voted and if all the votes were properly counted.
Nah, that would just be dangerous. Sounds a little too much like.. that.. democracy thing if you ask me.

All hail Jeb Bush, the future of Mathematics

It would be fascinating to know what the result would be if everone in the US voted and if all the votes were properly counted.

the reason half of America don't vote is probably because they don't care due to the extreme similarity between Bush and Kerry. They're both right wing, they both argue the same points, its just one's a hick and the other is Kerry. That's the only difference

europe rules and us brits always end up saving yr ass . when will u americans learn that thats its us who end up fighting yr wars .

awesome! :)
Go to Baghdad and see what your 'awesome' president thinks international diplomacy is.

HAIL BUSH OUR BELOVED NOBEL PEACE PRIZE NOMINEE

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans?

4M vote lead. Sounds impressive, no? Whats the population of the US? 300 million! Oh no a 1.3% lead! Amazing! Absolutly overwhelming! 1.3% 51.3% to 48.7% such a landslide! EVERYONE LOVES BUSH!

europe rules and us brits always end up saving yr ass . when will u americans learn that thats its us who end up fighting yr wars .

I could have sworn Brits spoke english too :confused:

Very few people in Europe REALLY care whoever becomes president in America. We've got our own problems.

I think you should check your math. Overwhelming support is usually more than 51% and the electoral gap is currently only 2. Where's the overwhelming support? :confused:

4M vote lead. Sounds impressive, no? Whats the population of the US? 300 million! Oh no a 1.3% lead! Amazing! Absolutly overwhelming! 1.3% 51.3% to 48.7% such a landslide! EVERYONE LOVES BUSH!

The entire 300 million didn't vote. Given the number of voters who actually took the time to put up, instead of just shut up, his win is very overwhelming. You can minimize all you want to... sucks for you doesn't it? weeeeee :D

the reason half of America don't vote is probably because they don't care due to the extreme similarity between Bush and Kerry. They're both right wing, they both argue the same points, its just one's a hick and the other is Kerry. That's the only difference
Kerry isn't as far right as Bush though.

The funny part is that Bush accused Kerry of being on the far left bank of American society...but Bush is beyond the far right bank of the global community. It's freaking scary that it looks like we have a Republican president...leading a republican senate and house, and will likely be appointing a couple republican justices to the Supreme court. I fully expect a draft with that kind of "balance" of power. The fact that the republicans control the legistlature is reason enough to vote for Kerry. What kind of socialist agendas can Kerry get through if he can get it past the Republican congress anyway?

It would be fascinating to know what the result would be if everone in the US voted and if all the votes were properly counted.Nah, that would just be dangerous. Sounds a little too much like.. that.. democracy thing if you ask me.

All hail Jeb Bush, the future of Mathematics

Funny thing is, my country is looking into removing the compulsory vote, as one of the last European countries to do so. The argument of those that are pro voting right (as opposed to voting duty) use exactly that same argument : non-compulsory voting is (according to them) more democratic.

If you ask me, it all just boils down to this :
compulsory : blueprint of the whole population's opinion, even of those who don't have an opinion.
non-compulsory : blueprint of the opinion of those that actually care about and are involved in politics.

So which is more democratic? I sure as hell wouldn't know.

The entire 300 million didn't vote. Given the number of voters who actually took the time to put up, instead of just shut up, his win is very overwhelming. You can minimize all you want to... sucks for you doesn't it? weeeeee :D
I must say, if Bush wins Ohio and keeps the 4% popular vote lead he has, it would be pretty overwhelming if you look through history and compare, however, neither candidate has 270 EVs yet, so they've both overwhelmingly lost so far.

I agree that there is not much difference between Bush and Kerry, although Kerry seems more interested in domestic affairs and I hate to think of the state of the US's economy, unemployment rate, and healthcare after four more years of Bush. But the most important thing for us Europeans is that Bush has completely wrecked his relationship with much of mainland Europe, has shown a complete disregard to the UN and to the Kyoto agreement and has basically pissed us all off.

Let us not forget that Bush wilfully lied to the American people about his reasons for going to war which hardly recommends him as a good president. Instead of giving Americans dreams Bush gives them the nightmare of the 'war on terror'. Don't forget that 'terror' is a concept and not a finite thing like another country. There was no terrorism in Iraq until the war, it's an ever increasing cycle - the more people you piss off the more terrorist they'll be. It will not ever end...

If America has voted for Bush to be their president again, more fool them, because alone you will flounder and fail.

bin Laden might as well call his Jihad the War on Nationalism...

I must say, if Bush wins Ohio and keeps the 4% popular vote lead he has, it would be pretty overwhelming if you look through history and compare, however, neither candidate has 270 EVs yet, so they've both overwhelmingly lost so far.

I've noticed that you aren't too bright sometimes Opal, you try hard and come close though.

Bush currently holds 269 "EV's". The very best Kerry can do is tie. He HAS to win Ohio to do that. If there were to be a tie, then the House will vote as the tie breaker and elect the next President. Given that the House holds a Republican majority, by several seats, Bush wins either way. Anyways, the point is moot, Bush will win Ohio... even after Kerry sues and puts the 2000 vote 'Florida shoes' on his feet in an attempt to so-called "steal" the election. Accept the fact that Bush won, and move on, it's a done deal... you'll have a better day if you do

weeeeeeeeee :D

But the most important thing for us Europeans is that Bush has completely wrecked his relationship with much of mainland Europe, has shown a complete disregard to the UN and to the Kyoto agreement and has basically pissed us all off.


I can't complain there, my country's done a well enough job of pissing Bush off before Bush could piss us off. At least I voted for the opposition, so I don't have to blame myself. Seriously, a country the size of a post stamp has no business telling America they can't fly over their territory or to wag their fingers and threaten with genocide laws applicable to foreign presidents on state visits.

As things are, I'm surprised we're not on America's black list. Guess we ain't important enough.

The entire 300 million didn't vote. Given the number of voters who actually took the time to put up, instead of just shut up, his win is very overwhelming. You can minimize all you want to... sucks for you doesn't it? weeeeee :D

No only 100M voted. Thats still only a lead of 4%. ooo not 54% to 46%! Thats much better! I'm completely bowled over!

This may sound weird... but I wonder if any americans realise that they are European. They just moved to america a few hundred years ago and took over from the Incas and the Indians.

heh heh... have a go at europeans, and you're having a go at yourself.

Well still a chance that Kerry can win. Most important thing for this european is that the Dutch PM and his parliament falls soon. Back out of Iraq and fix some dumb mistakes PM made.

And if Dubya really wins........well I guess WW III would be fun :-)

bin Laden might as well call his Jihad the War on Nationalism...

Heh, maybe Bush should send HIM a few video messages back about what he thinks of the muslim people and their leaders. Forget shooting each other and blowing people up, just settle the War on Terror with insults.

Well still a chance that Kerry can win. Most important thing for this european is that the Dutch PM and his parliament falls soon. Back out of Iraq and fix some dumb mistakes PM made.

And if Dubya really wins........well I guess WW III would be fun :-)

Why would Bakellende fall? Lost his christian majority in the house?

Did any fellow Brits watch Bremner, Bird and Fortune on Sunday night? I thought the comically subtitled bin Laden part was the best.

"So, Americans, vote Bush! He's the best advert for a Jihad there is!"

I've noticed that you aren't too bright sometimes Opal, you try hard and come close though.

Bush currently holds 269 "EV's". The very best Kerry can do is tie. He HAS to win Ohio to do that. If there were to be a tie, then the House will vote as the tie breaker and elect the next President. Given that the House holds a Republican majority, by several seats, Bush wins either way. Anyways, the point is moot, Bush will win Ohio... even after Kerry sues and puts the 2000 vote 'Florida shoes' on his feet in an attempt to so-called "steal" the election. Accept the fact that Bush won, and move on, it's a done deal... you'll have a better day if you do

weeeeeeeeee :D

Unless you are watching Fox News, its still 254 to 252 according to C-Span, BBC and CNN plus numerous others, so bush doesn't have 269 EV's yet.

I've noticed that you aren't too bright sometimes Opal, you try hard and come close though.

Bush currently holds 269 "EV's". The very best Kerry can do is tie. He HAS to win Ohio to do that. If there were to be a tie, then the House will vote as the tie breaker and elect the next President. Given that the House holds a Republican majority, by several seats, Bush wins either way. Anyways, the point is moot, Bush will win Ohio... even after Kerry sues and puts the 2000 vote 'Florida shoes' on his feet in an attempt to so-called "steal" the election. Accept the fact that Bush won, and move on, it's a done deal... you'll have a better day if you do

weeeeeeeeee :D
I don't see how you figure up 269 EVs. From what I'm looking at, Bush has 254, Kerry has 252, and there are 3 states that haven't been called yet. In fact, if you're giving Bush two of the three uncalled state, you just game him Iowa and New Mexico (5 + 7 = 12), so Bush has 266. If Kerry wins Ohio, he has 272, not 269. I don't see where you're getting the three other Bush votes from. Thanks for attacking my intelligence though, despite the fact that I'm not the one that buys into propaganda (from either side).

weeeeeeeeee :D

Are you ok...? :confused:

Unless you are watching Fox News, its still 254 to 252 according to C-Span, BBC and CNN plus numerous others, so bush doesn't have 269 EV's yet.

Hey, you know that FOX News is a news program for the kiddo and his parents only feed him this. BBC is a brand of cornflakes for that humanoide specy.

Why is God on Bush's side?

Why is God on Bush's side?

Cause Bush hears voices in his head. That is scarry.

Hey, you know that FOX News is a news program for the kiddo and his parents only feed him this. BBC is a brand of cornflakes for that humanoide specy.

poor kid :p

Well still a chance that Kerry can win. Most important thing for this european is that the Dutch PM and his parliament falls soon. Back out of Iraq and fix some dumb mistakes PM made.

And if Dubya really wins........well I guess WW III would be fun :-)

Okay... one more time. Here's an education for you... no charge:

Bush currently holds 269 "Electoral Votes" (out of a total 538 possible). The very best Kerry can do now is tie. Bush already holds exactly 50% of the electorate. Kerry HAS to win Ohio, and the last remaining states to do that. If there were to be a tie, then the House will vote as the tie breaker and elect the next President. Given that the House holds a Republican majority, by several seats, Bush wins either way. Anyways, the point is moot, Bush will win Ohio. Accept the fact that Bush won, and move on, it's a done deal... you'll have a better day if you do.

Is it too late for Britain to become the 51st state? We could easily swing the vote Kerry's way.... ;)

poor bastard :p

He must be :p
You to BTW :D

He must be :p
You to BTW :D

oh thanks :p

Okay... one more time. Here's an education for you... no charge:

Bush currently holds 269 "Electoral Votes" (out of a total 538 possible). The very best Kerry can do now is tie. Bush already holds exactly 50% of the electorate. Kerry HAS to win Ohio, and the last remaining states to do that. If there were to be a tie, then the House will vote as the tie breaker and elect the next President. Given that the House holds a Republican majority, by several seats, Bush wins either way. Anyways, the point is moot, Bush will win Ohio. Accept the fact that Bush won, and move on, it's a done deal... you'll have a better day if you do.


where the hell are you getting 269 from?!?! As i pointed out earlier only Fox is saying that, where as near enough all others are still showing a 254 - 252 as two states are out and ohio undecided.

Is it too late for Britain to become the 51st state? We could easily swing the vote Kerry's way.... ;)
According to CNN there are "51 states including DC"

And Meatopiaa, stop telling people Bush has 269 until you prove it. You're giving Bush Iowa and New Mexico, which are both too close to call, plus three other EVs that CSPAN, BBC, and CNN have all project for Kerry, and then saying "Now Kerry needs Ohio to tie."

The fact of the matter is, the only place saying Bush has 269 is Fox. BBC, CNN, and CSPAN are all in line saying that it is 254-252, Bush lead, with all 4 of Maine going to Kerry, New Hampshire to Kerry (was called late), and Ohio, New Mexico, and Iowa unprojected.

oh thanks :p

Well I am going to ski a bit, our slopes are open since last weekend. W won the pop vote so in most EU countries he would have won. But guys that here voices won't run for president here but would be helped by our social security.

By all, going to taste some powder.

Cause Bush hears voices in his head. That is scarry.

ah...I see.

It all makes sense now.

Is it too late for Britain to become the 51st state? We could easily swing the vote Kerry's way.... ;)

Never thought of that.

Would we be able to cede from the union and rejoin the EU in time to stop french, german, austrian and former-soviet-union-ian nazis from becoming president of europe?

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20041108&s=facts

And people think they haven't been had by the Bush administration

Well I am going to ski a bit, our slopes are open since last weekend. W won the pop vote so in most EU countries he would have won. But guys that here voices won't run for president here but would be helped by our social security.

By all, going to taste some powder.
Meh...if it was based on popular vote, Bush wouldn't be up for re-election, so that's out of the question.

By the way guys, everyone was ignoring my about how a guy can win even though he was beaten by a large percentage in the popular vote...it looks like Kerry only needs 170,000 (150,000 in Ohio and 20,000 in Iowa) to win the EV, even though that would make Bush the winner of the popular vote by over 3 million and Kerry the winner of the EC.

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20041108&s=facts

And people think they haven't been had by the Bush administration

A liberal quoting from "The Nation" is like a conservative quoting from "National Review" ... interesting, but hardly credible.

Never thought of that.

Would we be able to cede from the union and rejoin the EU in time to stop french, german, austrian and former-soviet-union-ian nazis from becoming president of europe?


I think the real question is, who is going to pay for the fleet of tugboats to tow the UK across the atlantic? I nominate the American electorate, after all it's for their own good.

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans? And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay. Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.

Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that. Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.

And if you don't like it, Hillary Clinton will run for President in 2008 and you can have another chance. Better luck next time!

Oh yeah... I want to gloat a little bit here...



http://members.cox.net/logan5/Images/7023r.jpg


There are very few Europeans who are Anti American. They are Anti American government. Read the Threads properly. However this might change due. I have spent a lot of time all over America and while I found some people to be enlightened and current in the world of politics-i can only assume you are too. A very large percentage have no notion of the outside world, believing if the world doesn't revolve around America than its not worth knowing. As already mentioned I do believe that most nation states users are well up in political affairs and know when they are being fed mass propaganda. The issue is the mass propaganda of the American Media. Fox News should lose it's licence for complete distortion of the facts. While most media is biast in some way or another, american media really takes the biscit The perception amoung certain groups that any non Americans only believe the Micheal Moore info and are die hard Clinton fans isn't exactly true. I strongly urge you to look before you leap.
...The Chances of Hillary Clinton getting in are very very very slim.

OH MY GOD PEOPLE,

STOP WATCHING FOX NEWS..they can't count

I only read a couple of pages of this thread before deciding to ask this question: Why does Europe hate America so bad? I am relatively new to NS, but have seen so many derogatory remarks about the US(and the same goes for my country bashing yours). I would love to visit Europe and meet some of the people and I would definitely not base my opinion of Brits just by what some people say about you over here. I doubt the people who make these remarks have actually had much interaction with each other to have an informed opinion or reason to "hate". I have 2 friends who are in London and they are simply fabulous. I just thought after reading all the "Stupid americans who voted for Bush" comments and the " Europe can kiss my ass" comments, that I should ask why all the hatred and animosity?

I think the real question is, who is going to pay for the fleet of tugboats to tow the UK across the atlantic? I nominate the American electorate, after all it's for their own good.
Yehaa!! Better weather and Hooters(TM)!! Do we have to take Northern Ireland? No offence to you boys but don't think EIRE would be much pleased if we set up a bunch of high powered pneumatic drills, snap NI off and tow it behind us.

Can we really impose the cost on the US electorate seeing as they have to put up with four more years of Bush economics? How about just the people who voted for him?

Europe doesn't hate the US. Maybe a little jealous because of the whole land : people ratio. We might hate the way the political system is run on the basis of 'who has the most money?' And the way many americans (from the media coverage) seem to vote Bush because he's:
a) their neighbour
b) a nice guy
c) tough on terrorism (he creates terrorism in places which were relatively happy)
Not even the BBC gives a decent representation of things anymore, not since they started firing people for disagreeing with the government.

Now it all stand clear!

Two times in a row the americans have elected a person that doesn't care for anything but rich people and war.
Have you not learnt anything from Iraq?

You US americans are so naive!
:headbang:

Read 2 posts above you. People don't have Americans. Stop being so paranoid. Personally I believe the world is going to become a pretty scary place over the next few years. This would happen no matter who won the election. But Europeans believe that Bush just isn't right for the job. He just really rubs people up the wrong way.

Yehaa!! Better weather and Hooters(TM)!! Do we have to take Northern Ireland. No offence to you boys but don't think EIRE would be much pleased if we set up a bunch of high powered pneumatic drills, snap NI off and tow it behind us.

What shall we do with Anglesey? Scottish Isles? Can we really impose the cost on the US electorate seeing as they have to put up with four more years of Bush economics? How about just the people who voted for him?


Hey speaking as an Irish it'd slove a lot of problems. Please feel free to take Ian Paisely..the IRA, Gerry Adams and the gang and while your at it can you take Bertie Ahern? Then we'll go halves on the cost of the cutting equipment?

Hey speaking as an Irish it'd slove a lot of problems. Please feel free to take Ian Paisely..the IRA, Gerry Adams and the gang and while your at it can you take Bertie Ahern? Then we'll go halves on the cost of the cutting equipment?
We'll drop them in the Atlantic on the way over..
Can we have some of your beer before we go? US stuff is crap: Budweiser, President of Beers

compulsory : blueprint of the whole population's opinion, even of those who don't have an opinion.
non-compulsory : blueprint of the opinion of those that actually care about and are involved in politics.
I'd be happy with compulsory voting provided there's a "None of the above" option.

There are very few Europeans who are Anti American. They are Anti American government.
This is something which it seems many people in other countries don't understand about America. Since the US is a republic, those we elect to office are, in a very real sense, us ( or at least that is what we choose to believe ). Most Americans resent being told they "should" vote a certain way, particularly by non-Americans. This combination leads many in America to conclude an anti-American bias on the part of Europeans, which angers and mystifes them.


The issue is the mass propaganda of the American Media. Fox News should lose it's licence for complete distortion of the facts. While most media is biast in some way or another, american media really takes the biscit.

In your opinion. We see things through different filters ... us through an American myopia, you through a European myopia. Fox News has become the most popular news source on cable. One of the reasons for this is the perception among many Americans that most of the so-called "mainstream media" reporters and commentators fall into the "we know better than you what is best for you" category, which, as I have pointed out, breeds resentment.

I find Meatopia's comments on propaganda hillarious.. The farking us media would be the dream of the likes of Goebbels and his peers, powerful corporations controlled by a small handful of people with interests in becoming more powerful...

Speaking from a place where I regularly watch the BBC, CBC, CNN, France-1, RFN... I can tell you its not the other world media that sounds like "spoon-fed propaganda" its the freaking american media!

And Bush is a wingnut whos going to continue his great job of alienating america's allies, yay! four more years of cowboy foreign policy! Wooo!
... At least the comedians will be given PLENTY of material...

Now it all stand clear!

Two times in a row the americans have elected a person that doesn't care for anything but rich people and war. Have you not learnt anything from Iraq?

You US americans are so naive!

Ahem. If, as you say, President Bush "doesn't care for anything but rich people," then how on earth could he be re-elected? There certainly aren't that many "rich people" in America. I'm certainly not "rich," and I voted for him!

We'll drop them in the Atlantic on the way over..
Can we have some of your beer before we go? US stuff is crap: Budweiser, President of Beers


Of course except we have more guinness in stock. Didn't like that President remark tho!!!!!

... At least the comedians will be given PLENTY of material...
..And, lo.. upon that daye didst the politicall satirists danse with joy and upon that daye didst flowe the champagne in many houses of stand uppe comedians..

Of course except we have no more guinness in stock. Didn't like that President remark tho!!!!!
Don't worry. Does anyone else find Guinness foul? Was more after a couple hundred barrels of Caffreys or similar. Something for the trip. Please, Bud's awful!!

Ahem. If, as you say, President Bush "doesn't care for anything but rich people," then how on earth could he be re-elected? There certainly aren't that many "rich people" in America. I'm certainly not "rich," and I voted for him!
Again with the logic. Bush cares for the rich. The poster didn't say 'only the rich care for Bush'. He doesn't mind exploiting the non-rich and persuading them to vote for him. Makes political sense.

Ahem. If, as you say, President Bush "doesn't care for anything but rich people," then how on earth could he be re-elected? There certainly aren't that many "rich people" in America. I'm certainly not "rich," and I voted for him!

The same way Kerry got his votes, I assume - through $ millions of advertising.

I'm not American, by the way, so it doesn't really bother me who won. If the people want four more years of him, they should get it. If they made the wrong choice, they're punishing themselves.

The title of this thread is when will the europeans learn, right?

It should be when will the Americans learn. The electoral college system benefits no-one but the lawyers, who apparently run the US elections now.

And oficially its still only 254-252... come on democrats!

The same way Kerry got his votes, I assume - through $ millions of advertising.

I'm not American, by the way, so it doesn't really bother me who won. If the people want four more years of him, they should get it. If they made the wrong choice, they're punishing themselves.

I agree with that last, but I think you seriously overestimate the influence of advertising in general and political advertising in particular.

This is something which it seems many people in other countries don't understand about America. Since the US is a republic, those we elect to office are, in a very real sense, us ( or at least that is what we choose to believe ). Most Americans resent being told they "should" vote a certain way, particularly by non-Americans. This combination leads many in America to conclude an anti-American bias on the part of Europeans, which angers and mystifes them.

In your opinion. We see things through different filters ... us through an American myopia, you through a European myopia. Fox News has become the most popular news source on cable. One of the reasons for this is the perception among many Americans that most of the so-called "mainstream
media" reporters and commentators fall into the "we know better than you what is best for you" category, which, as I have pointed out, breeds resentment.


Who doesn't hate being told how to vote? But what you must remember is that the US is the only country in the world uses elections can have a lasting effect on everyone else. This anti american stuff comes down to ....Media. You also say that elected officals are a representation of yourselves. I live in a republic too. While the Irish voting system differs to the American one our government by no means a proper representation of the Irish people. In the last election the Irish people fell hook, line and sinker for the mass propaganda coming from fianna fail(current gov party). They
lied about the state of the economy, health care, educations etc. And within 6 weeks of their re election the country was fuming realising it had been hood winked. My point is that governments action during elections are very different to a few months/years down the road. Showing that in most countries voters should logically question all election mandates. As said all ready the out come of the election is important to every one

I agree with that last, but I think you seriously overestimate the influence of advertising in general and political advertising in particular.

Well, advertising can't be that ineffective, as people buy a lot of crap products.

As for political advertising, if it's not very effective, then a lot of money was wasted.

Ahem. If, as you say, President Bush "doesn't care for anything but rich people," then how on earth could he be re-elected? There certainly aren't that many "rich people" in America. I'm certainly not "rich," and I voted for him!

Only the rich and stupid voted for him, and "There certainly aren't that many "rich people" in America."

For the Record, this is a joke before the fighting starts.

People want to know why so many people elected Bush? Well, its sooo easy to use peoples fear and hope to let them think your the best choice. Bush used 11 September and people now thinking hes protecting them.
Thats btw the reason why the rest of the world hates Bush. They dont have the same hope and fear like americans, that have fallen in masses to bushs propaganda. Im looking forward to you little atomar war, that Bush one day will start....

Propaganda is very effective as you have to know. Ever heard of this crazy man Hinkelhuber, who called itself Hitler and then started WW2?

A rather cynical possibility for how Bush won:

"Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger."

-- Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials

Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time.
How can you be so sure that it is not you who has been fed propaganda? Maybe what we know is closer to the truth?

Only the rich and stupid voted for him, and "There certainly aren't that many "rich people" in America."

For the Record, this is a joke before the fighting starts.

I know. I also know I am not stupid, so either way, it's kewl. :)

It's good that Bush was re-elected. He's good for the Anti American sentiment in Europe. I'm glad he was.

It's good that Bush was re-elected. He's good for the Anti American sentiment in Europe. I'm glad he was.

I'm glad he was too, but because I'm becoming more and more anti-European, largely because of statements like yours.

I'm glad he was too, but because I'm becoming more and more anti-European, largely because of statements like yours.
Well, then at least you now know how I became Anti-American in the first place.

Either Bush cheated (heaven forfend) or people were too ashamed to own up to voting for him.
People shouldn't have to "own up" for who they voted for. It's a private ballot.

Yeah. Shame on all us stupid, ignoble asses who had the unmitigated GALL to vote for someone other than a member of the liberal elite! I mean, after all ... liberals know SO much better than we how we should vote and live and think, right? Democracy is ok as long as we just rubber-stamp whatever candidate all the liberal elitists think we "should" vote for, right?
Because Bush is a regular man of the people, right? :rolleyes:

The day that America chose the "under god" as more important than "liberty and justice for all".
Great post.

Look you moron I dont give a damn who rules your country, as long as they stop fucking up the world for the rest of us. But they wont. Frankly it doesnt really suprise me that Bush got in (even if the vote was false I dont think it would matter), as we ARE talking about America - land of the slavers, home of the idiots.

I only read a couple of pages of this thread before deciding to ask this question: Why does Europe hate America so bad? I am relatively new to NS, but have seen so many derogatory remarks about the US(and the same goes for my country bashing yours). I would love to visit Europe and meet some of the people and I would definitely not base my opinion of Brits just by what some people say about you over here. I doubt the people who make these remarks have actually had much interaction with each other to have an informed opinion or reason to "hate". I have 2 friends who are in London and they are simply fabulous. I just thought after reading all the "Stupid americans who voted for Bush" comments and the " Europe can kiss my ass" comments, that I should ask why all the hatred and animosity?

Being a European living in America I can tell you that I have dealt with all sorts of negativity from Americans. One reason for this is because of my location at the moment, small town Missouri, which hasn't been very receptive to myself or my family. Based on this I have also come to dislike America. Now of course I'm not saying that I "hate" everyone, I have lots of friends here, but the majority of the Americans that I come in contact with on a daily basis (I work at a hospital) tend to be, well.....not that smart. Even most of my friends seem to have a "holier then thou" attitude when it comes to Europe or any other country for that matter. I think the animosity between Americans and Europeans comes from what we've been taught in school, what we've heard on the news, what we are told (especially when we were younger), and the people we have come in contact with. Since I've been immersed in European and American culture I think I have the unique opportunity to look at both up close and personal, and in doing so I've been able to make up my own mind about them. Even though I'm living here now, in two years I'll be done with school and able to go back home, and I can't wait. :)

europe rules and us brits always end up saving yr ass . when will u americans learn that thats its us who end up fighting yr wars .

You sure you're not American...that's some nasty spelling! Don't fuzz the line between us stupid ignorant Americans and you super intelligent Europeans. XD

On topic though...the Europeans ARE educated fairly decently about the workings in America. America is watched carefully by the world, loathed as much as it is loved. To think they are being fed propoganda, that may be true in some cases, but only some. America prefers to corrupt it's own country that way. This seriously was one of the most disgusting campaigns in history.

- Asylum Nova

Your president will ask for our support on his knees in this or another war.

BTW: 4 MORE YEARS OF MICHAEL MOORE FILMS :D I am looking forward to it. Hahahaha

Ya, I bet Mike is really happy that Bush won. How much more money will he make in the coming 4 years?!

Seriously though. I think it's bad for America that Bush was elected, i.e. good for the rest of the world, because he's increasing the public and trade deficit. Furthermore, by waging wars and exercising other forms of brutal foreign policy he will hopefully help unite the world against his country. Dont get me wrong. I'm not some kind of nutjob who wants america to be wiped out or anything. I just don't think Kerry's policies are that much less imperialistic & neocolonial than Bush's. And maybe if the rest of the world gets really pissed off, the american people will vote someone a bit more friendly into the oval shed.

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans? And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay.
That's fine, as long as you (ie the States) don't decide what's best for other countries as well. But unfortunately, you just can't help yourself from meddling, can you? Rather forcefully too at times, I might add.

Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.
Rightttt.....so the ENTIRE world has been fed the same propoganda (since approx 70% of the World support Kerry). But ONLY in the States, have you been lucky enough to hear the truth. :rolleyes:

Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that. Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.

Considering something like 70% of Bush voters still believe that Saddam had something to do with 9/11 and had WMDs, it's a bit rich to talk about other country's propoganda and lies. Or American voter intelligence for that matter.
I posted this in another thread, but here it is again, cause it's pertinent:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3973197.stm
Religion - rather than class, ethnic origin or education - has become the key determinant of voting in the 2004 presidential race, according to an exit poll conducted by the Associated Press news agency...22% of the electorate said "moral values" was the issue that mattered most in how they voted
Not the economy, not terrorism, not the Iraq war, but how often you go to Church is what mattered the most. Which means all the stuff you posted about how intelligent and informed Americans when they vote isn't true. All the majority is concerned with is how often the candidate goes to Church and how fervently he believes in Jewish fairy tales. Real rational reason for voting. :rolleyes:

If you read the BBC post, it also had this to say:
Democrats also ran strongly among unmarried and young people, families with incomes under $30,000 a year, and among the highly educated.
Of course I know you can be intelligent without being educated, but you can't be highly educated without being at least (usually above) average intelligence. So it does poke a few (more) holes in your claim that GOP voters are intelligent. Also note the poor families bit - they can see who would help them the most.

I didn't include the pic file, but I just want to say, it's not bad!

Just one request to the Republicans of you:

Please don't start another war, unless you say the truth about the "WHY"-Question.

Otherwise the position of the "last friends of the US in Germany" (meaning: mine and that of about 1% of the German population) will be much worse in the future.


Well, at least Michael Moore is on the looser-side for once. That's something to smile about. :)

In the last election the Irish people fell hook, line and sinker for the mass propaganda coming from fianna fail(current gov party). They lied about the state of the economy, health care, educations etc. And within 6 weeks of their re election the country was fuming realising it had been hood winked.
Not to mention the citizenship referendum! (I voted No - me=1 in 5) For the foreigners, if there is ever a proposal to change the Irish Constitution, it must go before the people in a popular vote. Five months ago, an amendment to remove citizenship as a birthright to everyone born here passed by 80% of the vote. The government relied on anecdotal "evidence", fearmongering, and pandering to ignorance and racism. Like Bush, i suppose.

It's good that Bush was re-elected. He's good for the Anti American sentiment in Europe. I'm glad he was.
So you put the interests of the Anti-American fringe above the interests of the world in general?

I'm glad he was too, but because I'm becoming more and more anti-European, largely because of statements like yours.
Maybe you should come over hee and meet some Europeans. We're not as snooty as you think. Don't judge us all by representatives of the Anti-American fringe.

It's good that Bush was re-elected. He's good for the Anti American sentiment in Europe. I'm glad he was.

I would like to point out as a British person that we voted for Tony Blair (not me personally). So who are we to complain?

I would like to point out as a British person that we voted for Tony Blair (not me personally). So who are we to complain?
I'm not British and don't realy understand what you are trying to say?

I'm not British and don't realy understand what you are trying to say?

Not you personally,
I mean there's been an uproar amongst europeans, especially Brits about Bush being President. Although I'm anti-Bush, Tony Blair is just as bad but we don't spend half as much time complaining about him.

The British accuse Americans of meddling in international politics, then we complain about their president when our own Prime Minister is a joke.

I actually feel kind of sorry for all the U.S soldiers serving in Iraq - it looks like they won't be getting any reinforcements for a while.

Not you personally,
I mean there's been an uproar amongst europeans, especially Brits about Bush being President. Although I'm anti-Bush, Tony Blair is just as bad but we don't spend half as much time complaining about him.

The British accuse Americans of meddling in international politics, then we complain about their president when our own Prime Minister is a joke.

Give some reasons or I'll assume you're just reciting populist anti-Blairism.

Not you personally,
I mean there's been an uproar amongst europeans, especially Brits about Bush being President. Although I'm anti-Bush, Tony Blair is just as bad but we don't spend half as much time complaining about him.

The British accuse Americans of meddling in international politics, then we complain about their president when our own Prime Minister is a joke.
Ah right. Yeah. Afterall Blair had troops relocated in Iraq trying to help Bush gain popularity points. Wether it helped or not I do not know. But the intentions where clear. Eventhough Blair of course denies it.

I actually feel kind of sorry for all the U.S soldiers serving in Iraq - it looks like they won't be getting any reinforcements for a while.

I'm sure Britain will send some, can't be easy having bricks thrown at you when all you've got is an M16 assault rifle and some grenades.

Not you personally,
I mean there's been an uproar amongst europeans, especially Brits about Bush being President. Although I'm anti-Bush, Tony Blair is just as bad but we don't spend half as much time complaining about him.

The British accuse Americans of meddling in international politics, then we complain about their president when our own Prime Minister is a joke.

All british politicians are a joke... who cares?

Plus why should I winge about useless american politicians? they're all useless. Vote anarchy in 2008!

Not the economy, not terrorism, not the Iraq war, but how often you go to Church is what mattered the most.
Yeah, I'm shocked that when the USA is fighting a war against terrorism for its survival as a nation, people vote entirely on issues like abortion and gay marriage.

I'm sure Britain will send some, can't be easy having bricks thrown at you when all you've got is an M16 assault rifle and some grenades.
Or sitting in an attack helicopter. Imagine what would happen if one of those bricks hit's it while hovering 40 metres in the air. Britain should send more troops.

Maybe you should come over hee and meet some Europeans. We're not as snooty as you think. Don't judge us all by representatives of the Anti-American fringe.

I've met a goodly number of Europeans, most of them when I was in Germany, Italy, France, etc. My sister lives in Amsterdam. When ( and IF ) I can ever again afford to travel, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Finland, et al, are on my list to visit. I like most Europeans I have met. The only reason I said what I did was because I get sick unto death of all the rabid anti-Americanism on here. If I offended, I humbly apologize. :(

Or sitting in an attack helicopter. Imagine what would happen if one of those bricks hit's it while hovering 40 metres in the air. Britain should send more troops.

I hear they may be developing a boulder

propoganda (which is an art form in Europe)

Actually mate, the MOCKING of propaganda is an art-form here ;)

Ah right. Yeah. Afterall Blair had troops relocated in Iraq trying to help Bush gain popularity points. Wether it helped or not I do not know. But the intentions where clear. Eventhough Blair of course denies it.


Oh for Gods sake, just because he agreed to a U.S request to supply reinforcements to the Sunni triangle is not tantamount to helping Bush get re-elected, unless that is you think that rational military decisions with the intention of stabilising Iraq and countering the insurgency should be put on the backbenches until after America has "decided".

I hear they may be developing a boulder
Oh god!!!! Whats will they develop next? Clubs? Bow and arrow? Spears?

Oh god!!!! Whats will they develop next? Clubs? Bow and arrow? Spears?

Dunno, maybe carbombs and assault rifles.

Oh for Gods sake, just because he agreed to a U.S request to supply reinforcements to the Sunni triangle is not tantamount to helping Bush get re-elected, unless that is you think that rational military decisions with the intention of stabilising Iraq and countering the insurgency should be put on the backbenches until after America has "decided".
Rational? What was rational about it? The US have what? 100,000+ troops in Iraq and they need Britain to send reinforcments?

Oh for Gods sake, just because he agreed to a U.S request to supply reinforcements to the Sunni triangle is not tantamount to helping Bush get re-elected, unless that is you think that rational military decisions with the intention of stabilising Iraq and countering the insurgency should be put on the backbenches until after America has "decided".

It's not just that though, Blair has backed Bush regardless of what he has said or what the British people have wanted. As Prime Minister of Britain he is supposed to listen to us, not the American president. If George Bush announces plans to demolish Britain, kill all the citizens and rebuild a theme park in its place entitled "Britain's A Big Pile Of S**T world!", Blair will be 100% behind him.

I say, well done, right-wing America, and go kick some terrorist butt for us leftist Europeans too scaredy-cat to do it ourselves.

When you go and "kick some terrorist butt" as you so eloquently put it, you end up with an Iraq sized mess. The best way to beat terrorism is through subtle tactics. Ameirca and Americans should learnt that rather than steamrollering across every problem they find with the world.

Rational? What was rational about it? The US have what? 100,000+ troops in Iraq and they need Britain to send reinforcments?

You're right, I guess cuz Iraq is such a safe place at the moment, reinforcements would be completely unecessary.

Many Europeans would be giving less comment on Americans if they elected a president by his program and not according to what the media say. Has any american looked at the things Bush said he would do and the things he actually did at the end of his term? Economy has plunged, he massively overspent taxmoney on wars that could have been resolved with diplomacy and he has done hardly anything to help american citizens on a social level (as in creating employment and fighting poverty). And still...many of them vote for the "friend" of terminator. How brainwashed are those people. This is a black day for Europe too. Bush doesn't see that working with Europe instead of against Europe, would be much beneficiant for the both of us. Since Bush broke UN and NATO protocol he has no moral ground anymore to further "police the world" (read: defend American oil interests).

A smart man choses the best sollution for a problem, a stupid man grabs his guns and goes to war.

It's not just that though, Blair has backed Bush regardless of what he has said or what the British people have wanted. As Prime Minister of Britain he is supposed to listen to us, not the American president. If George Bush announces plans to demolish Britain, kill all the citizens and rebuild a theme park in its place entitled "Britain's A Big Pile Of S**T world!", Blair will be 100% behind him.

Agreed, Blair really ought to be more openly dissenting of a lot of Bushs' foreign policies - but I certainly don't agree with people who call this decision a political one rather than a military one.

Look you moron I dont give a damn who rules your country, as long as they stop fucking up the world for the rest of us. But they wont. Frankly it doesnt really suprise me that Bush got in (even if the vote was false I dont think it would matter), as we ARE talking about America - land of the slavers, home of the idiots.

Hooray!

Hooray!
Seconded. Hooray! Hooray!

I would like to point out as a British person that we voted for Tony Blair (not me personally). So who are we to complain?

Yes but to be fair, Tony Blair isnt a moron. He is just a deceitful, manipulative, arrogant, smarmy, typically New Labour politician. I think if he weren't Prime Minister, he'd be some sort of second hand car sales man.

In order to fuel his paedophilic needs...

The guy is too creepy.

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans?

I'm not european, but I'm sure you would put me in the group of people to whom this is directed, so...:

First: The dislike of the world (all the world, not Europe) against Bush have nothing to do with how many people from the United States vote for him.

Second: It's a shame that Bush doesn't think that way, maybe he would make the troops come back from Irak an let them decide on th... hahaha, sorry I could even finish that sentence, too much sarcasm and irony, even for me.

Third:That most of the people from the United States have no freaking idea of what all this is about has been proven once again, how can you expect the rest of the world to be ok with it?

Fourth: My condolences to the american people, specially to those of you who voted for Bush...

The above posts are correct, Libitia was spot on. Bush failed to ratify the Kyoto Protocol and when climate change causes the whole of Holland, The Thames Valley, The Ruhr and a whole lot of other important places in Europe to be underwater then we can thank him for his sensible judgement. As Tony Blair is just Dick and Rummy's puppet just like George Bush, British troops are killing and being killed at his whim, he has a fundamental power over the British soldiers and the nation as a whole it is fair that the 51st state should be able to vote in the US Presidential Elections. If the Citizens of the United States are too pig ignorant to see through the cynical burlesque that is American politics and that George Bush is a fascist then they should be denied the vote and re-colonized. Republican scum make me sick they should all be rounded up and... ahem. I think I should stop myself there.
And he can't spell.

In order to fuel his paedophilic needs...

The guy is too creepy.
WTF? Blair is paedophilic? That's going a bit extreme doncha think?
I agree with the guy above you. Blair'd make an excellent used car salesman.
Punter: "Hang on - it's a red Ford Anglia for the front half and a brown Austin Allegro for the back half!"
Blair (smiling that creepy smile of his):"Well, you see, that's your original two-tone car that is! You get the all the benefits of both Ford and British Leyland reliability!"
etc etc

While President re-elect Bush sits comfortably in the White House, enjoying a popular vote superiority of 4,000,000 +/- over Kerry, as well as an unsurpassable electorate lead, does everyone the world over (especially in Europe) now see that he is overwhelmingly supported by Americans? And since it is our country, it really only matters what we decide is best for us anyay. Do you now see through the fog of your anti-American sentiment that you've been being fed nothing but propoganda (which is an art form in Europe) by those who had the most to lose if Bush won and everything to gain if Kerry won? He would never have been re-elected if things truly were as so many of you have claimed here on these boards.

Please believe me when I say, if Bush and the lies about Bush and his administration were half as bad as you've been spoon fed and brain washed with, America would NOT have re-elected him. America would most certainly NOT have given him a 4,000,000 +/- vote supremecy over Kerry. We are smarter than that. Bush is not perfect, and maybe not even preferred if you could pick ANYONE to be President, but he is far, far better than John Kerry. Half way across the world, you have been lied to, spoon fed propoganda, and deceived for so long a time. But don't feel bad, many people right here in the U.S. were in the same shoes. Thankfully, the mature, intelligent silent majority has yet again prevailed.




http://members.cox.net/logan5/Images/7023r.jpg

we've been lied to and fed propaganda? excuse me? while i'm not saying all our media is unbiased, at least it's not run (with the exception of italy) by power-hungry mediamogols with their own agenda (tax breaks anyone - let the rich get richer!).

and for the last time: you're not just choosing a president for YOUR country. bush will decide the course of world history for the next 4 years :headbang: (making me very scared). this is all the more true since he pushed aside UN mechanisms and set a very dangerous precedent. damnit, think man!

We'll drop them in the Atlantic on the way over..
Can we have some of your beer before we go? US stuff is crap: Budweiser, President of Beers

And the scary thing is... they call it 'beer'.

Then they go visit Europe for a week, and wonder why they are eating the carpet after only two drinks...

I've met a goodly number of Europeans, most of them when I was in Germany, Italy, France, etc. My sister lives in Amsterdam. When ( and IF ) I can ever again afford to travel, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Finland, et al, are on my list to visit. I like most Europeans I have met. The only reason I said what I did was because I get sick unto death of all the rabid anti-Americanism on here. If I offended, I humbly apologize. :(
That's cool. Anti-Bushism and criticism of US foreign policy is widespread here, but hatred of the American people is not. Anti-Americanism is pretty much just a feature of the extreme left and (yes!) the extreme right.

However it appears to me that in America, particularly "red states", anti-Europeanism is becoming more and more mainstream. I see a lot of Americans here saying how much they hate limey assholes or French monkeys. Am I right or just paranoid?

Your'e right. The Daily telegraph sent some letters to ohio voters and got the most disgusting correspondence of flaming that could be imagined. Except from democrat voters. :rolleyes: Who replied in a crodial manner to the paper (nb, the telegraph is almost as right wing as FOX)

the other strange thing one that really made me surprised to see this thread is that most americans barely believe there is a world past the american borders, (dont try and deny that, its true) so why this thread would attract any attention at all is quite odd.

And lay off Tony Blair, because the alternatives are Michael Dracula von Howard (<shudder>) a drunkard (although Charles Kennedy is actually alright) a set of tree hugging neo-hippies, a group of splinter tories led by the worlds most obscure backbencher (UKIP, <double shudder>) and some neo nazis (the BNP, just dont go there. Blair is the sensible candidate by a mile!

And lay off Tony Blair, because the alternatives are Michael Dracula von Howard (<shudder>) a drunkard (although Charles Kennedy is actually alright) a set of tree hugging neo-hippies, a group of splinter tories led by the worlds most obscure backbencher (UKIP, <double shudder>) and some neo nazis (the BNP, just dont go there. Blair is the sensible candidate by a mile!
Blair may be the best option at the moment (not surprising when you look at the alternatives), but he's still a tit.

Being a European living in America I can tell you that I have dealt with all sorts of negativity from Americans. One reason for this is because of my location at the moment, small town Missouri, which hasn't been very receptive to myself or my family. Based on this I have also come to dislike America. Now of course I'm not saying that I "hate" everyone, I have lots of friends here, but the majority of the Americans that I come in contact with on a daily basis (I work at a hospital) tend to be, well.....not that smart. Even most of my friends seem to have a "holier then thou" attitude when it comes to Europe or any other country for that matter. I think the animosity between Americans and Europeans comes from what we've been taught in school, what we've heard on the news, what we are told (especially when we were younger), and the people we have come in contact with. Since I've been immersed in European and American culture I think I have the unique opportunity to look at both up close and personal, and in doing so I've been able to make up my own mind about them. Even though I'm living here now, in two years I'll be done with school and able to go back home, and I can't wait. :)


I'm sorry that you and your family have not received a warm welcome to this country. I guess I take the comments on here too personally since I am an American. I hate that the ignorant judgemental people give us all a bad name. Thats true for any country.

One reason, as a Brit, to have hoped for Bush to go - because Blair would have gone down with him, I'm quite certain. Then we could have had Brown. Who's not perfect, but hell, I'd vote for him, and with very few reservations!

One reason, as a Brit, to have hoped for Bush to go - because Blair would have gone down with him, I'm quite certain. Then we could have had Brown. Who's not perfect, but hell, I'd vote for him, and with very few reservations!
There was an article in the Guardian today about Blair wanting Kerry to win

http://www.guardian.co.uk/guardianpolitics/story/0,,1341993,00.html

I'm British and lefty, but part of me is pleased Bush won. Kerry wouldn't have done much different apart from his handling of the middle east.

People will see a lot they disagree with in Bush (I'm not saying he's wrong, just that the average Brit will disagree with him), hopefully that will push us towards Europe.

As a Brit, I would like to say that the US election doesn't matter in the slightest bit to me. I don't mind if you elect Bush, Kerry, or Lenin's embalmed corpse. Your country, your business. My country's already going downhill too much for me to care about a foreign election.

As a Brit, I would like to say that the US election doesn't matter in the slightest bit to me. I don't mind if you elect Bush, Kerry, or Lenin's embalmed corpse. Your country, your business. My country's already going downhill too much for me to care about a foreign election.

Is the United Kingdom going downhill? I didn't know that. I thought Holland was the worst country in Europe. Tell me, what especially is going wrong in Britain?

Is the United Kingdom going downhill? I didn't know that. I thought Holland was the worst country in Europe. Tell me, what especially is going wrong in Britain?

take a look at the NHS records and public service and you see what he means.. privitisation.. in the words of michael moor "minimi america" :(

Wow ... you just can't trust those crazy EuropeOns. I think we now know why Bush has the majority of American support.

Knock off the flaming. The "misspelling" could have been unintentional; your emphasis through use of shift key clearly is not.

As a Brit, I would like to say that the US election doesn't matter in the slightest bit to me. I don't mind if you elect Bush, Kerry, or Lenin's embalmed corpse. Your country, your business. My country's already going downhill too much for me to care about a foreign election.


LENIN'S EMBALMED CORPSE???!!! That would RULE!!!!!!

As a Brit, I would like to say that the US election doesn't matter in the slightest bit to me. I don't mind if you elect Bush, Kerry, or Lenin's embalmed corpse. Your country, your business. My country's already going downhill too much for me to care about a foreign election.

lol- I like your attitude.

Bush will give Europe a clearer view of what not to do - noone in his sane mind would want to turn the EU into a copy of Bush's Own Country.

The US needs cooperation of the EU and the EU (and the world) needs some cooperation of the US, Bush or no-Bush. ((By the way, many polls showed that "NotBush" would have won over both Bush and Kerry))
It's a small world, after all, even though its much larger than many Us voters perceive it.

The outcome was as expected and frankly I do not expect any surprises in the next two US-elections either. The Bush-camp will see to that. The senate, the house (retailoring voting precincts helps here), the prez and the supreme court are "red" now and will stay so for times to come.

On a sidenote, considering all the slander in the fora and this thread especially, by the kiddo who started this and others who joined (or opposed) him: Did you take the time to look at their NationStates?

Take Meatopiaa... Its hard-nosed, cynical population of 629 million are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government. Crime -- especially youth-related -- is a serious problem. (Bowling for Columbine?) So that is basically what he wants his State to be... what he expects of Dubya's supreme rule.

It is safe to say that we're both happy each not to live in the NationState of the other.

But, hey - it proves that America TRULY IS the land of opportunity: In America, it doesn't matter if you can't do your job, if people think you are going the wrong way, if more than half of the population consistently tells you they don't approve of you. In America, you can be an utter failure, and STILL be President.


They deserve the leaders they vote, and I hope it bites them in the ass.

What is surreal about Bush is that he keeps getting rewarded for failures throughout his career.

I'm sorry that you and your family have not received a warm welcome to this country. I guess I take the comments on here too personally since I am an American. I hate that the ignorant judgemental people give us all a bad name. Thats true for any country.

No need to be sorry. :) I was just trying to maybe help you understand why there might be so much animosity between the two.

No need to be sorry. :) I was just trying to maybe help you understand why there might be so much animosity between the two.

well its sad really. the things that matter most will affect the whole world, and why we cant be harmonious with each other really discouraging.

They deserve the leaders they vote, and I hope it bites them in the ass.

What is surreal about Bush is that he keeps getting rewarded for failures throughout his career.

yes i agree.. but the problem is it will bite the asses of the rest of the world too, world's most powerful nation is everyone's buisness.. pity.. why do we have to suffer for an "internal problem"

yes i agree.. but the problem is it will bite the asses of the rest of the world too, world's most powerful nation is everyone's buisness.. pity.. why do we have to suffer for an "internal problem"


how does Bush make it so horrible for the rest of the world?

Wow ... you just can't trust those crazy EuropeOns. I think we now know why Bush has the majority of American support.
We do? Why?

how does Bush make it so horrible for the rest of the world?
oh please make a topic about that, it needs one! "bush's foreign policy" it should be called.. but i'm not in a debating mood tonight.

I am not sure if this Bush victory is a good or a bad thing for Tony Blair and the British Labour Party.

In one way Mr.Blair is not as isolated and not the only war leader left, as he would have been if Bush lost the election.

However the Republican Party and the Labour Party definitly don't see eye to eye on a lot of issues and many of the Labour Party wanted Kerry to win.
Bush is also a reminder of the highly unpopular relationship between Bush and Blair

However it is not much different between the one Cliton and Blair had, only Cliton was more likely to listen to Blair and they both came from the same political "third Way" and from historically 'left wing' parties.

oh please make a topic about that, it needs one! "bush's foreign policy" it should be called.. but i'm not in a debating mood tonight.
Bush has a foreign policy? Or are we talking about the 'if it moves outside our borders, nuke it' one.