NationStates Jolt Archive

For all of Europe's mocking of the United States, the joke is still on them-- Europe is not producing enough babies to maintain population levels and is soon going to begin rapidly shrinking. For a population to reproduce itself every woman needs to have at least 2 babies, a rate not met by a single European country except for I think Albania. Countries like Russia, Spain and Italy can't even produce 1.3 babies per woman. The conclusion is obvious-- extinction is imminent in a matter of generations, in 100 years French and German will be languages will be akin to ancient Greek or Latin and spoken only by scholars. Russia has already entered the phase of steep population decline. I don't see any solution, Europe is doomed. Hey Europeans do you have any plans to avert this fate? Perhaps you could farm humans in some kind of futuristic factory? Or do you simply just not give a shit? I would fit in the latter category I think.

I have to disagree with you. If there's one thing Europeans aren't bad at, it's screwing themselves.

So you're saying Europe is weakening???

*prepares army of darkness*

I've had my eye on a French Chateau for the longest time...

:mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: < My 1337 army!

So you're saying Europe is weakening???

*prepares army of darkness*

I've had my eye on a French Chateau for the longest time...

:mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: < My 1337 army!
Who are you going to conquer with seven soldiers? Maybe France...

Well, I could name a few places where al ower population wouldn't hurt...

Who are you going to conquer with seven soldiers? Maybe France...

L0lzor, you made da Franc3 j0k3!

L0lzor, you made da Franc3 j0k3!
Any thread about European suckiness almost demands a French joke.

Why are French jokes so unpopular?
French people don't like them and no one else thinks they're jokes!

So, Europe will end up more...Albanian, I guess. It's nothing to lose sleep over, guy.

Who are you going to conquer with seven soldiers? Maybe France...

We had a French Exchange student at our house and in the time we had him (about a month) he learned to strike people and shoot things (we took him to North Dakota, God's home state). We singlehandedly doubled France's military might!

*True Story!!

Lol, European's are having 1.3 babies.

Seriously though, it will take a while for this to begin to happen, and things change rapidily, ecspecially in our day and age. Euro's could start just cranking out 10 babies a woman tommarow. Who knows. Shit happens. :)

:mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: Look, I had a draft!

:mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: Look, I had a draft!
Was it started by Democrats, supported by Democrats, received the only yes votes from Democrats, but blamed on Republicans?

:sniper: SNIPE THE LOSER WHO STARTED THIS THREAD.

:fluffle: yes, mateing, VERY important my friend, but pay attention to these words 3,

Populations flucuate frequently,

So, to cover what i just said for people without brains.. :p

once the population begins to decline enough, people will be able to get better places in life, the 1.3 children will not be competeing with that .7-1.8 or whatever, the people will get more room to breath, and eventully the population will increase again becuse it ineritbily does,

extinction? how the hell could that occur, plus rember there is a constant trend, with any nation.

poor people mate more. :fluffle:

this is becuse htye have less to do, if we got rid of all the tv's in europe i bet that problem would clear up.

so in closeing, lets destroying all the tv's i nthe world, and practice polyogamy, that should fix this problem right uP!

We had a French Exchange student at our house and in the time we had him (about a month) he learned to strike people and shoot things (we took him to North Dakota, God's home state). We singlehandedly doubled France's military might!

*True Story!!


Bullshit!!!!!

0 to 1 isnt doubling.

pop declean means the econ shall hit a wall . ass the pop declean that means less demand witch means less jobs and plus all the old people that will depend on the soicalist gov for helthcare and retirement and housing shit this is going to be an econ doomsday . i wouldnt be suprised if euros started moving to the US in large number agean . when the shit hits the fan .

For all of Europe's mocking of the United States, the joke is still on them-- Europe is not producing enough babies to maintain population levels and is soon going to begin rapidly shrinking. For a population to reproduce itself every woman needs to have at least 2 babies, a rate not met by a single European country except for I think Albania. Countries like Russia, Spain and Italy can't even produce 1.3 babies per woman. The conclusion is obvious-- extinction is imminent in a matter of generations, in 100 years French and German will be languages will be akin to ancient Greek or Latin and spoken only by scholars. Russia has already entered the phase of steep population decline. I don't see any solution, Europe is doomed. Hey Europeans do you have any plans to avert this fate? Perhaps you could farm humans in some kind of futuristic factory? Or do you simply just not give a shit? I would fit in the latter category I think.
I don't see American women churning out babies by the dozen, and for every only child I see here (I'm one) I see at least one other family with two or more kids (my girlfriend is one of five). Maybe it's just where I live.

I don't see American women churning out babies by the dozen, and for every only child I see here (I'm one) I see at least one other family with two or more kids (my girlfriend is one of five). Maybe it's just where I live.
I think we're still birthing like 2.1 kids per woman. Plus we have a bajillion immigrants each year, many from Europe.

I think we're still birthing like 2.1 kids per woman. Plus we have a bajillion immigrants each year, many from Europe.
Meh, you can keep most of Europe. Full of foreigners, you know.

Seriously though, England is already getting overcrowded, mostly due to a shithouse immigration system, so you guys taking a few thousand out of Europe every year is clearing a nice space for us to spill out into - As the old saying goes, France would be a great place to live if it wasn't full of French people.

France would be a great place to live if it wasn't full of French.
I think that could be said for any country. I've been to France, and it was nice seeing stuff, but there were so many...French.

Russia has already entered the phase of steep population decline.

Yeah, it's called immigration. Europe's been doing it for centuries. Meanwhile countries like the US has their figures artificially bolstered by incoming immigrants.

I think that could be said for any country. I've been to France, and it was nice seeing stuff, but there were so many...French.

Nah, Belgium would be a terrible place to live no matter who it was full of.

Nah, Belgium would be a terrible place to live no matter who it was full of.
Oh, is Belgium still around? I must have missed it.

Oh, is Belgium still around? I must have missed it.
It's still around, but it's still a pretend Germany who speak French and keep cows. Oh, and make chocolate. And that's about it.

I know someone who went on holiday to Belgium for 3 weeks. God knows what they spent the whole time doing.
Probably crying. Over the fact they spent all that money to go to bloody Belgium.

Canada's got the same issue of a population that is not growing, but rather being stagnant. We have around 1.6 children per... or something near that. I forget who mentioned it already but they mentioned fluctuating populations and whatnot. They'd be correct, as well with more couples that are career oriented, later on adoption will be a more likely way of having children. No matter what, no nation will go 'extinct' unless the U.S.A. or Russia bombs it back to the Stone Age. It just wouldn't happen.

Even after that nation is bombed like that there will be survivors still living on the soil and emigrants all around to preserve the culture.

Oh, keep up the French jokes guys.

But then again ... Europeans everywhere don't know how to screw properly ... because in the US its the Black and Hispano people who are the ones keeping the country going man ... and ... and they are also the ones that hold the most amount of intelligence in that all to buffonic country of the USA

Spicism ese

Who are you going to conquer with seven soldiers? Maybe France...

Overkill, surely?


Well, I find i hard to say Europe is doing anything, becuase Europe as a "united" institution is only good at screwing up regulations, and giving france and germany power of veto on everything. And the birth lower than death rate is quite common in a period of no growth. these birth adn deeath rates are crude as well, taking no other factors into account. I know; I had to write an essay on it.

Meh, you can keep most of Europe. Full of foreigners, you know.

Seriously though, England is already getting overcrowded, mostly due to a shithouse immigration system, so you guys taking a few thousand out of Europe every year is clearing a nice space for us to spill out into - As the old saying goes, France would be a great place to live if it wasn't full of French people.

And you can keep america, with your crappy accents, stupid politicians, even worse immigration system and mad consumerism. no offence.

PS your television is awful.

PPS and your sport


:rolleyes:

And you can keep america, with your crappy accents, stupid politicians, even worse immigration system and mad consumerism. no offence.

PS your television is awful.

PPS and your sport


:rolleyes:
Hey, it's Britain that invented accents just so their langauge would sound cooler, not us.

it's called migration. the u.s.a. has just as low a birth rate as europe so like don't jump to conclusions and stuff, unless you have the patented jumping to conclusions game.

PS your television is awful.

Whoh, wait a bit. I might be wrong, but wasn't it America that gave creats such as Aqua Teen Hunger Force and Family Guy?

I don't see American women churning out babies by the dozen, and for every only child I see here (I'm one) I see at least one other family with two or more kids (my girlfriend is one of five). Maybe it's just where I live.
i've seen it a couple times actually. There's like 5 families of 15 kids in my town, it's crazy. the sad thing is i'm not exagerating

who needs to expand the population anyway...
this is the 21st century
not some pre industrial age whe labourers are needed
for every industry.

not surprising people aren't having children when
they've seen that all you do is work to try to make ends meet
so you might have some money left to do something you want...

FORTUNE's got a point, the problem is the ones who are reproducing quickest
are the ones i wouldn't want remaining as part of the 'human' race.
:mad:
this bit written a bit too hastily and already opened to misquotation
but TBH - if you saw the people i was talking about, and the things their kids get up to...well!...

yep we don't need masses of workers to keep our economy working. a service economy can thrive with a small population.

There will be a problem with the welfare system: once the baby boom generation gets old, the '70's/'80s generation (wich is a lot smaller) will have to finance their pensions and stuff. In the near future most european welfare states will have to reform a bit to keep things payable. Luckily my government (the netherlands) has allready done that. In countries like italy and france there may be some conflict between the labor unions and the government ahead.

Facts and figures people!

5 member countries of the EU are experiencing at least 2.1 births per woman (the replacement rate: Ireland, France, Luxemburg, the Netherlands and Cyprus) and only 5 EU countries have a decling population (once immigration is taken into account: Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Hungry and Poland) while the other 20 have increasing populations!
(Sourced from http://www.csmb.unimo.it/pubblicazioni/soattiva/soatt/news_release_2004.pdf)

You might wanna research a point before making it.

the netherlands may still have 2.1 children pp, but in 20 years our population will stabilise at 17,2 million and then decline. combined with the big baby-boom generation retiring, we do have a serious issue here.

Nulands:
the problem is the ones who are reproducing quickest are the ones i wouldn't want remaining as part of the 'human' race.


That sounds a bit too much like eugenetica. Remember nazi propaganda about ungewenschten taking over the population? i'd rather not think in such terms..

if, and I say if, it's true, then can you imagine the bumper stickers and slogans

BOP for Brittian

or the Pickup lines in bars...

"Hey baby, Let's do our part for Europe!"


Ok,humor turned off now.

It's still around, but it's still a pretend Germany who speak French and keep cows. Oh, and make chocolate. And that's about it.

I know someone who went on holiday to Belgium for 3 weeks. God knows what they spent the whole time doing.
Probably crying. Over the fact they spent all that money to go to bloody Belgium.

Don't forget the beer and Tintin.

We Swedes are increasing now we are over 9 millions:) So look before we atack you with swedish meatballs

The french language isn't going anywhere. Quebec can crank out babies like nobody's business.

to be honest are birth rate in the US is going uo with in the white america it is like 1.9 so just lower than it wouldneed to be for white americans to keep the pop stable . but all in all the us pop u exspanding without including immgrations . throw in immgration and we are set .

i know europe has immgrants but first europeans are not used to immgrints also i dont think the muslems coming into europe will ever become part of the mainstream pop . couldnt this be why alot of european nations are so afraid of teeing off the islamic world

I have to disagree with you. If there's one thing Europeans aren't bad at, it's screwing themselves.

emphasis: themselves. Masturbation does not produce babies.

Yeah, it's called immigration. Europe's been doing it for centuries. Meanwhile countries like the US has their figures artificially bolstered by incoming immigrants.
Dude, the US pop has always relied upon immigration for pop growth. Hell the first people here were immigrants (admit it "native" americans you come from somewhere else as well). The great thing about America and Americans is that we aren't a race, we are a collection of individuals, so it's not like eventually have more hispanics than white dudes is gonna make america less american.

well now we are going to see what stage 5 on the demographic transition graph will look like at least!

every country need a birth rate of 2.1 to maintain a stable population.. yet most european countries are dropping to below 2.0 into the 1.9's which is not so bad, it is slow.. by 1.8 or 7 it will be a problem.. :(

In the future the EU is said to need 700,000 immagrants from asia and africa per year to keep all its services in order due to the future "native" population decrease.. i'm not a racist but i really would not like to see europe in the long run being populated almost totally by foreigners.. :(

The problem is that people have become VERY selfish.. young people do not want to have childen.. they want to live totally free lives, party, booze, gather money, etc. and the trend now is to have children in their mid 30's unlike mind/late 20 as it used to be a few decades ago, if they have any children at all.. rather buy a couple of porsh cars for themselves than have a family.. it is selfishness of the youth population.. :(
my nation's population is decreasing fast- i will raise a family... if i can find someone who can tolerate me and my bad habits! lol :D

emphasis: themselves. Masturbation does not produce babies.
I always thought Frenchmen produced asexually.

I think the birth rate in Britain is 1.8. Not as bad as some countries like Italy, but not enough to sustain the population on it's own. The trouble is, the government would probably use this as an excuse to allow uncontrolled immigration. I'm not really keen on the idea of all of Britain becoming an entire country of racial tensions. I used to live in Burnley (It was in the news a few years back for the race riots) and that's an example of what happens to towns with huge immigrant populations. I'd sooner see the government take action to try and increase the birth rate (Stuff like better childcare, ect.) than try quick fixes.

I actually saw John Rhys-Davies on television (I think it was on BBC America, might have been on AMC) a while back where he was in a debate with some very, very liberal woman. (And by liberal, I mean she made Michael Moore look like Ronald Reagan.)

John's point was that due to the decline in the birthrate and the increase in immigration, that the Dutch may well see a time within three generations where they will be a minority in their own country.

The woman just kept calling him a racist and anti-immigration, no matter what he said.

Is this underpopulation going on in Italy?

Just wondering; after all, Italian *is* the language of love! ;)

The conclusion is obvious-- extinction is imminent in a matter of generations, in 100 years French and German will be languages will be akin to ancient Greek or Latin and spoken only by scholars.
I'm European and I don't feel dommed. In 100 years I think France will have 40 million people and Germany will have 50 million. That's assuming that there is no large-scale immigration, which there probably will be.

Is this underpopulation going on in Italy?

Just wondering; after all, Italian *is* the language of love! ;)
I think Italy has the lowest birth rate in Western Europe. It's surprising really, they apparantly have a low amount of women in ful time work and are a staunch Catholic country - I expected them to breed like rabbits!

Can you say how the weather will be in 14 days?

No?

Then you shouldn't predict how Europe will look in 100 years!

100 years ago, all here in Europe "produced" (what a word, by the way!) enough children to increase the population. If someone like you would've predicted Europes future by that number, Germany would have...I don't know...100 to 120 million inhabitants by now.

Now it looks like Germany will have only 50 to 60 million inhabitants in 2104. So what? If the birth rate will rise in 30 to 50 years it all changes.

Nobody can predict the future THAT far. May I remind you how the world looked like in 1904? How could anyone back then predict the reality of 2004 even close? Nuclear power, space stations, cell phones, Internet...no chance. So is everyones' chance of 2004 predicting 2104 even if it's something like population growth.

The interesting thing is that it is non-Europeans that claim that we are doomed in Europe... have they ever visited the most wonderfull part of the world? or are they just Bushified?

our population in Ireland is growing, albeit rather slowly,

and remember all ye yankee doodles, its about quality of offspring not quantity!

This is awful, soon there'll be no Europeans at all!

Course, it'd have helped if the Americans didn't shoot down so many of our planes in the first stage of the Iraq war, but that's just friendly fire for you!

Mikorlias of Imardeavia

So the yankees are capable of shooting us down in friendly fire, and that is why they think we cannot shoot... bed or no bed?

The Canadian fertility rate is about 1.8/per woman, but the population is increasing by just a smidge under one percent a year. About perfect, really. And as for immigrants ... bring them on! Most immigrants to Canada are hardly drains on the economy ... I mean, we wouldn't have doctors where I lived if it wasn't for South Africans. :D

Although regarding immigration, I will grant that it's probably a different issue for immigrant settler states (ie, Canada, US, Australia, New Zealand) than for the European nation-states. As for population decline in Europe, it could change. I don't think 'extinction' will happen ... but more likely just a big crunch for social services. Japan has the same problem, and the US and Canada would be going that way, but for immigration. (Of which Canada has rather more per capita nowadays, about 200,000 a year last I checked)

The problem with a low birth rate is not that there will be some sort of extinction or "die-out", but rather that the average age will increase, and there will be far more pensioners (or dependants in general, really) per worker than there was before. And as anyone with a third of a brain will can tell you, a lower worker/dependant ratio means that either pensions will fall, drastically, or that the economy will slow. Or both.

Which is what we are seeing today, I suppose. Oh well :)

I'm European and I don't feel dommed. In 100 years I think France will have 40 million people and Germany will have 50 million. That's assuming that there is no large-scale immigration, which there probably will be.
I think Europeans will have little choice but to import millions of immigrants to keep from imploding, however, the result is that actual "European" Europeans will become increasingly rare. I lived in the east end of london for awhile, it seemed more like the middle east or north africa than Europe. I was a little dissapointed. Europe will become I think more of a multicultural stew, of aisans, africans, and increasingly few Europeans. This could be very positive is some respects, increasing interaction and cooperation between different peoples, but it is also incredibly depressing to me because I love Europe, and would hate to see it changed so drastically. By the way if anybody wants to look up the figures people are throwing around check out cia.gov and click on the world factbook it has a lot of intereting info.

The entire world should strive towards zero population growth, and fix the stupid economic system that asks for more and more resources.

On immigration and ethnic composition of Europe; we all come from Africa anyway, so it doesn't matter. Humanity is in a constant stage of flux. So things in 200 years won't be like they are now. Big deal! They aren't now like they were 200 years ago.